Would mega-expansion get us closer to a playoff? I don’t think so

 I get asked a lot whether or not big-time conference expansion would bring us closer to some kind of playoff in Division I-A football. Doesn’t it stand to reason that if we end up with four, 16-team conferences, a playoff of some kind is more likely?

I don’t think so. And here’s why.

Amid the clutter of noise that surrounds the issue of expansion, we occasionally have a moment of clarity. That really didn’t come yesterday when Commissioner Jim Delany told reporters at the Big Ten Conference meetings that his league might look South for expansion. Understand that Delany’s comment was just another shot across the bow of the SEC, the Big Ten’s only rival when it comes to financial supremacy in college athletics. When you’re reading all of these expansion stories and projections remember that at the end of the day it is about only one thing: The SEC vs. The Big Ten. Everything else is just conversation.

The clarity about which I write this morning came last Friday when Delany did a brief Q&A with The Chronicle of Higher Education.

Delany was asked: What should be the role of the NCAA in regulating some of the commercial issues in college sports?

I’m paraphrasing his answer but essentially Delany’s response was that the NCAA really doesn’t have a role in this regard. That’s because the schools and the conferences should control and benefit directly from the revenue they generate. The NCAA is not there to spread the wealth: “No one questions that Harvard or Texas have a (big) endowment and don’t share it with Hofstra and South Alabama.”

And then Delany said this. Read this very carefully:

“But intercollegiate athletics is sort of unique in that institutions that have certain advantages—based on demographics or history or tradition or fan base—somehow are seen as the sources of resources for others that do not. I don’t think that’s going to happen anytime soon, but there’s certainly a lot of gnashing of teeth, like why doesn’t the Rose Bowl spread its revenue around to Boise State?”

Read this even more carefully:

“Well, partially because we developed it. We built it, it’s our tradition and to the extent that it’s successful, it’s successful for our institutions. So that’s essentially a home-rule approach. I think it’s an honest approach. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with money, but life’s a lot easier when you have it than when you don’t.”

Delany is one of the most blunt and to the point men I’ve met in college athletics. He is nothing if not brutally honest. His point, I believe, is that while the media, and fans, and Congress want college football to throw all the money into a big pot, hold a playoff, sing Kumbaya, and share everything equally for their entertainment, that’s not the real world.

Here is what I believe Delany would say to those people if he could:

“Hey guys, let’s have a little reality check here. The Big Ten and the other power conferences like the SEC have built college football, and specifically post-season football, into a multi-billion dollar enterprise. ESPN is going to pay the BCS $125 million in each of the next four years. And they ain’t paying that kind of money to see Boise State play Utah for the national championship.

“The reality is that our institutional brands, which have been built over 100 years of hard work, are what bring the eyeballs to the television sets and create the value. Remember that the networks came to US in 1998 in order to build the BCS. They determined that the six equity conferences (ACC, SEC, Big East, Big Ten, Big 12, Pac-10) gave them the best value. It has now become one of the most successful brands in the history of sport.

“Now does Ohio State or Alabama have an advantage over other schools because of size, tradition and fan base? They sure do and we’re not about to apologize for it or give it away. I work for the 11 presidents of the Big Ten and my job is to put our institutions in the best possible position, both competitively and financially.

“We’ve tried to be fair for the sake of keeping peace but all we get is grief from Congress, the media, and the fans who think every conference should be equal and we should just give away the equity our institutions have built. Here is another dose of reality: Before the BCS the five non-equity conferences (Mountain West, WAC, Conference USA, MAC, Sun Belt) were making relatively little money from bowl games. In the past five years those conferences have collectively taken home about $80 million from the BCS. I would say we’ve been more than fair.”

Here my ultimate point on this exercise. The Supreme Court decision of 1984 determined that individual schools, not the NCAA, own the property rights to a school’s football games. And the benefits that are created by these institutional brands will accrue to the institutions. That’s the law. Delany’s point is that his institutions should not be forced to give away the equity they have built any more than Steve Jobs should be forced to share his I-Pad revenue with the folks who make the Kindle.

The counter argument, of course, is that educational institutions are, for the most part, tax funded and should not be conducting business like Apple or Kindle. But I’m afraid that train has already left the station.

If we have expansion Armageddon, the conference’s first and only goal will be to protect its members and to give its specific television partner (s) the best bang for its buck.  College football’s regular season, which is the best of any organized sport, will become even more important because so much money is invested in it. The Big Ten could decide that playing in the Rose Bowl is in its long term best interest because that way it controls the equity that it has created. The SEC could decide that its champion will play somebody in the Sugar Bowl and wait for the polls. In other words, the big conferences will become even more insular and detached from the other conferences in Division I-A because that is in the long-term best interests of their institutions.

I hope that doesn’t happen. I hope that in four years we can come up with a way to have a four-team playoff for the national championship.

But I also know that the big conferences are terrified that college football might go the way of college basketball, where the vast majority of the public outside of Durham and Chapel Hill doesn’t pay attention until the NCAA Tournament.  The commissioners are going to do everything in their power to protect the regular season. Will it ever come to the point of the biggest conferences pulling away from the NCAA to form their own organization? I don’t think so. I sure hope not.

That’s why I think if expansion comes in a big way it moves us further away from a playoff than ever.

 

MACINTYRE FUND UPDATE: Last week I wrote about former Vanderbilt coach George MacIntyre, who is bedridden with MS and was forced out of his home by the floods in Nashville. Former Vanderbilt players are raising funds to get permanent housing for Coach Mac and his wife, Betty. The papers have been filed now all donations are tax deductable. If you want to help, please send a donation to:

Betty & George MacIntyre Flood Relief Fund

Green Bank

4205 Hillsboro Road, Suite 101

Nashville, TN 37215

 

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217 comments Add your comment

TommyJack

May 19th, 2010
8:47 am

I always value TB’s take.

Grantland Rice

May 19th, 2010
8:59 am

Delany sounds desperate, like a 8 year old clamoring for attention. Seems he can’t stand the fact that the Big 10 has lost it’s luster and has taken a backseat to the SEC.

Ron Mexico

May 19th, 2010
9:00 am

There’s a little hubris going on here thinking that Delany is materially concerned about the SEC. It’s the Big 10 vs. the rest of the college football world.

But you’re right, 4 16-team conferences doesn’t lead to a four team playoff, because of the need to include the little guy. It doesn’t even set up nicely for an 8 team playoff. That said, I don’t think a 16 team conference leads logically to the Big 10 breaking away from the BCS and going back to a limited deal with the Rose Bowl – there’s too much money on the table from the BCS to walk away from.

14TH--ON THE WAY

May 19th, 2010
9:02 am

Very interesting, Tony. Now, when are you going to paraphrase what Mike Slive is thinking?

Not happening but...

May 19th, 2010
9:08 am

I really don’t see 16-team conferences becoming a reality, but if they do, I have to believe we would get closer to a playoff. Having say 4 mega conferences would pretty much destroy the Big East and all the non-AQ conferences so there wouldn’t be anyone left to share the wealth with. Any of the teams currently in these conferences who are not picked up by someone would more than likely just fall into the Division 1-AA level…most of which deserve to be there anyway. Frankly, I’d like to see the Big Ten expand to 14 teams with 1 Big East team and 2 Big 12 teams, have the Pac-10 expand to 12 teams, the SEC stay at 12 and Notre Dame being left with no one left to play but the service academies and the MAC. In twenty years, the city of South Bend can convert the building once used for the College Football Hall of Fame into a “Remember When Notre Dame Had Football” museum.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
9:14 am

If Notre Dame would just go ahead and join the Big 10 everything would be fine. If not, I think the major changes that could come from stronger conferences raiding weaker conferences will be bad for the game. The game that mind you has the best regular season by far and is the best overall sport in the country.

travy

May 19th, 2010
9:17 am

good piece, but i think a ‘nat’l championship’ will always outweigh a ‘conference championship’ to everyone from fans to tv networks to the colleges. take that golden ring out of the equation and the excitement level goes way down.

college football wouldn’t be the the first organization to dine on the golden goose.

Alphare

May 19th, 2010
9:18 am

One question I have for Delany is: why do you call you conference Big Ten if you have 11 teams?

Is that 11th team a red-headed stepchild?

Can you change it to Big Eleven? Man, Big Ten people are not very smart. I think all our SEC fans can agree on that one.

RamblinRed

May 19th, 2010
9:19 am

Reading more of the quotes from the Big 10 meetings shed light on alot of the expansion topics.
First, it isn’t happening this year. They are not even going to vote on it. So next year is going to be the big year when everything breaks loose.
Second, the drivers for the Big 10 are very different than say the drivers for the SEC or ACC were – which was creating a championship game. They all but said they don’t care about the championship game and the relatively small money they believe it creates for the conference.

Third, the driving factors for the Big 10 are demographics, TV markets, and academics. They see more of the population heading to the SunBelt region and they want to be able to tap into those students. Second, they want to expand the cable nextworks that carry the Big 10 Network so they can both increase their carriage fees as well as they ad rates. Third, all the Big 10 schools are members of the AAU and with the exception of Notre Dame – any school they consider will likely be a member of that organization.

Delaney’s comments are actually a nice positive for GT. While I don’t think the SEC necessarily would have GT high on its expansion candidates list – it likely moves up if they think they can grab GT as a defensive measure to keep the Big 10 out of the Atlanta market. I don’t think it is a coincidence that GT became the first new member of the AAU in 9 years. I don’t think GT will join the Big 10, but I do think they will use the Big 10 as leverage to get into the SEC if a big conference re-alignment happens.

It is going to be an interesting 12 months.

Mike

May 19th, 2010
9:27 am

I miss the way New Year’s Day used to be. Let’s go back to the old system where almost every bowl on NYD meant something and had something to do with the national title race. Here’s hoping the conferences will do just what Tony says here. Abandon the BCS and go back to the old bowl system.

