17,500 Canadians Can’t Be Wrong
Since Barack Obama was inaugurated President just over seven months ago, some 17,500 Canadian have come to the U.S. to receive health care. Just since the President’s health care legislation was introduced in the House of Representatives in March, about 12,500 Canadians have come here for health care. During that same period, how many Americans have travelled north to obtain health care in Canada because they couldn’t get it here in the States?
The average wait time for a Canadian to obtain treatment from a specialist after seeing a primary care physician? About 4-1/2 months. In the U.S.? Virtually none.
Want to see a primary care doctor in the U.S.? Pick up the phone and call one. In Canada, get in line behind the five percent of the population waiting to get a primary care physician (about 17 million Canadians).
And still there are those in Washington extolling the benefit of a government-controlled, single-payor heath care system . . . like they have in Canada.
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283 comments Add your comment
Gandhi
August 28th, 2009
6:52 am
Millions of Americans can’t get, or afford proper care, Bob. What’s your point?
Gandhi
August 28th, 2009
6:56 am
This link might be informative:
http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2009/08/five_myths_about_health_care_a.html
DeborahinAthens
August 28th, 2009
6:56 am
How about getting some real statistics! Of all of the industrialized nations, the US ranks 37th in healthcare (cost, treatment outcome, longevity, infant mortality, etc) while Great Britain ranks 17th. I don’t know the ranking for Canada, but I have never met anyone from Canada, Great Britain, or France that has ever had anything bad to say about their healthcare system. In this country, there is no waiting time for a procedure. If Aetna, Cigna, et.al. doesn’t want you to have it. If they won’t cover it, and , if you can’t afford it, it simply does not get done. I love hearing the “free market capitalists” rant about letting the market take care of the costs. Believe me, if the government deregulates the insurance industry and lets insurance companies operate across state lines (the Republicans favorite healthcare reform plan), they will not lower premiums, they will raise them. Why? It is in their best interests to do so. Another nasty side effect will be that “unhealthy” states like Georgia will have very few options, while “healthy” states, like Colorado, will have plenty of coverage. We only have to look at the deregulation of the power companies and gas companies to see what the effects are. Remember Enron, anyone? Enron could not have even existed if that industry had not been deregulated. I am in a business that requires me to take 15 hours of continuing education to keep my insurance license. Last month, while studying the material, I had to laugh! The subject was ethics, and it was discussing why it was necessary to have so much government regulation of the insurance industry. Know what the answer was??? IT WAS BECAUSE THE FREE MARKET WOULD NOT ENSURE THAT INSURANCE COMPANIES WOULD DO WHAT WAS RIGHT FOR THE INSURED! Even the industry itself knows that greed and striving for profit will make the insured very low on the list of priorities. If you retire or are laid off and you have diabetes or Parkinson’s disease, after COBRA terminates, you will NOT be able to get any healthcare insurance, period. While you are throwing out “statistics” let’s try another one. As recently as a decade ago, about .12 of every dollar of premium was a profit for healthcare insurers. With technology and better tracking of individuals, today about .22 of every dollar of premium is profit. Know why? With today’s sophisticated technology, the insurance company has exquisite ability to ferret out the high-risk client and terminate their coverage. And if any of you believe that they don’t do that, just wait. Your time will come.
Michael H. Smith
August 28th, 2009
6:58 am
The average wait time for a Canadian to obtain treatment from a specialist after seeing a primary care physician? About 4-1/2 months. In the U.S.? Virtually none.
If ObumerCare a.k.a. the Public government run no-Option healthcare becomes the law Americans, especially seniors, may have worse fears than a long wait if-when specialists are forced to stop practicing medicine.
Cardiologists Crying Foul Over Medicare Cuts Hurt Obama Revamp
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aRqnpw9ZInJ4
Karl Marx
August 28th, 2009
7:26 am
Dear, DeborahinAthens How about you stop with the liberal talking points and get some real statics like talking with some of the people from Canada, Great Brit, etc. I work with many people from Canada and Europe. They tell me we do not want this plan and have repeated many horror stories about their government run health care system. Our system needs reform but the Democrats plan is not it.
Ian
August 28th, 2009
7:27 am
Thanks for pointing this out, Bob. I spent the first 20 years of my life in the Canadian system. Thankfully I was very healthy and only had to use the system for emergency care on a very small number of occasions.
I urge people to learn about the Castonguay Report.
Canadians have always had access to third-party, private care at their expense. That tier is called “The United States”. When it’s flat out illegal to get the care you want and can afford from a private provider (or be that private provider), the only thing you can do is go to one of the few places in the world where you are allowed to do that. Fortunately the vast majority of the Canadian population lives within a day trip of the U.S.
Bill Johnson
August 28th, 2009
7:30 am
Well, Gahndi, why don’t you break down those millions into: those who are able but choose not to, those that are illegally in the country, etc – then tell me how many needy people can’t get care when they need it. Much smaller number, that. And if you think government medicine is so great – go the F**K elsewhere to get it. I DON”T WANT IT!!!!!
Bankrupt my country to give shoddy, inept care – did you even see the BBC’s stories about NHS? Do you research anything for yourself? Do you think, or just emote?
It would be really nice to give everybody on the planet a new Rolls-Royce, too, but we don’t have the money. Sometimes, you just don’t have the money. Especially to give to the one proven most wasteful entity in the country.
No Thanks.
Wheat Williams
August 28th, 2009
7:35 am
No, Bob, not like they have in Canada, where private healthcare and private insurance are illegal.
What the President is proposing is a system like they have in England, France and Germany, where private healthcare and private insurance, for those who can afford it, exist side-by-side with a government-run insurance and healthcare program that people with lesser means pay for as an alternative.
Ken
August 28th, 2009
7:37 am
Millions of Americans can’t buy a house. So, Gandhi, should the government provide a house to these people… most of whom are chronically unemployed or unemployable, have bad habits with money, etc? When I was younger, I did not have any health insurance. When I needed a doctor, I went to one and paid in cash… and generally kept myself in good health. Now that I am older, 49, married with kids and RESPONSIBLE, I have the insurance I need to get proper care. I work for a living so I can afford the insurance. Most Americans who demand free insurance also want free food stamps, and other welfare…. and these people REFUSE to be productive. Why waste health care on these people who just want to mooch off the system. Come on Gandhi, think it through.
Laura
August 28th, 2009
7:39 am
I lived in Canada for 35 years and the United States for 17. Every relative I have but 2 lives in Canada. They all love their healthcare, including my aging parents. The only complaints I hear about the Canadian healthcare system come from Americans who have never used it. I would love the United States to adopt a plan similar to the Canadian one. Canada spends about 10% of their GDP on healthcare vs 16% in the U.S. – if Canada spent that kind of money on healthcare the problems with waits etc would be eliminated. Tommy Douglas, founder of Medicare in Canada was voted the greatest Canadian several years ago. As Mr. Barr says – so many Canadians can’t be wrong.
