Why the South looks stupid to the rest of America
Keith Bardwell, justice of the peace in Tangipahoa Parish, La., is one of the reasons that people elsewhere in the country think the South is home to nincompoops and Neanderthals.
I cannot tell you how many highly educated people have told me over the years that they hesitated to take jobs in Georgia or South Carolina or Mississippi because of concern over the quality of education. The first question I get from people considering a move here is, “What are the schools like in Georgia?”
And idiots like Bardwell contribute to the myth that we are all wearing plastic bags on our feet and eating red clay. In reading the story about Bardwell denying a marriage license to an interracial couple for concern over any future children they may have, I turned to my co-workers and asked, “Why do all these lunatics have to come from the South?”
“I’m not a racist. I just don’t believe in mixing the races that way,” Bardwell told the Associated Press. “I have piles and piles of black friends. They come to my home, I marry them, they use my bathroom. I treat them just like everyone else.”
I know that some Southerners don’t care about the stereotypes, noting correctly that industries have been flocking here anyway. But it was cheap land and cheap labor that drew many of them.
Now, we want the higher-paying jobs to come here. Richard Anderson, the chief executive of Delta Air Lines, was quoted in The Atlanta Journal-Constitution earlier this year explaining why many of the Northwest Airlines employees relocating to Georgia from Minnesota will look for private schools for their children:
“I think the high school graduation rates and the quality of the graduates that we have coming out of the schools in Georgia need to be a lot higher.”
That’s the impression of the South that we have to counter, and that’s what characters like Bardwell make even harder.
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© 2009 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
177 comments Add your comment
V for Vendetta
October 16th, 2009
12:07 pm
Sigh.
Although I completely agree with your analysis of the situation, Maureen, I find it interesting that a media maelstrom can erupt over an event such as this . . . but no one thinks twice about denying gays the same freedom to marry.
Individual rights are just that: INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS.
Just as it is unlawful (and asinine) to prevent two people from marrying based on the color of their skin, it is equally absurd to prevent two people from marrying based on their sex. However, as a born and bred southerner, neither rights violation surprises me–even in 2009.
Ernest
October 16th, 2009
12:15 pm
Though many of our colleges/universities are well respected, I know many of my friends in the northeastern corridor have commented that we seem to put more emphasis on athletics over academics. Yes, athletics has provided a means to access higher education for many however many of the perceptions still exists.
Heck, GA brags that it has as many former HS football players on scholarship at Division 1 schools as states like CA, FL, and TX. Maybe we need to begin publishing every students time in the 40 along with their GPA….
TW
October 16th, 2009
12:19 pm
Yeah, this was pretty blatant. I mean, get with the racist program and join the NRA, or the Minutemen, where you can hide your racist beliefs behind socially acceptable terms like ‘gun control opposition’ and ‘illegal immigration.’ Supporting tax cuts for those millionaires who’ve ‘earned it’ (a la flat-tax) is another good way to come in through the back door without us smelling you.
Really, those who’ve perfected closet racist schemes like these must cringe when ignorant clowns like this bring light to the issue.
jim d
October 16th, 2009
12:24 pm
Mo, this one is a perfect example of Jackassery.
Mary Radford
October 16th, 2009
1:01 pm
Au Contraire, Ms. Downey: It was my experience on my travels North of the Mason-Dixon that we, here in the South, were far advanced book-wise and common sense wise —- before the government started tampering with our schools, particularly in the Kennedy years—–get the drift?
from the north
October 16th, 2009
1:12 pm
Just the title of this article alone is funny. On behalf of black people, thanks Maureen, you get it!!
Maureen Downey
October 16th, 2009
1:16 pm
Mary, Not sure of the drift, but I can tell you that the South has never led the country in any education measures, not pre or post Kennedy.
According to Census data: Educational attainment among the population aged 25 and above: The Northeast region has the highest percentage of high-school and college graduates. The Southern United States had the lowest educational attainment at every level.
Maureen
yubing
October 16th, 2009
1:24 pm
Bardwell: “I’m not a racist. I just don’t believe in mixing the races that way.”
Same as: “I am not stupid. I just don’t believe in making sense of how I think and what I say.”
If you are not a racist, why do you make decisions using “race” as a “factor”?
If you are not a racist, why do you believe “race difference” is a “problem”?
If you are not a racist, why do you “not” have faith in “all” human beings?
And,
If you do not obey the law, why should criminals obey the law?
Jiggy
October 16th, 2009
1:27 pm
Well I’m one of those guys who thinks southerners are trash. I positively hate living in GA, and deeply regret my parents coming here in the 80’s. We have the worst schools, the most corrupt police and government, the lowest standards and the largest amount of stupidity per mile. The driving just reeks, my neighbors are stupid and I see exactly what people are saying when they describe folks from the south as arrogant, ignorant fools. The vast 90% of people I deal with here are morons.
From the new stadium, to the rampant unchecked development, right down to the shady, high-power land deals, this state you call GA is no more than a riser for rednecks if one were to merely scratch the surface.
Before you go on a flaming, patriotic tirade, just know there’s plenty of folks I call me and mine who are from here. There’s good things, maybe I didn’t mention them, but then again those folk probably don’t care to be mentioned.
There’s so much just general BS involved in my daily life here that it’s enough to move to SOUTH AMERICA. I have been there and must emphatically assert that it was MUCH much nicer. They might not have big airports, millions of people per square mile, cars in every driveway and fat wallets in every pocket…but one thing they do have down there is decency and human freaking respect. Rednecks, as it stands, are disgusting mongrels by comparison to a BELIZIAN! That’s saying quite a bit considering that they don’t even have a 9th grade there…and I wonder at this.
Where I am from in the Midwest, every Christmas when I go home is like I stepped into another world that only exists in warm family sitcoms. People walking along the street will stop and chat, sometimes even invite you over to see the game. The driving? It’s awesome, you don’t even have to do 60 to get on the highway. The police are completely nonthreatening, even at the city level. Once my cousin threw a party and someone called about the noise, so the cops came out, quieted the music down and blocked off the street for extra parking. Tell me you’ll ever see that here? Oh no, Duluth and Dekalb PD would’ve showed up swinging bats.
