Spreading swine flu to avoid going broke

Stop the presses, Cindy Lou has taken another thinly veiled jab at the Republicans. If you get off your butt and work you must hate American, becuase you are going to spread the flu……..Everybody runnnnnnnn.

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No company, no where, wants their workers to come to work with swine flu.

So, the only issue here is those that need to come to work for the money. If one is so tight with their finances that they can’t afford to miss a couple of days of work, then they are playing their finances too close. Build an emergency fund by avoiding the $100 sneakers, cable TV, and car that is too expensive for their budget. But we know that those don’t have a budget, don’t we. So, this failure to plan is now our problem, somehow.

I am thinking that we need to invest 1.2 trillion dollars in healthcare reform to fix it. NOT!

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Same tired BS from the same cast of usual suspects. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Heard it. Read the book, saw the play, the movie and the sequels. Goes like this:

“Cindy’s” a pinko, (if I mock her with a silly little-girl name, she must not have any cogent argument. Umm – nice try.)…
Sick people must be careless, irresponsible, blah, blah, blah. If they were solid, white hard-working “productive” Christian citizens as God intended, they’d have the sense not to be sick, not to “be in a position” to be sick.
Got cancer? Too freakin’ bad, commie! You should’ve eaten more cruciferous vegetables! And oh, you want healthcare? S—-w you, you pathetic, undeserving liberal trash! So you got old, sick, hurt, who cares – why’s it my problem? Why should I help the likes of YOU?

Final judgement before God’s going to be so fun for you tighty-righties.
Good luck.

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Life isn’t fair Cynthis. The sooner you get that through your thick skull, the better off you will be.

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Diluting the Deluded GOP’s Koolaid

What happens if a doctor, dispensing the swine flu vaccine, comes down with the swine flu? Is he supposed to call in sick? Or is he supposed to be a good republican and spread it to every single person he vaccinates? As long as he’s in a gerrymandered republican district…..yes, (and the infected doctor should also pee in their Koolaid).

Refounding Father Glenn Beck has fallen just short of calling for secession. Yesterday he indicated that the GOP should start “building an ark”. His argument was based on Koolaid, which itself was based on false Rx data-spin. Beck claimed that in 1970, the USA spent $1500 per person on healthcare, and with Rx reform it will spend $8400 per person today. Well guess what? $8400 equals $1500 in 1970 inflated dollars. There’s been no increase if you discount inflation.

The world war two dollar is worth only 7 cents today. Did you know that?

If you get the swine flu, people, you should rest, drink plenty of liquids, and Pee in the GOP Koolaid.

Jklol (dont try any of this comment’s metaphorical advice at home, kids)

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Ctucker…

I guess it depends on ones definition of “promote the general welfare”. The founding fathers surely were not intending to promote a “welfare state”? Or were they?

Your counter-counter point makes sense as does the infinite argument presented…kinda like the dog chasing its tail.

When is your next appearance on This Week with George?

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For a graph of the number of confirmed swine flu cases in the US & World (as reported by the CDC & WHO), check out:
http://www.peterdolph.com/2009/10/how-many-swine-flu-cases-are-there.html

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A dreadful aside issue:
Could those who knowingly and willfully spread an infectious disease be held civilly and criminally liable? Consider this as irresponsible behavior, not in the promotion of the general welfare, much like drunk driving.

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As an athiest, I have to agree with most of the comments here. We owe nothing to other people, and if they come in sick that’s their problem. My company owes nothing to the “general welfare”- only to our customers. What’s good for me is good for me- if everyone had that idea we would get rid of a lot of these high taxes and welfare cases that hold down those who are out to make a living due to a mis-placed feeling of responsiblity to the poor.

We owe the poor nothing, and if they die off, there is then more for everyone else, not less.

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Kamchak,

You must hae gone to school in Georgia.

Have you even read the Constitution or the Fedralist papers?

Article I,
Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Okay, what is the general welfare?

In the next few sentences it describes what Congress can do for the General Welfare.

The powers are few and explicit.

And at the end, is the key sentence.

To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.

Get your head out of the lefties kool-aid and try learning something.

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I did not mention swine flu. It does not matter. Customer based point of service positions do not work at home: restaurants/fast food, auto parts and repair, department stores, manufacturing/fabrication, and so on.

So, if one becomes ill from a trip to any of the above, who’s liable? The infected employee(s), or the employer who allowed/forced/coerced them into the work place, knowing they were infected?