Michael
August 28th, 2009
7:42 am
Don’t drink, don’t smoke, and don’t get in fights. That’s about all the health insurance you need.
Frank
August 28th, 2009
7:46 am
Wheat, when has our government ever had any success in running a business? never. It cannot exist side by side because private companies will not have the deep pockets and printing press which Washington uses to fund government run companies. it alters free market, period. When you taint the system in such a way it creates imbalances which eventually tilt in the governments favor, hence no longer competitive. See competition to Amtrak or the Post Office? Not really. One because its against the law and two, it wouldn’t be viable for a private company to enter that market. What makes you think healthcare is different?
When the feds took over the Mustang Ranch in Nevada…it went bankrupt! If you can’t make money selling whiskey and a$$, you’ve got no business running a business
Ramjet
August 28th, 2009
7:47 am
People who have insurance do not understand all of the complications of obtaining insurance and keeping it when your self-employed or your employer does not provide it. They just assume people who do not have it want a freebie. That may be the case with some but for most of us we are willing to pay for it however, when you are not on a group policy insurance companies extremely raise their rates if you make a claim making it unaffordable so you will not have insurance in catastropic situations. My mother got cancer and when our policy came up for renewal they raised the rate to $9,500 per month. Therefore, they may as well of cancelled us.
jj
August 28th, 2009
7:48 am
Two words that set off a red flag on this article, and make it suspect – BOB BARR (whose photo make him look like he’s hosting a theatre show on PBS ;> ). How many American’s have died during this same period, because they can’t afford, lost or can’t get coverage? NO country has a perfect system. While we may fear the Gov, how can you fear the Insurance industry sharks any less???
And where was your indignation during the previous 8 years? When we were yanked down into this black hole we find our country in? You were upset, weren’t you?
Krista
August 28th, 2009
7:50 am
Mr. Barr has a troubling grasp on math, particularly decimals. Canada has a population of 33,592,686, five per cent of which is actually 1.7 million. As a Canadian, I’ll gladly keep my universal health care, where I will always receive care at any hospital I walk in to. My insurance will never be cancelled arbitrarily, and I’ll never go bankrupt trying to pay medical bills. This debate has been completely maligned by special interests, particularly those who make billions of dollars a year off of millions of sick Americans. Bon courage…
Former Oregonian
August 28th, 2009
7:52 am
The article in The Oregonian was very informative but completely failed to discuss the financial end of other countries medical provider systems. France’ system is completely in the red, as is Germany’s. The Danish and Czech health care systems, which are excellent, are also experiencing extreme financial difficulties. With all the rhetoric around health insurance, wouldn’t it be refreshing if the four largest insurers (Blue Cross, UnitedhealthCare, Cigna, and Aetna) acted like insurance companies and had a coast-to-coast “pool” to mitigate high claims. Affordable healthcare is completely attainable but the three components: insurers, medical facilities, and pharmaceutical companies need to stop the shell game.
Brett
August 28th, 2009
7:54 am
“During that same period, how many Americans have travelled north to obtain health care in Canada because they couldn’t get it here in the States?”
More specifically, how many Americans have traveled north to obtain medical marijuana in Canada? I reckon seventeen-five is a low estimate.
George Bush
August 28th, 2009
7:57 am
nothing wrong with a little competition people…quit your whining and stop making this a upper middle and working class issue..plenty of people who have means and work get into situations where the big insurers screw them because of pre existing or major medical conditions..so stop making it a class issue ..it needs to be available ..if it was not needed it would not be on the table. Heck i wish i had thought of it during my administration
W
canadian MD
August 28th, 2009
7:57 am
As a Canadian, and a doctor, it is always amuses me to see uninformed and ideologically cramped opinions like those touted by Mr. Barr. ( for starters, 5% of the Canadian population is not 17 million people)
True, there are waiting lists to see a specialist like me. Of course, if a family physician calls me and explains that he or she is worried about their patient, I will see them without delay. (as I am doing so for two patients today). Medical need determines this, not the patient’s insurance/finacial status.
And I do see non-Canadians (Yes, Mr Barr, even Americans) though I do so with some reluctance because their insurance companies typically engage in hesitant and partial and grudging re-imbursement. For a Canadian citizen, I bill a government agency and am reimbursed within two weeks for the full amount 98% of the time. (Telling this to an American MD often causes their jaw to drop).
As with any system, there are problems with single-payer systems (and some solutions, like private MRI labs, have existed side by side with the single payer system) and physicians and patients have to work toward pressuring government to make it a better system. True, we don’t have a lot of what americans have, but this includes medical bankruptcies, a growing underclass of working uninsured, an abysmal infant mortality rate and a system where administrative costs are more than double those in Canada.
But don’t worry Mr. Barr, I can’t see meaningful reform coming to the US. There is simply too much money to be made, (money that could go towards healthcare of your citizens will instead be funnelled into profits). That’s fine. That’s your country’s choice. But I can’t imagine having the same debate about your military that you are having abouut healthcare, suggesting taking control away from government and letting the free market run things (hello Blackwater), letting big corporations make the little decisions that will maximize profit off your soldiers. Most americans would see the harm in that, would say that the military is too important to let that happen, that it symbolizes something vital about America and that America’s security is not worth the tradeoff for a few (trillion) dollars of petential profit.
Well, most Canadians feel the same way about healthcare. Respect that.
Now excuse me, I have to get to work.
Dean
August 28th, 2009
7:58 am
Both health care systems are about to get a massive ’stress test’ with H1N1 creeping over us day by day – http://thintheherd.info/index.php?board=2.0 –
One thing they are not considering is that all US doctors would agree to keep working. The ones I have spoken with said they would quit if the rules changed this much. Many I have met have side businesses they can put all their time into.
jesuschristsuperstar
August 28th, 2009
7:59 am
What is the source of the statistics that support your claim of “virtually” no wait time to see a specialist here in the US? I have personally had to wait weeks and months to see specialists after visiting a primary care doctor. So provide the actual statistics and I’ll figure out what I’m doing wrong, or stop making stuff up.
hryder
August 28th, 2009
8:02 am
Survival of the fittest. Follow the terms of a health insurance policy and you will remain insured and treated with specified financial obligations paid by the insurer. Do not adhere to the terms of the policy and you have problems. One of the proposals floated nationally was cost effectiveness based on the individuals age in order to receive the most effective procedure. Too old, you receive a less effective treatment and die earlier then medically necessary. Unless, of course, you are Ted Kenneddy.
Michael Smith
August 28th, 2009
8:03 am
DeborahinAthens wrote:
Believe me, if the government deregulates the insurance industry and lets insurance companies operate across state lines (the Republicans favorite healthcare reform plan), they will not lower premiums, they will raise them. Why? It is in their best interests to do so.