Finally, you will never see some ignoramus on the bench AT ALL in the midwest. People like the aforementioned ‘judge of the peace’ don’t last long when they spout off at the lips like Keith Bardwell. The people that live up north would have DARED this guy to say something like that for their spot on the news. He would not have lasted two days.
In conclusion? Hell, I don’t know. I do know all this politico is killing us. The guy didn’t want whites and blacks mixing. I don’t like my steak juices touching my mashed potatoes, but you don’t see me using my authority to enforce my views on other people. The judges and police here do, and that’s probably the biggest point: START BY MINDING YOUR OWN GO**AM BUSINESS!
In the immortal words of ‘Grey’s Anatomy’ last night: YOU CAN’T PRAY THE GAY AWAY!
Common
October 16th, 2009
1:36 pm
To V for Vendetta: Please do not equate gays’ fight for marriage to that of the marriage of a man and woman. Doing so makes an erroneous assumption that 2 people of the same sex were guaranteed by the constitution to do so. This is why the Civil Right’s movement sometimes differs from the gay rights movement; though there are some similarities. Gay rights often involves CREATING new laws/amendments to the constitution while the Civil Rights movement simply attempted to uphold the God given right of men and women as stated by the constitution.
So in conclusion, contrary to what ‘V for Vendetta’ states as an obvious equivalence – the fight for gay marriage being equated to the fight for interracial marriage- they are two VERY different things. That is not to say that gays don’t have a right to marry- I actually believe that though that is not what constitutes true marriage, because we are guided by secular laws, we must permit such civil unions. The constitution already states 1 man and 1 woman (disregarding race) = marriage. The constitution never states that 1 man can marry 2 women (i.e. polygamy- which is not recognized as marriage even though this type of union predates any type of gay union) even if all parties are in love. And if polygamist want to fight for that new right, they should by all means BUT let them not equate that to the inalienable rights already guaranteed by the constitution for 1 man and 1 woman to marry.
Guy
October 16th, 2009
1:43 pm
I don’t care what this JP believes in. If he was a minister with this kind of objection, then its his opinion/loss. But he is an agent of the government whose job is to issue marriage licenses. Let the future parents worry about the kids, not him. We have a government whose trying to be a ‘nanny’ enough.
This guy needs to be investigated. The article on Yahoo said he’s done this 3 or 4 other times.
Jiggy
October 16th, 2009
1:44 pm
Dude correction to the both of you: ALL MARRIAGE IS WRONG, get that straight right now. humans aren’t meant to live that way.
Snellvillian
October 16th, 2009
1:46 pm
It is funny to me how perception is so far from reality.
I have friends who moved to Minnesota for about 6 years. When they came back their child had to go to summer school for 2 summers because she was so far behind in graduation credits. The Mn. HS had academic classing in stuff like sewing that didn’t qualify in GA for an actual diploma.
Maureen Downey
October 16th, 2009
1:56 pm
Snellvillian,
In the name of fair play, I have to point out that Minnesota high school students have the highest average composite score on the ACT among the 27 states in which more than half the college-bound students took the test in 2009. Minnesota has led the nation in average composite ACT sores for five consecutive years.
Georgia’s average composite score on the ACT was 20.6, out of a possible 36, and though that was unchanged from 2008, it bumped Georgia in the national rankings from 41st to 40th.
Maureen
The South
October 16th, 2009
1:58 pm
I have lived in the South and the North. There is no different. There are plenty of dumbasses in the North – plenty! I would suggest that you move if you do not live the South! If you cannot move, then try to make a difference by educating those that are less educated.
Jrm
October 16th, 2009
1:59 pm
Apparently the education is not very good in the midwest when you quote the “immortal words” of Grey’s Anatomy!!!! OMG pick up a book. And if you hate it here so much get the hell out, people like you ruined this state anyway. It amazes me how people complain about how bad Atl is and blame it on the good ole boys when no good ole boys run Atl anymore, see the recent Mayoral email stories but don’t look to the upper right of this page because that just wouldn’t be appropriate on this blog. I agree the guy in La was an idiot but its no reason to lump in the rest of the South with him or think all lunatics are Southerners, that would be discriminatory and stereotypical. People are idiots everywhere and yes our education sucks but that’s because it hasn’t been properly funded and rural, less populated areas always have trouble finding good teachers. It’s a bad cycle and if you’re so smart, step up and try to help instead of whining on the internet.
Jessica
October 16th, 2009
2:00 pm
Schools here (and in the rest of the country) clearly need improvement, but I have to point out that the national media and “transplants” from other regions think it’s funny to stereotype people from the South. If an event in a southern state makes national news, you can be sure that the reporters will interview some toothless idiot standing in front of an old trailer instead of a “normal” person in the area.
We all know that it’s not okay to say derogatory things about people based on age, race, gender, religion or national origin — unless those people are Christians with conservative views and a southern accent. For some reason, bigotry against this one group of people is considered perfectly acceptable even though it is as spiteful as any other form of intolerance.
Terry
October 16th, 2009
2:00 pm
Wow Mo, nothing like tackling tough subject matter. Hats off to you. Individual rights are individual rights just like someone else said, and that should apply to children in schools as well with regard to discipline in the south.
The South
October 16th, 2009
2:03 pm
JRM – very well said. If you do not like the South, then move. If you can not move then help those that are less educated. I grew in the South and move to the North for while and now back in ATL. I can compete with anyone around the nation with my southern education. Make a difference.
RCD
October 16th, 2009
2:07 pm
If you do not like the South, then move. I do not understand it. I grew up in the South, move to the North and did not like the North, so I moved back t Atlanta. There are two options – either move or shut up – Jiggy. Better yet, help those that are less educated.
Lo
October 16th, 2009
2:10 pm
I appreciate how Maureen replies with actual facts.
Jiggy seems a bit angry and ignorant.
Koz
October 16th, 2009
2:12 pm
Jiggy said the South should “START BY MINDING YOUR OWN GO**AM BUSINESS!”
That’s hilarious.
It was the idiots in the North and Midwest that Voted in our current President – who wants the government to be involved in everyone’s business.
Jessica
October 16th, 2009
2:14 pm
I’m a little annoyed that my comment keep disappearing, but I’m going to try one more time…
We all know that education in the South — and in the rest of the country — needs to improve. We also know that the South is facing some challenges, as are many other regions.
