Health care Never Never Land

In “Sicko,” iconoclastic filmmaker Michael Moore extols the virtue of health care in such liberal “paradises” as the United Kingdom and Cuba. Leaving his audience to wonder where he would choose to go for treatment if he were facing a life-threatening illness — the People’s Hospital in Havana or the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minn. — Moore exhibits the same Alice-in-Wonderland delusion that has settled over the Obama administration.

A majority of members of Congress, too, seem to believe that if only enough bureaucracy and taxpayer dollars are thrown at the health care “crisis,” then everyone in the country will have their every medical need met, when they want it, and at much reduced cost. Such a mind set turns Peter Pan’s Never Never Land into a reality show.

For starters, advocates of the House legislation might want to talk to governors of those states, like Massachusetts, that have already implemented “universal” coverage plans. Increasing program costs, coupled with decreased state revenues as a result of the economic downturn, are causing serious fiscal problems and are forcing those states to consider cutbacks in coverage.

However, witnessing the irrational, “gotta-do-this-now” push in our nation’s capitol to pass comprehensive health care “reform” within the next few weeks, it is obvious the proponents of Obama-care are not interested in anyone throwing the cold water of fiscal reality on their parade.

The House version of the legislation, unveiled by Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) last week, includes substantial mandates on American businesses (including a severe, 8 percent payroll tax on any business that fails to offer health insurance coverage to its employees). Still, the Pollyannaish Pelosi claimed (with a straight face) it would “lower costs to businesses.” This is government logic at its finest — you lower the cost of doing business by raising taxes on those businesses.

Pelosi’s obvious inability to grasp even the most basic of economic concepts was further displayed when she claimed that the “costs to consumers,” too, would be lowered. Apparently, this would be accomplished by placing a new surtax on those American consumers whose income exceeded the levels deemed worthy by the legislators.

Analysts of the 1,000-plus page legislation calculate its 10-year cost to exceed $1 trillion. Other experts fear such a figure greatly underestimates its true cost. Even the Congressional Budget Office calculates that the government subsidy for health care coverage will amount to some $6,000 per person within the next decade, which figures to more than $1.8 trillion.

Pelosi’s bill would also create a government-run insurance plan to compete with private insurers. Such a scenario, of course, is never a fair “competition,” because the government “owner” can always print money, spend borrowed money indefinitely, operate without regard for cost-benefit analysis, and threaten legal sanctions for those who fail to comply. None of these remedies are available to businesses (except, of course, for the “new” General Motors).

The smoke-and-mirrors approach is evident also in the fact that high-income taxpayers, who would already be taxed in order to pay for the “universal” coverage for their less-well-off compatriots, would face escalating taxes if the government fails in the years ahead to achieve targeted “savings” in Medicaid and Medicare. In other words, the government will set “savings targets,” but if it fails to meet them, it is taxpayers who will pay the penalty, not those members of Congress or federal bureaucrats who decide how much to spend on the entitlement programs.

Other industries, including pharmaceuticals, will face increased taxes as well, in order to pay for this “reform.” The more successful drug makers will pay a higher percentage tax than their smaller, less successful colleagues. Once again, success in the business arena is punished in the government arena.

Truly, this bill is a monstrosity.

93 comments Add your comment

Jefferson

July 20th, 2009
5:24 pm

If you are not moving forward, you are backing up.

Chris Salzmann

July 20th, 2009
5:33 pm

Bob,

I hear a lot of griping and no solutions. This country spends over $6,000 per man, woman and child on health care. That’s twice more than most of Europeans, Canadians, etc. So, again, we spend twice as much money than most other industrialized country on earth on health care right now. Logically, that would mean we have the best health care system? HARDLY! This country has 20,000 people dying annually from treatable illnesses because of the lack of health insurance. Ever priced health insurance when you own a small business or are self employed. You have? Good! Now try finding health insurance with all that AND when you have a pre-existing condition. Now tell me what you find? Let me know because I know a few people facing exactly that situation right now.

Also, 50% of all personal bankruptcies in this country are because of health care related costs. Ever calculate how much that ends up costing the tax payer? This includes unpaid bills from ER visits to treat illnesses when it is usually too late or cost 20, 30, or 50 times to treat because of the delay.

For the record, I support a single payer plan with a private option, as most European countries have. I know because my Mom who is 79 lives in Europe under “socialized” medicine and wouldn’t want to change a thing. Yes, the same “socialized” medicine that delivers and COSTS ABOUT HALF than the system we have right now in this country.

