Is abortion a racist plot? Of course not
WASHINGTON — Perhaps members of the anti-abortion movement are growing a bit desperate. Though they’ve managed to crimp women’s reproductive rights through decades of legislative maneuvering and extra-legal harassment, they still cannot overturn Roe v. Wade, the historic 1973 Supreme Court decision. Nor have they moved public opinion much: A majority of Americans still believe that current law should stand.
Perhaps that’s why some factions in the “pro-life” crusade are professing a newfound concern for the well-being of black children. Perhaps that’s why “racism” has become the battle cry of anti-abortion groups whose members — overwhelmingly white, conservative and Republican — like to think that racism no longer exists.
Georgia’s largest anti-abortion group, Georgia Right to Life, is presenting itself as the last line of defense against a widespread plot to wipe out black people — a pogram of sorts. The group has mounted billboards throughout black Atlanta neighborhoods, claiming that “Black children are an endangered species” because of abortions.
While anti-abortion activists have long derided Margaret Sanger, considered the mother of modern family planning, for her endorsement of eugenics, they have more recently taken aim at such mainstream organizations as the Planned Parenthood Federation of America, claiming it, too, is run by bigots. Two years ago, a faith-based group with ties to black clergy sent a letter to the Congressional Black Caucus denouncing Planned Parenthood for its “racist and eugenic goals.”
Well, paranoid theories are usually impervious to facts, but let’s try some facts, anyway. Despite the obstacles many black children face on the road to a successful adulthood — poverty, crime, poor schools — their numbers are not threatened. Black women have a higher birth rate than the national average.
But it is also true that black women use abortion services disproportionately. According to the Alan Guttmacher Institute, a non-profit that advocates for reproductive health, the abortion rate for black American women is almost five times that for white women. About one-third of all abortions are obtained by white women and about 37 percent by black women (who account for less than seven percent of the population), according to Susan Cohen of the non-profit Alan Guttmacher Institute, which advocates for reproductive health.
Those numbers are certainly troubling. But are racists persuading black women to have abortions? Is there some group of grim executioners looking to carry out a shadowy genocide?
That’s not only nutty; it’s also insulting. It’s both sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual and emotional firepower to make their own decisions.
(Largely owing to easier-to-use contraceptives, abortion rates have been declining for the last 25 years, black women’s rates falling along with those of other ethnic groups. However, Latinas and black women still terminate pregnancies at higher rates than white women.)
“The truth is that behind virtually every abortion is an unintended pregnancy. . .Because black women as a group want the same number of children as white women, but have so many more unintended pregnancies, they are more likely than white women to terminate an unintended pregnancy by abortion to avoid an unwanted birth,” Cohen wrote in a paper entitled, “Abortion and Women of Color: The Bigger Picture.”
If conservatives are sincere about curbing abortions — among all women, white, black and brown — they should support efforts to broaden women’s health care, which includes reproductive health care. Easy access to contraceptives would encourage their use, thereby reducing unintended pregnancies — and abortions.
“The health disparities for low-income women and women of color are enormous,” noted Cecile Richards, president of Planned Parenthood, which provides full-service reproductive health care — including non-controversial procedures such as annual pelvic exams — to women who cannot get it elsewhere.
But social and religious conservatives have been fighting health care reform, which would broaden access to reproductive health care, with the passion they normally reserve for bashing Roe v Wade. That’s why it’s hard to believe they really care about black women — or their children.
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276 comments Add your comment
Bud Wiser
March 17th, 2010
7:53 am
Of course it is a racist plot, CTuck!
And despite your column title, you obviously believe it, because racism, to you, is the only way you far left wingers approach every aspect of daily life.
But social and religious conservatives have been fighting health care reform, which would broaden access to reproductive health care, with the passion they normally reserve for bashing Roe v Wade. That’s why it’s hard to believe they really care about black women — or their children. (bold emphasis mine)
That is as slanted and racist as any and most statements you make; you cannot help it, it just always comes out.
You, in fact, not your ubiquitous and unnamed ’social and religious conservatives’ are the true racist, and the only one, I see here.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
8:08 am
Well, Ms. T, I’d guess you are going to have a busy morning moderating this thread!
There’s a right wing bookmaniac who semi-annually posts everything we ever wanted to know about Margaret Sanger, eugenics and the racist undercurrents of Planned Parentood. Stuff and nonsense.
It’s one thing to be anti-choice, I can respect that, but I have no respect for those who lie and mislead in an attempt to make their ideological point.
On a happier note….to all my Irish brothers and sisters….have a safe and happy St. Paddy’s day.
May ye be in heaven a half an hour before the devil know’s your dead!
Robert
March 17th, 2010
8:13 am
When African American’s unemployment rate is projected to hit a 25 year high this year, some could argue that the Democrats are the racists. After all, the Democrats control the house, the senate, and the white house.
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
8:19 am
In 2008, there were nearly 1.27M abortions peformed in this country. That’s the population of a fair sized city, EVERY YEAR. Nearly 98% of these procedures were performed for so called “societal reasons’, ie, birth control.
AA birth statistics in 2009:
616,074 AA births
458,500 AA abortions
743,377 AAs died in 2009, which represents 127,303 more that those who were born.
From 1973 to 2004, nearly 30% of the AA population in this country was lost to abortion.
The most common cause of death in a AA male between 18 and 35 is violent homocide.
4,400 abortions are performed each day in this country. Of these, 1,300 are AAs who only represent 6% of the population. AA women are three more times a likely to have an abortion than any other ethnic group.
You folks are killing off your best and brightest, either by shooting them or aborting them. Maybe those evil Republican do-gooders have a point.
Turd Ferguson
March 17th, 2010
8:22 am
These “advocacy” groups will stoop to any level to have their way. Society has become a group of 4 year old alarmists and attention hounds. Believe none of them.
Zoe
March 17th, 2010
8:30 am
IPPF is a racist organisation! They hate white people which is why they predominantly put abortion clinics in black areas. They love black people and provide this wonderful service for them. It is exactly the same as Hitler, he loved the Jews and hated German women which is why he denied German women abortions and only provided abortions for the Jews and others that he loved. So there is a lot in common between the generous IPPF and the beautiful Nazis
Zoe
Sammy
March 17th, 2010
8:42 am
Must….not…talk …about …heathcare…..
Lets just “deem” Tucker relevent. It works for Peolosi.
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
8:42 am
“Easy access to contraceptives would curb the rate of abortion”. Very true Cynthia, but you make it sound like the evil Republicans are the people responsible for there being no “easy access”. News Flash…… You can buy them at CVS or Walgreens….. about as easy an access as you can imagine. They have a great selection, green ones, ones with bumps on them, even large or small. Maybe we need billboards in black neighborhoods spelling out where you can buy them.
It all boils down to personal responsibility. You make it sound like all of these poor unfortunate peope just don’t know where babies come from, however, from a pragmatic standpoint, they just don’t seem to care. There is a big difference.
Robert
March 17th, 2010
8:42 am
Kayaker,
They don’t come more liberal than Rosie O’Donnell and she suggested yesterday that it is cheaper to abort than “waste money” on half a million children in foster care. Not sure where your figures come from, but if they are accurate then Rosie is a racist for wanting nearly 1/2 million African Americans to never be born into this world because the price attached to them is not worth it.
Turd Ferguson
March 17th, 2010
8:50 am
Robert
March 17th, 2010
8:42 am
Did Rosie O statement specifically single out black children? I seriously doubt that is the case. Now Im no fan of Ms Obnoxious/Rosie O, however, I would guess you are incorrect or interpreted her statements incorrectly.
Turd Ferguson
March 17th, 2010
8:51 am
PS…Also I think, in the past, Rosie and Whoopi G have dated.
Blue
March 17th, 2010
8:52 am
Wow…any other time for CT, it’s whitey keeping the man (or in this case, woman) down. But I guess not if it goes against her political platform. But if it was reversed and CT held the pro-life standpoint, you can bet your behind she would be all over the race issue.
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
8:52 am
You and Cynthia miss the point. Rosie, et al, thinks that rather than take responsibility for your actions, it is “easier” to just kill the unwanted. Forget about being responsible. Cynthia seems to think that we need to have better access to birth control methods. They give away free ones all over town. That’s like making new laws when we already have sufficienct ones on the books. I would imagine that most people who engage in sex know they are taking a risk when unprotected. Rosie is an airhead.
Peturagga
March 17th, 2010
8:53 am
Thank you for this column,I had one of the “Black children are an endangered species”billboards up on my property-and had to threaten CBS with termination of the lease to get them to take it down.As Lewis Carrol pointed out so well words do not mean what we say they mean-the meaning resides in them.When we allow speech declaring one race to be a separate species to go unchallenged we poison the land.As I told Mr.Martinez(The executive at CBS who decided to post these vile creations)CBS ” failed in your duty to refuse those messages intended only to inflame the curse of racism. For shame, for shame-on us all.”I am glad this message is no longer on my property but I call on CBS and the community to remove this racist message from our common space.
Philosopher
March 17th, 2010
8:56 am
MS. T. How DO you sleep at night?? These bloggers are enough to scare one to the toes. This reminds me of the time as a child when I was slapped across the room for suggesting to my mother that God did NOT create a race of evil black people! Hell, not much has changed, has it? Bigots, racists and religious zealots will try ANYTHING, won’t they…except to face the fact that they might be wrong!!
This postion by Georgia Right to Life is so foolish as to result in a complete lack of credibility..at least from anyone who can think for him/herself. Sadly, the fanatics will take it and make other sheeple buy it. Maybe we shouldn’t just laugh and turn the page…as such claptrap deserves…I think you were right to shine a brighter light on it.
OneFreeMan
March 17th, 2010
8:56 am
They need more “Black” children to filled their jails. They want you to believe they would like a larger minority population…yeah right.
Not one of that bunch has adopted any of the kids waiting to be adopted. They are not concerned about children they just want to CONTROL the lives of others.
Cynthia, you are right again. Keep up the good work.
Robert
March 17th, 2010
8:56 am
TF,
No, she didn’t single out any race. But if CT is going to make an assertion like she has done by saying conservatives are racists for targeting the African American community (whose abortion percentages are high), then I can go out on a limb just as easy by assuming Rosie is racist by saying it’s a waste of money to pay for foster care for unwanted children (when a large number of them are African American children).
Flasks
March 17th, 2010
8:56 am
This article is about an ironicly conservative ploy to spin eco-friendly and green by using billboards to block out scenery while pointing out another endangered species. The message on the billboards is a subtle as a Pap smear, which conservatives also refuse to fund, even in a compliant gesture to stem the abortions they are trying to prevent.
A subtitle for this article, if you read some of the comments it elicited, could be “Why Johnny can’t read or write”, and kudos to Cynthia Tucker for her efforts to promote the education reform sorely lacking in Georgia.
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
9:02 am
Peturagga,
Maybe you could put up a sign in it’s place. Perhaps it could instruct all of the people in your neighborhood as to where they could obtain birth control devices. This is not a racial phenom. These same billboards could be placed in latino and white neighborhoods as well. But some statistics are hard to ignore. Maybe it’s better to pretend that a huge disparity doesn’t exist on this issue. Maybe when you pull your head out of the sand and realize what these statistics don’t lie, you can have a more unbiased outlook.
Question
March 17th, 2010
9:02 am
From my understanding, this new effort is to stop people from “soliciting” abortions based on race.
What I don’t know is, are any women being solicited to have abortions period?
I don’t see commercials on tv for it. Most abortion clinics are not even marked with signage. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of soliciting happening either way.
P.S. Rosie O’Donnell has adopted 6 children from foster care and given them homes. Her opinion may be radical, but at least she has done something to help the unwanted children problem we have.
Chris
March 17th, 2010
9:02 am
Hard to imagine black or any poor women wanting less children?…See on the news all the time about welfare families having 7, 8 kids, and as soon as they need a new bigscreen tv, it’s “pump out another rugrat and get more welfare dollars each month”
Robert
March 17th, 2010
9:05 am
Question,
So instead of promoting abortion, she should be promoting adoption. Don’t you think?
DW
March 17th, 2010
9:06 am
Cynthia – I usually don’t agree with you, but I do on this one. Calling it racism is the latest tactic of the anti-abortion movement. It has nothing to do with racism. There are more abortion clinics in poverty stricken neighborhoods because those people are less likely to have insurance, and access to prescription birth control.
Blue
March 17th, 2010
9:06 am
“Easy access to contraceptives would encourage their use”. Really? Wow…going to the store and buying some (they are NOT cost prohibitive) and keeping some of them with you or where you live is not “easy access”? How easy do you want it, Cynthia? But I think I know what she means; she wants a “rich republican” to buy them, and then deliver them just before the magic moment. Yeah…easy access…THAT’S the ticket. Your problem solving abilities underwhelm me; you should be the president or something!
Common sense
March 17th, 2010
9:08 am
Abortion may not be an actual plot but the results are the same. Just like government housing and welfare it seems to single out one ethnic group of people and keep them from advancing on society!
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
9:08 am
Robert, Not that this is your business, but I do promotion adoption — where it matters most, in my personal life. I’m the mother of a 14-month-old that I adopted at birth.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:09 am
Can some of you enlighten me as to how a voluntary abortion qualifies as “health care?” What percentage of abortions are medically necessary?
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
9:09 am
Question, Amen and amen!
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
9:12 am
Robert, I should have also mentioned that I have promoted adoption in my columns.
Question
March 17th, 2010
9:13 am
“Hard to imagine black or any poor women wanting less children?…See on the news all the time about welfare families having 7, 8 kids, and as soon as they need a new bigscreen tv, it’s “pump out another rugrat and get more welfare dollars each month””
I watch the news every night, I have never seen this story.
Blue
March 17th, 2010
9:13 am
Bubba; don’t look for an answer from CT on your question; she just likes to do the “amen” stuff to the posts she agrees with, and the only dissenters she answers are the ones she knows she can debate…and yours isn’t one of those.
T-Town
March 17th, 2010
9:13 am
Hmmm, coffee is made and I’ve just begun reading about abortion/race relations/Rosie/rubbers as I complete my census forms. And it’s St. Pattys day, boy today is going to be interesting. Good morning world.
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:16 am
For years government health programs like Champus, VA and Medicaid have paid for Viagra to encourage men to have sex, but have at the same time refused to pay for birth control to prevent recreation from turning into procreation. As a great woman once said “if men got pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament of the Church.” She also said that if men had monthly cramps, then “morphine would be an over the counter drug.”