That said, why is it okay for the media and “transplants” from other regions to stereotype people from the South and make fun of our culture? If there is a national news story in a southern state, you can be sure that the reporters for the national news outlets will interview some toothless guy in front if a trailer instead of a “normal” person in the same area. They WANT to perpetuate that image of the South.
We all know that it’s unacceptable to judge people based on their race, religion, age, nationality, gender or religion, but for some reason bigotry is okay when it’s aimed at white Christians with a southern accent. So what if it’s just as spiteful and malicious as any other form of intolerance? It’s just so darn funny…
gene
October 16th, 2009
2:17 pm
The reasons for not “mixing” the races in the past was concern for the children -OBVIOUS JUST A POLITICALLY CORRECT EXCUSE OF LONG AGO. The irony is that the first A/A president is a product of this type of union. Seems to me that he’s faired better than “kids” his peers that were white and Black.
GAY people. Regardless of your urge or how you acquired it. It is wrong! You are afronting God! God called this an abomination. Water it down if you will. Convince the whole world to agree with you, you and I know that this will never change the mind of our creator. An abomination means an utterly repulsive thing to God. Do not allow yourself to be deceived by your feelings or the strong opinions of others as the bible is very clear, even when its GAY proponents try to twist them. The truth is the Truth!
high school teacher
October 16th, 2009
2:23 pm
How do you take a racist comment by one who happens to be from the South and turn it into an argument about how the South is dumber than the North? Does this mean that Chicago is more peaceful than everywhere else because Obama received the peace prize? Anne Coulter is from New York and has quite a reputation for being uber conservative; does this mean that people in the northeast are much more conservative than people elsewhere?
I am well aware that test scores of the South lag behind other regions. That doesn’t mean people in the South are stupid; it means that generally speaking, they don’t value education as much as people in other regions do. That’s a general lifestyle choice, not a lack of intelligence. Don’t confuse lack of desire with lack of knowledge.
Jiggy, if you hurry, you might be able to book a one-way plane ticket out of this God-forsaken place and avoid the holiday baggage surcharges:)
what's right for kids???
October 16th, 2009
2:24 pm
Oh, Gene. Just another thing for the northerners to point and laugh at. Why such hate? If you are convinced that homosexuals will go to hell, just think it, believe it, cherish it, even; but please be quiet about it. No one cares to hear your rants.
high school teacher
October 16th, 2009
2:25 pm
Forgive me if this appears twice, but it went to the cyberspace abyss…
How do you take a racist comment by one who happens to be from the South and turn it into an argument about how the South is dumber than the North? Does this mean that Chicago is more peaceful than everywhere else because Obama received the peace prize? Anne Coulter is from New York and has quite a reputation for being uber conservative; does this mean that people in the northeast are much more conservative than people elsewhere?
I am well aware that test scores of the South lag behind other regions. That doesn’t mean people in the South are stupid; it means that generally speaking, they don’t value education as much as people in other regions do. That’s a general lifestyle choice, not a lack of intelligence. Don’t confuse lack of desire with lack of knowledge.
Jiggy, if you hurry, you might be able to book a one-way plane ticket out of this God-forsaken place and avoid the holiday baggage surcharges:)
jim d
October 16th, 2009
2:29 pm
Common,
LOL, LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,LOL,,
The US Constitution —- Marraige issue??? I musta missed that one about 1 man, 1 woman marraige thing. Where exactly is that in that document.
gene
October 16th, 2009
2:33 pm
It does not matter who hates or likes that. I don’t want to see anyone go. We are not just spinning around here for 70 or so years. THis all means something and it more than just getting one’s jollys and doing what makes them feel good. You may want to live that way. But just because Heaven and hell seem Millions of mile away from the reality to now know makes them no less real. I will continue to warn about the “cancerous sin ” of homosexuality. Perhaps God knows a little better than we do, the dangers of this sins that ensnares and entraps its victims and is so very hard to break it grip. The men of Sodom and Gomorrah were not concerned about tending their cattle and farming their land. When this sin took over their lives they went around in a gang looking for “fresh” victims to defile. You say we are no where near that and perhaps you are right, but I refuse to call what God calls wrong for his reasons, right. Who am I and who are you if you silence the voice of reason that causes someone entrapped in this sin to seek help. Hopw cruel and selfish can you be, regardless of what you believe.
The One
October 16th, 2009
2:34 pm
Well I’m from the north (minnesota actually) and let me say that I love the ATL and I don’t think it’s necessarily a “south thing” I think it’s a Louisiana thing. Those folks are backwards there. The black people are racist, the white people are racist. Its hot and humid and just plain sucks there. I went to school next door (Texas) so I’ve been there plenty of times. Hell in 2003 during Mardi Gras there was a CLAN float during the family parade…..are you frickin kidding me!?!?! in 2003! This century! So I think it’s not really a “south” looking stupid but the Louisiana people looking stupid….and yes they are (please don’t hit me)
what's right for kids???
October 16th, 2009
2:35 pm
Maureen, can we ban Gene’s comments? I, in particular, find them offensive.
Thankful
October 16th, 2009
2:36 pm
Wow- Can’t go into detail but today I want to thank V for Vendetta- loved the comments. I taught in the North for 5 years- huge difference. Education is valued so much more and football is much less of a priority. And Gene- your close-minded and ignorant response towards gay people is exactly the type of comments that hinder forward progress in the South.
Maureen Downey
October 16th, 2009
2:40 pm
What’s right for kids, Can we start by asking Gene to forgo the preaching about gays?
Gene, Please return to the more general topic.
We try to be tolerant here – that has been the consensus in the past from posters, that we allow people leeway in their comments.
But I think the comments have traveled too far astray.
Maureen
gene
October 16th, 2009
2:42 pm
Maureen,
You really need to think about this. Don’t just listen to a society that is growing more and more bankrupt with each passing day. Maureen I love people, but in confronting this issue with all of its vocal opponents, I have to go to the source of authority (the Bible) which at times speaks quite directly. I am not here to condemn anyone, but the activity I will call out just as any other sin the bible mentions, it’s just that I don’t see a offensive aggressive group defending in this way any other sin clearly spelled out in the bible.
