I’m disappointed that the ADL has joined the demagogues
I am deeply disappointed by the Anti-Defamation League, a group which was founded to fight vicious bigotry and religious intolerance, specifically that against Jews.
The venerable organization has now made common cause with the bigots and demagogues who are fighting plans by a group of New York Muslims to build a community near (not at) Ground Zero. The ADL’s statement is careful in its wording, acknowledging that the Cordoba Initiative has the “right” to build near the site of the Twin Towers. (BTW, the Cordoba Initiative has been in the vicinity of Ground Zero for years.) Nevertheless, it provides cover to bigots and opportunists who are using the controversy for political gain (think Sarah Palin and Newt Gingrich):
“Proponents of the Islamic Center may have every right to build at this site, and may even have chosen the site to send a positive message about Islam. The bigotry some have expressed in attacking them is unfair, and wrong,” the statement reads.
“But ultimately this is not a question of rights, but a question of what is right. In our judgment, building an Islamic Center in the shadow of the World Trade Center will cause some victims more pain unnecessarily and that is not right,” it says.
What is not right is for the ADL to join with those who smear all Muslims as somehow associated with suicidal jihadists. That’s the very definition of prejudice.
As a Christian, I want nothing to do with murders like Scott Roeder, who killed a Kansas abortion doctor and claimed he did it in God’s name. If anyone associated my Christianity with his, I’d be quite offended. But the ADL has joined with those who associate all Muslims with the 9/11 wackos.
As Trevor Swoverland wrote in the Duluth Tribune:
The Cordoba Initiative is dedicated to the promotion of human rights and democracy in the Muslim world, as well fostering understanding between mainstream Muslims and broader American society. The founder, Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf, has been an outspoken critic of terrorism and violence and a vocal advocate for the integration of Muslims into American society. The center would be a powerful statement to would-be terrorists and their companions that Muslims in America are fully American, and that terrorists will not define Islam here. What a powerful repudiation of terrorist ideology; it seems patently absurd to demand such a stand from American Muslims and then shout them down when they take it.
The ADL’s motto reads, in part, “to secure justice and fair treatment for all.” There is nothing in its position on the Cordoba mosque that does service to justice or fair treatment.
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472 comments Add your comment
stoor
July 30th, 2010
7:37 pm
I don’t know what does the Quran or the Taliban say about that? You might be kicked out of Joel Osteen’s congregation though
bxnyc
July 30th, 2010
7:43 pm
I live in NYC. My city suffered this 9-11 tragedy. You idiots,in what you not us like to call flyover country have no clue. I worked 2 blocks from the WTC, I used to shop in the stores in the neighborhood,ergo, I know what I’m talking about.You flag waving idiots in the south & midwest need to turn off the John Wayne movies.Hating people simply because of their religion is not only stupid its xenephobic. I know that there are some like Ms. Burlingame(sp) who lost a brother on one flight, that does not justify bigotry,matter of fact it only enforces the thought abroad that we are no different than the zealots who preach exeptionalisim(see this weeks time where the taliban cut off a womans nose & ears because she wanted to get away from her abusive in-laws)If the attitude of superiority keeps being pushed by self serving politicans and bought by a combination of racists, low info voters and xenephobes we will never be able to bridge the bigotry gap.
A "Voice"
July 30th, 2010
7:47 pm
Granny . . . . you make me ill.
barking frog
July 30th, 2010
7:58 pm
Commit adultery-get stoned-what’s wrong with that? sounds like
my misspent youth.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:07 pm
To BXNYC:
you say “Hating people simply because of their religion is not only stupid its xenephobic.” I never said I hated Muslims, so don’t misquote me. However, my criticism of Islam is based on their lack of respect for life in general. I will never respect a group of people who lack the ability to be compassionate and who force Shariah law onto women (mothers) and publically stone them.
And to the critics who continually cite the bible in comparison to the Quran, I ask this question (again)- Please point out the Christian church or the Christian culture that stones women. I don’t know of any, so if you do, please post the name of this country or church. In the meantime, I do know of a group of people that stone women NOW in 2010. Its called the Islamic culture. Don’t bring text into this argument, this has to do with one person’s attitude toward another- Muslims just don’t respect women, or life.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:11 pm
To BXNYC:
You say “If the attitude of superiority keeps being pushed by self serving politicans and bought by a combination of racists, low info voters and xenephobes we will never be able to bridge the bigotry gap.”
Lets put this into context. First, a group of Muslims in Iran accuse a woman of adultery. Next the stone her in public. Next, Shariah law is criticized on this blog and in the US.
