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Get Schooled

Why the mystery around teacher assignments?

9:25 am August 6, 2009, by Maureen Downey

Whenever my pediatrician’s office adds a new doctor to its roster, an announcement arrives with the new physician’s bio.

Can someone explain why schools don’t do that with new teachers?

It seems like a simple effort that would yield a lot in community relations. My system sends a letter in late July telling parents that their child has Mr. X or Ms. Y, but gives no other information. Since systems go to the expense and effort to write a letter to each parent and mail it, why not include something like: Timmy  will have Mr. X, who comes to us from Elm Street School in Charlotte, N.C.  where he taught fourth grade for six years. He is a graduate of UGA and GSU. Mr. X is a former high school soccer player and looks forward to playing with the students at recess.

I am sure that parent volunteers would compile the short bios, if asked, or the teachers themselves could provide their own description for the letter.

I think systems are getting better. My system used to post the class list the night before school began on the school’s front doors, and parents and kids drove over that evening to crowd around to find their assignment. I never understood why as teachers told me that they were assigned their classes weeks earlier so the late-notice seemed unnecessary and deliberate. (In fact, some systems inform students who their next teacher will be during the last week of school in May.)

I suspect – and perhaps some of you know better — that late notice gave unhappy parents less time to protest.

Can anyone explain why systems don’t seem to have this down to a science? Are there  implications in this issue that I am not seeing?  I wrote a Learning Curve column last year about providing teacher bios and some miffed teachers sent me notes saying that if they had to provide bios, so should parents. That would be fine with me as I think the more information a teacher has about a child, the better it is.

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117 comments Add your comment

momtoAlex&Max

August 6th, 2009
9:56 am

My school in Cobb Co did not announce teacher assignments until today, school starts Monday.

I think you hit the nail in the head: they don’t want to give parents time to complain if they receive a less than stellar teacher. I know that that is exactly what happened to me last year. This year I was determined to know early so I can be prepared and I was prepared to demand a transfer if it was someone i did not like. As it happened, I am perfectly happy with their assignments this year.

old teach

August 6th, 2009
10:13 am

Good Morning Maureen,
It’s really quite transparent to one who has been in the inner sanctum of the convoluted strategies in schools of today. The “everybody’s the same” mentality is pervasive among the power brokers in education. Every student can and must take college prep classes because every student is expected to go to college. If not enough students in a certain school can score high enough for the Gifted program, then lower the required score so one school does not appear to have better students than another. And so on ad infinitum.
The teacher bios fit right in the pattern. Heaven forbid that one teacher’s bio looks more impressive than another. One teacher graduated from , let’s just say, Vandedrbilt, got an MAT from Boston U,. AND a Phd. from Ga Tech and has has been teaching math for 15 years. Another teacher has a BS from a small school in Idaho and has no advanced degrees and this is her 2nd year of teaching math. NEVERMIND that the latter may be a fabulous teacher whose students not only show progress every year but adore her/him.
You can see the problem that could arise here when parents get the bios .
In a school system where learning disabled students are expected to perform at the same level as students who have no learning disability…. and non English speaking students are expected to perform at the same level as native English speakers AND if they do not, the school is labeled
“failing”…..Well… there will be NO teacher bios.

Ernest

August 6th, 2009
10:22 am

I’ve can go to some schools websites and see this information. A general template is used and provides background information such as degrees earned, years in education, and personal anecdotes. I would think that if citizens wanted this as a ’standard’ for every school, they could request a policy to enact this.

I recall years ago when working with my local elementary school, I would help with the newsletters and solicit this information from new teachers. Never had problems in getting this information, in fact all were glad to provide it.

Harper's Mama

August 6th, 2009
10:24 am

So if you aren’t happy with your child’s teacher, you go and “demand” a transfer? Really? Seriously???? What is it about the teacher that you would not “like”? Was he or she unseemly? Ugly? Or did he or she simply do her job and not cowtow to parental “demands”?

Classes have been run up to the absolute maximum; teachers have been laid off. I have 32 in every English class that I teach. If a parent “demanded” that a child be moved out of another class and into mine, I would have to laugh. And put him where?

I would NEVER go into a place of business and tell someone how to do his or her job, and I daresay that I find it offensive that parents “demand” changes because they may not like something about the way a teacher runs his or her classroom.

Seen it all

August 6th, 2009
10:27 am

Ok Maureen, you and your parent friends are making more out of this than it needs to be. What difference does it make what teacher your child has? What difference does it make as to the “qualifications” of a particular teacher? Why do parents need to know a teacher’s resume? Quite frankly I find the whole thing insulting.

First of all, teachers are the same in EVERY SCHOOL, regardless of the county or the system. Do you know how I know? Because the system is the same EVERYWHERE. Only certain people are hired to be teachers. These “teachers” all come from the same system, the same machine. They come from colleges where they are all taught and indoctrinated in the same ideology. The same thought patterns and behavior patterns. They even dress alike.

Researchers will tell you that the majority of schoolteachers are white women. To tell you how much these people are cookie cutter, automatons, look at how they dress and act. I can spot which women are teachers when I am shopping in a store. Also, and more importantly this- their behaviors, beliefs, methods of classroom management, relationships with students and parents, and instruction are all the same. There are no real instructional or idealogical differences between teachers in a school. Why because the system wants conformity. They want principals who look alike and think alike. Principals want teachers who look alike and think alike.

So Maureen, I ask you this- What difference does it make where Ms. Simpson got her college degree? What difference does it make what Ms. Harper likes to do in her spare time? Does this have any bearing on if Ms. Simpson is a “good” teacher or not?

Maureen, let’s be for real this one time. I know (and most educated people who have any real experience in education know) that you, like many other middle class parents, want to engage in teacher shopping. And since we now know that as a whole teachers are pretty much the same, this teacher shopping is much ado about nothing. It’s simply about personalities. It has nothing to do with the real ability of this person to teach your child. You just want to pick people you think that YOU would like to be your child’s teacher.

But alas, I guess parents wouldn’t know this because they have never been a part of the system. They don’t know what the game is really about (or maybe they do and I, being a “good” teacher, had it wrong all along). All they see is from the outside looking in. And what from I hear from these parents, supposed the best, most educated, wealthiest people in all America is that real education really doesn’t matter. They just want a certain person, a certain personality to be in the influence of their children.

So what is the lesson for today children? That instruction, true teaching, really doesn’t matter in the American educational system. School is simply a social institution. It really isn’t necessary for a person to work hard trying to teach at all. It’s not the learning that’s important. It’s the social outcomes that really matter.

Maureen, I am guessing that when this is all over, you will have learned something about what school that you would never have learned simply as a parent.

Welcome to Get Schooled.

Seen it all

August 6th, 2009
10:42 am

Can somebody tell me what a “stellar teacher” is? I just want to know. In all the debates, after all these years, NOBODY HAS NEVER REALLY DEFINED WHAT MAKES A GOOD TEACHER.

Instead we see people everyday try to tell schools and teachers how to do their jobs. You don’t tell doctors, lawyers, car mechanics, judges, politicians, street sweepers, hamburger flippers, etc. how to do their jobs. Do you cashier shop at when you go to Target? Or do you just get what appears to be the shortest line? Do you mechanic shop when you take your car to the Ford dealership for maintanance? Or do you just give the service manager the keys to the car and let them handle their business?

Please “moms”, cut out the foolishness over what class your child is assigned. I, an insider in the system, am telling you that these people are BASICALLY THE SAME. There is no difference between Ms. Simpson, Ms. Harper, Ms. Zimkowski, Mr. Johnson, Mrs. Elliot, or Mrs. Brown. They are all the same.

