Coaches should not be judged on national championships

 

It’s Friday and on Friday all of us are given the freedom to present views that may be a little out of the mainstream. Here’s mine:

Mark Bradley’s blog on Thursday “Will UGA win at BCS title under Mark Richt?” reminded me of a conversation I recently had with a reporter. He basically asked me the same question about Richt  and I said something that shocked him a little bit and it may shock you. But I have believed this for a long time:

The question about Richt is irrelevant.

Why? Because I believe coaches should not be ultimately judged on whether or not they win national championships.

You read that right. Having covered this sport for a long time I have concluded that national championships are not an accurate measure on whether or not somebody is a good coach or a great coach. Now if a guy like Urban Meyer has won two national titles in three years and is favored to win another, it’s a pretty good bet that he’s a great coach. But the absence of a national championship does not mean that someone is a lesser coach.

Here is how I back that statement up. In the era of the BCS, and we’ve had some version of it since 1992, there are simply too many variables beyond winning games that factor into a coach and team just getting a CHANCE to play for the national championship. You have two human polls and a bunch of computer polls that are combined and spit out a formula that puts two teams into the national championship game. There is simply too much luck and too much good timing involved for the national championship to be the standard we use to measure coaches.

Let’s just take this decade:

**–In 2000 Miami beat No. 1 Florida State on the field, 27-24. Both Florida State and Miami ended the season with one loss and Miami finished No. 2 in the human polls. But the BCS formula gave the spot in the national championship game to Florida State. So Butch Davis is less of a coach that season because the computers didn’t allow his team to play Oklahoma for the title?

**–In 2001 Oregon finished the season ranked No. 2 in both human polls and had only one loss. Nebraska finished No. 4 in the human polls, also with one loss, a 62-36 thumping in its last regular season game by Colorado. But Nebraska goes to the Rose Bowl instead of Oregon and Joey Harrington. That was Mike Bellotti’s shot at the national title and but the computers picked Nebraska, who got embarrassed by Miami, 37-14.

In 2002, Ohio State went 12-0 in the regular season with a five-point win over Wisconsin, a six-point win over Penn State, and a 10-6 win over Purdue where Craig Krenzel threw a 37-yard touchdown pass on fourth down in the final two minutes. Then the Buckeyes needed overtime to beat Illinois and beat Michigan 14-9 with a touchdown with less than five minutes remaining. Ohio State could have seen its national championship dreams derailed several times but to the Buckeyes’ everlasting credit, they always found a way to win. Mark Richt’s best team at Georgia (12-1 with a loss to Florida), which finished No. 3 in the BCS Standings, just needed for Ohio State to lose one of those games and the Bulldogs are in the Fiesta Bowl against Miami.

I can go on. In 2004 Auburn went undefeated and won the SEC championship. Under normal circumstances the Tigers would have been a lock for the national championship game. But USC and Oklahoma started 1-2 and never lost. That was a great Auburn team that didn’t get a chance. So does that mean that Tommy Tuberville was not a national championship coach that season?

Urban Meyer has won two national championships at Florida but some things had to fall into place for him to get the chance. In 2006 UCLA pulled off a stunning upset of No. 2 Southern Cal and Florida jumped from No. 4 to No. 2 (over No. 3 Michigan) after beating Arkansas in the SEC championship game. Florida just destroyed Ohio State in the BCS championship game but what if USC had not lost? Would that have made Meyer less of a coach in 2006?

Last season Florida earned its way into the BCS title game by beating No. 1 Alabama in the SEC championship game. But what if Alabama had not been No. 1?  What if Alabama had been No. 10? Then Florida may have been watching Texas and Oklahoma in a rematch for the national title. Florida had the best team in the country and proved it in the BCS championship game. But some things had to fall into place for the Gators to get the chance.

The 2007 season is the best example of all of how it takes more than talent and good coaching to play for the BCS title. LSU began championship Saturday with two losses and ranked No. 7 in the BCS standings. The ONLY way the Tigers had a chance to get to the big game was by beating Tennessee in the SEC championship game and hoping beyond hope that both No. 1 Missouri and No. 2 West Virginia BOTH lose. The odds against that were incredible but it did happen and LSU got its shot. LSU was the best team in the country at the end of the 2007 season but the Tigers would have never gotten the chance to prove it without some good fortune.

 

The point is this: In college football, especially in the SEC, the focus has to be on the conference championship. That is the thing as coaches and players that you can control.  If you are consistently playing for the SEC championship, then more years than not you’re going to be in the hunt for the national championship.

A coach is either consistently playing at the top of his conference or he’s not. If your coach has all the resources to compete for the conference championship and proves over a period of time that he can’t do it, you should certainly question whether or not he should continue to be your coach.

 But if two guys are consistently playing at the top of their league there is nothing magical that makes one a national championship coach and the other something less. It’s about winning your conference and then hoping the right dominoes fall into place that will give you the opportunity to play for something more.

Steve Spurrier told me during his great run at Florida that he never discussed the national championship with his players. “Our goal was to always win the SEC championship. That was the thing we could control,” Spurrier said. “If we won the conference championship, we figured there was a pretty good chance that we would get to play for the big title. But it doesn’t do any good to focus on that because you have no control over it.”

