You be the judge
Since there has been much ado about the blocks made by Georgia Tech against Virginia Tech in their game two weeks ago, I thought I’d let you see a couple of clips that a Hokies fan posted on youtube.com
The first:
Chop block?
As you can see, at first it appears that the Virginia Tech defensive lineman is being chop blocked, an illegal block in which one player engages a defender high while another defender engages him low.
But, if you watch closely, Georgia Tech’s guard actually doesn’t engage the defender, he simply runs by and he two players briefly collide. It is then that Georgia Tech’s tackle goes low and hits him. It’s a fine line, but it is the line.
I have no idea if I’m correct, but that’s what it looks like to me.
The second:
Crackback block?
Virginia Tech coach Frank Beamer said this was one of several plays in which safety Kam Chancellor was illegally blocked.
I’m sorry, but I don’t see it. Chancellor is cleanly blocked.
So, there are likely other plays, but at least in these two examples I don’t see it.
There had to have been some, otherwise the ACC wouldn’t have told Beamer that there were four missed blocks.
———–
In other news, Georgia Tech coach Paul Johnson said that Cooper Taylor likely won’t play again this season. He is going to apply to the NCAA for a medical redshirt.
Julian Burnett may return this week, however.
————
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199 comments Add your comment
Nerd
October 27th, 2009
11:42 am
FG,
For the play to be an illegal block, the player must be diving towards the ORIGNAL PLACEMENT of the ball. Not sideways. That block is close – it could go either way. It probably should have been called – but it wasn’t. Maybe next year.
This reminds me of Beamer accusing UGA of stealing signals a couple of years ago when they lost the chicken bowl. He seems to blame anyone but himself…
Trade School Junkie
October 27th, 2009
11:49 am
Figthin Goobler: Grow a pair.
GT has these ACC game left:
1. Wake
2. Duke
VT has these ACC games left:
1. UNC
2. Maryland
3. NCSt
4. UVA
Not worried at all of GT beating Wake and Duke.
You can take this to the bank:
VT better win all of their remianing ACC games, or VT is gonna look R-E-A-L-L-Y STUPID, worse than they already llIf VT loses one more ACC game, we want hear ANYTHING MORE from VT or about this bogus blocking non-sense.
Gt4Ever
October 27th, 2009
11:52 am
superDawg
October 27th, 2009
6:00 am
If any of you nerds have read my post in the past I have mentioned gt’s blocking tactics,specifically chop blocking it is part of your mo and should be addressed by the NCAA.I think it is part of your coaching schemes and needs to be stopped.
If so, then why are there more chop block calls being called on other teams not named Tech? Beamer sent in tape and not one of those officials said they were illegal. Watching games this weekend at least three chop calls were made. None on Tech. CPJ sent in 12 holding calls and the officals agree on half. Maybe the refs should be watching the holding calls since that’s the real issue. The OL holds on just about every play. You guys should be more concerned with your celebration after scoring, that is if you can score on UF’s #1 defense.
juvenal
October 27th, 2009
11:58 am
FG, daugs were at least good before the 60’s, when most everyone stopped using real students to make $-how much math those communication majors of your take?
Burdell
October 27th, 2009
12:00 pm
Hey Knob Gobbler–
Go cry on a VT blog…find someone that cares. We didn’t make the blocks!
