What did children learn today from Joe Wilson?
“He who establishes his argument by noise and command shows that his reason is weak.” - Michel de Montaigne
I know some parents didn’t want their kids to hear President Obama this week.
I didn’t want my kids to hear U.S. Rep Joe Wilson. The South Carolina lawmaker shocked Republicans and Democrats alike and earned a reprimand from John McCain when he interrupted the president’s address by shouting, “You lie!” from the House floor.
It is very hard to teach kids common courtesy because we live in a world where shouting, denigration and hair pulling are TV entertainment. I hate the response “Shut up,” but it shows up in many children’s programs.
When Rep. Wilson interrupted the president on national TV, he demonstrated the behaviors that most parents work hard not to instill in their children. Don’t talk back to the teacher, the police officer or the boss. Be reasonable. Let the other person talk. Honor the time and place. Don’t grouse during the minister’s sermon that you’re thirsty, hungry, bored or tired. Don’t tell your grandmother she’s told you that story at least a million times.
Last month, I was getting gas at Kroger when a woman asked the driver of the landscaping truck at the pump across from me to move up because he was taking up two bays. He ignored her, so she drove to another bay. Before the guy left, he deliberately drove by her and loosed an obscenity-laden attack so vile that I was shocked. There were many parents with young kids getting gas as it was a Saturday morning, as well as a church youth group in a van.
And we worry about kids today?
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103 comments Add your comment
susan demarco
September 10th, 2009
3:18 pm
If you did not identify the lies obama was throwing out .. line after line, that is your falult.
i think your children will idenitfy with the TRUTH..
THIS WANNA BE EMPEROR HAS NO TRUTH.
BLESS JOE WILSON FOR BEING THE ONLY PERSON TO STATE THE TRUTH.
Michael J. McFadden
September 10th, 2009
3:19 pm
Joe Wilson’s attack may have been done rudely and badly, and I can’t speak to the truthfulness of the immigration claim but we *DO* know that Obama lied quite openly and blatantly to the American people on June 21st’s “Today Show” when he said, quoting here, “The only tax change I’ve made in the 6 months I’ve been here is to cut people’s taxes.”
- – -
He said that – despite the indisputable fact that he raised cigarette taxes by 150% and raised the tax on one of the poorest well-defined minority groups in the country, smokers so poor they roll their own from shreds of tobacco and scraps of paper, by OVER TWO THOUSAND PERCENT (from $1/lb to $24/lb). See :
- – -
http://pro-choicesmokingdoctor.blogspot.com/2009/07/obama-in-bare-faced-lie.html
- – -
for the quick video clip and full story. Obama does, most definitely, lie. And he can’t back out of it with “We all make mistakes.” either: That tax was one of his first and highest profile actions upon taking office AND he even interrupted the interviewer specifically to state that particular lie. Our children should learn to respect both the values of politeness AND truth.
- – -
Michael J. McFadden,
Author of “Dissecting Antismokers’ Brains”
Barbara Wilcox
September 10th, 2009
3:21 pm
It is disappointing that Joe Wilson represents the State of South Carolina and the Republican Party. His outburst towards the President of the United States was objectionable on many levels.
CobbParent
September 10th, 2009
3:21 pm
Completely support you on this post. My family watched the speech last night and I was actually distracted not only by Rep. Wilson, but the whole applause, standing up/sitting down, booing, cheering….I felt like I was watching a football game. Is all that necessary during a Presidential speech. Shouldn’t everyone be quiet and just listen. When I asked my daughter, who is in 3rd grade, what she thought of the speech, she just said there were lots of yays and boos. That was all she heard and probably many others only heard that too.
Last night displayed alot of childish behavior and honestly, I am seeing more and more of this in my professional workplace. There is talking back to superiors, purposely ignoring company directives because someone things they know better, and lots of chatter. Not sure when manners went out the window, but sure wish they would come back.
Lefty
September 10th, 2009
3:23 pm
Very very few children learned anything from Joe Wilson’s behavior because they weren’t watching the President’s speech. The ones who were watching are probably smart enough to gleen from the general audience reaction that it was poor behavior on the heckler’s part.
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:25 pm
Susan Demarco you are an idiot!!!, and you are probably raising future racist idiots, THIS MAN IS THE DULY ELECTED PRESIDENT OF THESE UNITED STATES ! If you , and your really ignorant, racist kind, hate him so much, LEAVE, and come back when his term is over, may I suggest Russia, or Siberia, there are few minorities, in those places . as far as that fool from South Carolina, he should be yelling you lie TO HIS GOVERNOR, you know the lying, adulterer, Republican HYPOCRITE !!!