Utter nonsense. Companies in a free market can’t raise their prices arbitrarily. If they do, their competitors will take away their business. This is why Delta Airlines doesn’t solve all of its financial problems by just tripling the prices of its flights — this is why General Motors couldn’t return to profitability by just deciding to charge double for a Chevrolet automobile — this is why the prices in relatively unregulated markets, like, for instance, consumer electronics, continue to FALL.
The notion that government regulation is necessary to keep businesses from raising their prices at will is pure insanity — it’s refuted by things you see with your own eyes, every day. Good lord, if there are no competition-imposed limits to prices — absent government regulation — why isn’t gasoline $100 per gallon?
And as far as insurance companies refusing to cover pre-existing conditions, it is their absolute right to do so — just like it is your absolute right to seek better coverage elsewhere if you don’t like the terms and conditions they are offering.
But what you want is the ability to avoid the expenses of having a disease like diabetes and Parkinson’s by having everyone else forced to pay higher insurance premiums to cover YOUR costs — essentially, you are in favor of the legalized looting of others to pay your doctor bills. Nothing on earth justifies the notion that any one person is entitled to have their doctor bills paid by confiscating the fruits of another man’s labor.
She also wrote:
We only have to look at the deregulation of the power companies and gas companies to see what the effects are. Remember Enron, anyone? Enron could not have even existed if that industry had not been deregulated.
More nonsense! In the first place, the “power and gas companies” were never “deregulated’. Their prices are still set by state governments and they are still protected from competition by state laws. In the second place, the Enron fraud was based largely on its use of “mark-to-market” accounting principles, which were specifically approved by the government regulators at the Securities and Exchange Commission. So far from preventing the Enron fraud, the government regulators gave it the go ahead.
You’ve been duped and brainwashed into regurgitating leftist talking points on cue. You’ve allowed yourself to become a mindless little “useful idiot” for looters of the left.
Stuart
August 28th, 2009
8:09 am
Yeah, that’s right, Ken. Everybody that wants a public policy doesn’t wanna work, just wants food stamps, and is irresponsible with money. Well, let me explain something to you, Ken, and I’ll try not to use big words. I have worked since I was 13 years old, and have supported myself since 18. I have always paid taxes, and always had insurance. Then, at the age of 46, I was laid off (you know, like all the lazy auto workers, steel workers, construction workers, etc, etc. have been) and paid about $700 a month for Cobra. That’s right, I paid that while I was still trying to pay my other bills with what money I had saved. After the Cobra ran out, I was dropped from my insurance company, the one I’d been with for 10 years, because I had type 2 diabetes. Forget the fact I run, eat right, don’t smoke, work out regularly. And I got the same rejection pretty much across the board. Right now, if I had a major illness or accident, I can pretty much kiss my house and what little is left of my IRA goodbye. And there’s my mom, who works for a company that hires a lot of people for just under 32 hours a week so they don’t have to pay benefits. Until Medicare kicked in…you know, that Nazi/Socialist/Communist health plan that I’m sure none of your relatives take advantage of, her insurance cost her more than her rent. My mom, who worked full-time when my sister and I were growing up, did so from 1963 until 2004. And for what it’s worth, I know a lot of people from Canada, and in Europe, none of whom have any complaints about their healthcare, nor can they understand why we have to pay for it. But I’m sure nobody in Canada or Europe, nor anybody that thinks healthcare should be affordable, or available to people who need it, works as hard or knows as much as you.
Red
August 28th, 2009
8:10 am
What a lot of people fail to realize is that public option will become public mandated by the government. Obama has even said that he wants the public option to eventually replace all private health insurance. With the way it is currently written I will not have a choice when I change jobs. I either take something similar to what I have now by choosing from a list of government approved insurance providers or go on the public option, even if my new job offers better coverage. Health insurance is not a right, the only rights we have were in the Bill of Rights and health insurance was not in it!
Greg
August 28th, 2009
8:13 am
My personal experience is that Canadians that I know personally tell me they prefer their system to the US system. Some of the earlier posts reinforce my belief in the American legal system where we do not allow hearsay evidence. My advice is to seek out the opinions of our neighbors to the north rather than American’s interpretations.
By the way quite a few Americans are already going to India, Panama, Costa Rica for affordable medical procedures.
kitty
August 28th, 2009
8:16 am
michaelsmith, you are obviously healthy and have never had your insurance rates raised so you can’t afford them. Look at the post above where the mother in law got cancer and her rate went up to 9500 per month. A free market only works when you can decide not to buy the product. When you have cancer if you do that you die. Health and free market do not work together as well as your little dream world thinks.
When you get cancer and can’t work and have no health insurance get back to me…of course, that will be when your retirement money is completely gone and you are in Stage 4. Cheers.
Homer
August 28th, 2009
8:17 am
Because the few can’t get affordable healthcare the many have to suffer? This is crazy like the Democratic proposal. Healthcare needs overhaul not rebuilding like the government option. As one doctor said, where are we going to get the new doctors for the additional 50 million which is actually around 14 million which 20% can buy insurance but choose not too.
jj
August 28th, 2009
8:18 am
It is not uncommon at all to wait a month to see a specialist. I have insurance, and last week was told a problem I have ‘may be cancer’. When is my next appt? October 12! 6 weeks of waiting – and wondering. Maybe Bob can walk in and be seen, but not normal people. Why do you think they tell you to make an appt for your next physical a year early? Because it takes a long time to get one later, when the doc is trying to fit in more urgent patients.
Universal health care will save money. Like dental checkups, which insurers like you to have, regular checkups save huge sums of money down the road, and keep people out of the pricey ER.
Thank you ‘Ca MD’, for the real info. There is so much rumors and distortions shouted about, you would almost think this is about getting the ‘party of NO’ back in power in 2010, rather than proper health care. Mob hysteria rules once again…
bobo
August 28th, 2009
8:18 am
Enter your comments here
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
8:19 am
Really Bob? 17,500? Not exactly a representative sample is it? Personally I have never met a Canadian that would trade their health care for ours. Ever.
Thomas
August 28th, 2009
8:19 am
I go to my Dr. and he requests me to get tests for normal physical exam, I should be able to choose where I want the tests administered and which merchant I want to support. But my Insurance Company says that if you do not use our listed Labs, which are miles away from my preference, we will only pay 20% of the bill. So now I have no choice but to travel many miles for testing that could have been done within walking distance from the Drs. office. Makes me wonder who is on whose side? This is the USA where Insurance companies have become the outlaws.
don'tcare
August 28th, 2009
8:19 am
The only Americans who can’t get health care are already dead.
Murray County Indian
August 28th, 2009
8:21 am
Liberals made it rain out my football practice yesterday and they broke into my house and clogged my toilet! Stupid liberals!
MomOf2Girls
August 28th, 2009
8:21 am
I recently housed 2 young women from Canada in my home for a weekend. One of them had a gymnastics accident almost 18 months ago and dislocated her kneecap tore some ligaments. She is still waiting for surgery. She was given a date that was originally 12 months post injury, but the surgery has been rescheduled 4 times so far. She is now being told it will be next summer. She and her parents have looked into having the surgery here in the U.S., but they are unable to afford it without assistance, so she’s stuck trying to get around her college campus for another year with a bum leg.