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Indeed, Kamchak, their ignorance did not prevent the FF’s from recognizing the importance of science to the promotion of the general welfare.
From Article I, Section 8: “To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries”

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Cynthia isn’t allowing links so without the link:

You can google for Nothing to Fear But the Flu Itself NY Times to see a great Q&A:

Studies from CDC, NIAID, and other tertiary centers show that after patients are asymptomatic they can shed the virus from 7-14 days. That does not equate directly to contagion for that exact period of time, but certainly there is a period of time after symptoms are gone when people can spread H1N1 flu.

This is being largely disregarded by everyone, and I’m not sure we can measure the clinical consequences. The more people vaccinated, the more everyone is protected.

Figures will be interesting. Right now it appears that overall, despite lines in some counties Georgia has had an extremely low turnout. I don’t know about DC where Cynthia now lives.

Pregnant women are 6 X more likely to contract H1N1, and 4 new studies including one from Yale, suggest vaccination of pregnant women confers protection for the babies, and they are hospitalized less.

My experience is schools in Atlanta despite the bureaucracy of people with titles connected to H1N1 are doing next to nothing at this point, and the word for parents is insouciance or indifference. The turnout at Fulton’s clinics has been about 15% or a little less of their 5300 doses of Medimmune nasal mist appropriate for age 2-49 if not pregnant or immunosuppressed, or with significant illness.

Please get vaccinated if you haven’t.

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Thank you PODS! My liability posturing has more to do with complacency and the conflict between public responsibility and individual freedom than legality.

Public health and public works infrastructures have produced a nearly disease free environment for most people, leading to complacency and the notion that disease, illness and injury are someone else’s problem.

Amazingly, many posters here, appear divorced and isolated from any social reality and responsibility, and at the same time referring to the US Constitution as something other than a social contract.

The notion that a pandemic infectious disease is “hype” is promoted by those who are apprehensive of constraints on individual freedoms. But are they willing to take the risk? If yea, are they willing to take responsibility for putting others at risk?

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It is funny that folks like Cynthia get all up in arms when anyone says that some liberals are “socialists”. Then they go and write screeds like this against “capitalism”. Give me a break.

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TV Media reports 4300 of Fulton’s 5300 vaccine used now. If so that’s amazing incremental activity from a week ago where 700/5300 doses were used. That would be from 13.2% to 85% all of a sudden in the past week. I seriously doubt the figures, but it’d be great if they were true.

I polled 30 teachers at a well respected magnet school in Atlanta and the response of all 30 was that they were not getting vaccinated because of side effects. What that says to me is that teachers who are supposed to be curious and supposed to encourage students to dig out facts are too lazy to read any information whatsoever and remain totally ignorant as to vaccination.

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In a new survey, conducted by Harvard School of Public Health, 60 percent of adults said they will not get vaccinated. That includes their children or children in their care if the biological parents aren’t present.

The good news is that for the first time in more than 50 years we’ve made a vaccine against a pandemic strain of influenza before the onset of winter, when lower temperatures and humidity allow the virus to spread more easily.

In a study in the November 4 Journal of the American Medical Association, there is a distressing ignorance among some health care workers who are refusing vaccination, and in my opinion, it should be written into their contrzcts manditorily. Just as a nurse wouldn’t be trained to stab a patient in the carotid artery, a nurse or physician should be trained as to the value of vaccines and it should be a job requirment but CDC, DHS, HHS are not making it mandatory. That will be a big mistake if the H1N1 Type A strain mutates.

SWINE FLU VACCINE IS UNSAFE The H1N1 virus revealed itself too late for it to be included in this year’s seasonal flu vaccine. But the H1N1-specific vaccine was manufactured in the same way as the regular vaccine: The shot form is made by growing the virus in hen’s eggs, purifying it and then treating it with a chemical that inactivates it. This technology has been used to make influenza vaccines for 60 years, and it has an excellent safety record. The nasal spray form is made by adapting the virus to temperatures below those typically found in the body. This allows it to reproduce in the relatively cool lining of the nose, but not in the lungs where it could cause harm. This technology has been used safely for more than 30 years. FluMist, a seasonal flu vaccine used since 2003, is made the same way.

THE VACCINE IS UNTESTED The H1N1 vaccine has already been given to thousands of volunteers to determine whether it could protect them from the virus and to make sure that it caused no adverse reactions. Only then did the Food and Drug Administration license it.