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
3:28 pm
CobbParent, It’s interesting you mention feeling like you were watching a crowd at a football game. My oldest — a UGA student — told me the same thing, that lawmakers behaved as if they were in a stadium rather than the U.S. Capitol.
Maureen
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:30 pm
George Bush lied, and THOUSANDS of our finest young men are DEAD, MAIMED, OR MENTALLY DAMAGED because of it…(*see so called weapons of mass destruction) where was all this “outrage then ! OH I forgot…….. HE WAS WHITE !!!
Steveo
September 10th, 2009
3:34 pm
We all should commend joe for speaking out and calling a spade a spade or a lie is a lie its why we vote politicians into office, I feel for all those that cant speak up for thereselfs and thanks joe for speaking out for me and millions of other fellow americans your a true american hero.
Unbelieveable
September 10th, 2009
3:54 pm
Between the nonsense over preventing kids from watching the Predidential adress to students, to Joe Wilson’s outlandish beavior, this has not been one of America’s finest weeks. The rudeness and ignorance are embarassing.
Rich
September 10th, 2009
4:04 pm
Maureen, I just love how you leftists can wholly ignore the past. It is the Left that borked Judge Bork, stifled free speech on college campuses (i.e., Columbia University), intimidated voters (Philadephia 2008) and heckled at Presidential speeches (Pres. Bush’s 2005 State of the Union), yet Joe Wilson’s the bad guy? Republicans are amateurs at this stuff compared to you guys.
American woman
September 10th, 2009
4:07 pm
Arealblkwmn
September 10th, 2009
3:30 pm
George Bush lied, and THOUSANDS of our finest young men are DEAD, MAIMED, OR MENTALLY DAMAGED because of it…(*see so called weapons of mass destruction) where was all this “outrage then ! OH I forgot…….. HE WAS WHITE !!!
Ma’am, just because you disagree with someone of a different racial makeup than yourself does not mean that you a racist. It may and usually does, mean that you have a different opinion.
As far as telling someone they are idiots, calling their children idiots and telling them to leave, THAT was rude. I disagree with 90% of what the president says, and I do believe that he lied last night. I also believe that Mr. Wilson should have better manners than to blurt out his opinion in such an atmosphere, but I don’t find fault with the gist of his message. Go ahead and tell me to leave and how brave young people have died in the war. I know it. I have a Bronze Medal winner in my immediate family, in addition to another member in the military currently, and my family has had someone fighting in every war this nation has seen since the French and Indian war. This is my country and I am not leaving, and it is Mrs. Demarco’s country and I don’t expect her to leave either, and I don’t even know her.
Joey
September 10th, 2009
4:20 pm
Joe Wilson was not the first House Member or Senator to shout or boo rudely to a sitting President while he was speaking. But I am pretty sure this is the first time Maureen Downey publically objected to such behavior.
Consider it a Teachable Moment for you and other parents.
Dunwoody Mom
September 10th, 2009
4:28 pm
Actually, Joey, this is the first time anyone, Republican or Democrat can remember a member of Congress shouting out to the President during an official speech. You right-wingers keeps saying Obama is lying about not covering illegal aliens, but it is there in the Healthcare proporsal in black and white – THEY ARE NOT COVERED. You just don’t want to see it. But, this reflects badly on your and your ilk – not the President.
jim d
September 10th, 2009
4:33 pm
liar or truth sayer—matters not. The office (if not the man) commands respect. Wilson was clearly in the wrong.
Dunwoody Mom
September 10th, 2009
4:36 pm
This has not been the best week for the Republicans. Perhaps they need to take a long, hard look at the type of individuals they have allowed to take over the Republican party.
oldtimer
September 10th, 2009
4:40 pm
The demmos booed Bush a time or two. It is all politics. Be glad we don’t have to watch the British Parliment. This would be mild behavior. I think they pride themselves on being rude to Prime Ministeres.
oldtimer
September 10th, 2009
4:41 pm
And Joey…you are so right.
Toto: exposing the man behind the curtain
September 10th, 2009
4:55 pm
Just the facts please. Could it be that old whitey Joe actually had a reason to yell? If Obama was speaking of the full House Bill HR3200, then it appears that Obama was “incorrect”. With but a few limited EXCEPTIONS, the bill does not exclude illegals from most coverage provisions. Regarding health care exchanges, the CONGRESSIONAL RESEARCH SERVICE found:
“H.R. 3200 does not contain any restrictions on noncitizens – whether legally or illegally present, or in the United States temporarily or permanently-participating in the Exchange.”
