Support or oppose Gwinnett airport expansion?
Which side on you on? And why?
Supporters say turning over Gwinnett’s airport to a private operator to add commercial flights could boost the local economy at an opportune time, AJC reporter David Wickert writes. It could also provide an alternative to Hartsfield.
But many Gwinnett residents oppose the move. They cite the added noise, traffic congestion and declining real estate values that would affect the surrounding communities, Wickert reports.
Where do you stand?
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80 comments Add your comment
Vince
June 21st, 2010
3:09 pm
@ Jason… So you mean the jets that land here will be quieter than the ones that take off about once a month now that rattle my walls and make it sound as if a train is running across my roof?
I find that difficult to believe.
@Art…
I thought your assertion that Hamilton Mill is 11 miles from Briscoe sounded a bit far fetched…so I took a drive. From the end of the runway on Cedars Road to Hamilton Mill’s entrance on Jim Moore Road it is 5.4 miles….and that is taking winding semi-rural roads. Or, by your terms, about the distance from the Bobby Jones Gold Course on Northside Drive to Phipps Plaza. I would imagine the folks along West Paces, West Wesley and Wieuca Road would be equally unhappy if Fulton County wanted to land jets several times a day at Phipps.
Also, Art….go ahead and insult the 800,000 people who call Gwinnett home. We really don’t care. Our school system is among the nation’s finest, proven so with test scores and national awards. Our park system, recreational facilities and sports programs are among the nation’s finest. We have excellent shopping, restaurants, concert venues close by. We moved here for many reasons and your jealousy doesn’t bother us.
However, since you have nothing to do with Gwinnett why should you even care if an airport is shoved down our throats?
Vince
June 21st, 2010
3:13 pm
@Jason…
Your argument that people moved near an airport has no merit. It would be the same as saying. You moved next door to a house so you have no right to complain if the house changes to a skyscraper. Get real.
Jason
June 21st, 2010
3:49 pm
@ Vince,
My comment about the homes and the proximity to the airport holds a lot of water…. Again it is not the fault of the airport and the business that operate at the airport that you decided to settle miles from the runway. How smart is it to buy so close. This is the same problem that happen at Witham airport KSUA in Flordia where the airport butts up to multi-millon dollars homes on the ICW. the airport was able it establish a noise abement solution for the noise. They lost the battle because thay decided to build there. Location, location location did real estate not teach any of you any lesson. If you don’t like airplane noise don’t live by a flippin airport simple solution!
David
June 21st, 2010
4:21 pm
NO TO THE AIRPORT EXPANSION, WE ALREADY HAVE LOW FLYING JETS OVER OUR HOUSE EVERY EVENING AT 11:00 PM, LOW ENOUGH AND ENOUGH NOISE TO WAKE FROM SLEEP. I HATE TO IMAGE WHAT THE LARGER JETS WILL DO.
NOT ONLY THAT BUT HOW MANY MORE WILL CRASH INTO THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOODS.
DEFINITELY NO!!
David Smith
June 21st, 2010
4:28 pm
Really Vince? “People’s Lives”?
Can’t you make it more dramatic?
The truth is, that unless you haven’t flown in the last 5-10 years, you’re argument regarding the the noise level of modern jets is simply ignorant. The new 737s are FAR more quiet than the current planes flying in and out of Briscoe now.
Additionally… for anyone to even bring up ATL in this discussion is just NIMBY sensationalizing. Really? You’re suggesting that a couple more flights an hour (the airport currently has ~15 per hour) is going to cause a Hapeville? LZU had an average of 228 flights per day in 2009…. They are talking about going up to 250 or 260 a day?
For comparison, ATL has ~3000 flights per day… That’s 12 times the total volume being considered for LZU… AND AT LZU 80%+ OF THE FLIIGHTS WILL CONTINUE TO BE SMALL PLANES AS THEY ARE NOW!
Instead of letting your emotions get the best of you because you are just coming off of going nuts over the garbage program and are just looking for your next boogie man, step back and look at this from a logical standpoint leaves out the “for the children” and “we’re talking about people’s lives” crap.
Seriously…. anyone comparing LZU and ATL is guilty of dishonest and ignorant propaganda…. and I mean that in the nicest possible way.
David Smith
June 21st, 2010
4:31 pm
2nd to last paragraph was supposed to finish out with:
“step back and look at this from a logical standpoint. Leave out the “for the children” and “we’re talking about people’s lives” crap.