Hillbilly Deluxe
August 28th, 2009
8:21 am
some 17,500 Canadian have come to the U.S. to receive health care
What about the other 33+ million Canadians? Granted I don’t know that many Canadians but the ones I do know don’t seem to have a problem with their system. They usually ask me, “How can the richest country in the world have such a mess?”
As for choice, those who have insurance through their employers actually have very little choice. The company makes it for you.
Michael
August 28th, 2009
8:21 am
Again with the myth of doctors leaving practice if this happens, or if tort reform doesn’t happen. Believe me, those in medical school want them to quit rather than hanging on until they are 70 yrs old.
Hillbilly Deluxe
August 28th, 2009
8:22 am
*seem to have no problem…I need an editor I think.
GTMike
August 28th, 2009
8:25 am
Hmmm, Medicare…bankrupt. Social Security…bankrupt. Deficit projections without single payer health care plans…9 trillion dollars. Economy…..stinks. Spending by governments in the US on non-defense programs? Under JFK…19% of GDP. Under Obama, 39% of GDP. That’s 20% of our annual GDP taken out of the private sector where it grows jobs and fuels future employment, diverted to primarily welfare type programs of one kind or another.
We may be the richest country in the world, but that doesn’t mean that we can’t bankrupt it as surely as the individual who continuously overspends their income. Socialists have NO idea how the economy grows long term, they care only about ‘gimme, gimme, gimme’ and be damned if our children or our children’s children no longer have the economic base that we were blessed with.
Barr’s basic facts about Canadians coming to this country (rather than vice versa) remains true and unrefuted by any of your arguments. They come primarily for what the Canadian health care system defines as “elective’ procedures.
Who is John Galt?
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
8:25 am
And jj is spot on. My wife had a biopsy for possible breast cancer almost 2 months ago and has yet to get the result. We wait NOW. It’s time to cut the BS surrounding this issue. Insurance company beauracrats are making life and death decisions for people everyday because of their bottom line. Want the plug pulled on “grandma”. Then keep trusting the present system. How many times has a doctor told families their is nothing else he can do after the insurance murderers tell him their is no more money to keep “grandma” alive. The ignorance and pure naivete of the opposition to HC reform is appalling.
Cayce
August 28th, 2009
8:27 am
Sorry. This is bogus. I lived in Canada for 2 years and they scoffed at the very idea of an American style health care system. The only thing they came to America for was voluntary surgery, things like plastic surgery. The wait for basic care is actually no longer than it is here (when was the last time you tried to get an appointment with a new primary care physician?).
Talk to some Canadians before you make these kinds of statements. I never met a single one who would change their system for ours.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:31 am
I am not a Republican or Democrat, and I do not support Government funded health care. We need as little Government in our life as possible, becuase remember Government funded programs fail, look at public education, social security and welfare. Even if you can’t afford health care, a hospital can’t deny you treatment if you are sick and also there are places like Grady.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:33 am
Les Miles, they contact you if something is wrong but if nothing is wrong then there is no need.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:34 am
Also, look at Government funded neighborhoods called projects they are a complete failure.
bob
August 28th, 2009
8:38 am
Deborah in athens, If you want to quote an arm of the United Nations, The world Health Organization, please post the guidelines they use to determine the rankings.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:40 am
“True democracy is nothing more than mob rule, when 51% of the population takes away the rights of the other 49%” Thomas Jefferson
This is true and we should vote whether or not for health care and if 51% of the population wants public health care, then why not try it? I don’t like the idea but if 51% wants it then that is democracy and that is what the Founding Fathers would want.
bob
August 28th, 2009
8:40 am
Cayce, were you in Canada when the Supreme court ruled to allow private clinics to open ? These clinics were not for boob jobs and the gov fought their opening because they did not want competition. I think it was 05.
In the Know
August 28th, 2009
8:40 am
Liberalism is a disease – there are several that have posted this morning on this blog that have a terminal case of it. Tis sad, but we need to rid the world of liberalism – anyone that is a liberal is a loser anyway and won’t be missed. We should ship all the liberals in the world to the South Pole. Man, that would be just terrific if we could make that happen.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:41 am
Just keep Government funded abortions out of the Public heath care. If someone wants an abortion then that should be from their own pocket.
Greg
August 28th, 2009
8:42 am
Thankfully the government does do a good job is some areas. National security and our military forces are the strongest of any civilization, A large part of our public lands including our national parks and most of the states of Alaska and Nevada have been important investments by our country. We also have a great transportation system. Well maybe not in Atlanta!
William
August 28th, 2009
8:42 am
If you liberals would have not starved an oil based economy to avoid the so called global warming and going green, higher taxes on gasoline could have filled the void. But nooooo, you starved the economy and the profiteers got the billions. Your ideology has never been put into practical affordable terms. It never will.
Now, you want me to pay for higher gas and your healthcare. Liberals cannot lead. It becomes more evident every day. Your statistics are created thru ideology and your college algebra.
good grief
August 28th, 2009
8:43 am
Thank you Canadian MD. Your input is obviously more informed and useful than anything Mr. Barr could write as you have direct experience and not useless statistics.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:44 am
Greg, and that is where more of our current taxes should go, is the military. We need fewer taxes but more of the taxes we do have should go there. Honestly, when the Conservatives were in office, we were getting pay raises a lot quicker than when the Democrats took office.
bob
August 28th, 2009
8:46 am
Les Miles, the ignorance is you wanting the same group that underwrote a TRILLION in bad mortgages, Gave us Social Security and busing will run healthcare better. Even you could come up with a better idea than busing !
Serge Savoie
August 28th, 2009
8:46 am
There are 2 types of Canadians that usually seek health care in the States: 1. Those who are in need of treatment or procedures that are so rare that there are no specialist in Canada. (to small of a population) In those cases, the provincial government usually pays for the procedure and even sometime for the hole trip. 2. And then there are the rich and powerful who would not be caught dead being seen sitting in the same waiting room as the rest of us ordinary canadians. That should account for most of your 17 500.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:49 am
Just let the people decide on the health care.
Larry
August 28th, 2009
8:50 am
Who said we need or want the Canadian system?
We have a good single-payer, government plan now, it’s called Medicare. It’s worked very well for the past 40 years. Could it be better, sure there is always room for improvement. So tweak it and let the people decide. If you want a government plan go for it, if not keep what you have or go buy your own.
Why are the insurance companies so afraid of competition? They could have improved their product years ago, but instead they just increased their profits!
TC6483
August 28th, 2009
8:50 am
I have friends in Canada and I have family in Germany. They all love their health care. I know that if there is urgent care it is there, NO WAITS, and even if it is not so urgend. This kind of reminds me about the stories of the dark ages. If it is something unexperienced, it’s EVIL and the rumors are flying to kill it.