President Obama wanted a full House vote to pass HR3200 before the last recess, so one could conclude that he supported covererage for illegals.
For more details see
http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2009/09/house-bill-does-cover-illegals.html
The author is an Associate Clinical Professor of Law, Cornell Law School, Ithaca, NY
rebecca lehman
September 10th, 2009
5:02 pm
Respect; we had to hold our tongues during the Bush lies…8 years worth
of deception…now what…we are in a depression, because Bushy was covered by other idiots that only leaked what they wanted the public to
hear; we are still uncovering all the lies, and coverups to this day.
Again, rich white boys can do just about anything in this country; I am
a white woman, and I am sick of all the white trash this country needs to contend with. There are some very scary rednecks in this country!
Cere
September 10th, 2009
5:11 pm
He says he won’t sign it if it adds to the deficit – but guess what – he doesn’t have to sign it! The bill will become law simply after sitting on Obama’s desk for 10 days after Congress approves.
jim d
September 10th, 2009
5:16 pm
To reitterate–it doesn’t matter if he lied. He can talk all the smack he wants to–what we should concern ourselves with is are or congressmen smart enough to read the damn bill before signing on to it? If they are not, I suggest you start considering who you can support in the next election cycle.
Mr. Obama can not pass this legislation only congress can. GET REAL people
thebob.bob
September 10th, 2009
5:18 pm
Joe Wilson is angry, bitter and full of hate. His Party dismantled necessary government oversight and let the banks and insurance companies wreck the economy. His Party started an unnecessary, trillion dollar war based on lies. His Party claimed to be the “Morality” party and got busted with male meth prostitutes, in airport bathrooms, cheating on their wives while praying on C street with ‘the family’. His Party claims to be the “Christian Party” and fights like made to keep medical care from the poorest Americans.
Joe Wilson represents his Conservative Christian district perfectly. He’ll get re-elected.
Censure the lout!
DB
September 10th, 2009
5:26 pm
There is a time and a place for everything. President Obama was making a speech to Congress. He was not conducting a Q&A session. The time for Mr. Wilson to make his objections known was AFTER the speech, not during it. (But I guess he realized that, media being what it is, no one would have come to a press conference that *he* called to discuss his objections, and this was his only shot.) But to slander the President of the United State on public TV during a speech to Congress and the Nation? Tacky, tacky, tacky.
Maureen, if I had been you, I would have gotten the telephone number for the landscape company, called immediately, and complained about the rudeness of the driver. Assuming that he wasn’t the owner, no landscape company needs that kind of marketing!
@Rebecca – we’re in a recession (not a depression) due primarily to the changes in financial industry safeguards that were changed when CLINTON signed into law the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act in 1999. If you want to play the blame game, at least get the names right.
AlreadySheared
September 10th, 2009
5:37 pm
MDowney:
“What did children learn today from Joe Wilson?”
Yeah, like your topic really has ANYTHING with education, or kids.
It would have been miles more honest to say “Forget about the school thing today – how about that Joe Wilson?”
Given your allusion to “Bush Lied and People Died” in another blog title last week, I can’t say I’m real surprised.
Do us a favor and stick to educational topics in this (education) blog.
If you REALLY need to, surely there’s an outlet for you to get your partisan politics on elsewhere on ajc.com.
Laura
September 10th, 2009
6:24 pm
I’m going to have to back up what AlreadySheared said. Are four separate blog posts on President Obama related to education? Unless he was standing up discussing NCLB or the latest bi-partisan piece of misinformed education legislation last night, then no. It doesn’t, outside of perhaps a government class.
I’d prefer to discuss politics on the politics blogs, or with my friends. I check Get Schooled for people’s opinions about pressing issues involving education, not to have to read someone’s political opinions.
catlady
September 10th, 2009
6:30 pm
The best teaching would have been for the police to have escorted Mr. Wilson out of the Chamber.
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
7:02 pm
DB, I did call the company and left a message upon getting voicemail, but I am pretty sure that the voice on the message matched the nut at the gas station. No one called be back. I have to wonder how well he’s doing as a business owner in the customer service area aftering seeing how he deals with anger.
Maureen
Maureen Downey
September 10th, 2009
7:17 pm
Laura, After covering education for 12 years, I came to realize how much of it was politics. In fact, I talked to a former ed department employee this week who told me that his job was 2 percent education and 98 percent politics – which is why he left.
That said, I have posted several other blogs this week dealing with what I think you would consider straight education. I hope you will participate on those discussions.
One of the balancing acts with a blog is to offer topics that interest the serious followers of the issue and the dabblers.