Get Real
March 17th, 2010
9:17 am
You can call it racist or what you choose but I choose to call it STUPIDITY when people don’t use birth control! I don’t care where they are black, white, pink or purple. Abortion is no different than taking a gun and shooting a baby in the head. Before someone is for abortion they should be forced to watch a fetus with llittle arms and legs being pulled out from a womans womb and watch the doctor stick a sharp object into the base of the skull and watch as the fetus jerks and stiffens from the shock of being killed!
anon
March 17th, 2010
9:18 am
If conservatives are sincere about curbing abortions — among all women, white, black and brown — they should support efforts to broaden MEN’s health care as well, which includes responsible reproduction education, teaching respect for women, and easy and affordable access to condoms and sterilization. No woman gets pregnant alone.
Just be glad they abort more often
March 17th, 2010
9:19 am
One less black baby is one less gangbanger..One less chance your life will be affected by father abandoned black males in our society..You can ban me if you want and certainly will probably but when black people get enough money the first place they move to is where white people live to try and feel safer themselves!!!
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:22 am
A couple weeks ago, the Economist magazine had a front page story on the “300 million missing female babies.” That is the in-balance between live male births in the world and live female births, adjusted for the fact that the probability of a male birth to a female birth is 1.05 percent. The story says over the last 20 odd years, 300 million female babies have been murdered around the world by families with a preference for males children. The two countries with the highest death rate for female babies are India and China. I will try to find a link to the article online, I only have the physical magazine.
Steve
March 17th, 2010
9:24 am
I don’t believe Planned Parenthood is racist. They will help anyone kill an unborn child.
Jeff
March 17th, 2010
9:25 am
I think abortion is appalling. But the facts are clearly stated by CT: Abortion kills a disproportionate amount of AA’s. the klan couldn’t have made a better plan than what is currently happening in the AA community.
Ryno
March 17th, 2010
9:25 am
Ms. Tucker – rather than addressing the continued struggle for womens reproductive rights, it might be prudent to address the issue of single parent families in the African American community.
One wonders if the number of African American abortions might decrease as the number of two parent families increase? Is it a fair point?
Get Real
March 17th, 2010
9:26 am
The real problem is that parents aren’t involved with their children’s lives in a lot of cases. Both parents or single parents work and have their own agenda and the children are left alone to fend for themselves which leads to some very unwise decisions and pregnancies! People don’t want to educate children on sex education in school or make contraceptives readily available to them and then complain about unwanted pregnancies! Well,look around…at all the illiterate people that are walking around with a housefull of kids that they can’t pay for and support. Many of them just want and rely on the government to take care of them because their parents did the same thing. Education is the key to success in preventing unwanted pregnancy!
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:26 am
T&F, horrible as it is, what does that have to do with abortion?Are you suggesting all these girls should have been aborted instead?
John
March 17th, 2010
9:27 am
I know a bunch of white Jews from South Africa. They are African American.
The people Tucker is talking about are black, and they are the most racist people I’ve ever known.
Robert
March 17th, 2010
9:27 am
CT,
Oh, when i made the adoption comment, it was in response to a previous comment made by Question…referring to the 6 children Rosie O’Donnell adopted. I knew you adopted a child and I applaud you for that. It definitely speaks to your character.
Owl
March 17th, 2010
9:28 am
So if Obama’s health care provides federal funds for abortion, define who the racist is.
Please keep writng these columns. Please!!!
RxDawg
March 17th, 2010
9:28 am
Ughhh, this same ol’ song and dance again? Look folks, abortion has been illegal before, it didn’t work. Stop letting your biased churches brainwash you. Everytime the word abortion is mentioned in any healthcare reform talk my BP goes up a little more.
If your absolute prolife, your actually antichoice.
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:28 am
Gendercide is the term coined by the Economist to label the murder of 300 female babies over the last 20 odd years. Here is the link, just put in periods for spaces.
economist com/world/international/displaystory.cfm?story_id=15636231
Jess
March 17th, 2010
9:29 am
Interesting how Cynthia has spun this a plot by whites. I have watched coverage on TV of the movement, and this is just not true. Of course Ga. right to life will aid the movement since it may prevent abortions. This is what they do. Read the name. Yesterday Cynthia was upset because a pro Israel lobby chose Israel’s side in the current spat. This is their job.
This current movement is by black churches who are upset mainly because their are 19 abortion clinics on the south side of Atlanta and few if any on the north side. Could this be because people on the north side go to their own doctors? Should whites be upset because all the tax supported abortion dollars are spent on the south side? The answers are yes and yes.
Strait Road
March 17th, 2010
9:33 am
“It’s both sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual and emotional firepower to make their own decisions.”
By the same token, is it not equally sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual firepower to succeed in education and professionally without the help of laws that provide them with quotas? I suppose, after reading a few of your columns, one might conclude that these laws have enabled you to keep gainful employment. I guess that’s worth something.
T-Town
March 17th, 2010
9:33 am
Ms. Tucker,
You asked a simple question: “Is abortion a racist plot?” Followed by a simple reply: “Of course not.” I’m not sure why these simple items created racist statements/Rosie/rubbers/etc. Pro/Anti abortionist will use any material at their disposal to push their agenda, much like the politicians have done pro/con with healthcare. The real question is should abortion be part of the healthcare bill?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:33 am
Not to change the subject, but this is an interesting read:
http:/ /www. ajc. com/ business/ fact-check-premiums-would-376684. html
“FACT CHECK: Premiums would rise under Obama plan”
Tired of BS
March 17th, 2010
9:34 am
Look here are the facts. Many of the women are from welfare entitlement homes themselves. They live off the system and they feel no responsibility for the burden they put on the taxpayers. They lay down with boys and men like they change their clothes. In many cases they abuse aclohol, drugs, and the american taxpayer who must pay for their numerous children from different fathers.
You won’t stop the number of children born or the abortions performed until the community starts shaming these women and young girls who download children with no means to take care of them. Sadly, it’s entirely possible that these abortions are a saving the taxpayers CT. I’m inclined to think it’s not a bad idea after all. Education hasn’t worked, the money that we the taxpayer keeps throwing at these women only continues paying for cell phones, cheesy polyester weaves, and ghetto talon fill ins, that they use to attract new baby daddies. Racist….. not at all, just really tired of all the excuses and really tired of all the BS!
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:34 am
Read the story Bubba, it starts with the live birth of a female baby, who is allowed to live all of 30 seconds prior to an ice pick being inserted into the back of baby’s skull, and the dying baby placed in the slops bucket for disposal. I call this full term abortion on demand.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:35 am
As far as abortion goes, it’s murder plain and simple whether it’s black or white. Nothing more to say.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:36 am
Why are people afraid to call themselves pro-abortion? What’s with the “pro-choice” canard?
Robert
March 17th, 2010
9:38 am
I just find it hard to equate conservatives (assuming CT thinks that only whites are conservatives) wanting to save the lives of unborn African American children as a racist idea. Wouldn’t it be more racist if the opposite were true? (i.e., white race promoting abortion in these predominately black neighborhoods)
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
9:38 am
When 70% of babies are born out of wedlock in a particular ethnic group, it would seem that anyone could see the disparity. These are the ones that make it to the delivery room. About 1.27 M didn’t make it, 468,000 of which were AA. That’s about 1/3. If it walks like a duck…….
The Cynical White Boy
March 17th, 2010
9:38 am
I completely understand why the Obama press office dispatched this article to all ‘journalists’ on the ‘team’ in DC…..
Obama has to slant this issue in this way – otherwise he is caught between two of his most loyal support bases – the civil rights crowd on one hand, and the feminists on the other hand.
If the fringe of the civil rights movement steals this issue and makes it their own, Obama has these two groups fighting each other over abortion.
Hence, the slant that this entire issue is, ultimately, the fault of white, conservative, Repubs, who want to stomp down both women and hi-jack the civil rights movement in order to do it.
Just another day hanging in the press room, waiting for the latest Obama campaign message.
neo-Carlinist
March 17th, 2010
9:38 am
here’s an idea, let’s restrict posts to bloggers who have been party to an abortion. a woman who has had an abortion, or a man whose partner “chose” to abort the couple’s child, with or without the consent of the father. the anti-abortion crowd is not “pro-life” because it doesn’t care about lives; it cares about votes (see: war, death penalty, etc.). the pro-abortion crowd doesn’t care about life; either, but that’s a given. Roe v. Wade is like any other law. there are those who abide by it, and those who do not. the same will hold true if it is reversed (which I doubt); people who want abortions will have access to abortions (see: drugs, firearms, identity theft, etc.). this whole issue is political (a fundraising excercise). politicians and lobbyists don’t care about abortion beyind the political (and real) capital if offers. I guess abortion is “racist” if you are talking about the human race, but the government cannot legislate “thought”.
blady
March 17th, 2010
9:39 am
“Perhaps that’s why “racism” has become the battle cry of anti-abortion groups whose members — overwhelmingly white, conservative and Republican — like to think that racism no longer exists.”
Says it all and speaks volumes about the hypocrisy in which these flat-earthers constantly engage.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:39 am
“Why are people afraid to call themselves pro-abortion? What’s with the “pro-choice” canard?”
I always wondered why people sugar-coat it like that as well. Just call it like it is.
CrowDog
March 17th, 2010
9:40 am
Ms. Tucker, do you realize that planned parenthood had an agenda to reduce the number of black and other so call rejects in America. Margaret Sanger was a racist and she used the black preacher to do her dirty work in Harlem and other black area. Currently, and you can look up the statistics yourself from the CDC, black comprise 12% of the population but have 25-33% of abortions. More black have been aborted than the Klan could ever kill. There have been 12 million black abortions since Roe v Wade.
Now who’s doing the hate, conservatives or liberals? You say you believe in adoption but you never question the ethics of your Democratic party and why planned parenthood targets poor black women. Babies can make decision, people do and when planned parenthood tried to use the same tactics in Hispanic communities, they were ran out.
Democrats are pro-abortion not choice. Choice promotes adoption.
Reality
March 17th, 2010
9:40 am
@Bubba: I can answer that one! The term “pro-abortion” would mean that one wants abortion. I don’t know of anyone whose position is that we “want” abortion. The term “pro-choice” would mean that one wants everyone to have options – yes to abortion if they chose or no to abortion if they don’t want one; and maybe even yes to give their baby up for adoption or no they want to keep it.
I always felt that these terms were self-explanatory and am shocked to see that everyone doesn’t clearly see the distinction.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:41 am
“overwhelmingly white, conservative and Republican — like to think that racism no longer exists”
2 things, Cynthia.
1. Are there no black Republicans?
2. To some people racism doesn’t exist. Sad to say some people like Cynthia keep it alive.
JMS
March 17th, 2010
9:41 am
Maybe black woman should cross their legs more often and or use birth control if they do not want to concieve a child… actually that goes for all woman! Black ,white red, yellow…. And Cynthia the race card is about worn out. Not everything is a conspiracy.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:42 am
“I always felt that these terms were self-explanatory and am shocked to see that everyone doesn’t clearly see the distinction.”
They’re the same. One just isn’t politically correct. One just sounds better.
DBH
March 17th, 2010
9:42 am
“If conservatives are sincere about curbing abortions — among all women, white, black and brown — they should support efforts to broaden women’s health care, which includes reproductive health care.”
Oh, really, Ms. Tucker? Well, then, answer me this, please: What does the lack of women’s health care have to do with the woman’s decision to have sex in the first place and ultimately resulting in an “unintended” pregnancy? I mean, seriously. How much more “health care” does a woman need in order to understand that IF you CHOOSE to have sex, there is a CHANCE you COULD become pregnant? The woman’s choice to have an abortion is no more due to a lack of reproductive health care than it is for the woman who chooses to have the baby.
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:43 am
Why is a woman’s choice to either reproduce or not any of Bubba’s business anyway? Unless he is the father, he has no say in the matter, and neither should the government. There is far more Evil in the world than an American woman choosing abortion in the first trimester. After the first trimester, abortion or miscarriage becomes an increasingly risky procedure for the mother, a life threatening event for her. Gendercide is an ancient practice that has been and continues to be the greatest “holocaust” in the history of the world, yet it is ignored by almost all. That is the true Evil.
Bob
March 17th, 2010
9:44 am
Anon, how many times does a kid have to be told how babies are made and a condom can be bought for about the same as a forty, price is no excuse.
Reality
March 17th, 2010
9:45 am
@CrowDog – Whoa there nelly! Pro-choice means to give individuals the right to make their own decisions regarding their own reproductive abilities. That’s it. Nothing more or nothing less.
If they chose to have an abortion, then that is pro-choice.
If they chose to have the baby, then that is pro-choice.
If they chose to keep the baby, then that is pro-choice.
If they chose to give the baby up for adoption, then that is pro-choice.
The group calling themselves “anti-abortion” want to step in and dictate with big government to tell individuals what to do with their reproductive rights. It is always funny and very hypocritical that the same people that claim to be republican conservatives wanting less goverment intrusion into our lives are the SAME ones wanting big government telling others what to do with their reproductive rights.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:46 am
Reality, I have two follow-up questions: If you believe there’s nothing wrong with abortion, why do you want to limit it? Also, were the people in the 1800s who favored slavery but didn’t own them pro-slavery or pro-choice?
Chris
March 17th, 2010
9:46 am
Bubba…Political Correctness was invented for those without the intestinal fortitude to actually speak their true mind and beliefs. Lets face it “pro-choice” is their euphamistic way to express the fact that they are FOR killing babies for the simple convenience of the parent
Jess
March 17th, 2010
9:46 am
Peadawg,
I read the article this morning on the fact check about health care cost. No surprises. Obama is lying about the numbers.
TnGelding
March 17th, 2010
9:47 am
Well, somebody has to look after their children and do their menial tasks.
“That’s not only nutty; it’s also insulting. It’s both sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual and emotional firepower to make their own decisions.”
Well, I think we can agree they’ve made some bad decisions or they wouldn’t be having so many children or abortions.
And nobody is pro-abortion. We’re pro-choice and think the key is preventing unwanted pregnancies. Something you’d think conservatives would support. And in the very high percentage of procedures cells, embryos and fetuses are aborted; not babies. But we men really need to leave the argument to the women. It’s their final decision.
Drinking the koolaid...
March 17th, 2010
9:48 am
Another day, another CT column on race. This one is a bit far fetched, but the goal is to stir the pot I guess so mission accomplished.
I do like the way you weave in that its “nutty” (I actually agree here) with a statement that its being planned by “overwhelmingly white, conservative and Republican” (which by the way I believe to be in of itself a racially biased statement unless you have official statistics of what the demographic, race, and political make up of the group is). Never miss an opportunity to poke the other side huh?
I don’t believe in abortion any longer- my attitudes changed as I got older and had kids of my own. I think adoption is a better solution. I’m not willing, however, to enforce my beliefs on anyone else legally or otherwise.
Every person must make their own choices in life and settle up for the good and bad at the end.
