What did children learn today from Joe Wilson?
“He who establishes his argument by noise and command shows that his reason is weak.” - Michel de Montaigne
I know some parents didn’t want their kids to hear President Obama this week.
I didn’t want my kids to hear U.S. Rep Joe Wilson. The South Carolina lawmaker shocked Republicans and Democrats alike and earned a reprimand from John McCain when he interrupted the president’s address by shouting, “You lie!” from the House floor.
It is very hard to teach kids common courtesy because we live in a world where shouting, denigration and hair pulling are TV entertainment. I hate the response “Shut up,” but it shows up in many children’s programs.
When Rep. Wilson interrupted the president on national TV, he demonstrated the behaviors that most parents work hard not to instill in their children. Don’t talk back to the teacher, the police officer or the boss. Be reasonable. Let the other person talk. Honor the time and place. Don’t grouse during the minister’s sermon that you’re thirsty, hungry, bored or tired. Don’t tell your grandmother she’s told you that story at least a million times.
Last month, I was getting gas at Kroger when a woman asked the driver of the landscaping truck at the pump across from me to move up because he was taking up two bays. He ignored her, so she drove to another bay. Before the guy left, he deliberately drove by her and loosed an obscenity-laden attack so vile that I was shocked. There were many parents with young kids getting gas as it was a Saturday morning, as well as a church youth group in a van.
And we worry about kids today?
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103 comments Add your comment
susan demarco
September 10th, 2009
3:18 pm
If you did not identify the lies obama was throwing out .. line after line, that is your falult.
i think your children will idenitfy with the TRUTH..
THIS WANNA BE EMPEROR HAS NO TRUTH.
BLESS JOE WILSON FOR BEING THE ONLY PERSON TO STATE THE TRUTH.
Michael J. McFadden
September 10th, 2009
3:19 pm
Joe Wilson’s attack may have been done rudely and badly, and I can’t speak to the truthfulness of the immigration claim but we *DO* know that Obama lied quite openly and blatantly to the American people on June 21st’s “Today Show” when he said, quoting here, “The only tax change I’ve made in the 6 months I’ve been here is to cut people’s taxes.”
- – -
He said that – despite the indisputable fact that he raised cigarette taxes by 150% and raised the tax on one of the poorest well-defined minority groups in the country, smokers so poor they roll their own from shreds of tobacco and scraps of paper, by OVER TWO THOUSAND PERCENT (from $1/lb to $24/lb). See :
- – -
http://pro-choicesmokingdoctor.blogspot.com/2009/07/obama-in-bare-faced-lie.html
- – -
for the quick video clip and full story. Obama does, most definitely, lie. And he can’t back out of it with “We all make mistakes.” either: That tax was one of his first and highest profile actions upon taking office AND he even interrupted the interviewer specifically to state that particular lie. Our children should learn to respect both the values of politeness AND truth.
- – -
Michael J. McFadden,
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
Barbara Wilcox
September 10th, 2009
3:21 pm
It is disappointing that Joe Wilson represents the State of South Carolina and the Republican Party. His outburst towards the President of the United States was objectionable on many levels.
CobbParent
September 10th, 2009
3:21 pm
Completely support you on this post. My family watched the speech last night and I was actually distracted not only by Rep. Wilson, but the whole applause, standing up/sitting down, booing, cheering….I felt like I was watching a football game. Is all that necessary during a Presidential speech. Shouldn’t everyone be quiet and just listen. When I asked my daughter, who is in 3rd grade, what she thought of the speech, she just said there were lots of yays and boos. That was all she heard and probably many others only heard that too.
Last night displayed alot of childish behavior and honestly, I am seeing more and more of this in my professional workplace. There is talking back to superiors, purposely ignoring company directives because someone things they know better, and lots of chatter. Not sure when manners went out the window, but sure wish they would come back.
Lefty
September 10th, 2009
3:23 pm
Very very few children learned anything from Joe Wilson’s behavior because they weren’t watching the President’s speech. The ones who were watching are probably smart enough to gleen from the general audience reaction that it was poor behavior on the heckler’s part.
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:25 pm
Susan Demarco you are an idiot!!!, and you are probably raising future racist idiots, THIS MAN IS THE DULY ELECTED PRESIDENT OF THESE UNITED STATES ! If you , and your really ignorant, racist kind, hate him so much, LEAVE, and come back when his term is over, may I suggest Russia, or Siberia, there are few minorities, in those places . as far as that fool from South Carolina, he should be yelling you lie TO HIS GOVERNOR, you know the lying, adulterer, Republican HYPOCRITE !!!
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
3:28 pm
CobbParent, It’s interesting you mention feeling like you were watching a crowd at a football game. My oldest — a UGA student — told me the same thing, that lawmakers behaved as if they were in a stadium rather than the U.S. Capitol.
Maureen
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:30 pm
George Bush lied, and THOUSANDS of our finest young men are DEAD, MAIMED, OR MENTALLY DAMAGED because of it…(*see so called weapons of mass destruction) where was all this “outrage then ! OH I forgot…….. HE WAS WHITE !!!
Steveo
September 10th, 2009
3:34 pm
We all should commend joe for speaking out and calling a spade a spade or a lie is a lie its why we vote politicians into office, I feel for all those that cant speak up for thereselfs and thanks joe for speaking out for me and millions of other fellow americans your a true american hero.
Unbelieveable
September 10th, 2009
3:54 pm
Between the nonsense over preventing kids from watching the Predidential adress to students, to Joe Wilson’s outlandish beavior, this has not been one of America’s finest weeks. The rudeness and ignorance are embarassing.
Rich
September 10th, 2009
4:04 pm
Maureen, I just love how you leftists can wholly ignore the past. It is the Left that borked Judge Bork, stifled free speech on college campuses (i.e., Columbia University), intimidated voters (Philadephia 2008) and heckled at Presidential speeches (Pres. Bush’s 2005 State of the Union), yet Joe Wilson’s the bad guy? Republicans are amateurs at this stuff compared to you guys.