P-Man

May 19th, 2010
9:29 am

I’m of two minds about this. On the one hand, I long for the days when there wasn’t this pressure to win a national championship or be considered a failure (pre-BCS). On the other, if we are going to have a “champion”, it needs to be decided on the field, not by polls/computers. If we’re going to have this pressure to win at all costs, then these coaches and players need to have the opportunity to determine their own destiny, and not have it be left up to the whims of others.

Not happening but...

May 19th, 2010
9:31 am

Mike, I agree with going back to when New Year’s Day meant something, but disagree on completely going back to the way it was. If we could cut the number of bowl games in half and not have any automatic conference tie-ins (thus allowing a 1 vs 2 every year and avoiding another Georgia vs Hawaii game), then I say let’s do it.

Reptiles Rule

May 19th, 2010
9:39 am

College football is a winning formula. Every Saturday in the fall is monumental. Every game counts. Every Saturday in the fall we all wake up like little kids on Christmas Day. So why do we always want to screw with success?? Why do we want to become like the NFL or the NBA or HNL Hockey? I want to keep waking up on those fall Saturday mornings with that same excitement and not knowing what dramatic upsets will unfold that day. Now pretty soon someone’s gonna want to tell me there’s no Santa Claus.

SimpleDawg

May 19th, 2010
9:40 am

Delany talks like “Bill the Butcher” from GANGS OF NEW YORK. He believes that his Rust Belt cronies rule the roost…..but I detect a bit of envy in his stated desire to expand south. His brand is a faded brand….bleached out by defeats when his upper crust teams play SEC upper crust teams. The Rose Bowl for all of it’s “Grand Daddy of Bowls” hype has held very few meaningful games over the past 8-10 years.

Delany likes to “throw around the weight of the mighty Big Ten ( +1 )”………

Will Rogers once said, “Be careful when you feel like throwing your weight around….someone else may want to also.”

Forrest Gump is the most famous Bama grad

May 19th, 2010
9:51 am

Well, if there was a playoff system in college football, teams like Bama, Ohio State etc would lose to teams like TCU, Boise State and Utah. We can’t have that, can we……..

dawgfan

May 19th, 2010
9:52 am

Something tells me this whole Big 10 expansion thing is a lot of hot air and a ploy for attention. The Big 10 is looking up to the SEC and they don’t like it. It just sounds like a bunch of talk with no action. We’ll see.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
9:53 am

Agreed with Delany. I may dislike Big10 teams but thank them for keeping playoffs out of CFB.

Keep the season as it is and up the scholarships back up to 95. The higher scholarships will weed out many of the nonBCS teams that are suddenly undeserving Cinderellas playing easy schedules. The CFB season has been a weekly playoff making it more fun than any other American sport becuse every game counts. The BCS system has worked more times than not giving a true National Champ.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
9:56 am

The Big 10 network is available in Atlanta on Comcast. If they look south, I hope they consider fellow AAU member Georgia Tech. Playing Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin and the like would be better than the current scheme of Virginia, Maryland, NC State, etc.

Don

May 19th, 2010
10:00 am

Hey Tony, how’s your 401k/IRA’s doing? Soon you won’t even care about college football, mr college football when your savings have evaporated.

Kiffinisatosser

May 19th, 2010
10:02 am

Did Delaney actually say that the Big 10 was looking to expand southwards? I have not been able to find that quote. ESPN claims that one should not confuse studies about southward demographic shifts and inviting southern schools into the Big 10. Tony, did you misinterpret?

Dan

May 19th, 2010
10:04 am

Dalaney is dead on.

No GT

May 19th, 2010
10:06 am

Georgia Tech can barely hold their own in the ACC…they wouldn’t be successful in the Big Ten. They would just be another another tiny stadium school that can’t sell out their games like Northwestern and Indiana. They can replace Pitt in the Big East when the Big Ten snatches them away next year.

Charles from Reeltown

May 19th, 2010
10:08 am

Playoffs would ruin the only pure sport left other than fishing…oh wait, I forgo about the pro bass circuit. Scratch that.

Another second of these idiotic NBA and NHL playoffs and I may become a mass murderer…thank goodness there are no masses in Reeltown.

McDawg

May 19th, 2010
10:08 am

the only thing i see coming out of this expansion business is mediocrity not to be confused with parity

Tech Fan Since 1950

May 19th, 2010
10:13 am

At the end of a given football season, if Boise State ranked #1 and Utah ranked #2 and they were going to play each other for the national championship they would have an audience Tony. Maybe not initially as big as some “traditional” football factories, but a profitable audience none the less. Yes, I know dollars seem to rule over integrity when dealing with the BCS. The whole point about this issue is to give everyone a fair shot. If Alabama or Ohio State or Southern Cal are going to play Utah during the regular season and get credit for beating them, then Utah should get credit for playing these teams and for beating them too (on the way to a national championship opportunity). It truly is not a national championship now, and will never be a national championship, until all teams in Division I-A football have the opportunity to fight to be a national champion. That’s the beauty of the NCAA playoffs in other football divisions and other sports. Yes, I know, it’s just about dollars to the TV boys, conference athletic officials, and sports journalists.

AlphaDawg

May 19th, 2010
10:20 am

Just an idea…What about a 14 team MEGA conference? SEC adds Texas and the Tarheels. SEC adds two rabid fan bases, boosts SEC’s basketball identity(which I don’t think it needs) by having 4 of last ten NCAA tourney champs, not sure of final 4 appearances and 6 of last 10 BCS champs. UNC would gain Football cred which it is desperatly seeking, and slowly gaining with Butch, and 14 teams wouldn’t dilute the non-conference games that many SEC teams historically enjoy(FSU v UF, UGA v Tech etc). And I’m not even mentioning baseball. This is just an idea, but I imagin the money ramifications both in football, basketball, and even baseball would be huge for all schools involved.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
10:23 am

That’s not his point, 1950. He is saying that the reason people watch is because of the brand awareness that the football factories created a long time ago.

A Boise St. – Utah title game might get eyeballs but they’d do it only because of the groundwork laid by people before them. Basically they didn’t build anything but now that it is built, they want to profit from it too.

murfdawg

May 19th, 2010
10:24 am

Now I understand why the Buckeyes think they are THE only school to play football. They have their little Rose Bowl game and get a nice check, go back to Ohio and wait to play another Big 10(11) schedule. Delany has to make the Rose Bowl out to be the biggest game every year because it is the only big game the conference plays. Since The ohio state university has never beaten an SEC team, Delany has to protect his team and his conference. He will never vote to have a playoff because the Big 10(11) will eventually have to play an SEC team. And we know how that will end up.

Seems like I remember Vince Dooley taking on the NCAA long time ago about keeping tv money. I can’t remember all the details, but Dooley wanted to form a separate conference for big time football and leave the NCAA. Maybe it is time for the SEC, the Big 12, and eight other schools to form a Baby NFL. The NCAA can have the Big 10(11) and the PAC 2 and the precious Rose Bowl. Then Congress can have Boise State and Utah playing in a BCS bowl every year. The Baby NFL will be divided into divisions and have a playoff and a champion determined on the field. Then the players can step into the NFL, nobody has to worry about graduation rates and the schools will make more money than the Rose Bowl could ever imagine.

Tony, you could be the first Commissioner of the Baby NFL. Now it is up to you.

kgator79

May 19th, 2010
10:32 am

Reptiles Rule….while I certainly agree that every saturday right now is important and we dont want to mess with that too much. I do believe that having even an 8 team playoff still keeps every saturday important if say we base it off the top 8 ranked BCS teams. Because its not like getting into the top 8 is something all that easy. You can be ranked say #4 or #5 going into that last weekend against a big rivalry game. Lose it and you may fall out of that top 8. So the point is, the games would still be very important every week. A 16 team playoff would not be as much so though.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
10:35 am

I can see a split developing in the NCAA. There could be a Big 10 / PAC 10 alliance with 16 or more schools in each that truly separates itself from the rest of Div. 1A (BCS). The Rose Bowl would be the big prize, and no doubt they would scoop up some other bowls. The Big 10+ would control the TV Markets from the great plains to the the northeast. With the addition of Colorado and possibly BYU, the PAC 10+ controls everything west of the Rockies. If Maryland and/or Ga. Tech goes Big 10+ those Atlanta/N. Virginia/D.C./ Maryland TV markets would be big plums. And, the Big 10+ would retain its all-AAU status.

[...] Jim Delany tells Joe where he can stick his manhood (h/t Tony Barnhart). … But intercollegiate athletics is sort of unique in that institutions that have certain [...]

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
10:40 am

murfdawg – I like the idea of a “baby NFL,” but why have it associated with and funded by universities? It would be a good place to go for ex-high school players who cannot meet the minimum academic requirements that regular applicants have to meet.

Ramblin Wrecker

May 19th, 2010
10:43 am

No GT,

I guess tying for the Coastal Division in 2008 and winning the ACC in 2009 doesn’t qualify as “barely holding their own” in the ACC?!?!?!? Moron.

I think it is not a coincidence that GT has recently been added to the AAU. I think GT saw that as a leverage move to make themselves an attractive target for the Big 10 and thereby a more strategic target for the SEC to protect its home turf.

GT will be in the Big 10 or SEC if there is expansion.

Charles from Reeltown

May 19th, 2010
10:43 am

NFL Minor Leagues….a concept whose time has come.

Boss

May 19th, 2010
10:43 am

I agree with everything RamblinRed said except I think GT would take the Big 10 invite over the SEC invite.

As it stands today, the Big 10 pays out far more money than the SEC per school, has the most alumni, and has excellent academics. There is no doubt whatsoever, that as it stands today, the Big 10 is the premier conference in the nation.

If they expand to 16 via AAU schools like GT, Texas, Maryland, Rutgers, and throw in ND for good measure, they will become the 1 national superconference. Even if the SEC goes to 16, it will be via the ACC schools and will remain a regional conference.

Now you decide:

A 16 team national-level superconference with all members in the AAU, or in the case of ND, very highly regarded academically. With the biggest payout in the land by far. With it’s own network. With a lock on college sports for decades to come. America’s conference.

vs.