When you have some answers, do let us know. Again, I hear complaints but no SOLUTIONS.

BiteMe

July 20th, 2009
6:16 pm

RHONDA, WATCH THAT HOME MODIFICATION! I did that and still lost my house, as Countrywide accepted the agreement for 5 years and then turned around 2 months later and said the contract was “void” – I paid $750 to get the modification done and thought I was OK, but was not. DO NOT TRUST IT. God Bless and I hope you and your family make it through these hard times.

hryder

July 20th, 2009
6:53 pm

There could be sanity in the health care proposal if all federal elected officials, yes Congress, the Prez and his minions, were legally required to avail themselves of such health insurance and their current plan abolished. If not, any health insurance program changes should never occur until the countries economy has achieved a semblance of normalcy.

Rhonda

July 20th, 2009
6:58 pm

WELL, Mr. Barr, after a long day, I just found out that I no longer have my LITTLE check. My job was cut. So now there is no way I can pay the 800 a month for insurance, mortgage, utilities, credit cards (WHICH I HAD TO USE TO LIVE, etc etc. SO, tell me now what I need to do. Do you not understand that there are millions without insurance????? NOW I have somebody telling me the loan modifications are not even truthful. Thanks for letting me know, Biteme. And also, Rockerbabe, yes, I have BUT my 2 sons are over 18 and I stopped receiving theirs (they are in collge), so now I just receive my daughters, for one more year! It stops at 18 and mine has also stopped. Believe me, I am now ready to just give my house away. But, Mr. Barr, I would love for you to answer the question—what do people like me do? I am not a lazy nor a dumb person, but there are no choices for me. By the way, I am Republican, but slowly getting turned off by the party because of the things that are said about “people like me”….
People that “want” the government to take care of them. I AM NOT like that. I, unfortunately, am a victim of circumstance. AND now if you all will excuse me, I am going to go finish my crying. THEN I will pick myself up and start looking for a job TOMORROW, maybe 2 Mr. Barr.

Buddy El

July 20th, 2009
7:14 pm

Bob:
For many years you were my hero until you suddenly decided to run for president. You, and anyone else smarter than a fifth grader, had to know that you would only pull votes from the Republican candidate. Can you explain this or do I continue to ignore you and your ideas?

Larrybobba

July 20th, 2009
7:25 pm

Rhonda

Good luck to you. I hope everything works out for you.

I too used to be a Republican, until this past election when I enthusiastically voted for Obama. Republicans and Libertarians have an ‘every man for himself’ attitude. Capitalism on the way up… socialism on the way down. They don’t want government action unless it’s THEIR house that’s on fire. Obama only wants to return tax rates to Ronald Reagan’s level and they label Obama a socialist. Many Republicans and Libertarians are just selfish hypocrites.

Larrybobba

July 20th, 2009
7:33 pm

Buddy El,

Take it easy on Bob. Obama won by a whopping 9 million votes so Barr was not freckle of a factor in the election. If you’re looking for a problem, take a look at Sarah Palin… now there’s a problem for you Rebublicans

Hell is Other People

July 20th, 2009
7:42 pm

The system is too screwed to recover, regardless of who is in charge. Unless we can turn the clock back to 1776 and start all over again there is no way out of this fiscal mess brought on by both parties.

America: too divided, too in debt, too stupid collectively to know any different.

The etch-a-sketch that is the world needs a really good shake to clear out the clutter. Pandemic, anyone?

jt

July 20th, 2009
7:59 pm

In response to Chris Salzmann-

When you have some answers, do let us know. Again, I hear complaints but no SOLUTIONS.

Here is a good start.

Allow consumers to purchase health insurance companies across state lines.
Widen the availability of medical savings accounts.
Allow consumers to deduct the cost of insurance from their taxable income.
Allow doctors, nurses and medical suppliers to take a credit against any income taxes due for the market value of services provided free to those living at or below the poverty level.

The current crop of incumbants in congress will never allow these easy steps to be taken ,because it takes away their respective powers.

Keep voting republican or democrats. You get what you deserve.

The REAL GodHatesTrash, Superstar

July 20th, 2009
8:10 pm

Thanks for the clarification, Mr. Barr, although it appears you’ve spent a good deal of time in your life on the public teat for your health insurance – the CIA, a federal judgeship, and 8 years defending marriage and managing failed impeachment trials, etc. And let us not forget the two decades you were on your father’s health insurance – he, too, was a public sector employee.