hellobeez
October 27th, 2009
12:06 pm
Fightin Gobbler – go look up the rules. That block is 100% legal on Kam in the second to last drive. A crack back block (which is very different than a chop block) is only illegal if the blocker goes low while blocking – and I know this is tough for you to follow, but here is the key – and goes low back toward the direction of the original spot of the ball. In your video, the blocker was blocking towards the end-zone. Yes it was low, but legal, safe, and totally a part of football. If you want to play this game, I can 100% guarantee you I can find piles of these same blocks by your Turkeys. And realize that any well coached team teaches down field blocking. Every team does it. The reason Tech gets whiners like you and uneducated UGA fans who also don’t know the rules (like curious and SuperDawg) is because Tech basically runs 100% of the time and down field blocking creates big plays. Most teams are not well coached enough to effectively block down field on runs – it sort of happens as a byproduct. GT coaches this as a fundamental part of the game. There is nothing illegal here – the illegal hits are ones that effectively blindside players. The whole intent of the ‘crack back’ rule is to make sure a defender (within 10 yards of the line by the way) doesn’t have guys diving back towards the ball and really making it dangerous. Again, blocking low is not illegal or dirty – blocking from behind and the side is (which can tear up knees). Find those, and I will agree with any Turkey or UGAy fan. Next I can educate you arm-chair quarterbacks on why people THINK Tech chop blocks at the line…. Which they don’t…
Al
October 27th, 2009
12:06 pm
nothing illegal to me. i see the same stuff all the time. a chop is when two at the same time intentiaonally go after one guy. that never happened here.
Fightin Gobbler
October 27th, 2009
12:07 pm
For a school that’s supposedly one of the best in the country, you guys obviously don’t teach logic.
Of course Paul Johnson coaches his kids to block low. Heck, he actually held a seminar with refs to show them what he was going to do. To suggest that this player is normally coached to go up high on that play and this one time he forgot and instead dove at players legs is laughable at best and intellectually dishonest at worst.
The whole “it’s part of the game” argument is also pretty pathetic. Yes, injuries are part of the game. Rules are there in part to try to discourage/prevent the sort of plays that have shown they can cause those injuries (again, facemask, horse collar, CHOP BLOCK, etc.). You can call holding on every play. You can probably call pass interference or defensive holding on most plays too. There is judgement involved. CPJ seems to feel chopping comes under that same heading (i.e. sometimes it is, sometimes it isn’t) but the potential for injury on a chop block is exponentially higher and as such refs should be that much more sensitive to it, not less.
And for the poster who claimed no defensive lineman have been hurt by GT this year, John Graves was in fact injured on play #1 and didn’t return to the field (huge loss to lose your starting D tackle vs. a triple option scheme) and no word yet if he can play this week. But that’s okay becuase its just part of the game, right?
Mel
October 27th, 2009
12:09 pm
Talk about whiners. The guy noticed his player was blocking and immediately let up and went after another guy. He didn’t even push him or the vt player would have been flattened. VT are a bunch of whiners
UGAIsSoLastYear
October 27th, 2009
12:20 pm
Chris Evert rarely, if ever, complained about a line call in tennis. Her take was always ‘they tend to even out’. This regarding the calls that go your way and the ones that don’t. Most true sportsmen (and women) know this and play their sports with class. To complain about calls is just silly. Whether they were legal or not, the calls tend to even out over the long run. To me, the sad issue is them bringing it up. No class.
Tech82
October 27th, 2009
12:22 pm
Gobbler – Ok, so the actions of the players on the field always reflect the intent of the coaches? That being the case, Frank Beamer is quite possibly the dirtiest coach in the history of college football. The key witnesses against him: Michael and Marcus Vick along with Meangelo Hall. Based on the number of thugs that have been produced by VT over the years, Beamer must be conducting gang initiations instead of football practices. Face it, your logic is hopelessly flawed (probably due to your inferior education).
BankerDawg
October 27th, 2009
12:23 pm
I didn’t realize that people only got injured in games played by GT while being coached by Paul Johnson.
This is truly unbelievable.
Hokies, give it up, really.
Injuries ARE part of the game. If there was a conclusive study that showed football injuries only occurred employing the illegal blocking techniques of one Paul Johnson, then you would have a point. But I am fairly certain no such study exists.
These are all JUDGEMENT calls. There is nothing that OBVIOUSLY shows any illegal block in any clip shown by a Hokie…period. I’m sure your interpretation is of an illegal block…because you lost. This, I think, would be the very definition of sour grapes.
Bottom line is, as alluded to earlier, the ACC has done nothing in an official capacity to verify any of the claims the Hokies are making. If so, such statement or action would have taken place last week, which it did not.