So what about this? Am I totally wrong here? The floor is yours. Have a great weekend.

 

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http://twitter.com/MrCFB

277 comments Add your comment

bubba

July 31st, 2009
8:30 am

spot on great info

Saint Simons

July 31st, 2009
8:33 am

((((((45-42)))))) hahaha

Eric

July 31st, 2009
8:35 am

Tony,

Coach Tuberville and Auburn won the 2004 People’s Choice National Championship. I know, I was there!

viningsgator

July 31st, 2009
8:37 am

What’s wrong with being called a good coach?

The word “great” gets thrown around way too much. In order for a coach to be considered “great” they must have won a National Title.

TECHnicallySpeaking

July 31st, 2009
8:37 am

Richt is a good coach. He may evolve into a great coach.

The2 Davids&VernLundquist

July 31st, 2009
8:38 am

Does CMR have the ability to “heal” his players after they are injured?

bmoney

July 31st, 2009
8:43 am

Sorry, Tony.

I think that you have to factor money into this equation. If a coach’s salary has to consistently increase when he wins to “keep pace”, then fans have every right to demand a national title. When coaches decide that they will settle for less pay, I think fans will have lower expectations.

Alabamadawg

July 31st, 2009
8:47 am

JB

July 31st, 2009
8:51 am

I’m a Dawg fan, but i think Auburn pulled the trigger on Tubberville too fast. He got caught in a lull of talent and no SEC caliber QB, plus the timing of Saban arriving at Bama. I think he should have been given time to right the ship…….On a “teachable moment”, Tubbs liked to fire assit. coach’s when things didn’t work, and we all scream at Richt to make changes, but I think firing coach’s hurt Tubbs in the long run…….Georgia’s coach’s may not be the best in the SEC, but they ain’t bad. As bad as the D played last year for lot’s of reasons, that unit STILL finished 22nd nationally !!!!!!!!!!

Tim

July 31st, 2009
8:54 am

Excellent Tony you are dead on

JB

July 31st, 2009
8:55 am

Another note, I think Clemson will regret not hiring Tubbs. I would have as AD.

jacketbacker

July 31st, 2009
8:57 am

agree with bmoney…if you’re coach is getting paid 2 mil+ per season, and more in some cases, there had better be some serious hardware in the trophy case…..an undefeated season is not easy but it is within a teams control….auburn in ‘04 was a fluke thing…..in most cases, if a team from a BCS conference does not lose they will be in very good shape to be in the NC game…..

Sunny Purdue

July 31st, 2009
8:57 am

If there is so much luck involved why do the same coaches (Carroll, Meyer, Tressel, Saban, Brown, Stoops) always seem to find themselves in the BCS championship game – or close to it? Take a look at the past few years – those are some lucky guys.

BankerDawg

July 31st, 2009
8:58 am

One of your best blogs to date, Tony.

Agree 100%.

Win your Conference title, and then watch the chips fall where they may, because the coach, as you pointed out above, has zero control over what occurs at that point.

Oh, and thanks for reminding me about 2002.

Craig freaking Krenzel…..unbelievable.

GO DAWGS!

geauxtigers

July 31st, 2009
8:58 am

good point Tony. Didn’t UGA talk too much about a national title run last year? That is what did them in, along with Matt’s inaccuracy.

Seriously?

July 31st, 2009
8:59 am

“In college football, especially in the SEC, the focus has to be on the conference championship. ”

Why throw in “especially in the SEC”? B/c you had such juggernauts as UT, UK, Vandy, Miss St, Arkansas, usce & Auburn last year??? I’m pretty sure that the goal of EVERY team is to win their conference first. This “SEC beats up on each other” mentality is a joke now kids (almost as bad as some GT fans who claim academics with every other breath, GIVE IT A REST). I don’t care how great these teams ONCE were, but I know they were crap last year, and there is absolutely no sign that they will all of a sudden be great this year (unless Coach O ripping his shirt off is the best motivator on earth, which it could be).

SEC couldn’t even fill up its alloted bowl slots last year. SEC last year was only top heavy. The rest of the conference was crap. Basically the Pac-10 except with 2 great teams, and 2/3 mediocre teams.

With the rest of your comments, yes, it normally does take some luck to get into the BCSNCG. But keep in mind that uga beat 1 team ranked in the top 25 in 2002 (No. 22 Auburn), and i believe only 3 with winning records. This was before everyone went SEC crazy, because it wasn’t the ALMIGHTY conference and its what the SEC is heading to again. Couple great teams, and then some other teams. How quickly we forget.

JB

July 31st, 2009
9:00 am

Sunny, those Schools have, get the best players in the Country….Put Johnson from Vandy at ANY of those schools, he wins a championship within 5 years.

UGASlobberknocker

July 31st, 2009
9:03 am

At what point does the moderator of this blog say “enough is enough” with the constant juvenile postings of St Simons and that score. Does the ajc not have the ability to delete asinine posts, especially the repetitive BS of this mental midget? Ive gone from being mad about it, to thinking its funny, to my position now that his postings are a pathetic indicator of some serious psychological problems. Obviously this guy needs some therapy; or at least a girlfriend.