In that chain of events, I find it interesting that you choose to criticize people in the US for condemning Shariah law…..as if they are the problem. And you so loosely throw around the term “racist” and “bigot”. How would you describe the Muslims who stoned that woman?
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:26 pm
To BXNYC:
You say”You flag waving idiots in the south & midwest need to turn off the John Wayne movies.Hating people simply because of their religion is not only stupid its xenephobic.”
The only hatred I’m detecting is coming from you. Sounds like you have a general disrespect for people from other parts of the county.
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
8:30 pm
A United States Marine
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”
It’s no about anyone’s feelings. It is the founding document of our country. Freedom of religion doesn’t apply when it’s convenient or when Christianity is threatened.
There is the crux of this dilemma. Which do you pledge your allegiance to, your religion, or The United States of America?
Aquagirl
If they want to build a Mosque it’s certainly their right. But it’s inflammatory.
Only if it is looked at in that light. Kinda like poison, strong drink and insults—they can only affect one if they are accepted. Islam-Americans were impacted by 9-11 too.
neo-Carlinist
…is in fact a hotbed for radical Islam and terrorists, do you know think the DHS, FBI, NYPD Counter-Terrorism, and CIA will not have it under surveilance, if not “bugged/wiretapped”? if we really are fighting a “war on terrorism” you folks need to starting thinking like terrorists and not easily-offended Americans.
Uh…that kind of practical cynicism…words fail me.
jconservative
Apparently many say “damn the Constitution”, I do not want this or that when it comes to religion. We are getting around to interpreting the Constitution like we interpret the Bible.
Yep, A Chinese menu to pick and choose from—all that Chinese money invested in T-bills must be infecting US brains. MSG?
midtownguy
And I don’t like that the cruel and inferior culture of the Southern Baptist Convention infects the US. But it’s about the constitutional right to freedom of religion and freedom of assembly, not my opinion or yours.
As a former member of that cult I hafta agree.
ronald
You are merely a fear monger.
I have faced all of my fears, and I don’t need to be infected with yours.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:36 pm
kamchak
Fear Monger? Hardly, I’m just asking real questions about real events. Since no one else has answered, I’ll pose the question to you. How would you describe the Muslims who stone women in public in Iran (and other areas of the middle east.) Its a fact that it happens, don’t call me a “fear-monger” for asking valid questions about disturbing events. I didn’t make this happen, I’m just bothered by the fact that some people on this blog don’t seem to think that its that big of a deal.
Heba
July 30th, 2010
8:40 pm
I disagree with ADL. I’m an American Muslim and NOT building this would be a slap to my face – especially since two of my family members are serving in the US military. The ADL makes me laugh…what a two faced group!
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
8:41 pm
Since no one else has answered…
Yes, they have sport, you were just too busy spreading your fear that you weren’t listening.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:44 pm
Heba- You would prefer that the majority of this country feel disrespected, so that you’ll feel good about where your mosque is?
If you are an American, you wouldn’t feel like it was a slap in the face. The problem is that you are Muslim first and American second.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:45 pm
Kamchak- Actually they haven’t, but since you don’t have a good answer to my question, you decided to try to be funny instead. Call me names all you want to. The facts don’t change.
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
8:46 pm
Hey Granny Godzilla @ 2:17 and 2:23
If you think those nut jobs in OKC, ATL etc were Christians then God help YOUR soul!
Godzila @2:17 amd 2:23
leonard
July 30th, 2010
8:47 pm
Heba, i dont care if you feel like a slap in the face. my face got slapped when your muslim terrorist cousins bombed the wtc. screw you.
Scout
July 30th, 2010
8:48 pm
midtownguy:
……….. and which large segment officially associated with the Southern Baptist Convention is cutting people’s heads off and causing other various havoc over most of the world ?
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:49 pm
Heba, I’m glad we finally have a Muslim on this blog. Please explain to everyone why your fellow Muslims condone public stoning of women in Iran?
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
8:51 pm
The facts don’t change.
The fact is that they did answer your question, but you either weren’t smart enough to see it or you didn’t like what you heard.
If you cannot see the false comparison that you are making between a stoning in Iran, and a cultural center in NYC, then no amount of words will ever penetrate your fear.
Scout
July 30th, 2010
8:52 pm
FOOD FOR THOUGHT :
Adapted from the book “Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat” by Dr. Peter Hammond.
“Islam has religious, legal, political, economic, social, and military components. The religious component is a beard for all of the other components.
Islamization begins when there are sufficient Muslims in a country to agitate for their religious privileges.