Many tapes are sent to many League Offices every week and they ALL show some missed calls, which anyone can admit happen all the time.
But it sounds like you VT people are speaking of a calculated, purposeful intent by CPJ to teach his players to cheat and that is what amazes me. Hard to believe he’s been coaching for so long and no one has figured out his “illegal” system yet.
Give it a rest. Play better defense, and tell your best player not to run his mouth in the preseason…all of this could have been avoided.
Sorry for the rant, but between Kiffin, Mullen, Petrino, Beamer, et al, I am fed up with cry babies. Way to teach your kids the important lessons in life….”Blame someone else”.
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DAWGS! SIC ‘EM!
hellobeez
October 27th, 2009
12:25 pm
Hmm gobbler seems to be the one with logic issues. Which point would you like to address a crack back block or a chop? Very different but you seem to be mixing the two. What CPJ was showing the refs last year was that in his offense he has an O lineman (OL#1) shooting a gap and not engaging a D lineman. The intent is to block a LB or the secondary. While not unique in football, it is employed much much more by GT. What some teams have tried to do to slow down GT (LSU did this with great success) is to hold OL#1 (which is defensive holding, lots of people don’t know this rule because it’s never called, but it is a penalty on the D). What can happen is that O lineman #2 is assigned to block D lineman. But when D lineman turns to hold OL#1, it creates a very dangerous and stupid situation for him (opening him up to get hit low). I guess Turkey is such a good football player that he could immediately pull up if he was OL#2 when he saw DL holding OL#1. But 99% of football players are not that good. Again, this is not a dirty play. It is a STUPID play by the defense and even more negligent by the coaches to tell their line to do this. They create a situation where their d lineman turns their back to the line by holding an OL trying to run by them. So who is at fault here? What is really happening is defensive coaches are putting their players at risk by employing a very dangerous strategy to try to hold back an offense they cannot stop otherwise. ALL TEAMS DO THIS with their O line, difference is that defenses can key on that since tech runs it virtually 100% of the time. If you know that O lineman is going to shoot by you each time, you can pretty much know that you should start holding him every time. Or at least designate one guy each play to do it, so that you have a LB better in position to shoot a gap. If you were playing a more traditional offense that might drop back and pass block more, you’d be a huge disadvantage if you were waiting for a shooting O lineman to hold…. Well, darn, now I find myself wasting my own time with people like this. My own fault for getting sucked into people who know almost nothing about the game.
chokiehokiehater
October 27th, 2009
12:36 pm
When a team starts preparing to play us in their spring drills even when they open up against Bama and they do not play us until Oct. 17th..then you know that THEY KNOW the hoax is over..No longer is VT going to dominate this conference. VT also knows they were lucky they got away with that win in Blacksburg in 2008. They are scared as hell of being the Losers and having to take a back seat to GT in the Coastal . No more HokieNation, as even the majority of the country and media will favor Ga Tech..
I have despised this VT scheming coaching staff and team for a long time and even more than Clemson and UGA. Cry now cause it’s not over as your entire hoax of a conglomerate will crumble right before your eyes. LOSERS
Voice of Reason
October 27th, 2009
12:39 pm
This offense doesn’t work without chop blocks. Everybody knows this. It’s a dirty offense that requires dirty plays to be made. I don’t fault the Tech players since they’re just doing what they’ve been taught. You could easily call a penalty on every down against Tech’s offense.
juvenal
October 27th, 2009
12:42 pm
fg-you sent back 900 tickets-you did not bring your band-it is a 7 hour drive-i will be making it next year-next you gripe about sliding tackles in soccer?
WTH
October 27th, 2009
12:44 pm
Well said BankerDawg.