Joyce

August 6th, 2009
11:03 am

I agree with other posters that teacher differences are not generally significant within a grade. I think that the schools hire the best people they can: degreed, certified, etc. The rest really is personalities and is usually not worth kicking up a lot of sand over. I think that having some generic, “getting-to-know-you” bio information on teachers who are new to the building is a nice idea. The established teachers could also include that info in their packets so that students feel welcomed by a human being.

momtoAlex&Max

August 6th, 2009
11:09 am

Yes Haper’s Momma this teacher was BEYOND unacceptable. Believe me when I tell you that I do not expect ANYONE to cow tow to my needs. This particular teacher was lazy, she did not communicate with parents AT ALL, her homework assignments were sloppy, she never graded them or returned them to the students (how else are we supossed to know how if our kids need more help in certain areas), she never did any of the other fun projects that ALL the rest of the 2nd graders were doing, she instilled no discipline in her classroom and my kid did not learn squat in his year there. He and a buddy actually started doing multiplication ON THEIR OWN because they were SO beyond bored in the classroom.

SO NO, I am not one of THOSE parents, but can you really blame for wanting the best for my kid? I cannot afford private education and I am the world’s worst teacher plus I have to work, so what are my options here Ms Assumptions?

AP Teacher

August 6th, 2009
11:21 am

First of all – some of my colleagues just found out yesterday that their schedules got changed, and now they are teaching X instead of Y. So, please don’t think that your child’s teacher got changed because of some secret conspiracy! Furthermore – my school posts all of this information on the teachers’ websites. This is not so parents can “shop” for a teacher; it’s more like a “get to know me” kind of deal. I have had a parent request that his daughter’s teacher be changed because she went to Tech instead of UGA! Unreal!

FYI – can I get only the “stellar” students in my class??!!

SB

August 6th, 2009
11:26 am

I disagree that it doesn’t with the statement that it doesn’t matter or make any difference what the teacher’s background is. That is ridiculous. Why, you ask, it knowing this information necessary? Because this person, the teacher, spends 20-30 hours a week with my child. I think it’s perfectly reasonable for me, as a parent, to want to know something about her. Now, if the issue is, should a parent have the right to transfer their child out of the classroom on the basis of what appears on that “resume?” I think not. There are many great teachers out there and a resume does not necessarily reflect that. Unless a teacher has shown to the parent that he/she cannot teach that parent’s child for whatever reason (personality conflicts, disability, etc…) then there should be no transfer to another classroom. I agree, classrooms are already overwhelming. Teacher transfers should be limited to only circumstances that truly warrant it and not just because a parent prefers another teacher.

Erin

August 6th, 2009
11:33 am

Even if it’s just the night before school starts, at least most people get to see which teacher their kids are going to have BEFORE the first day of school. In my elementary school, we found out the first day of school. Never earlier than that. And I actually liked it that way. Y’know, the anticipation factor … whether I’d be in the same class with my friends, etc.

Pulbic School Parent

August 6th, 2009
11:47 am

to Seen It All: It is true that my children have had excellent teachers with bachelor’s degress and absolutely incompetent teachers with PhDs. However, the degree and experience level can make a huge difference, especially in advanced classes. I’d much rather have my high school student taught math by someone with a bachelors or masters degree in MATHEMATICS rather than a PhD in Educational Leadership from an internet school. These degrees add absolutely nothing to the acedemic quality of the teacher or the classroom.

I seriouslly disagree with your repeated statements that all tachers are the same. That is like saying that all doctors and all lawyers and all accountants are the same. And it is not all about “personalities.” The absolutely best teacher in my son’s middle school was a grumpy, opinionated guy that no one particularly likes at first. But he works hard as a teacher, knew the material inside and out, made the students think, and did not mindlessly follow the canned state curriculum.

Ernest, if requested, public schools are now required to provide parents with the degree that a teacher holds. I think it may be part of NCLB. But DeKalb will only disclose the generic degree (bachelor/masters/doctorate) and refuses to provide the name of the academic institution that conferred the degree or the specific degree. So you don’t know whether the teacher has a PhD from MIT or from Argosy University via the internet.

Mac

August 6th, 2009
12:01 pm

Most of the time it is merely a perception that teacher XYZ is the perfect teacher for whatever social reason. The reality is those aren’t always actually (or even usually) the better teachers. They are the better self promoters.

AlreadySheared

August 6th, 2009
12:14 pm

“Seen it all”:

“Do you mechanic shop when you take your car to the Ford dealership for maintanance?”

Are you KIDDDING? Do you STAY broke?

I only work with shops that I know do a good job. Pick restaurants based on the quality of food and service? Yep. Stop going to a dentist who seems inclined to do unneeded work (”You’ve had those fillings how long – we need to replace those”)? Uh – huh. Ask around about contractors, ask them questions, check references, hire the one I think will do the best job? You bet.

Your hubris and fear of being held accountable are stunning! You educate children. The people who are responsible for those children are their parents. It’s none of the parent’s business – they should stop meddling? REALLY?

Gail

August 6th, 2009
12:40 pm

I don’t believe in teacher shopping, but it can sometimes be helpful to know how much experience a teacher has. I am much more likely to wait to see how things work out when a problem occurs if I know the teacher is experienced. Since I rarely have real info about a teacher’s background, I find myself going by age and naturally assume older teachers have more experience. However, this backfired on me once when I assumed a middle-aged teacher had experience. I saw problems, and waited too long. When I finally approached her about the problem, I found out she was a first or second year teacher at about age 50!

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
1:11 pm

I’m a grumpy, opinionated middle aged teacher with the middle aged spread going on. I also just started my 22nd year in this profession and have three degrees, one from UGA, another from Piedmont College, and a third from, yes, an online university that I worked my butt off for. (It was much more difficult than UGA, let me tell you.)

I’m also considered to be a pretty darned good teacher.

But here’s the thing: I’m not the best “fit” for every single kid that walks through my door. If a parent is shopping for a perky, SUV-driving, blonde haired soccer mom to be their child’s teacher, then I’m definately not the one for them as I’m practically the exact opposite.

Also, I had absolutely NO idea who I would have in classes or even how many I would have in my classes until they day they walked in. Just a rough number. Was it my fault? Nope. Rather, the two days of furloughs put everyone behind: technology, the registrars, etc. We only had two days of pre plannning, 4 hours of which were open house for 7th and 8th grade. The 6th grade didn’t even get an open house due to the furlough days. My students literally knew their schedules before I did as I couldn’t get into my online roll book until the first day of school.

In my school, some classes have at least 38 kids in classes. And, yes, that is too much. Schools were given a “projected number” of students to expect by the county office based on numbers at the feeder elementary schools and general population within districts. We planned according to those numbers. And we obviously planned wrong as we have more students than we were expecting. Schedules will have to be redone. Student needs (such as special ed and gifted) are going to have to be considered. And if classes can’t be evened out, then a teacher may have to be hired, but that is a BOE decision. And even then, there is no such thing as an “instant” teacher. They have to be interviewed, have their qualifications and backgrounds checked, and hired…which will take at least a couple of weeks.

The thing is, Maureen, planning for and scheduling students is not an exact science. These days, schools don’t want to have too many teachers due to budget restraints so they plan for what population is expected.

And you are worried about a BIO? Isn’t that a bit TRITE when compared to all of the other problems that schools and teachers are faced with? Should teachers have taken their furlough days to write them, or take away from their other time in planning for INSTRUCTION, grading, teaching, doing hall duty, or actually spending some time with their families in order to write bios prepare those parents who are “teacher shopping.”? I’ll be honest: I haven’t been home any time before 7:00 for the past week and a half as I’m still trying to catch up from those two furlough days. If parents want me to put yet one more thing on the plate, it might be October before I get around to writing one.

jim d

August 6th, 2009
1:23 pm

Harpers mom,

Only once did i ever request my childs class be changed–that was due to a hiring junket GCPS system went on several years ago to India, not only did the accent cause a problem for my child but even i had problems understanding what the teacher was saying. My request was granted on the grounds that my child couldn’t understand the teacher. BTW, that one cost taxpayers aa bundle and lord knows how many children suffered due to the language barrier.

jim d

August 6th, 2009
1:30 pm

OH my seen it all,

What a broad brush you use to paint all teachers the same. Shall we take it then that if there is even one pedophile that gets hired that all teachers are then pedophiles? What is it that you would like to make sure parents don’t know?