Have you ever had to make a payroll Mr. Barr? Have you ever had to deal with a business downturn or a bankrupt or slow-paying customer, and still make sure that your employees’ insurance premiums get paid?

Have you ever been a loyal employee left holding the bag when for one reason or another your employer stops paying his bills, or changes insurance companies, or decides to lay you off because you’ve gotten older and his cost for your health insurance premium goes up?

Somehow, I doubt it.

The REAL GodHatesTrash, Superstar

July 20th, 2009
8:16 pm

Jt, of course Mr. Barr needs no advice on how to suckle the government teat.

He’s spent most of his life firmly attached to one, and now he makes a good living complaining about it.

jt

July 20th, 2009
8:21 pm

The REAL GodHatesTrash, Superstar

July 20th, 2009
8:16 pm
Jt, of course Mr. Barr needs no advice on how to suckle the government teat.

He’s spent most of his life firmly attached to one, and now he makes a good living complaining about it.

I cannot dispute that.

And he is a lawyer.

Whatever.

Stumpy

July 20th, 2009
8:47 pm

Quit missing a major cost factor in health care…. paying for illegals aliens health care. That could save us billions. The people use the emergency room as a primary health care resource because they know they will not be turned away. Truth be told, nobody is ever turned away. I believe that if our government actually enforced it’s own immigration laws and deported these bloodsuckers, health care would be much more affordable. Of course, we would also have to stop them from coming back. This we can also do if we just resolve to do it.

Chris Salzmann

July 20th, 2009
9:56 pm

jt July 20th, 2009 7:59 pm SAID:

In response to Chris Salzmann- When you have some answers, do let us know. Again, I hear complaints but no SOLUTIONS.

Here is a good start.

JT SAID: Allow consumers to purchase health insurance companies across state lines.
CHRIS SAYS: Consumer protections for Health Insurance are governed by the individual states and vary dramatically from state to state. CA or VT have vastly superior consumer protections than states like GA or AL. This would does not answer the question how to deal with consumers with pre-existing conditions or are they just left to fend for themselves since no insurance company will cover them. Buying health insurance is not buying baseball cards on EBAY. I know since I hold several insurance licenses.

JT SAID: Widen the availability of medical savings accounts.
CHRIS SAYS: They already are. Which planet do you live on? Many banks now offer them. So how do these accounts help low income or unemployed households who don’t have the means to put aside any significant amount of savings?

JT SAID: Allow consumers to deduct the cost of insurance from their taxable income.
CHRIS SAYS: Actually, employer based plans are already pre-tax though this tax benefit should be expanded to individual consumers.

JT SAID: Allow doctors, nurses and medical suppliers to take a credit against any income taxes due for the market value of services provided free to those living at or below the poverty level.
CHRIS SAYS: So, the poor and low income under your plan, should now have to depend on the charity of individual doctors and nurses? Like that African saying goes, “The haves have it and the poor can beg”. Nice solution there and so typical.

Explain again how “your” plan helps those who are unemployed, have low incomes or who have pre-existing medical conditions? Lets see, it goes BEG, BEG, and SOL, right? That’s essentially what you just proposed.

Basically, you just coughed up the typical Republican Talking points that offer no solutions at all. Essentially, DEREGULATE EVERYTHING AND ALL PROBLEMS WILL BE SOLVED!!! Yeah, that worked great on Wall Street. What’s that saying? Didn’t work the first time, lets try it again and pray for a different outcome. I think they call that “idiot logic” in professional circles and there’s no shortage of that in conservative circles.

Chris Salzmann

July 20th, 2009
10:02 pm

Stumpy July 20th, 2009 8:47 pm SAID: Quit missing a major cost factor in health care…. paying for illegals aliens health care. That could save us billions. The people use the emergency room as a primary health care resource because they know they will not be turned away. Truth be told, nobody is ever turned away. I believe that if our government actually enforced it’s own immigration laws and deported these bloodsuckers, health care would be much more affordable. Of course, we would also have to stop them from coming back. This we can also do if we just resolve to do it.

CHRIS SAYS: Not really worth even commenting on. Another conservative solution is “Get rid of the Illegals and everything will be solved”. BTW, did you know that most of your conservative immigrant baiting Georgia politicians forbid the IRS from raiding farms during picking season? Yeah, conservative values at work: Let the immigrants first do the dirty work for little pay, THEN DEPORT THEM. LOL. Pathetic!!!