Step up, Mr. Moderator. and show some gonads. Delete this loser’s 45-42 posts the second they appear. Otherwise, this blog is going to continue to degenerate into a pissing contest, eventually leading to the serious fans abandoning it as a forum for losers and spankers. Given the sorry state of the printed version of this paper; can the AJC stand to lose its online customers?

shankit

July 31st, 2009
9:03 am

Steve had a losing bowl record while coach at Florida.
Did win a NC, only with a rematch with a team which
had already beaten him during regular season.
Another example of the screwed up system. FSU
should never had to play Florida twice.

Eric

July 31st, 2009
9:06 am

JB is right about Auburn and Tuberville. I just hope it wasn’t a huge mistake. Maybe Gene Chizik will be the next golden boy. I certainly think the potential is there. War Eagle!!

Eric

July 31st, 2009
9:09 am

Grow up Slobber. Just ignore the posts you don’t like.

CharlotteGator

July 31st, 2009
9:10 am

Interesting take Tony. For the most part I agree with your take. Conference championships usually are the measure. Of course, continually being at the top of the Big East or ACC or Sun-Belt is like being the valedictorian of summer school. :) Sorry, had to do it. ACC Truthers, flame away…

I wonder though, I’m not sure the Mark Bradley article was arguing whether Richt was a great coach or not, I think that’s a given. If the question is will UGA win a BCS title with Mark Richt, could the issue at hand or at least posed by the question be his ’style’ or the intense competition in the league, etc. I think it’s a valid question. My personal opinion is that he’ll have an opportunity, but there’s a big hurdle to climb just to win the SEC. Given the talent, competition, etc., I don’t know that any coach wouldn’t be a little ‘lucky’ to win the conference and play for a title. So much has to go your way just to make it to Atlanta. This year is a perfect example. Although everyone picks the Gators to win the SEC, there’s not one level-headed Gator fan who can boast supreme confidence over this happening for sure. Even though our schedule isn’t the toughest, we can still see land mines all over it if a few things happen or if attitudes sour.

Anyway, I’m interested to hear everyone else’s take.

Joe M

July 31st, 2009
9:11 am

This is very simple in relation to Richt. In 2002 he and Van Gorder were out coached by Ron freaking Zook and Ed stinking Zaunbrecher. That started the trend that I have seen under Richt, which is Georgia will lose one game a year they shouldn’t lose. Starting with the 02 loss to Florida there was 03 Florida (Zook AGAIN!), 04 Tenn., 05 Sugar Bowl/WVU debacle, 06 Vandy(AT HOME) and Kentucky, 07 S. Carolina, and Tech last year with a 17 point lead at half.

Not to mention the blowouts that have accumulated in the past 4-5 years.

Love Richt, but he is simply too nice to reach that level. I say you can be good w/o a National Championship, but not great. Great coaches find a way to get it done, no matter the odds they face. My God, Les Miles found a way, LES MILES!

rocksteadyfreddie

July 31st, 2009
9:12 am

Tony I agree with your premise. Consistent success at the conference level should be the measuring stick, but getting to a BCS CG game and winning it while there is a factor IMO.
Either way you look at it, Meyer is a better coach than Richt though.

geauxtigers

July 31st, 2009
9:13 am

Hey St. Simons: 38 – 3. Who cares about your acc, it’s a basketball conference anyway.

Bamafan

July 31st, 2009
9:15 am

Tony, Good article and hope one day Mark Richt wins a cystal trophy. It is really hard to win a national championship these days with the computer polls and other coaches polls. Great coaches
are measured by national championships like the best Bear Bryant and Bobby Bowden and Urban Meyer. Saban is a very good coach and would be considered a great coach if he was a media darling,
but he was in the top ten poll of the most hated sports people the other day and finished 9th in the poll.ROLL TIDE!!

CharlotteGator

July 31st, 2009
9:18 am

On a totally separate note, since it’s Friday, just wanted to fill you guys in on the hot CFB topics on Charlotte sports radio this morning.

UNC wanting to push back the game with South Carolina now, because they’d rather play LSU. Are you kidding me? Do they prefer a beatdown?

Question of the Day was “What’s your dream inter conference matchup?” During my 15 minute drive in, 3 USCe fans all called in independently of each other and said they wanted a piece of the Trojans to find out who the real USC was. Again, do they just prefer beatdowns? This made no sense to me.

One super intelligent USCe fan went on for a few minutes about how if they hadn’t rotated QB’s last year they would have beat UF in the swamp. The hosts laughed him off the air.

Man I miss living in real SEC country.

Eddie

July 31st, 2009
9:21 am

Excellent article Tony. You are right on with your comments. It is nice to have the MNC by your name, but that is not what makes you very good or great. As one previous writer said, “great” is thrown around a lot of places that it does not belong.

UGASlobberknocker

July 31st, 2009
9:21 am

Eric, you are probably right about the uselessness of my last post, although I dont think it is me that needs to grow up.

AUtiger

July 31st, 2009
9:22 am

I have mixed feelings about Tubbs.. great personality and that team in 2004 was just loaded. 4 first round picks on that team. But another measure of a great coach is can they consistantly recruit top talent and win with that talent. Auburn hasn’t had a good QB in 5 years and we should have recruited one by now.

JB

July 31st, 2009
9:25 am

T, good call, per usual.

The Dawgs could have easily played in the NC, and won, several times. Nobody wanted to play us in’07.