Trey
August 28th, 2009
8:51 am
That is the best way to go.
William
August 28th, 2009
8:54 am
Obama lied about everything and Holder will get US citizens killed, and seniors have the death option. Now that is leadership I could die with.
TomTucker
August 28th, 2009
8:55 am
Actually we do have a single payer government financed healthcare system it, is called Medicare. Seniors get to go to any doctor or hospital of their choice, unlike my private insurance plan. Of course, as some of the right wing would say, it is bankrupt. When social security was bankrupt in the early 80’s, few of you Reagan worshippers remember that Reagan raised the social security tax to pay for it. But the new Reagan Gospel prohibits tax increases of any kind. So the logical conclusion would be to force seniors into a private insurance program if they could get it or afford it. Who would be killing old people then?
Why aren’t Republicans calling for the abolition of Medicare if the private market is always superior?
Can you see it
August 28th, 2009
8:58 am
Healthcare is not and i repeat a right. You and the government do not have the right to take my hard earned money to supply your every want and desire and healthcare is just that. Its a want. Im not buying into this big corrupt government any longer.
There are approximately 10 million american people without health insurance but that does not stop them from getting care. Those people can walk into any hospital and get good quality care without insurance. Thats a fact. What they want is to push their agenda and force more freedoms from americans.
Want reform, break down coverage, get rid of stupid lawsuits, allow medical and dental without drug rehab and maternity, I mean come on, why does a single man have to pay for maternity? The government is regulating the insurance companies and theres you high cost. Get rid of the corrupt medicare doctors and billers. One doctor cant see 200 patients in one day but they bill that way all day long. A wheelchair does not cost 3,000 and hospitals do not send pillows home with you so stop billing medicare for 4 pillows on bills. Medicare should become private and controled and so should medicaid. Get rid of the waist in these two programs and you could put a couple of clinics in areas where people that were uninsured because of cost could get care. Most however are uninsured because they want to be. There is the facts dear people who believe in Obama distroy care programs.
Atlanta Native
August 28th, 2009
9:00 am
Bob, you are nothing but an ignorant, racist, brownshirt to make such talk. You have no right to speak like this against the plans that the president and congress have for our bodies! We have a right to turn our, and everyone else’s, bodies over to the government.
Wow! It is fun to talk like that. No wonder so many people enjoy it so. Oh well, time to actually use my brain and see the logic in what you are saying.
Rob
August 28th, 2009
9:03 am
I cannot imagine anyone believing politicians would manage your healthcare better than you; who has the the interest here for you health? Certainly not a politician who is worried about the next election, the taxes, the money floating under the table. I really have a hard time even believing the statistics floating around about how many people are un-insured. It seems too much like a straw man argument to state that 47 million (thats well over 1 in 10) americans don’t have health insurance. And to that statement there has been no one to show me they cannot get access to it.
Is that not the argument being made by Obama…that we need more competition which interpreted to me means 1) that there is not enough insurance for folks and/or 2) that insurance is too high. If it is that there is not enough, I am not convinced. There should be more openess between states for sure but I don’t see a lack of insurance. There may be a lack of high end insurance plans like some businesses provide but not a lack of it period. It sounds like #2 the later is the problem….the cost.
Let’s be real…the only way government can control cost is to ration…there is no other way. To those who cite european models and say theirs is better just ask them…well that is Mr Barr’s point. Germans or Brits don’t have any other bais but what they have now because they are all mostly the same. Canadians do. And they flood across the border constantly.
There is also the law of unintended consequences here. If you set up a government sponsored insurance do you not think the immigration problem will exponentially multiply? How can you stop folks from flooding here for cheap food, free insuance, free to cheap housing? That has been the core problem with Oregon or Massachusetts…they got flooded with hands reaching out and legally cannot close their borders to just those living there when insurance started. We will see the same thing happen here if we offer this freebie plan.
JDW
August 28th, 2009
9:04 am
Hey Bob, how many Americans have bought perscription drugs from Canada this year? Try billions you moron and you drivel on about a few thousand Canadians coming to the US to see a doctor. During that same timeframe how many Americans have traveled abroad for treatment? I daresay far more than a few thousand.
Margaret Love
August 28th, 2009
9:05 am
I am a dual citizen of Canada and USA and it is ridicidulous how ignorant most Americans are about anything in Canada. Shame on our leaders here like, Bob Barr for being an ignorant Americans. I love the weather here but I prefer the health care in Canada any day. Does anybody else in Atlanta have Kaiser? Ugh! Copayments and deductibles galore not to mention WAITING TIMES! Oh yes, and the Wellstar hospital closest to my house (5min away) did not have their doctors !!!
Haliburton Billionaire
August 28th, 2009
9:06 am
The propaganda is sickening. And as long as there are twice as many Americans going to India and South America for health care your point is pretty much MOOT.
Facts Please
August 28th, 2009
9:08 am
The only fact here is that Obama and his Chicago cronies are tearing apart america piece by piece and handing it over to the third world countries in the way of trillians. You liberals cant think for yourself, your to stupid to look at the proof in voting and think government can take care of every thing you need. Let me tell you a secret. Its not the government its the working taxpayers and we didnt give birth to you and we really dont want to support you.
As for the 45 million uninsured, most of these people are not even americans. They are illegals here who do not pay taxes and take pleasure in their crimes against americans. Why in the hell do you want to give them health insurance? We should be sending them home and securing our boarders.
clyde
August 28th, 2009
9:08 am
Bob,
Read canadian MD over and over until you understand what he’s saying.Then vow never to write about anything about which you don’t have all the facts.Leave the speculating to your readers.
Here’s a hot tip for you.Find out how many Canadians elected to come to the U.S. because they wanted to and because they had the money to.And because they didn’t want to wait with the commoners.
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
9:11 am
Trey maybe you can now tell us why the present system is so wonderful.
bob
August 28th, 2009
9:12 am
Wheat Williams, private healthcare in Canada is not against the law. Canadians had to go to court to get it.
VooDoo Child
August 28th, 2009
9:12 am
American’s aren’t going to Canada huh? Spend one day at the Canadian or Mexican border and tell me Americans are not crossing into other countires for care. You will see bus loads of senior citizens crossing into Canada and Mexico (Mexico!!!) to buy their drugs since they can not afford them here. The Republicans signed PArt D into law, an entitlement program by the way, and Americans still have to go to Mexico for affordable drugs.
All one needs to do is look at these posts to see the problem. Americans simply do not understand with the Obama plan proposes. Many hear what Limbaugh, Hannity or (gulp) Palin tell them and run screaming to a town hall. It’s called reding people, try it some time.
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
9:13 am
Facts Please thinks there are 45 million illegals in this country. There you go folks. That’s the kind of ignorance revolving around this issue.
Dennis
August 28th, 2009
9:13 am
My friend from Canada was on a waiting list to get a knee replacement. When his turn came up after months of waiting he was denied the procedure because he is overweight. No statistics, just a true story that happened in 2008.