No –Teachers are not all the same. They are human and as such have different personalities as well as teaching styles. Personally, I feel students should adapt to the teachers style and personality, but I also believe parents have the RIGHT to know who it is they are entrusting their child to.

Reality 2

August 6th, 2009
1:50 pm

I concur with jim d. Not all teachers are the same – some are more competent than others. Some have personalities that work with some kids but not with others while other teachers may have completely opposite match.

Public School Mom: Someone with PhD in Educaional Leadership from whatever the school may still have a bachelor’s and even master’s degree in mathematics. So that point just didn’t seem to make any sense. On the other hand, I would like to know how many years of teaching (and what grades and subjects) of all administrators.

momtoAlex&Max

August 6th, 2009
2:02 pm

Haper’s Mom: thank you, Ms Assumption. I can assure you that I DO NOT shop for a teacher that cow tows to me.

This particular teach was renowned for her lazyness. EVERYONE knew it. And I experienced it with my child. Homework assignments that were never graded, she never did any of the other fun projects that ALL the rest of the 2nd grade teachers were doing, she did not speak proper English (I had an extremelly hard time understanding her), she did not control her classroom and she yelled a lot. A LOT of the parents that I spoke to that year (classmates of my child) had the same issues.

So NO, not all teachers are the same. I cannot afford to send my child to private school and I am the world’s worst teacher myslef (yes I admit it’s a tough job) so homeschooling is really not an option.

What would you have me do Ms Assumptions? (aka Harper’s Mom) Do YOU not want the best you can get for your child???????

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
2:13 pm

Ok…so now parents want me to supply a bio in addition to school supplies? Goody. I’ve been getting home at around 7 p.m. because I still haven’t caught up from those furlough days. I guess I need to give up eating, spending time with my family, or showering to take care of yet another demand by a parent.

Sigh.

Bitter Much?

August 6th, 2009
2:21 pm

Seen it All,

I’m not entrusting my child to the “doctors, lawyers, car mechanics, judges, politicians, street sweepers, hamburger flippers” for 7-8 hours a day either.

Bitter Much?

August 6th, 2009
2:31 pm

Harper’s Mama,

What if you had a child in daycare and the worker was endangering your child because they were unattentive. You wouldn’t speak up and tell them how to do their job. I find that hard to believe.

We entrust the teachers to assist us in educating our children & a bad teacher one year, can have serious consequences in later grades.

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
2:37 pm

So much for the the thing that eats blog posts. I’ve lost two today…don’t really feel like wasting more time with it. Time to go grade papers and write a darned bio for parents. Maybe I’ll get home by 7:30 tonight.

Practical Mom

August 6th, 2009
2:44 pm

Go one step further.

Let parents evaluate teachers at the end of the year. Teachers are, in effect, working for the parents (we do pay the bill), so we should get some input into what teachers are retained, and which teachers are acceptable to teach our children.

luke

August 6th, 2009
2:58 pm

joy in teaching ,,,,,, wah!! you will get home at 7:30 this evening, but you have been off for 10 weeks !!!!! c’mon

luke

August 6th, 2009
3:00 pm

P.M. ….. I know plenty of parents that aren’t in any way capable of evaluating a teacher, so that really couldnt work ..

Smiley

August 6th, 2009
3:02 pm

What I’d like to see is some sort of information that could be sent home to parents each year showing the amount of academic growth that children in each teacher’s class experienced. I’m not talking about static scores like those rendered by the CRCT. I’d like to see a test that measures student learning over the school year (with a score at the beginning and one at the end) and shows which teachers are showing growth in their classrooms and which are not. The ones who do not would be required to retrain … and if they did not improve, they would have to find new careers.
Measuring growth would take away teachers’ excuse of “Oh, I just had a bad class this year.” Even a bad class who starts out behind can show growth. It would also make teachers responsible for all children in their class.. not just the middle. The data could be broken out to show growth by the top students, the middle range students and the struggling students.

And no… sorry, but teachers are not the same by any stretch of the imagination.

Cere

August 6th, 2009
3:04 pm

“I can spot which women are teachers when I am shopping in a store.”

That’s interesting Seen it all — seems teachers have this psychic ability – as Vince (also a teacher with several degrees as he impressed upon us) declared on the home school thread, “At the pool, at a park or just walking down the street my wife and I can invariably pick out young people who are being homeschooled…”

Personally, to me, the very thing I try to avoid in teachers are people with egos like this – people who think they “know” people just by looking at them.

And – we do tell doctors, lawyers, mechanics and burger flippers that we don’t like how they do their job – by taking our business elsewhere. We can’t do that with teachers. My son was assigned three of the worst teachers in our high school his first semester there and I said nothing – went along to get along – and it was the worst decision.

Believe me – all teachers are very much not alike.

Cere

August 6th, 2009
3:07 pm

College professors have to allow students to evaluate them at the end of a course. Even worse – they are now subjected to “RateMyProfessor.com” where they are not only evaluated on how they teach, but whether or not they are “hot”… !

Cere

August 6th, 2009
3:10 pm

Joy – pretty much anyone in the corporate world at a managerial level has to have their professional bio posted on the corporate website. Big deal!

mdowney

August 6th, 2009
3:18 pm

Just back from Gainesville. (This is second note as first was riddled with typos. I have a new keyboard and I am adjusting slowly.)
The debate on this topic surprises me. Joy in Teaching, I am not sure why a bio – which can be short and sweet – is an imposition. (I spoke to a group today that had mislaid my e-mailed bio so I sat down with the presenter and we quickly assembled a new one in about a minute.)
And I have to believe that anyone saying that all teachers are the same is joking. Please?
My issue with a short bio isn’t so parents can compare or evaluate a teacher, but simply know a few facts about the person who will spend the next 10 months with my child. Not sure why a bio is seen as either an intrusion or a trap.
By the way, I sprang six comments from the filter.
Folks are e-mailing me at mdowney@ajc.com to let me know when their comments vanish. Please do so if that happens to you.

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
3:37 pm

Luke, I was only off for 3 weeks, thanks.

Cere, I’m pretty sure that those in the corporate world at a managerial level get paid a great deal more for fewer hours and less training. Not that I’m complaining as I knew what I was getting into.. just pointing it out for you. They also don’t have to deal with crazy children during a full moon nor helicopter parents.

Practical Mom: Teachers also have to help pay their own salaries through taxes. Weird, huh? According to your logic, then teachers also apparently work for themselves. Maybe I’ll give myself a day off in a few weeks.

I am not ashamed whatsoever of my qualifications or background as they are impeccable. I do not mind sharing those in the least if asked. However, I do resent the fact that some people think that it should be yet another thing that is required of teachers.

NCLB is killing public schools. It is turning good students into mediocre ones and it is driving good teachers away in droves. There is a reason why attrition rate for new teachers is so high and they are leaving after only 3 years in the classroom. It is because of all of the ridiculous expectations of time, energy, and talent as well as the mountains of paperwork. It is getting to where teachers can’t seem to do enough for parents, students, or administrators because they always want MORE while cutting our pay, raising our insurance rates, and cutting the days that we have to prepare.

By the way: my school superintendent has already given the word that there will be at least 3 more furlough days after Christmas break.

jim d

August 6th, 2009
3:42 pm

joy,

Sounds like someones had a rough week.

jim d

August 6th, 2009
3:49 pm

Joy,

if you had to come up with aquick bio, you mifght try a bit of cut and past from your resume’ which I would expect any professional to have updated on a regular bassis–should only take a few minutes

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
3:52 pm

Maureen, writing a bio IS an imposition when you add it to the ever growing pile of stuff that teachers have to do. Dealing with POI is literally kicking my butt right now…as well as working on my school’s leadership team. Both have added at least 6 additional hours to my week over the regular amount of work from last year.

I really don’t think you understand or appreciate how overworked teachers are. I’m sure that you think that writing a short bio won’t take long. And it really wouldn’t. Putting up a word wall doesn’t take long. Nor does putting the standard on student’s displayed work, grading essays, going to 2 afterschool meetings a week, answering emails, teaching classes, putting on bandaids, creating learning focused lesson plans, making copies, taking kids to the restroom, keeping up with educational trends, and all of the other things that “don’t take long.” If you put it all together, then, yeah, it DOES take up a lot of time.