That said, bring on a playoff. ;-)

HBTD!!!

UGASlobberknocker

July 31st, 2009
9:26 am

AUTiger is right about no QB lately, but to me, another problem is that Auburn used to have dominating lineman on both sides of the ball..I dont see that any more.

SugarHillDawg

July 31st, 2009
9:27 am

Only if you don’t play for national championships.

Jack G.

July 31st, 2009
9:27 am

Saint Simon—-your constant 45-42 HAHAHAHAHA has become more of an embarassment to GaTech than to UGA.

gatorman770

July 31st, 2009
9:27 am

Tony good insights.

The current BCS system screwed Urban’s undefeated Utah team as well as undefeated Auburn in 2004.

Only a playoff system will make the NC truely legitimate and a playoff system will have to be implemented in steps and the first step is to equalize the conferences over the next couple of years and the independents, like Notra Dame, will have to join a conference or be left out.

Delusional SEC Fan

July 31st, 2009
9:27 am

Yes, Charlotte Gator, we are quite delusional down here. Prime example: Eric, an Auburn fan, said Chizik has the potential to be the “Next Gold Boy.”

But seriously, UNC is looking at the national exposure the Kickoff game provides. The stomping they will receive is an afterthought.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
9:31 am

“Steve Spurrier told me during his great run at Florida that he never discussed the national championship with his players.”

Very interesting. Many times I’ve heard low IQ haters claim that Georgia aims low and only wants to win division and conference titles and is too scared to aim for National Championships. I’m paraphrasing a little bit but that is basically the jibba jabba that these idiots have been spewing for years, especially since Richt won a couple of SEC titles.

“Either way you look at it, Meyer is a better coach than Richt though.’

I don’t think Tony said that he wasn’t. In fact, I don’t think Tony made any comparison between the two at all. Its entirely possible that BOTH are great coaches. Did you ever think of that? Sure, you’d have to give the edge to Meyer right now. That’s a no brainer, but it doesn’t mean that Richt is not a great coach. This stuff is not an either/or mutually exclusive proposition people.

Chew on this St Simons

July 31st, 2009
9:33 am

7 out of 8. 14 out of 18. 23 out of 31. 59-39-5 total.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
9:35 am

“Not to mention the blowouts that have accumulated in the past 4-5 years.”

I count a grand total of two 20+ point losses that “accumulated” from ‘04 through ‘08. What’s the count in the fantasy world that you live in? Dismissed.

Denver Dog

July 31st, 2009
9:38 am

Good job, when Tech won thier championship in 90, they tried to find a team not to play. They could’ve played Colorado in the Orange bowl, but chose not to. At least Bama, UT, LSU, UF have played some real teams to win it.

DawginLex

July 31st, 2009
9:40 am

tony,

Is Joe Cox better than Craig Krenzel?

That’s why UGA has a chance this year. All depends on the defense. The OL is going to be the strength of this team instead of the achilles heel.

Richt is a great coach. Your SOS quote os the ONLY thing that came out of his mouth that I agree with. I still predict he will be unemployed this time next year after an 0-2 start.

The Blog Referee

July 31st, 2009
9:42 am

UGASlobberknocker,

Yes, the blog “moderator” does have the ability to delete blog postings that violate the AJC blog user agreement. Generally, profane, overtly sexual, or racially offensive comments will be deleted. Since the AJC does not proactively patrol its own blogs, it relies on good citizens like yourself to report offensive comments by clicking on the “Report this comment” link, found underneath every blog posting, and complete the information requested.

Given the AJC’s policy of erring on the side of free speech, the AJC will generally not delete comments merely because they are juvenile, repetitive or annoying.

BTW, I have no official capacity as “The Blog Referee.” I am merely a self-righteous fellow blogger who gets irritated enough to periodically report the more offensive comments and request their deletion. You can do exactly the same thing, and you can become “The Blog Line Judge” or “The Blog Referee II” or . . . well, you get the idea. GATA.

Delusional SEC Fan

July 31st, 2009
9:42 am

If Richt was in the Big 10, he would have played for a national championship by now. His team would have been crushed by an SEC team but at least he would have played for one.

Instant Classic1

July 31st, 2009
9:43 am

Like it or hate it, great coaches are defined by NC’s. If Sprurrier hadn’t won one at UF he would not be thought of so highly 13 years later. Think of it this way, if Richt ends his career with more wins and no NC’s than Vince, are they both great coaches?

Thanks Tony, always enjoy reading your pieces.

KR

July 31st, 2009
9:45 am

Part of what led to Tuberville’s downfall at Auburn was his steadfast loyalty to a core group of his assistants. While there was a revolving door at some of the assistant positions, it appeared that others couldn’t do anything that would get them fired.

He also wouldn’t step in and override one of his coordinators’ decisions during games, no matter how bad the decisions they were making. (For example, see 2008, Vanderbilt, 4th and goal on the 3 yard line…)

Tuberville was a good coach. But if the measure of a good coach is conference championships, then Tuberville came up short. He fielded a lot of good teams but didn’t really rack up a whole lot of SEC championships with them. The biggest frustration was that we (me and my Auburn friends) were tired of eeking out wins, losing some games we should have won and generally achieving in the top 3rd, but rarely at the very top.