A 16 team SEC. All southeast. All awful academic schools except for Vandy which is itself is a joke in football. Millions less per year.

It’s not even close, GT would take the Big 10 invite in a heartbeat. SEC Tradition was nice, but the future is here and it’s the Big 10 going national.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
10:45 am

Tech Fan since 1950, The viewership would decline as it has with basketball tournament. The regular season would become boring just as in Basketball.

Jim from Crestwood

May 19th, 2010
10:50 am

The colleges should cease their cosy relationships with the No Fun League. Why should the NFL be allowed to free-ride off the colleges as a minor league? How do you do it? Simple, force all football players to be proper students.

Tech Fan Since 1950

May 19th, 2010
10:55 am

Dan, please give us a break. Those “brands” you speak of were built on the backs of all the Division I-A schools that have been beaten up by the likes of Alabama, Ohio State, Southern Cal, etc. If all the so-called “brands” just played each other eleven games out of a season, there would never be an undefeated team. Everybody would be so beat up they might not be able to field a team through December. The BCS is built on the backs of the Tulanes, Rice’s, New Mexico States, you pick a school with a poor win-loss record, etc. Hey, I remember when Alabama played Tampa and Georgia played Yale and it hasn’t been as long ago as you think.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
10:57 am

Hold on, there. The University of Florida is an AAU member (as is Vanderbilt). But the problem of academics is deeper than that. Ole Miss and Miss. St. are Tier 3 schools, and Kentucky, LSU and Arkansas are Dead last, tied for # 128 of Tier 2. Dump those schools, Merge with Texas and Texas A&M (AAU members) and possibly some other Big 12s. Then form an association with the ACC for a southern mega-division of the NCAA.

Hoopie

May 19th, 2010
10:58 am

I like Delaney’s candor. Let’s quit trying to inject socialism and income redistribution into CFB.

NCAA football has the only truly relevant regular season in sports. Anything more than a 4 team playoff will ruin that regular season. All pro league regular season are a joke and I quit watching those years ago.

All the way turnt up

May 19th, 2010
10:59 am

A Georgia Tech student, walking to his car in the Home Park neighborhood just north of campus, was robbed Tuesday night.

According to a crime alert sent out by Tech police, the student, whose name has not been released, parked his vehicle at 11th Street and Atlantic Drive in northwest Atlanta shortly before 10 p.m., and “began walking away when he realized that he forgot something in his vehicle.”

Hoopie

May 19th, 2010
11:00 am

There are/have been numerous pro football minor leagues ..Canada, Europe, Arena, etc.

m

May 19th, 2010
11:05 am

The BSbcs is the dumbest system ever develped by mankind.

We need a 16 team playoff…and we need it NOW.

We don’t need anyone’s opinion to make any difference…only ON THE FIELD PLAY should determine who advances.

Think of college basketball or baseball with the idiotic BSbcs…it would be LUDICROUS…but not any more LUDICROUS than it is right now in football.

Let the champion have to earn it on the field and not have it handed to them.

And THANK GOD AND GREYHOUND that gomer Gailey is gone forever.

Jim from Crestwood

May 19th, 2010
11:05 am

All these previous leagues failed because the colleges have been the actual minor league system. Banishing the non-students from college football (good-bye 3/4 of SEC rosters) would create the need for the No Fun League to develop its own minor league system and we would have just as much fun on Saturdays.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
11:06 am

Those schools were paid for those beatdowns. Plus, is anyone gonna pay for a Tulane game? Please.

Anonymous

May 19th, 2010
11:08 am

Read in today’s AJC:

“IRS goes after UGA”

Is Richt in charge of the financial records as well?

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:09 am

You can knock the PAC 10 all you want to, but they play each of the other members every year. Take USC (and Kiffin, please). Last year their OOC schedule was Boston College, Notre Dame, Ohio St. and San Jose St. This year it is Hawaii, Virginia, Minnesota and Notre Dame. Notice the lack of Div. 1AA patsies.

T3

May 19th, 2010
11:12 am

Ohio State has beaten both 2 SEC schools Vandy & Kentucky 3 times each.

Just sayin…

Butts Wagner

May 19th, 2010
11:12 am

Either Minor League Football or just stop giving taxes to colleges and let them pay players. Then we’ll get a sense of the true worth of college athletics vs college academics when it comes to alumni.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:13 am

The City of Atlanta shouldn’t have closed all of those police precincts.

KJ

May 19th, 2010
11:14 am

“the Big 10 is the premier conference in the nation.”

aaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahah… Good one gnat. You SHOULD move to the Big 10, you’d fit right in with all of the delusional idiots in that conference.

Unforgiving

May 19th, 2010
11:14 am

Hey, I think it is a great idea to expand so the Big Ten and others can have another easy game in their conference. This will have more impact guaranteeing those one or two teams in getting a BCS bid. You guys are doing a lot to get this stuff done. However, it is the play on the field that matters. One day you may know this.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
11:18 am

Hold on, there, Boss:

Of the top 50 or so universities listed on US News & World Repeports’ 2010 Best National (read that public) Universities, 8 were Big 10 and SIX were SEC.
Not exactly an overwhelming margin.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:19 am

Even a 4 team playoff would ruin the regular season and create more crying about rankings than solving of problems.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
11:20 am

And that doesn’t include Vandy!

HugoStiglitz

May 19th, 2010
11:20 am

I actually appreciate Delanys honesty. He said what we all know already that College Football is a business. Its not a sport anymore. There is no reason for the rich guys who run these teams to give up the fat paycheck they are getting in the name of fairness and crowning a real champion for the first time.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:22 am

Notre Dame plays 3 away games this year, plus 2 neutral sites (Meadowlands and Yankee Stadium). Still doesn’t top Auburn’s 8 home games, though.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
11:24 am

I think you’re right, Otto. Just look at this past year. Who would have been in the four team playoff? Obviously Texas and Bama because they were both unbeaten major conference champions, but who after that? Before the bowls, everyone thought TCU was better than Boise. It just creates more issues.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:25 am

G8R GRAD – And it also doesn’t include Northwestern.

RxDawg

May 19th, 2010
11:26 am

It’s hard to argue with Delaney’s points.

Steve

May 19th, 2010
11:26 am

If one conference expands, they all will expand to remain competitive. Not on the field, that does not really matter to men like Delaney, but where it matters, in the checkbook. They are all competeing for the media $$$ and the conference with the biggest demograhic footprint will get the most media $$$. Bottom line!

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
11:28 am

I don’t know, Tony. I think there is another reading that could be given to Delaney’s comments. When viewed in the context of the resentment that the power conferences have with the way the NCAA runs the basketball tournament, I think what Delaney is suggesting could be that if there is a playoff, those institutions that created the interest in the first place (in this hypothetical-the 4 super conferences) are going to keep the money and we aren’t going to be splitting it with the NCAA or any small fry conferences either. Ergo, we will participate on a playoff system, but it will be one delivering all of the eyeballs for the game. Nothing personal Boise State, it’s just business.

The reiteration of the comments about geographic and demographic issues for expansion give credence to the possibility of Tech being considered. Is it a long-shot, sure. But once the ball starts rolling, there is no telling where it would come to rest.

Reptiles Rule

May 19th, 2010
11:31 am

kgator79…I understand your point regarding an 8 team playoff system. The problem is that eight becomes sixteen, then sixteen becomes twenty-four and twenty four becomes thirty two etc etc. Look no further than college basketball and the NCAA Tournament expansion. And soon enough THAT number will be in the 90’s (almost was this year) rendering an already watered down season into…well, let’s just let ‘em all in and forget about the regular season. It is no wonder that college basketball ratings are down from just a few years ago. And let’s not even talk about the NBA or NHL ratings. Why ruin something that is so wildly popular and is talked about year round as witnessed on these blogs…???

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:33 am

G8R GRAD – The ACC and Big 12 each have 8 in the USN&WR public top 50.

Scott

May 19th, 2010
11:36 am

You can drop any talk of Texas joining some SEC mega-conference. Not. Gonna. Happen.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
11:37 am

Thanks Delbert, I didn’t realize Northwestern was a private school.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:37 am

East Cobb Hokie

May 19th, 2010
11:39 am

4 Mega Conferences will (in my opiniobn) result in a 4 team playoff. 4 teams would have to win their conference championship game. This would avoid blocking a very deserving team, like Auburn a few years ago that was undefeated, including winning the SEC CG.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:42 am

Also on the list from Tony’s article, how many time where the 4 team model solves a problem with the 3rd team, does it create a problem with picking the 4th team.

Utah will still be wasting time in Congress wanting a bigger playoff and they’ll get it. Just as basketball started out with 8, football will grow killing the regular season and just as in basketball the playoff itself will decline in interest.

HugoStiglitz

May 19th, 2010
11:43 am

There is only one fair way to do a playoff. Every conference champion gets into the tournament. There are 12 FBS conferences therefore you can either have a 12 team playoff (4 first round byes) or a 16 team playoff with 4 at large bids. It would be the only fair way to do it. A 4 team playoff wouldnt solve anything. If they did it this way they could probably get the NCAA to recognize it also.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:45 am

I’ll take the fun of the regular season and current problems with Auburn being left out in ‘04 and UGA in ‘07 over the playoff (even 4 team) or mega conf.

Also this is from someone that is a life long UGA fan who grew up with season tickets and very strong Auburn ties in the family.

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
11:45 am

G8R Grad, let me help you with your arithmetic. In USN&WR’s top 50 National Universities there are 5 Universities from the Big Ten, 5 Universities from the ACC and 2 from the SEC-Vanderbilt and #47 Florida.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:47 am

Otto – More lipstick on a pig, as they say. Do the Big 16/PAC 16 alliance and the “SEC” 16 and “ACC” 16 alliance, and you have a 64 team playoff, assuming they want to.

