Program of the decade? Camden, Northside stake claims
Northside and Camden County will play on Saturday for the Class AAAAA championship.
Is this also for the title of ”football program of the decade”?
Let’s look at the candidates:
Northside: 121-13 record this decade, two state titles, two runner-up finishes, but is it significant that the titles were won in Class AAAA, below the highest level?
Camden Couty: 120-13 record this decade, two state titles, but are Camden’s W-L record and playoff draws enhanced from playing in the state’s weakest Class AAAAA region?
Lowndes: Three state titles and six championships in the state’s toughest region, but does that make up for having only 106 victories this decade and a 2-4 record vs. Camden County?
Buford: 137-7 record this decade and five state titles, with a sixth possible, but how do you compare AA vs. AAAAA?
Is there another program that deserves consideration? Parkview? LaGrange? Charlton County?
As far as the other finals, there are no great surprises that I see except Clarke Central. Great job by Leroy Ryals in reviving a program that hasn’t been in a title game since 1992. Sandy Creek also deserves some recognition. An early loss conspired to keep this team out of the limelight until it counts.
All the finalists from AAA down have been ranked No. 1 or No. 2 at some point this season. I’d say Sandy Creek is a solid favorite to win AAAA, but the rest of the finals are toss-ups.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
420 comments Add your comment
Troup High Alum
December 7th, 2009
1:14 am
People are sleeping on LaGrange High!! Check there resumes.. They are stock with D1 n NFL prospects every year!! For more info go to lagrangefootball.com
CamdenGuy
December 7th, 2009
1:19 am
OK NSWR(NHS want a be)! You are picken nuts my friend! We are much faster on defense this year with all 11 players on the field than last years team! On another note, we have an incredible community and county! In regards to the Corky Kell Classic we have enjoyed playing there but change can be a good thing! I know we are looking at playing a couple Florida schools that are much closer to home!
Oh by the way NSWR(aka NHS) you forgot Waverly, KingsBay and Browntown! Please include all of our communities when you mention the others! We are one big happy family!
EagleNationRising
December 7th, 2009
1:24 am
CamdenGuy: I believe every high school football fan in the state of Georgia knows that Camden is a great program with amazing commnity support. When a person says Northside, everyone knows exactly who they are talking about.
JayBo and Opinion: At the end of the day, our state has some great programs and some great stories. I am going to give the advantage to the winner of the Northside vs. Camden County game Saturday night. They will have the same number of state championships with more wins and playoff wins than Lowndes County. You can not go wrong with either program.
The games this weekend will be great and showcase some of the state’s best. I believe that programs like LaGrange and Charlton County have earned their way into this conversation, as well. We are fortunate to have competitive football across the state.
montanto
December 7th, 2009
7:37 am
how about northsides 37 game win streak and of course wins against camden and lowndes and carver twice and miami team sat nights winner between camden and northside should truly decide
Taylor Wooten
December 7th, 2009
8:06 am
If Camden wins…..then its Camden. Not Northside…..they have yet to win a single AAAAA title. Lowndes would be #2.
6 Championships, Best Record, Buford!
December 7th, 2009
8:20 am
If we are talking about the best program of the decade, you have to give it to the team with the best record, and most championships. While making the case for Northside, you mentioned that they had finished RUNNER UP twice with TWO championships. You mentioned that Buford has SIX championships (THE MOST CHAMPIONSHIPS) and the BEST RECORD, but you didn’t mention that Buford has been RUNNER UP TWO other times!!! In addition Buford has had a lot of big time Division I Athletes come out of it. Darius Walker, Tim Wansley, and PK Sam to name a few! They have frequently beaten AAA and AAAA schools during this run. I remember when they used to kill North Gwinnett even though they were 1/5 the size!
