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Cynthia Tucker

Giuliani isn’t hobbled by consistency on terrorists

3:28 pm November 18, 2009, by ctucker

Testifying before the Senate today, Attorney General Eric Holder declared, ““I’m not scared of what Khalid Sheikh Mohammed will have to say at trial — and no one else needs to be either.”

He’s right, of course. It’s a position that former prosecutor Rudy Giuliani used to hold about trying terrorists in civilian courts. Back in 2006, he spoke highly of the decision to prosecute Zacarias Moussaoui in Virginia, even when the jury refused to sentence Moussaoui to death. Here’s what Giuliani had to say on Chris Matthews’ Hardball:

I testified in the penalty phase of the trial.  And it was much more difficult than I thought it would be, reviewing all that, going over it, seeing the films of it.

And, you know, obviously I‘m personally involved in this, but I would have preferred a different verdict.  But it does show that we have a legal system, that we follow it, that we respect it.  And it is exactly what is missing in the parts of the world or a lot of the parts of the world that are breeding terrorism.

So maybe there is something good that can come out of this in showing these people that—at least showing the ones that have any kind of an open mind that we are a free society, a lawful society, a decent society, that we have respect for people‘s rights and that we can have disagreements about whether the death penalty should be imposed on somebody like Moussaoui.

I think it should have been.  I‘ve been a lawyer more of my life than anything else.  And I respect a jury‘s verdict.  I sat in front of this jury for about three or four hours.  They look like very, very careful and very decent people.  And I am sure they did the best they could.

In other words, Giuliani was for the civilian prosecutions of accused terrorists before he was against them.

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42 comments Add your comment

Carter is a Fool

November 18th, 2009
3:55 pm

Where is the racial angle to this opinion? Everything has a racial angle because we are all racists. Citing Chris Mathews who has tingles all up and down his leg when Presbo speaks is not a really good source for information. He is a leftist hack, wait so are the opinions expressed in this column.

The bigger issue is that terrorism is now not an act of war, but it is a police action. Enemy combatants are tried in military tribunals according to the military codes. This terrorist is not a citizen or even a resident alien, but we are about to afford him the rights and protections of a citizen in court. This is just WRONG.

Carter is a Fool

November 18th, 2009
3:56 pm

First, YEAH.

Peadawg

November 18th, 2009
4:00 pm

2 blogs in a row that AREN’T about race. Wow Cynthia!!! Keep up the good work.

eddy

November 18th, 2009
4:32 pm

Please explain to me why is KSM being treated as if he is a citizen….oh I get it now ’cause Obama and his “band of brothas” say so. With that same logic applied, why do we have immigration laws and an orderly legal process to follow….guess they’ll be abolished “cause Obama says so and now with the one fell swoop, all illegals are now citizens and entitled to anything and everything. “You ‘no I won” thus spake Obama.

Carter is a Fool

November 18th, 2009
4:47 pm

If he is tried in Federal court, then he has to be given the Miranda warning which are the rights given to citizens and residents. He has to have counsel paid for by the taxpayer. The rules of evidence apply (as the were drawn to protect residents and citizens). Also all it takes is one loony death penalty non-believer to lie and get on the jury and he will be spending the rest of his life in prison (such as Moussaoui).

No THANKS. This also means that this now a police action and not a war crime. A huge difference.

Carter is a Fool

November 18th, 2009
4:49 pm

I found the race angle — Holder says it is so. Obama says it is so. They are Black. Giuliani says it is not so. He is white. He disagrees with them because they are black. Therefore he is wrong and a racist.

Got it. A little more subtle than usual Sinthia.

mike

November 18th, 2009
5:12 pm

LOL. Tucker talking about anyone’s inconsistency is so laughable. She defines the term.

Chris Broe

November 18th, 2009
5:12 pm

I wonder how comforting it is to the families of 911 victims that commenters on this blog are more concerned with the symantical texture of a label (terrorism vs criminality) than in destroying Al Queda and killing Osama Bin Laden.

Dick Cheney didn’t dither when he countermanded the order to attack Al Queda in 2002. Rummy didn’t dither when he stood like a stone wall, refusing to to attack simply because the CIA was in charge. (PBS Documentary)

I’m not concerned where Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is tried. So what. Bush isn’t concerned where Osama Bin Laden hides.