In the end, Auburn and its fans wanted more than he could or would achieve. Gene Chizik may or may not be the answer. But after 10 years, we did know that Tommy Tuberville was not.

Not Disappointed

July 31st, 2009
9:46 am

I’m a do or die Georgia Tech fan and Alumni.

That being said, “Coach Richt is a great coach and human being.” It’s hard not to like him or his family. I brought back a spark to Georgia that I hadn’t seen since the early 80’s.

He is a good Coach.

I remain, “Not Disappointed and a Ramblin Wreck!” Good weekend all. Yeah pups too.

Joe M

July 31st, 2009
9:46 am

04- L to Auburn 26-6, 06- L to Tenn. 51-33, 07- L to Tenn. 35-14, 08- L to Bama 41-30 (and don’t even try to act like that wasn’t a blowout) and L to Florida 49-10 and it wasn’t that close.

That’d be FIVE blowouts in 4 yrs. DISMISSED!

Huh? Serioiusly?

July 31st, 2009
9:48 am

Huh?,

Nice try. I know you put 20+ points as your line of demarcation but c’mon we know blowouts when they happen. Not to mention they were blowouts in key games that really affected the Dawgs’ seasons. Let’s not dismiss so easily.

2008
UF 49-10
Bama 41-30

2007
Tennessee 35-14

2006
Tennessee 51-33

2004
Auburn 24-6

2003
LSU 34-13

reality check

July 31st, 2009
9:48 am

JB I also thought Auburn pulled the plug on Tuberville too fast, but the true story is that Tuberville found out Auburn had approached Houston Nutt about the Auburn job and that triggered a clause in his contract that he walked away with $8 million. It was Tuberville’s decision. Bobby Lowder & company are not the brightest candles on the cake. Tuberville found out about it because he and Houston Nutt have the same agent.

The news media never reported this, but I can assure you that is what haqppened.

Georgia News - 7/31/09 | MrSEC.com

July 31st, 2009
9:51 am

[...] In a cost-cutting measure, there’s a chance some Georgia coaches could be forced to take furloughs.  If football coaches have to take furloughs, just when will they take them?For Georgia fans, traveling with the Dawgs is an expensive proposition.  Just to gain the right to buy tickets from Georgia’s allotment at Neyland Stadium this year, a fan has to have donated at least $21,950 to UGA’s Athletic Association over the course of their lifetime.  Well, at least it’s cumulative.Will Georgia win a national title under Mark Richt?  The AJC’s Tony Barnhart says it’s a faulty question because coaches should not be judged by their national championship trophies. [...]

MikeyD

July 31st, 2009
9:51 am

Indeed there is too much luck involved and too many variables to be able to win a national championship, and guess what? There’s an easy answer. It’s called a PLAYOFF! Settle it on the field, not in the polls and computers. Pretty revolutionary idea, don’t you think?

reality check

July 31st, 2009
9:53 am

Tony, I agree with your logic and that winning a National Championship does not define greatness.

I would ask all the critics what they ever won at any level.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
9:54 am

I didn’t go back to 2003 because the clown said past 4 or 5 years. I obviously counted the 2007 Tennessee game. Okay, so that’s three more supposed blowouts that you have pointed out to me in the past 5 years. That brings the total to 4. Four blowouts in 5 years does not warrant a misleading comment implying that this is a common thing under Richt. It is not. Quite while you’re ahead clown. Good day.

Sam Robards, Dawg Fan

July 31st, 2009
9:54 am

Tony, I am in total agreement with everything you said except this:

“LSU was the best team in the country at the end of the 2007.”

I’m sorry, but I’d argue that Georgia was the best team at the end of 2007. I think LSU deserved the championship based on all the factors, but, if we had a proper playoff, Georgia or Southern Cal woulda beaten LSU. Oh well! Agree to disagree.

Gen Neyland

July 31st, 2009
9:56 am

Although the goal of a HC in any conference is to win the conference, the measure of a good football coach is found within his handling of the program and in the character of the majority of the men he turns out. A great coach does the same without patting his own back. A NC is icing on the cake…Other than that, to quote Al Whacko Davis, ‘Just win,baby’…

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
9:57 am

Fairly and objectively, there’s a heck of a lot more to being a good head coach than merely winning a national championship. For example, if Steve Spurrier had stayed at Duke instead of having the opportunity to coach at his alma mater, would that have made him any less of an offensive master? No, but the Evil Genius never would have had the chance to prove it on the big stage, with a regional and national audience paying attention. And, no, it’s not like he’s forgotten how to coach since he’s been in Columbia; he’s had his share of upset wins over Florida, Georgia and Tennessee, but he doesn’t have the same level of talent he had in Gainesville.

Or, if you prefer a non-Gator example, what if Bear Bryant had stayed at Kentucky? Does anyone really believe that Bear would have won as many SEC and national polling championships in Lexington as he did in Tuscaloosa?

So, the point is, Tony is correct in saying that winning national championships is not the only measure of a great coach. Problem is, you can’t objectively measure a coach’s ability to maximize the potential of his players through good coaching. If you could, we might discover that someone like Erk Russell was a far greater coach than Urban Meyer, Dooley, the Bear, the General, the Evil Genius, and anyone else you care to name.