American woman
September 10th, 2009
4:07 pm
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:30 pm
George Bush lied, and THOUSANDS of our finest young men are DEAD, MAIMED, OR MENTALLY DAMAGED because of it…(*see so called weapons of mass destruction) where was all this “outrage then ! OH I forgot…….. HE WAS WHITE !!!
Ma’am, just because you disagree with someone of a different racial makeup than yourself does not mean that you a racist. It may and usually does, mean that you have a different opinion.
As far as telling someone they are idiots, calling their children idiots and telling them to leave, THAT was rude. I disagree with 90% of what the president says, and I do believe that he lied last night. I also believe that Mr. Wilson should have better manners than to blurt out his opinion in such an atmosphere, but I don’t find fault with the gist of his message. Go ahead and tell me to leave and how brave young people have died in the war. I know it. I have a Bronze Medal winner in my immediate family, in addition to another member in the military currently, and my family has had someone fighting in every war this nation has seen since the French and Indian war. This is my country and I am not leaving, and it is Mrs. Demarco’s country and I don’t expect her to leave either, and I don’t even know her.
Joey
September 10th, 2009
4:20 pm
Joe Wilson was not the first House Member or Senator to shout or boo rudely to a sitting President while he was speaking. But I am pretty sure this is the first time Maureen Downey publically objected to such behavior.
Consider it a Teachable Moment for you and other parents.
Dunwoody Mom
September 10th, 2009
4:28 pm
Actually, Joey, this is the first time anyone, Republican or Democrat can remember a member of Congress shouting out to the President during an official speech. You right-wingers keeps saying Obama is lying about not covering illegal aliens, but it is there in the Healthcare proporsal in black and white – THEY ARE NOT COVERED. You just don’t want to see it. But, this reflects badly on your and your ilk – not the President.
jim d
September 10th, 2009
4:33 pm
liar or truth sayer—matters not. The office (if not the man) commands respect. Wilson was clearly in the wrong.
Dunwoody Mom
September 10th, 2009
4:36 pm
This has not been the best week for the Republicans. Perhaps they need to take a long, hard look at the type of individuals they have allowed to take over the Republican party.
oldtimer
September 10th, 2009
4:40 pm
The demmos booed Bush a time or two. It is all politics. Be glad we don’t have to watch the British Parliment. This would be mild behavior. I think they pride themselves on being rude to Prime Ministeres.
oldtimer
September 10th, 2009
4:41 pm
And Joey…you are so right.
Toto: exposing the man behind the curtain
September 10th, 2009
4:55 pm
Just the facts please. Could it be that old whitey Joe actually had a reason to yell? If Obama was speaking of the full House Bill HR3200, then it appears that Obama was “incorrect”. With but a few limited EXCEPTIONS, the bill does not exclude illegals from most coverage provisions. Regarding health care exchanges, the CONGRESSIONAL RESEARCH SERVICE found:
“H.R. 3200 does not contain any restrictions on noncitizens – whether legally or illegally present, or in the United States temporarily or permanently-participating in the Exchange.”
President Obama wanted a full House vote to pass HR3200 before the last recess, so one could conclude that he supported covererage for illegals.
For more details see
http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2009/09/house-bill-does-cover-illegals.html
The author is an Associate Clinical Professor of Law, Cornell Law School, Ithaca, NY
rebecca lehman
September 10th, 2009
5:02 pm
Respect; we had to hold our tongues during the Bush lies…8 years worth
of deception…now what…we are in a depression, because Bushy was covered by other idiots that only leaked what they wanted the public to
hear; we are still uncovering all the lies, and coverups to this day.
Again, rich white boys can do just about anything in this country; I am
a white woman, and I am sick of all the white trash this country needs to contend with. There are some very scary rednecks in this country!
Cere
September 10th, 2009
5:11 pm
He says he won’t sign it if it adds to the deficit – but guess what – he doesn’t have to sign it! The bill will become law simply after sitting on Obama’s desk for 10 days after Congress approves.
jim d
September 10th, 2009
5:16 pm
To reitterate–it doesn’t matter if he lied. He can talk all the smack he wants to–what we should concern ourselves with is are or congressmen smart enough to read the damn bill before signing on to it? If they are not, I suggest you start considering who you can support in the next election cycle.
Mr. Obama can not pass this legislation only congress can. GET REAL people
thebob.bob
September 10th, 2009
5:18 pm
Joe Wilson is angry, bitter and full of hate. His Party dismantled necessary government oversight and let the banks and insurance companies wreck the economy. His Party started an unnecessary, trillion dollar war based on lies. His Party claimed to be the “Morality” party and got busted with male meth prostitutes, in airport bathrooms, cheating on their wives while praying on C street with ‘the family’. His Party claims to be the “Christian Party” and fights like made to keep medical care from the poorest Americans.
Joe Wilson represents his Conservative Christian district perfectly. He’ll get re-elected.
Censure the lout!
DB
September 10th, 2009
5:26 pm
There is a time and a place for everything. President Obama was making a speech to Congress. He was not conducting a Q&A session. The time for Mr. Wilson to make his objections known was AFTER the speech, not during it. (But I guess he realized that, media being what it is, no one would have come to a press conference that *he* called to discuss his objections, and this was his only shot.) But to slander the President of the United State on public TV during a speech to Congress and the Nation? Tacky, tacky, tacky.
Maureen, if I had been you, I would have gotten the telephone number for the landscape company, called immediately, and complained about the rudeness of the driver. Assuming that he wasn’t the owner, no landscape company needs that kind of marketing!
@Rebecca – we’re in a recession (not a depression) due primarily to the changes in financial industry safeguards that were changed when CLINTON signed into law the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act in 1999. If you want to play the blame game, at least get the names right.
AlreadySheared
September 10th, 2009
5:37 pm
MDowney:
“What did children learn today from Joe Wilson?”
Yeah, like your topic really has ANYTHING with education, or kids.
It would have been miles more honest to say “Forget about the school thing today – how about that Joe Wilson?”