Chris Salzmann

July 20th, 2009
10:23 pm

Landon Lord July 20th, 2009 12:00 pm SAID: The small businesses and middle income tax payers are going to be taxed out the wazoo (many small businesses — the employers of the majority of American workers — will go out of business if the Administration’s Healthcare proposals pass —

CHRIS SAYS: WOW! Sounds good if it weren’t total BS. So, please explain how small businesses, contractors or middle income households can pay for affordable health care insurance right now??? Throw in pre-existing medical conditions and I really would like to know since I know many people in that boat? ROFLMAO. Yeah, nice try if it weren’t so pathetic.

This your the latest conservative talking points you have??? Sorry, been there, done that and the SYSTEM’S BROKEN!!!!!!!!

Stumpy

July 20th, 2009
10:41 pm

Chris, you’re a dumbass… If it’s not even worth commenting on, then why did you comment? Q.E.D.

I never said that getting rid of illegals would solve all our problems. I DID say that removing them would alleviate a major burden on our health care system. Disprove that!

Further, I am a Virginia resident who did not vote for any of my Democrat Senators or Representative. So you can’t hang any of their failures on me. Conservative that I am, I believe in the enforcement of the laws that we have on the books. That means, deport the illegals who are taxing our medical system (among other things). Disprove that also, please! If you can…

Chris Salzmann

July 20th, 2009
10:55 pm

Stumpy July 20th, 2009 10:41 pm SAID: Chris, you’re a dumbass… If it’s not even worth commenting on, then why did you comment? Q.E.D.

I never said that getting rid of illegals would solve all our problems. I DID say that removing them would alleviate a major burden on our health care system. Disprove that!

CHRIS SAID: You’re right. I was being a dumbass!!! LOL. Seriously though, good luck in enforcing current immigration laws. I take a pretty hard line on immigration too since I have many friends and co-workers who are legal immigrants after having jumped through countless hoops, given the run around and waiting 2 or 3 years before getting their permanent residency in the US. But again, good luck on that since vested interests won’t allow that to happen, namely the farming and construction industry to name a few.

Charlie

July 21st, 2009
12:15 am

Those who favor current health care legislation often respond to criticism by claiming that Democrats are offering a plan while opponents offer none. Proponents, however, seem to have missed the point; there should be no plan. Health care (and might I add that when they control your health care they will regulate your every waking moment) is not the concern of the Federal Government. The solution to our problems is that the Federal Government is not the solution.

Eric

July 21st, 2009
1:53 am

There is no doubt that our healthcare system needs to be fixed, but not at the cost of bankrupting our grandchildren. I fail to understand where the Democrats feel that healthcare is a right provided by our constitution. If anyone can find where our founding fathers wrote that into the document, then let’s go, but its not there. Ask our Veterans or elderly how their government ran healthcare is working for them. The elderly are not getting government discounts on their medications. So are you really ready to put your blind faith in the idiots in Washington???

There are many ignorant people who have never experienced government provided healthcare. Ask any Canadian citizen how spending 50% or more of their earned income and what they really think about their GREAT preventative healthcare, America your eyes will be opened. You have no idea what you’re asking for and you do not want it. For those that believe that cheap healthcare is the answer look up the words (Cheap and Quality) they are not synonymous terms and you get what you pay for.

How about we setup our healthcare like car insurance, if you diet and maintain healthy weight, non smoker etc your insurance rates will be cheaper. You mean if we are proactive in reducing heart disease, diabetes and other health related issues our insurance rates would be less??? Deductibles which help fray cost and hypochondriacs from going to see the doctor for hang nail.

I am no healthcare expert, but I am wise enough to see that our government has failed miserably with Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, Veterans welfare and we are blindly going to hand our government another program that they can rape the funds from and mismanage…..No dam way, Washington has not seen a tea party like the one that will be coming if they push this 1,000 plus page rip-off through. We know they don’t read what they vote on!!!

America wake up and stop falling asleep at the wheel!!

Nick

July 21st, 2009
4:05 am

I find the increasingly common view that government is some kind of benevolent force to be very disturbing. Have we been bribed and deceived to the point where the idea that government is a necessary evil has become viewed as ancient paranoia?

Many people subscribe to the saying that power corrupts. What do you expect the outcome to be of this massive growth in the size and scope of government? Utopia? I get it, the tendency of man to amass and abuse power throughout its existence has suddenly evaporated.