Are you kidding?

July 31st, 2009
10:00 am

CharlotteGator’s “Real SEC country” comment…why would NC be SEC country at all? There are no SEC schools in the state.

BILLY JACK

July 31st, 2009
10:03 am

Great article Tony-it takes many intagibles to win the national championship in its current format.Mark Richt is in his 9th year and will win multiple national championships before his 30 plus years is over.We UGA alumni need to appreciate what we have and to remember that we could be Notre Dame who barely goes to a bowl anymore,which is hard to do being they are about 15 more bowls than they should be.We could be Georgia Tech who beats its in state rival 2 or 3 times a century.It was not long ago people said Mack Brown could not win the big game.Mark Richt will rival even the great Bear Bryants SEC record before he retires.Tim Tebow will graduate this year and gator fans time for honoring themselves will soon come to an end.

Are you kidding?

July 31st, 2009
10:04 am

Why do some of you think NC will recieve a stomping from LSU? Will have a fouth year starter at QB, RB, and almost an entire defense full of high level recruits who have been playing since being true freshman. I think UNC on the rise will match up well against LSU which is obviously in decline slowly but surely under Miles.

greatpacho

July 31st, 2009
10:05 am

Tony, great article. I’m a sucker for historic college football writing especially regarding the near misses and woulda shoulda coulda’s. Its clear that fate has not been kind to the Georgia Bulldogs over the last 25 years. Ever since “Run Lindsay Run” and the 1980 National Championship the Dawgs haven’t caught a break. But like anything you have to keep coming back every year. If Richt is as good a coach as you think (and I don’t doubt that he is) the dawgs will have several chances over the next few years to finally win that NC. Just look at Florida, for years the gators couldn’t seem to get off the mat and take advantage of their talent but lately everything has broken for the Gators. Maybe its the water down here… but then again we get our water from georgia. Hey keep up the good work and GO GATORS!!

Otto

July 31st, 2009
10:06 am

CMR can’t reach that level? He came very close in ‘02 and ‘07 as Tony points it takes just 1 break.

For the fan that thought Tubby was let go to soon, as Franklin interviews pointed out the coach staff was very fragmented. I have family in the athletic department and there was an inner circle with in fighting. It was a partnership that was always nicer on the surface than it really was. I do hope Tubby gets back in coaching if he wants but Auburn was not the place.

Coach Chizik has potential. Johnny Majors record at Iowa St. wasn’t much better. The coaches are a unified staff now which Tubby had not enjoyed in years. Auburn has hired some good assistant. I look for them to have the best record of the teams with new coaches.

Are you kidding?

July 31st, 2009
10:08 am

Glad to see there are some objective fans on here capable of providing great insight and independent thought. Good post Billy Jack! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Joe M

July 31st, 2009
10:08 am

Huh,

Obviously you cannot hold a discussion w/o becoming juvenile, which is unfortunate for you.

Simply put, in the past four years there have been five blowouts under Richt (not sure where you got four but it doesn’t really matter, because you only had two to start with anyway). Just going with your four, that is 1 per year over a four year period and therefore it has become a trend.

Hopefully it stops this year along with the trend of losing to a team Georgia is clearly better than.

Mike

July 31st, 2009
10:10 am

WOW…..Tony, I can finally agree with you! Nice article. I will say this- USC and OK started 1 and 2 and did not lose so they stayed Number 1 and 2. Wonder why????? UGA starts number 1 and wins their opener by 3 TDs and drops in polls.. Did USC and OU win all their games by more than 3 TDs???Again- media has too much influence on polls

GWJ

July 31st, 2009
10:10 am

Tony, you are correct.

Bama Aaron

July 31st, 2009
10:13 am

Well done Barnhart. While I enjoy reading your blogs I’ll admit I probably disagree with you 7 out of 10 times. But you nailed this one. Conference titles should be the main judge of a coaches ability. Too many silly things like polls involved in the National title. IMO it will be a joke of a system until they find a way to do away with the polls altogether or at least don’t make them until the 1st week of October when you might realistically be able to tell which teams deserve to be in the top 25.

GatorGreg

July 31st, 2009
10:20 am

Tony,

You are 100% correct that getting into the BCS championship game takes luck. BUT – you will eventually have good luck if you consistently put yourself in position to get it.

I believe what makes a GREAT (not good, which is what I Richt is) coach is:

1. Consistently in the BCS championship conversation.
2. Win it when you are lucky enough to be in it.

Using this measure, Richt has been on the cusp of greatness, but hasn’t reached it yet.

Bear in mind that I really like Richt as a person. But I agree with what someone else said – he just might be too nice to be a great coach. If I’m looking for a best friend, it’s going to be someone like Mark Richt. If I’m looking for a great coach (or field general, or stockbroker, or whatever), it’s going to be someone like Steve Spurrier or Urban Meyer.

charles

July 31st, 2009
10:21 am

The truth is that there has never been a NC in D1 college football. Everyone should just admit this and go to an 8 team playoff.Some of the NC’s that some schools claim are comical.

chazzo

July 31st, 2009
10:22 am

Miles

July 31st, 2009
10:30 am

Mr. Barnhart, you’re right. A coach should not ultimately be judged by the number of national championships he won. This seems pretty simple to me.