It all adds up. Add one more thing? Bah. It never stops with just one more thing and you know that. That one thing always seems to have babies. Require teachers to have a short bio? Parents wouldn’t be satisfied with that and neither would administrators. It would turn into a series of meetings, a “correct format” would have to be decided upon and used, and something that should take 15 minutes would end up taking hours. That short bio would end up being much more once all is said and done.

And teachers are people who really do like to give to others. Its our nature. But even we are starting to break. Enough is enough.

irisheyes

August 6th, 2009
3:57 pm

My parents find out who the teacher is on “Meet the Teacher” day which was today. If they want to know about me, then all they have to do is walk through my door and talk to me. We don’t give out teachers names earlier, because our secretary already spends too much time answering the phone from parents calling asking who their child’s teacher is. Can you imagine what it would be like once the parents knew? She’d never get anything done!

BTW, I only have a bachelor’s degree, not a master’s, but that certainly doesn’t mean I’m not educated in the latest research. I just can’t afford the $12,000 it would cost me to get another degree. Hopefully, my parents won’t hold that against me.

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
4:55 pm

Another reason I have seen mentioned here that schools wait until the last minute is transiency – both of teachers and students. Even though we sign contracts in April, teachers do leave through the summer – spouses get transferred, that great “real-world” job finally opens up for you, expecting moms change their mind about going back to work – you get the picture. In the 10 years I’ve been teaching at the MS level, in schools of about 100 teachers, usually about 5 leave during the summer unexpectedly.

In schools like mine, with 40% transiency rates, you have wait until registration in August before you can even hope to start assigning classes, not to mention balancing them.

It seems like there is a sentiment of Machiavellian intention behind everything schools do – even when it’s a case of practicality, and not conspiracy.

For the record, through my school years in the 70s and early 80s, we never knew who we had until the first day of school, either, like another poster said.

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
5:06 pm

Part II – I figured I’d split it up since Maureen said the blog monster tends to prefer entree blogs to appetizers…

On the bio – since my first year teaching, I have always sent home a letter to my parents on the first day of school introducing myself. It’s also posted on my webpage and blog. Our school newspaper always interviews the new teachers shortly after the start of the year, and that, too, is online – plus the “junior reporters” get a kick out of the interview. We teachers don’t even get the lowdown on our fellow new colleagues until the first day of pre-planning, so I don’t think it’s any conspiracy on the part of the school to not provide this to parents. As a parent, I never expected the information, nor did I ask for it – it didn’t really matter to me – what mattered were the answers to the questions I asked my kids when they came home from school each day. This question did remind me of my daughter’s first grade teacher, whose room was plastered in crimson – clearly she went to ‘Bama – Roll Tide! (which she taught the kids to sing – too cute).

JIT is right – it’s not a big thing, but when you look at all the little things we’re expected to do, they all add up. Even a penny can grow to over a million dollars if the number you have is doubled every day.

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
5:10 pm

dang – lost it anyway!

Missing post, which will probably show up at some point was talking about bios – most of us give letters of introduction to our kids the first day – what’s wrong with that?

As to RateMyProfessor.com, there is also RateMyTeacher.com – it’s been around since at least 2004. However, teachers are only listed if a student or parent decides to rate them, and the site is not up to date – I know there are teachers listed for my school that haven’t been there in at least four years.

Harper's Mama

August 6th, 2009
5:14 pm

The other thing missing in this is that teachers and administrators being off for the summer precludes any true planning for classes in the summer. The only thing that I am absolutely sure of is what I will be teaching, not who or when.
I suppose, then, that teachers should not have been fuloughed and administrators should not have been cut days. Then Momtowhomever could be able to find out who her kids’ teachers are and either be smug or “demand” the change. But that would require people to actually value education instead of complain about it all the time and pony up and pay teachers more.
Momtowhomever, when anyone says “demand”, it sounds accusatory and degrading. Maybe word choice got in the way of content because I still take offense.

old teach

August 6th, 2009
5:25 pm

Just a little parent story from a teacher.
Many teachers are seem to be teaching “out of field”. Or perhaps in a field in which they are certified but have little experience teaching that subject. My son had an English teacher who had been teaching Spanish for 15 years and , suddenly, was assigned to teach an English Lit class. When my son was not making his usual good grades in that class I went to have a conference. The gentleman told me that it was probably his fault because he really didn’t know anything about what he was teaching even though he was certified to teach English. I suppose he felt comfortable telling me that because he knew that I was a teacher and am totally familiar with the administrative decisions to assign classes without discussing it with the teacher.

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
5:25 pm

Ernest – my PTSA puts new teacher bios in the first PTSA newsletter of the year as well.

Seen It All – I definitely differ with your assertion that all teachers are alike – I understand what you mean about “teacher clothes” – teachers and grandmoms keep those holiday sweater and vest people in business. However, the teachers at my school are most decidedly not cookie-cutter.

jim d – I could “cut and paste” from my resume, but it wouldn’t look like a bio. My resume is geared towards describing my achievements in order to get hired, not talking about my background and life experiences. It’s bullet points, not paragraphs.

Mac – agreed – one of the most requested teachers in my school is an ok teacher, but an excellent PR man – for himself!

Practical mom – I live in my district, I shop in my district, and contrary to popular belief, I pay income taxes (many people are under the assumption that no income taxes is a teacher perq). Based on QBE, not only is some of my money going to pay my own salary, but it’s also going to pay the salary of someone in some other county. Parents (and I am one) are not the sole customer of a school. Businesses in the community are as well.

sped teacher bibb

August 6th, 2009
5:27 pm

Maurene- since when did a long list of degrees mean that a teacher is “the best”. My experience is that more degrees means less common sense and inovation is applied in the classroom. Most schools now have a web site that teachers post bios,lessons,homework, and links to homework help.

MA

August 6th, 2009
5:46 pm

Joy in Teaching
August 6th, 2009
1:11 pm
“I’m a grumpy, opinionated middle aged teacher with the middle aged spread going on. I also just started my 22nd year in this profession and have three degrees, one from UGA, another from Piedmont College, and a third from, yes, an online university that I worked my butt off for. (It was much more difficult than UGA, let me tell you.)”
“I’m also considered to be a pretty darned good teacher.”
“then I’m definately not the one for them as I’m practically the exact opposite”.

WOW! Joy in Teaching. I hope that was just a typo. Definitely! It is an “i” not an “a”.

mdowney

August 6th, 2009
5:47 pm

Parent and Teacher, I have found and restored your two posts.
Sped teacher bibb, I am not suggesting that parents get a bio just to see degrees, but to learn some basics about the teacher. I, too, don’t think a long list of degrees assures strong teaching, although I prefer a degree in the content area when it comes to middle and high school.
I have had several parents e-mail me rather than post here to talk about how they would have loved just a bit of background, especially parents delivering their children to school for the very first time.
I have read all the protests above and still think it makes sense and builds goodwill to share a few facts about the teacher with the parents before school starts.
My own system does not post any bios on teachers. So, the Web site is not a resource, although it well could be.
Maureen

Simeon

August 6th, 2009
5:55 pm

I don’t think it is a big deal for teachers to make parent know some bio about them. I have done this several times as a teacher by sending home to parents a brief introduction of myself especially on the firsrt day of school.

However, it should not be overflogged by parents as if heaven and earth would fall apart and on crush on us if not done. Should that become the condition, then I would probably have to require all my children to come into my class the first day of school with bio and all the previous problems encoutered by the parents and child so that I would take a few days to read and prepare myself to deal with them before I start to teach them. This would also give me some time to prepare individual lesson plans to be able to deal with every family apart from the school curriculum. With about 150 students being a conservative estimate of the number of students in my biology class which I teach, I have to request for additional time to prepare my lessons for each day, apart from other administrative demand on me.