John Coktoasten
June 21st, 2010
5:41 pm
This is all Propaganda. The decision WILL be made by the CITIZENS and their ELECTED officials of Gwinnett County.
Vince
June 21st, 2010
6:28 pm
@David Smith…
It doesn’t really matter what your last paragraph was supposed to say. It’s all a load of crap. No way that commercial jets are quieter than the little single engine planes that take off there now.
David Smith
June 21st, 2010
7:29 pm
@ Vince….
And this is your “expert” opinion? Because you “know” this to be a fact…. or is it what you have to say in order to have this issue fit what you have predetermined to be your position on the airport?
Ed
June 22nd, 2010
9:24 am
I expect that just about everyone near the airport moved there after the airport was built. Thinking that it would never expand is like moving next to an Interstate exit and not thinking that any business would move in there.
We dramatically need the airport expanded. It would be good for just about everyone’s property values in the county. Atlanta needs a second airport. It needs Delta’s monopoly relaxed. It wasn’t the residents of Gwinnett who defeated the expansion last time, it was Delta.
The area around the approach to the airport is mostly commercial already. Neighborhoods to the North and South of the airport don’t have to worry about traffic, airplanes usually fly straight into the runways. It’s mainly the areas next to 316 that will even know the airport exists.
For those who worry about property values, NOT having the airport expansion is probably a bigger issue for you. If Gwinnett County grows stagnant, that’s what kills the property values. A county that is growing is what drives property values up. Access to transportation is a big factor, look at those who move next to subway stops or downtown, just to reduce travel time. That will happen to Gwinnett as well. Look at organizations who are looking at Cobb, N Fulton, or Gwinnett for their new location. With a commercial airport near you, that makes the deal look a LOT sweeter!
Vince
June 22nd, 2010
9:39 am
@David Smith
It is what I know. An occasional small jet takes off from Briscoe every once in a while. When it does, my walls shake, the sound is deafening and it sounds as if a train is running across my roof. I do not usually even hear the smallplanes that take off from there unless I am outside and they fly directly overhead.
@Ed
That argument of “people who move close to an airport should expect expansion” is hogwash. That is like saying, “People who move next to a playground should expect an amusement park to be built there” or “People who move next to an empty lot should expect a garbage dump to be put there” or “People who move next to a house should expect a skyscraper to be built there some day.” Get the picture?
A pilot
June 22nd, 2010
9:55 am
I been at the Airport for about 12-14 years now and During that time I have seen it all. the smaller jets come and go the Loud single engine planes flying below what there published altitude to fly over their or someones house. Lear Jets come and Go and they are Known to be the loudest plane in the sky! there is roughly 6 Loud jets coming and going out of Gwinnett on a regular basis.
Here is your problem None of you that are complaining have a clue what goes on at the Airport!
the Jets they would be able to bring in are NOT 737’s or the bigger Jets but the much smaller commuter type Planes either twin Prop or Jet, 20-30 passenger tops. the runway and taxiways and not stressed to Handle much Bigger. Look it up!!
20-30 flights Ha that is nothing, Lawrenceville airport has to average between 300-400 movements a day as it is now. with about 20-30 of those being Jets already!
Get a Grip folks, Athens hasn’t changed and they have commuter flights in there and have had them for years.
Vince
June 22nd, 2010
10:15 am
@ A Pilot
Actually, the company that wants to privatize Briscoe states 737’s will be landing at Briscoe. So will the Boeing 717 and the Airbus 319 and the MD 90.
I know enough about the airport to know there have been three crashes into residential areas in the last couple of years.
Okay, for those of you who care nothing about the tens of thousands of people who live within two miles of the runway, here is something else to consider.
All of the roads around Briscoe are currently little two lane roads that don’t even have curbs. These roads will have to be upgraded. The company itself states that road improvements would be paid for with “local and state funds.”
Maybe money means more to you than people.
sam
June 22nd, 2010
1:59 pm
While I see that that the airport privatiztion might have some economic benifits I also believe it’s also going to reduce the quality of live in Gwinnett. The airport expansion will bring more airplane noice and more traffic congestion which will reduce property values in Lawrenceville. Look at Lawrenceville now and look then at College Park…Lawernceville will look like College Park if this thing goes through.