Margaret
March 17th, 2010
9:48 am
Cynthia, I know that hundreds of people who agree with you simply don’t take the time to post. I am often in that group, and I so appreciate your courage in continuing to speak truth to power.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:49 am
T&F, so in your world I would have no interest in whether a parent killed his child unless I was the parent?
Silly Liberals
March 17th, 2010
9:49 am
Tucker,
Would you please do yourself a favor and study your history before you vomit words all over a computer screen?
Planned Parenthood WAS created out of Sanger’s belief in eugenics. But whereas other supporters of eugenics back in the day promoted drastic measures, like forced sterility, to curb births of “undesirables”, Sanger’s approach was considered more humane because she advocated eugenics by preventing pregnancy through safe-sex. It was a way for a society, in her opinion, to become stronger by preventing the births of children who would otherwise be born into less than perfect environments, namely poverty. But it was still eugenics. Were Nazi concentration camp guards who gassed Jews kinder than those who burned them alive in ovens? No. It was just a different kind of cruelty. If Sanger were a Nazi, she would have chosen to gas prisoners, while her counterparts chucked them into ovens.
Nunya Beeswax
March 17th, 2010
9:49 am
Kayaker71 provides some interesting figures to digest. The future suddenly looks brighter, in more ways than one. Rosie makes a very valid point. Self-inflicted genocide is the wave of the future.
Donna P.
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
Abortion will be paid for in Obama Care. Is birth control of any kind available for free in it?
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
a gentle reminder….birth control is not simply a womans issue.
while women should “keep there legs closed”,
men should try “keeping it in their pants”.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
“The group calling themselves “anti-abortion” want to step in and dictate with big government to tell individuals what to do with their reproductive rights.”
You’re a Democrat, right Reality? Cynthia? Y’all like big government controlling our lives, right? Or is it just sometimes or when it’s convenient to your beliefs?
Rafe Hollister
March 17th, 2010
9:51 am
Sin-thee for once you are right. Abortion should be kept legal and adoption promoted. Are their racist policies in place at abortuaries, I do not know. I guess for you it is “in Democrats we trust”.
We do need better medical care for poor people in general and expentant mothers specifically, but Obamacare, is an abortion in itself and needs to be defeated.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
9:51 am
T&F wrote: There is far more Evil in the world than an American woman choosing abortion in the first trimester.
There is far more evil in the world than a man robbing a bank too. Does that mean I shouldn’t oppose armed robbery?
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
9:52 am
Donna P
You are wrong.
HCR is limited by the Hite amendment.
There is no provision in HCR to have federal funds pay for abortions.
You are either misinformed or telling a lie.
Interesting
March 17th, 2010
9:52 am
I’ve been concerned about this for years. The real number of AA abortions is probably closer to 45% (note that 37% of abortions come from AA mothers…This does not include the race of the father…If you included AA fathers with non AA women, the number will surely increase.)
I’m concerned that so many AA parents believe this is the best option for them and their child. This tells me that many AA parents are not comfortable with our adoption/foster care system or their extended family when it comes to helping raise a child. I’m not saying the abortion process is racist, but I am saying that it seems like general society is fairly comfortable with high abortion rates in “at risk” communities. The authors of Freakanomics even suggest that abortion has helped reduce crime rates in major cities. Personally, I would argue that high abortion rates have hurt major cities…
Aquagirl
March 17th, 2010
9:52 am
I anxiously await more posts indicating black women should cross their legs, just say no, quit being sluts, etc. Until then, I’ll be researching this new phenomenon that black women impregnate themselves, since I see nothing about guys keeping it in their pants, just saying no, supporting their children, etc.
pat
March 17th, 2010
9:52 am
Well abortion kills more blacks than any other demographic. An argument can be made that keeping it “free and legal” and even subsidizing it with tax dollars is a way to keep the black population in check
Seriously?
March 17th, 2010
9:53 am
After reading the article and some of the responses, I am floored at the thinking in America.
It is ALWAYS someone else’s fault, Planned Parenthood, Georgia Right to Life, etc….How about taking personal responsibility for your own actions. I find it hard to believe that ANY race is not aware of how babies are born. If you play with fire, you will eventually get burned.
The problem is the American society is becoming more and more latch key and parents are not there to raise their children. We also have an epidemic of absentee fathers.
I am SO SO SO (see a pattern here) sick of everything coming down to race (especially in Tucker’s blogs); people disagree with Obama’s stance because he is black, the white man is keeping us down, the list goes on and on. People disagree with Obama because they disagree with the bill, resolution, bail-out, etc. ObamaCare will run this country into the ground and getting decent healthcare will be impossible. If you have ever looked at Canada, why do you think so many Canadians are coming across the border to get medical care; they cannot wait months to have a procedure! If people think ObamaCare will assist the “low-income”, they are wrong; it is yet another false promise for change!
Food for thought…..
1. Stop having sex and take personal responsibility for your actions.
2. Raise your children to understand the importance of safe-sex or abstinence.
3. Be a father to your children, don’t run off looking for the next piece.
4. Create a future for yourself and don’t expect anyone else to do it for you.
I came from a low income family in a carpet mill town and I have made it far by hard work and determination. I never expected a hand out and worked my butt off to get where I am now. I went to college in Decatur and was by far a minority being I was one of a very few white kids. I saw too many black kids with a free ride with grants and other government money who wasted it. I am still paying for my education and worked hard to graduate and move on to get my Master degree. If you do not have to work hard for something, you will not appreciate it.
Get off you @$$ and do something with you life and take personal responsibility for your actions! It does not matter if you black, white, green or freakin’ purple, you are the only one in control of your life!
VERITAS
March 17th, 2010
9:53 am
It is no coincidence most of the “planned parenthood” locations are in low-income and minority neighborhoods. Nothing but modern-day Auschwitzs, funded by the American taxpayer. No wonder God is frowning on the USA these days.
Scooter (the Original)
March 17th, 2010
9:55 am
If someone can’t figure out how to get a contraceptive before intercourse or successfully implement the pull out method during, then by all means let them have an abortion.
Oh Brother
March 17th, 2010
9:56 am
African American women are LEAST LIKELY to get abortions than white women, though. Did anyone cite that FACT in the midst of this nonsense?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:57 am
“There is no provision in HCR to have federal funds pay for abortions.”
There is vague wording in the bill that could possibly allow it. Google “health care reform taxpayer funded abortions” That’s one of the problems right now…that’s why Pelosi can’t get some Democrats to vote for it. Atleast some people can read for themselves and not listen to Pelosi and Obama’s lies.
MikeB
March 17th, 2010
9:57 am
I don’t care which side of the abortion fight you are on Ms.Tucker. Just don’t bring race into the discussion in terms of “oppression”.
The end result will be the same for all races.
Since you are obsessed with positioning yourself as the next Rev.Al Sharpton (using the AJC as your pulpit) why not focus on the “choices” and “consiquences” of those choices of those you spend so much time advocating for.
Instead you consistently avoid the personal responsibility debate and run around with your figurative hand out, thinking that society owes this and that. What a poor irresponsible use of pen/pulpit.
Many who may be inclined to help, may after reading a series of your rants may step back They know the more they give, more you will try to get, and it will never stop.
pat
March 17th, 2010
9:58 am
Pro-choice my rectum. It’s a way to soften the truth. The truth is that abortion kills viable living human beings. Doing this willfully is murder. There is no break in the human life cycle from conception to death. If I kill you as a fetus, you will never exist, period.
There’s a lot better ways to not get pregnant. Don’t kill your kids because they are inconvenient to you.
Do the right thing and quit whinning. Pro-abortionists cannot and never will win the debate because you are wrong morally, philosophcally, and scientifically. You just want it because you want it, nothing more.
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
9:58 am
Wrong Bubba, killing a child is murder, early abortion is just another form of birth control. R U opposed to birth control? Gendercide is practiced, for the most part, in parts of the world that do not have access to ultrasound or other techniques to determine the gender of the fetus, so the father must wait till after the birth to determine the sex of the baby, and its fate. After the birth, it is a murder to kill the baby, and that is what Gendercide is all about around the world, the systematic murder of millions of baby girls every year. Yet Bubba only wants to tell American women when and where to reproduce. It must be very depressing for you Bubba to see the work place in America being totally taken over by WOMEN. If you currently have a job, your boss is most likely female. What would she say if she knew you were not working, rather you were posting sexist rantings on the internet? I think you would be fired. I hope she is reading this, and runs out of her office to check up on you Bubba.
Oh Brother
March 17th, 2010
9:58 am
“AA women are three more times a likely to have an abortion than any other ethnic group.”
Please cite your source.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
9:58 am
Scooter
the pull out method…..sorry foolish idea.
pre-ejaculate impregnates too.
Pope UGA XXIII
March 17th, 2010
9:58 am
Mrs/Miss/Ms/whatever Tucker:
On occasion, I look at your column, if for no other reason, to
see how stupid some jounalists really are. You very well may be
Terrence Moore with a dress on.
When will some of you clowns stop hollering “RACISM” when
you can conjure up some silly thought about black people being
mistreated in some fashion.
Although I don’t have access to your medical records, I will bet
you a steak dinner that you were dropped on your head when you
were a child – several times.
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
10:00 am
In typical fashion, CT responds to that of which is for her own self-promotion. Advertising about your own adoption efforts is just one of the narcissistic signs that we see with you. Your adoption is not any sort of merit badge. Good for you-but its discussion amidst this article is completely irrelevant.
Your article had nothing to do with adoption, and never mentioned it. It’s odd how you conveniently skip over the arguments claiming you are the racist in your own debate, or for being Chicken Little against the right-but then, most people who don’t speak the truth usually avoid the facts.
People who were adopted tend to be more pro-life people then anyone else-given that the nature of the medical procedure results in their death, and people like you are advocating it as a form of birth control that is on the same level as a condom, pill, etc. There are times when abortion can be necessary, but to advocate it as a form of birth control belongs as a half-brained idea from an amoral person (no implications there toward religion, just to that of someone who knows right from wrong).
What will come of the day when your adopted child asks you whether you would have supported their death simply because the mother did not want a child? For the quid pro quo of the argument CT-do you support the Death Penalty for murderers, or just for unborn children to parents ignorant of the 10’s of 100’s of different contraceptive measures?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:00 am
“early abortion is just another form of birth control.”
I can’t believe people still think like this. Have a one-night stand who cares, I can just abort it later this week. That’s just sad!
TnGelding
March 17th, 2010
10:01 am
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
You got that right. There’s more than one way to skin a cat!
Rod
March 17th, 2010
10:01 am
Keeping people poor and uneducated by having unwanted and unplanned pregnancies is not the way to go. These billboards are nonsense and need to be taken down. Let’s help those who are here and get people into schools and universites to get an education. Nobody wants to pay higher taxes for children having children.
signed a
A Black man
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
10:02 am
Bubba, robbing a bank is a crime, a first trimester abortion is not. R U in jail? U seem to have a problem distinguishing between what is legal and what is illegal.
dw
March 17th, 2010
10:02 am
TnGelding: You are working with symantics when you say cells, embryo, fetus, and baby. Just different levels of development of the same live being. Please tell me when it is not a live being. Ok call yourself pro-choice, but millions of times a year, that choice results in death for a live and completely innocent and unprotected being. Sugarcoat it all you want. That is what occurs. Use birth-control you knotheads. Now to CTs main statement: Abortion is not a race deal. I agree with CT for once on something. Did hell just freeze over???
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:03 am
Peadawg
No vague wording.
No funding for abortions in HCR.
from Slate:
the Senate bill explicitly ensures that Americans who receive federal subsidies under the reform plan must pay separately for abortion coverage. Here’s pages 2,074-2,075: “In the case of a plan to which sub paragraph (A) applies, the issuer of the plan shall collect from each enrollee in the plan (without regard to the enrollee’s age, sex, or family status) a separate payment” that “may not estimate such a cost at less than $1 per enrollee, per month.”
Only vague if reading comprehension skills are low.
Oh Brother
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
Someone, anyone, PLEASE type in “african american abortion statistics” into google and tell me what you get. On PAGE ONE ALONE, there were contradictory statistics. While one “study” posts that “African Americans are three times more likely to get abortions…”, another says that “68% of all abortions in this country are performed on WHITE WOMEN”. All of you have computers. Take a look for yourselves. You can’t trust every piece of junk that’s passed off as a study. Check the CDC stats. How can AA women be leading the number of out of wedlock births in this country but at the same time be most likely to get abortions than anyone else???
But then again, most of you believe that “there are more black men in prison than in college” ANOTHER FALSE statement eaten up by the public as fact.
Anyone who can think for themselves, I urge you to delve further into this.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
TNGelding
My Mr. G is currently undergoing treatment for prostate cancer.
At our house we’ve got loads of naked cats…..just sayin’.
Right
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
They don’t care!
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
From the Economist: ” XINRAN XUE, a Chinese writer, describes visiting a peasant family in the Yimeng area of Shandong province. The wife was giving birth. “We had scarcely sat down in the kitchen”, she writes (see article), “when we heard a moan of pain from the bedroom next door…The cries from the inner room grew louder—and abruptly stopped. There was a low sob, and then a man’s gruff voice said accusingly: ‘Useless thing!’
“Suddenly, I thought I heard a slight movement in the slops pail behind me,” Miss Xinran remembers. “To my absolute horror, I saw a tiny foot poking out of the pail. The midwife must have dropped that tiny baby alive into the slops pail! I nearly threw myself at it, but the two policemen [who had accompanied me] held my shoulders in a firm grip. ‘Don’t move, you can’t save it, it’s too late.’
“‘But that’s…murder…and you’re the police!’ The little foot was still now. The policemen held on to me for a few more minutes. ‘Doing a baby girl is not a big thing around here,’ [an] older woman said comfortingly. ‘That’s a living child,’ I said in a shaking voice, pointing at the slops pail. ‘It’s not a child,’ she corrected me. ‘It’s a girl baby, and we can’t keep it. Around these parts, you can’t get by without a son. Girl babies don’t count.’”
In January 2010 the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences (CASS) showed what can happen to a country when girl babies don’t count. Within ten years, the academy said, one in five young men would be unable to find a bride because of the dearth of young women—a figure unprecedented in a country at peace.”
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:05 am
CT, no matter what you do, you’ll always be accused of being a racist, even when you write an opinion that effectively says this is not a race issue. The same forces that want government to stay out of their lives and cry about individual freedoms also cry out to control the individual freedoms of women. They want to cry out about government programs that teach responsibility and taking action to prevent an unwanted pregnancy…and the “anti-abortion” crowd only wants to teach “abstinence” (How is that “hope your daughter wont have sex” thingy working for ya?). And if you point out the financial impact to all of us from forcing a woman to have a child she does not want in the first place and from an anti-abortion action that wants to force a woman raped to have that child or to have a child even if medical testing shows that the life of the mother is endangered, then suddenly cost does not matter. Consistency does not matter. Blame young women for having sex in the first place even when classes to teach then about sex and the consequences of unprotected sex are banned by the same group mentality. Ignorance abounds from misinformation.