Bush said to the world, “I’m not concerned where OBL is.”

Well the families of the victims of 911 are very concerned.

Mark

November 18th, 2009
5:27 pm

Isn’t it interesting how some people were so adamant that the Geneva Conventions, which deal with war crimes, did not apply to captured terrorists, because they were not regular military. Now the same people claim the terrorists cannot be tried in civilain coutrts, because what they did was a war crime.

El Jefe

November 18th, 2009
6:02 pm

Cynthia, you’re ignorance is showing – AGAIN.

Zacarias Moussaoui was arrested and charged in the United States. He was not an illegal combatant, he was initially arrested on immigration charges.

KSM was captured by the Pakistanis during an armed conflict. They should not have turned him over alive.

Using Holders logic or lack thereof, the Nazi leadership would have been brought to the US and tried in Federal Court instead of a Tribunal in Nuremberg.

TnGelding

November 18th, 2009
6:05 pm

Just the usual hyprocrisy played by all politicians. I’m certainly conflicted on the issue. Can we even afford it? Let ‘em rot in jail awaiting trial. They wouldn’t be the first.

Road Scholar

November 18th, 2009
6:12 pm

What country did KSM represent? I didn’t ask what group did he represent. Aren’t acts or declarations of war between countries (omitting the war on drugs- that’s a whole different blog)?
Everone is in a tizzy because they just want to shoot him, but aren’t his and others acts against the people of the US?

jconservative

November 18th, 2009
6:48 pm

“Citing Chris Mathews who has tingles all up and down his leg when Presbo speaks is not a really good source for information.”

You do understand that Giulani was speaking live on Matthews show and actually said what he said? You do understand that, correct?

You also probably do not know that VP Cheney speaking before the AEI said that Al Quaeda were not military, were not subject to the Geneva Convention & should not be tried by military courts. You do remmber that, correct?

Moral to the story: politics & the wind change directions and so do political opinions.

jconservative

November 18th, 2009
6:54 pm

El Jefe – {”KSM was captured by the Pakistanis during an armed conflict.”

Wrong. KSM was hiding out in Pakistan in what he thought was a safe house. US operatives had a tip on his location & asked the Pakistanis to pick him up. They did, turned him over to the US authorities who then took him to an unidentified location.

Mark at 5:27 pm is basically 100% correct.

Just because

November 18th, 2009
6:59 pm

I guess Cynthia has forgotten how Obama said one thing when he was running for office (i.e., transparency, posting legislation on-line for folks to read before Congress voted on it, getting rid of all the pork in bills, etc.) but doing whatevery he wants once he is elected. So Obama was for change before he was against it!!

jconservative

November 18th, 2009
7:07 pm

Declaring “war” is a legal term. “War” on drugs is just an advertising slogan. War must be declared again another country per US law. This is what has made the “War on Terror” so difficult legally. That is why the Bush 43 & now the Obama lawyer types are turning themselves inside-out.

If it is a “real” war then the Geneva Convention applies since we keep signing the thing. But legally it cannot be a war because Al Quaeda is not a “country”. If we try them in military tribunals that makes them “military prisoners” subject the the Convention. And if they are “prisoners of war” then we can’t legally turn the screws when we interrogate them.

Anyone ever read Joseph Heller’s “Catch-22″?

fitzgerald

November 18th, 2009
8:40 pm

Catch-22 is a real brain teaser. May another terrorist attack never be showered on New York city or any other location. However, I am afraid that this is going to happen on Obama’s watch. Then what?

Joan

November 18th, 2009
10:00 pm

The best thing that can happen here is that their plane up to New York goes down–preferably into a hog pen.

Joan

November 18th, 2009
10:02 pm

The best thing that can happen here is that their plane goes down on the way to New York–preferably into a hog pen.

Del

November 18th, 2009
10:12 pm

Please this is just Obama and Holders stupid strategy of trying to dumb down the American people by bringing this scum to trial in a civilian court where they can put the Bush administration on trial instead of terrorists. This of course is designed to divert the public’s attention away from Obama’s intrinsic incompetency. It would be humerus if it wasn’t so serious.

mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the LIAR Obama

November 18th, 2009
11:01 pm

Let’s talk about flip/flops shall we!