Tech82
October 27th, 2009
12:46 pm
Voice of Reason – Please take the time to educate yourself before running your mouth. The option offence works just fine without chop blocks. Chop blocks are illegal and nobody on the coaching staff teaches them. What is integral to the option offense is the use of cut blocks. Cut blocking is LEGAL in college football. Get a clue.
air conditioned gypsy
October 27th, 2009
12:47 pm
Pussies…
Joe Schmoe
October 27th, 2009
12:47 pm
Voice of Reason
October 27th, 2009
12:39 pm
This offense doesn’t work without chop blocks. Everybody knows this. It’s a dirty offense that requires dirty plays to be made. I don’t fault the Tech players since they’re just doing what they’ve been taught. You could easily call a penalty on every down against Tech’s offense.
Once again Mr. Ignorant. Tech does not “chop block” as that is illegal, they do however cut block. I wouldnt expect a doggie to know the diffrence though.
Voice of Reason
October 27th, 2009
12:48 pm
Tech82 – Then why doesn’t CPJ teach “cut” blocks instead of the chop blocks they are obviously using?
juvenal
October 27th, 2009
12:50 pm
vor-nobody elses’ O works without holding..maybe we should allow our opponents to wear skirts-
Nerfle
October 27th, 2009
12:51 pm
Why can’t Tech block like men instead of throwing their bodies at the shins of defenders? Pu$$ies
Tech82
October 27th, 2009
12:54 pm
Voice of Reason – If Tech was is “obviously” using chop blocks on every play, why aren’t the refs calling them? Are you another of the conspiracy theorists who think the refs are fixing the games? Get a clue.
Alabama jack
October 27th, 2009
12:56 pm
Uh, BEAT VANDY IS ALL THAT IS IMPORTANT. Forget the rest of this stuff.
VT Whiners
October 27th, 2009
1:04 pm
Hey Gobbler Idiot. Your coach is a whining cheat. VT and FSU are 2 of the dirtiest teams in college football. Beamer has no room to complain.
GT For You And Me
October 27th, 2009
1:07 pm
Fightin Gobbler is only whining because they got beat………….. Find another argument Gobbler………..
Stinger
October 27th, 2009
1:09 pm
I don’t recall us crying so much about the bad helmet to helmet call that cost us the game against VT last year or the same call that cost us a game against Notre Dame a few years ago. We lost 2 games because we tackled a QB running down the sidelines as the QB lowered their heads. I don’t ever see that called against anyone but us. Miami should have had that called in their game against Clemson, but no flag was thrown.
GT For You And Me
October 27th, 2009
1:10 pm
Nerfle: Your obviously a Homer DAWG fan………….
GT FAN PA
October 27th, 2009
1:12 pm
Bankerdawg as always good to see you on our blogs-Good luck to you guys this weekend down in FL- Judgement calls at best- yes officials could call something every play on every team- I have to ask as well- why didn’t Beamer say something last year? Because they won- and if they would have won this year he would say nothing- if you are going to talk the talk you better be able to walk the walk- Beamer should be instructing his players to insert foot in mouth and shut the piehole up-I don’t think he lead the team in tackles for the game did he? CPJ has been doing this for 20+ years I think he is well aware of what is legal and not legal one would think anyway! Go JACKETS-also wanted to give a thank you to Yabba Dabba DOO for his Clemson team winning at the U!
StraightJacket
October 27th, 2009
1:20 pm
Fightn’ Goober: Re: Your post of 11:05 … Go back and look at the video. The block on Kam “I use the Force to know where Tech is running the ball” Chancellor there IS legal. LOOK at Embry’s Head AND shoulder position – across Kam’s right leg as Kam is moving from North to South. Kam even falls “South”. In order to violate the applicable rule here, we’d have to be running the play the other direction – EAST, not west, and Kam would have to be in pursuit to the EAST (or at least SouthEast). If that were the case, then Embry would have been approaching Kam from the WEST as Kam was heading toward (quoting from the rule book here) “the original position of the ball” and the ONLY way to block Kam would be from behind … a clip, and a 15 yard penalty.