NHS (not Camden-StMarys-Kingsland-Woodbine-Waverly-Kingsbay-Browntown-***Unfair Advantage)
December 7th, 2009
8:22 am
Wow, more name calling, now I am nuts. Camden is bigger than I thought. Does any other 5A school in the state get all the football players from 6 communities? Maybe if we close WR, Houston County, Perry and Veterans, we could compete with Camden.
eBuzz
December 7th, 2009
8:29 am
While I would not contend that they would beat Lowndes or Camden, or NS-WR head to head, Marist, a AA sized school playing at the AAAA level and who always wins 9 or 10 games a season and who is always in the play-offs, is by far the number one over-achiever in the state and perhaps the country. As noted by Sports Illustrated several years ago when they ranked them as the number 14 best program in the country and tagging them as “The Little School That Could”, who really is the best when it is all put into perspective?
yessir
December 7th, 2009
8:40 am
I think it would have to be a 5A or 4A school. I just don’t see how a 1, 2 or 3A program has a dog in this fight.
GreggJ
December 7th, 2009
8:46 am
Buford hands down
Cane-66
December 7th, 2009
9:43 am
After seeing Buford last Friday, I’ll take Buford in an all-region playoff against Camden Co.!!
Nilo Silvan
December 7th, 2009
9:49 am
The City of Buford did not want to move up to AAA, that is a fact. I believe the HS athletic dept. okayed the move to go AAA, but they do not get the final say. This would have been the perfect time to do it too, because their Sophomore class this year is loaded. Not sure who wins this Friday, but Buford will win the state championship the next two years in AA.
A Boy Named Sue
December 7th, 2009
10:01 am
I hear all this talk about Lowndes, Camden, Northside, and Buford and their records, playoff records, and record versus each other to decide who is the program of the decade. Those numbers are fun to look at, but all 4 teams are to similar to compare. The only thing that really matters is championships. That is what every team is playing for right? Lowndes has 3 at the highest classification, they win hands down (not to mention the one they won in 1999). Its a playoff system so in the years they won, they had to go through the best in the state and they have done it more times then anyone at this classification this decade.
1. Lowndes-most state championships at highest classification, toughest region in the state
2. Buford-most state titles in the state (kind of like the Boise or TCU in NCAA)
3. Camden-weak region giving them easy wins and an automatic #1 seed in the playoffs is HUGE advantage
4. Northside-titles at 4A level hurts when compared to Camden and Lowndes
BW
December 7th, 2009
10:01 am
I think Buford has made it know that it will play anybody regardless of classification in this state and other states (Ohio & Texas) as well. They wanted to play up this time in AAA but Buford did not get the region requested.
They not only have won 5 AA championships but have played or will play for 8 championships this decade counting this weekends game. Can’t get much better than that anywhere!!
WAQ
December 7th, 2009
10:17 am
How did Peach County get left out this discussion? Resume Champs 05 and 06. Runner ups 03(with a regular season lost to NSWR score 10-11). If they win this weekend that makes 3.
The reason Statesboro is not included in this discussion is poor performance the past 2 years in the playoff. But their resume is impresssive champs 01 and 05. Runner-ups 00, 03, 04. That’s a great five year run.
B-TOWN HERO
December 7th, 2009
10:25 am
Yeah!! Its got to be Big Buford with the best record this decade with 6 trophies and 2 runner ups. Undeniably its them. Much loves goes out to all the other schools and higher classes but we ruled GA in 2000’s. By the way “All state championships run through Buford!” They own the Dome and Calhoun will catch a B-town Beat down this Friday as The Wolves go down in GHSA history!!
Parkview, all the way
December 7th, 2009
10:29 am
4 state titles since 1999 at the highest level and one runner up. Winner winner chicken dinner!
SportsFan31313
December 7th, 2009
10:31 am
TNGADAWG States:
I think sportsfan31313, haha, and brian are all missing TH’s main point when he talks about Camden playing in a weak region
Greetings TNGADAWG,
No Sir. The point is who is the team of this decade.
Big Tyme 21
December 7th, 2009
10:42 am
What about Peach County?