THE VACCINE CONTAINS A DANGEROUS ADJUVANT Some vaccines, like the hepatitis B and human papillomavirus vaccines, have substances called adjuvants, which are added to enhance the immune response, so that smaller quantities of vaccine can be given. Some people fear that the H1N1 vaccine contains, in particular, squalene, an adjuvant that, while included in other vaccines in Europe and Canada, has never been used in routine vaccines in the United States. But the H1N1 vaccine available in the United States has no adjuvant of any kind.

THE VACCINE HAS A DANGEROUS PRESERVATIVE Thimerosal, a preservative containing ethyl mercury that has been in vaccines since the 1930s, is used to prevent inadvertent bacterial and fungal contamination of multi-dose vials. H1N1 vaccine distributed in multi-dose vials will contain about 25 micrograms of ethyl mercury per dose. The issue of thimerosal received public attention in 1999 when the American Academy of Pediatrics and the United States Public Health Service took the precautionary step of asking that thimerosal be removed from single-dose vials of all vaccines. This was done in such a precipitous and frightening manner that it gave rise to the notion that thimerosal had led to autism or mercury poisoning. It hadn’t.

In fact, subsequent studies found that infants could safely receive eight times as much mercury as is contained in the H1N1 vaccine. But the public’s perception of thimerosal was damaged. This year, enough thimerosal-free vaccine is available to inoculate children under age 6, but that does not mean doses with thimerosal are unsafe.

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I’m thankful that we still have the choice.

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The whole thing.

O.C.G.A. § 31-12-2.1

GEORGIA CODE
Copyright 2009 by The State of Georgia
All rights reserved.

*** Current through the 2009 Regular Session ***

TITLE 31. HEALTH
CHAPTER 12. CONTROL OF HAZARDOUS CONDITIONS, PREVENTABLE DISEASES, AND METABOLIC DISORDERS

O.C.G.A. § 31-12-2.1 (2009)

§ 31-12-2.1. Investigation of potential bioterrorism activity; regulations and planning for public health emergencies

(a) The department shall ascertain the existence of any illness or health condition that may be caused by bioterrorism, epidemic or pandemic disease, or novel and highly fatal infectious agents or toxins and that may pose a substantial risk of a public health emergency; investigate all such cases to determine sources of infection and to provide for proper control measures; and define the distribution of the illness or health condition. The department shall:

(1) Identify, interview, and counsel, as appropriate, all individuals reasonably believed to have been exposed to risk;

(2) Develop information relating to the source and spread of the risk; and

(3) Close, evacuate, or decontaminate, as appropriate, any facility and decontaminate or destroy any contaminated materials when the department reasonably suspects that such material or facility may endanger the public health.

(b) The department shall promulgate rules and regulations appropriate for management of any public health emergency declared pursuant to the provisions of Code Section 38-3-51, with particular regard to coordination of the public health emergency response of the state pursuant to subsection (i) of said Code section. Such rules and regulations shall be applicable to the activities of all entities created pursuant to Chapter 3 of this title in such circumstances, notwithstanding any other provisions of law. In developing such rules and regulations, the department shall consult and coordinate as appropriate with the Georgia Emergency Management Agency, the Federal Emergency Management Agency, the Georgia Department of Public Safety, the Georgia Department of Agriculture, and the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. The department is authorized, in the course of management of a declared public health emergency, to adopt and implement emergency rules and regulations pursuant to the provisions of subsection (b) of Code Section 50-13-4. Such rules and regulations shall be adopted pursuant to Chapter 13 of Title 50, the “Georgia Administrative Procedure Act,” but shall be automatically referred by the Office of Legislative Counsel to the House of Representatives and Senate Committees on Judiciary.

(c) The department shall promulgate, prepare, and maintain a public health emergency plan and draft executive order for the declaration of a public health emergency pursuant to Code Section 38-3-51 and Chapter 13 of Title 50. In preparation of such public health emergency plan and draft executive order, the department shall consult and coordinate as appropriate with the Georgia Emergency Management Agency, the Federal Emergency Management Agency, the Georgia Department of Public Safety, the Georgia Department of Agriculture, and the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

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Give it a rest already. Whoa is me. In the worst case scenario, you have to stay home for a few days with no pay. BOO HOO.

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PODS is a PEST,

The nature of my game is not fear or scare tactics; just posting current GA state law.

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I just came from the emergency room at a local hospital. (knee xray). It was packed with sneezing, coughing, and red-faced people, all moaning in unison, all curled up in the fetal position. I walked gingerly amoungst them toward the television that nobody was paying any attention to. It was on Sportscenter. The Falcons are for real, man. They surprised me. I think we have a playoff team, (if our pig-skinners can avoid the swine flu).