By the way, adding Texas, Texas A&M, Kansas and Iowa St. to the SEC adds 4 AAU members.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:48 am

HugoStiglitz,

The basketball tournament started with Conf champs only but grew to include non champ when USC was left out while UCLA was on a roll.

The argument was USC being left out due to playing a tougher conf deserved to be in the Tournament.

A 4 round tournament would decrease ratings in the regular seaon and over time lower ratings in the tournament itself.

Jim from Crestwood

May 19th, 2010
11:49 am

Where is Bama in this academic ranking? I guarantee you we are in the Top 10 universities locted in Alabama…right?

Otto

May 19th, 2010
11:50 am

Kansas and Iowa St. to the SEC? please learn something about the demographic and politics of College Sports before posting comments and wasting bandwidth.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:51 am

“64 team playoff, assuming they want to.”

Clarifying that, 64-teams play round-robin to win their division, and then 8 team conference/alliance playoffs.

Tex

May 19th, 2010
11:52 am

Boys, you need to be disabused of the notion that any of the big schools in my state will allow their conference to be run by anyone who thinks that real BBQ comes from a pig. This is the real cultural divide and the SEC and teams from my state are on separate sides of it. However we can both join together and condemn any conference where BBQ is used as a verb rather than a noun (Big 10 are you listening?).

PMC

May 19th, 2010
11:54 am

I understand why they behave the way they do I simply beseech the Jim Delaneys of the world to give us the BEST bowl matchups.

Please. PLEASE give us good bowl matchups. I don’t care about the mythical national championship. That’s going to be speculative even with a small playoff. I don’t want a situation again where USC is playing an extremely average Illinois team in a bowl because of tradition when there is a better matchup available. Keep the money. I get it, you don’t want to share…. but give us great matchups at least in the bowls so we can enjoy the games at least.

Blow up the traditional bowl matchup deals. It’s bad for the economics of college football as a whole for all the conferences.

Forget the playoff… give us great matchups.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
11:55 am

Funny comment, Tex.

But I love me some pulled pork!

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
11:55 am

Otto – these mega-conferences make that secondary. It’s no more of an oddity of BC and Miami in the same conference. I’ve been following college sports since 3-channel, black and white days.

Charles from Reeltown

May 19th, 2010
11:56 am

PMC’s post = post of the day…if not the year.

PMC

May 19th, 2010
11:56 am

A month of talking and anticipating 2 weeks of great bowl matchups would be an epic end to the college football season.

Charles from Reeltown

May 19th, 2010
11:57 am

Tex’s post = truth

Charles from Reeltown

May 19th, 2010
11:57 am

Paul Finebaum = God made flesh and bone

T3

May 19th, 2010
11:59 am

Delaney understands “business.”
Any organization has “go to where the market is.”

In this case, its really about the demographic “market.”
Delaney clearly understands this.

As Gretzky use to say, “You dont skate to where the puck IS.
You skate to where the puck is GOING TO BE.”

State of Nebraska has approx 1.8 million TOTAL residents.
State of Georgia has approx 8.5 million TOTAL residents.

How many Big10 alums live in Nebraska?
How many Big10 alums live in Georgia?

Over a 10, 20, 30 year horizon, which “expansion candidate”
represents the bigger potential financial gain to the Big10 network,
University of Nebraska or GT. GT, by a “financial” mile.

IMHO, the purpose of Delaney making his pronouncement of “southward expansion” has nothing to do with “sending a shot across the SEC bow.”

The REAL purpose was to “subtully” put potential expansion candidates on notice that the Big10 is considering coming to call. Its a professional & graceful way of prompting possible expansion candidates to start doing your own due diligence on the idea of joining the Big10, so that if/when the Big10 calls, you’ll have carefully evaluated your own standards and requirements BEFORE-HAND.

The fact that SEC super-homer Barnhart, potrays this as nothing but a pissin match between the Big10 and the SEC tells you how
narrow-minded Barnhart is. Foks, the Big10 isnt coming to “raid” the SEC. The Big10 clearly sees that their “market” is changing significantly, and the Big10 has to change with it.

GT, Maryland, and possibly Virginia all seem to
nicely fit the “market” the Big10 is after. All 3 are also AAU members.

And BTW, AAU membership is an INVITATION-ONLY organization.
GT didnt just suddenly “choose” to join.
They were INVITED to join. A big difference.

However, the “timing” of the invitation might prove interesting.

HugoStiglitz

May 19th, 2010
12:05 pm

Otto, so if im understanding correctly you would rather Fox and ESPN make more money then have College Football crown a real champion? If College Football is going to stay the way it is now then they should just get rid of the notion of a national champion. They can have their bowl games, and make lots of money and just not crown some random team champion. Conference championships would be what every team strives for which might be for the best. This would make even more sense if the mega conferences come along.

Marble Rye

May 19th, 2010
12:05 pm

If you’re like Delany, and come only from the money angle, there is justification based on that alone. Too capitalist IMO. However, some things in college football should transcend money, and the problem is so few things do. How many more (b)millions does the BigTen or SEC or any of the other Big Six need to thrive? Would sharing the championship opportunity with the MAC, C*USA or MWC really put the Big Six conferences at a highly disadvantageous position? Is the Big Six’s greed that out-of-control? One of this country’s founding principles (or myths, however you want to look at it) is equal opportunity, and it’s clear Delany thumbs his nose at is. How modern-American.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:06 pm

Delbert The SEC does not care nor will care if schools are AAU members. The Big10 may care. The SEC will be after championships and money.

T3

May 19th, 2010
12:09 pm

WTH does…”Too capitalist”…mean ??

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:12 pm

Delany is what America was built on. Sharing with those that have not worked their way up is modern American.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:15 pm

Hugo, Money is a by product of having a sport that is fun and interesting to watch. Football championships are more fun to watch as it is harder to attain with more variables.

Why drop a National Championship? The system is working.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
12:15 pm

Otto – Yeah, that’s one of the hangups with the SEC in general. It’s not education, it’s just football. But the only possible championships right now are conference championships, so that part of the argument isn’t even in play.

Dan

May 19th, 2010
12:17 pm

Marble Rye, no one is telling the smaller schools that they can’t exist or can’t try to compete. That qualifies as equal opportunity. The fact is that there just isn’t a big market for their product because, quite simply, it isn’t that good. That’s American.

And too capitalist? Please move to Europe. Those words should not even be in your verbiage.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
12:18 pm

“WTH does…”Too capitalist”…mean ??” – T3, you need to write a letter to Nancy Pelosi on that one.

PMC

May 19th, 2010
12:24 pm

I can’t enjoy brisket and pulled pork?

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:24 pm

Education? The kids get an education in Football and if they want the chance to go after whatever major they want. They are often given a chance at that education when they do not have the funds or requirements to otherwise get that degree. They also are given major networking opportunities while in school. How many athletes that do not make it in sports end up in their own business ventures or coaching after sports?

If we follow the Big10 model kids that did not have the funds or requirements out of High School should be denied a chance at a college degree or networking with the boosters of the athletic programs?

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
12:25 pm

I’m sticking with my Ford trucks. No “Government Motors” in the future for me.

HugoStiglitz

May 19th, 2010
12:27 pm

How is the system working Otto? Every year we all talk about how much of a joke college footballs postseason is. Congress even has introduced bills to force it to change. We never have any idea who the best team is at the end of the season. Some teams cant win the MNC regardless of how well they play, or who they play. Its just a big mess. The MNC is just another bowl game anyways, there is no real reason for why the teams there got there so why call it a National Championship?

Tex

May 19th, 2010
12:28 pm

PMC, all lovers of BBQ can and probably do love both the steer and the swine. The quesion really is what constitutes “proper” BBQ in your mind. In most US non yankeefied jurisdictions that is a binary choice between swine or steer.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
12:30 pm

“If we follow the Big10 model kids that did not have the funds or requirements out of High School should be denied a chance at a college degree or networking with the boosters of the athletic programs?”

There’s so much wrong with that statement that it is hard to address in one comment. I guess it could be boiled down to the “pay for play” argument.

leroy

May 19th, 2010
12:32 pm

could somebody please explain to me why the current KING of the SEC is playing Ga State? Cannot BAMA man up and play somebody to give an example to the rest of the nation that yes we can play these “sisters of the poor” but we choose not to and be the leaders that we are? This school use to hate Curry years ago so why are they not telling him to Blank off now and play somebody? The only answer to me is that they are cowards and so is UF for playing Charleston Southern who was forced to move up to Div IAA because of the basketball team. They (CS aka Baptist College) are beneath High School in facilities and a stadium. If you people want to walk around and brag about your conference than quit playing these Wussies with a capital P. MAN UP

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:37 pm

The system is working Bama was the best team last year and Texas 3rd best behind UF. OU and UF were the year before, Texas lost a 3 way tie. ‘07 LSU was the most deserving. More times than not the best teams play in the title game.

Miami and FSU worked their way up from where many of these programs that the media says does not stand a chance. Follow FSU’s and Fresno State’s model of play anyone anywhere and the program can build into something with hard work. Bama put alot of hard work in their program years ago to be the first southern team to win the Rose Bowl. UGA scheduled Yale to open Sanfard Stadium. For some reason the media seems to think the hard work to build the program is no longer required.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
12:38 pm

So paying them with a chance at a college education is a bad thing?

1eyedJack

May 19th, 2010
12:43 pm

Tony, could you suggest to Delany that he run for President of the US? Spread the wealth my eye.

Jim from Crestwood

May 19th, 2010
12:52 pm

Hey, don’t knock Georgia State. bill Curry is a great coach. We bama people loved him and treated him and his family with the greatest of respect while he was here! I think GaSt will be a challenge!

HugoStiglitz

May 19th, 2010
12:53 pm

The only problem with that Otto is that we really dont know if Alabama was the best team last season. They might have been but they never had to prove it. You cant really say that more times then not the best teams play in the title game because we dont really have a good way of deciding who the best teams are. Boise St may have blown Alabama out if they played them. We really have no idea.

athensdawg

May 19th, 2010
12:56 pm

As stated best by Lewis Grizzard:

“I went to the Ohio State Michigan game one year, and let me tell you, it was about as exciting as two mules fighting over a turnip.”