Reeze
December 7th, 2009
10:50 am
Todd……..I am so glad you bought this up… I will give you my pitch why the Eagles are the team of the decade ,and for all others that just don’t know ,listen up…….121 -13 this decade , 2 state championships with 4 championship apperances ( 5 Appearances after this weekend and maybe 3 titles)…….121 – 13 …..5 of the 13 losses were to Nationally ranked teams Camden and Lowndes 2008 , Parkview 2002 and 2001 , Warner Robins 2000…..5 losses to eventual State Champions , Camden 2008 , Statesboro 2005 , Warner Robins 2004 , Parkview 2001 ,2002 ( with only a 5 point margin of victory average). 1 lose to the State Champ runner up , Statesboro 2004 , . 1 loss to a semi-finalist , Newnan 2003 , 1 loss to a 11-2 ,2002 Westside Seminole ,region champ and qrt finalist squad , 1 loss to a playoff bound E Coweta squad ,2000…….. Our only real hicup out of 134 contests was to a 2002 , 7-4 Jonesboro squad. …In any given year ,it’s a toss up between the Eagles and the Demons , 2009 was the Demons year to win….Chokers? I always wondered how the Eagles got the label?…..Not even!……..”but is it significant that the titles were won in class AAAA ,below the highest level”…….I chuckle and shake my head everytime I hear this from any so called high school football fan of Georgia, They are automatically put on disregard ,it is apparent that these folks have no clue about the game of football……..In 2006 what AAAAA team could match up with Northside?……Warner Robins beat Camden by 20 in Kingsland , made it the the Semi’s that year and lost to Ptridge by a TD , Northside convincingly beat the demons by 20 plus….In 2007 Lowndes and Camden were the only teams in AAAAA that could be mentioned in the same breath as Northside , TCC ,Ware , Buford ,Carver and Tucker , these were the best teams in the state that year , after that a hugh drop off……..I will end with a quote from ENR . ” Its girls basketball season”…….See you at the Dome!
cane fan
December 7th, 2009
11:05 am
hands down buford; wins – losses, championships, runner-ups, athletes etc., they are what you would call the north georgia all-star teams.
WAQ
December 7th, 2009
11:15 am
Big Tyme 21
The topic is Program of the decade and Is there another program that deserves consideration? Are you saying they should not be mention?
New To Camden
December 7th, 2009
11:28 am
We moved from the upper midwest just before the 2008 football season. You fans down here are great and true football fans. Here’s my take on why Camden is #1. This year there are only 3 retunring starters on offense and 3 returning on defense. 6 out of 22 and they’re in the State Championship game. That is good coaching and commitment from these players. Further, regarding their weak regions. Is is very weak, no doubt, over the last two the starters only average a little over 2 quarters per game. If the stayed in the entire game, Camden would be blasted for running up the scores. Frankly, there were time when scoring 100 points was really not that far from a reality. But consider this coaching problem. When your starters can only play 2 quarters per game – how can you really prepare them properly for the play off run? How do you get true legitimate game experience when you are blasting another school 48 to 0 at half time and then have a running clock the whole second half??? Thanks – Just my 2 cents.
Country Cooking.....
December 7th, 2009
11:29 am
People forget that from 1977 through 1992, that’s a decade in a half, that Clarke Central dominated North Ga football at it’s higest level, with only Valdosta(South Ga), and Griffin, and SW Dekalb geing there only real threat. ‘77 state champs, ‘79 state champs, ‘85 state champs, and alot of North Ga championships thrown in, including ‘86-’88. Guess who’s back people!
BullDawg Rick
December 7th, 2009
11:30 am
Going strictly by the numbers…..
Buford Wolves – Hands down!! No Competition!!!
I find it amazing that every AA State Championship this decade has been Buford or Charleton Co…
Country Cooking.....
December 7th, 2009
11:37 am
Don’t matter if it’s 5A’s, 4A’s 3A’s…. you get the point! Football is football in high school, not like college where the very best GET TO CHOOSE where they go. Line Buford up against anyone with there history and there going to win, or be competive to the end period! The talent level is so good here in this state that on any given Friday night, anybody that’s got a competive team can line up and whip the next team!
Fred
December 7th, 2009
11:40 am
NHS (Northside High School).
For what its worth, Fred = Grayson fan and fred = Camdem fan.