DirtyDawg
August 28th, 2009
9:15 am
So, rich Canadians want to come to the US so they won’t have to wait for face-lifts, tummy-tucks and hair implants. Don’t worry, those services will still be available, BOB, even after we get a public option (meanwhile, BOB, you really should use a little more Rogain – you’re in that in-between stage, not entirely slick and sexy but not enough left for a comb-over).
Access to affordable health-care shouldn’t be considered a right but totin’ guns is? Oh yes, I understand…you’re gonna need those guns when all those people that have been denied the ability to receive life-sustaining care decide to come and get yours…right? Your kind of thinking has been around forever – why do you think the KKK got started? – only now it’s not just to instill fear in the black community, it’s to make sure the down-troddin, the poor, the out-of-work with a pre-existing condition don’t start to get ‘uppity’. So what’s to be done? I’ll bet you you wouldn’t have any problem with using your tax money to fund a ‘final solution’…namely concentration camps and mass ovens. I mean if we spend all our time and energy seeing to it that the ‘hind-most’ get taken by the Devil, somebody’s gonna have to also see to it that they don’t get organized and do something about their situation…I mean even you don’t have enough bullets hoarded away for that.
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
9:16 am
And Rob thinks we manage our own health care.
airline employee
August 28th, 2009
9:18 am
All one has to do to see how well the government runs things is to go to any airport and get on an airliner. The TSA is at once, the most inept and the largest of all the government entities. No accountability, no oversight. This is what you want for your healthcare? Finally, when the government makes it so difficult for doctors to do their business without big bro’ looking over their shoulder, the numbers of doctors leaving the profession will dwarf the current number.
Rebecca
August 28th, 2009
9:20 am
“We all agree that the system is imploding, we all agree that things are more precarious than perhaps Canadians realize,” Doing said in an interview with The Canadian Press. That’s a statement from the president of the Canadian Medical Association. Is that what you want for your healthcare? It’s not what I want from mine.
My sister-in-law was born and raised in England. Her father got a boil, and he died from it. Under England’s system, treatment is ranked according to severity. Boils aren’t considered serious, and he was given an appointment for weeks out, even though it was obvious the infection was entering his blood stream. All his family could do was beg the doctors to treat him, but the doctors had very strict guidelines to follow. Medical decisions are not made by doctors; they are made by the legislators. That’s not what I want from my healthcare system.
Let’s fix what is broken right now in healthcare. Start with tort reform. There is no reason an attorney like Democrat John Edwards should be a multi-millionaire just because he can convince uneducated jurists that doctors cause cerebral palsy. It is because of attorneys like him that my gynecologist quit delivering babies. He could no longer afford the $100,000+ in malpractice insurance every year. Look at how many unneeded tests are performed by doctors just to protect themselves from medical malpractice suits. Think about this. If a doctor sees 4 patients per hour, 8 hours per day, 5 days per week, for 50 weeks out of each year, the first $12.50 charged for each office visit is eaten up just to cover the medical malpractice.
According to the Association of American Doctors, the average medical school student came out of med school in 2007 with $139,517. Doctors have to charge enough to cover malpractice, repay exorbitant student loans, hire a competent staff, purchase expensive equipment, lease a clean building, and have some money left to put food on his table and a roof over his own head. The government is forgiving student loans to teachers under certain circumstances. Let’s look at creating a program that will forgive student loans to doctors in exchange for inexpensive office visit and yearly physical charges for low-income patients, and free office visits/yearly physicals for poverty-level patients.
Let’s repeal all the government regulations that have increased health care costs. When I had my last baby, I was ready to go home a few hours later. My doctor agreed I was ready to go, but he could not let me. By law, he was required to keep me in the hospital for a certain number of hours after delivery. That is a decision that should have been between him and me, not something that was legislated by Congressmen who don’t have any medical training. Is it any wonder insurance rates are skyrocketing when Congress bows to the political pressure from every PAC who wants certain procedures required under every single policy?
I had to go the ER a few years ago with a dislocation. It took over 10 minutes just in the check-in line to tell them why I needed treatment. I was one of the few people who had a true emergency, and one of the few who actually spoke English. I spoke to the triage nurse, and he said it’s like that every single night. People, usually illegal immigrants, come in for the sniffles because a private physician will charge them. However, by law the ER can’t turn them away – even if they don’t have insurance – or else the hospital will lose any Medicare reimbursements it is entitled to receive. Most of the patients will never pay a dime for the services they received, even though emergency services cost more than going to a private physician for the same care. So the hospital has to increase all of its fees to cover the costs of those people, much like your retailer has to charge more for its products to cover the costs of shoplifters. Let’s allow ERs to turn away non-emergency cases that are clearly non-emergency cases. Perhaps this could tie in with the proposal to forgive student loans. When an uninsured patient shows up at the ER for non-emergency treatment, he could be referred to a doctor who is providing free/reduced services under that program.
I agree we need to fix our broken system, so let’s just focus on fixing what is broken. Let’s not make it worse by giving the government more control over our healthcare decisions.
Les Miles
August 28th, 2009
9:20 am
Bob you give yourself away. Bussing? And if you are smart enough, please tell the millions of senior citizens in this country how Social Security has failed them. But please Bob, don’t miss your cherished time with Rush Limbaugh on our account. Bussing. Puhleeeeeeze!
Gail
August 28th, 2009
9:21 am
Once again, Mr. Barr, you are so wrong. READ what the MD from Canada said….I have so many friends in Canada and you are out right lying.
They LOVE their healthcare as do my friends in Europe. One friend in Scotland gets all of their medical, dental, etc. when they need it. NEVER a wait or worries. NOW lets go to me…..FIRST off I have worked since I was 16, never took a handout from anybody, including my sorry parents. MET my husband when I was 25, had so-so insurance and then he passed away after 15 years. I was left with 3 kids and cobra for a short while. In the 13 and half years since his death, I have paid appro. 800 dollars a month for insurance. This past year I have been very sick AND my insurance company, BCBS, whom I have paid and never missed a month WOULD NOT COVER TEST I needed. IT took me 2 months to get a appointment with a specialist, even though I was very sick. NOW, I owe SO much in medical bills that I will never be able to pay them all off.
SO what do I have to look forward to in my old age (and I am not there yet) NO MONEY left to my name. I will never earn back what I have had to pay on medical bills out of my savings. DID I say I have had a 5000 deductible with that 800 a month premium???? WE simply do not go to the doctor unless it is a emergency. SO Mr. BARR while I do not want the government to take care of me, there has to be something done to our system. AS it stands right now, I could not even get insurance from another company AS I HAVE A PRE-Existing condition, one that is not even that bad. SO Mr. Barr, while people like you, that have all the money they need and more, there are circumstances that happen to people like me, out of our control, where maybe we do need help. Of some kind. So when you lay down tonight and have NO WORRIES, think of the people like me that cannot even sleep for fear of losing everything, including my house.