John Hennecy
June 22nd, 2010
3:22 pm
Enter your comments here
Oppose-Oppose-Oppose- Expansion of Briscoe field would create intolerable Levels of Traffic and Noise which would have a disastrous Effect on the Local Schools, Churches, Hospitals, Residences and quality of life for the citizens of Gwinnett county. This is just another step in the long line of miserable decisions made the Gwinnett County Board of Commisioners that eventually cost the taxpayers more and more each year.
Jason
June 22nd, 2010
3:59 pm
Folks,
If the Athens airport can somehow handle small and I stress small regional aircraft than Lawrenceville can handle this type of traffic.
Like all airports that are surrounded by communities there are NOISE ABATEMENT PROCEDURES. And somehow the athens economy in the surrounding area is still surviving… Ha what a surprise. millions of dollars going into the city… amazing! Here is what a pilot would see in a noise abatement procedure. And as a pilot we do follow all procedures and protocols.
Good Neighbor Program
NOISE ABATEMENT PROCEDURES
Fixed Wing Aircraft
Athens Ben Epps Airport is located in a noise-sensitive area surrounded by residential communities. The Good Neighbor Program has been developed to further reduce noise levels in the vicinity of the airport. We ask that all operators participate to their fullest.
Important: These procedures are recommened for arrivals and departures at AHN. However, they are not intended to abrogate safe aircraft operations and compliance with overriding directives.
NBAA Standard Departure Procedure (for business jets only)
The prime requirement for an acceptable noise abatement procedure is that it will ensure operational safety. Secondly, it should provide the lowest sound level for noise-sensitive areas surrounding AHN.
NBAA Approach and Landing Procedure (for business jets only)
Initial inbound altitude for noise abatement areas will be a descending path from 3,300′ MSL or higher. Maintain a minimum airspeed (1.3 V + 20 KIAS) with gear retracted and minimum approach flap setting.
Use of Reverse Thrust
Limit the use of thrust reverse at other than idle power and limit the use of reverse thrust to perform early runway turnoff. Full length taxiways are availble.
Maintenance Runups
Runups for maintenance are discouraged from 10 PM to 7 AM.
Preferential Runway Use
When the tower is closed and safety permits, Runway 9 is the preferred runway for departure..
Intersection Takeoffs
For noise abatement, intersection takeoffs are not recommended.
Departure Routes
Aircraft departing the Athens Airport are strongly encouraged to fly routes avoiding noise-sensitive areas. (See map below.)
Military Operations
The use of afterburners is strongly discouraged.
Jason
June 23rd, 2010
2:05 pm
@ Vince,
You are problably so mad because you may have read the same article that I read showing that a survey conducted shows 70% agree with the airport expansion. bummer!
Alison
June 24th, 2010
10:01 pm
I leave about 4 miles from the airport and we will be affected by it as will people who live in Grayson, Dacula, Suwanee, Lawrenceville, Hall County, Barrow County and Jackson County. Wake up people, there is no undeveloped property around here. The airport would only benefit those who are not protesting it and those who will make money from it. People who live here do not want it. Jets are quieter but they are still noisy, we hear the ones that come over going to Hartsfield. To the person who said that 20 at 316 was run down that is correct but that is not the story on the north side of 316. We have nice homes, good neighborhoods with little crime, nice shopping centers and good schools. Many of the schools will be in the flight path as will Gwinnett Medical, the Justice center, the historic courthouse and the new college. If you want an airport put it in your backyard. And if you live in Gwinnett, Barrow, Hall or Jackson it will affect you by noise, traffic, lower property values( yes ours dropped but not as much as other areas) in other words quality of life. The city of Lawrenceville doesn’t even want it expanded. The difference with Athens and Gwinnett is that they won’t stop at small, they will want to keep expanding it. Wonder who they sent the survey too, no one in my neighborhood or my church has every seen it. .
LZU Pilot
June 24th, 2010
10:34 pm
If Atlanta needs another airport, why not consider Dobbins? Dobbins already has a more than adequate runway for commercial operators and space to expand. The Naval Air Station is now gone from there so that leaves plenty of space for commercial terminals, etc. There are *lots* of joint use (military and civilian) airports around the country.
The fact remains that Propeller, Inc. basically wants the county to GIVE them the airport on a silver platter. This plan has nothing to do with fulfilling the needs of the Atlanta area, it’s about Propeller Inc. getting a sweetheart deal. They’ve done they’re homework and they know that here in very red Gwinnett any mention of the word ‘privatization’ is met with open arms.