Tom

July 31st, 2009
10:31 am

Great players and luck make good coaches GREAT coaches and you can’t win the Ky Derby with a mule and some good coaches only have mules. Look at your team to see how many mules you have the decide where you will finish.

Cameron

July 31st, 2009
10:40 am

You are 100% correct. Any educated fan would agree.

JB

July 31st, 2009
10:44 am

Tom Osborne, Mack Brown,the guy who used to coach the cowboys with the nice hat and suit.
all soft spoken, all gentlemen, all produced championships. Read in SI’s preview mag last night that outside of Florida, Georgia produces the best high talent and the second most numbers in the SE…….that being said, it’s only a matter of time when the right chemistry of studs will hit Athens all at once and we’ll get there.

Long Dawg

July 31st, 2009
10:46 am

Tony, I think you nailed it. There are a lot of great coaches in college football and while winning and losing is the ultimate measure of success there are usually several teams at the end of the year that deserve to play in the NC game. That is why we need a playoff system.

As to the question of Mark Richt’s ability to win a NC. I believe he will and I believe it will happen in the next 4 years.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
10:48 am

Joe M, I’m not sure where you got 5 blowouts in 4 years. That simply isn’t true. You’re probably a Techie that thinks your 3 point win last year was a blowout.

Juvenile? Maybe, but I’m just keeping the audience in mind.

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
10:48 am

WOW. Well its really hard to top this gem from, “Mr. College Football.”

He actually accomplishes two HUGE things at once.

There is just SOOOOOOOOO much written between the lines its hard to know where to begin.

If you read between the lines (obvious to a non-SEC fan) you can EASILY see Barnhart “talking down” UGA fan expectations about his season and CMR specifically. This has all of the “please dont throw CMR under the bus” smell to it. Tony, tell that story to all the UGA fans that ponied up $10,000 last year for rights to tix, and to the BIG MONEY crowd that have dropped down SERIOUS money for their dawgs. How do you think THEY’LL feel about your sentiment?

What ol’ Mr. College Football is trying to say is that the dawgs are headed for a bad season(8-4 at best, maybe even 7-5), starting with what will be a beatdown by OKST and ending with, YES, a loss to GT. Mark Bradley said the same thing 4 weeks ago. You heard it from MB first.

Second, with all the BS that TB just wrote about the clusterf**** that is the BCS, did he not just make a CONVINCING CASE for a LEGITIMATE PLAYOFF SYSTEM. Why is it that D1 canbring itself to a LEGITIMATE PLAYOFF system like D2, D3, etc. etc. etc.

Folks, TB…”says”…he wants a playoff system. He doesnt. Not a playoff system in a true form, but some convoluted, BCS manipulated, conference-biased, pre-determined outcome-type playoff.

Hell, you could even call it “Outcome-based Football.”

So much for integrity from…(ahem, choke) Mr. College Football.

Charles

July 31st, 2009
10:52 am

Joe M…Meyer has lost one game in each of his two title seasons. Does that make him too nice? Yours is an asanine, irrelevant point.

Winning the national title is about being both very good and lucky.

Tony’s point is well-taken, though he’s wrong in saying LSU proved it was the best team at the end of 07. Georgia was. Georgia’s had two national championship caliber teams in 02 and 07. The cards are going to fall the right way for Richt soon enough.

Ray Goff

July 31st, 2009
10:59 am

Barnhart, you dont know what the hell you’re talking about.

Jim Donnan

July 31st, 2009
11:00 am

Agreed.

Barnhart, you dont know what the hell you’re talking about.

David Cutcliffe

July 31st, 2009
11:00 am

Forrest Gump

July 31st, 2009
11:01 am

Chance certainly plays a role in winning a NC, but the more successful the team, the better the chances. Richt’s win record has never matched the talent that he recruits year after year. He is certainly near the top in players who go to the NFL. But behavior issues have always characterized Richt’s teams. If you encourage end-zone dances and “black outs” as game-winning strategies, you are not a very good coach.

Tommy Tuberville

July 31st, 2009
11:01 am

Ron Zook

July 31st, 2009
11:01 am

F******ing A !!

Mike Shula

July 31st, 2009
11:02 am

Right on, Zook.

Barnhart, you dont know crap.

Otto

July 31st, 2009
11:02 am

Trade School Junkie, It is obvious you love to hate and really only know what you see on SportsCenter.

Lou Holtz

July 31st, 2009
11:03 am

I just wanna say….zzzy8tFH 8EVBN27CB GRF2Y9 1

Excuses

July 31st, 2009
11:04 am

Just making excuses for Richt not winning. Hell he can’t even get to the game. Sorry but when you have the classes he gets, the preseason #1 ranking, the top qb in the draft taken, best running back etc you should be able to make it to the big game. Keep making excuses trying to put the blinders over the uga fans faces. They aren’t falling for it. With what Richt has, he’s underachieved here. Let’s see how this year plays out.

Otto

July 31st, 2009
11:04 am

How many SEC title do the coaches above comine for? 1?

Lou Holtz

July 31st, 2009
11:04 am

I jushhhhh wanna shhhaaayyy

…..zzzz…zzzz…blah blah blah

fjwifwofi9r38er3uh4t0-g0egj92rfhhubfgwr

Houston Nutt

July 31st, 2009
11:06 am

Barnhart, WTH ????????????????????