Here’s another interesting saying… the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

TechLover

July 21st, 2009
5:38 am

Nick: I find it disturbing that some think that private industry is some kind of benevolent force. They are out for money, not the common good. I also find the “I’ve got mine, scr*w everyone else” attitude when it comes to health care. It’s also disturbing that so much of the oppostion to health care for all is from so called “Christians”, ie The Christian Coalition, the “God” party Republicans, etc. who soehow have made Jesus into some sort of capitalist hedge fund manager instead of the man who said, “And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” Billy Bov: Why do people need insurance for “for everyday type medical expenses like: regular checkups, broken bones, routine surgeries and medications?” Either you’re loaded and it doesn’t matter or you haven’t paid for any of the above lately. A doctor visit can easily cost $150 or more, which is often just the cost of them seeing you. Throw in some labwork, an EKG etc, and you could easily have a %500 dollar bill. The daily cost of a hospital room where I work is around $1,200, just for the room. You also have to scan to charge for every urinal, box of kleenex, iv catheter, bag of fluid, package of EKG leads, plus waaay overpriced meds, etc. If by chance you end up in the ICU or CCU (where I work), the room is over $12,000 per day plus all the add on charges, plus the doctor bills you, you get billed for x rays, Ct scans, etc. then the radiologist bills you and on and on. Catastprohic coverage can still leave you owing tens of thousands. See my above posts on the cost of my treatment. Don’t forget that medications can eaily cost $150 or more per each per month. Gee, I can’t imagine why some folks want coverage.

Mark

July 21st, 2009
9:06 am

Eric, the argument that health care is not a right provided by our constitution is just about the silliest one can make. There are many things you expect the government to do that are not spelled out in the Constitution. The Constitution says that it has been established, among other things, to promote general Welfare. Is health not Welfare?

Ask our elderly how the government ran healthcare is working for them? YOU should do that. You would find how they appreciate Medicare, and Social Security. There are legitimate gripes about health care everywhere, but again, you SHOULD really ask Canadians whether they would like to exchange their health care system for ours – it would open your eyes.

StJ

July 21st, 2009
10:12 am

Socialism is “coming”…? No, it’s ALREADY HERE, and “socialism” doesn’t adequately describe it. A more correct term would be “communism” or “fascism”, albeit in an early stage.

Chris Salzmann

July 21st, 2009
10:16 am

Eric July 21st, 2009 1:53 am SAID: There is no doubt that our healthcare system needs to be fixed, but not at the cost of bankrupting our grandchildren. I fail to understand where the Democrats feel that healthcare is a right provided by our constitution. If anyone can find where our founding fathers wrote that into the document, then let’s go, but its not there. Ask our Veterans or elderly how their government ran healthcare is working for them. The elderly are not getting government discounts on their medications. So are you really ready to put your blind faith in the idiots in Washington???

CHRIS SAYS: Yes, ask our veterans how health care is working for them and many of them will be thankful for the help they receive from the many veteran hospitals around the country. I especially like this quote, “The elderly are not getting government discounts on their medications”. ROFLMAO. Have you heard of Medicare and its PART D which is the PRESCRIPTION DRUG PLAN!!!!. You obviously don’t have a freaking clue so shut up before you bedazzle us with more examples of your abundant supply of ignorance!

Eric July 21st, 2009 1:53 am SAID: There are many ignorant people who have never experienced government provided healthcare. Ask any Canadian citizen how spending 50% or more of their earned income and what they really think about their GREAT preventative healthcare, America your eyes will be opened. You have no idea what you’re asking for and you do not want it. For those that believe that cheap healthcare is the answer look up the words (Cheap and Quality) they are not synonymous terms and you get what you pay for.

CHRIS SAYS: Yeah, ask the Canadians and they’ll tell you they are pretty satisfied with what they have. My mother lives in Europe under “socialized” medicine and wouldn’t change it for anything in the world. I’ve lived in Europe and also experienced their health care system and its definitely far better than what we have here. I have to wait a week to see my “in-network” doctor here by appointment. In Europe, I could see a doctor the same day and pay a co-pay of about $15. Also, About 22,000 people die each year in this country because they lack coverage and are unable to treat preventable illnesses which sometimes escalate into life threatening sicknesses. Over 50% of all personal bankruptcies in this country are related to medical expenses. Have you also estimated how much that ends up costing the taxpayer?

So Eric, here are your answers from someone who has experienced other health care systems and found what we have here pretty sad. This is especially true since the United States spends about $6,000 per man, woman and child on health care. That’s TWICE as much than the vast majority of industrialized nations. So, ARE WE GETTING OUR MONEY’S WORTH????