Survivor
March 17th, 2010
10:06 am
I have survive a abortion. My mom try to abort me and it did not work an I was born anyway. I am a working member of the soceity now. I own a bar with my friends and busines aint good all the time but we can at least drink our drink. It fun because i only get to do work like clean up and imty the rat trap but they call it Charlie work so it is all good.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:06 am
Granny, so the reading comprehension of some Democrats are low? Whoda thunk it!!! I’m reading what you put and I don’t see anything about abortions in that paragraph. Maybe I’m just as dumb as members of Congress……
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
10:06 am
Peadawn: No different than taking a birth control pill.
Scooter (the Original)
March 17th, 2010
10:09 am
Granny, pre ejaculate is the most potent, I know this. Did you notice the operative word “SUCCESSFULLY” implement. I have done it scores of times and never impregnated a woman until I was married and able to care for the product. It probably had nothing to do with self control, I was just lucky.
Right
March 17th, 2010
10:09 am
And….if people did care they would try to have a legitimate conversation about why black women tend to have higher birth rates and supposedly more abortions…lack of education and awareness. By the way, raising standards and performance pay won’t teach kids life skills of which so many desperately need.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:10 am
Granny, my wife and I use the pull-out method everytime. She’s on bc also. No baby yet. Been married for 2 years.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
10:11 am
I’ll let you in on a little secret, T&F. I am the boss.
Adolf Hitler
March 17th, 2010
10:11 am
Abortion clinics? Planned Parenthood? Why didn’t I think of that ! Heil, Cynthia Tucker !
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:11 am
Peadawg
Nope. But you’re cute when you obfuscate!
Scooter
Thank heavens you never dated either of my ‘Zillettes. They had the good sense to stay away from gamete gamblers like you.
Bill Hartzell
March 17th, 2010
10:12 am
neo- as someone who is part of the ‘anti-abortion’ crowd, let me say that I am one of those in this ‘crowd’ who very much cares about life. ANYONE who has ever had the nerve to look at pictures of aborted fetuses CAN NOT tell me that they still don’t believe that abortion is the murdering of a child. One day, ‘every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is Lord- and, on that day, they will answer to Almighty God why they never took a stand for those who were unable to defend themselves, ie. the unborn children who were aborted. I hope and pray that He will prevent us from hearing the great ‘wailing and gnashing of teeth’- it’s not a sound I want to hear. CT I find it interesting that you haven’t responded to Ryno’s post- any comment?
Philosopher
March 17th, 2010
10:14 am
Bob: Such incredible ignorance…sit in on a 5th grade sex-ed class and refresh, please. No form of birth control except total abstinance (THAT ain’t onna happen!)is 100% effective. My beautiful daughter,tied tubes and all,is testament to that….
Dear Granny: Amen, Amen, Amen! What an asinine statement that was!
bob
March 17th, 2010
10:15 am
WHY MISS SCARLETT TUCKER
I Don’t know nuffin bout burfin babies! Why dont you just quote Gone With The Wind! To you everything is racism. Its called keep your legs closed or buy contraceptives and use them.
I do want to point out how I think you let your racist views toward white women slip out as you refer to black women as American Black women yet just list American White women as plain white women. Hmm why Ms Tucker, do you not have the same respect for American White Women as you do for American Black Women? Lordy, I do declare!
Have a nice day!
Corey
March 17th, 2010
10:15 am
Planned parent hood and the eugenic program is actually the same thing…they just changed there name to Planned Parent Hood years ago, because of the flack they were recieving from the black community. And actually some of the same people that help Hitler with his messed up logical way of thinking were the creaters of the Eugenics program… Hitler studied and like their work so much he had them come and help him…Blacks are sub-human to them then and are still are today. Look it up…Men Lie, Women Lie, Facts Don’t!
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:16 am
Granny, can you explain what the paragraph you posted has to do w/ abortions? I don’t see anything about abortions in it. When I do ‘control F’ in my browser and search for the word abortion, it isn’t in that paragraph. Maybe Internet Explorer is dumb as well?
CMix
March 17th, 2010
10:17 am
Of coarse it is! everyone knows that abortion clinics are set up by the KKK and funded Hitlers Youth! A racist plot, really?!?!? It is a choice that they make! simple as that
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:18 am
Peabrain…..I have to disagree…you aren’t just a dumb. They are being disingenious for their political gain. You however seem to believe any dumb comment put out by them.
Truly you believe that a woman who is raped should be forced to have a child?
Or a mother who is at medical risk for her own life if she goes through childbirth should be forced to have a child?
Of course, safe sex is never 100% effective, so even those who use protection devices may inadvertently fail.
Your women with low morales who have sex first and often, then dont want to deal with the consequences is just absurd as an extreme posing as the “majority”.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:21 am
“Truly you believe that a woman who is raped should be forced to have a child?”
Why is it the kid’s fault? Why shouldn’t he have a chance at life because of this?
shellybean
March 17th, 2010
10:24 am
Abortion is something that a person CHOOSES to do. No one FORCES someone to get an abortion (in most cases). Unfortunately the government is wanting to FORCE the American tax payers to pay for the abortions that people choose to get. Killing an innocent person is wrong. Forcing the American people to pay for a procedure that someone CHOOSES to do is wrong. Just because one racial group over another happens to the be recipients of this procedure does not make it RACIST! It just makes it even more heartbreaking.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:27 am
Peabrain…since you want a woman who is raped to have the child, I assume you have no problem with a government program to care for the health and well-being of that child and mother. Since you care so much about that child and that life, surely that care does not end at the moment of birth. If the raped mother is only 14, are you going to also provide the food, education and healthcare needed? Are you also going to provide for the child care while the young girl is in school?
Since you support “life” and want to force the birth, do you not have a responsibility to care for the life that you have forced to be born. You want to lecture about responsibility, but you want to ignore your own.
T.C
March 17th, 2010
10:27 am
Kayaker wrote these same billboards could be placed in latino and white neighborhoods,but the fact is there not.We all know that the latino population is growing but considering the present population percentage wise(LATINOS) as to black and whites,is not even a topic of discussion.You probably just wanted your comment to sound like ms tuckers colum did’nt strike a nerve.I have learned that whats in a person’s heart rather its racism,hatred,ect…it will come forth and your oppinion is just what it is a oppinion.
bob
March 17th, 2010
10:29 am
Philosopher, ignorance, not hardly. Is not keeping your legs closed abstinance, and whatever happend to being taught right and wrong at home by ones parents, and why is it the schools place to teach morals and sex eduation to my child or yours, or others. I guess i was raised different by a different kind of parent/s, than what are raising kids today. Let the gov’t raise them, teach them, cuz after all since Hillary said it years ago, It Takes A Village To Raise A Child, and now the values of Village Idiots is coming to frutrition so you reap what you sow.
I am sure your daughter is beautiful and it is nice to see a parent not hesitant to say it. I feel the same way about my son, I just say handsome. Thanks for your point if view!
Bill Hartzell
March 17th, 2010
10:30 am
TAR and FEATHER- Just bcuz something is “legal’ does not make it morally right. For the pro-abortionists saying that a fetus is not ‘alive/a life, if the ’sperm’ is alive and the ‘egg’ is alive, just when in the process does ‘not alive/a life happen?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:30 am
Is Peabrain the best you got? Cynthia, if you’re moderating, isn’t that considered name-calling? I thought you didn’t allow name-calling on here, Cynthia?
fultonrighty
March 17th, 2010
10:32 am
Peadawg, you may be one of the “lucky” 1/6 of married couples who are infertile. Any contraceptive method will work for them.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:32 am
Peadawg
see the PDF of the bill
pages 2071 and 2072
it won’t let me copy and paste
i tried to post the link but it put my post into moderation
if you can get to here:
Fact-checking Stupak on abortion
Posted: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 3:05 PM by Mark Murray
Filed Under: Congress, Democrats
there’s a link to the pdf
At it again
March 17th, 2010
10:33 am
Well Cynthia Tucker, you are back to your old ways using the race card. When is everyone going to wake up and realize that there is good and bad in every race/nationality. There are greedy white people, there are greedy black people. There are criminal white people and there are criminal black people. There are good Republicans and there are good democrats as well as bad ones. We should disapprove of the criminal, the greed, the zealous, etc. that lives in evey race nationality, not the race or nationality itself. I don’t like Pres. Obama. Not because he is black, I could care less about that. I dislike him because of his power-hungry, egotistical, socialist views that are ruining our great country. Maybe those who feel the race card is being played against them should take a look at themselves and see if any blame lies there first. Read the book Son of Hamas and you will understand what I am talking about.
CT, do you realize that when you scream “racism” then you follow that with a negative conotation of “overwhelmy white, conservative, and Republican, that you in fact are being a racist? We must love evryone and hate the sins/actions/manifestos, etc. not the person.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:33 am
fultonrighty, how am i infertile?
anti t
March 17th, 2010
10:35 am
Good grief….blame white conservatives if it makes you happy.It was God that said he knew you before you were in the womb.I don’t wanna explain to god that i was inconvenienced by the baby in my womb…so i murdered it.Pro-choice means not spreading my legs if i can’t handle the outcome…that’s the real choice…the baby in the womb doesn’t have a choice does it…so i guess white conservatives care about pro choice for the one being murdered.how many babys have been aborted because of their color?More than you would think….it is racist also..
HDB
March 17th, 2010
10:36 am
Strait Road
March 17th, 2010
9:33 am
“It’s both sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual and emotional firepower to make their own decisions.”
By the same token, is it not equally sexist and racist to suggest that black women don’t have the intellectual firepower to succeed in education and professionally without the help of laws that provide them with quotas? I suppose, after reading a few of your columns, one might conclude that these laws have enabled you to keep gainful employment. I guess that’s worth something.
————————————————————————————————————————–
Where you’ve made your mistake is to think that black women don’t have the intellectual firepower to succeed….period!! Statistics show that there are more black women pursuing higher education than black MEN!! The greatest beneficiary of the Affirmative Action statutes is WHITE WOMEN!!! Who needs more protection via Affirmative Action are BLACK MEN!!
——————————————————————————————————————————–
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
9:41 am
“1. Are there no black Republicans? – Yes, there are….but white conservatives use them to denigrate those that don’t think as they do, therefore creating a wedge in the black community!! White conservatives team with black conservatives in the elimination of programs that allow black people to progress…but those same black conservatives used those programs to gain their successes!!
2. To some people racism doesn’t exist. Sad to say some people like Cynthia keep it alive.
The problem is that racism STILL exists…..some people wish to IGNORE that fact!!
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
10:37 am
HDB, I don’t know what time warp you’re stuck in, but there are NO QUOTAS anywhere. There never have been actually, but there was enough talk of “goals” for affirmative action opponents to define them as “quotas.” There is no longer even any affirmative action. Come out of the ’70s
I hate kids
March 17th, 2010
10:38 am
There ARE people out there who are actually pro-abortion but few will admit to it. I, however, am admitting to it. People, a fetus is not a child. It is a clump of cells. It’s not a person until it can live independently of the mother. If abortion is murder, where does it stop? Are we murdering babies every moment we’re not in bed procreating? The world is so over-populated anyway, & as time goes on, I see more & more (repulsive) pregnant bellies, on ALL races & ethnicities but they all have one thing in common…most are poor. Poor people should have NO right to have babies! Babies are not a joy & a blessing & all the rest of that sentimental slop, they’re a burden. Especially to us taxpayers who must BEAR the burden thrust upon us by the selfish poor. Of course we can’t stop the poor from having sex; they’re like animals, just dropping their pants & lifting their skirts for anything that comes along. Gee, they can use their welfare checks to buy condoms but no, when they pop their crack & AIDS filth out, they can be assured of a lifelong free ride. I, for one, am sick & tired of subsidizing that “human” waste with my hard-earned dollars & please don’t tell me all human life has value. That, too, is a load of sentimental bilge. A 10-year old, pants-on-the-floor gangbanger with a loaded gun is NOT precious. A baby born horribly sick & deformed should not be allowed to be born, not only because it’s unfair to make taxpayers subsidize its useless, pain-wracked life but to prevent the child itself from living a life of dreadful suffering. Google “Juliana Wetmore” & you’ll see what I mean. I can’t understand why anyone would want to sleep with poor people anyway; they’re dirty & they stink. But, if one gets pregnant, they should at least do the decent thing & get rid of the piece of waste
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:38 am
Wow Bob….I am glad you acknowledge the poor parenting skills of Sarah Palin. If she had taught her daughter right and wrong and morals, maybe even some sex ed, then things would have been different.
Why even have schools at all? Education and teaching morales should be the duty of parents. People without children should not have to bear this cost of teaching your children. You had the child now accept the responsibility for that child and the cost. Philosophy, literature, history are all just matters which include morales and social justice.
Beaves
March 17th, 2010
10:38 am
If abortion was legal back in 1960 maybe we would not have to endure the Obozonomics that we have today. Just think what a great place this country would be without a whole generation of liberal/progressive/communist.
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
10:38 am
At it again, please don’t comment here if you cannot be bothered to read the post.
To Catherine Davis
March 17th, 2010
10:42 am
To Catherine Davis -
I just wanted you to know that I think that the billboard stating that Black children are an endangered species is both inaccurate and disgusting. The state of Georgia/the Nation, etc. cannot even balance its budget, so I surely have zero confidence in some bureaucrat’s stats on abortion and who’s having them. Additionally, I’ve grown very tired of the demonization of the Black women and I certainly don’t appreciate it when the truth is this is NOT motivated by a real concern for our community. This is just a new and provactive way to promote GRTL’s agenda, just like perpetuation of the “link” between abortion and breast cancer when studies have shown and experts agree that there isn’t a link. GRTL could care less about the Black community, in my humble opinion, they just want support.
Further, I am disappointed that you are allowing GRTL to use you (as a Black woman) in this manner. If you see abortion THE MAIN social ill in our community, then you really are not paying attention.
Also, in your last point during the CNN interview you totally disregarded the statement that was made by the host. NO ONE said that abortion was the remedy or solution to some of the probelms within the Black community. What was said (which you chose to disregard because it was a great point) was that abortion is often a RESULT of some of the ills within the community such as lack of education and job opportunities – both ESSENTIAL to one’s ability to CARE FOR a child properly.
And the assertion, without any supporting facts, that abortion clinics target African-American women is a bit irresponsible. You have absolutely no proof of that at all.