Here’s how it works:
1) As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority and not as a threat to other citizens (i.e. United States – 0.6%).
2) At 2% to 5%, they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, often with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs (i.e. Denmark – 2%).
3) From 5% on they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. For example, they will push to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves (within their ghettos) under Sharia Law (i.e. France – 8%).
4) When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions. Any non-Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam (i.e. India – 13.4%).
5) After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues (i.e. Ethiopia – 32.8%).
6) At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and ongoing militia warfare by Muslims (i.e. Chad – 53.1%).
7) From 60%, nations experience unfettered persecution of non-believers of all other religions (including non-conforming Muslims), use of Sharia Law as a weapon, and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels (i.e. Sudan – 70%).
9) 100% is to usher in the peace of ‘Dar-es-Salaam’ (the Islamic House of Peace) because everybody is a Muslim, the Madrasses are the only schools, and the Koran is the only word (i.e., Afghanistan – 100%).
Unfortunately, peace is never achieved, as in these 100% states, the most radical Muslims satisfy their blood lust by killing less radical Muslims for a variety of reasons.”
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:54 pm
Kamchak- Why should NYC or any other US city allow a cultural center to be built by a group of people who perform attrocities like public stoning? Its not fear, its the truth. Is that what you want your kids to grow up and watch. You want your children to one day witness a public stoning in the US? Thats what Shariah law is. I didn’t write the book, so don’t focus your anger on me.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
8:56 pm
Heba- Still waiting for an answer…….Are you all of a sudden shy now that stoning is being discussed? Embarrased that this sort of torturous violence is perpetuated by YOUR religion. What are you going to do about it?
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
9:00 pm
I didn’t write the book, so don’t focus your anger on me.
I am not angry.
Time for you to take that crystal ball in for service as it is failing you now
Your fear is distorting your vision into a binary black/white, bad/good, us/them perspective.
Scout
July 30th, 2010
9:03 pm
ronald:
Just imagine if some well funded group wanted to build a “Confederate Historical Museum” in Manhattan …………… the hipocrisy here is staggering.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:05 pm
Kamchak- If anyone is being binary here its you. You’re so afraid to criticize or question Islam, that its preventing you from making common sense decision. I asked you a very simple question about a very real event and you can’t even admit that 1) Stoning is a terrible, horrific practice that still goes on today or that 2) It is only practiced by Muslims.
The stoning argument was only brought up earlier because some fool stated that the US has no real values. I argued that the core values of being an American included valuing and respecting life. That value distinguishes American culture from Islamic culture. If Muslims were to practice a peaceful religion, I would have no issue with the religion itself or the peole who practice it.
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
9:06 pm
Ronald
people like Obama, Cynthia, and Kamchuck worry about what other countries think about us instead of whats good for THE United States
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:06 pm
Scout- The easiest way to spot the liberal in the room is to find the guy who 1) dodges all of your questions and 2) quickly resorts to name calling.
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
9:09 pm
“Dont torture those poor innocent terrorist, that would be horrible”
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:09 pm
Notice how Kamchuk has no logic in his statements. Everything is simplistic finger pointing and name calling. He doesn’t answer questions or put forth any real ideas. This is what he is forced to do because logic and common sense are not in his tool belt.
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
9:11 pm
You’re so afraid to…
First you erroneously assume that I am angry.
Now you are wrong about me being afraid.
Best to quit while you’re not too far behind, sport.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:12 pm
Kamchak- Care to answer any of the many questions that have been directed to you or do you want to just sit back and continue with the name calling?
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
9:13 pm
Ronald…you hit that nail on the head!…when you put facts in front of a Liberal, they dont know how to act
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:13 pm
Do you want us to assume that you support public stoning and Shariah law?
Scout
July 30th, 2010
9:14 pm
ronald :
Oh, I’ve been dealing with that for two years now. I hope you hang around for awhile.
BTW : I meant “hypocrisy”
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:14 pm
I was hoping that Heba the Muslim was going to answer some questions, but he quit and went home too.
Scout
July 30th, 2010
9:15 pm
ronald:
This is a little something I put together. Your thoughts ?
There are three types of Islam:
1) Westernized Islam – a minority of Muslims in the U.S. are in this category. They worship Allah in sincerity but they also (because of their education and secularization) embrace freedom and Western democracy. They fear the other two forms of Islam probably as much as we do. Even this type of Islam will morph into the two below if left unchecked.