As far the question of program vs team, as Todd said, he is looking for the program that consistantly does the best with what it has. Throughout this season, there has been a tendency to equate 5A with the best programs. 5A programs tend to have a better pool of players to pull from and better financial resources to support the team with things like good stadiums, weight rooms, etc. I think you can successfully argue though that smaller clasifications schools do the best they can with can. I also enjoy hearing and seeing where the college and pro players palyed as high school and college kids and am always amazed at the number that come out of smaller programs. As far as teams go, clearly a Florida or Alabama is a better team in a heads up competion against a Georgia Southern in no small part to the greater resources available to them. But when you look at Ga Southern against the similar sized schools, they obviously have a great program. Ok, maybe not this year but you get my point.
I think there is a lot of really good football being played by good programs that fly under the radar simply because of the attention the big boys get. I say this from the perspective of someone whose school has over 970 kids in the 10th grade alone. That is more than most schools in Ga have in the entire school. Size does not always equate to best.
CamdenGuy
December 7th, 2009
11:41 am
We are dealt with being in Region 3 AAAAA and with the previous comment I would say we are getting our younger players in and developing their skills very well! We are blessed and again NSWR is a class program! This game is between some fantastic young men who are going to lay it on the line for the prize! I feel that there are qualities in both programs without labeling who is the best. We are blessed to have two incredible programs competing on Saturday!
Todd Holcomb
December 7th, 2009
11:46 am
‘’4 state titles since 1999 at the highest level and one runner up. Winner winner chicken dinner!’’
Parkview has three state titles since 1999 (or since 2000, which is our cutoff). Parkview’s fourth state title was 1997. I will say that Parkview’s three-year run (2000-02) is the most remarkable feat of the decade.
Re: Peach County – Certainly a top-10 program in this discussion with its two state titles. But the Northside-Camden winner will have more state titles and more total victories than Peach, so there’s no way that Peach could be #1.
WAQ
December 7th, 2009
11:51 am
New To Camden
How is resting your starters a problem? Coach Herron develops quality depth by playing Freshman and Sophmores during live game situations. That also means these startes have also played since they were freshmans and understand the program. The last two games of the season your starters play at least three qrts. You are now injury free and you possess depth. This is why unlike other programs you reload and not rebuild. You are assured at least two playoff games at home. The weak region affords you this great advantage. You have a great coach that make’s this work.
PACKDADDY
December 7th, 2009
11:54 am
Hey, NHS, Camden doesn”t need much of a field goal kicker. He was the coldest and the driest player last Friday night cause he never had play much. Their running backs crushed us. You will see, in about 5 days. Played Northside earlier in season. Northside squeeked by us. Played Camden last Friday, we were lucky to have a shot at it late in the game. Camden will win, bet on it. I’m serious. Their running game is that good.
GOPACKGO
December 7th, 2009
12:04 pm
Camden by AT LEAST 14. Northside doesn’t stand a chance. Too bad we couldn’t have another shot at them. Go Cats!
titletownusa2008
December 7th, 2009
12:08 pm
Lowndes
PC Fan
December 7th, 2009
12:13 pm
How can you justify leaving Peach County, LaGrange, and Charlton County off of this list? PC and LG have combined to win 5 AAA titles this decade. PC will play in the AAA title game for the fourth time this decade on Saturday. Charlton has won 2 outright and split a 3rd all in consecutive years. All three have over 100 wins this decade
Jefferson
December 7th, 2009
12:24 pm
I want to see the Calhoun Yellow Jacket beat the team of the decade this Friday afternoon. 1 to go. Be ready for a championship game. !!!
Jefferson
December 7th, 2009
12:35 pm
Guinnett county has what a million in population, that a lot for Buford to pick from. How many actually live in the city limits? That not to say they have been very good. With all their wins and championships is why they are the team of the decade that no other team can match.
otherside
December 7th, 2009
12:44 pm
In the first decade of the 21 first century, Hoover high of Alabama won six state championships and came in second three times. Now that’s a record.