Given your allusion to “Bush Lied and People Died” in another blog title last week, I can’t say I’m real surprised.
Do us a favor and stick to educational topics in this (education) blog.
If you REALLY need to, surely there’s an outlet for you to get your partisan politics on elsewhere on ajc.com.
Laura
September 10th, 2009
6:24 pm
I’m going to have to back up what AlreadySheared said. Are four separate blog posts on President Obama related to education? Unless he was standing up discussing NCLB or the latest bi-partisan piece of misinformed education legislation last night, then no. It doesn’t, outside of perhaps a government class.
I’d prefer to discuss politics on the politics blogs, or with my friends. I check Get Schooled for people’s opinions about pressing issues involving education, not to have to read someone’s political opinions.
catlady
September 10th, 2009
6:30 pm
The best teaching would have been for the police to have escorted Mr. Wilson out of the Chamber.
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
7:02 pm
DB, I did call the company and left a message upon getting voicemail, but I am pretty sure that the voice on the message matched the nut at the gas station. No one called be back. I have to wonder how well he’s doing as a business owner in the customer service area aftering seeing how he deals with anger.
Maureen
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
7:17 pm
Laura, After covering education for 12 years, I came to realize how much of it was politics. In fact, I talked to a former ed department employee this week who told me that his job was 2 percent education and 98 percent politics – which is why he left.
That said, I have posted several other blogs this week dealing with what I think you would consider straight education. I hope you will participate on those discussions.
One of the balancing acts with a blog is to offer topics that interest the serious followers of the issue and the dabblers.
The usual complaint I get is that the blog speaks to teachers too much and not enough to parents.
I am hoping to strike the right balance but may not always hit the mark.
Maureen Downey
OvenBaked
September 10th, 2009
8:12 pm
Where was the outrage and the heckling when former President G. W. Bush lied about the weapons of mass destruction? Where was the outrage with the G. W. Bush administration when as the financial system was crumbling? Where was the outrage when the Patriot Act was signed that allowed the government to put any and everyone on watch lists as suspected terrorist? Where was the outrage when he signed the No Child Left Behind Act that has essentially left children behind? Where was the outrage when G. W. Bush signed the bill that gave corporations greater power that allowed them to handcuff consumers with unfair and unethical business practices? Our country is becoming broke because of this “war”. Where is the outrage? Sun Tzu stated thousands of years ago that any nation that engages in protracted wars (lasting more than a year) would begin to lose its wealth and the moral of its people will decline. He also said that when the country’s treasure is spent, people’s homes will be stripped bare and three tenths of their income will be dissipated. These things have come to pass.
Think about it. Why do you all think Colin Powell left while leaving was good? He knew the principles of the Art of War and the administration he was a part of violated each and everyone which has caused this country to lose its stance and ardor. Now people want to take out their frustration on our new Leader. The American people should scrutinize every thing that is said by our government officials and hold them accountable for our welfare. However, why did we acquiesce to the government being able to take away our freedoms and make us afraid ( and they gave us a level system of how much to be afraid orange, yellow, red or something like that)? We allowed this. What are we going to do to hold Congress accountable? Other nations are laughing at us right now. America’s true character will be tested for the next 7 years. So far we come up wanting.
BILLY
September 10th, 2009
8:19 pm
susan demarco-you are stupid.all your kind of people think Obama can BRAINWASH CONGRESS and have all the laws.if so maybe he could do some reverse slavery and maybe then you might understand…Diploma or GED……stupid
jay
September 10th, 2009
8:22 pm
Susan Demarco husband is a doctor. I know and that is why she is so upset with Obama’s health care plan. She’s afraid her husband, the doctor, salary will dip.
Lee
September 10th, 2009
8:28 pm
Wilson was wrong for calling out, the Democrats had already turned the speech into a circus act by jumping up and giving a standing O when Obama called talked radio hosts liars.
So what is the difference, other than good manners in this country are spiraling downward faster than the value of our currency.
V for Vendetta
September 10th, 2009
8:35 pm
jim d is completely in the right here. I honestly don’t know why anyone who considers himself a conservative would align with the philosophically bankrupt Republican party. The have shown for many years now that they are uninterested in championing the values they once held to be their core beliefs. Branding oneself a Republican in 2009 is akin to branding oneself a bigoted, religious fundamentalist.
I would prefer a political party that believed in individualism, capitalism, and minimal government–the classically liberal beliefs of the Founding Fathers. However, no one seems to remember them (the beliefs OR the Founding Fathers).
OvenBaked
September 10th, 2009
8:36 pm
Maureen,
You speak correctly when you stated that education is politics. If it were not political, educational programs would not be cut. If it were not politics, teachers would not be getting furloughed. If it were not political, school districts would not be accepting federal money and following there guidelines in order to keep the money. When state legislators change so does edcuational policies and priorities. This is why as a parent I don’t blame teachers if my child is not learning something because schools are not going to make sure that children receive a broad edcuation. It is my responsibility as a parent to identify how my child learns and provide experiences that will allow growth. Good schools will do this. Unfortunantly, there are not that many.
Old Physics Teacher
September 10th, 2009
8:44 pm
Toto,
Sorry, your statement about illegial aliens is incorrect according to http://www.factcheck.org/2009/09/obamas-health-care-speech/
You have the right to your opinion; you do not have the right to your own facts. Rather than make up your mind by reading liberal blogs or conservative blogs to find out “truth”, why don’t you check out “non-partisan” websites for reality? Obama is not a Saint or Devil. Neither was Bush 43. They neither lied or told the truth. They are politicians; they live on the edge of reality.
Before you give up your rights to think to someone on radio or tv, with a vested interest in having you think like them, GET THE FACTS FROM A NON-BIASED SOURCE. BTW, neither Keith Oberman nor Rush Limbaugh fit that definition.