Sounds like the Mules want to keep all their turnips to themselves. They can have ‘em.

SEC Big 10 man

May 19th, 2010
1:05 pm

Don’t knock the Big 10. It is a hell of a lot more civilized than the SEC rabid insanity. And the quality of the football is surprisingly comparable. Tex needs to try a brat and some beer in Madison sometime…it is damn good stuff.

Wooly1

May 19th, 2010
1:10 pm

It’s not the first time I have heard that sentiment, and as a capitalist I have to agree with the basics of it. However, I would argue that in general the fans of college football, the ones who take every year spend hard earned money to take football trips with family and friends, the ones who spend the money to go to bowl games, watch it like a religion on TV and generate all of this revenue stream for these schools does not give a rats rear end about the money (sure its a fun side not and we all cheer for the little guy or the down trodden and want it to at least appear to be fair) but generally thats not our beef. What we do want however is a REAL National Champion.. we want to see that crystal football raised up by a team that it wasnt just handed over to because some press dude or coach (who btw hasnt even watched much college football outside his small world, especially when compared to rabid fans of the game) voted it that way or some data fed computer has crunched a bunch of numbers based on a mathematical logarythm that some nerd deems to be statistically correct! We want it raised up by a team that worked to get there and when they arrived took names, kicked butt and earned it the old fashioned way…. they beat everyone else and WON IT!

SOMISSEAGLE

May 19th, 2010
1:17 pm

No one wants to see Utah vs. Boise State for the national title? No one wants to see Wake Forest vs. Washington State for a national title either. Some schools are in the BCS because they’ve always been there. Grandfathered in. In reality, when re-alignment occurs, some bottom feeders need to be thrown out. Hear me, Mississippi State, Indiana, Washington State???

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
1:20 pm

“Seems like I remember Vince Dooley taking on the NCAA long time ago about keeping tv money. I can’t remember all the details, but Dooley wanted to form a separate conference for big time football and leave the NCAA. Maybe it is time for the SEC, the Big 12, and eight other schools to form a Baby NFL.”

Murfdawg,

I don’t remeber Dooley ever talking about this but it doesn’t surprise me in the least. Awhile back I remember Alabama having informal discussions with several major football powers about breaking away from the NCAA and forming a superconference consisting of about 20 big time teams. I don’t remember all the names but some of them were Texas, OU, USC, ND, etc.

The issue was about tv money and general dissatisfaction with the NCAA. The talks never got real serious but the idea has been out there before about a group of premier programs taking their ball and forming their own mega conference.

Probably will never happen and if it ever did it wouldn’t be anytime soon. But stranger things have happened.

The Reason Bama Sucks

May 19th, 2010
1:28 pm

is its mouthbreathing knuckledragging fanbase. Anybody happen to catch Bill Maher on Friday night?

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
1:28 pm

Leroy,

Alabama does “man up” and play big time out of conference opponents. In the 2000s we played home and homes with OU, UCLA, and played 1 game contests with Va Tech, Clemson, etc. We pick up Penn State this year for a home and home.

As far as these “sisters of the poor” get real. Every sec team as well as acc, big 12 and big 10 teams play a series of anywhere from 2-4 games against these “sisters of the poor”. Everybody does it.

Last, we are playing Georgia State as a favor to Bill Curry and it was he who approached us about playing the game. He knows they will get blown out. But what he is looking at is the national exposure of playing the defending champions and the obscene amount of money GSU will make from the game. This is badly needed money to help grow the program. The game will also erase some of the bad feelings between Curry and Alabama and the fact that he was never fully accepted by a lot of old guard Bama folks.

The Reason Bama Sucks

May 19th, 2010
1:31 pm

Bama should be shamed if itself playing GA ST. Florida is no better with it’s pitiful schedule…I think I saw a catholic girls middle school on the Ole Miss schedule for 2012.

Brunswick Tech

May 19th, 2010
1:35 pm

for the last time “TEXAS IS NOT AND WILL NOT JOIN THE SEC !!!” they do not need to what would they gain? they got plenty of cash and they are already #1 in total Athletics. they will stay put and play close to home.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
1:41 pm

The Reason Bama Sucks,

Don’t know who your team is but if I did I guarantee I could go back through 10 years of scheduling and find a series of no name and double AA opponents if you’re a rival sec fan or an acc fan. Likewise I probably won’t find any Oklahomas, Penn States, or Va Techs on your regular season schedule.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
1:41 pm

“So paying them with a chance at a college education is a bad thing?”

Otto – There is nothing wrong with rewarding an athlete with a scholarship as long as he/her meets the requirements that all students applying to that school have to meet. They already get a waiver on the out-of-state quotas. If they can’t meet University of Georgia or Georgia Tech requirements, other schools aren’t as stringent. Bob Hayes, the fastest man on the planet (that we knew about) attended Florida A&M. The NFL doesn’t care where they came from, as long as they look good at the combines and on tape.

According to the current administration, everybody will have an opportunity to attend college on a free government ride. I find that offensive, as it is socialistic and also grubbing for votes in future elections. I didn’t get a free ride, and I didn’t deserve one. I had a 50% loan that lasted me 2 years, going to school and working, and then 8 years in the military. I got my BS 4 years after that, again while I was working full time.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
1:45 pm

Brunswick Tech,

In a very recent interview Texas AD Deloss Dodds was on public record as saying Texas wanted in the sec back in the 90s. But the sec wanted Texas only and not Tam. The Texas legislature blocked the deal because if the sec was going to take Texas they would have to take A&M also so the deal fell apart. Apparently you and the Texas Athletics Director have differing views on whether Texas would or would not like to join the SEC.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
1:54 pm

“As far as these “sisters of the poor” get real. Every sec team as well as acc, big 12 and big 10 teams play a series of anywhere from 2-4 games against these “sisters of the poor”. Everybody does it.”

Tide Rising – USC’s sister of the poor last year was San Jose St.(WAC). The others were BC, Ohio St. and ND (an annual opponent). This year they got Hawaii (WAC), Virginia and Minnesota (and ND). 9 in-conference and 4 FBS schools.. Boy, are they stupid.

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
1:59 pm

Boss, you need to either get back on your meds or lay-off the drugs. First Texas isn’t interested in the Big 10, they make more in their share of the Big 12 pie. GT is only the sixth academically ranked school behind Duke, UVA, UNC, Wake Forest, and Boston College. Any of these, Texas, A&M, Nebraska, Kansas, or Iowa State will be as good a fit as GT and any of them would be closer.

SEC for Ya

May 19th, 2010
2:01 pm

Delbert D.
May 19th, 2010
10:40 am

We already have “a good place to go for ex-high school players who cannot meet the minimum academic requirements that regular applicants have to meet.”

It’s called thUGA.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
2:06 pm

Awhile back I posted the SEC’s out-of-conference schedules. Nobody’s asked for the ACC, but to support my 1:54 post, here’s a sample:

U Miami—–Fl. A&M, Ohio St., Pitt, USF
FSU———-Samford, Oklahoma, BYU, Florida

The 2 schools are atypical of the rest of the ACC, no debate from me on that. But, like Southern Cal, it’s not the “2-4 games…’sisters of the poor” mentioned previously.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
2:06 pm

Delbert D.,

In the interest of being brief I was leaving USCw out because they are the single exception to the rule. ND also I would maybe put in there because they play no double AA opponents to my knowledge and while some of their bcs opponents may not be the strongest in the conference they still play bcs opponents. Heck, Navy isn’t even a joke to play.

I have an immense amount of respect for USC because they are the one and only program I can think of that plays no double AA teams ever and I’ve seen full schedules where they don’t even have patsy. San jose state would be their one patsy but most years they play the full pac 10 schedule, then one heavyweight like Ohio State, then a bcs conference team like UVA, and then a typically good, respectable middle tier team like Fresno State. I’ll never put down their scheduling.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
2:07 pm

Delbert, My problem with that is the lower Division schools such as do not offer a full ride and can not due to NCAA scholarship limits. Many of these kids would not attend school.

I would rather these kids have a chance at a college degree under a full ride and if nothing else go into coaching or some sort of business with connections made while in school than remain in the projects or the low income rural housing.

It may appear socialist in giving these kids special rules to get in the school but IMO they will more than pay for it in the hours they will put in at practice, money made for the school which fund other athletic programs, and hopefully staying out of crime and living off Gov. programs. The success rate for getting the youth out of the projects is not very high on other programs.

Is it perfect? No but it is an improvement.

Also if you take away special clauses to get the athletes in school then I would suggest taking away transfer limitations for athletes. Allowing them to transfer between schools just as any other student without having to sit out a year.

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
2:10 pm

G8R Grad, Hold on there, you say 8 were Big 10, I count only 5 – Northwestern 12, Michigan 27, Illinois 39, Wisconsin 39, and Penn State 47 and two from the SEC – Vanderbilt 4 and Florida 47, and seven were from the ACC – Duke 10, Virginia 24, UNC 28, Wake Forest 28, Boston College 34, Georgia Tech 35, and Miami at 50.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
2:12 pm

Delbert D.

Yes. The FSU and Miami schedules are very respectable. Only 1 patsy for each of them. But you get my drift. I’m saying that in general the majority of the bcs teams out there play 2-4 patsys. K-State would be a notorious example as in many years they played 4 patsys. That’s how Bill Snyder built the program.

Also, Georgia played a highly respectable schedule last year. Tech, Ok state were 2 decent teams. ASU not so much but they are still a bcs caliber team. Only 1 patsy last year for the dawgs. I think the year before they only had 1-2 patsys also. This year they will have 3 since I have to include a 3-9 Colorado team as being a patsy. In years before the last 2 years Georgia played a typical 2-4 game patsy slate like everyone else in the sec.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
2:17 pm

“Bama should be shamed if itself playing GA ST. Florida is no better with it’s pitiful schedule…I think I saw a catholic girls middle school on the Ole Miss schedule for 2012.”