Evil Eye
October 16th, 2009
2:42 pm
Can anyone find an actual picture of this Justice of the Peace?
Are we sure he’s white?
Maureen Downey
October 16th, 2009
2:45 pm
Gene, This is a blog about education. The readers don’t come here for religious or spiritual guidance. I trust they can find that on their own, if they want it. They are all smart people who can read the Bible if they choose.
There are religion blogs and I think your comments are fitting for one of them.
Here, please talk about education-related issues.
Maureen
gene
October 16th, 2009
2:49 pm
Maureen,
I respect that and I will honor you request. I am A/A and I detest when the issue of racism is hijacked by the other agenda. A few from the opposing point of view did that earlier and no one, including yourself, utter a corrective response, so I did.
Nicole
October 16th, 2009
2:50 pm
Unbelievable. The man is entitled to his opinion, however ignorant it may be. However, he needs to keep it in his private life. If he can’t do a very simple job (justice of the peace is not rocket science) and follow clear law, then he needs to resign. If someone is a vegetarian, don’t work at a butcher shop. Same thing with this.
The rest of us don’t care to hear him waxing poetic on interracial children. He needs to do his job and zip his lips. Only in Louisiana would this even be tolerated for a minute. He should have been fired or resigned immediately. His personal interests clearly conflict with doing his job properly. In the real world, that’s when they let you go or you step down out of principle. You certainly don’t break the law.
NY Native
October 16th, 2009
3:06 pm
The Delta executive’s comments about schools down here stereotype the metro region in the exact same way that many on this forum are criticizing.I like to think that most people have a more nuanced interpretation of the South than stereotypes would suggest. While it’s true that Georgia schools overall lag the nation in academic achievement, when I first moved to Atlanta a few years ago from Long Island, I was surprised how much of the metro area has high performing schools. Based on test scores, college admissions records, national press, we have entire regions in the metro area like East Cobb, North Fulton or Peachtree City that have strong public school systems comparable to those up north.
Granted, we do have many areas where school performance is quite appalling but the point is that the region is capable of attracting high paying jobs and those people have ample opportunity to find an area that caters to their educational expectations. Just as I would hope that most people can see that the crazy person in La is not representative of most of the South, I hope that people can see that not all schools in the metro area are terrible.
Beth Sager
October 16th, 2009
3:06 pm
The scary thing is that this can happen anywhere in the US. I am quite familiar with Hammond and Tangipahoa Parish. I attended four years of college there and graduated from Southeastern Louisiana University. Now I live in Tennessee and spend the winters in Arizona. I could see this happening in both of those states. This couple is in their 30s, quite old enough to decide whether to marry and whether to have children.
high school teacher
October 16th, 2009
3:18 pm
Maureen, forgive me for being “ornery” today, but your discussion of a judge with racial overtones is no more relevant to education than Gene’s comments.
Philip S
October 16th, 2009
3:18 pm
You folks down South will continue to be regarded as stupid WHEN YOU KEEP ELECTING BONEHEAD IDIOTS like Bardell.
It isn’t like anybody else makes you do it.
And you have such a looooooooooooong history of it.
Do something about it or live with it.
It’s your choice.
Philip S
October 16th, 2009
3:21 pm
Elect Gene (above me).
Perfect candidate to keep up your fine racist traditions.
Er, I mean heritage!
Lee
October 16th, 2009
3:46 pm
“Why the South looks stupid to the rest of America”
Really?
So Maureen, you want to use your position at this failing newspaper to spout off about the South. At the rate the AJC is losing subscribers, we won’t have to put up with caustic pen much longer…
Hell, I applaud Bardwell for taking his stance. He is merely stating what a whole helluva lot of people believe. They do not believe in race mixing nor do they want their grandchildren to be some heinz 57 variety.
…and I see nothing wrong with those who believe that way.
transplanted
October 16th, 2009
4:00 pm
I am not born in the south, but I do like living here. However, the “perception” that the southerners are “dumber” may not be really a perception – just look at some of the comments in this blog, not just today’s discussion. People like Common, Gene, catwoman, etc. are exhibit A for that perception.
On the other hand, although racism may be much more explicit in the south, racism in the north (and elsewhere) is just as strong. You actually see a lot more interracial couples in the south than anywhere else. People outside of the north may not say it like this stupid judge, but they certainly practice it.
George
October 16th, 2009
4:11 pm
You want good schools. Try the Republic of Singapore. If you dont know where it is located try finding it on the map. The bottom of the barrell 20% of students in Singapore do as well in math as the top 30% in the state of Louisiana. Does not inspire much confidence. If you dont believe me, try researching an international test called TIMMS.
none
October 16th, 2009
4:19 pm
To Jiggy and any other transplants, etc. If you dont like it here, then leave.
Straight shooter
October 16th, 2009
4:22 pm
HSTeacher, I think this topic is vey relevant to education: Why does the South have so many weirdo stories – wasn’t the recent Bigfoot hoax a product of a Georgian?
All this feeds into the view that we’re backwards and our schools stink. And that, my friend, scares away jobs.
V for Vendetta
October 16th, 2009
4:34 pm
Common,
I’m familiar with the Constitution. The way I see it, the Founding Fathers were trying to PROTECT individual rights. Not allowing gays to marry clearly violates individual rights. Even if it were in the Constitution, it should be changed because it’s immoral.
gene,
Come out of the closet, dear. You’ll be much happier.
Lee,
He can think however he wants, yes, but based on the authority of his position, he is not at liberty to discriminate against people who wish to get married. He is more than welcome to take a position at his local Confederate historical society and reennact Civil War battles if he wants to fight for his (dumbass, ignorant, blatantly racist) “beliefs.”
I do agree with what others have said about other regions of the US. Though I am a southerner born and bred, I have traveled all over the country. Stupid is everywhere. However, stupid down here–in my opinion–seems to be based more on bigotry. Elsewhere, stupid seems to be just, well, stupid. I’m just saying . . . .
Constitution
October 16th, 2009
4:40 pm
Common…..read the constitution. There’s no mention of marriage. And not a single use of the word “woman.” “Woman” isn’t even used in the text of the 19th Amendment. What document are you reading?
high school teacher
October 16th, 2009
4:51 pm
“wasn’t the recent Bigfoot hoax a product of a Georgian?