Chris Salzmann

July 21st, 2009
10:19 am

StJ July 21st, 2009 10:12 am SAID: Socialism is “coming”…? No, it’s ALREADY HERE, and “socialism” doesn’t adequately describe it. A more correct term would be “communism” or “fascism”, albeit in an early stage.

CHRIS SAYS: You ever lived under “Communism” or “Facism”??? Speaking from experience??? NO? Wow, another UNINFORMED and IGNORANT OPINION!!! Another shining example of ignorant discourse.

Chris Salzmann

July 21st, 2009
10:26 am

Charlie July 21st, 2009 12:15 am SAID: Those who favor current health care legislation often respond to criticism by claiming that Democrats are offering a plan while opponents offer none. Proponents, however, seem to have missed the point; there should be no plan. Health care (and might I add that when they control your health care they will regulate your every waking moment) is not the concern of the Federal Government. The solution to our problems is that the Federal Government is not the solution

CHRIS SAYS: Yeah no plan at all. If you have a small business or are self employed, too bad. If you have a pre-existing condition and NO INSURANCE COMPANY WILL COVER YOU, too bad. LMAO. Yeah, lets all return to the law of the jungle. That’s what Republicans and Conservatives call progress!

Blue

July 21st, 2009
12:12 pm

So for all of you lefties who like to reference all of the people who “can’t afford” insurance or health care, what is your proposed solution for all of the young professionals who CAN afford insurance and CHOOSE not to carry it? Included in the numbers of “those without insurance” is this group that are in substantial numbers. You all comment as if there are only two groups; haves and have-nots. I’ve got news for you…there is a large third group called “choose-not-to”. Why should I pay more taxes than the 35% of my money that already goes to it to take care of people who can and choose not to? You have NO WAY to dilineate those who can’t and those who choose not to. And I would be ALL FOR helping those who TRULY can’t.

Copyleft

July 21st, 2009
12:22 pm

Blue: I’d tell them the same thing I tell childless couples who pay for public education, or apartment-dwellers who pay for public housing, or lucky people who pay for others to be rescued by the fire department.

“We’re trying to have a society here, not a random collection of selfish a-holes. Chip in or get out.”

Rhonda

July 21st, 2009
2:11 pm

Yes, I am back. Mr. Barr never answered any of my questions. Now, I have lost my job, widow with 3 kids, 2 in college, mortgage, bills, do not even use a/c or heat because I cannot afford it. I HAVE ask numerous talk radio host and now Mr. Barr. What would you suggest for a widow of 54 years old, no college, who is about to lose her house, her only asset!!!!! to do????? I cannot even get loan modification nor insurance. Just what do you suggest Mr. Barr? and do not tell me you are not reading these posts. SO, I would love to hear any suggestions you have.

elisabeth

July 21st, 2009
3:23 pm

Being well is complicated. Not every problem can be solved with a “pill” But not every problem can be solved without a pill. Many factors need to be considered. But each and everyone of us need to be responsible for their own health or their own illness. Many people are under treated and many people are over treated. I work in a nursing home, and see so many illnesses that could have been prevented. A lot of them are based on “PAIN,” if that is managed than I feel that the other illnesses could have been prevented. But, PAIN is under treated and dismissed very often by our “medical experts.”

Ed Miller

July 21st, 2009
5:37 pm

Life isnt fair people. Rich people will always have an advantage over poor people, read up on the U.S.S.R. if you don’t believe me.

jacksmith

July 21st, 2009
7:24 pm

AMERICA’S NATIONAL HEALTHCARE EMERGENCY!

It’s official. America and the World are now in a GLOBAL PANDEMIC. A World EPIDEMIC with potential catastrophic consequences for ALL of the American people. The first PANDEMIC in 41 years. And WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES will have to face this PANDEMIC with the 37th worst quality of healthcare in the developed World.

STAND READY AMERICA TO SEIZE CONTROL OF YOUR NATIONAL HEALTHCARE SYSTEM.

We spend over twice as much of our GDP on healthcare as any other country in the World. And Individual American spend about ten times as much out of pocket on healthcare as any other people in the World. All because of GREED! And the PRIVATE FOR PROFIT healthcare system in America.

And while all this is going on, some members of congress seem mostly concern about how to protect the corporate PROFITS! of our GREED DRIVEN, PRIVATE FOR PROFIT NATIONAL DISGRACE. A PRIVATE FOR PROFIT DISGRACE that is in fact, totally valueless to the public health. And a detriment to national security, public safety, and the public health.