On my SEC OOC schedule post, I had Florida ranked 2nd in toughest OOC games. LSU #1, Georgia #3. Ole Miss #12.

1) LSU————-UNC#, West Va., McNeese St., UL-Monroe
2) Florida———Miami (OH), USF, App. St., FSU*

12) Ole Miss——–Jacksonville St., Tulane*, Fresno St., UL-Lafayette

It should be mentioned that Ole Miss-Tulane is an old rivalry, and Fresno St. did go to a bowl.

* road game
# neutral site

Otto

May 19th, 2010
2:18 pm

Tide Rishing, USC is cutting back on those heavy weight games

Virginia, Syracuse, Minnesota, and Hawaii look to be making the schedule for the next few years. A series with BC is also in there, respectable but I would not say a regular powerhouse.

http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa/pac-10/usc-trojans.php

The next school scheduled that is a regular hevy weight is Tenn. in 2021

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
2:32 pm

Otto, USoCal/UVA was a home and home, doubt that they will play again for awhile.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
2:33 pm

Otto – The partial scholarship problem is there, no doubt. The lack of a convenient JC is, also. Some of these kids could be commuters if they live in metro areas. If they get a ride on my tax money, well, they also hopefully will have to meet standards to stay in school.

By the way, Hutson Mason said (earlier last Fall) that he was planning to attend Georgia anyway when it looked like he wasn’t going to get any offers.

Thank the Oklahoma Sooners for your TV $$$

May 19th, 2010
2:36 pm

Tony you can thank the Oklahoma Sooners for your ultimate point on this exercise. It was the University of Oklahoma who sued the NCAA, resulting in the Supreme Court decision of 1984, which determined that individual schools, not the NCAA, own the property rights to a school’s football games.

It was great for college football, but it landed Oklahoma on the NCAA hit list.

Prior to the lawsuit, powerhouse schools were on TV at most 2-3 times per year. Now we are seeing Billion dollar TV contracts with hundreds of games being televised.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
2:42 pm

OB-1 – Click on “Top Public Schools”

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
2:45 pm

Delbert, not all colleges in the “big” conferences are public so you should use all, both public and private.

GeneralNeyland96

May 19th, 2010
2:52 pm

Tony,

What would you think about getting the “Big 4″ conferences lined up, then instituting a policy similar to the English Premier League where lower conferences’ teams compete to “move up” into a slot in one of the main conferences…..gives incentive to the “little guys” as well as the Vanderbilts, Wake Forests, Northwesterns to put out a consistent high-quality product or be relegated to a lower conference for a couple of years.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
2:56 pm

Delbert, I see your point but many of these rurual kids come from bad school systems which fight low income and often with bad family situations with ineffective or underfunded gov programs. I would argue that the SEC fights this more so than most Big 10 states. It is no secret where many of these states and their school systems fall.

A 4 year scholarship would be cheaper in the long run than a lifetime of foodstamps and section 8 housing. Have SEC, SWC, ACC and other schools in other conferences expolited this in the past?

Absolutely, at the current time I think there is much more effort put on making the kids better.

In a perfect world the school systems would be able to give these kids the education they need to have an equal shot at getting in the Big Schools but that day is a long way off and will require some socialism in a capitalist economy. Remember both only work perfectly in utopias.

All the way turnt up

May 19th, 2010
3:13 pm

I can’t believe Mr. Georgia Basketball Marcus Thornton chose UGA over Tech. Why?

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:19 pm

OB-1 – Right. I think his point was to screen out the Ivy League and some others that don’t play football. Hey, the rankings are intended to help people decide where to attend, and how much it’s going to cost. Most public schools are less expensive. None of their listings are all-inclusive; the service academies and some other all-military schools aren’t in any of the USN&WR listing, for example. Their curricula is less diverse.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:20 pm

IL Jacket & OB-1:

I was looking at the National PUBLIC Universities list.
Thanks with my “math” anyway.
I went to law school for my lack of mathematical aptitude.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:22 pm

And thanks for the clarification Delbert.
You’re a scholar and a gentleman.

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
3:23 pm

G8R Grad, is it true they teach you how to read/write legalize?

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:29 pm

Don’t U mean “Legal-like?”

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:33 pm

And OB-1, aren’t U supposed to start your sentences with a verb?
Mistaken, you were?

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:34 pm

Or is that Yoda?

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
3:35 pm

Great is the force in this one.

OB-1

May 19th, 2010
3:35 pm

That was Yoda but what the heck.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:35 pm

Otto – Some of the worst aren’t in rural areas. I was in a class of 100 in a town of less than 5,000. Not rural, because we had 2 grocery stores, I guess. I’ve been in towns in Arkansas that make it look like a metropolis. On the other hand, Belle Glade, Florida is in Palm Beach County, and Glades High School has turned out a *lot* of football players. But, according to the FBI in 2003 the city had the second highest violent crime rate in the country at 298 per 10,000 residents. And there’s Detroit, and the numerous high crime areas in the LA area, and before Katrina, the infamous areas of projects in New Orleans.

I don’t think their can be a utopia. When everybody has a BS or BA degree, who’s going to work at the grocery store, or man the check-in lines at the airport, or drive the cabs? Maybe everybody will be smarter in terms of knowledge exposed to, I don’t know. I won’t be around to see it.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:37 pm

Sorry.
Wrong part of speech.
It’s been a long day.
And I have to go 2 Dismal World w/the whole Famn Damily tomorrow!

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:38 pm

G8R GRAD – What the heck, how about some Shakespeare?

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:40 pm

How ’bout: Our academic debate is “Much Ado About Nothing?”

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:41 pm

“He who would his own quietus make with a bare bodkin.” I never could diagram that sentence. Sounds like a prosecutor’s opening statement, though.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:41 pm

Pretty much. Consider the source…TB.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:44 pm

We have succeeding in elevating the art form of blogging to a new low. Or, a new high, although still negative. Darned math, again.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:45 pm

Your sympathy for my weeks plight; my family, my Bro’-in’laws’ and my Outlaws in the Tragic Kingdom!

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:46 pm

If a double-negative=to a positve, then 2 wrongs DO make a right!

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:48 pm

G8R GRAD – Keep of the teacups. I rode those once with my drunken sailor buddies and we all threw up. And that takes some doing for bubbleheads.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:50 pm

“If a double-negative=to a positve, then 2 wrongs DO make a right!”

Save that one, you can use it in your professional work. Ah, they probably taught you that one, or it was on the bar exam.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:51 pm

Good thing my brother-in-law isn’t afraid to “pull a cork.”
We’ll manage through self-medication, but thanks 4 the teacups warning.
Nothing like hurling in front of the kids & your mother-in-law!

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
3:54 pm

Off 2 a pre-trip Happy Hour.
It’s been an honor and a pleasure.
And no matter your collegiate allegiance, good luck in the Fall!

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:55 pm

The teacups may look innocuous, but they are *way* worse than the old Tilt-a-Whirl.

Gator Hater

May 19th, 2010
3:55 pm

Two wrights make an airplane

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:56 pm

I hope everybody wins.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
3:57 pm

Gator Hater – I’ve got to put that one in my notebook!

Otto

May 19th, 2010
3:59 pm

Delbert Agreed, I have also mentioned the projects in my post. I would wager that your neighborhood had a lower divorce and crime rate than what we are fighting now with kids like Montez who was kicked off UGA’s team.

I don;t think there will be anything like a utopia but I hope we can make it better without going full on socialist. I also don’t like making a college degree overly easy to get.

BTW I was scheduled and on the payroll as part time during school in a corp. job but often turned enough hours to get overtime during the Mon-Fri and often worked in a family business on the weekends while going to school full time. I refused to graduate with a student loan or credit card debt.

Otto

May 19th, 2010
4:01 pm

G8tr, 2 wrongs don’t make a right but 3 lefts might.

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
4:01 pm

So, if a double-negative = a positive, then two Wrights do make an airplane?

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
4:03 pm

Sorry. “a left airplane?”

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
4:06 pm

I need a drink!

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
4:06 pm

Enter your comments here

G8R GRAD

May 19th, 2010
4:07 pm

Adios, mi buen amigos!

wham

May 19th, 2010
4:11 pm

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
4:12 pm

Otto – Clark Howard would approve of your college plan. I finally made it by seeing the finish line. I did the last semester working full-time in a union job up north at a power plant, putting up with the extra 8-hour OT shifts, and going to school 4 nights a week and Saturdays.

Back in the school days, nobody got into much trouble, but I started driving at 13 (occasionally, to go to the Boy Scout meetings at the church), and a lot of kids got Cushman scooters way before then. Our football coaches were pretty tough, though. One of our starting guards let his sideburns start to grow, and our line coach told him if he showed up the next day like that, he’d dry shave him.

If it doesn’t require effort, then it probably isn’t worth much.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
4:22 pm

wham – That is very interesting. What caught my eye was “…to obtain, to the extent possible, information necessary to construct preliminary options and recommendations without engaging in formal discussions with leadership of other institutions.” Some of that seems to have slipped out with the Missouri-Nebraska-Notre Dame-Rutgers stuff. Maybe just a bit of disinformation to keep everybody guessing?

RussN

May 19th, 2010
4:48 pm

I read several things here. First is the B10 think they and some others built the whole college football into what it is today. Lets see, I think I watched maybe 1-2 B10 games last year in total. The B10 has OSU, Penn St., Iowa and who else??? Oh yeah, Indiana, Illinois, Minn, Mich (which has lost their luster) Northwestern, Purdue. The B10 doesn’t want a playoff, they don’t want to have to face the likes of TCU or Utah or Boise St. They don’t mind losing to a USC or Texas as it brings in tremendous revenue. But they don’t want to play other schools that will beat the majority of B10 schools, and they don’t want to share their pie either. Well they basically want college football to be like the MLB and they think their the Yankees. Sorry but that model isn’t going to work in college athletics.