I’m pro-choice and always will be, but I am very disgusted that RTL has chosen to make this a racial issue when it is simply about civil rights.
HDB
March 17th, 2010
10:42 am
Peadawg — I can understand that many want to limit the number of abortions; no problem with that here…but I don’t desire to make it illegal….as many here desire. Specifically, in the case of rape or incest, no one should be FORCED to carry that type of pregnancy to full term.
I understand that the child was not at fault…..but the decision as to how such a situation is handled should NOT be made by those OUTSIDE of it….IMHO….
Tommy Lee Maddox
March 17th, 2010
10:43 am
Yep – evil white Republicans are responsible for all these pregnancies [well, John Edwards too but he does not count - wrong party].
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:43 am
“The problem is that racism STILL exists…..some people wish to IGNORE that fact!!”
You mean the people who don’t see black or white? The people who just sees others as equal human beings? Sad to say not many exist.
Bright Idea
March 17th, 2010
10:44 am
If you have a problem with abortion, don’t have one.
What’s it to you anyways? Seriously. Why do you care? Whether people use it as birth control or not, how does it seriously affect you? And DO NOT say tax payer dollars because it has been LONG STANDING federal regulations that prohibit that. Medicaid/Medicare is NOT funding abortions, so really why are you concerned???
Again, if you are against abortion, don’t have one.
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:46 am
Granny, Lawyer Tim’s comment at the bottom of http:// firstread. msnbc. msn. com/ archive/ 2010/03/09/2222673. aspx is pretty interesting.
barbaric
March 17th, 2010
10:47 am
Even after you remove any religious arguments. Abortion is still a barbaric act for a civilized society to practice.
FINALLY!!!
March 17th, 2010
10:47 am
Repost from CTucker – I don’t know what time warp you’re stuck in, but there are NO QUOTAS anywhere. There never have been actually, but there was enough talk of “goals” for affirmative action opponents to define them as “quotas.” There is no longer even any affirmative action. Come out of the ’70s.
Thank you!!! You would be surprised how may people really think quotas and affirmative action are law. Like a written law that requires all business owners, schools, etc. to have a certain amount of Black people. Not even minorities (women, asians) but Black people. LOL. Thanks for TRYING to educate.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:47 am
Beaves
yep, that pre-60’s world was really cool man!
the pill was illegal, women who worked outside the home were looked down on, black folks got beaten or lynched for just trying to register to vote, school kids were taught they could be safe from atomic bombs by hiding under their desks, doctors told us how good smoking was for us…..
grand times eh?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:47 am
HDB, it’s funny how the people who are against an amendment outlawing an abortion, i.e. government controlling our lives, are also for this health care bill and more regulations. just sayin…..
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:49 am
Pea and others…. just ignore the hard questions and consistency.
Anti-abortionists are also against the death penalty?
What about the young girl who is raped?
What about the mother who medical experts determine will likely die in child birth? Is life so valuable that you will sentence her to death.
Are there exceptions to your “rule of life” that permits abortions?
If life is so valuable that it must be born, then to allow a child to die or suffer from lack of healthcare after birth must also be part of that value system, correct?
Bill Hartzell
March 17th, 2010
10:49 am
hates kids- I don’t see what your problem w/ Juliana is- looks like a beautiful little girl who is enjoying life to me. Oh, btw, I didn’t see anything on her homepage about it costing the taxpayer anything for her surgeries, so, really, where do you get the right to judge or say her parents were wrong?
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
10:51 am
Pea… it funny how you ignore that the bill already provides that no federal dollars go to the funding of abortion and that you dont care about the lives of those children after their births. …..just sayin
ELVISINTHEHOUSE
March 17th, 2010
10:51 am
Ms tucker,i think you have struck a nerve to the white folk.Now the KKK is about to bombard this column because you mentioned black folk and racism in the same sentence.Its funny where the word racist come from to begin with.If they would have left them black folk alone and all men was really created equal,then racism would’nt even be a factor now would it.Im a white guy and im married to a latino,but when it comes to blacks and any other race for that matter i don’t dislike them because there skin is dark.If your a black person and speak up for what you think is right,you will be cut down with hatred from you fellow white american.white folk love there dogs and cats more than a black person.Its true but they(most whites)will never admit it.
Whatever
March 17th, 2010
10:51 am
@ Peadawg – It is funny that the people who are for the death penalty and support the DENIAL of access to education and healthcare are against a woman making her own decision as to whether to terminate a pregnancy or not.
Trust and believe that if men had to carry children there would be dead babies lining the highways.
Whatever
March 17th, 2010
10:52 am
@ Bill H – Exactly!!
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:53 am
Peadawg
Lawyer Tim. Is that like Plumber Joe?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:56 am
Whatever, for the record I’m against the death penalty. Who are we to decide who lives and who dies?
Beaves
March 17th, 2010
10:57 am
Granny G,
like I said we should have had legal abortion then, then we would not have the issues we have now. I am glad we agree. By the way abortion should not be used for birth control; these people need to learn where babies come from and how to stop it before it happens. What a stupid thought that is…
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:59 am
“By the way abortion should not be used for birth control”
AMEN!
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
11:02 am
Peadawg
and the birth control pill? are you against that as well?
it’s an abortive.
and invitro? what do you feel about tossing frozen embryos in the land fill?
An American
March 17th, 2010
11:02 am
@ Tar and Feather
that was an interesting article. if you haven’t done so already, read A Mother’s Ordeal by Stephen W. Mosher.
as for how you feel about abortion in general, i disagree with you. are you aware that the fourth week after conception that the baby’s heart is beating? at the sixth week the baby starts to move. (mayoclinic website )
i think that the worst part of the abortion debate is that people that are for abortion continually dehumanize the child with terms such as “fetus” and arguments that this is not a human being until he or she takes their first breath outside of the womb. If someone doesn’t want to have the baby, just say so. Let’s not try to obscure what is really taking place with misdirection – the intentional cessation of a human life.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
Beaves
but then we’d still have the issues we did then…..and a number of them sucked.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
hdb…since you agree that abortions should be permitted in some circumstances, then you must agree that the claims this is about “murder”, “life at all cost” and “abortion is wrong always” are not applicable. You concede that choice should be permitted but you want to limit the situations where choice is permitted. So the real discussion should be about when is choice permitted and the pejorative comments are out of place. Perhaps more people should realize that this is not a right or wrong issue but one with nuances and subleties that need to be addressed. It certainly is not a race issue in that it is a “plot against a race” as the original opinion points out.
I hate kids
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
Bill, think of the life Juliana is doomed to have. Her disabilities & health problems are horrendous. And what will happen when she reaches her teens & the hormones kick in? She’ll have to watch her classmates have normal, happy lives & know that will always be barred to her. Imagine if she was your daughter, & every night you heard her bitterly crying herself to sleep & praying for God to strike her dead. How would that make you feel? Yeah yeah, I know, in a perfect world, some wonderful young man will be able to see past her face, but, you see, Bill, we don’t live in a perfect world plus her health problems go way way deeper than her outer appearance. After years of terrible treatment, abuse & discrimination, that poor girl will end up killing herself. Actually, no, scratch that. We live in such a superficial world that some idiot will do the job FOR her.
bob
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
KEEP UP YOUR RIGHT, Ms Palin should have done a better job if she could have. Or perhaps her daughter just chose to do it, irregardless,it is now her responsibility to care for that child period, not yours or mine. I have no issue at all with tax dollars being used for education of our children. Education to me is still the 3 R’s ( convience of our discussion )which along with discipline, responsibilty and accountability kept this nation on course with values and morals. In my view it is NOT the school systems place to teach my child sex education, self responsibility and accountability for their actions regarding sex. I assume you think it is the school systems place to teach sex education to children and if that is correct and you had a daughter in school and the teachers view was it is ok for young people to have sex would you agree with them and tell your child it is ok for her or him to have sex since the teacher said so?
HDB
March 17th, 2010
11:05 am
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
10:43 am
“The problem is that racism STILL exists…..some people wish to IGNORE that fact!!”
You mean the people who don’t see black or white? The people who just sees others as equal human beings? Sad to say not many exist.
‘Dawg, that’s desirable….and I pray for that day to occur; the problem still exists, however…particularly in the South, that minorities are seen as non-existent….particularly with Republicans. Racism between Caucasians and African Americans is less of a factor the farther west I’ve travelled…..but here…in my home town….it’s a perdominant factor..politically, econically, socially…….
Understand about people wanting government out of their lives….but voting for HCR…but it’s needed to ensure that all people have affordable access to health care!!
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
11:05 am
“and the birth control pill? are you against that as well?
it’s an abortive.”
LOL! Please don’t go there. That’s like saying people shouldn’t masturbate.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
11:10 am
Peadawg
well do you?
and i’m not asking about your mastabatory habits…..
fultonrighty
March 17th, 2010
11:10 am
Why are Planned Parenthood’s abortion clinics so handy to the African American community?
HDB
March 17th, 2010
11:12 am
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
hdb…since you agree that abortions should be permitted in some circumstances, then you must agree that the claims this is about “murder”, “life at all cost” and “abortion is wrong always” are not applicable. You concede that choice should be permitted but you want to limit the situations where choice is permitted. So the real discussion should be about when is choice permitted and the pejorative comments are out of place. Perhaps more people should realize that this is not a right or wrong issue but one with nuances and subleties that need to be addressed. It certainly is not a race issue in that it is a “plot against a race” as the original opinion points out.
Can’t disagree with you….abortion is a nuanced situation for those who need it; many people see it in only a life and death issue…infanticide; others see it as a denial of choice. What people need to understand is this:
1) Abortion IS a legal, medical procedure…..protected by law
2) Abortion IS a personal decision, not one that is made by those OUTSIDE of the situation
3) The rate of abortions should be reduced
As a man, I don’t want abortion criminalized…but I do not have the right to determine for a woman what her rights are pertaining to HER body. What people are against is tax-payer funding for abortions. In the majority of cases, I can understand….but there are limited cases where it may occur…and that flexibility should not be denied!!
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:12 am
bob, you missed the point about education. But i fear you will never understand it. But your view on what is taught in our schools about “sex ed” is disturbing. I dont think it is okay to teach children “its okay for you to have sex.” Time for a reality check! In fact, sex ed is about teaching here is what sex is about: STDs, child birth, the risks. It teaches children in a world with sexting and kids not even in their teens having sex about responsibility for their actions. Teachers do not educate that it is okay to have sex. It counters television programming that shows sex without real impact or consequences.
Kamchak
March 17th, 2010
11:12 am
these people need to learn where babies come from and how to stop it before it happens.
Now…if only there were institutions set up, where children could attend five days a week and be instructed in a structured environment–perhaps a series of instruction sessions about health issues….
RACE CARD
March 17th, 2010
11:12 am
Playing the race card is an idiomatic phrase that refers to the act of bringing the issue of race or racism into a debate, perhaps to obfuscate the matter.[citation needed] Playing the race card is amplified in socio-political systems where individuals know they may be formally awarded special access to rights and resources, based upon their membership of a racial group.[citation needed] Race card is a metaphorical reference to card games in which a trump card may be used to gain an advantage.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
11:14 am
kamchack
brilliant!
Malcolm XXX
March 17th, 2010
11:17 am
Black children are hated – by Black society !
Bill Hartzell
March 17th, 2010
11:19 am
Hate kids- I have listened to a child pray at night for God to strike them dead- my youngest son was sodomized at the age of 11 by a family friends son, unbeknownst to my wife or I or our friends until 6 years after it happened. Our son wouldn’t tell us why he wanted God to kill him, only that he wished for it. We told him the same thing any parent who loves their children and God, that God loves them no matter what- they look like, have done, have had done to them, etc., and that God has a plan and a purpose for their life and that what the enemy plans for evil, God will use it for good. If her parents are the good and loving parents that by all appearances they seem to be, they will help Juliana through all of the difficulties that she will face and help her to not be afraid to live her life in spite of her differences and challenges. This what ALL ‘good’ parents do for their children.
DBH
March 17th, 2010
11:20 am
The hypocrisy of pro-abortionists is laughable. They’ll argue until they’re blue in the face that a woman has the so-called “reproductive right” to abort (i.e. “kill”) their unborn child, while at the same time totally glossing over the fact that had they themselves been aborted, they obviously wouldn’t be here to tout such a position.
The same applies to President Obama. The man supports abortion with no exceptions, but has he ever thought for one second that had HIS own mother chosen to abort him, he would not have had the opportunity to achieve the historic accomplishment he did in becoming the first black President of the United States?
Who knows how many other “firsts” are being murdered each day in the name of “reproductive rights”?
Scout
March 17th, 2010
11:21 am
It’s a plot all right but not by liberals or conservatives but by Satan himself ………………..
Ms. Tucker ………. I’m betting you used to sing this ……….. how sad what we do to our unborn children ……………
“Jesus loves the little children,
all the children of the world.
Red and yellow, black and white,
they are precious in His sight.
Jesus loves the little children of the world.”
bob
March 17th, 2010
11:22 am
Keep Up I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what should or should not be taught in a public school instead of a parents home. I do appreciate your view though. Happy St Pattys Day to you and yours!
fultonrighty
March 17th, 2010
11:24 am
In Georgia African American have 57% of the abortions done each year. Nationally 40% of black women’s pregnancies end in aborting the child. Isn’t something racial is going on?
Google “too many aborted” to find a good website about this.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
11:24 am
One of the most frustrating things in arguing against abortion is the people who say, “It’s not your child, why do you care?” That attitude permeates the pro-abortion argument and it’s very distressing that people actually believe that; because if the unborn child is a human life, as anti-abortionists believe, then it is EVERYONE’S concern, just as it is everyone’s concern, or should be, when a child is killed after birth. I don’t know whether the pro-abortion people don’t get that point or just don’t want to get it. I can actually accept as a logical argument if someone says: “It’s not a human life, so it should be legal to kill it.” I disagree with them, but at least it’s a logical argument. That’s a much different argument than, “I think abortion is a bad thing, but it should be everyone’s choice” or “it’s none of your business.” That’s akin to the argument, “I would never own a slave, but I believe slavery should be legal for others.” I don’t expect an answer to this question from very many people, but I’ll ask it anyway: If it could be proven – don’t worry about how it would be proven, but if it could, would you still support legalized abortion?
Peadawg
March 17th, 2010
11:24 am
“Peadawg
well do you?”
You couldn’t gather that my answer is ‘no’ from my response? geeze.
DBH
March 17th, 2010
11:25 am
@ Scout: On the contrary. Ms. Tucker probably sang it this way:
“Jesus loves the little children,
all the children of the world.
Red and yellow, black and white,
But not above a woman’s rights.
Jesus loves the little children of the world.”
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
11:25 am
proven that a fetus is a human life, I meant to say.