All this feeds into the view that we’re backwards and our schools stink. And that, my friend, scares away jobs.”
After the hot air balloon publicity stunt yesterday, can I now assume that people from the West are stupid and that their schools must be going downhill?
dgroy
October 16th, 2009
5:01 pm
All you folks who think the Northeast, Midwest, etc., etc., are such great places to live and to raise and school your children, please take your car, the bus, train, plane and hightail it outta here…..we don’t need you and your negative attitudes in Georgia, particularly you, jiggy…..you sound like a person who would have a hard time adjusting to any place you live. There are people like who the article refers to, everywhere……It’s not just a southern thing.
Common
October 16th, 2009
5:14 pm
To Constitution and Jim D,
you are correct in pointing my error ( I was wrong to state that marriage is defined under the constitution as 1 man+1 woman). However, this is because the idea that marriage is the union of one male and one female has been thought to be so basic that it is not ordinarily specifically expressed by statute.
Denying 2 men from marrying one another is tantamount to denying 1 man+3woman a polygamous marriage. Do you agree? I don’t believe anyone in their right mind would equate that to denying someone interracial marriage because the latter scenario does not contradict the most basic rudimentary acknowledged definition of marriage.
Now if one argued that the Equal Protection Clause should apply not only for race but also sexual orientation and therefore should enable same-sex unions, I would say that the secular law of the land would likely have to acquiesce to such change.
I think that the opponents will also make a very strong and perhaps viable rebuttal that, marriage is defined as 1man and 1woman; you can’t have any other permutation. Is that fair to polygamists and same-sex marriage? One could argue that it’s not about fair or not fair, that is what marriage is. Just as I cannot marry my daughter even if she is 30 and i’m 50. That’s an accepted limitation; no one would argue that it’s our rights to marry if we wanted because it doesn’t fit the definition of marriage.
Common
October 16th, 2009
5:20 pm
Also I’m Canadian so I’ll use that as my excuse for not being well-verse in the Constitution.
My point is the same nonetheless; gays want to marry but the same laws that say polygamy* is prohibited, are the same laws that say gay marriage is prohibited. Is that not a double standard to deny one and allow the other. THERE IS A GOOD COMPARISON BTW; same-sex marriage with polygamous marriage. not same-sex marriage with interracial marriage.
*(even polygamy outside the context of marriage in consenting adults who truly love one another just as gays or straights)
Bruce
October 16th, 2009
5:21 pm
dgroy said:
“There are people like who the article refers to, everywhere……It’s not just a southern thing.”
I would agree with you. They, i.e., “nincompoops and Neanderthals”, are everywhere. However, I think what the article is addressing is fact that there is a higher percentage of these folks in the South versus other places like the Northeast and West Coast.
Federal Law Doesn't Work Here
October 16th, 2009
5:26 pm
Maureen,
Mr. Bardwell’s actions are right in line with the mentality and arrogance of Tangipahoa Parish. According to an ACLU action in 2007, “The American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana today filed a case against the Tangipahoa Parish School Board because of an official prayer by a teacher at a graduation ceremony. The legal action, on behalf of a parent and his two children who attend Tangipahoa public schools, represents a record sixth court case by the ACLU against the same district for government-endorsed religious activities over the past 13 years.” What did the school board do? “Teachers and administrators in Tangipahoa Parish continue to violate a court-imposed school prayer ban, according to the ACLU, which on May 18 (2007) asked a federal judge to send them to jail.” Federal laws don’t apply to them, apparently.
As others have said, stupidity, ignorance and ignorant arrogance are not exclusive property of the south. I guess, though, we are not really surprised when these issues arise from the south.
Maureen, I disagree that this is an educational issue, as much as it is a cultural issue. I know you admonished Gene for his overly one-sided religious views, but it seems to me that most of the cultural issues arise from strong, and probably ill-guided, religious beliefs.
George
October 16th, 2009
5:29 pm
“However, I think what the article is addressing is fact that there is a higher percentage of these folks in the South versus other places like the Northeast and West Coast.”
Higher percentage of folks who will keep their mouths shut in places such as Indiana, Maryland or Pennsylvania…they dont show their ignorance to the public..they are not dumb enough to show their ignorance to the rest of the world while unfortunately people in the south tell it out loud for everyone to hear. Perhaps white people on average elsewhere in the country are smarter than in the south to the extent they dont show their stupidity.
ScienceTeacher671
October 16th, 2009
5:37 pm
Personally, I think people with New Jersey accents sound stupid, but I have met some people from that state who were actually rather intelligent.
jim d
October 16th, 2009
5:39 pm
WWJS??
Maureen Downey
October 16th, 2009
5:44 pm
ScienceTeacher,
As a native of the Garden State, I have to admit that I was shocked at age 8 to discover that the spelling of the word for the place where you store your socks was not draw, but drawer.
Maureen
Sam
October 16th, 2009
5:44 pm
“The first question I get from people considering a move here is, ‘What are the schools like in Georgia?’”
Well, the schools in Georgia are like the corporate businesses in Georgia, to wit…
“But it was cheap land and cheap labor that drew many of them.”
High quality education and learning would simply destroy Georgia’s and Atlanta’s cheap labor markets.
Rich
October 16th, 2009
6:46 pm
Interesting. As a Pennsylvanian relocated to California, I want to say that I find it amusing when stuff like this comes out about the South, but I do recognize that it’s not really representative of the entire South.
Let’s face it, Bardwell’s idiocy exists everywhere in this country. But it makes headlines when it happens in the South because it plays to a familiar meme in mass media: that Southerners are bigots and rubes who would marry their sister but not someone of a different race.
Bardwell just plays to the stereotype. Makes for easy reporting.
California has the worst or next-to-worst schools in the country. And people around here like to mention the names of Southern states that have better schools as a way to make the shame more obvious.
Raven Lee
October 16th, 2009
6:51 pm
To Common….
You must not have ever read the Constitution.
There is NO mention of MARRIAGE.
Raven Lee
October 16th, 2009
6:55 pm
To Common (again)…
You must not have ever read the bible.