Progressive democrats the Tri-Caucus and others should stand firm in their demand for a robust government-run public option for all Americans, with all of the minimum requirements progressive democrats demanded. If congress can not pass a robust public option with at least 51 votes and all robust minimum requirements, congress should immediately move to scrap healthcare reform and request that President Obama declare a state of NATIONAL HEALTHCARE EMERGENCY! Seizing and replacing all PRIVATE FOR PROFIT health insurance plans with the immediate implementation of National Healthcare for all Americans under the provisions of HR676 (A Single-payer National Healthcare Plan For All).

Coverage can begin immediately through our current medicare system. With immediate expansion through recruitment of displaced workers from the canceled private sector insurance industry. Funding can also begin immediately by substitution of payroll deductions for private insurance plans with payroll deductions for the national healthcare plan. This is what the vast majority of the American people want. And this is what all objective experts unanimously agree would be the best, and most cost effective for the American people and our economy.

In Mexico on average people who received medical care for A-H1N1 (Swine Flu) with in 3 days survived. People who did not receive medical care until 7 days or more died. This has been the same results in the US. But 50 million Americans don’t even have any healthcare coverage. And at least 200 million of you with insurance could not get in to see your private insurance plans doctors in 2 or 3 days, even if your life depended on it. WHICH IT DOES!

If President Obama has to declare a NATIONAL STATE OF EMERGENCY to rescue the American people from our healthcare crisis, he will need all the sustained support you can give him. STICK WITH HIM! He’s doing a brilliant job.

THIS IS THE BIG ONE!

THE BATTLE OF GOOD Vs EVIL!

Join the fight.

Contact congress and your representatives NOW! AND SPREAD THE WORD!

God Bless You

Jacksmith – WORKING CLASS

(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ian-welsh/americans-lives-vs-insura_b_241703.html)

Kathy

July 22nd, 2009
9:38 am

Jack Smith, you’re a dolt! How many people do you see flocking to Cuba, Guatemala, Britain or Canada for medical care? We are hardly in any State of emergency. People are NOT dying in the street. If you are sick, you go to a DR and you will not be refused treatment. The issue of who pays can easily be rectified by calling the hospitals financial assistance representative who can a) make a payment plan that is affordable or b) forgive your debt if you’re in dire straights as MANY hospitals, have funds paid for by those nasty rich people, pharmaceutical companies, and middle class caring Americans who believe in charity and not forced government thievery. And before you rattle off the benefits of HR676 apparently you obviously don’t care about the fact that HR676 would outlaw private insurance unemploying 14-17% of Americans, would seriously cripple your rights to privacy, and would snatch 17% of the GDP serioulsy debilitating the economy all for an incorrect interpretation of the WHO’s statitics you LIBS like to Taut as evidence of failure. Statistics lie my friend. Whereas I can’t go into all the reasons for that ranking, I can illustrate one point, Live birth. The US leads in Infant mortality rate. THat has to do with the differences in defining LIVE BIRTH. In the US every child born whether still born or not is considered a live birth. In other countries, a child isn’t considered born alive unless they are a certain weight. Premies are not counted. Socialized countries also pad their stats a bit. When the WHO compiled their stats, they did find evidence that leaders of Socialized countries plain out lied but why don’t you go to Costa Rica when you’re diagnosed with cancer and see how you do as Costa Rica obviously has better care, hospitals, access to treatments and specialists than we do. What this bill in the House does not do is contain costs. There will be no savings. There will be only be increased costs and increased taxes and sooner or later, we will be taxed at 60% like France but since you like living on 40% of your salary, why don’t you donate 60% of it to that charity hospital so that your neighbor can have health care. And while your demonizing big Pharma, Big Insurance, you seem to forget about a segment of the population. THe segment of the population with diseases so rare that clinical trials and experimental treatments are the only option. I am one of those. I have Sarcoma, a rare cancer of the soft tissue. I have stage IV cancer and cannot be happier with the care I have received and how great my insurance company has been in covering my experimental treatments. If a government beurocrat determines what the protocol should be, taking that power away from the Dr., what will we do when there is no protocol? THe protocol for my cancer is surgery, radiation. There are no approved chemos. Let me be the first to challenge this so called reform on Constitutional grounds. I believe I have the right to life. I believe I have the right to my property and I will ascertain that I have the right to fight for my life which is my property and the government cannot interfere. HR676 is plain outright UNconstitutional. Government run healthcare is not patient focused. It’s money focused. It’s government focused. But if you were to get a rare disease Mr. Smith, I don’t think you would lay down and die to save money for the government would ya? The Huffington Post and the Daily Kos both written by “Junior Journalists” are rags. Nothing more and as for Obama, he could give a darn about you or your healthcare. He just doesn’t want to miss an opportunity for a government money and power grab to acheive his Socialists dreams. Mr Obama is a Communist and was a member of the Chicago New Party, a Communist/Socialist org here in Chicago. He is for Government, not for the people. Sure you may trust HIM with this power but someday, down the line, we will elect a leader who you may not. Do you like the idea of a President having enough power to tell you that to save money, they will deny you life saving treatment? What if you’re his political opponent? And if you really want to see what happens when you give tons of money to the government, look at the social security debacle, the Medicare debacle, and the Post Office. All broke and instead of Congress being held accountable, we all will be as we pay more and more to fix their mistakes. Good vs. Evil, oh brother!!! It’s more like freedom for the people vs bondage by the government.