There is no mention in their plans of the 400+ airplanes that are currently based at LZU that pay property taxes to the county. When those airplanes get ran off, so will the property taxes and Barrow, Jackson, etc. will get our taxes.
Also not mentioned is the fact that the airport will need to close for a year for runway expansion and building of the terminals. How much will that cost? Hmm…
Lori Patrick
June 25th, 2010
8:12 am
I fully support the expansion of briscoe field. I live off of hurricane shoals & as faR as the noise issue, It can’t be any different than the police & fire trucks that go out at all hours of the night, trying to keep peace in gwinnett. However if all the people that were loosing homes & personal self asteem because they can’t support their families due to lost jobs. I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THE PUBLIC OFFICIALS THAT OPPOSE THIS EXPANSIONS SHOULD SHUT UP SIT BACK & AND WELCOME THE INCREASED REVENUE THAT THIS WOULD CREATE FOR FOLKS IN GWINETT COUNTY. NOT EVERYONE CAN SIT BACK AND HAVE THE LITTLE GUY SUPPORT THERE FAMILIES.(PUBLIC OFFICIALS THAT SIT BEHIND A DESK AND STIR UP THE MIDDLE CLASS ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO TRYING TO STOP THE COMMON PERSON THAT HAS THE GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO SUPPORT THEIR FAMILIES).they wouldn’t know what to do if the bank showed up on their front door & threw their personal items out on the street just for the unemployed & homeless to pick apart their life & lock the door behind them. They hav no idea what if feels like to have to start over especially when their use to making hundreds & thousands of dollars a year. So for once do something that means alot to more than just 1 person. I SAY ON WITH THE EXPANSION WHAT TOOK YOU SO LONG.
Cheryl
June 25th, 2010
2:59 pm
There is more to this issue than just NOISE people! NO I do not want this airport to expand. I love Lawrenceville. It is my home and I will HATE what this is going to do to the town. This is a beautiful residential community with a small country airport. If you turn it in a large commercial airport then you also expand, traffic, air pollution, eye pollution, noise pollution and an increase crime. Everything that I moved here for will be threatened. Home values anywhere close to the noise and pollution will decrease even more than they already have. We will loose our schools and the top rated teachers that work here. We will see a decline in services in the area because the property values are so low. We will see an increase in the types of low paying businesses we don’t need in the area while larger more stable business will move away from the noise and congestion.
All of you people that are so for this expansion would be right here saying NO if it was your home and your way of life that was threatened. We are not a bunch of whiney NIMBY people. THIS IS HOME. THIS IS A WAY OF LIFE. Do you understand that? Don’t give me that TRIPE about “well you moved near an airport”. That is just a bunch of hogwash and you know it. The people here in Lawrenceville have just as many rights as everyone else. The real problem here is that we have a bunch of County Commissioners that think they can push through major way of life changes without giving their constituents the right to vote on it. It makes me wonder exactly how much money is going into the pockets of our commissioners from outside sources? What promise have they made in exchange for promises made to them? How much money did they make personally for that Ball Park? And the garbage companies that were selected, how much under the table money did they have to pay? Now we have this Airport. What kind of a sweet deal are they getting from the Commissioners? This whole year of BOC decisions just STINKS of money and how much is in it for them.
MKS
June 26th, 2010
11:31 pm
There are a at least 7- 12 schools in the immediate area of the airport. The only mass commercial part is the Mall of Georgia which already causes congestion on the roads. There are soccer fields right across from 316. This is a family-friendly area and a great place to bring up kids. I hope the county government doesn’t ruin our community just because they want to bring in more revenue. People who need to commute using airlines can drive to Hartsfield in 45 minutes. The vast majority of Gwinnett residents work in this area and want to keep our homes safe and free of noise pollution.
Cathy
June 29th, 2010
1:29 am
I am totally against the airport expansion. I don’t live near the airport, I live near Lawrenceville. The noise, pollution and increased traffic will all affect me. I chose to live near Lawrenceville because of the small town Americana feel of downtown Lawrenceville. The surrounding tree lined roads are beautiful and make you feel like you are out of all the hussle and bussle of metro Atlanta. This is a residential area, it is not light industrial. These are established neighborhoods and lives that you will be tearing apart and once again in the name of money. Most of those jobs that they talk about at a new airport will be minimum wage. Not enough to make a mortgage payment. Don’t be fooled again with the major promise of riches. You will end up having to pay for this airport in higher taxes and still have to put up with all the inconveniences that it will bring. Please take a stand against this.