I would rather advise parents who are over-emphasizing the demand for bio from teachers to find ways and means of helping the child to adjust to the new teacher instead of a “stellar teacher” that is not easy to find to this day. Most of your worries had already been taken care of by the school systems before your child enters into the new year to meet with the so-called new teacher. Life has no answers at the back of the textbook which you are looking for. Allow your child to interact with the new teacher to learn from what he/she has brought on the table and be patient. As sure as you and I know, if the teacher has brought nothing into the class, he/she must have come in with a variety. And variety is the spice of life. Without it, life becomes monotonous. Give the teacher a professional chance and do your parenting part coperatively with the teacher to help your child.

Simeon

August 6th, 2009
5:56 pm

Enter your comments here

Seen it all

August 6th, 2009
6:16 pm

This is why I love this blog- it’s so funny!!!!!!!

“she never did any of the other fun projects that ALL the rest of the 2nd grade teachers were doing, she did not speak proper English ”

So I guess this what is required to be a good teacher- assigning lots of “fun” projects and speaking PERFECT English (if this teacher happened to misspeak once). BTW, that is an old line. You know, the one about teachers speaking or writing with bad grammar. Mom, that’s Complaining About the Teacher 101. I think you’re ready to move to Complaining About the Teacher 201. Keep studying.

Northview (Ex)Teacher

August 6th, 2009
6:26 pm

This is an interesting topic for me. This is the first time in nine years that I have not been in a Georgia public school this week, preparing to meet with my students on Monday. I felt the lack of being there acutely earlier this week, and I spent some time and energy wondering if I had made a mistake. I actually felt withdrawal pains.

However, as I read many of the parent comments on this blog, I know that I did not. I think one of the great misperceptions many parents have is that they are teachers’ employers. Granted, the public schools are taxpayer-supported, but I never felt that I was accountable to parents. I assure you that my degrees are in content areas, and they were all in respectable schools: no online degrees in educational leadership for me. My teaching was rigorous, demanding, and challenging on every level. I felt accountable to my field, but not to the so-called community where I happened to work.

I found that the vast majority of parents were willing to work with me, as most, even in Georgia, want their children to be educated. But the small percentage that approached me with an agenda were so difficult to deal with that I finally decided simply not to subject myself to their abuse any longer. Several students cried when they heard I would not be back, and others were angry and felt abandoned. The good students, the ones who truly want to learn, have lost out because the school system refuses to deal honestly with parents and students who don’t want to learn, or who want to force the rest of us to be as limited as they are. To remain in teaching would have required dishonesty on my part, so I decided to stop.

I find myself, much to my surprise, in agreement with jimd. In Fulton County, we have the loathsome and despicable Ashley Widener on the school board. She is completely dedicated to destroying public education: bellicose, quick to take offense, and thin-skinned. Katie Reeves is another who should go. Katie thinks that education is a cost, rather than an investment, and her recent comments surely must have dispirited most teachers. One of the best teachers I know (truly stellar) told me recently that she has concluded that public education in Georgia from now on is going to be a joke: the state has simply thrown in the towel. If you defeat this person so that she leaves the classroom, you are cheating your children out of one of the best educational experiences they will ever have.

Parents, you get what you pay for, and that is as true in education as any other area of life. You don’t get a Ferrari when you pay for a Focus. What you are willing to do (and what you are willing to pay) is going to define to what opportunities your children are going to have, now and down the road.

Those of you who actually want your children to be educated have reason to be concerned. If money really makes no difference in education, then why are so many wealthy parents willing to pay $20K a year (plus) for a private education for their children? It seems to me that they want their children to be fully educated while denying that opportunity to the rest of us.

catlady

August 6th, 2009
6:58 pm

I’d like to know how much actual classroom experience my principal has. I already know her degrees and that of the asst principal are from “less than stellar” schools (diploma mills).

momtoAlex&Max

August 6th, 2009
7:05 pm

WHatever’s MOM: I will demand whatever it takes to assure my child gets the best education I can get him out of the public schools. I volunteer countless hours and money to my school, so YES, I will demand it. As it turns out, I didn’t have to. Both my kid’s teachers are awesome this year.

Yeah, but then again -

August 6th, 2009
7:06 pm

Too bad the parents of the 8th grader who ended up having sex in a pick-up truck recently with her 30 year old teacher didn’t know much about him.

Northview (Ex)Teacher

August 6th, 2009
7:14 pm

My apologies for repeating the posting. The original seems to have disappeared.

This is an interesting topic for me. This is the first time in nine years that I have not been in a Georgia public school this week, preparing to meet with my students on Monday. I felt the lack of being there acutely earlier this week, and I spent some time and energy wondering if I had made a mistake. I actually felt withdrawal pains.

However, as I read many of the parent comments on this blog, I know that I did not. I think one of the great misperceptions many parents have is that they are teachers’ employers. Granted, the public schools are taxpayer-supported, but I never felt that I was accountable to parents. I assure you that my degrees are in content areas, and they were all in respectable schools: no online degrees in educational leadership for me. My teaching was rigorous, demanding, and challenging on every level. I felt accountable to my field, but not to the so-called community where I happened to work.

I found that the vast majority of parents were willing to work with me, as most, even in Georgia, want their children to be educated. But the small percentage that approached me with an agenda were so difficult to deal with that I finally decided simply not to subject myself to their abuse any longer. Several students cried when they heard I would not be back, and others were angry and felt abandoned. The good students, the ones who truly want to learn, have lost out because the school system refuses to deal honestly with parents and students who don’t want to learn, or who want to force the rest of us to be as limited as they are. To remain in teaching would have required dishonesty on my part, so I decided to stop.

I find myself, much to my surprise, in agreement with jimd. In Fulton County, we have the loathsome and despicable Ashley Widener on the school board. She is completely dedicated to destroying public education: bellicose, quick to take offense, and thin-skinned. Katie Reeves is another who should go. Katie thinks that education is a cost, rather than an investment, and her recent comments surely must have dispirited most teachers. One of the best teachers I know (truly stellar) told me recently that she has concluded that public education in Georgia from now on is going to be a joke: the state has simply thrown in the towel. If you defeat this person so that she leaves the classroom, you are cheating your children out of one of the best educational experiences they will ever have.

Parents, you get what you pay for, and that is as true in education as any other area of life. You don’t get a Ferrari when you pay for a Focus. What you are willing to do (and what you are willing to pay) is going to define to what opportunities your children are going to have, now and down the road.

Those of you who actually want your children to be educated have reason to be concerned. If money really makes no difference in education, then why are so many wealthy parents willing to pay $20K a year (plus) for a private education for their children? It seems to me that they want their children to be fully educated while denying that opportunity to the rest of us.

catlady

August 6th, 2009
7:16 pm

I’d also like to see the true schedule of teachers. We have some coaches who only teach one class a day (out of 4) yet get paid full time and also get coaching stipends. And other attrocities for “special friends/family members” of the board or administration. And 49%ers who push/carry paperwork or “manage” this or that after they retire. That should be publicly posted as well. I am aware that you can see salary info on line, but sometimes you might think you are getting your money’s worth when you might not be.

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
7:34 pm

Homework Question for the bloggers:

Rate these in order of importance in assessing a teacher:

1. Word of mouth from other parents
2. Word of mouth from your child’s peers
3. Word of mouth from other teachers
4. An admin supplied list of colleges attended and degrees earned
5. A teacher-generated letter about themselves
6. A PTSA newsletter or school journalism article about the teacher

Cere

August 6th, 2009
7:36 pm

My son had a football coach for a full year class called “Entrepreneurship”. The coach never spoke to the class for the entire year. He simply wrote assignments on the board and insisted on silence while students completed the work on their own. He even assigned projects, but never verbally stood and explained them. Yes, this was at that “high-achieving” DeKalb high school.

AP Teacher

August 6th, 2009
8:00 pm

momtoAlex&Max – Quite frankly, teachers don’t owe you a thing! What makes you think that because you volunteer at your childrens’ school, that you need to know that I like to bowl, have 2 dogs, and have been skydiving 4 times? All of this will probably come up during conversation with my students, but, I don’t OWE you this information! I cannot believe that this is even a blog topic. What next – my health records?