• Obama entered office, vowing he would do what George W. Bush had not: lead the world to a global climate accord.
• Pass the stimulus bill and unemployment won’t go above 9.2%, it’s now 10.2%
• Recipients of federal stimulus dollars have overstated the number of jobs created or saved in GA by more than 1,500, according to an AJC analysis of public records
• Quote: “I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war….You can take that to the bank!”
• Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac need $30 BILLION more taxpayer dollars
• Health Care reform by Labor Day, Oct, Christmas, end of the year, NOT
• the White House is NOT for sale
• Transparency
• bipartisan support
• close Gitmo
• Timmy the TAX CHEAT Geitner
• ACORN
• find Osama bin Laden
• NO lobbyist on the White House staff
• all bills put on line so the public can read them first
• no tax increase for anyone making less than $250K
• and on, and on, and on……let’s say it again, mmm, mmm, mmm Barack the LIAR Obama

mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the LIAR Obama

November 18th, 2009
11:34 pm

HEADLINE SHOULD BE: Tucker isn’t hobbled by consistency from the Liar in Chief

Sunshine and Thunder

November 19th, 2009
2:32 am

Is this some feedble attempt at stabbing us Republicans with a Giuliani bayonet? Forget it. We don’t care. He was also FOR gun control before he was AGAINST it. He’s a finger sucking Republican who can’t make up his mind if he’s really a liberal. Nobody cares about Rudy. Not nobody, not no how.

TnGelding

November 19th, 2009
5:42 am

mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the LIAR Obama

November 18th, 2009
11:34 pm

Liar, liar, pants on fire! Good grief!

All the way

November 19th, 2009
6:14 am

It’s a sure sign that Tucker can’t defend the irresponsible decision to try KSM in New York in civil court when she can only attack someone else. No defense from Tuck on the risk, the cost, the propaganda value for our enemes. No defense from Tuck on the amount of classifiend data that will be publically revealed in the trial. No defense from Tuck on pursuing terrorism as a police matter and giving foriegn nationals constitutional rights. Not even any explanation for how we can kill terrorists with predators but must try them in court if they are caught.
She has become an empty suit.

Bob

November 19th, 2009
6:18 am

Why bring up people that have no role. Obama clearly stated in 06 that he would have military tribunals for KSM and others, now he dosen’t. That is where we need to be consistant Cynthia, at the level where decisions are made.

Dave

November 19th, 2009
6:19 am

Ms. Tucker, it must be very lonely in that empty building up there in D.C,, I would think with all that time on your hands and no one to talk to, you could do a better job getting the facts. How about to start with, if you’d wanted to be “fair and balanced” you could have pointed out that Mr. Obama too changed his mind regarding the venue this scum should be tried in. No, this is about using Mr. Bush as the fall guy, hoping folks will not notice the many failures of this administration. One day soon the Intern President will be held accountable for his growing list of failures. You can ignore them but the majority of the American people will not.

ck Hall

November 19th, 2009
7:03 am

Holder needs to get his pesonal tax mess corrected before trying to be a law man! Also Read my lips—-These show trials in NY will lead to Obama’s Waterloo..Sayonara Mr Pres. on this one.

Scott

November 19th, 2009
7:23 am

Has anybody realized that before Holder was Atty General, he used to work for the lawfirm, Convington and Buring, that was trying to get these terrorists rights and tried in American courts? Doesn’t anybody see a conflict of interest here? This whole thing is shady from the POTUS on down. I can already picture the courtroom now. Obama is going to drag everybody from the Bush Admin into the courtroom and question them in a case that is going to be a colossal waste of time. The saddest part is this Admin has proven to be inept in handling pretty much anything, that these scumbags will end up getting off on some sort of technicality. Of course, Cythnia will be ecstatic when that happens but she will also find a way to blame Republicans and white people for the verdict.

axelrod's email

November 19th, 2009
7:25 am

Rudy just confirmed on TV that David Axelrod put out Cynthia’s talking points over the weekend. Must be nice to have a direct hook-up, huh Cynthia?