2) Basic Islam – most Muslims in the world fall into this category and many live in the U.S. They embrace Islam in its unbridled totality (educational, societal, legal, economic, political, governmental, military, religious, etc.,). They may not individually murder or terrorize in the name of Allah/Islam but neither to they verbally condemn those who do. Radical Islam recruits from their ranks. This type of Islam must be marginalized in the U.S. as much as possible (including immigration) or given enough time and volume it will ensure the destruction of this Republic as we know it.
3) Radical Islam – these types of Muslims will stop at nothing to physically force their vicious schism of Islam on the world. They are pure evil and every effort must be made to totally eradicate their influence and existance from the face of the earth.
Summary: All three forms are intermingled and therefore like the cancer cells in a human body they cannot be physically separated. We ignore this at our peril.
Scout
July 30th, 2010
9:16 pm
P.S.
My 8:52 post is “eyeopening”. It was sent to me by a friend.
Mr Charlie
July 30th, 2010
9:19 pm
Ronald, you have a good point. We see words like “Racists, Bigots, and Ignorant” defined quite often on the board by all the intellectual progressives.
But, when you ask what you call people who stone woman to death, they scatter like roaches.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:20 pm
Well said, Scout. I think that is good summary. The Muslims that I went to college with, I would classify them all as being group 1. The issue, as you pointed out is that Americans classify ALL Muslims in the way that you describe group 1, and not all Muslims are group 1 Muslims. There is just no way to differentiate- Ft. Hood is case in point, I guess. In that case, from what I’ve read, many fellow soldiers all thought of the guy as a moderate, non-violent Muslim. But you know how the story ended.
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
9:21 pm
Care to answer any of the many questions that have been directed to you…
Only one question was “directed at me” and I answered it. Again—you are either not smart enough to see it or you didn’t like what you heard.
Do you want us…
Us?
Who granted you the authority to speak for anyone other than yourself?
…to assume that you support public stoning and Shariah law?
You seem to be laboring under the misapprehension that I care what you think.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:22 pm
Kamchak- How would you describe a religion that practices public stoning in the year 2010?
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:24 pm
“Only one question was “directed at me” and I answered it.”
No you didn’t.
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:26 pm
Neither did Heba the Muslim, who claimed he was insulted by not having the ability to build a mosque at the WTC site. Wonder how the stoned women’s family felt when their daughter was stoned in Iran? Moreover, I wonder what Heba felt about the situation since its his Muslim cousins that committed the act.
Upon Further Review
July 30th, 2010
9:29 pm
ronald wrote:
Kamchak- Care to answer any of the many questions that have been directed to you or do you want to just sit back and continue with the name calling?
______________________________________
*** I think you have your answer, Ronald. Suddenly, there’s no trace of Kamchak except for the crickets.
Congratulations — you shut Kamchak up. His political correctness setting would overload if he typed anything resembling criticism of Islam.
Amazing how liberals can vehemently defend a religion that promotes the subjugation of women and the public execution of gays.
Mr Charlie
July 30th, 2010
9:29 pm
Kam, your rational is no more intellectual that the ‘I am rubber, you are glue” 2nd grade debating tatic.
You would look better if you just logged off.
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
9:30 pm
ronald
Let’s review the relevant post, shall we?
Kamchak
July 30th, 2010
8:51 pm
The facts don’t change.
The fact is that they did answer your question, but you either weren’t smart enough to see it or you didn’t like what you heard.
If you cannot see the false comparison that you are making between a stoning in Iran, and a cultural center in NYC, then no amount of words will ever penetrate your fear.
If you don’t like that answer, fine I can accept that.
You are, however, bearing false witness to aver that I didn’t answer.
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
9:32 pm
simply amzing!
MARK T
July 30th, 2010
9:33 pm
Ronald, you might as well give up…his avoidance of the question answers the question
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:35 pm
Thats not an answer, you’ve just directed my question back to me. I want you to put into words a description of a religion that practices stoning in 2010. If you don’t want to do that, whatever.
Also, I never made a “false comparison.” The cultural center is a Muslim cultural center. The public stonings in 2010 are executed by Muslims as well. Another question you could answer is why Americans should celebrate or honor a religion that doesn’t share the value of respecting life?
Upon Further Review
July 30th, 2010
9:36 pm
Wow, a Kamchak sighting!
C’mon, K-man, why don’t you have the stones to condemn Islamic stoning?
ronald
July 30th, 2010
9:37 pm
I’ve said this before, but if Muslims worldwide could separate themselves from the violence in thier culture, then I would accept them and their religion. The violence is what defines them, and until they change their culture, it will continue to define them. But people like Kamchak don’t want to talk about the violence. They want people to pretend that it doesn’t exist. That approach won’t solve the problem.