All God’s prophets have had multiple wives. Ever hear of Abraham????
So are you seriously saying that marriage is not between 1 man and many women? This is what was practiced and ordained by God. So if God’s teachings allow you to marry multiple women, why do you think God would deny marriage between 2 men or 2 women?
“marriage is defined as 1man and 1woman”
Donald Wang
October 16th, 2009
6:55 pm
To Common (again)…
You must not have ever read the bible.
All God’s prophets have had multiple wives. Ever hear of Abraham????
So are you seriously saying that marriage is not between 1 man and many women? This is what was practiced and ordained by God. So if God’s teachings allow you to marry multiple women, why do you think God would deny marriage between 2 men or 2 women?
“marriage is defined as 1man and 1woman”
ScienceTeacher671
October 16th, 2009
7:13 pm
Maureen,
There are some Southern words like that, too…in fact, if you go to Crackerbarrel or somewhere similar, you can find whole BOOKS of them.
ST671
V for Vendetta
October 16th, 2009
7:16 pm
Common,
To compare gay marriage to polygamy is to render your opinion on this matter irrelevant. It’s aboot time you gave it up. Thanks for making it easy for the rest of us. Your logic is beyond flawed, eh?
Joe
October 16th, 2009
7:55 pm
Retired military, and have lived in all sections of the country and overseas. From my personal experiences I would not subject my family to the attitudes and blatant prejudice I have observed in the south. In fact post civil war I believe that the southern states should not have been readmitted to the union. they should have been administered as a territory.
formely knows as common
October 16th, 2009
8:21 pm
V for Vendetta,
Why do people in favor gay marriage get offended at that comparison? It’s either abject hypocrisy OR self-hatred (a vicarious dislike of their own alternative marriage through deriding the very same rights to polygamists in the comparison). I suggest that the latter as a possible option only because if you loathe the ‘polygamist equivalence’ then you must think polygamists (even though they’re mostly loving law-abiding ppl fighting for the same laws as gays) are so frowned upon that you do not want ANY association with that group.
alan
October 16th, 2009
9:21 pm
So what if the Justices in that State or any State decided to pass a law that Says ONLY MARRIAGES BETWEEN SAME RACES IS LEGAL IN VALID? What would happen? IT would EXPLODE into a big deal for all the races. They could never get away with it. It is unconstitutional and wrong to tell any Adult what Adult they can marry. HELLO!!! This is why there should be a law that states all Adults should be able to any Adult they choose regardless of race, religion, color or SEXUAL ORIENTATION. COME ON PEOPLE WHEN ARE WE GONNA LEARN…ALL PEOPLE DESERVE THE RIGHT TO BE MISERABLE.
Tim
October 16th, 2009
10:09 pm
You just don’t get it Common. You are using a very twisted criteria for saying that homosexual marriage is the same as polygamy. Saying that they are both ‘alternative’ is meaningless. Homosexual marriage and heterosexual marriage are both one-on-one marriages between consenting adults that love each other. The ONLY difference is the sex. Homosexual people feel exactly the same love for their partner as heterosexuals. Why is that so difficult to understand? Homosexual marriage is only ‘alternative’ to you, just as interracial marriage is ‘alternative’ to Bardwell. Now THERE’s two things that fall into the same category. Guess which one?
V for Vendetta
October 16th, 2009
10:51 pm
formerly known,
You can only confer the legal status of marriage on two individuals. If you were to open it up to polygamists, you would have all kinds of fraudulent marriages being made in order to receive the same benefits. It’s logistically unfeasible.
I personally could care less if people want to have multiple wives, but I think the potential for fraud (and individual rights violations–e.g., pedophilia) is too great.
formely knows as common
October 16th, 2009
11:04 pm
Tim and V for Vendetta,
I actually do get it; gays want to legitimize their alteration of the traditional definition of marriage and equating gay marriage to interracial marriage is a means by which people will see that equivalence. That is not hard to understand.
What I’m saying is that by virtue of the fact that 1man-1woman-interracial marriage is still between 1man and 1woman, you cannot equate interracial marriage to that of same-sex couples.
Ask yourself why gays don’t like their alternative form of marriage (same-sex marriage) to be compared to another alternative form of marriage, POLYGAMY, which also happens to be between loving adults who are committed to one another. If it’s good for the goose it should be good for the gander, but not in this case? So not being in agreement with law recognizing gay marriage is wrong but using that same appraisal on polygamist is correct? Why the double standard, if you assume the polygamist are law-abiding?
THE ANSWER IS COMMON SENSE, marriage is not defined as just loving adults coming together, it is however ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN.
In the example of the polygamists; their religion (which one could be born into and not chose) may actual allow for polygamy. So why is it right to deny polygamist and wrong to deny gay marriage?
my name is common
October 16th, 2009
11:19 pm
V for Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
COMMON is my name
October 16th, 2009
11:23 pm
V for Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
I.am.Common
October 16th, 2009
11:33 pm
V for Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
Maureen's accountability metric
October 16th, 2009
11:38 pm
As far as this entry goes Maureen, you’ll find zero disagreement from me. But I do have to point out a quote from the AJC on Sunday’s must reads:
“In the wake of a state cheating probe, an exclusive AJC investigation finds “statistically unlikely” test scores at more than a dozen Georgia schools.”
Maureen, where is the Learning Curve column on CRCT cheating you promised us, and will you address why you or the AJC editorial board won’t call for the DOE to send monitors to these schools where your own reporters found scores that were “statistically unlikely”?
The DOE and for that matter the AJC could say it’s cost prohibitive to send monitors to every school. But why not Maureen, advocate for the DOE sending a message to every school? They can certainly afford to send that message by sending monitors to those schools were the evidence indicates cheating occurred.
By not only monitoring during the test, but by having the DOE secure the testing materials before and after, the public could know once and for all what the students did, and not what panicky adults did for them?
Does the AJC think we can’t handle the truth? Is the politician in Kathy Cox really ready, in her heart of hearts, to deal with what might possibly happen, as far a test scores dropping, if there were monitors in place?
Wouldn’t addressing those issues be, as you say, “what’s best for Georgia students?” Since you claim to write with a single lens focus for what’s best for Georgia’s students, what compelling reason would you have to not use your voice to bring some pressure to bear on Kathy Cox and the DOE to restore some faith in the integrity of the testing process?