Diane
June 29th, 2010
11:01 am
Totally opposed! Property values will sink even lower!
Kathy
July 1st, 2010
10:17 am
Assurances were made in the mid-90s that Briscoe would “never” expand. Otherwise I would have moved elsewhere, rather than choosing Lawrenceville in 1997. Any new airport on the northside should be near I-85, not 316, and should be placed in a less developed or commercial-industrial area, not near thousands of homes. At a time when no one can sell their homes, this is just one more terrible blow.
Matt
July 15th, 2010
10:05 am
No one has brought up the pathetic state of traffic on 316. If you are in Duluth and have a 5pm flight at Briscoe, you are going to have to leave at 3p, you might as well drive to Hartsfield, it will take less time.
If you have a flight on the same day as a Bulldogs game you are screwed.
NVD
July 20th, 2010
6:20 pm
I live under the pattern and I support expansion. My only problem is that this airport is self-sufficient, which is rare for a general avaition (non-airline) airport, so why privatize? If airlines really are in the county’s best interest (and I think it is), then the commisioners just need to grow a pair and do it themselves rather than privatize. Privatization just gives them someone else to blame if things go wrong.
Weyman
July 28th, 2010
8:37 pm
I worked for Gwinnett County for 30 years. I have watched the airport grow; I have watched Ga 316 go well beyond it’s capacity as well as all the other roads in the area; I have watched the schools go beyond their capacity and business crowd out residences well over 100 years old. This county is not improving from what is was…it is going down hill and will continue to do so. We have been running about ten years behind Dekalb County. You only need to drive that direction to see what it has become and what Gwinnett will look like. The county never considers the infrastructure before bringing in more and more. I along with others have testified before planning commissions to tell them what the problems are but they did refuse to listen and will continue to do so. Each new set of commissioners that come in promises something new or different. None of them have made any improvements. The airport will be no different. Once they screw that up along with the community around it, another set of commissioners will come along and find something else to destroy. The problem with this area is that non-natives have moved in bringing with them the garbage they moved away from. Life here was very good for many years but it will never be the same again. We who have families back into the early 1800s can thank those that moved here. They have done more damage in 30 years than was done the previous 200 years. So let the airport expand; let Ga 316 and other roads become grid locked; let the schools continue to go downhill as they surely are; then sit back in your cars while standing on the highway; or sit in your homes while the power flickers off and on due to overload; let the judges tell us we can’t have water from the lakes and rivers and enjoy your life for soon there won’t be anything left to enjoy. Have your fun while to you can.
Cathy
September 4th, 2010
7:03 pm
So many of the comments site the fact that the airport will not affect homes out of the general area of the airport, but that is so wrong. I live fairly far from the airport, but I know that I am on some sort of flight plan. I can hear, especially as it gets into the evening, the flights going over my house. I did not move near the airport, but the airplanes will find you no matter where you are. This will affect a much larger area than we are being told. Also, who is going to pay to expand 316 so that all this new traffic can get to the airport. Guess what citizens, the Commisioners and Gwinnett will both be in our pockets looking for more money as soon as this gets started. Also, if the buyer goes under, we will be asked to cover that expense also. Think about this before you buy the old more jobs, more money for the community lie.
Marie
September 7th, 2010
1:44 pm
We live in Dacula, 5 miles from the airport. We have been residents of Gwinnett County for over 45 years, most of our life. We have been researching the airport privatization/expansion since it was first mentioned to the public months ago. We helped fight the battle in ‘93 when the expansion was billed as “Hartsfield Reliever”. At that time, EVERYONE in the county was opposed because they knew how devastating it would be to the entire county. Seems they are just calling it something different this time so people won’t really pay attention to the facts. Where are all those people now? We are strongly opposed to any expansion of the airport that will bring in 737’s, MD90’s and planes such as this. If you will research and read the information from Propeller Investments and also the official documents from Gwinnett County that were submitted to the FAA (over 300 pages long-you can link to this from the Gwinnett County government website) you will know that this will be an origin/destination airport – not a commuter airport. Plans are to tear up the existing runway and build a new runway that will accommodate large jets. I urge everyone to educate themselves on this issue and just not post what is speculation – facts speak for themselves. If you are opposed, please support us at the Commission Planning and Zoning meeting on Sept. 21st at 7:00.