Michael Smith
August 28th, 2009
9:23 am
Medicare and Medicaid and the FDA — along with state governments — have proven ruinous to the healthcare market. These programs, and the agencies that administer them, have driven medical costs through the roof.
As one small example: there are now over 200,000 pages of Medicare regulations alone, and the average doctor that treats Medicare patients now spends ONE FULL DAY per week doing nothing but paperwork to comply with those regulations.
Medicare and Medicaid relieved millions of American’s of any financial responsibility for their healthcare — and thus eliminated any incentive to shop for the best value. Simultaneously, the fixed reimbursement schemes of these programs destroyed any incentive to compete between doctors and hospitals.
Meanwhile, the FDA adds several years and millions of man-hours of additional work to develop any new drug.
The Federal law that requires hospital emergence rooms to treat everyone, including those who cannot (or simply will not) pay, has created millions of additional patients who receive treatment at the expense of the rest of us.
State governments have done vast additional damage with insurance mandates that force everyone to pay for coverage they don’t want and won’t use — just so those who need it can afford it. The states enforce these mandates with laws forbidding their residents from buying out-of-state insurance, thereby giving the insurance companies an entire state protected from competition.
And in the face of all this, you wonder why healthcare is so expensive and getting more expensive every year.
And yet so many of you think the solution is a vast new injection of government into the healthcare market — i.e. you want one more HUGE dose of the poison that has already sickened you.
I dare say those of you pushing for more governmenet control of healthcare are going to get exactly what you deserve. Unfortunately, the rest of us will get it also.
We need a public Option
August 28th, 2009
9:24 am
How many of the people who are complaining here planning not to take Medicare when they become eligible? canadian MD you made some valid points but unfortunately we are too dumb to understand most of your valid points.
TG
August 28th, 2009
9:25 am
Given that the current proposals for health insurance reform in the US bear absolutely no resemblance to the Canadian system, I have to wonder: Mr. Barr, why are you writing such irrelevancies? Are you clueless, or are you cynically assuming that the readers are clueless? The first indicates mere ignorance; the second, malice. Which would you have us believe about you?
Gerald
August 28th, 2009
9:26 am
@Deborah in Athens – as an insurance professional, you also know about the “Law of Large Numbers” – that insurance is based on more premium dollars coming than claims going out = profit for the insurer. I appreciate your comments. Were it not for some regulation, they’ed eat us alive. We need, and pay enough taxes to deserve BOTH in the US, not one or the other.
Chuck
August 28th, 2009
9:27 am
More misleading data – just like the woman the insurance companies paraded around and made ads about, the dirty little secret is that the procedures these people are coming here for are elective procedures like plastic surgery.
The Canadian system – quite rightly – places these procedures on a VERY LOW priority, whereas we have a GLUT of plastic surgeons in the US.
booger
August 28th, 2009
9:29 am
Deborahinathens,
I lived and worked in London, and for those who do not have private insurance, complaining about health care is like complaining about the weather. My neighbor had to wait 9 months for an MRI for a knee injury, and another 11 months before surgery.
Also, I do not know where you get the numbers for insurance companiy profits, but they are not even in the ballpark. I just looked on the google financial page and profits for major health insurance companies range from 3.5% to 7.5%. Pick one of the companies you hate the most, and look it up.
BPJ
August 28th, 2009
9:30 am
Two points:
Neither President Obama nor congressional Democrats are proposing the Canadian system. Anyone who says they are is either an ignoramus or a liar (which is Barr?). Neither is anyone here proposing the English system. Obama’s proposal is closest to what they have in Switzerland. I cannot find any record of Swiss people coming here for medical treatment. However, the NY Times found over 750,000 Americans going abroad for medical treatment last year.
Faux News and the rest of the right wing “media” are spreading lies about Democratic proposals, and also about health care in other countries. Not that it really matters what they have in England or Canada, since no one is proposing to import their systems here, but there are a number of outright lies about the English & Canadian systems. There is a British member of the European Parliament, a conservative, who has been on Fox for months denouncing the british system. Finally the leader of his own party – that’s David Cameron, leader of the Conservative Party! – denounced this guy for spreading “outright lies” about the British health care system. My Canadian friends all say they prefer their system to ours. Perhaps you’ve heard the statistic about how on average one has to wait longer for a knee replacement surgery in Canada than here? That was a big right-wing talking point until someone noticed that most knee replacements in the US are covered by -oops! – Medicare. Government health insurance (whose costs are rising more slowly than those of private insurance). That’s especially remarkable when you consider that the “pool of insured” for medicare is old people – excuse me, “senior citizens”- who use health care more often than the general population.
Then there’s the loonies at Investors’ Business Daily, who opined that Steven Hawking would have been denied care under the british system because his quality of life (paralyzed in a wheel chair) would have been considered insufficient. Oops again! It never occurred to these numbskulls that Hawking IS British, and lives in Britain. Hawking issued a statement thanking the British Health service for saving his life.
Of course, none of this about Canada and Britain matters, because NO ONE is proposing those systems here. Got it?
nypeach
August 28th, 2009
9:30 am
Canadian MD, thanks for taking the time to educate us. I think it’s funny that Bob Barr, Mr. Masterpiece Theatre himself, purports to tell us what Canadians think and want. How about a guest column for the AJC? You have offered the most cogent argument yet for healthcare reform.
JackLeg
August 28th, 2009
9:32 am
Here we go again treating the symptoms and not the disease. This whole debate is missing the point. If you get people jobs they will have healthcare. So why not work on creating new jobs? Or we could just reward bad behavior with more perks…. Supply the jobs and the rest will fall into place. Torte reform and letting large groups organize across state lines to get group rates on policies. That is reform, not take over….
Michael Smith
August 28th, 2009
9:34 am
Rebecca concluded:
I agree we need to fix our broken system, so let’s just focus on fixing what is broken. Let’s not make it worse by giving the government more control over our healthcare decisions.
Great post, Rebecca.
There are many laws that could be repealed that would bring down healthcare costs immediately. But the Obama’s of the world are power-lusters wanting ever more control, and willing to promise anything to get it. The only issue is whether the American people will fall for the promise or see it for what it is: a massive power-grab over a huge portion of our lives.
Dual Citizen
August 28th, 2009
9:35 am
I am 53 and lived a total of 26 years in Canada, being born there. The rest of my life has been in the US.
My parents lived and died in Canada, both contracting cancer from smoking. They were treated extensively, promptly and correctly in Canada, when they needed it with no wait.
My aunt, a Canadian, has had 5 surgeries replacing both knees, both hips and an ankle. My uncle, her husband, has has two bypasses. All procedures were done with little wait and without a single cent in out of pocket cost. I COULD GO ONE FOREVER.
For anyone, to say the Canadian system is unworkable is totally ingnorant of the facts. ALL Canadians are treated fairly and without regard to their bank balance. The level of care is world class. REMEMBER THE “ALL” WORD FOLKS….WE WILL NEVER HEAR THAT IN THE USA.