TW
September 10th, 2009
8:51 pm
Maureen – GREAT post today. Keep up the good work
SuperB
September 10th, 2009
8:57 pm
Why don’t we just divide the US into two countries: Red America and Blue America. One could spend a trillion dollars fighting a war in Iraq and using the sanctimony of their religion to openly bash anyone who doesn’t see it their way. The other would spend their money on the environment, health care, and improving the life of the needy. We wll know which country Joe Wilson and his minions would choose. Rattle the sabres, load the muskets!
Matt and Jack's Mom
September 10th, 2009
8:58 pm
In response to Behind the Curtain’s post, clearly you were not taught about verifying the validity of your sources. If you would like to read the bill to which he was referring, would do well going to a reputable source. Try http://www.whitehouse.gov. to find accurate information. Please keep in mind that these bills are still being debated in committee. If you are unfamiliar with how that process works, please refer to a civics book.
As for the original question, Rep. Joe Wilson behaved badly and has brought shame upon his office.
Sue
September 10th, 2009
9:02 pm
Thanks for echoing our voice, Joe Wilson. We the people were finally heard.
TW
September 10th, 2009
9:14 pm
Sue – thanks for qualifying yourself as an idiot.
SuperB – well said. Who needs al qaeda when you have the Republicans?
Philip D. Hansten
September 10th, 2009
9:19 pm
You quote Michel de Montaigne at the top of this article…more of his wisdom can be found in this new book–
Premature Factulation: The Ignorance of Certainty and the Ghost of Montaigne
by Philip D. Hansten
info at http://www.Philoponus.com/
math 88
September 10th, 2009
9:21 pm
I was once a diehard right winger, but the more outlandish nutjob fruitloops I hear talking the more liberal I become. What has happened to true conservatism? It has been hijacked by a bunch of ignorant neocons!
Jacks Mum
September 10th, 2009
9:27 pm
I think it is very valid for a wife of a doctor to be concerned about government limiting or lowering his salary. My husband is a doctor, we scrimped and saved and ate Ramen Noodles all through medical school. We gave up vacations and new clothes and eating out for years while he built a practice. We sometimes skip on our luxuries so he can treat people who need to be treated who do not have the money to pay. Now that he has built a successful business, is a very well compensated doctor and business man, we have every right to speak up when the government wants to set limits on our ability to earn.
How would you react if your boss (President) was decided that you (Dr.) were overcompensated and the guy that sits next to you (Insurance Company), who found a way to overlap your work, was given a huge raise in pay with a guarantee for life of continued income, and your salary was cut to pay for it? Would you quietly return to work and not complain or fight for what was right?
Maureen's accountability metric
September 10th, 2009
9:30 pm
File this one under AJC accountability metric. If we are going to talk about anything and everything even remotely related to education today let’s discuss this.
“Roswell man earned Purple Heart a few days before dieing (sic) in ambush.”
This headline is on the AJC home page! This isn’t a typo; this is a “I don’t know”. How embarrassing! Yet another example of how the AJC’s credibility is “dieing” a little bit more, each and every day.
Clay
September 10th, 2009
9:32 pm
I think it’s outrageous that the same people who think the “You lie” shout is the most disrespectful display of all time are the same people who think the Bush shoe throwing incident was the funniest thing they ever saw. You members of the lunatic left represent nothing but hatred and hypocricy and I feel sorry for you all.
By the way, you are not a racist and a hater just for not loving Obama. It’s not my fault you guys elected a political lightweight with no ability to lead effectively. Can he talk? Heck, yes, he can. He’s a great speaker. He’s proving himself more and more to be a pitiful president. Thank God this Obamacare nightmare will guarantee we only have to put up with 4 years of this joker.
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:32 pm
Wilson was wrong for doing what he did and he apologized. When is Obama going to apologize for all the lies he’s told, promises he made during his campaign speeches that he’s not kept. As far as the lies Bush told about Iraq….seems that a lot of the Dems thought the same thing, guess they lied too, huh? Wake up almost all politicians lie or say what they think the majority of the particular audience wants to hear. It’s all a game to them but we the American people are the losers.
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:34 pm
math 88 you’re a poser!
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:36 pm
Jacks Mum, great post. Nowadays those that work hard and earn a good living are looked down upon (unless you’re a politician). It’s called wealth envy.
Clay's Mama
September 10th, 2009
9:37 pm
‘How would you react if your boss (President) was decided that you (Dr.) were overcompensated and the guy that sits next to you (Insurance Company), who found a way to overlap your work, was given a huge raise in pay with a guarantee for life of continued income, and your salary was cut to pay for it? Would you quietly return to work and not complain or fight for what was right?’
Perhaps you should take some of that fat, Dr. cash and go back to school yourself. Your post makes absolutely no sense at all.
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:38 pm
Clay’s mama, apparently you can understand plain English, it makes perfect sense.
Clay's Mama
September 10th, 2009
9:41 pm
Yes, I ‘can’ understand – you are correct about me. You, on the other hand, have just tossed Bush’s salad. Thus, we know you ain’t got no brain.
Jacks Mum
September 10th, 2009
9:44 pm
Clay’s Mama, I do not expect someone who doesn’t have a boss, who lives off the kindness or tax burden of others to understand why anyone should expect to keep what they earn.
Thanks nana!
MIchael J. McFadden
September 10th, 2009
9:44 pm
Actually, you can NOT accuse Wilson of slander. You can argue about whether Obama lied regarding immigration and health care, but you can NOT argue about his lie on the Today show about not raising taxes on smokers as shown in the video I linked above at 3:19.
Unless you want to consider them vermin instead of people.
Michael J. McFadden
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
Clay's Mama
September 10th, 2009
9:50 pm
Oh, Heavens! I’m sooooo sorry! Of course, NObody has ever worked as hard as Jacks Mum! Oh my, having to eat those noodles and go to college! Wow!
Maybe you could webcam your story to our soldiers overseas – let them see just how easy they have it…wait….that’s right – those soldiers are just part of that ridiculous government of ours that does nothing but punish the real hard workers like yourself.