I surmised that every single person in the ER had swine flu. I had to wait twenty minutes in that viral death trap. I didn’t want to be rude, but I kept my distance from the ones that looked closest to death. One guy, sweating and scratching, with open sores all over his face, approached me and offered me a draw off of his lit stogie. He didn’t know that I knew that his strain of leprosy wasn’t contagious. I drew deeply from his cigar and rolled it around in my mouth……..

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Azazel – Remember, having laws is one thing. ENFORCING or enacting upon them is another.

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Personally…, I’m not worried. I wash my hands ALOT!!

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Azazel, like many in this country, is just looking for a profit center — like suing employers because idiot employees come in to work sick. Boy, if that one lifts off, then what? Do we require employers to have a doctor in attendance to screen workers prior to their entering the building? Are we all going crazy in this country, or what!!

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Employees are ignorant of the fact that after they are asymptomatic from H1N1 they are still potentially contageous for about a week. Further, most states including this one are doing little reliable testing to map the real extent of H1N1. CDC’s statisticians estimate for every death reported 2.7 more people die. That’s a statistical average for those of you who want to know what a “.7 people” looks like.

The only reliable test in wide circulation is not commonly done, and that’s a RT-PCR, and the quick test for H1N1 has up to 70% false negative rate.

The new rapid accurate test approved last week is very scarce and won’t see wide use during this season.

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We don’t have a practical method available now for widespread use among pharmaceutical comapnies that will mass produce viral vaccines by other than the primitive, slow, unpredictable chicken egg method we’re forced to use.

We do have it for bacterial vaccine production. Hopefully this pandemic will a DNA type vaccine production for viral vaccines that can be used widely in the near future.

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Joan,
My use of responsibility and liability terminology has nothing to do with profit or litigation. I am referring to the moral and social responsibility we have to each other by not placing ourselves at unnecessary risk through negligent behaviors.

I do not support those actions you propose.

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Well, Cynthia, Did you do an about face here? I remember a while back you played down the crisis of the swine flu…said something about it not being nearly as bad as the deaths by drive-by shootings and gun fights, That the media placed too much importance on the disease. Is is because Obama says it is a crisis that you changed your tune?

But even if everyone can and did take the day off if they are sick with the swine flu, it’s still going to spread. – in doctor’s offices, on public transportation, etc. Then an infected person may show up at work not know they are contagious or maybe not caring.

I remember when I didn’t get sick pay and if I missed work, I didn’t get paid, but I learned to save for a rainy day. I made minimum wages then, so I lived as cheaply as I could and saved as much as I could. I ate beans or mac & cheese almost every night. I did without a lot because I simply couldn’t afford it. But going to vocational school and learning a marketable trade changed all that. Not getting handouts from the government. I strongly recommend the same for people working for minimum wage and no sick pay. There is a way out, but you got to find and work for it.

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As I said (before me comment was arbitrarily deleted) . . . I supervised a person who was on Medicaid . . . had a child on SS disability . . . we had sick leave and personal leave . . but that didn’t keep this person from using it all and being out without pay.

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This blog is politics, true, but as clicking through the link shows, the above New York Times article is grounded in science. The CDC has long been aware of the “but I have to go to *****” mentality’s contribution to the spread of infectious disease. Based on this finding, the CDC has made (to my knowledge) at least two H1N1 control recommendations addressing this mentality. In addition to the “nonpunitive leave policies” referenced in the NYT article, the CDC is also urging schools to drop “doctor’s note” requirements, which compel a sick student to choose between exposing the class or exposing the doctor’s office.

To the “boo hoo it’s just the flu” types: better leave the science to the scientists. We in public health always bear in mind the lesson from Intro to Epidemiology, week 1, lecture 1: not everyone is a healthy adult with an intact immune system: no HIV, no transplants, no antibiotics, no cancer treatment, no bun in the oven. H1N1, just like seasonal flu, is a proven killer among the three usual at-risk populations (the young, the old, and the immunocompromised) plus everyone with respiratory ailments. Much as it seems you think that way, H1N1 and seasonal flu mortality is not some kind of elaborate hoax.

P.S. I changed doctors when I found out the doctor I was seeing did not give his staff sick days. Ewwww! I most certainly would not eat at a restaurant with sick servers, either — Thalassa in TriBeCa, I’m looking at you. So it’s not only legislators that can or ought to apply pressure here — we need to be savvy health consumers as well.

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did you know their is an H1N! videogame

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