PETRA

August 6th, 2009
8:17 pm

The real reason for the “late” teacher assignments is that the schedule for the entire school (high school, anyway) is forever changing. The constant influx of students from other schools and states does not permit the school to prepare for 1300 students; the school must plan on 1300+ students. No one knows what the plus means. The law which requires kids to be in school until after thir 16th birthday creates problems with registration and class assignmnets. Thus, there is a constant state of “flux” whichis very unsettling

Joy in Teaching

August 6th, 2009
8:23 pm

I just got home from school at 7:45. I stayed late to grade a few dozen essays and work on developing a few Learning Focused strategies for a new lesson on Shakespearean language for my 8th graders.

My animals were hungry and out of water. I am hungry and need water. My animals have been taken care of and I might end up with a peanut butter and jelly sandwich as my husband is out of town and money is tight these days.

Not much else to say other than to momtoAlex&Max who seems to think that teachers owe her something, so here it is:

momtoAlex&Max, get over your d*****d self. Your kid’s teachers don’t OWE you diddly squat. In fact, you owe THEM an apology for your ridiculous attitude and you should probably send them flowers tomorrow. If they are anything like me, they probably put well over 12 hours of themselves today into this God-forsaken low paying job that people like you take for granted.

Teachers put ourselves out there because we love children and we love knowledge. We also love sharing that knowledge with children and watching their eyes sparkle when they have that “a ha” moment. We have politicians telling us what we need to teach, administrators telling us that we have to put up with rude children and that they have to make “significant gains” each year. We have parents of over a 100 students who demand that we call and email them over every little thing. So far, on this 5th day of school, I have talked to one parent on three different occasions. Yeah, their child is “challenging.” That’s more than I’ve talked to my own mother in the same time period.

I like teaching. I like the kids. And if I could keep the politicians, administrators and idiot parents like momtoAlex&Max the h*ll out of my classroom, both my students and my teaching would seriously benefit.

Teacher Teacher

August 6th, 2009
8:28 pm

Sounds like momtoAlexandMax should be supporting school vouchers, so she can “demand” her choice. That’s what this topic seems to come down to – you want the best teachers for your child, but it’s impossible in a public school system because of the logistics already discussed. Besides, I’d love to know what Mom’s credentials are to assess my performance. Word of mouth from other parents? Test scores from year to year? I’d LOVE to know what kind of criteria alexandmaxs mom is using to rate her kids’ teachers as AWESOME . . . . wanna elaborate for us?

Bitter Much?

August 6th, 2009
9:02 pm

Um, she is Alex & Max’s mom. That’s all the credentials she needs to insist on the very best.

Teacher Teacher

August 6th, 2009
9:16 pm

Bitter much – one one hand, true. On the other hand, I can’t tell you how many conferences teachers have because parents “demand” to know why a paper was graded a certain way, why a policy is in place, etc. I am all for parents questioning a teacher’s practices, but there’s a tactful way to do it. While this might not be the case for Alex and Max’s mom, it seems that if a teacher doesn’t do something they way a parent wants it for *their* kid, well, then, that teacher isn’t up to par in their eyes. You can make cases for either side. Wouldn’t it be great if teachers could get a bio on their student’s parents before the beginning of the year?

parent and teacher

August 6th, 2009
9:31 pm

Playing devil’s advocate – Bitter much?, if everyone insists on the very best, how do we ensure that’s what they get? What defines the best? Who defines the best?

I don’t have an answer – I’m just throwing out the question for discussion.

Ernest

August 6th, 2009
11:27 pm

Interesting situation I was involved in. While attending curriculum night and moving between our children’s classes, I would ask each teacher to provide a brief bio. The Language Arts teacher looked startled when I asked but then gave her background which segued nicely into her goals and expectations of the students. I met her later in the school year after she got to know my child and myself much better. She admitted I intimidated her initially with the question but realized my intentions were honorable. She also indicated she planned to provide her bio in future events like this to help parents understand how her background will ultimately benefit their children.

IMO, providing bios can be a good thing!

MLNow

August 6th, 2009
11:43 pm

Principals don’t want angry parents in their offices for weeks complaining, so they announce teachers at the last possible moment, hoping no one will have time to complain.

Dee

August 7th, 2009
12:09 am

Some schools delay if they have a lot of turnover. We get our rosters a couple days before school, but they change for withdrawals and new students. Rosters are displayed for our open house we have the day before school begins. Sometimes students are moved from one class to another to keep the numbers about the same. Planning months ahead can be difficult. I remember one year 1/3 to 1/2 of a class were no shows that eventually withdrew.

Elementary teacher

August 7th, 2009
12:59 am

A good teacher sends home a short bio on day 1… I feel parents have the right to know my academic background and my areas of certification. It gets everything out in the open and parents are not second-guessing your qualifications…

Legend of Len Barker

August 7th, 2009
2:01 am

Having worked in a school and (naturally) been a student, qualifications and experience aren’t the be-all and end-all in determining teacher quality.

At the local public institute, a middle school science teacher retired after 30+ years in a classroom. Most of this person’s years – if not the vast majority – were as a science teacher. This teacher was replaced by one that had only one year of classroom experience.

One would think that the vet would have the newbie beat in just about every category. As it turns out, the newbie relates better to the kids, really knows the subject, and has an outstanding grip on discipline. The vet – whom I had known as both a coworker and a student – lacked all of the above. Especially having a rapport with the kids and discipline.

Most schools attempt to divvy up kids in a particular pattern. Some try to put high-achievers together. Some divide the student body equally as possible between race, gender, and learning disabilities.

Class rosters are generally kept secret to keep parents from expressing an opinion. While most are reasonable, schools do have that few who will demand that Susie is with her friends or that Johnny does not have Ms. So-and-So because the parents’ next-door neighbor said she was awful. Never mind that the neighbor’s child would make Job give up and run screaming for the hills and that the neighbor never set foot in the classroom and believed her spawn over the teacher’s detailed documentation. Or when the neighbor did actually visit the school, it was to drop said spawn off because the blankety-blank bus didn’t wait. I shall also mention that the neighbor was wearing only a teddy when the drop-off took place*.

I hated the short bio. It accomplished nothing. For teachers, degrees are more about how much money you want to make per year than it is about the additional education. The master’s is worth a nice chunk of change more than the simple bachelor’s. The rest of the bio is usually a cliche (if it regards classroom philosophy), becomes an attempt to make you think I’m actually cultured (randomly mentions Mab and Titus Andronicus), or tells you too much information (I’m glad you’re religious, but being familiar with the current societal beliefs of your particular church…).

* True story. The teddy story was the talk of the campus for a week.

CA. Middle School Tchr.

August 7th, 2009
5:04 am

In California, where I now teach, we have a school-wide website that posts current school events, grades, daily/weekly/monthly assignments (with due dates), and a link to each teacher’s own webpage, which gives a bio of every staff member and their email address.

This has helped increase communication between staff and parents, and has been a wonderful tool for our school. It is called School Loop. If your school doesn’t have something like this, they should get it!

Certified

August 7th, 2009
5:19 am

Teacher Bios would probably confirm the embarrassing state of our public school systems. Lets see.. Mr.X comes to us from my church group, he got laid off and I really felt bad for him. Ms. Y is my cousin on my mother’s side. She was a hairdresser and we all thought she needed a more stable job. Mr. B is my frat brother, we have known each other for a while. Ms. C is my neighbor, her kids play with my kids and if she didn’t get a job she was going to have to move. At least Mr. B is fully certified. The others are provisional but should finish their qualifications in a year or two… This is the reality of the hiring process. Now with unemployment at 10% it has gotten even worse. Certified and experienced teachers with excellent standardized testing track records can no longer get these jobs. Its like a cell phone Friends & Family plan in education. Check the certification levels for yourself. Oh wait, is that public information? Hmmm….. I mean they are only teaching our children everyday why should we know if they are even certified to teach them?