Brenda J
September 10th, 2009
9:54 pm
I am just so amazed when people that consider themselves intelligent and talk about lying continue to do so even to themselves. This whole argument is about the rich and the poor it has nothing to do with anything else. The rich want the healthcare to stay as it currently is so they won’t lose mone on their investments and the poor just want some help. If you have ever been out of a job and unable to afford healthcare then you might understand. Now I don’t know if the President is lying or not about the illegal aliens getting healthcare but I do know that Wilson is a rude slob for yelling out when the President was speaking. Heckling with boos and yelling out a direct insult are two different things. No one ever yelled out you lie to Bush even though he was caught out there with his pants down more than once. In fact I don’t recall any of the hate that PRESIDENT OBAMA receives directed toward Bush at all. Whether you like it or not he is the President and no matter what happens he will go down in history being just that. The whole world is watching the disrespect that is now being shown to the office and the US is being laughed at daily. Why not get on board and try to help out. Stop it with the racism. Most black people try to forget the past but with the actions of Wilson how can it be done? He would never have done that to Bush and you all know why. Get over yourselvesI heard that if ou already have insurance there will be no changes. You with the cigarette tax, stop smoking and teach the President a lesson. You don’t have to smoke to live do you? So why pay the tax if you don’t have to???? DUH!!!!!
Jacks Mum
September 10th, 2009
9:57 pm
Question, does Obama buy his own cigarettes? If so, does he pay the taxes or buy direct?
MrLiberty
September 10th, 2009
9:59 pm
Unfortunately our congress just sits by while president after president bombards the airwaves with lies and half-truths. Unfortunately, unlike our British counterparts who do speak out vocally in parliament, our congress just sits with their mouths closed and their heads up their asses.
It is a shame that it took this guy to point out what most americans have already figured out – that most of what is being said about this health care plan and its REAL impact is a lie or at best, a blatant misrepresentation of the realities to come.
What children in america learned from this speech is that at some point you have to stop holding your tongue and speak out. If more americans had done that under Bush the imperial presidency would be that much weaker today, and the threat of a dictatorial takeover of our country would be a bit further from reality.
I can only hope that the rest of america got the message that we can no longer sit idly by while politicians lie to us and steal both our wealth and freedom for the benefit of the banking community and the military industrial complex.
Speak out as loud as you can and tell all of your representatives to restore the constitution, restore liberty, and End the Fed.
Rural Education
September 10th, 2009
10:05 pm
Let’s be honest the Republican “Junta” has no interest in anything positive. They are determined to destroy Obama even if the country suffers. When they surrendered the leadership of their party to “entertainers” Hannity and Limbaugh they lost all chance of being taken seriously.
Clay's Mama
September 10th, 2009
10:13 pm
MrLiberty, you are an anarchist. You wouldn’t know liberty if it sat on your face. Perhaps you shouldn’t drink so much?
reality
September 10th, 2009
10:33 pm
The kids should learn that they will spend most of their lives paying for Obozo’s inane policies. And that he is a liar. And that dimocrats did the same thing to George Bush during a State of the Union address.
reality
September 10th, 2009
10:35 pm
“George Bush lied, and THOUSANDS of our finest young men are DEAD, MAIMED, OR MENTALLY DAMAGED because of it…(*see so called weapons of mass destruction) where was all this “outrage then ! OH I forgot…….. HE WAS WHITE !!!’
Who is killing them now, twit?
V for Vendetta
September 10th, 2009
10:36 pm
Brenda J,
It’s not about the rich and the poor; it’s about the producers and the moochers.
Rural Education,
I somewhat agree, but I think the party became more of a laughing stock when it surrendered itself to Jesus. Hannity, Limbaugh, O’Reilly, etc. were never worth taking seriously in the first place.
algonquin J. Calhoun
September 10th, 2009
11:17 pm
Here is the email I sent to Joe Wilson last night: Your behavior tonight gives new meaning to the term ‘low country.’ You should be as ashamed of your conduct as the good people of South Carolina undoubtedly are! President Obama campaigned on bringing health care reform to this nation. Your party, which is in the pocket of the insurance thieves, has done nothing but distort, tell outright lies and try to subvert the will of the majority of Americans. Your ill-mannered display, while totally disgusting, is nothing new for Republicans. We expect neanderthal behavior!
algonquin J. Calhoun
September 10th, 2009
11:21 pm
Who is killing them now, twit?
You’re the twit, you war-criminal supporting, Rush (pillpopper) Limburger listening, Hannity saluting, Ann (orexic) Coulter reading douchebag!
Beautiful Monte
September 10th, 2009
11:24 pm
After reading several of Ms. Downey’s blogs over the past couple of weeks, I can’t decide if she’s ignorant, or incredibly dishonest.
Since she is a PROUD graduate of Columbia – just ask her, she’ll tell you! – I will assume she isn’t dumb.
Therefore, I can only deduce that the misinformation she continues to spread on her blog is an intentional effort to mislead people.
With such crooks on the payroll, it’s no wonder the newspaper business is a dying industry.
BTW, Ms. Downey, are you aware that the ENTIRE Democratic delegation booed and heckled President Bush during his 2005 State of the Union Address? Would you consider using THAT episode as a “teachable” moment?
Cere
September 10th, 2009
11:43 pm
Our Congress hasn’t always been prone to decorum. Rent the mini-series “John Adams”, and see how our original Congress argued, fought and debated for months before compromising on any decision. John Adams himself was disgusted with the now-famous serene painting of the signing of the Declaration of Independence – as the scene in reality was anything but serene – it was very contentious – months of yelling went on. I wish we would act more like the Brits – and more like our original Continental Congress – hash it out people – that’s what you’re sent in there to do. Has anyone actually read the thing? I’ve tried to read parts of it — the bill out of the House is total legal gibberish. And – there’s really nothing in there to make access to free healthcare illegal for illegals… so even though Wilson shouted disrespectfully, he wasn’t wrong in his claim. Sorry, but it’s true. And it’s also true that no one knows how we are going to afford it. Prepare for 50-60% income tax rates – that’s what people are paying in the countries with public health care.