Scott

November 19th, 2009
7:28 am

CK, that can be pretty much said for all of the Dems. The only reason why they don’t mind taxes being raised to pay for their wreckless spending is because they don’t pay taxes themselves. Think of all of the appointees that Obama put forth only to pull back, think of all of the Congresspeople that are “under investigation.” We all know that with this admin. that investigation amounts to taking a couple of statements and then slapping on them on their wrist after saying “Next time be more careful when you commit your fraud.” If anybody else did half of the fraud they commit, we would be in jail for many, many years to come. Their robbery isn’t much worse that Madoff’s crime in my book. They just do it with taxpayers dollars, of which they contribute nothing to the pot.

mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack the LIAR Obama

November 19th, 2009
8:04 am

Liar, Liar pants on fire?….how adult you are. Gelding fits you perfectly!

DAVID

November 19th, 2009
8:14 am

CYNTHIA…..you are still a clueless…..moron.

Spare the rod...spoil the child

November 19th, 2009
8:24 am

It’s pretty obvious that a lot of republicans are spoiled children posing as adults. Look at all the
petty, mindless comments they post daily. Like spoiled little children who didn’t get their way, they throw their daily temper tantrums.
Oh, the RACE ANGLE ? Take a look in the mirror if you’re looking for the one obsessed with race,
crybaby republicans….STFU, before us adults bend you over our collective knee !!

ken ross

November 19th, 2009
8:29 am

Why didn’t we send thousands of police to fight in Afghanistan instead of soldiers if you really believe that this is a police action and that we are not at war? This is an insult to our troops who are dying over there so that people like Obama & Holder can make a mockery of our country.
This is the worst President I have seen in my 66 years on this planet, and I have seen a few.

Gregg

November 19th, 2009
8:35 am

It ammazes me how ignorant some people can be! Do you any of you realize that he IS being tried for 9/11. He is being tried for masterminding the attacks on the towers. He is being tried for hijacking two planes and crashing them into the twin towers. He is not being tried for any war crimes. There is a difference or do you not understand the difference.
Stop allowing people to tell you what to think and think for yourselves. He is being charged for hijacking planes (a federal offense) and using the to commit mass murders. Tell me where in your infintile minds is there a war crime comitted. Again attack the facts and not me. Just explain it to me why he is any different than Timothy McVeigh or the you hijacker of the ships off the coast of Africa?

Gregg

November 19th, 2009
8:38 am

@ ken ross What he did preceded everything else. This was the precursor to the war and not the actual war. In your 66 years did you learn the difference? Have you ever served in the military and understand why he cannot be tried by the military? He cannot be tried by a military for a civilian act of terrorism AGAINST civilians.

bob

November 19th, 2009
9:15 am

Gregg, Obama gave a speech in the Senate in 2006 clearly stating KSM and others should get tried by the military, why was he so ignorant ? Wasn’t an individual that died at the pentagon a military person ?

bob

November 19th, 2009
9:30 am

Gregg, I was right, not all victims were civilians, you are ignorant. And it “ammazes” me when someone calls others ignorant and mispells amazes.

Gregg

November 19th, 2009
9:56 am

@ bob, I agree with you that at the time he was ignorant of the facts. I think it may have been made clear to him by the Military and other leaders that this action was not feasible. I think he should be tried where he did his damage.
And sorry for misspelling a word. I am sure you are so perfect that you don’t make mistakes. You are probably sooo rich because you have never made any mistakes in life. Again, What was used? A commercial airline (hijacking is a federal offense not military) was used to commit these crimes. Why was McVeigh not tried in a military tribunal?
And the question should be, “wasn’t the individual that died” so easy to do huh? Attack the substance of the argument.

don_Gabacho

November 19th, 2009
2:48 pm

Georgia

“What could Holder possibly be thinking?” That, while prosecuting the 9/11 defendents, no one will bring him to task for failing to investigate and prosecute the Mexican Government for registering voters for U.S. elections — as the Chief of Staff of the U.S. DOJ’s Civil Rights Division was notified last July 4th with full proofs soon following.

Scott

November 19th, 2009
4:43 pm

Gregg, where are the Cole bomber tried? Military tribunals. Why? Because they attacked a military asset and they were caught outside of US borders. So……what exactly is the PENTAGON!!!! If that isn’t a military asset, I don’t know what is. THAT is why they should be treated as war criminals. They attacked our heart and soul of our military operations. Check and Mate.