All this talk has been centered around 3 plays… 3 PLAYS! One is the “joke” where Tyler hits Kam HIGH and RIGHT IN HIS FACE on the crackback on Nesibitt’s TD run – OBVIOUSLY, a legal block. The one we just discussed, where Embry’s head AND shoulder are clearly across Kam’s right leg to get cut him from the front, and 3rd is the case where Cord is on his way to the second level to get a LB and “brushes” a VPI&SU DL. IS THAT ALL YA GOT? WHERE’s all the OTHER plays?
This is getting silly, and Beamer will pay the PR price for it when people watch the tape and realize that, at best, he’s complaining about ONE “questionable” call in a game of over 100 plays. That is why I think Beamer will shut up now.
As for us, and “chop” (i.e. not “cut”) blocking, … our coaches watch the film too. Even if “chop” blocks AREN’T called, CPJ has mentioned before that any “chop” block is a result of somebody messing up on a blocking assignment … and that guy will be running extra stadium steps on Monday. Why? Because chop blocks are not part of the game, they give you a 15 yard penalty, and can quickly get your team in a hole.
-SJ
Greg
October 27th, 2009
1:29 pm
Since all the Tech fans want to get on Dawg boards, I feel I can come right on in here.
All bug fans would be screaming bloody murder if the Dawgs would use some of the tactics that the bugs use in the trenches. There will come a time when the Trade School will get its medicine and you’ll be in the blogs whining about how some team played dirty against you.
Not Disappointed
October 27th, 2009
1:34 pm
“Cry me a River…Why don’t you?”
Beamer should be trying to identify why he looked so Stupid after the game, “We just couldn’t stop them!” Let it go and/or Grow a pair.
We didn’t cry about the two bad calls in last years drive! Stop whinning like a Betch!!!!!!!!!!!!
Virginia Tech needs to be worried about winning the rest of their games. Like we are… “Press on, 1st Virginia!” StoneWall Jackson!!!!
db
October 27th, 2009
1:35 pm
I think VT is trying to bring atthention to and therefore set the stage for the ref’s to be looking hard at everything GT does now. They are probably hoping we will get a bunch of penalties which may cost us a game and VT is back in the running. If you win, be a winner, if you lose, don’t be a loser. Accept it like a man.
db
October 27th, 2009
1:35 pm
I think VT is trying to bring attention to and therefore set the stage for the ref’s to be looking hard at everything GT does now. They are probably hoping we will get a bunch of penalties which may cost us a game and VT is back in the running. If you win, be a winner, if you lose, don’t be a loser. Accept it like a man.
Not Disappointed
October 27th, 2009
1:36 pm
Is this the same Greg that’s MIA after Virginia lost last week?
Eh?
DogFan
October 27th, 2009
1:36 pm
Beamer is a crybaby. I remember UGA spanking the Hokies in a bowl about 3 years ago and a few months later he accused UGA of spying on the Hokie’s practices. Seems he just can’t blame himself for losses…
Not Disappointed
October 27th, 2009
1:41 pm
OMG DogFan! I remember him crying about UGA spying on him. “Spying in the midst!” To Funny!
Ramblin Wreck!
jkj300
October 27th, 2009
1:43 pm
For those VT fans that think they have an elite program, might I remind them that. . .
. . .they’ve NEVER won a national title . . .
. . .and only had a shot at one and got f*in WORKED by FSU. . .
. . . get housed in bowl games (8-14 all time). . .
. . . and have only 7 conference championships in ~120 years of football . . .
. . . and are perennially overranked!
So before you go shooting off you mouth, think about being in a room with a Florida, LSU, Michigan, Alabama, USC or Oklahoma alumnus and keep your mouth shut until you put up 1, just 1, national title.
juvenal
October 27th, 2009
1:43 pm
does that mean Navy plays dirty?
Delbert D.
October 27th, 2009
1:48 pm
Looked like great cut-blocking technique to me. That’s improvement over the early games this season.