I agree – this is no longer an education blog, is it? Maureen – your liberal beliefs are showing — why don’t you do some serious investigating of our new state math curriculum… it’s dangerous, IMO – and now Kathy Cox is saying the state will be making cuts to math tutorials! Yikes!
Maureen's accountability metric
September 11th, 2009
12:01 am
Maureen laments that so much of education is political, but then she wants us to believe her views as expressed in the AJC have nothing to do with politics, but are in fact written with a “single lens focus” on “what’s best for Georgia’s students?”
Is this the AJC or Comedy Central’s website?
Toto: exposing the man behind the curtain
September 11th, 2009
12:23 am
Old Physics Teacher
If you had taken the time to “fact check” Walter Annenberg’s bio, you might not have fallen prey to his Foundation’s spin. http://www.answers.com/topic/walter-annenberg Rush can’t hold a candle to this guy. Also, if you had bothered to read my link, you would have found this statement to counter Fact Check’s claim:
“One of the talking points I have seen in numerous comments posted around the blogosphere is that Obama was correct because Section 246 of the House Bill excludes illegals from receiving individual Affordability credits. That is true, and one of the few EXCEPTIONS under the Bill. But it is the EXCEPTION that proves the rule. As the Congressional Research Service found, illegal aliens can participate in most of the critical aspects of the government health system INCLUDING THE HEALTH CARE EXCHANGES.
It also would be interesting to see how long the exclusion of illegal aliens from getting the credits lasted, since as the CRS notes, illegal aliens are subject to the health care mandate; one can anticipate the argument that if the House Bill requires illegals to have qualified health insurance, some accomodation needs to be made for those who cannot afford it.”
doctor T
September 11th, 2009
1:15 am
It’s all hate because Obama shocked crackers by winning the President of the United States. Get over it honky, Black Presidents today, tomorrow, and forever.
Toto: exposing the man behind the curtain
September 11th, 2009
1:21 am
Matt and Jack’s Mom:
My civics book says the legislative branch gets to make law. The White House website won’t be of much help.
TREATMENT OF NON-CITIZENS IN HR-3200
http://www.scribd.com/doc/19592760/Treatment-of-Non-Citizens-in-HR-3200
The full House Bill HR3200 (The one the President tried to railroad through by August)
http://docs.house.gov/edlabor/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf
Senate HELP Committee bill (this is a draft and not a full Senate proposal)
http://help.senate.gov/BAI09A84_xml.pdf
Is this “reputable” enough? Why don’t you read the documents for yourself. Perhaps you will reconsider your position.
There is nothing new under the sun…
Presidents Clinton and Bush were both “Booed” by Congress:
http://mediamatters.org/research/200502040014
Dr. Craig Spinks /Augusta
September 11th, 2009
1:45 am
Unfortunately, Mr. Wilson’s recent, well-documented rudeness in the U.S. House Chamber mirrors the misbehavior which dominates many, if not most, American classrooms. A responsible citizenry should tolerate such incivility in neither place.
Facts Please
September 11th, 2009
7:47 am
Joe Wilson had it right and I am one who will applaud his outburst. We dont have enough Joe Wilsons in congress who will actually speak out on a lie and a disaster for the american people.
What is totaly against my values is Princess Nancy Pelosi standing there and telling you that a public option must be included as it will save the industry hundreds of millions of dollars. That is the biggest lie yet. What the public option will do is force millions of companies to join the public option or be fined or shut down completely. Also add to that the hundreds of thousands of americans who will be let go as these insurance companies shut their doors because they cant compete with the laws that the government sets for insurance and then breaks every one of them for their own purposes.
jim d
September 11th, 2009
7:49 am
Most kids should have taken a little something from this incident.
They should have learned how to make an apology when you are wrong.
History buff
September 11th, 2009
8:02 am
Oh you people loving Obama and his health care plan. Against the constitution and illegal as hell it is. Educate yourselves.
Roosevelt – A democrate- introduced Social Security. It was to be voluntary and deductable from income tax. Was to be used for only Social security puposes only and no other government agency could touch it. Now read the following:
If I recall correctly, 1958 is the first year that Congress, not President Eisenhower, voted to remove funds from Social Security and put it into the General Fund for Congress to spend. It was a democratically controlled Congress. Congress’ logic at that time was that there was so much money in Social Security Fund that it would never run out / be used up for the purpose it was intended / set aside for.
Question: Which Political Party took Social Security from the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ and put it into the General Fund so that Congress could spend it?
Answer: It was Lyndon B. Johnson (Democrat, Term of Office: November 22,1963 to January 20, 1969) and the democratically Controlled House and Senate.
Question: Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?
Answer: The Democratic Party, with Albert Arnold Gore, Jr. (Al Gore) [Vice President Term of Office: January 10, 1993 to January 20, 2001] casting the ‘tie-breaking’ deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the US ….
AND MY FAVORITE
Which Political Party decided to start giving Annuity payments to immigrants?
JAMES EARL CARTER, JR. (JIMMY CARTER) (DEMOCRAT, TERM OF OFFICE: JANUARY 20, 1977 TO JANUARY 20, 1981 AND THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.
IMMIGRANTS MOVED INTO THIS COUNTRY, AND AT AGE 65, BEGAN TO RECEIVE SOCIAL SECURITY PAYMENTS: THE DEMOCRATIC PARTYGAVE THESE PAYMENTS TO THEM,EVEN THOUGH THEY NEVER
PAID A DIME INTO IT!
The way I see it, Democrates have been very high on spending money that does not belong to them and taking care of people who dont belong here or have no rights to the programs they get. Social Security is not a general fund, that is our money that we put away to live off of. You can see how congress (democrate congress) has protected you over the years and now you want to believe more lies as they set out to distroy our healthcare. They are telling you now that social security will not be there for you. In ten years of government controled healtcare, that wont be there for you either. They will take the money out of that to spend where they see it also. Its a never ending saga and for those of you who fall for it and dont fight to get your freedoms back, well dont cry when its your family you are forced to watch die from no good medical care.