John

August 7th, 2009
5:51 am

The elementary school I attended 40 plus years ago in southeast Alabama had the right idea. There were three classes in each grade. The teacher whose last name came first alphabetically got the first third of the students alphabetically, the second teacher the middle third, and the third teacher the final third. If your name started with G or H, you might shift which third you were in from year to year, and the same might occur if your last name began with N, O or P. Otherwise, you pretty much knew whose room you were going to be in every year. There was no fussing and no controversy. People need to stop fretting. Everything will work itself out over the course of 13 years and your child will get very good teachers in enough of those years,

mo

August 7th, 2009
6:39 am

Most schools do not post class rosters ahead of time because kids are still enrolling up to the last minute and sometimes class assignments have to change. Also, number of students enrolling during registration means a teacher may have to be moved from one grade level to another if a grade level has higher or lower attendance than expected.
Check the school’s website for teacher bios or you may get one from the teacher during the first week of school.

Turd Ferguson

August 7th, 2009
7:47 am

Most of these overpaid/underqualified “teacher’s” arent worth the paper needed to wipe ones behind let alone be let loose to instruct young minds on proper procedures.

The Schools of today have become nothing more than a huge toilet for gossip, sniping and back-biting with most 7 year olds being more mature than these so called adults could ever dream.

momtoAlex&Max

August 7th, 2009
8:06 am

Teacher teacher: I don’t give a darn about credentials. A PHD from Harvard (while I am sure is impressive) does not a good teacher make. What DOES impress me is a teacher that is dedicated to educating my child. My hat is off to all you teachers: I freely admit I could not do it, not even to just my children.

My school does publish short bios on their webpage. Completely meaningless. I wanted to know who my child was going to be assign to beforehand so I could ask around and see what experiences other parents had had with that teacher. As it turns out, NO ONE I spoke to (and belive me, I spoke to lots of parents) had a good experience with this particular teacher. If I had know that before hand, things would have been different.

And as for “the teacher does not owe me a thing” I BEG to differ. She/he OWES my child a good education, that;s she/he is being paid for (even if it is not as much as he/she should)

Cere

August 7th, 2009
8:29 am

One good thing about the NCLB law is that it forces principals to send notification to parents if their child’s teacher is not “highly-qualified” by the law’s definition. We received a letter like this once, after a month in class with a long-term sub teaching Spanish – but he didn’t speak a word of Spanish. The principal was late on the letter for reasons that would take another post. (He was in the middle of being fired — for the second time in 2 years.)

Anyway – when parents are allowed to manipulate teacher choices, things can go badly for some others. One time, a pansy ES principal accommodated parents preferences for teachers and ended up with a second grade classroom consisting of 20 boys and 1 girl! Bad deal for that girl. The principal had the nerve to ask me to transfer my girl into the classroom so there would be 2. I guessed we were the only 2 parents who hadn’t made special requests! (Of course, at that point, I said “no” and the other parents insisted on moving their girl out so the class actually ended up all boys.)

Allowing parents to manipulate and micromanage serves those parents well – however, it causes repercussions for others who are not as aggressive. Principals need to be empowered and supported by the superintendent to maintain control over things like this.

Ken Thompson

August 7th, 2009
10:10 am

Many posters suggest the bio info has no value and yet are adamantly opposed to publication. hmmm…

I, as a mere taxpayer, would like a source for the following info on every teacher, admin, parapro, sub, media specialist, school nurse…in all schools through out the state

name
full academic history including high school and elementary school
certification status
year first certified
year of last re-certification
tenure status
current assignment
number of years in current assignment
total teaching experience
total admin experience
total non-teaching, non-admin experience (curriculum development, etc.)

And just what would I, with no child in school, do with this information? I would answer a few questions:

how many teachers are teaching out of field?
how many teachers are not fully certified?
how many teachers are products of the “most excellent public school system on the planet”
how many teachers are educated under the Ga system and how many are “imported”

I am sure I could think of a few more.

Mac

August 7th, 2009
10:22 am

Ken – Everything you asked about is on file and publicly accessible at your school or Central Office – All you have to do is ask them. All schools are required to send out notification each year if there is a teacher on their staff who is not Highly Qualified, or teaching out of field for any reason.

GA Educator

August 7th, 2009
10:22 am

Joy in Teaching, THANKS for shedding some light on online studying. I don’t know why people have such a misguided or misinformed view of distance learning. This is tedious, rigorous instruction that is more difficult in many many ways than onsite studying. You are on your own without the benefit of “befriending” or otherwise garnering support from the teacher. It requires STRICT discipline and dedication to purpose. For those of you who don’t believe it and before you pass judgment on it, please, please enroll in a reputable online university program and see for yourself.

These are not fill out a form, attach a fee, and a week later you have a degree in the mail, as I think many people think and as was prevalent aabout 20 years ago. These are HARD EARNED degrees. If you don’t know about it, please don’t speak on it by speculation. Study to show yourself informed before passing judgment.

Jessica

August 7th, 2009
10:23 am

I’m thinking back to my own school days, and I KNOW that not all teachers provide the same quality of education. I’m sure most people who went to public school had similar experiences.
I had some wonderful, dedicated teachers who had a lasting impact on my education. They had my respect and my parents’ appreciation.
I also had some really awful teachers. I know that teachers have a difficult job and no one is perfect, but some teachers are consistently terrible. Some of them were very lazy, and others (including some very nice ones) didn’t understand their subject well enough to teach it. I had one teacher who would actually lie to parents and administrators about students to cover the fact that she was grading and disciplining unfairly.

That said, why shouldn’t the teachers who excel get better pay and more opportunities, and why should the lousy ones keep their jobs year after year? Also why shouldn’t parents (the people responsible for the education of their children) have a role in evaluating the job performance of teachers?

mdowney

August 7th, 2009
12:58 pm

I have de-spammed five comments. Sorry I was slow to do so. I was out this morning.

JMH

August 7th, 2009
1:18 pm

We met my son’s teacher at the new BFES (Milton) and she is HOTT!

mdowney

August 7th, 2009
4:05 pm

JMH, I assume you mean the poor woman was sweltering because the AC wasn’t working.

Robin

August 7th, 2009
4:59 pm

Parents like “momtoAlex&Max” are the most hated types by teachers and administration. My school “tolerates” these types and can’t wait till they get to middle school and beyond where they can throw tantrums all day long and can’t get their way. There are notes in your child’s folder about parents like you and you do eventually get what is coming to you. You may think you are doing what is best for your child, but you are really ruining their lives. Good luck with that!

old teach

August 7th, 2009
6:34 pm

One of the advantages of a good private school…..student placement takes into consideration the personalities of the teachers and the needs of the students. For example, a child who needs a nurturing, calm loving teacher is placed in the classroom of teacher who can and does offer that support. A child who needs a teacher who takes no nonsense and offers not so much support but structure and expectations is given to a teacher who suits that need.

ScienceTeacher671

August 7th, 2009
7:14 pm

old teach, I think that would be nice…and it’s probably easy to do when you have 10:1 student:teacher ratios…

We find out which students will be in our classes the day before school starts, and about 2 hours before the students find out who their teachers will be…although, high school schedules being what they are, the entire situation (for teachers and students) may be radically different a week after school starts…

momtoAlex&Max

August 7th, 2009
9:11 pm

Old teach: that would be very nice, but unfortunately, I cannot afford private education. I have to work withing my public school system.

Robin: I don’t give a rat’s behind what the administratots think of me. I support my kid’s teachers 100%. I help with whatever supplies they need, I volunteer in the classroom. ALL I care about is that my children are getting the best teacher that suits their needs. I don’t care about degrees or certifications. I care about having teachers that actually care.

long time high school teacher

August 7th, 2009
10:49 pm

On the first day of class I spend a few minutes having the students introduce themselves and share something about themselves. I then spend a few more minutes introducing myself including where I grew up, went to school, how long I’ve taught, subjects I’ve taught, my areas of certification, and what I did over the summer. (I taught high school summer school for almost five weeks) Yes this takes up precious teaching time, but it establishes a rapport with students and makes us a cohevise group. Besides it’s fun getting to know something about each other. The students can then go home and share the information. and yes I do this with each class.