The usual complaint I get is that the blog speaks to teachers too much and not enough to parents.
I am hoping to strike the right balance but may not always hit the mark.
Maureen Downey
OvenBaked
September 10th, 2009
8:12 pm
Where was the outrage and the heckling when former President G. W. Bush lied about the weapons of mass destruction? Where was the outrage with the G. W. Bush administration when as the financial system was crumbling? Where was the outrage when the Patriot Act was signed that allowed the government to put any and everyone on watch lists as suspected terrorist? Where was the outrage when he signed the No Child Left Behind Act that has essentially left children behind? Where was the outrage when G. W. Bush signed the bill that gave corporations greater power that allowed them to handcuff consumers with unfair and unethical business practices? Our country is becoming broke because of this “war”. Where is the outrage? Sun Tzu stated thousands of years ago that any nation that engages in protracted wars (lasting more than a year) would begin to lose its wealth and the moral of its people will decline. He also said that when the country’s treasure is spent, people’s homes will be stripped bare and three tenths of their income will be dissipated. These things have come to pass.
Think about it. Why do you all think Colin Powell left while leaving was good? He knew the principles of the Art of War and the administration he was a part of violated each and everyone which has caused this country to lose its stance and ardor. Now people want to take out their frustration on our new Leader. The American people should scrutinize every thing that is said by our government officials and hold them accountable for our welfare. However, why did we acquiesce to the government being able to take away our freedoms and make us afraid ( and they gave us a level system of how much to be afraid orange, yellow, red or something like that)? We allowed this. What are we going to do to hold Congress accountable? Other nations are laughing at us right now. America’s true character will be tested for the next 7 years. So far we come up wanting.
BILLY
September 10th, 2009
8:19 pm
susan demarco-you are stupid.all your kind of people think Obama can BRAINWASH CONGRESS and have all the laws.if so maybe he could do some reverse slavery and maybe then you might understand…Diploma or GED……stupid
jay
September 10th, 2009
8:22 pm
Susan Demarco husband is a doctor. I know and that is why she is so upset with Obama’s health care plan. She’s afraid her husband, the doctor, salary will dip.
Lee
September 10th, 2009
8:28 pm
Wilson was wrong for calling out, the Democrats had already turned the speech into a circus act by jumping up and giving a standing O when Obama called talked radio hosts liars.
So what is the difference, other than good manners in this country are spiraling downward faster than the value of our currency.
V for Vendetta
September 10th, 2009
8:35 pm
jim d is completely in the right here. I honestly don’t know why anyone who considers himself a conservative would align with the philosophically bankrupt Republican party. The have shown for many years now that they are uninterested in championing the values they once held to be their core beliefs. Branding oneself a Republican in 2009 is akin to branding oneself a bigoted, religious fundamentalist.
I would prefer a political party that believed in individualism, capitalism, and minimal government–the classically liberal beliefs of the Founding Fathers. However, no one seems to remember them (the beliefs OR the Founding Fathers).
OvenBaked
September 10th, 2009
8:36 pm
Maureen,
You speak correctly when you stated that education is politics. If it were not political, educational programs would not be cut. If it were not politics, teachers would not be getting furloughed. If it were not political, school districts would not be accepting federal money and following there guidelines in order to keep the money. When state legislators change so does edcuational policies and priorities. This is why as a parent I don’t blame teachers if my child is not learning something because schools are not going to make sure that children receive a broad edcuation. It is my responsibility as a parent to identify how my child learns and provide experiences that will allow growth. Good schools will do this. Unfortunantly, there are not that many.
Old Physics Teacher
September 10th, 2009
8:44 pm
Toto,
Sorry, your statement about illegial aliens is incorrect according to http://www.factcheck.org/2009/09/obamas-health-care-speech/
You have the right to your opinion; you do not have the right to your own facts. Rather than make up your mind by reading liberal blogs or conservative blogs to find out “truth”, why don’t you check out “non-partisan” websites for reality? Obama is not a Saint or Devil. Neither was Bush 43. They neither lied or told the truth. They are politicians; they live on the edge of reality.
Before you give up your rights to think to someone on radio or tv, with a vested interest in having you think like them, GET THE FACTS FROM A NON-BIASED SOURCE. BTW, neither Keith Oberman nor Rush Limbaugh fit that definition.