The peace of mind KNOWING you will not be forced into bankruptcy because of medical bills is a given in most of the civilized world. Not here.
All of my US adult relatives work for insurance companies, including my wife. I see and hear the abuses of the system and the automatic denial of claims by insurance companies. This is the only country in the world that allows uncapped profits to be earned by a group of private, FOR PROFIT companies, to determine who gets care and who doesn’t. THEY ARE PRIVATE COMPANIES… THEY CARE ONLY FOR PROFIT, THAT IS THEIR JOBS SILLY?
Insurance companies have a simple motto….”pay us premiums……and we will keep them!” Simple.
People, take your head out of your a___es! Until the PROFIT issue is taken out of the equation, we will all suffer. ANYONE who thinks an insurance company is looking out for the well being of the public is simply an IDIOT!
THE GOVERNMENT PROTECTS US WITH A WORLD CLASS MILITARY…WHY DON’T THEY PROTECT US WITH HEALTH CARE?????????????
DEMAND IT PEOPLE, IT IS A RIGHT IN ALL BUT ONE CIVILIZED COUNTRY…..THIS ONE!!!!!!
I love this country, it is the best, most powerful country in the world…but we are dead wrong on health care….it is time to fix it…..I am a Republican who believes in universal health care..I think there are allot of us.
gtg
August 28th, 2009
9:36 am
so if 17,500 canadians leaving their country for better healthcare over a 7 month period is bad, half a million americans doing the same would be…?
last year my fiance needed GI surgery. we went to india and had a great experience. the level of care was fantastic, the procedure went just fine, and the entire trip cost less than the copay that we’d have paid if she’d had the surgery here (especially since her employer had downgraded their coverage and she now has to pay 25% out of pocket). we even got some siteseeing in to boot.
the savings was especially significant after the diagnosis. between waiting for appointments and waiting for tests, it took 5 months to be told she needed surgery (which we’d deduced from the start). we spent over $5,000 out of pocket on various drugs and tests, most of which were useless (and one of which was done improperly and had to be repeated). the total out of pocket cost, had we had the surgery in the US, was going to be roughly $13,000. going abroad, it was about $9,500
now, i guess i can’t really say anything about the canadian system, as i’ve never witnessed it and have only talked to a couple of people who have been in it. i’m sure it has flaws, as does everything else in the world. but americans really need to pull their heads out of the sand. whether or not you support universal health care, there’s something inherently wrong with a system wherein employed, insured, individuals can’t afford health care. maybe instead of just screeching about how universal health care is the devil, people should start coming up with alternative solutions.
Haliburton Billionaire
August 28th, 2009
9:36 am
“This debate has been completely maligned by special interests, particularly those who make billions of dollars a year off of millions of sick Americans. Bon courage…”
I felt this needed repeating. JJ and Linda are spot on. Too bad so many people in this nation are gleefully ignorant.
Dan
August 28th, 2009
9:37 am
No insurance policy should cover maternity. If you cannot afford a few thousand dollars for a doctor and a hospital room, then you shuld not be having a baby in the first place because you can’t afford to raise it.
BBro
August 28th, 2009
9:37 am
What about these injured girls mr. canadian md oh excuse me was I suppose to put dr in front of that I know how touchy you peeps are;MomOf2Girls
August 28th, 2009
8:21 am
I recently housed 2 young women from Canada in my home for a weekend. One of them had a gymnastics accident almost 18 months ago and dislocated her kneecap tore some ligaments. She is still waiting for surgery. She was given a date that was originally 12 months post injury, but the surgery has been rescheduled 4 times so far. She is now being told it will be next summer. She and her parents have looked into having the surgery here in the U.S., but they are unable to afford it without assistance, so she’s stuck trying to get around her college campus for another year with a bum leg.
Californication
August 28th, 2009
9:38 am
Hey if your “public option” works why not ask you congress or senate rep if they are going to be on it? LOL are you kidding me not one of those elitist will EVER be on the public option i.e.: socialized medicine. But hey it would be good enough for the “common person”.
Hey nypeach, glad you got an education on Canadian medicine, so why does the Prime Minister’s wife come here for treatment? I guess you did not get the whole education…
Jennifer
August 28th, 2009
9:40 am
TG, exactly.
I needed heart surgery in March and what did my insurance company do? They tried like hell to deny it. Like I was just sitting around sipping tea one day and said, “hey, I think I’ll have heart surgery today”. I don’t think so. Finally they agreed they would cover it; however, it wasn’t long before I started getting denial of payment papers in the mail. I guess they didn’t think I needed that extra blood, huh? It’s only heart surgery, right? And, by the way, those touting that there are long waits to see specialists in countries that have public healthcare, you are not 100% correct. If someone is in need of a procedure that is life threatening then they get the procedure. You make it sound as if there are lines and lines of people holding their chests waiting for their hearts to stop pumping outside of some clinic. Germany seems to be doing just fine with the public option and we can, too.
Michael Smith
August 28th, 2009
9:40 am
TG wrote:
Given that the current proposals for health insurance reform…
Notice the subtle way in which the Obamabots have been trained to no longer talk about “healthcare reform”, but instead call it “health insurance reform”. It’s a transparent and lame attempt to further demonize the insurance companies. It’s a tactic of desperation.
Ry
August 28th, 2009
9:42 am
DeborahinAthens – Those statistics are very much skewed. Other countries do not count infant deaths when the baby was born premature, still births, etc. so the 37th rank is not legitimate. The US has the best healthcare system in the world. That is why so many people come here from other countries to receive treatment. Go talk to real people from Britain, Canada, Australia etc and you will learn how poor the healthcare is. For example, in Australia a friend of mine broke his hand and had to wait 1 1/2 days just to see a doctor, but the care is “free”…no not really. They pay extremely high sales tax on all goods. When he came to the US, he couldn’t believe how “cheap” the prices were for televisions, clothing etc. Healthcare does need reform to become even better and more affordable, but there are better ways to achieve that than a government run system which will not bankrupt the country.
Yurtle_the_turtle
August 28th, 2009
9:43 am
I guess the Dalibama and his nuts can run our system into the ground and Ghandi and DeborahinAthens would like that too. I’m tired of Liberals painting themselves as “care providers”. Liberals generally just hate people and only care about their dogma. I read enough hate-mail when Robert Novak passes away about 10 days ago from “caring” liberals.
By the way, I have two family members who work as a nurse and a physician in Canada. They hate it, their patients hate it, and most of the intelligent people in Canada hate it. In the Canadian system, doctor’s pay is capped at $300,000 a year. They usually make that by August, and guess what happens after that? That’s right, they close their office until January! Great system. And for those of you who are in love with Europe, I have several family members who serve in the medical community there as well, and it isn’t better there either. So, if you’re a liberal, please move to China or Europe and get your health system in a government you feel better with.