TnGelding
March 17th, 2010
11:26 am
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
Sorry to hear that, but enjoy your “vacation.” Give him a big hug from us!
How is the grandchild?
I hate kids
March 17th, 2010
11:26 am
Howe awful about your son, Bill!!! Christian counseling may have helped him. I hope he’s OK now. Juliana’s parents seem to love her, but as someone who had suffered from a disfigurement, NOTHING, but NOTHING will take the place of a normal, love-filled life, if that is what one wants. Luckily, mine was minor & was fixed, all’s cool now, but Juliana’s case is more severe than anything I’ve ever seen or experienced. To tell a girl like that “Yeah, no man will ever look at you without gagging, screaming in horror, etc, but don’t worry, God is there to see you through a lesser type of life” is something I, if in her shoes, would find insulting, demeaning, patronizing & placatory. Luckily, you don’t know what it’s like to be hated, beat up & reviled for something you can’t help & didn’t ask for so it’s a little hard for you to judge???
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:27 am
hdb…I think you are wrong. I appreciate your acceptance of the nuances. Numerous groups are just against abortion completely no matter what. But again, where in the current health bill is there any proposal to use federal dollars to pay for abortion. It is not in there.
But at the same time….. since you acknowledge that a raped 14 girl should not be forced to have that child, does it really make sense to say that she is entitled to an abortion only if she is rich enough to pay to have that choice. If you accept her right to chose, should you not also say that for the victim of rape, if they cannot afford it, the taxpayers will pay for your child or for your abortion.
Is she entitled to heathcare from complications arising from an abortion? Are women permitted to purchase insurance policies that include a right to a medical abortion if the women pay a separate premium for that coverage but federal dollars are used to pay for the portions of the policy that do not cover abortion?
Leigh Roix
March 17th, 2010
11:37 am
I think we’re getting to the point where more rappers are in jail than not – maybe this will be the tipping point and this poor excuse for “music” crap will finally disappear, along with its influence on a certain demographic.
HDB
March 17th, 2010
11:37 am
Keep up the good fight! – I also said that there may be circumstances where under the necessities of health care that the funding may have to come from the federal government!! It’s more of the “abortion on demand” by those who have the capability to pay is what I believe most people are against!!
david wayne osedach
March 17th, 2010
11:40 am
The statstics are alarming. The statistics don’t lie.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:40 am
Bubba…. you mischaracterize the prochoice movement. To accept your premise that a fetus is life and therefore due a right to live simply distorts the argument. We can argue about when does a fetus become life..indeed that is what Justice Brennan discussed in Roe v Wade in his concurrence. But if want to argue a fetus is life (ingoring that you have not defined what is life–a definition that has changed as our medical knowledge has grown) and to be protected, then why are you not for protecting that life after birth. Why should people die from lack of heathcare? from death penalty? why is any death which could have been prevented acceptable?
Many prochoice supporters are not for unlimited abortions just as some who are prolife are not against all abortions. In fact, some prochoice supporters may be more willing to have tighter regulatons on abortions if there were better programs to provide choices, education and options to avoid pregnancy. If you make the argument that no fetus may be aborted, there is an absurdity to argue that society must protect that fetus but at the same time society should not be acting to prevent unwanted pregnancy.
DBH
March 17th, 2010
11:42 am
@ Leigh: While it is true that there are “seemingly” more rappers in jail these days, the problem is that most of them receive only one-year sentences which, unfortunately, isn’t quite long enough to expedite the demise of rap/hip-hop. Longer jail sentences might help in that regard. LOL!
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
11:46 am
Thanks for answering, Keep Up, but it’s you who mischaracterize things. In the first place, how do you know what my stand on health care is? I’ve never weighed in on that subject. And to say I don’t favor protecting life after birth is absurd. Are you saying I support murder?
Pro-Choicer
March 17th, 2010
11:50 am
I’m a pro-choice advocate who doesn’t understand why so many of my peers are so horrified by the death penalty, yet are seemingly unconcerned about the VICTIMS of those who are given the death penalty? That’s like wanting to love, nurture & have compassion for teh 911 terrorists but not for those innocent thousands who died in the attacks.
DJ
March 17th, 2010
11:53 am
What an idiot; does she get paid for this. “social and religious conservatives have been fighting health care reform, which would broaden access to reproductive health care” ..broaden access to reproductive health care is this a code phrase for tapping into an unborn human beings scull with a hammer.
Bill
March 17th, 2010
11:53 am
They’ll never listen Granny. Their SHEEPLE!
Kamchak
March 17th, 2010
11:56 am
Good noon Granny Godzilla.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
11:57 am
Bubba, you felt comfortable enough to assert that there was an “attitude” that permeates the prochoice supporters…….In fact, I have not said you support murder. If you are prolife, I assume you are against murder. But to continue in the consistency of your argument, if you are prolife, then you should be for healthcare to preserve life born and appalled that the millions at risk because of lack of healthcare, you should be against “murder” by death penalty, you should be for social justice that provides for improving the quality of life for those babies born, you should be against all war and a complete pacifist, you should be against guns that kill life. Most prolife supportors do not go that far and in fact, proclaim there are times when some deaths (you can call it murder if you want) are permitted despite a claim that life must be protected. You dont have to weigh in on all these issues. When a dogmatic statement is that all fetuses are life and must be allowed to life…the inevitable consequence follows. If you believe that there are exceptions, then the dogmatic statement must be tossed out as a false starting point. Then real discussion can begin on where those exceptions and nuances fall.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
12:01 pm
Keep Up, of course I’m in favor of health care. Who isn’t? And I’m opposed to the death penalty. Now that that’s out of the way, you must agree with me. Right?
A Time and a Place
March 17th, 2010
12:03 pm
I have a co-worker who’d grown up in foster care & she’s told me stories that literally gave me nightmares. After 18 years of horrific abuse, she “aged” out of the system & was tossed out on her derrierre to live in the streets. Her life prior to that was so awful that this was an improvement! She’s told me quite frankly that she wishes she’d never been born, it’s left such deep scars. And just so y’all know, if I was having a baby & ever found out my husband told the doctor “If it’s a choice between saving my wife & saving the baby, save the baby”, I’d never speak to that SOB again, unless it was through a lawyer!
Blue
March 17th, 2010
12:04 pm
Margaret; did you steal that “continuing to speak truth to power” from the Cynthia McKinney campaign? That was her ‘catch phrase’ as well. And just because someone says it LOUDLY does not mean it is the truth. But I have also thought that both Cynthias were one in the same person!
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
12:14 pm
Bubba…. I can agree that the discussion about where the limits are to legal abortion, to healthcare that includes a right to abortion for those who cannot otherwise afford it and to other programs to prevent unwanted pregnancy including sex ed are needed. That does not mean that I have to agree that the definition of life is conception or even if it is that there are not exceptions to any blanket preclusion of abortion. I agree there are not simple easy soundbite answers but instead a need to discuss the boundaries and limits in a sensible manner…..and to argue that somehow abortion is racism and disguised genocide is oversimplification.
Bubba
March 17th, 2010
12:18 pm
Good post, Keep Up, I agree with some of what you say and agree that the racism argument is BS.
fultonrighty
March 17th, 2010
12:20 pm
What is your explanation for the huge disparity in abortion stats for African American women and Latinas? AA is about double the rate. Latinas probably have much less access to “health care” because of immigration issues. Again, where are the abortion clinics located–Google it for yourself.
Robert
March 17th, 2010
12:21 pm
Like many liberal beliefs, it seems hypocritical to say you are “pro-choice”, but at the same time will deny the unborn child the same right to choose.
Granny Godzilla
March 17th, 2010
12:23 pm
TnGelding
Grandbaby due in late august……#1 is taking a crowd of us to someplace for a 3D ultrasound on what we are calling “GenderQuest2010″ then we’re all doing brunch.
The majority of our family progeny of late has been female so we are hoping for a male for a change of pace.
Paul the Reasonable One
March 17th, 2010
12:25 pm
I find it troubling that you don’t find this troubling. Obviously I’m against abortion, but this skewed percentage is not just coincidence or happenstance.
Can you not see this?
When can you take off your party glasses and step back and view something head on. It should trouble you greatly that blacks are aborted 5 times more in proportion to whites.
Where are the Pharaohs that ordered the murder of all these children?
kab
March 17th, 2010
12:26 pm
as a black woman, i am speechless at ms. tucker’s blindness. i would love to read just one unbiased, column by ms. tucker. even to the detriment of the black community, she is gonna spit the party line no matter what.
Turd Ferguson
March 17th, 2010
12:27 pm
Are you kidding?
Confusing Ms Tucker with McKinney would be like confusing a Porsche with a Yugo, a trip to the ocean with a trip to the cesspool, a 4800 square foot home with an outhouse, a fine cabernet with a fine bottle of “bull of the woods” from the Quiktrip, a dinner at Bones with a dinner at Krystal a ride in a 767 with a ride in a gyro-copter.
Need I say more?
Scout
March 17th, 2010
12:28 pm
DBH:
How sadly true ………………..
J. Morgan
March 17th, 2010
12:28 pm
Let’s remember the more updated and accurate definition of racist:
Racist: 1. Slang: Extremely Disparaging and Offensive term for a white person. 2: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities, if promoted by white people. 3: a belief that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race, if promoted by white people.
kab
March 17th, 2010
12:28 pm
AND THANKS FOR THAT EXCELLENT POINT FULTONRIGHTY. i bet she won’t answer that.
J.
March 17th, 2010
12:46 pm
I think you meant “pogrom.”
I largely agree, but think more education is key. Unplanned pregnancies are endemic across all races, and there’s no excuse for it since contraceptives are freely available at any health department in the state. Unplanned pregnancies or pregnancies by folks who can’t afford children could be prevented if people used their brains and regarded sex for its huge potentialities. Not often enough do people think about the potential consequences of their actions on other human beings, and we don’t have to summon morality or god to understand that.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
12:48 pm
As for statistics, I think you are mistaken to assume that prochoice supporters or Ms. Tucker are not disturbed by any statistic that shows that abortions by one race are much higher than for another. But statistics alone do not prove racism or a plot. Statistics require an analysis for cause and impact. False correlations must be removed or assessed. A disparity shown by a statistic may arise because of economic or eduction disparities or other root causes.
Lucy
March 17th, 2010
12:51 pm
I would be interested in knowing if you wrote about this story on your own or if an editor assigned it to you because of your color?
Billy Peeler
March 17th, 2010
12:59 pm
Doesn’t matter why it’s happened. As Malcolm Gladwell pointed out in “Freakanomics,” the drop in crime is directly traceable to the ready availability of abortion. And it eliminates an enormous number if kids who would otherwise grow up to become nothing more than urban predators. And because the greatest percentage of them would be African-American, their victims would be other African-Americans. So the abortion of these babies is one of the best things that could possibly happen to this country…for Whites and Blacks alike.
Beaves
March 17th, 2010
1:02 pm
Kamchak, I agree if we only had a school system that worked, in fact our guvment is so good and decent job we should let them run health care, they have done so good with the schools, post office and social security.
Kamchak
March 17th, 2010
1:08 pm
Kamchak, I agree if we only had a school system that worked…
And they would efficiently be teaching abstinence only.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
1:08 pm
Keep up@10:38, When you were referring to Palin & said, “If she had taught her daughter right & wrong & morals, maybe even some sex education, then things would have been different,” were you including Obama’s grandmother?
Obama’s father was married to another woman.
The Tar and Feathers Party
March 17th, 2010
1:11 pm
Bubba’s business must be failing, as he is supposedly the boss, yet spends all day wasting time blogging hate. I bet he is a government worker, blogging from his/her/its government office, on a government computer, using a government internet connection. Surely the government IT people are at least trying to trace this obvious abuse and theft of government time and equipment? I will complain to the federal and state agencies in Atlanta, in hopes they catch this thief.
Ruthie
March 17th, 2010
1:14 pm
Frankly, I had thought that at the time Roe was decided, there was concern about population growth and particularly growth in populations that we don’t want to have too many of.
Ruth Bader Ginsburg
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
1:21 pm
Linda….perhaps the sarcasm was lost on you. But if you really want to trot out who may be cheating on who…hmmm… Bob Barr, Newt, Ensign, Mr. Wide-Stance… Yep, I think it safe to say it is human nature.
But then we dont say that cheating shows that their parents were poor parents or failed? SO why do you ignore the comment that my response addressed. If we are going to say that the actions of children reflect the quality of the parenting alone…then yep. Obama’s grandmother must have been bad and so is Salin Palin…Horrible horrible mothers who deserve nothing because their children’s act show the depravity. Make ya feel better now?
Linda
March 17th, 2010
1:22 pm
“We don’t want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population.” 12/19/39 in a letter to Dr. C. Gamble.
“The most merciful thing that a large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it.”
These are quotes by Margaret Sanger, founder of Planned Parenthood, who CT mentioned above & who Obama mentioned in his speech to PP on 7/17/07 on YouTube.
anon
March 17th, 2010
1:22 pm
shellybean, I am forced to pay for wars I don’ agree with in which countless innocent people die. So are many of my fellow American taxpayers. Bob, read the blog, and any other related to abortion/teen pregnancy, etc. – the majority of our society considers birth control, as well as unwanted pregnancy and the resulting children, the woman’s responsibility.
Big Mac
March 17th, 2010
1:25 pm
CT says: “There is no longer even any affirmative action.”
I deal with this quite regularly and whether you are misleading or flat out lying, the fact remains that there are preferences and set asides all over the place… City of Atlanta bids, Fortune 500 diversity goals, university admission preferences, Federal EEOC enforcement of perceived bias solely by statistics….. what the heck are you talking about? Affirmative action is alive and well, though it may not be labeled that way, it certainly is promoted in many ways including laws.
Jeff
March 17th, 2010
1:27 pm
“If conservatives are sincere about curbing abortions — among all women, white, black and brown — they should support efforts to broaden women’s health care, which includes reproductive health care. Easy access to contraceptives would encourage their use, thereby reducing unintended pregnancies — and abortions.”
Of course, the least modicum of personal responsibility & restraint are out of the question, aren’t they?
Linda
March 17th, 2010
1:34 pm
Keep up@1:21, My comment had nothing to do with cheating.
Your comment @ 10:38 implied that Palin’s lack of teaching her daughter may have prevented her from having a child out of wedlock.
Obama is also illegitimate.
I asked you if Obama’s grandmother’s lack of teaching her daughter was equally a failure.
OPINION: Is Abortion A Racist Plot? Of Course Not | News One
March 17th, 2010
1:42 pm
[...] Tucker wrote a good article in the Atlanta Journal Constitution countering the Pro-Life campaign that abortion is Black genocide. Here are some [...]