TW
September 10th, 2009
8:51 pm
Maureen – GREAT post today. Keep up the good work
SuperB
September 10th, 2009
8:57 pm
Why don’t we just divide the US into two countries: Red America and Blue America. One could spend a trillion dollars fighting a war in Iraq and using the sanctimony of their religion to openly bash anyone who doesn’t see it their way. The other would spend their money on the environment, health care, and improving the life of the needy. We wll know which country Joe Wilson and his minions would choose. Rattle the sabres, load the muskets!
Matt and Jack's Mom
September 10th, 2009
8:58 pm
In response to Behind the Curtain’s post, clearly you were not taught about verifying the validity of your sources. If you would like to read the bill to which he was referring, would do well going to a reputable source. Try http://www.whitehouse.gov. to find accurate information. Please keep in mind that these bills are still being debated in committee. If you are unfamiliar with how that process works, please refer to a civics book.
As for the original question, Rep. Joe Wilson behaved badly and has brought shame upon his office.
Sue
September 10th, 2009
9:02 pm
Thanks for echoing our voice, Joe Wilson. We the people were finally heard.
TW
September 10th, 2009
9:14 pm
Sue – thanks for qualifying yourself as an idiot.
SuperB – well said. Who needs al qaeda when you have the Republicans?
Philip D. Hansten
September 10th, 2009
9:19 pm
You quote Michel de Montaigne at the top of this article…more of his wisdom can be found in this new book–
Premature Factulation: The Ignorance of Certainty and the Ghost of Montaigne
by Philip D. Hansten
info at http://www.Philoponus.com/
math 88
September 10th, 2009
9:21 pm
I was once a diehard right winger, but the more outlandish nutjob fruitloops I hear talking the more liberal I become. What has happened to true conservatism? It has been hijacked by a bunch of ignorant neocons!
Jacks Mum
September 10th, 2009
9:27 pm
I think it is very valid for a wife of a doctor to be concerned about government limiting or lowering his salary. My husband is a doctor, we scrimped and saved and ate Ramen Noodles all through medical school. We gave up vacations and new clothes and eating out for years while he built a practice. We sometimes skip on our luxuries so he can treat people who need to be treated who do not have the money to pay. Now that he has built a successful business, is a very well compensated doctor and business man, we have every right to speak up when the government wants to set limits on our ability to earn.
How would you react if your boss (President) was decided that you (Dr.) were overcompensated and the guy that sits next to you (Insurance Company), who found a way to overlap your work, was given a huge raise in pay with a guarantee for life of continued income, and your salary was cut to pay for it? Would you quietly return to work and not complain or fight for what was right?
Maureen's accountability metric
September 10th, 2009
9:30 pm
File this one under AJC accountability metric. If we are going to talk about anything and everything even remotely related to education today let’s discuss this.
“Roswell man earned Purple Heart a few days before dieing (sic) in ambush.”
This headline is on the AJC home page! This isn’t a typo; this is a “I don’t know”. How embarrassing! Yet another example of how the AJC’s credibility is “dieing” a little bit more, each and every day.
Clay
September 10th, 2009
9:32 pm
I think it’s outrageous that the same people who think the “You lie” shout is the most disrespectful display of all time are the same people who think the Bush shoe throwing incident was the funniest thing they ever saw. You members of the lunatic left represent nothing but hatred and hypocricy and I feel sorry for you all.
By the way, you are not a racist and a hater just for not loving Obama. It’s not my fault you guys elected a political lightweight with no ability to lead effectively. Can he talk? Heck, yes, he can. He’s a great speaker. He’s proving himself more and more to be a pitiful president. Thank God this Obamacare nightmare will guarantee we only have to put up with 4 years of this joker.
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:32 pm
Wilson was wrong for doing what he did and he apologized. When is Obama going to apologize for all the lies he’s told, promises he made during his campaign speeches that he’s not kept. As far as the lies Bush told about Iraq….seems that a lot of the Dems thought the same thing, guess they lied too, huh? Wake up almost all politicians lie or say what they think the majority of the particular audience wants to hear. It’s all a game to them but we the American people are the losers.
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:34 pm
math 88 you’re a poser!
nana
September 10th, 2009
9:36 pm
Jacks Mum, great post. Nowadays those that work hard and earn a good living are looked down upon (unless you’re a politician). It’s called wealth envy.
Clay's Mama
September 10th, 2009
9:37 pm
‘How would you react if your boss (President) was decided that you (Dr.) were overcompensated and the guy that sits next to you (Insurance Company), who found a way to overlap your work, was given a huge raise in pay with a guarantee for life of continued income, and your salary was cut to pay for it? Would you quietly return to work and not complain or fight for what was right?’
Perhaps you should take some of that fat, Dr. cash and go back to school yourself. Your post makes absolutely no sense at all.