I always asked my children, who are now grown, about their teachers sometime after school on the first day. Sometimes at dinner or whenever we had a few minutes to talk. They usually had some tidbit to share about each of their teachers. This helped me get to know my children’s various teachers before actually meeting them.

HS Teacher, Too

August 7th, 2009
11:11 pm

Northview Ex … you lasted three more years than I did, and I think I am going to copy and paste your posting into a word document that I can hang on to forever. Good luck in whatever endeavors you take on. It’s sad that people like you are being run out — and no one seems to “get it.” You and I are the teachers Jim D wishes there were more of: people who put our money where our mouths are, so to speak. Unfortunately, that means leaving the field, not making it better. That’s the travesty.

Seen it all

August 7th, 2009
11:47 pm

MomtoAlexandMax,

We all knew (those who have been in education awhile) the reason why you wanted to know your child’s teacher ahead of time. My honest advice to you is to just talk to the teacher during “open house”, “meet and greet”, “sneak-a-peek”, or any of these other introductory sessions schools throw during the week of preplanning. I promise that this will serve you well. You will actually get to get some of your questions answered and it may even make you feel better about your child’s new teacher. You will get the opportunity to establish a real rapport and understand with the woman (or man, if that is the case) who your child will be with all year.

I’ll tell you this– when you do “private investigations” and “background checks” on prospective teachers ,you have already gone behind their backs. It shows that you don’t trust them and this is even before your child has set foot in the classroom.

And most important, doing “background checks” causes you to form opinions about people you or your child have never even met before. How can you say a teacher is good or bad simply from what a person in the neighborhood told you?

ScienceTeacher671

August 8th, 2009
8:49 am

Not that I’m in charge, but it seems to me that part of Northview (Ex)Teacher’s post is worthy of further discussion:

“Parents, you get what you pay for, and that is as true in education as any other area of life. You don’t get a Ferrari when you pay for a Focus. What you are willing to do (and what you are willing to pay) is going to define to what opportunities your children are going to have, now and down the road. Those of you who actually want your children to be educated have reason to be concerned. If money really makes no difference in education, then why are so many wealthy parents willing to pay $20K a year (plus) for a private education for their children? It seems to me that they want their children to be fully educated while denying that opportunity to the rest of us.”

I’d be the first to agree that many of our systems are bloated, top-heavy, and waste money…but I can’t help but wonder about those who think a $5000 voucher for each parent would be better than our current system, when the top private schools cost 4 to 5 times as much.

ScienceTeacher671

August 8th, 2009
9:24 am

Off topic, but considering the staff reductions and class size increases many systems have already experienced, how are systems to implement the CDC flu recommendations that include moving desks further apart? In our district, they’ve packed as many students as the fire marshall will approve into each classroom; there’s no room to move them apart!

mj

August 8th, 2009
10:41 am

Students and parents get out of school what they are willing to put into school. It is not the teacher’s sole responsibility to educate our children.

Teachers are people just like you and I trying to do a very difficult job in a very difficult time. They are not the same just like you and I are not the same as parents. I agree with teachers and parents getting to know each other, go to orientation, see and talk to the teacher. The resume does not make a good working relationship.

By requesting teacher changes, what are we really teaching our children. We encounter differneces in people and situations everyday. If we work with a boss that may not be a great boss, do we request a job change. That is not always the answer. Parents can take active role in helping a child learn to make a healthy adjustment to a situation that is not the ideal.

We are all teachers in some way shape or form.

parent and teacher

August 8th, 2009
10:41 am

FYI – my school was still registering kids as of 4:15 yesterday – the rosters I was given for meet and greet have already changed – TWICE. It’s transiency, not conspiracy, yo.

Northview EX – not only was that well-written, it exactly describes how I felt this summer when I was updating my resume and posting it online. I’m still teaching, but I’m not sure how long this will last – having a science degree, I have other options. Strangely, it’s allowed me a sense of calm I’ve never felt before, and I’m actually looking forward to this year.

long time high school teacher – exactly what I do!

Turd Ferguson – did a bad experience with school leave you feeling poopy?

Seen it all

August 8th, 2009
3:27 pm

To be quite honest, I felt the same way as the Northview teacher when I left teaching in GA. I became disgusted with the system. Disgusted with parents who don’t really care about their children being educated- only in playing power games. Disgusted with teachers who don’t really care about their students being educated- only in playing power games. Disgusted with administrators who don’t really care about students being educated- only in playing power games.

So what’s the point in being a caring teacher, putting in 110% everyday, when the people around you don’t care. There are a lot of people who teach, drive school buses, serve lunches, mops floors, etc. who care about students and their well being. And their are others who just work only for themselves. They end up bringing the whole system to a halt. But in the end, after it is all said and done, I have heard more complaints about the administrators, the people in charge. They are the ones, rightly blamed for all the problems of education.

I know from experience and knowledge, that is really isn’t the students, parents, or teachers that are the problems. It’s the leadership at the top. A real vision and good leadership will overcome “bad teachers”, “lazy students”, and “apathetic parents.” The reality is that the people at the top don’t care. This is why the system is a failure. Sometimes I think that it wasn’t it wasn’t meant to be successful in the first place.

Special Ed Teacher

August 8th, 2009
10:53 pm

As a teacher, I have no problem providing parents with a short bio of myself; however please know that it will give you little clue as to what kind of teacher I am. My degrees, experience and educational philosophy tell you little about me as a teacher because they are not what makes a successful teacher. A successful teacher is made from qualities that cannot be put on paper- compassion, determination, quick-thinking, dedication, optimism, and faith and hope in something grander than themselves, more important than the acronyms that guide public education. Say what you will about public education, but for the most part it is staffed by a hard-working group of people who each day try to make the world a better place. There are bad apples in every basket and our system with it’s burned out teachers and over politicized rules and procedures cannot escape that. However, they are the exception rather than the rule just as overly demanding parents and incompetent administrators out of the norm. Just as teachers need to be redirected to the heart of their profession, the endless journey towards a better future for each child, so too do parents who are merely working to give their child the best future possible. The system works best when it is an open conversation between people who are all striving towards the common goal of providing the best education for each student rather than when it degenerates into a name calling, accusation slinging cesspool of doubt. When that conversation begins is when we are sure to see the promise of each student fulfilled.

Bitter Much?

August 8th, 2009
11:40 pm

We get what we pay for? Well, according to the National Center for Education Statistics, during the 2005-2006 school year, it cost $9,154 to educate one student in the public school system. There are private schools in my area that don’t cost this much. Where does the money go?

The Sarge

August 9th, 2009
2:33 am

Why do we insist on filling our days with superflous information? When I board a commercial aircraft, the lead attendant, along with the safety brief, introduces the crew by name only. No one wants to know that the captain served in the Air Force, flew so many combat missions, yada yada yada…only that he is qualified for the task at hand. This is what we in the civilized world call professionalism. If I see the captain at the bar (he’s on a three-day stand-down), being a pilot, I might discuss details surrounding training, experience, etc; to a non-pilot, these details might be viewed simply as “polite time filler”. As a non-teacher, by the same token, I would be professionally interested simply in the fact that the kid’s teacher is qualified. A “been-there- done-that” discussion would be reserved for less-formal circumstances.

Let’s just trust that the teacher, by virtue of his/her credential, is fully qualified for the task at hand…it’s worked ok for hundreds of generations. If the parent wants a “tea party” conversation with teach, do so on the golf course.

Sarge

ScienceTeacher671

August 9th, 2009
8:14 am

Bitter Much?, the private schools in your area that don’t cost as much probably are based in churches and share facilities with the church. They may be subsidized by those churches as a ministry. They probably don’t have to provide transportation and hot lunches as public schools do, and they may not provide those things.

ScienceTeacher671

August 9th, 2009
8:17 am

Bitter Much? I’m going to answer you in little bits so maybe the Blog Monster won’t eat so many posts this morning. First, please note that your figure is a national average and most districts in Georgia spend less than that per pupil.

Many of the less expensive private schools are less administratively “top heavy” – but in part they don’t need as many administrators because they don’t have to deal with as many discipline problems and/or federal and state mandates & paperwork as public schools do.

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