Please share.
I'm Common
October 17th, 2009
12:04 am
Tim and V Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
C.o.m.m.o.n.
October 17th, 2009
12:10 am
Vendetta,
Sothe wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta, I wrote “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I was unsuccessful as you still resorted to the ‘polygamist=criminals’ stereotype .I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
TO V FOR VENDETTA
October 17th, 2009
12:18 am
Tim and V Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
Commmmmmmon
October 17th, 2009
12:28 am
Tim and V for Vendetta,
I actually do get it; gays want to legitimize their alteration of the traditional definition of marriage and equating gay marriage to interracial marriage is a means by which people will see that equivalence. That is not hard to understand.
What I’m saying is that by virtue of the fact that 1man-1woman-interracial marriage is still between 1man and 1woman, you cannot equate interracial marriage to that of same-sex couples.
Ask yourself why gays don’t like their alternative form of marriage (same-sex marriage) to be compared to another alternative form of marriage, POLYGAMY, which also happens to be between loving adults who are committed to one another. If it’s good for the goose it should be good for the gander, but not in this case? So not being in agreement with law recognizing gay marriage is wrong but using that same appraisal on polygamist is correct? Why the double standard, if you assume the polygamist are law-abiding?
THE ANSWER IS COMMON SENSE, marriage is not defined as just loving adults coming together, it is however ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN.
In the example of the polygamists; their religion (which one could be born into and not chose) may actual allow for polygamy. So why is it right to deny polygamist and wrong to deny gay marriage?
formely known
October 17th, 2009
1:10 am
Tim and V Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
Disguested
October 17th, 2009
1:47 am
I believe Mary’s “drift” was that when schools were forcibly desegregated the negroes ruined everything, hopefully I’m wrong.
Disgusted
October 17th, 2009
1:48 am
Oh the horrible ‘irony’ of having an extra E in Disgusted
Larry
October 17th, 2009
5:22 am
Consider the possibility that the main problem with pubic education isn’t the “education” part.
ScienceTeacher671
October 17th, 2009
8:51 am
I think Rich “got it”:
“Let’s face it, Bardwell’s idiocy [and idiocy in general] exists everywhere in this country. But it makes headlines when it happens in the South because it plays to a familiar meme in mass media: that Southerners are bigots and rubes…”
CL
October 17th, 2009
9:04 am
Georgia’s political leadership is extreme in it’s claim to Reputlican conservativism. One of the most obvious and disturnbing of the conservative Republican agendas seems to be the destruction of public education. You cannot have a prosperous and enlightened society if most of it’s members are cast aside as unteachable, and the entire system of school funding and political support becomes focused on private and/or religious schools, while public education is starved and systematically marginalized. Insuring basic public education available to all was one of the great successes of the Democratic administrations of the 60’s. Universal education is the cornerstone of democracy. Only despots prosper when the majority of the populace is left uninformed and ignorant.
Tom B.
October 17th, 2009
9:10 am
To any who state that the fact that Georgia has a lot of people attending college on football scholarships somehow justifies our emphasis on sports over academics: You are God’s poor fool is you believe attending college on a football scholarships gets you an education. Many will drop out long before graduation. Most will stumble along with worthless courses (basket weaving?), special treatment that will disguise their lack of any learning, or tutoring that will keep them barely eligible to play. Net result: Most football “scholars” will be exploited like pieces of meat for four years and then cast into the world with no more learning or education then the day they entered. Many will spend their lives in the ranks of the unemployed or underemployed. Only a lucky few–a very few–may make it into the NFL, where the process will repeat itself, only without the fiction that they are serving any cause but the provision of a good football game.
Badger
October 17th, 2009
9:26 am
Everybody has rights, gays, blacks, even illegals. So why is everyone stepping on this guy for exercising his rights? He didn’t say they couldn’t get married, he said he would not issue a license based on his beliefs. His right is to do what his beliefs tell him to do. Does this make him a moron? No. It makes all of you a moron because you don’t like what his belief is and you want to change it to yours.
this is common.
October 17th, 2009
9:38 am
V for Vendetta,
So you are saying the wrong ppl will abuse polygamous marriages so continuing the status quo by denying polygamist marriage licences is ok???? Alright now who has rendered their position irrelevant; especially considering what you just suggested is ironically one of the tactics employed by opponents of gay marriage i.e. “if we let gays marry, then two pals might just abuse it to get benefits to their friends”
Also V for vendetta please go back and read what I read i.e. me referring to “law-abiding” polygamists. The reason I used the term “law-abiding” was to preempt any stereotype of polygamist being incestuous. I myself am somewhat the progeny of a polygamist grandfather (they used to do that back in the day in Africa and still do some places). And while that would NEVER be the life for me, I know that many polygamist are not incestuous.
If I were a polygamist I would probably get as offended at that insinuation that they are pedophiles/incestuous as gay people would to the insinuation that gay men molest children; both equally ridiculous justifications to ban the respective alternative marriages.
I think the acceptance of polygamy into law has a lot more legitimate comparisons to gay marriage than you are willing to admit
Regularjoe
October 17th, 2009
9:41 am
Obviously the judge is a fool. So the now everyone in the south is an uneducated fool? Gov. Spitzer was a fool. Is everyone in the state of New York an uneducated fool? When a person writes a blog and equates one idiot with the education of a whole region, they must have some hidden agenda.
The south has same crazy folks, just like every other region. Check the latest census, more people from up north and moving south. If you don’t like the south, then move. The stupidest thing you can do as an adult is live in a region you detest.
Badger
October 17th, 2009
9:41 am
Everyone talks about desegregation…Why? Because blacks want to live with blacks and whites want to live with whites. Seems to me only a very few and the government want to desegregate schools. Blacks complain the schools their children go to aren’t as good as to ones white children go to. Wait a minute, could that be because white parents tend to get involved more in the school and tend to support the schools more monetarily than black parents. As I drive through black neighborhoods and see groups of black teenagers hanging out on the trash strewn street corners in front of unkempt houses with broken windows and junk cars in the front yard, I can only contemplate that the same is not true when I drive through white neighborhoods. The houses are clean, and you don’t see gangs hanging on the corners looking to score. The only hypothosis you can draw from this is blacks don’t want to work for a better future, they want the government just to give it to them.