JD

May 19th, 2010
4:58 pm

The expansion talk is more than just talk – it will be the end of the BCS within 5 years if not much sooner.

PAC-10 is the first to expand with Utah and Colorado. The Big 10 follows by adding Missouri, Nebraska, and Notre Dame (Yes, the Domers go because they see the writing on the wall). A year or two later there as profits rise for the Big 12 and PAC-12 and the strain starts to show in the Big East and Big 12, those conferences dissolve and the remaining four power conferences start to reel some of those schools in – Pitt and Rutgers to the new Big 16, Syracuse, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati to the ACC. The SEC adds Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Louisville, and one more school (USF?) to get to 16. The PAC-12 adds Texas, Texas A&M (those two are joined at the hip), Kansas, and Kansas State after the Big-12 dissolves.

Now, with 64 teams in 4 conferences, those conferences form their own football division and institute a four team playoff pitting the four conference champions.

Don’t believe what the Big 10 or Pac 10 are saying on expansion – it will happen sooner than they are letting on, especially with the PAC as they need to begin negotiations on their new TV deal/network next year at the latest and will need to have their new teams and conference title game in place for the 2012 season when the new TV deal will kick in. The Big 10 won’t be far behind.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
5:08 pm

RussN – Apparently it is going to work in college athletics, because they have gone ahead and done it. This is just the latest step. When everybody else played a 10 game schedule in the ’50s-’60s, the Big Ten played a 9 game schedule-the Big Ten. They had exclusive rights (with their PAC 8 partners) to the Rose Bowl, when every other bowl (except the Cotton) was open.

Scott

May 19th, 2010
5:14 pm

Tide Rising, Texas’ interest in the SEC was twenty years ago. The DI football landscape has radically changed since then. I can assure you, for a variety of reasons, that the SEC is at the bottom of Texas’ list of preferred conferences.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
5:26 pm

Scott,

The interview with Deloss Dodd was only a couple of weeks ago. Also, you are right in that the college football landscape in the last 20 years has changed dramatically. It has changed dramatically in that the sec has led the way while becoming the nation’s premiere conference. If the sec was appealing to Texas 20 years ago than it would certainly be that much more appealing today.

Also, there are not a variety of reasons Texas would not consider the SEC. The sole reason that Texas would possibly consider the big 10 over the sec would be academics. Perhaps Texas fits in better with the big 10 or Pac 10 on an academic basis but that’s about it. And even then I’m not sure that reason would wash since Texas used to be aligned with Tier 3 school Ark. in the old swc.

But geogrphically and culturally Texas fits in far better with the SEC as it borders 2 sec states. Someone in east Texas has a lot more in common with other southerners then they do with someone in Indiana or Illinois.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
5:33 pm

JD – I’m in general agreement with what you’re saying. I can see 4 16-team conferences. The schools in each are subject to several factors; for example the ACC would not accept Cincinnati or West Virginia because they are academic Tier 3 schools. What Texas, Texas A&M, the Oklahoma schools and Kansas do could go several ways, so could the SEC West and SEC East.

Whatever, even if the Big Ten + 6 and PAC “16″ form a solid pact, there could still be a 64-team playoff. Round-robin in each division, division champs for the conference championship, and the 4 conference champs play the final 4 (obviously). It is only game max (only for 2 teams) beyond the current 14th game BCS Poll-based championship.

Every body else could play in bowl games for the popularity contests.

Scott

May 19th, 2010
5:35 pm

Tide Rising,

Having been a former DI athletics administrator and knowing several members of the Texas’ senior administrative staff, I can assure you that the SEC is not preferred by Texas. The two main reasons are television – Texas is working on launching its own network, which is a major stumbling block with the SEC. This is the same reason why texas isn’t going to the Big Ten. Second, Texas lacks political clout within the SEC. Texas is not about to go into a conference in which they do not have the loudest voice.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
5:38 pm

The 64 million dollar question on expansion is does the SEC want to expand its tv footprint or does it want schools that are more culturally and geographically aligned such as Tech, FSU, Clemson, etc. Would those schools bring more money given that those tv markets are already covered by current sec teams or would it be much more profitable to go after the Texas-Oklahoma tv footprints? The answer to that question dictates everything.

If its more profitable to bring in the Texas/Oklahoma tv market then the solution is really pretty easy and it is this:

Add Texas, Texas A&M, OU, and Ok. State to the west division and move Bama and AU to the east division. Its that simple and its the best solution if we’re going after tv market dollars for several reasons with the most obvious being that practically no huge rivalries would be lost by moving Bama-AU to the east.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
5:45 pm

Scott,

If you were a former D-1 athletics director and you personally know several people in the senior Texas administrative staff then obviously I defer to your judgement in the matter. What I don’t understand is that if what you say is true and to me it does make a lot of sense so I believe you then why on earth is the big 10 wasting its time on a possible expansion including Texas? It seems the point would be mute.

I would certainly agree with you that if Texas wanted their own tv deal that is a dealbreaker with the sec. We’re not giving them any special treatment. At least I would hope not anyway. That ties in with your second reason that Texas would lack political clout with the SEC. We’re not willing to be pushed around in the same way that Texas kinda pushes around the big 12 with their own special tv revenue sharing deal. Interesting to hear all that. But now we have nothing to wildly speculate about. What a bummer.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
5:46 pm

“But geogrphically and culturally Texas fits in far better with the SEC”

I think that is true for the South in general, but other conferences span Miami to Boston, and Southern California to Washington State. Actually, California is different from itself – southern coast, central valley, desert, 2 sets of mountain areas, the bay area, and the northern wilderness. That is more diversity than some adjoining European countries.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
5:52 pm

Scott – Do you think the Texas people would take LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Miss. St., and Kentucky (competition for Kansas in basketball) if Missouri and Nebraska leave? Those are very bottom of Tier 2 and Tier 3 schools (the Mississippi schools), though.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
5:56 pm

Delbert D.,

No one is ever going to line up geographically perfect of course. I’m just sayin that Texas in the sec is a better fit than in the big 10 or Pac 10 and that in some of the games like against LSU, Ark, and possibly the MISS schools they are within reasonable driving distance on some game days. Also, looking at the geographic fit of the acc is it any wonder some of the games make no sense. For example FSU-Boston College. When BC comes to FSU do FSU fans really get excited about that?

But alas its all a mute point since Scott popped my balloon of optimism about the possibility of having Texas join the SEC.

Scott

May 19th, 2010
5:58 pm

Tide Rising,

The Big Ten did in fact pursue Texas rather aggressively a few months ago and the deal breaker was the TV network issue. Texas also wasn’t very keen on the geographic stretch, but the real issue was TV. The Big Ten and Texas have not revisited the expansion issue since then, though it continues to be tossed around by the media. Realistically speaking, the Texas-to-the-Big Ten movement is dead.

Its the same with them moving to the SEC. They know that there would not be any concessions made to them if they joined the SEC, which would kill their exclusive tv network project, and that is their biggest priority right now. Same goes for their politcal clout. The Big 12 is definitely slanted in their favor, and they are not about to move into a more competitive conference in which they are not the driving influence.

Yeah, I hate to rain on all of the fun speculation about possible SEC expansion, but realistically Texas isn’t going to be part of it.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
5:59 pm

Tide Rising – Oh, I am having fun wildly speculating. I can’t stand the wait ’til August. I visualize the SEC East (minus KY) plus Auburn and Alabama conquering the east coast all the way up through Maryland, with the help of some ACC schools (drop Miami, BC maybe another tweak or 2.)

Scott

May 19th, 2010
6:05 pm

Delbert,

If the Big 12 were to lose BOTH Mizzou and Nebraska, I believe that they would look first to northern geographic schools so the entire conference would not have to be re-aligned. I wouldn’t be surprised if they targeted Utah and BYU. They fit geographically with the north division and it replaces the St. Louis TV market with Salt Lake City.

Plus, why would any SEC school consider joining the Big 12? Any such school would take a huge pay cut to do so since the revenue sharing is much smaller in the Big 12 compared to the SEC.

Jim Messick

May 19th, 2010
6:06 pm

Having two teams in national championship just because of name recognition, tradition and fans is ridiculus. Try having the best teams in the nation regardless of conference affiliation. Ask CBS what the fans interest was in the Butler/Duke game. Great reviews.

Times are changing, adjust or get left in the dust. Rose Bowl can have PAC 10 vs Big 10 but who wants to watch Illinois vs USC. The ratings were terrible and game was boring, or watch BSU vs Oklahoma, Bama vs Utah fans will make the ultimate choice.

Einsteindawg

May 19th, 2010
6:12 pm

Good article Tony, but you know as well as anyone that a playoff is never going to happen…too much money involved. It’s all about the money, not the fans, not the sport, and not even the good of the game.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
6:15 pm

The more we speculate on it the more I’m starting to think not much is going to change even if the big 10 goes to 16 teams depending on who of course those 16 teams would be.

If the big 10 adds Mizzou and Nebraska and then 3 teams like Syracuse, Rutgers, and Pitt then who really cares? The addition of a marquee name like Nebraska is a coup but as for the other 4 who really cares.

Is Syracuse, Rutgers, Pitt, and Mizzou going to make the big 10 a football superpower over the SEC? It would add a lot to their tv market dollars but as far as football prestige I’m not overly impressed with that group outside of Nebraska of course.

Tide Rising

May 19th, 2010
6:17 pm

Jim Messick,

You’re right. In hindsight I would prefer not to have watched the Bama-Utah game.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
6:32 pm

Scott – Why would the SEC consider it? Again, wildly speculating, they would be cutting loose 5 small TV market schools, and joining a group that would add all of North Carolina, all of Virginia, and all of Maryland. That could make for an even more enormous TV contract. And, to make a 16 team conference, the obvious assumption I made is that BYU and Utah would not be available (maybe PAC 16). But what would the Texas-led 16 gain by the inclusion of those particular 5 SEC schools….)