Reeze
December 7th, 2009
12:50 pm
PACKDADDY………..Didn’t you read my post above?…..Nix and no others in Warner Robins are not worried to death of the Camden running game……I understand that Colquitt has been wallowing in mediocrity so long and you guys have forgotten how it is to be involved in real meaningful games ,but really man….you’re talking about the Eagles……” Squeaked by us”….I thought we played a very good opponent in Colquitt , you might not think much of the Pack ,but they’ve earned much respect in Houston county…….Northside and Camden should be a good game…..I think the Eagles run defense may be better than last years ,With Jones ,Fields , Ivey and Morton…….If the Eagles offense can move the ball on offense we’ll win….Win or lose it will be a close one……Camden will have to throw the ball to win , the Eagles are prepared for Herron’s Wing -T…..
Wolf
December 7th, 2009
12:52 pm
The answer is obvious: Buford. Anytime the “big boys” want to play us, give us a call. We’ve tried scheduling North Gwinnett. They refused.
Notsofast
December 7th, 2009
12:58 pm
If we’re talking about the past decade, how can it be anybody else but Buford. No team has had the dominance around the state that Buford has. The funny thing is, people will try to bring up the whole “City/Private” thing, when plenty of the champions this past decade (Lowndes, Carver, Wesleyan to name a few) all have the same system.
Buford has the state record for most wins, has sent many D-1 athletes to college, and is consistently one of the best programs in the state since the late 90’s.
spectator
December 7th, 2009
1:00 pm
does anyone know what time northside/camden will play?
PROSKILLpat
December 7th, 2009
1:02 pm
wildcatfan, I respect your camden team. They are well coached and have some very talented young players but I will tell you this , when we meet Camden sat night at 8:00 you all better be ready to throw the ball. Im sure, as you stated, you have some very good backs but that is not going to win you the game. Camden runs the wing T, right? We played at least 3 teams already that run the wing-T . 2 being lowndes and WRHS. And we know what happened there (wink wink)….. You will not come in a run 90% of the night and win…..just aint gonna happen. We have the quickest D in the state. With that being said, I wish your team a safe journey and we’ll see ya in the dome.
PROSKILLpat
December 7th, 2009
1:09 pm
Camden County better be ready to throw the ball if there going to beat us! ………………….Dont just think your going to bring that Wing T up in the dome and run it all night. We will shut it down!!!!!!!!!
Jon
December 7th, 2009
1:12 pm
These yahoos know nothing about Buford. Let them waist their time arguing on a blog all they want. They obviously have nothing better to do down there and it’s kind of sad really. Also, that Camden guy is pounding his internet chest about his program and he doesn’t even know that his team won’t be in the Corky Kell next year. If you don’t know the story on your own team, how the hell are you going to size up Buford? Save it uncle Rico.
BullDawg Rick
December 7th, 2009
1:14 pm
WOLF.. I believe you are incorrect on Buford being refused by others in Gwinnett Co.. I have a few friends in the know at Buford.. After they lost to a 7 – 3 Central team, Buford really did not want a part of the others in the Co.. They had been contacted by Grayson 5 years ago when they were AAA.. The Wolves said, Thanks but no thanks. They have also had an open invitation from Brookwood & Parkview for many years.. Check your sources..
Going by record only: the Wolves of Buford
Dr. Goober
December 7th, 2009
1:19 pm
Attention all posters! Don’t criticize Todd. He had one goal with this topic: Stir the pot! And he did it well, as validated by every one of you posting, including the ones criticizing him for the topic itself (how ironic and moronic). It doesn’t matter who “wins” the debate, as long as the debate is lively and vigorous, and exploits and evokes the uncontrollable emotions in we football fanatics (root word of “fan”). So Todd met his goal.
Speaking of the debate … Parkview’s (2000-01-02) and Buford’s (2001-02-03) three CONSECUTIVE titles don’t get enough weight (Todd did mention Parkview’s streak). The Panthers deserve better, but suffer because of the “what-have-you-done-for-me-lately” syndrome, which admittedly is hard to overlook. And Buford’s 3-in-a-row were part of a 5-consecutive state title game appearance streak (2000-2004). Also, Buford has a chance to win 3 straight AGAIN this weekend, which would be its sixth title, and eighth appearance, of the decade. To anyone questioning Buford’s small-school status … forget it. Any objective observation has to include Buford’s accomplishments in the debate.