Facts are facts – go look it up.
Way to go congressman for stating the obvious in front of millions of americans. Obama is a lier and its time we stop the fraud right now.
By the way, how can one become president of the US when he went to college on foreign student grants? Just wondering. A US Citizen is not qualified for foreign grants IS HE? Thus college records locked so nobody can read them………………….
whatever
September 11th, 2009
8:08 am
Dear arealblkwmn. You call anybody that disagrees with our current President a racist and say that they should leave the country until his term is over. What planet are you from? Also you sure don’t believe in the teachings of the Reverend Martin Luther King JR, Do you? You know the little unimportant (in your book) of judging a man not by the color of his skin but by the content of his character. Then you go on to try to trash a former President. Did YOU leave when he was in office? NO you just sat around talking trash during his administration. so why should we leave?
As for Joe Wilson. Is what he did rude? Yes. Was it said in the Wrong place? possibly. Was it the truth? Joe Wilson believes so. And so do over half the population of the country. Am I racist for thinking so? No because I think Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid are Liars too and they sure aren’t black. And President Obama? He is not to be trusted because he comes out of the Chicago Political Machine. And THAT is what makes him crooked and untrustworthy, NOT the color of his skin. Not everybody that comes out of Chicago Politics is crooked but I would bet that 99.9% of them are. Be they Republican, Democrat,or Independent. Or White, Black, or any other skin color.
SouthernGal
September 11th, 2009
8:22 am
They learned that we have the right to “free speech” but that we also must face the consequences of exercising that freedom.
Dunwoody Mom
September 11th, 2009
8:38 am
Well, I learned Joe Wilson is a hypocrite and does not want to take care of our military personnel:
“…Wilson voted 11 times against health care for veterans in eight years, even as he voted “aye” for the Iraq War (during the debate on the war vote, he even called one Democrat “viscerally anti-American”─several times). He voted to cut veterans’ benefits─not his own─to make room for President George W. Bush’s tax cuts. He repeatedly voted for budgets that slashed funding to the Veterans Administration and TRICARE. And perhaps most bizarrely, he refused─repeatedly─to approve Democratic-led initiatives that would have extended TRICARE coverage to all reservists and National Guard members, even though a disproportionate number of them have served multiple tours in Iraq and Afghanistan─and many lost access to their civilian work benefits when they did so..What does that mean? Nothing─except that Joe Wilson was against government-run health care before he was for it. And now he’s against it again. Just not when it comes to his own flesh and blood…”
Debby
September 11th, 2009
8:47 am
Ironically, Michael Vick spoke to school children this week and no one protested about that. Shows how bad our parenting is.
Rick in Grayson
September 11th, 2009
8:58 am
Americans need to confront politicians that lie or don’t tell the whole truth to the public. Joe Wilson is a hero and Democrats that hide their intention to provide healthcare to illegal aliens are despicable.
Cere
September 11th, 2009
9:05 am
Touche Debby!
Virginia
September 11th, 2009
9:32 am
Ok, to the whiner who is mad because his tobacco is costing too much, maybe it is a sign you should quit. My parents smoked in the house my entire life and that caused me to have severe allergy problems and other health issues that I can’t take care of because I am a student without HEALTH INSURANCE. You must be one of the lucky people who has health insurance..the saying goes..you never know what you’ve got til it’s gone. Don’t take it for granted. Nobody is stuffing the cigs in your mouth and forcing you to smoke, so don’t whine about the price. What an idiot.
I am embarrassed to be from the South with people like Joe Wilson speaking out and calling the President a liar. Regardless of your feelings about the President, you should still have enough respect and honor for the office not to act out in such a way, and especially not in the middle of a speech. Have your fun having the dueling press conferences before and after the speech, but don’t interrupt. How rude. He should not have a job, and the people of South Carolina should be embarrassed for electing him.
Dunwoody Mom
September 11th, 2009
9:37 am
Excellent point Debby.
MIchael J. McFadden
September 11th, 2009
10:19 am
Well Good Morning Virginia.
It’s good to see that you read my post. Did you follow the link to see if I was telling the truth? My guess from your ire is that you did, but just checking.
Regarding your health insurance, the “idiots” you refer to are trying to help you out. Obama knew the nonsmokers in this country wouldn’t stand for the tax increase necessary to support their children’s health so he just taxed the smokers for it under S-CHIP. Which, as I pointed out above, shows his lie.
In terms of allergies, did you know that asthma has gone UP roughly 400% in the US in the last 20 years while secondary smoke exposure by children has gone DOWN by almost 300% ? Some of the newer research out there indicates that children of atopic sensitive smokers develop far fewer allergy problems later in life than children of smokers. If it wasn’t for your parents it’s quite possible your problems would actually be worse.
Much easier to jump on the bandwagon and blame them of course, but you might want to read
“Smoking linked to reduced allergic sensitization” ; David Holmes ; 21 January 2008 ; J Allergy Clin Immunol 2008; 121: 38-42
for background.
Michael J. McFadden
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
Duke
September 11th, 2009
10:26 am
This morning I listened to an Iranian who said that the key to cooperation among nations is not necessarily liking each other, but agreeing to play by the rules. I thought how applicable that was even within a country like America, where racial and political fissures run deep. Now we have South Carolina Representative Joe Wilson’s drastically uncivil outburst in calling President Obama a liar in front of America and the world. Before then, we Americans expected our elected officials to play by the rules, at least in the setting of a presidential address. You just do not do what Joe Wilson did. The rules of civility were further eroded. How can our elected officials expect the world to play by the rules when they themselves do not?
MIchael J. McFadden
September 11th, 2009
11:05 am
Duke, I agree fully with your point. The rules in our Congress are very different than the different (and far more entertaining) rules over in the UK. Wilson needs to apologize for his behavior although not for the substance of what he said.
- MJM
Working Stiff
September 11th, 2009
11:15 am
Arealblkwmn – you are a racist. Your comments are disgusting.