SPS
October 27th, 2009
1:51 pm
I’m really worried about Cooper Taylor. If the surgical procedure was effective, he should have been back on the field a couple of weeks ago. I had a different type of heart arrhythmia, but it was treated with a similar ablation procedure, and I ran the Peachtree Road Race 17 days later. So it worries me that Cooper has not responded quickly. His type of arrhythmia can be caused by other underlying issues, and may not be easily or permanently corrected. Let’s keep this in perspective, and focus on his health, and forget about his playing status. Good luck Cooper. Get healthy.
"Big Six" Carpenter
October 27th, 2009
1:51 pm
Looks like “Beamer Bawl” has acquired a new meaning!
Squeezebox
October 27th, 2009
1:55 pm
TO @ 10:44 pm. You know not of what you speak. D-Linemen CAN be called for holding on offensive linemen. This often happens when the lineman is trying to block a linebacker, but the D-Lineman grabs him so his linebacker can get to the ball unimpeded.
Delbert D.
October 27th, 2009
1:55 pm
By the way, the officials did call two illegal chop blocks against Ga. Tech, which were obvious on the replays. Apparently, Beamer saw that since they were calling them, he wanted more.
GA Tech Insider
October 27th, 2009
2:01 pm
Fightin Gobbler; the link to play that you have provided to us was submitted to the ACC by Virginia Tech, and Frank Beamer, was deemed LEGAL by the ACC, therefore, Paul Johnson was NOT notified that it was an illegal block.
You, the rest of the Hokie fans, UGA fans, Frank Beamer, and the entire team can say whatever you want, the ACC and the officials have deemed the block legal. Stop your whining.
GA Tech Insider
October 27th, 2009
2:06 pm
It is very obvious to this observer that Frank Beamer has already decided that the only way that he can stop a Paul Johnson offense is with the assistance of the referees; his coaches can’t scheme for it and his players can’t execute to stop it.
Therefore, Frank Beamer is already in the process of petitioning the ACC referees to start calling chop blocks on GA Tech. That’s the only way that he thinks that Virginia Tech can stay competitive in the Coastal Division race.
GT65
October 27th, 2009
2:08 pm
I was really surprised to hear all of the whining and crying out of the Virginia Tech camp. Frank Beamer, his DB coach as well as Kam Chancellor come across like a bunch of whining, arrogant, elitist individuals.
VT has been used to winning divisions since it joined the ACC in 2004. In fact, with exception to 2006 and with all probability 2009, GT and VT have won the last six conference or Coastal Division titles. Well I’ve got news for you Hokies, GT ain’t going nowhere –GT will be battling for Coastal division titles year end and year out so get used to it.
Beamer comes out of this with egg all over his face. VT loses first the game, and then comes the interesting thing, on an off week after Miami loses and GT controls it’s own destiny, starts crying about the officiating.
The VT program is on it’s way down –without ever really accomplishing anything of meaningful significance– and this really should be an embarrassment to the program, depending on what the media decides to do –or not do– with it.
GT65
October 27th, 2009
2:12 pm
Greg
October 27th, 2009
1:29 pm
Since all the Tech fans want to get on Dawg boards, I feel I can come right on in here.
All bug fans would be screaming bloody murder if the Dawgs would use some of the tactics that the bugs use in the trenches. There will come a time when the Trade School will get its medicine and you’ll be in the blogs whining about how some team played dirty against you.
- – - – - – - – - -
I see with the rain in Atlanta Greg has the day off –can’t mow grass on the side of the highway when it’s wet huh Greg.
GTMike
October 27th, 2009
2:18 pm
Phil, your choice b does not seem correct. The fact that you can block with the shoulder does not make what happened here a block. Here is a ruling from the rules that seems to apply:
XXVI. After snapping the ball, snapper A54 brushes by nose guard B62
on his way to block a linebacker. A54 makes slight contact with
B62, or B62 reaches out and uses his arm to initiate contact with
A54. While B62 and A54 are in contact, right guard A68 blocks
B62 at the knee from the front. RULING: Legal. A54 is not
blocking B62. The incidental contact or B62’s initiating contact
does not constitute part of a combination block, and hence there
is no chop block.