Why are 3-titles-in-a-row important (and Buford’s 5-title-games-in-a-row)? This truly defines a “program”: to not only get to the mountain top, but to stay there awhile. Winning one title is hard enough. Winning two every other year or so is even tougher. Winning two consecutive is even tougher still. Winning 3-in-a-row? And winning 3-in-a-row TWICE in one decade, like Buford can do this weekend? Now that’s a “PROGRAM” — no matter how big or little you are.
If the Northside fans want to criticize Buford’s claim for being in a smaller class, then they must also apply that same standard to their team, since the Eagles were in a “smaller” class when they won two straight in 2006-07. Since I believe Northside should be included in this debate regardless of size or class, I must also believe the same about Buford. At some point the combination of wins, state titles, runners-up, and 3-in-a-rows, overcome ANY debate about size — just like Camden’s body of work overcomes any debate about the strength or weakness of its region.
The fact is that any team which has won three titles this decade — Buford, Lowndes, Camden, Northside, or others — can make its own fair and legitimate claim.
stop all yall whinning
December 7th, 2009
1:25 pm
all 4 of the above programs have stellar resumes & easily could be granted the title. the only reservation would be the not that buford is 2A, so is charlton county and if i understand correctly like buford ready and willing to take on all comers from higher classifications. charlton county for years played camden county until camden decided to play a national schedule. that being said i believe that the sign of a great program is that a program does with want it’s dealt, lowndes and valdosta swapping positions as the dominate county team and valdosta playing up, though still playing is sec region, northside playing 4 season’s in aaaa, camden county playing in weak region 3-aaaaa(though consistently being paired against the sec runner-up), but in buford’s case they have the ability through recruiting to change their hand. (now let’s be serious buford has a excellent academics and athletic program with plenty div 1 interest so as a player or family of player in the atlanta metro area have to consider it) i digress, 4 great programs 5a/4a to 2a like apples to oranges both great fruit with storied histories but just to different to compare
Dr. Goober
December 7th, 2009
1:31 pm
And here’s one thing which is NOT debatable: how and why have all of these great programs been so successful? There are TWO underlying themes common to and consistent in each one of them: they all RUN the ball very well, and play very tough, hard-nosed defense.
Think about it. Every great and successful team mentioned here became that way based on their ability to successfully and consistently run the football, and overwhelmingly, every one of them had and have great defenses. Not by passing, or not with the spread, did they attain success and win all these games.
In a world changing too fast and too much in a bad way, it sure is good to see that success in football, at least in Georgia high school teams, still comes down to blocking, tackling, running and defense. Just like all of those old coaches used to tell us all the time.
If you’re coaching today, you might want to pay attention to this.
The best of good fortune and good health and safe travel to all teams and fans this weekend!
WAQ
December 7th, 2009
1:39 pm
stop all yall whinning
That was pretty good…. Definitely agree with recruitement statement about Buford
Reeze
December 7th, 2009
1:49 pm
Notsofast……..I don’t think anyone doubt’s that Buford is legit at any level , I think your 2007 squad could have held it’s own with any team in the state that year ,even with your enrollment falling within AA ,I think it’s really time for Buford to move up and and mix it up with the top competetion in the state …..AAA would be perfect for the Wolves , just imagine if you were in 7 AAA….. matchups with Gainesville , Flowery Branch …. potential Playoff games with St Pius ,Carver ,Peach and others…….Bufords take at the gate would sky rocket….How long will Buford continue to humiliate Cross Keys , GAC ,Blessed trinity and Decauter?… Camden’s is tired of these type games , I know for a fact that a few of your kids from Buford and their parents are , I was at at recruiting trip in Kentucky with my Nephew last year , and we had a good duscussion on the subject ,the majority Buford folks favored moving up……..Buford does a great job in preparing the kids for the next level , I saw this first hand in Kentucky., thats great …..The move up is long overdue