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
6:34 pm

The reasons for Texas not joining the SEC have been enumerated well here by Scott and Delbert, but I would only add one more issue. Culturally, the UT faculty see themselves much more in the tradition of a Cal-Berkeley or UMichigan than any school in the SEC and since the President of the University will be driving the bus on the issue, I really cannot fathom it would happen.

On adding BYU to any conference(Big 12 or Pac10), I ran across something interesting on the Frank the Tank blog, which indicated BYU’s prohibition on playing any games in Sunday could
be a stumbling block to their acceptance into another conference. Obviously, not a football problem, but a scheduling nightmare for every other sport.

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
6:42 pm

Tide Rising, possibly the fallout could
be limited. The Big 12 would have to do something if Mizzou and Nebraska leave because under current NCAA rules they could not have a season ending championship game-the ACC
already went through that appeal and lost.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
6:54 pm

IL Jacket – Texas and Texas A&M are both AAU members, as are Kansas, Iowa St. and the presumed Big ten choices, Missouri and Nebraska. The only SEC schools are Vanderbilt and Florida.

Pittsburgh, Syracuse and Rutgers are AAU and therefore could be in the mix for the Big 10, but only Rutgers has been mentioned in the rumors from last week.

When I live in North Jersey in the late 1960’s, the only school of real interest in the NY media was Notre Dame. When I lived in South Jersey 8 years later, the only football schools of real interest in the Philly media were Penn State, Pitt and Notre Dame (well, they had to cover Temple).

Everybody knows North Jersey and South Jersey are like 2 different states, right?

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
6:59 pm

In Georgia, we have the gnat line. In New Jersey, they have the Pine Barrens (there is a legendary devil that inhabits them.)

wxwax

May 19th, 2010
7:12 pm

What’s wrong with Delany’s point?

Just this: it’s about money, not competition.

A playoff might make everybody rich, but that’s not its appeal to fans.

The point of a playoff is to give schools a chance to compete for a national title on the field, not in a computer. It’s about competition, not money.

That’s what Delany always has, and always will, fail to grasp. He can’t silence the talk by parsing out a few shekels to the small schools. People want a fair competition on the field.

Ironically (deliciously ironic) is that the creation of the BCS opened the door to a playoff. It gave fans hope that someday there might be one.

Nothing more dangerous than a person with hope, Mr. Delany.

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
7:18 pm

Delbert, the Pine Barrens is where a lot
of the best New Jersey golf
courses are located isn’t it? Pine Valley and others.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
7:48 pm

IL Jacket – Well, I used to take what seemed to be the only road up that way from Vineland, through Hammonton, and nothing but sand and little pine trees until Lakehurst. It was so boring that we’d often drive southeast over past Mays Landing and take the Garden State Parkway north. Occasionally, even the NJ Turnpike north and cut across through Freehold. The destination was Red Bank for a few years, and then Highlands after that.

Pine Valley is on the western edge of the Pine Barrens, near Berlin. I worked in Cherry Hill, and one of my many alternate routes from work to home took me near there. I think it was the only really nice golf club of note when I lived in South Jersey.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
7:50 pm

IL Jacket – BTW, where in IL?

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
8:09 pm

North shore suburbs of Chicago. We’re still waiting for spring to arrive.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
8:20 pm

Ah, yes. My wife’s from there. We got married in Glenview. Lived in Waukegan during Navy service. We drove back from NJ over New Years many years ago, parked the old Chevy and the engine block froze at -15 degrees and blew out the freeze plugs. Stayed frozen solid for over 2 weeks.

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
8:41 pm

Sounds like you were more persuasive than I was. My wife is from here and thus we stayed. When I was younger the winter didn’t bother me so, but I think my blood must be
thinning aa I get older.
Don’t know if you have been back lately, but they closed the Glenview NAS and turned it into a big planned unit development. Actually, they did a very nice job with it.

Delbert D.

May 19th, 2010
8:59 pm

No, I didn’t know that the NAS had closed. I was at Great Lakes training center. The Navy was very “persuasive” in my case. We got bounced around a lot, Boston, Maryland, western Mass., Charleston SC, California & Hawaii. Her parents were in North Jersey all that time, so we put down roots in South Jersey for a few years when I got out. When we moved back to Georgia, they followed us. She still has an aunt and several cousins in the Chicago area. I’d like to get up there for a visit. I used to live a couple of miles from US 41 in Waukegan (Green Bay Rd.), and now I live a couple of miles from US 41 down here.

IL Jacket

May 19th, 2010
9:11 pm

Sounds like they used a lot of persuasion on you. You should come back for a visit-some things would be familiar, others have changed quite a bit. I think September
and October are our best time of year, although the way we have started we could be in for a cool summer.

thunderbull56

May 19th, 2010
11:13 pm

Beeg TIN goes to sweet sixteen.Name one other than Notre Dame that adds any Marquee value? I confess,I too have a couple of notebooks realigning conferences to better affect a playoff for the national championship.No,none have a Beeg Tin expansion other than Ourish.

Miles

May 20th, 2010
1:18 am

Hopefully greed does not run college football into the ground.

flashypaws

May 20th, 2010
2:28 am

the bcs made boise state famous.

boise state has the brand recognition now that it took texas and bama 100 years to create.

that’s hilarious. i literally roll on the floor laughing when i think about it.

the best laid plans of mice and men….

[...] Will conference expansion move the BCS closer to a playoff?  [...]

BuLLdawg

May 20th, 2010
6:46 am

Tony you don’t have a clue. Stay out of trying to shape our decisions. We all know we are going to play-offs.

It has to.

Aaron

May 20th, 2010
7:38 pm

“The counter argument, of course, is that educational institutions are, for the most part, tax funded and should not be conducting business like Apple or Kindle. But I’m afraid that train has already left the station.”
That is all the dignity the opposition is given? What do you mean “that train has left the station”? It is a legitimate arguement and should tax funding should be pro-rated based on the revenue of the extra ciricular activities. If the Medical departments create revenue by clinical trials, or if the gymnastic team makes more than the football team that should affect tax funding significantly. Tax revenue should be based on gross worth of an institution instead of sending them on a spending spree to get their net worth down. If the head coach of a college football team is the highest paid government employee in the state, making more than the governer etc. then something is wrong.

Aaron

May 20th, 2010
7:46 pm

My tax dollars shouldn’t be thown in the pot if they are rolling in the dough already. Why should my tax dollars go to make a sports coach or athletic director the highest paid government employee in the state? The train station needs to be examined. College costs are astonomical. Some projections say that a person making $35k a year without college and not haveing to pay off student loans thus having more to put away over a longer period can have a more comfortable retirement than someone who uses their college degree to make $50k per year. Quit lining the pockets of Media Markets university employees and investers with MY TAX DOLLARS.

Vigilant

May 20th, 2010
10:06 pm

It amazes me that some don’t want an 8 team playoff because “it adds too many games” or it “dilutes the regular season” or any other elitist nonsense.

An 8 team playoff if 7 games. The current Bowl Championship Series is 5. You are making an argument based on the addition of TWO games?

It doesn’t dilute the regular season to have conference champions play. Conferences are different quality in make up and this changes from season to season. An SEC team, who had arguably the toughest conference in 09 and who had finished with 1 loss was demonstratively better than the undefeated winner of the Big East. Reward the teams that win confernces with a shot to play the games to win a championship. You cannot get a truly honest feel for matchups with the lack of common opponents or head to head play for those top teams.

Other than that, keep the rules similar to what they are now. Take the highest ranked Non-AQ if they are in the top 8 or maybe top 10. Otherwise it is the top ranked teams that are not conference champs. It is easy and not as dramatic as some of you are making it out to be. Again, you eliminated 112 (93.4%) of the teams with the regular season. Let the champions fight it out at the end.

flatrock

May 21st, 2010
12:47 am

There will be no college playoff unless the “bowl situation” is resolved. My take: since all but one
of the current bowls are basically fund-raisers for the host cities and exhibition games for teams with
6-6 or better seasons, why not move the fund-raisers/exhibition contests to the pre-season? Atlanta’s Chick-filet pre-season game has proven to be a great appetizer. Both teams are undefeated, the fans
are starved, recruits notice and the networks are looking for something other than MLB’s dog-days-of-August games. How about Alabama-USC, Georgia-Texas, Florida-Ohio State, Tennessee-
Michigan, Boise State-Oklahoma to get the season rolling? Then, CFB could get serious
about a true championship playoff. Sixteen teams with the higher seeds playing at home
until the championship game which could be rotated between the current BCS hosts. Worried
about the weather? Don’t. The best game I saw in 2009 was the semi-final contest between
Montana State and Appy State, played in a driving snowstorm before a packed house!

TexasAlum00

May 24th, 2010
10:31 am

Smoke and mirrors. I wouldn’t place much faith in any internet poster who claims to have “insider info” or friends in high places. If that was the case, said poster would be doing something more important with his/her time than message boards.

The company line from some of the Texas fanbase is the Pac 10 is the preferred landing spot. This is hogwash. The main factors killing any move to the pac are 1) control issues and 2) distance.

The Pac teams are not going to roll over and allow Texas to begin calling shots. Texas will not have the same stroke that they do in the Big 12. And at this point, the Pac doesn’t appear to have made any statements expressing interest in supporting a Longhorn sports network.

In addition to this, can you imagine the road trips? Keep in mind that it’s more than just football who travels. It’s baseball, women’s soccer. Volleyball, etc. A roadie from austin to washington state or oregon is not ideal in terms of cost, nor is it ideal for the study time of the student athletes who must make said trips.

Mr Slive from the SEC recently interviewed on ESPN radio in Dallas. He made several key statements. One of which was his support for each SEC institution to have their own tv “package” or network. Another was his great respect for the success of teams like UT, aTm, and TTech.

He seemed to be giving the green light for a Longhorn network supported by the SEC. He also made mention of the close proximity between the SEC and State of Texas…something neither the Pac or Big 10 has.

There is a lot more going on than meets the eye. I would not dismiss Texas/Texas A&M to the SEC just yet. Things just got even more interesting.