Not in Tangipahoa Parish! « NotionsCapital
October 17th, 2009
10:12 am
[...] “Why the South looks stupid to the rest of America,” Maureen Downey, Atlanta Journal Constitution [...]
AlreadySheared
October 17th, 2009
10:14 am
V,
I have to step up for “Common” – the point is that the U.S. Constitution doesn’t say ANYTHING about gay marriage. I and others think it’s wrong for learned legal minds to pore through that document and somehow find a right to gay marriage there. Slavery and denying women the right to vote also are by inspection wrong, but the end of slavery and women’s suffrage were enacted by constitional amendments passed by 2/3’s of the house and senate, and 3/4’s of the states.
You think gay marriage is fair and right? Fine. Get out there (”out” – get it ? ), make your argument, persuade your fellow citizens and PASS A NEW LAW. Stop trying to use the courts to make an end run around popular opinion. Stand up and smell the democracy.
p.s. – If marriage between two men and two women is ok, we should also have a right to polygamy.
“Who are you to tell me who I can love?” ain’t a whole lot different than “Who are you to tell me how many I can love?” I fail to see how, if society is unable to prohibit same sex marriage, it would still retain the right to say the “2″ is the only acceptable number.
The News Factor: updated headlines
October 17th, 2009
10:40 am
[...] Why the South looks stupid to the rest of America [...]
Truth be told
October 17th, 2009
10:49 am
This example of unenlightened thinking from a person with power is definitely one of the reasons the south has the reputation that is has. The second is the denial by it’s citizens that many Southerners are by and large, petty, small-minded and possibly even a bit dull. Not so much in the big city of Atlanta (there’s a large mix of people here from all over the world), but I’m telling you that in places like Birmingham, Augusta, Savannah, Jackson and other small cities across the south, closed-minded religious and other fanatics seem to rule. But then again, in metro Atlanta, we have Cobb County putting stickers in science books stating that evolution is just one of several “theories”. And then, everyone wonders why the rest of the country continues to chuckle.
Add to this the long history of horrible, terrible race relations and the horrible atrocity of slavery that occurred on this land, which so many white southerners still recollect as the good old days of Dixie, fighting hard to keep the old, offensive Georgia flag and still enjoying the long-term benefits of having had enormous plantations built and tended by slaves and we have a place that is a long time in healing – if ever. Especially when the only minds available to come to the table are closed.
GermanDawg
October 17th, 2009
10:56 am
This is the only reason that so many jobs and industries have moved to the South since the birth of the ‘New South”. It is because Southern leaders have promoted the idea for nearly 150 years that Southerners are too ignorant to expect a decent standard of living and wages that provide for the same. This is how this very newspaper came to be the leading newspaper in the South for many years because Henry W. Grady supported the notion of the New South, which when translated meant ignorance and a willingness to accept any indignity at the hand of industry and robber barons as long as the races were kept separate. Every time a public figure in the south refuses to remove a christian symbol from a public building or refuses to protect the rights of citizens equally some industrialist somewhere perks up like one of Pavlov’s dogs. There is a reason that BMW built a plant in Greenville – Spartanburg and KIA built one in West Point, and it has nothing to do with geography and everything to do with the fact that as long as we in the South are hell-bent on proving to the world that we are backward, ignorant hicks then they will be more than willing to accommodate us in our efforts.
Look before I leap
October 17th, 2009
11:13 am
Badger: You are missing the point with respect to the JoP in La. He in fact, does have a right to believe whatever he chooses. We in fact, have a right to comment upon, criticize and decry his beliefs. But as a public official, he has a duty to set aside his personal prejudices and perform his official functions as prescribed by law. If he is incapable of that, he needs to step down. Passing the buck to the next official does not in any way absolve him of his responsibilities to conduct his office according to public law.
Look before I leap
October 17th, 2009
11:27 am
Already Sheared: The constitution says nothing about any kind of marriage, gay or straight, monogamous or not. In addition, your version of history is a bit off. Slavery was initially abolished by Presidential decree, not by constitutional amendment. Additionally, American history is full of examples of the courts stepping in to overturn ignorant legislation with the aim of guaranteeing civil liberties and rights for ALL citizens.
Kudzu35
October 17th, 2009
11:31 am
Maureen, I understand the point of your article and I’ve had conversations with several non-Southerners about it before. My true name often encourages such conversations with the assumption that I am a brain-dead hick that married my sister. We’re going to have these stereotypes regardless… just as blacks will have theirs, Asians will have theirs, Mexicans… you get the idea.
On the point at hand, my son is a half-n-half Hispanic (Mexican) and white kid. I’ve lived in Texas, Hawaii, and now back in Georgia and he has only been in school in two of the three states. Hawaii, which might have the worst education in the union would not let him in school. Texas was where he attended a Pre-K school that reminded me of a Nazi Youth camp with how disciplined it was.
It was in Georgia that he started Kindergarten and was immediately recognized by his teacher as a gifted child. He has now been in the gifted/magnent program for the past three years and is doing well. I disagree with the JP’s beliefs but to be honest he is free to feel that way. All the uproar over this man and his beliefs is ironic, they attack him personally as a “racist” but few attack him as an agent of the government failiing in his duties.
Ma’am, I believe you hit a valid point but you fail to address the assumptions. The South, despite opinions otherwise, has some of the best colleges and universities around. Georgia alone has its share of these schools and is recognized as such. True we don’t place an emphasis on certain areas that we probably should and improvements won’t change over night. But taken into account our diverse economy of manufacturing, tourism, aggriculture, and business/corporate leadership I would venture to say that our high school graduation rates fulfill the need for qualified workers. I would hope our state government or some intrepid journalist and economist would do a study on this topic.
While the JP makes it harder for us he also illustrates some of our strengths. Independent mindset, not afraid to speak one’s mind, unabashed honesty, and dare I say it… integrity. People may not agree with him but they can’t deny that he hasn’t stuck by his guns on this subject. How many of you would cower behind some PC apology and beg for forgiveness? I hope none of you.