Steve
March 17th, 2010
1:43 pm
Why does everyone keep shaming and putting down black women? What about the black men that impregnate the women and then dump them? Also, instead of churches having marches against gays what about having marches against having children out of wedlock or sex before marriage? I guess if they did that the churches would not have any more members. I agree, though, with CT. Why all of a sudden is there a big concern for black babies amoungst whites?
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
1:48 pm
Linda…you are absolutely right…..Sanger has been linked to ABCL and may have been a proponent of eugenics….but so what.
Let me point out that Thomas Jefferson owned slaves. Jefferson wrote the Declaration. Obama has read the Declaration of Independence. OMG, Obama is pro-slavery. OMG, the Declaration is really about being pro-slavery. OMG you have a money in your pocket with TJ on it. You must be pro-slavery too! Really the Beck conspiracy idiotacy of linkage without more is absurd.
As for your inane Palin/Obama linkage…again my comment was ironic and completely lost on you. But have fun if you want to say that yes both mothers were equally poor in their motherhood responsibilities…..so how is that working for ya? The point is?
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
1:49 pm
Big Mac, You’re right about one: affirmative action is alive and well in college admissions. City contracting? A little, but not a lot. And there are no quotas anywhere
ctucker
March 17th, 2010
1:50 pm
Lucy, you’re done, honey.
OPINION: Is Abortion A Racist Plot? Of Course Not | Black Info.Net
March 17th, 2010
1:55 pm
[...] Tucker wrote a good article in the Atlanta Journal Constitution countering the Pro-Life campaign that abortion is Black genocide. Here are some [...]
kayaker 71
March 17th, 2010
1:56 pm
Sure, it’s no ones business if I have unprotected sex. That’s essentially true until you come to the part about who pays for it. Our Health and Human Services bills now are the largest of any one item in our budget, in part,due to the results of unprotected sex. We pour billions of dollars down holes in the ground promoting government programs which are supposed to make a difference in this arena but the statistics just get worse. You can be fiercely independent regarding your “rights” to do as you please but please take responsibility for the consequences. It is not someone else’s problem….. it is yours.
Steve
March 17th, 2010
1:59 pm
Linda: Palin,s teenage daughter having a child out of wedlock is a much bigger reflection on her parenting skills than obamas grandmother. Obamas grandmother was from a different time and their was not as much information on the subject as there is now. Palin woefully was negligent with bringing up her daughter.
Paul the Reasonable One
March 17th, 2010
2:03 pm
Ouch. Poor Lucy. Guess she’ll be holding the football for Charley Brown again.
Negro Project
March 17th, 2010
2:16 pm
Yes and her name was Margaret Sanger. Margaret Sanger founded Planned parenthood and was a proponent of eugenics, advocating selective breeding, sterilization and euthanasia. Please (goggle)read about and the Negro Project. Ms. Sanger wrote about what is known as the NEGRO PROJECT and that they should recruit “charismatic black ministers” to encourage black women to practice birth control. Question, why have you never heard of a march or protest by any of the major so-called black leaders against abortion?
Here’s the big lie in the black community. Well,we don’t want these welfare women to have all of these babies that are going to turn into gangbangers and future baby momma’s. A large amount of abortions are by employed educated professional women who’s partners are also educated and employed. The probablity of that child growing up uneducated and into a criminal gangbanger are highly unlikely. A large number of abortions in the black community are merly for convience.
DEATH FOR THE INNOCENT AND LIFE FOR THE GUILTY. I am sadly amused at these liberal groups and their supporters who are pro abortion and against the death penalty. “Anything growing is living. Therefore human life begins when the sperm and egg join and drop into the fallopian tube and the pulsation of life take place. From that point, life may be described differently (as an egg, embryo, fetus, baby, child, teenager, adult), but the essence is the same. The name has changed but the game remains the same”. When it’s all said and done a woman has the right to abort. Outlawing abortions is impractical and to a certain extent unenforceable. However, it is disingenuous to state that it is not a life. Life begins at conception. A woman has the right to choose if SHE WANTS TO MURDER HER UNBORN CHILD. This is the dirty secret that no one (especially black leaders) want to talk about. Add up the multiple abortions by a lot of single childless black professional women. Who have the nerve to turn their nose up and look down on the single baby mommas. Who, I might add, are also having multiple abortions so that they don’t have additional illegitimate babies by multiple baby daddies. And, its easy see how you get to that percentage. While the so called black leaders (civil rights activist, ministers and politicians) who receive large donations from, Planned Parenthood and multiple liberal/women’s rights organizations, remain silent. Every ones at fault. Abortion causes more death in the black community (1,452 PER DAY) than gang violence, hiv/aids, heart disease, and cancer combined. Silence is acceptance. The choice is yours. Please read about Margaret Sanger and the Negro Project.
Big Mac
March 17th, 2010
2:30 pm
CT: “Big Mac, You’re right about one: affirmative action is alive and well in college admissions. City contracting? A little, but not a lot. And there are no quotas anywhere”
I respectfully disagree and suggest you either are uninformed or don’t want to see it. Just one example, the state of GA and all other states and the Federal govt have a certification process for minority business enterprises. What is the point of that if there aren’t preferences dictated in contracting? (and there ARE!). As far as quotas, if a bid specifies that 25% must go to certified minority businesses based on race or the bid is penalized relative to others, are you claiming that is not a quota? Most reasonable people would determine it was and most bidders will comply on that basis. There are HUNDREDS of other examples. Just because you say it isn’t so, doesn’t make it so. I have first hand experience. I also have first hand experience in Fortune 500 diversity goals creating specfic numerical hiring and promotional quotas based on race. There may be good business and cultural arguments for doing so but your claim that this is not affirmative action defies logic.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
2:54 pm
NP….wow glad you made that great case that racism is part of the abortion conspiracy. Especially cogent parts like…..
“This is the dirty secret that no one (especially black leaders) want to talk about. Add up the multiple abortions by a lot of single childless black professional women. Who have the nerve to turn their nose up and look down on the single baby mommas. Who, I might add, are also having multiple abortions so that they don’t have additional illegitimate babies by multiple baby daddies.”
You’re absolutely on point. There is racism in abortion! Your racism shows while you proclaim how this is a racist plot……directly proves C Tuckers point. Now go back to watching the Kardashians…and keep your eye’s peeled for more proof about baby daddies and abortions.
Keith
March 17th, 2010
2:54 pm
Currently, in Georgia, out-of-wedlock births are approximatly 3 times higher among blacks than whites (75% blacks and 27% whites). In some counties across the state of Georgia, the rates are even higher with as many as 85% of all babies are born out-of-wedlock. This is a recipe for disaster. Say what you will, but this has a profound affect on the ability of many blacks to succeed in life. No wonder there are so many poor blacks, black students dropping out of school, higher unemployment rate, higher crime rate, black-on-black crime, etc. Until the black community is willing to seriously address the issue of out-of-wedlock births, then they will never experience real freedom and prosperity. And, no government program is going to fix it. It is time for black leaders to stop pointing fingers at the white community and look in the mirror. There must be greater respect for marriage and the significance of the father’s role in the family. IMO these are seriously lacking within the black community. It may not sound like it but my hearts desire is that all blacks be successful and enjoy the great opporunities available in this country.
Bill Hartzell
March 17th, 2010
2:55 pm
Negro project you are absolutely right on and I agree, it is a womans choice as to have an abortion or not. Sadly, not enough ministers, pastors or preachers are teaching the true word of God. If more people truly believed in God(demonstrated by being in ‘right’ relationship with Him as evidenced by fruit of the spirit) abortions in this country would be a non-issue- they would truly see it as God does and do everything they could to ensure it didn’t happen. I firmly believe that God judges this nation, homosexuality and abortion are the 2 issues that will bring about the same destruction as Sodom and Gomorrah.
Choice News «
March 17th, 2010
3:01 pm
[...] Prize winning journalist Cynthia Tucker of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution provides commentary on the recent anti-choice claim in Georgia that abortions are racially [...]
Brother John of Dallas
March 17th, 2010
3:06 pm
I’m a politically independent African American, and simply because some on the right have jumped on the black child abortion bandwagon for political expediency does not de-legitimize the underlying problem with the disproportionate use of abortions among African American women. It’s easy to lump everyone together into one basket to come to a convenient conclusion for an article, but the fact remains that historically, there have been some very sinister non-blacks who have experimented in various, sophisticated ways to control undesirable populations for their own selfish aims. For anyone to completely discredit that idea shows that perhaps one’s education has deliberately blinded one to think within the box instead of outside the box. There’s an old saying, “know your enemy.” If you turn a blind eye, then it is difficult to know your enemy and overcome his tactics and strategy.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
3:30 pm
Keep up@1:48, Here’s real linkage.
CT posed whether abortion is a racist plot.
PP is the largest abortion mill in the US with a budget of around $1 B per yr., mostly from fed funds. Most of their “services” are abortions, most of their locations are in poor areas & most of their customers are minorities.
PP was founded by a white British progressive who was part of the eugenics movement & who wrote about the extermination of “the Negro population” & “racial purity.”
Obama is a strong proponent of PP & during his speech before them on 7/17/07, he praised Sanger & hung the Supreme Court for their then recent decision to uphold the fed. partial-birth abortion ban.
Obama also appointed as his science czar John Holdren, another proponent of eugenics.
Abortion is legal but Christian, Jewish, Mormon & Islamic religions condemn it as well as sex outside of marriage.
The health care insurance reform bill (which has little to do with health, care, insurance or reform) is Obama’s & the Dems/liberals/progressives signature bill. It’s of such magnitude that it’s become apparent that they will do ANYTHING to get it passed except for 2 things.
It would have been passed many months ago had it not included the mandate that abortion must now be funded by taxpayer dollars, superseding the Hyde amendment from 1977. It’s like forcing religious Americans to pay for murder as well as the gun.
It appears that taxpayer-funded abortion was more important than “health care,” jeopardizing the bill as well as the WH, Senate, House, their political capital & face–both political murder & suicide.
If abortion is a racist plot, it’s by secular Dems/liberals/progressives.
Steve
March 17th, 2010
3:45 pm
Bill: What about the sin of divorce and remarriage? Those things are far more destructive to families than the things you mentioned. Why is it that christians always seem to forget divorce and remarriage.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
3:51 pm
Linda…nice talking point jibberish….where in the bill is the “mandate for abortion” I mean precisely. The exact language. Cause I believe language from the bill to the contrary has been quoted in this very blog today.
Also have to announce the next Secular Dems/liberals/progressive plot meeting is Tuesday at noon. Remember no need to bring birth certificates….we’ll all be makin new ones at the meeting.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
3:54 pm
Steve@1:59, How old are you? I can assure you that unwed pregnancies & children born outside of wedlock in 1961 when Obama was born were much more taboo than they were in 2008 when the Palin baby was born. Women got pregnant in the same way in ‘61 as they do today & had just as much info then as they do now.
The best mother in the world is one who carries a baby to full-term, knowing he or she will be handicapped, & who loves & cares for that child as much or more than their other children. (My father never walked a step in his life.)
I think it’s been hypocritical to condemn Sarah Palin for giving birth to a child, knowing he would be handicapped, her parenting skills for the pregnancy of her daughter & her daughter for having a child out-side of wedlock &, at the same time, ignoring the fact that Obama’s father was not legally married to his mother. If “Palin woefully was negligent,” then Obama’s grandmother woefully was negligent. They weren’t. If Obama’s mother had an abortion, what a waste that would have been.
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
4:09 pm
Keep Up, you have fallacies in all the assumptions you are generalizing with anyone. NO ONE has an argument about people that SHOULD NOT receive health care. BUT-health care is not a right, entitlement, OR cheap.
Preexisting conditions for example, in this-the government wants to deny Insurance Company’s the ability to charge more for someone with a known disease that will cost more.
So-in essence, someone with a condition that will require millions in care, is entitled that coverage for hundreds of dollars a month. Economically speaking, it won’t add up-whether that is private insurance, or a government run health option. The bottom line is, the cost will come elsewhere.
That means higher premiums for everyone because insurance is about dispersing risk. But government will regulate that too…so because it’s costing you more money now, and you are insuring even more people, you won’t make money. You will in fact lose money, if you are a private insurer. So why will you stay in business? You won’t. Which means people will be forced into the government option. BUT-the government isn’t bound by any different laws of economics that the insurance companies are. It’s the ultimate bait and switch-you will pay a lower premium but cover it with higher taxes.
It’s a decision that will force the largest employers in this country to move out of a market, creating more unemployment, and working class people will get less take-home pay due to higher taxes.
The issue is really not that complicated except to people who do not understand basic principles of economics, as well as the concept of health insurance. Insurance does not defer costs, it disperses risks. Saying you are going to force lower premiums does nothing to change the costs. We will all pay for it in one way or another, but we will lose more in the charitable donations that plays a part in health coverage because they won’t feel the need since the “government” will handle it.
There is no argument from anyone that people do not deserve good health care. If you ignore the arguments of those who disagree with this bill under the guise that they are saying people do not deserve health care-then you are ignorant of arguments of both sides.
You don’t understand the difference between deregulating, increasing competition, and true reform to reduce costs for more so that insurance costs/premiums go down. As opposed to government control that says regardless of cost-you have to charge less. Regardless of your individual cost, you will pay similar to everyone else-meaning we all pay more.
When you can understand the business of health care and insurance, then maybe you will be better equipped to make an argument in offering better health care.
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
4:17 pm
BigD…I understand much more than you think. I also see health care abuses like children born with birth defects and denied covered for “pre-existing conditions” A “for profit” system of health care has a number of inconsistencies especitally with CEO’s who make millions in salary. I understand the efficiencies of single payer and public option. I understand consumer law and being certain that consumers get what they pay for. I also understand, as ironically as it may seem that you point this out in an opinion related to abortion and racism, that we as a society do not put to death those who may have ailments and illness and that we already pay through our health care dollars and bankruptcy for the treatment of those who cant afford it. Perhaps when you understand the business of health care and insurance better, then maybe you’ll be better equiped for real argument.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
4:59 pm
Keep up@3:51, Maybe you haven’t heard, but it’s politically incorrect to read bills, even by Congress. Pelosi said we needed to pass the hc bill so we could find out what’s in it. I can’t wait!
The House bill could not pass until the Stupak amendment passed 240-194, after which the House bill passed 220-215.
Henry Waxman reportedly told Bart Stupak, “but we want to pay for abortions” & “but we think we should.”
I do not know & do not care where in the bill the provisions that Stupak, Kildee, Lipinski, Donnelly, Dahlkemper, Driehaus & Berry object to & that Waxman reportedly supports regarding federally-funded abortion. I trust moderate & pro-life Democrats more than I trust liberal/progressives who I know repeatedly lie. If they object, so do I.