I have worked for 35 years and have had to pay for my own health care. I do NOT want to pay for yours or anyone elses who sits around with their hands out waiting for others to provide for them. Do you not realize that you are supporting someone who wants to take away our freedom one piece at a time?? Wake up, it would not be free health care
for anyone. Call someone in Canada and talk to them about how satisified they are with their government health care.
Joe Wilson was expressing his freedom of speech. There is nothing wrong with that.
The only way I would support this public option is if there were a condition in it requiring participants to have filed income taxes for the past 5 years… The hardworking taxpayers are the ones who will carry the financial load for this.
My nephew just returned from Afganistan after being seriously injured in a roadside bombing there. He is 23 years old and his life will never be the same. I have a problem with a president who is trying to prosecute members of the former administration for their interrogation tactics of these terrorists. Wake up and smell the coffee, honey.
gc
September 11th, 2009
11:39 am
yall just mad and ignorant…get over it and grow up…I applaud rebecca lehman and arealblwmn
Me
September 11th, 2009
12:29 pm
Ok, for all the Bush haters out there. Our troups did find WMDs, but they were in pieces – basically they found all of the ingredients but because they were not ‘mixed together’ we can’t legally call them WMDs. We have SEVERAL military friends who have been in Iraq and they all back up this claim so stop watching CNN and listening to Michael Moore for all of your information. Also, this constant Bush beating is old news. Yo-ur guy is in the Big Office now so all of his followers had better be able to take the dishing out that they have done for years! And no, it isn’t about race. None of this is. It is about EXTREME liberal views that will destroy the fabric of what made this country great.
JCAR
September 11th, 2009
12:39 pm
It is a sad day in America when elected officials display such ignorance. Joe Wilson needs to apologize to the America people on national televison.
ugh
September 11th, 2009
2:25 pm
I can’t read this crap anymore. I’ll come back to reading this blog when you post something relevant to education.
Maureen Downey
September 11th, 2009
2:56 pm
Ugh, I think you missed the the two education entries that are posted, including one on charter schools. Maureen
Chris
September 11th, 2009
3:16 pm
Susan Demarco…..YOU LIE! You are a liar, and chances are you are too ignorant to know it…..lol You Republicans should educate yourself. It really shows that Obama won the top 16 states in education level, and 19 of the top 20. Meanwhile, the least educated states and counties consistently go to the Republicans. that’s a fact! and yet you keep celebrating your ignrance…..lol
Chris
September 11th, 2009
3:20 pm
With respect to Michael McFadden above, the cigarette tax is an optional tax (similar to fair tax proposals)…….no one has to pay it, only those that choose to. If this new tax discourages some of the poorest to quit smoking, we’ll all be better off for it…..if not, they are only killing themselves, and costing me and everyone else taxes to pay for their condition. Further, you need to make the case that the increase in their cig tax exceeds the new tax breaks they are getting to honestly say that their taxes in whole have gone up.
Chris
September 11th, 2009
3:41 pm
Clays Mama…..can you please explain to me how it is you feel Healthcare reform will cause docs to lose money? If everyone is covered, there will be about 30 million new paying patients. That should make income opportunities go up!
math 88
September 11th, 2009
5:38 pm
nana-
If I’m a poser honey I’ve done a helluva job. I’ve voted republican in EVERY presidential election since I was 18. Most of the whack job republicans I see nowadays I CERTAINLY would not want to pose as…. trust me on that one.
Dr. Craig Spinks /Augusta
September 11th, 2009
5:57 pm
If civilization is founded upon civility, what is founded upon incivility?
MIchael J. McFadden
September 11th, 2009
7:29 pm
Chris, you wrote, “the cigarette tax is an optional tax (similar to fair tax proposals)…….no one has to pay it, only those that choose to”
Chris, the same argument could be made for a gasoline tax (you can always move closer to work and bicycle back and forth – also saves the pollution of literally millions of cigarettes!), property tax (rent an apartment if you choose not to pay it), and of course alcohol, entertainment, toll-road or junk-food taxes are all taxes that are arguably optional (actually, more optional than cigarette taxes if you happen to believe in the whole “cigarettes are more addictive than heroin” thing.). But they’re all taxes, and increasing them IS raising taxes. Any politician who raised ALL those taxes and then said “I didn’t raise taxes.” would be in a bit of a pickle, no? {Don’t get me started on pickle taxes!}
Re the costs for everyone, although that’s irrelevant to the question of the lie, I’d invite you to read my essay on that, “Taxes, Costs, and the MSA” at
http://pasan.thetruthisalie.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=7
The formatting is a bit off in places as it’s one of my book Appendices and I’m not very skilled at web formatting, but I’d be very happy to hear any substantive criticisms of it if you have any. I think the picture may be a bit different in reality from what you think.
Michael J. McFadden
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
MIchael J. McFadden
September 11th, 2009
7:58 pm
Chris wrote, “the cigarette tax is an optional tax (similar to fair tax proposals)…….no one has to pay it, only those that choose to.”
Chris, by the same token one could argue that other taxes are also optional: the gasoline tax (most folks could move closer to work and/or bicycle there), the entertainment, alcohol, and junk-food taxes obviously, and even toll-road taxes: just use back roads instead. But any politician who raised all of those and then went on to say “I’ve raised no taxes would quickly be handed their hat and shooed down the road. And if you happen to be one of those who like to argue that smoking is “more addictive than heroin” then your “optional” tax becomes even less optional than the other ones I mention.
As for the costs, I think you’ve read too much of the propaganda put out by antismoking-funded groups. Try reading “Taxes, Costs, and the MSA” at
http://pasan.thetruthisalie.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=7
and feel free to come back and offer any substantive criticisms that you might have. I think you’ll find the full story a bit different than the sound bites out there.
Michael J. McFadden
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
MIchael J. McFadden
September 12th, 2009
1:10 am
Sorry for the more or less doubled comment. I thought the first one got lost when my puter burped.
- MJM