Charlie

July 22nd, 2009
6:20 pm

Rhonda, it’s unfortunate but bad things happen. Perhaps you should direct your anger to the Federal Government which has taxed your income for your entire life and squandered money which you could have saved for a rainy day.

Jason

July 23rd, 2009
2:36 pm

All the people against National Health Care options are idiots that do not realize the economy is bad. They don’t realize that the Democrats have nothing to gain from this. Obama was put there to change things and now that he is, scare tactics dominate the scene. Big surprises. How many Health Insurance Company Lobbyists do you people think are in Washington painting the pockets of those opposed? Which lobby group is paying the Democrats on this one? Having another “option” does nothing more than create the competition that the “so-called” Republicans push for in capitalism arguments. If people are getting the coverage they want, they can keep it right up until get canceled for something.

Bottom line is this going to pass. No matter what you think. Obama is doing a great job considering.

I am guessing everyone doesn’t remember our last president too well…

Hans

July 29th, 2009
11:57 pm

Copyleft: “We’re trying to have a society here, not a random collection of selfish a-holes. Chip in or get out.”

WTF? So now it’s come to this, huh? It’s selfish to not want to let government thugs take our hard-earned money by force? Civilization is doomed.

[...] The gloves are off and the fight is on, and I intend to join.  Cato.org will soon launch a series of radio ads (you can here one here) and Bob Barr has come out with this [Health care Never Never Land] in the Atlanta Journal Constitution [...]

Mark

August 7th, 2009
1:43 am

Bob, with the outright lies being told by the Republicans and the Conservative Groups, you are on very thin ice objecting to the objectivity/truth as to what the Democrats are proposing. The conflagrations being created by conservative stalwarts like Rick Scott and his Conservatives For Patients Rights, the Rick Scott that was at the heart of one of the biggest Medicare frauds ever when he was the CEO of Colombia/HCA where the company was fined $1.7 Billion dollars, simply have no integrity. These ’shout downs’ are manufactured and funded by the corporate and insurance companies with huge financial stakes in preserving the status quo. They make a lot of money from the status quo, and any public option health plan as part of the reform effort will adversely impact their money. Their tactics are malicious, vindictive and dishonest in every pejorative sense of those words. Until the Republicans, the right-wing and the ‘conservatives’ call off the rabid dogs and try to engage in civil public discourse on Health Care Reform, you folks will eventually have to live with the strong public repudiation and backlash that is coming your way. More genuine information will get out, more people will see what is being proposed in more objective terms and once again, the right-wings tactics will backfire; I just hope they backfire so completely that ‘conservatives’ are permanently marginalized by the American Public. After the last two elections, one might have thought that ‘conservatives’ had learned that their phony ‘Swift Boat’ type campaigns, the Bush Adminstrations incredible dishonesty and the unprecedented number of Bush appointees’ that left either under a dark cloud having been caught in the grasp of unethical behavior, or else on their way to jail would have proved at least a little bit enlightening.

Deek Dykstra

August 9th, 2009
12:51 pm

The Cato institute, the heritage foundation, and their ilk were founded when johnson declared his war on poverty. They have done an excellent job of defending the struggling american billionaires ever since, and continue to do so to this day. The war on poverty ended long ago. the poor lost. Now it’s the middle class that they are going after, in that time honored tradition of wedge issues. America will wither and crumble if the billionaires continue to run amock, writing laws to line their pockets and bleed ever more money from whats left of the middle class.

[...] Health care Never Never Land [...]

[...] Health care Never Never Land [...]