If you are calling me a birther, let me also give another Dem credit. If Obama wasn’t born in the US, Hillary would have made that announcement 3 yrs. ago.
Steve
March 17th, 2010
5:04 pm
I wonder if there are any “birthers” posting here. There has to be. LOL!!!!! I cant think of a more moronic group of people than “birthers”.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
5:31 pm
Keep@4:17, Why are you picking on CEOs with health care insurance companies? Don’t the CEOs of all major companies make millions?
Why are you picking on health care insurance companies? Don’t all 68 types of insurance companies make a profit? What about vehicle, hazard & life insurance companies?
Why are you picking on the health care insurance industry which ranks 86th in profits over book publishers (38th), specialty eateries (71st) & home furnishing stores (84th)? Everyone, by law, has a right to health care & a right to buy care insurance, but companies don’t have the rights to make a profit?
Why are you picking on what we spend on health care insurance (less than 5%) rather than what we spend on medicine (10%), doctors (21%), & hospitals (31%)?
I’ll help you answer my questions.
Part of the strategy of this adm for every agenda they have is to create a crisis, an emergency, victims & demons. With cap & trade, the ice caps were melting, the seas were rising, polar bears were dying, all due to our breaths, the science was settled & if you’re a denier, you’re a flatter.
With health care, people without health insurance were dying in the streets & the bad guys were the health care insurers.
Same old, same old.
Linda
March 17th, 2010
5:35 pm
Steve@5:04, Read the last sentence of my post @ 4:59 an inch from your post @ 5:04.
Did you read my post to you @ 3:54?
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
7:05 pm
KeepUp-no, you don’t understand anything compared to what you pretend to in hyperbole. Profit is the basis for which anyone does anything-with the exception of government-and that is because they don’t bankrupt even in the most liberal of fiscal standards.
As far as why interject the argument of understanding the cost and it’s irony here-its because you talk about denying people health care as a Right throughout multiple statements. There is no right to health care. Its a cost-benefit-and you talk about the cost benefit as a pro in using abortions, but you have no clue on cost-benefit in assessing a preexisting condition. That is a warped mindset.
You worry about the baby with birth defects in being offered limited health coverage, or at a higher cost due to known issues, but you were fine with killing that baby, or fetus as you call it a few months before in the name of saving a buck.
FYI-for someone who supposedly knows the health care market, people aren’t flatly denied all health care for preexisting conditions. They are offered either:
A) Limited or Restricted coverage that either caps, has a high deductible, or altogether excludes any coverage that relates to the condition.
B) Denied for specific general plans where their condition would exceed that plans intention.
BUT-that isn’t to say coverage isn’t at all available to them.
The bottom line is, in evaluating costs and entitlements, which is how you view health care-clinical care is not reduced because you control premium rates. That actually increases costs for all.
It is not reduced because you force insurers to carry people with known high costs, or otherwise referred to as preexisting conditions, without them paying hardly anymore. That increases costs for all.
You keep referencing that abortions is not in the bill, and that is correct on it’s face. BUT-subsidies for low-income people to purchase coverage that does cover abortions is. That is a way of hiding it by way of the middle man-or woman.
No one will pretend that our Health Care system cannot be improved upon, and that includes deregulation of Insurance WITH proper oversight. You cannot, however, increase coverage for people who otherwise cannot afford it without decreasing the costs in health coverage. Talking about that coverage as a right of anyone in this discussion is enough to conclude that you are referencing the current health care bill.
Open mouth, insert foot
March 17th, 2010
7:14 pm
Hmmm, let the so-called conservatives tell it and the government shouldn’t be involved in anything. You cry about this health care legislation infringing on your right to “choose” your coverage. No vouchers for schools thus limiting school “choice” for your kids. Taxes, taxes and more taxes, infringing on your “right” to keep your money and do as you see fit with it. But all in the same breath, you want to strip a woman’s RIGHT to CHOOSE what she does with her womb. And you wonder why free-thinking individuals despise you? You wonder why you’re labeled the biggest hypocrites known to man?
Keep up the good fight!
March 17th, 2010
7:17 pm
bd….you really are out of touch with reality. You obviously have no ability to follow the thoughts. You assume 1st that health care is not a right. It may not be but then neither was voting before 1776. So perhaps it is one that should exist as it does in other civilized countries.
Your abortion argument presumes a definition of life and does not do justice to the complications or the inconsistencies of your own cost assessment. You can read for yourself.
You can however with a single payer system provide that everyone has coverage and that costs are fairly distributed. You can however remove the burden on hospitals to “subsidize” those who happen to stumble into their waiting rooms but can afford to pay for services by effectively spreading those costs in an efficient manner and avoiding bankruptcy.
And, as the bill does, subsidize the cost of the policy for the non-abortion services and allow a separate premium to be paid for abortion services.
You apparently do not understand a system that takes your money first and then, after the fact, when a claim is filed finds a “pre-existing condition” or other manner to deny coverage.
Again, your arrogance at presuming you know better than I about health issues is just pure stupidity.
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
7:43 pm
Your example of a preexisting condition, the burden would be on the insurance company to prove you had prior knowledge of the condition when you applied for the coverage. Which in part, would mean you lied on your application for insurance, which in most states and insurance companies, can void your entire policy. Are insurance companies at times unscrupulous on using this item to their benefit? Yes. Are people intentionally deceiving on their application to avoid the disclosure of the condition? Yes. Is the answer to let the government run health care? Only if you are a fool.
To compare us to the other “civilized countries” that afford health care as a subsidized and socialized right-which country would you go to if you needed health care that is recognized as providing the best system in the world? You don’t reform what we have by changing the control, you reform it by lowering cost.
“And, as the bill does, subsidize the cost of the policy for the non-abortion services and allow a separate premium to be paid for abortion services.”
Ever heard of the 1st Amendment? It is one’s religious right to abstain and disagree with the practice of abortion, whether you are pro-choice, or pro-life. That subsidy indirectly removes the choice for all, and takes people’s money to fund a practice that some consider against their religious belief. To force someone to participate in an act which violates their religious belief is a violation of the 1st Amendment, even if the act is only to fund it.
“You can however with a single payer system provide that everyone has coverage and that costs are fairly distributed. You can however remove the burden on hospitals to “subsidize” those who happen to stumble into their waiting rooms but can afford to pay for services by effectively spreading those costs in an efficient manner and avoiding bankruptcy.”
There is no free lunch. We still pay for it. And how do you mean exactly by costs that are fairly distributed? According to Congress and the POTUS, my premiums will go down. How do we interject these people with preexisting conditions and add millions more people into the insurance industry so that it lowers our premiums all the while fairly distributing the costs?
“Again, your arrogance at presuming you know better than I about health issues is just pure stupidity.”
And no, by evidence of your other posts, merely disagreeing with you, and offering facts to back it up is enough for you to consider someone stupid. Maybe the government will offer you subsidized treatment for your God Complex.
Open mouth, insert foot
March 17th, 2010
7:44 pm
NEWSFLASH: The primary beneficiaries of Affirmative Action were WHITE WOMEN.
Shut the hell up about affirmative action and blacks already. It’s old and inaccurate.
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
7:53 pm
“You assume 1st that health care is not a right.”
No more than you assume a fetus is not a living being. Assumptions cut both ways, and because you say Health Care is a right doesn’t make it so.
Health Care requires a doctor. Someone becomes a doctor to make a living. If there is no doctor, or other medical professionals, there is no health care. You cannot guarantee a right which depends on the service of another.
Devil’s advocate says we grant the right to an attorney. In that same right, we state if you cannot afford an attorney-the court will appoint one for you. Does that mean you get to shop for the best paid, or that you even get the best attorney for your predicament. No-that means the government can appoint a general practitioner in some cases to do heart surgery.
They already estimate 1/3rd of Doctors polled will stop practicing medicine due to this legislation. How long will it be before people are getting their government appointed doctors…
Gee….seems like the USSR did this sort of thing back in the day. Great country for those people to live in…
An American
March 17th, 2010
8:16 pm
@ BigDawg…I agree wholeheartedly with you. Keep up the good work!
Linda
March 17th, 2010
8:28 pm
Open mouth@7:14,
* Conservatives aren’t anarchists. We believe in limited fed. govt. & in states’ rights. The fed. govt. spends every penny it taxes & what money it can’t tax, it borrows. What it can’t borrow, it prints.
* When the hc debate started a yr. ago, 85% of Americans had hc insurance & 95% of those were happy with it. Of the 46 M uninsured, 14 M are already eligible for CHIP & Medicaid, at least 10 M are illegal aliens & 18 M are under the age of 34 & probably choose not to buy it. Rather than tweeking the best hc system in the world, the Dems, have to have a complete overhaul & govt. takeover that the vast majority of Americans oppose, to accommodate 2 M people, at the same time increasing mandates on employers & our youth. Whose rights are being infringed upon?
* It’s the Dems who are denying school vouchers for the same reason that it was illegal to teach slaves to read.
* Progressives believe in a intellectual hierarchy that gets to decide what is best for us “uninformed” masses & believe they know what is best for us, including how to spend our money. They don’t. They believe our taxes are their piggy-banks. They aren’t.
* According to our Declaration of Independence, all our rights come from God, not the govt. There is but one God, whether you believe in the teachings of Christianity, Jewish, Mormon or Islam. God does not give the right of abortion.
May God bless you.
not a CT fan
March 17th, 2010
10:56 pm
I think reducing the number of AA babies was an argument for abortion, but the main reason most ‘pro-choicers’ support abortion is money. It’s a lucrative business for those who provide it and it’s a cost savings for the mother who does not want to support her child.
I think that the reason most abortion clinics are in poor neighborhoods is because it may be cheaper to operate there and the zoning laws may be more relaxed. Also may be due to the fact that poor people may not have transportation and the service is more readily available for them.
Did you know Obama and his lovely wife, Michelle, both support partial birth abortion?
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 17th, 2010
11:01 pm
KeepUpTheGoodWork said,”I also see health care abuses like children born with birth defects and denied covered for “pre-existing conditions”
A little quid pro quo-feel free include an example of such a thing happening. A short bit of research of a few state laws state that this is illegal to do so.
Newborns are not under the notion of getting their own health coverage, seeing as they fall in under dependent care. And, according to Illinois state law for example, a newborn cannot be denied health coverage for a preexisting condition so long as they are added to their primary’s carrier policy within 30 days.
As I said, you make arguments with false hyperbole.
George
March 18th, 2010
10:40 am
Will the white anti-abortionist who call pro-abortion groups racist adopt a black child and take them into their white neighborhoods? If they do, they are genuine. If they dont they are as RACIST as the pro-abortion groups.
Matthew Matuse
March 18th, 2010
11:50 am
Ms. Tucker’s article on abortion is forcing me to respond. She asks two questions. Are”racist persuading black women to have abortions?” Think about it. Out of all the abortionist/pro-choicer out there pushing women to do this, some will be racist. So yes. Look at the roots. Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood, who is no longer alive, was a racist. If Ms. Tucker thinks that spirit died with Ms. Sanger, then God bless her. Abortion is offensive on many levels and to ignore the racist element of the practice is naive. Abortions sole purpose is not inherently or entirely racist. Abortionist are equal opportunity life terminators. Although not in the scope of Ms. Tucker’s article, abortionist target young girls, which is why the “clinics” are located near high school and college campuses.
She goes on to ask if there is “some group of grim executioners looking to carry out a shadowy genocide?” Yes! Most definitely! Yes!
BigDawgEatsAlot
March 18th, 2010
12:34 pm
“Abortion is offensive on many levels and to ignore the racist element of the practice is naive. Abortions sole purpose is not inherently or entirely racist. Abortionist are equal opportunity life terminators. Although not in the scope of Ms. Tucker’s article, abortionist target young girls, which is why the “clinics” are located near high school and college campuses.”
Matthew-we cannot take statistics of an argument, or the viewpoints of a single person and characterize it as racist or racism. Well, we can, as Mark Twain said, there are 3 types of lies in this world: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
No one is recruiting black females to become pregnant and then have an abortion. No one is recruiting those who are pregnant to have an abortion. It comes down to who plays the support and guidance role for people who choose to have abortions.
Most I doubt their decision is based upon advice given by a random acquaintance whom they just met at _____ organization. Abortion isn’t an easy choice to make, even for some who choose it. If they are relying on that random support for their chief guidance, therein lies a cultural problem for why they are not relying on family, friends, or spiritual guidance if they are religious.
To imply the system is racist, and basing it off the opinions of a single person, or implying a conspiracy like theory that white people are using it as a legal form of genocide is ludicrous when your sole argument is on statistics. Especially when you only look at the statistics and evaluate it from a quantitative perspective based on race.
With the given data that you are basing your judgments on, the inverse would have to be true. Meaning, if most abortion candidates were white female, it would imply a racist motivation against whites. There is just no facts that corroborate that argument.
Not everything that happens to you is because of race. And oh yea, if a black female does not want to get an abortion, no one is making her.
Billy Peeler
March 21st, 2010
11:34 pm
CT says: “And there are no quotas anywhere”
You’re absolutely correct, Cynthia. Quotas…which are a certain minimum number of minorities that MUST be met…have been outlawed.
Instead, our universities now want to have “critical mass” in their enrollment. Which refers to a certain minimum number of minorities that must be met….uh….never mind.
We’d respect Affirmative Action a hell of a lot more if the proponents weren’t such hypocrites about it. Just tell us we need quotas, and let’s quit trying to bamboozle everybody about it.
Art Vandelay
March 22nd, 2010
4:52 pm
I think you miss a critical point CT. You don’t need to be comparing the rates between white and black but black and brown. This is really more a question of political genocide. The massive influx of hipanics (legal and illegal) and their birth rates are a serious threat to black political power. It is a mistake to believe that the black and hispanic political agenda’s are the same. They are in direct competition with each other. Hispanics almost never end an “unintended pregnancy.” Black leaders need to wake up and understand this threat.
Zoe
March 28th, 2010
9:31 am
IPPF is a racist organisation! They hate white people which is why they predominantly put abortion clinics in black areas. They love black people and provide this wonderful service for them. It is exactly the same as Hitler, he loved the Jews and hated German women which is why he denied German women abortions and only provided abortions for the Jews and others that he loved. So there is a lot in common between the generous IPPF and the beautiful Nazis
Zoe
Eugenic founding organization gives awards to journalists who hide their agenda « Saynsumthn’s Blog
July 19th, 2010
3:58 pm
[...] recipient is Cynthia Tucker who wrote an article in the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, entitled: “Is Abortion a Racist Plot? Of Course Not” . This article , doing the bidding of Planned Parenthood, was clearly written in my opinion, to [...]