Hel-LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW !!

greatpacho

July 31st, 2009
11:08 am

Trade School Junkie,

Sure Barnhardt is talking down the rabid members of the dawg-pound but hey who wouldn’t. Any follower of SEC football knows that it doesn’t take long for a shining star to become an outcast ala Tubervillle, Fulmer, etc. and then you end up with lane kiffin or worse.

Personally, I think the dawgs are gonna surprise some people this year. In football, as in life, there is nothing more powerful than having something to prove. and georgia has recruited lights out for a while now. so even though they lost Knowshon and Stafford they are still loaded with talent, albeit unknown talent. Oklahoma State is in the exact opposite situation, they still have their headliners but have certainly lost some critical seniors from last year’s team. The matchup in week one between these two teams will be illuminating for the Georgia fan base this year. Either the Dawgs are in for a long year or they are gonna be a surprising upstart.

I just hope my Gators come ready to play against UGA because I’m d@mn sure the dawgs aren’t gonna roll over
GO GATORS

G8R GRAD

July 31st, 2009
11:12 am

One of your best installments to date, Tony.

Yet, I have to echo Atlanta Gator’s point:

Coach Russel was a GREAT coach.

G8R GRAD

July 31st, 2009
11:13 am

One of your best installments to date, Tony.
Sorry.

AND I have to echo Atlanta Gator’s point:

Sly Croom

July 31st, 2009
11:13 am

Uh-huh.

Tell that to MY boosters !!

GatorGreg

July 31st, 2009
11:14 am

Who was it that said,

“The only people who say that it isn’t whether you win or lose are the losers!”

G8R GRAD

July 31st, 2009
11:15 am

Sorry.

AND I have to echo Atlanta Gator’s point:

Matt

July 31st, 2009
11:15 am

Tony, the fact is that if you were a UF hack instead of a UGA hack, you’d be saying the exact opposite. The people down in Florida and over in Louisiana all agree that it’s the BCS championship that carries all the weight. The only reason you’re making this absurd argument is because Richt hasn’t (and won’t ever) win the BCS because UGA is a second rate program in the SEC – not on the level of LSU, UF, or Bama.

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
11:20 am

Pacho:

How much does a fan have to put down to be “a rabid fan?”

$10,000…$20,000…$100,000

Tell it the BIG MONEY boosters.

This Barnhart piece was written to pour water on the flames Paul Finebaum lighted in his artcile about CMR being on the “hotseat,”
and, again…to start lowering EXPECTATIONS.

Link: http://www.al.com/sports/press-register/pfinebaum.ssf?/base/sports/124816778464890.xml&coll=3

Brad

July 31st, 2009
11:25 am

This whole luck crap sounds just like our politicians in washington. the ones that say you’re poor because your unlucky. Or they are rich because they got lucky. Ugh. You achieve greatness by hard work. Something UGA has underachieved at. Getting blown out by bama and fla last year and by fla several times this decade is not greatness. It’s called being 3rd or 4th best in your conference. Which is what ga is. Saying it’s luck is disgusting. Keep making excuses Tony. You should move to Washington. you’d fit right in there.

Rational Citizen

July 31st, 2009
11:33 am

I’m here once again to encourage everyone to consider the benefits of the legalization, regulation, and taxation of marijuana. At a time when our local and state governments are struggling with shrinking tax bases, we can create jobs and stimulate our local economies by bringing a reliable source of revenue out of the darkness and into the light. This is a multi-billion dollar market for a substance that is, by every measure, less harmful to society and to individuals than tobacco or alcohol.

By not legalizing marijuana, America is essentially ceding a huge market to organized crime. It didn’t work during Prohibition, and it’s failed miserably when it comes to marijuana. By treating marijuana the same as alcohol, where we place restrictions on its purchase and use, we can responsibly address the issue while simultaneously creating a reliable source revenue for Americans.

Let’s create jobs here in America. Whether you are a Republican or a Democrat, this an issue we should all care about. Contact your representatives in Congress and tell them it’s time we start looking out for the best interests of Americans.

Legalization, Regulation, TAXATION.

Craig

July 31st, 2009
11:38 am

Tony you wrote “The 2007 season is the best example of all of how it takes more than talent and good coaching to play for the BCS title. LSU began championship Saturday with two losses and ranked No. 7 in the BCS standings. The ONLY way the Tigers had a chance to get to the big game was by beating Tennessee in the SEC championship game and hoping beyond hope that both No. 1 Missouri and No. 2 West Virginia BOTH lose. The odds against that were incredible but it did happen and LSU got its shot.”

Oh really? Mizzou had to play Oklahoma in the Big 12 title game. They already lost to them that year. They were definitely a big underdog and got blown out. Yeah such a tough game to predict. As for WV, they already had a loss that year to SF. And they played their biggest rival, PITT, in the backyard brawl. Hardly incredible odds tony. You really don’t look intelligent in presenting your arguments. Yeah coaches shouldn’t be gauged on NC. What a stupid inane comment. Keep saying it’s lucky. You’ll sucker in those dawg fans who can’t see the obvious.

ecarruga

July 31st, 2009
11:40 am

Why is it that college football is the ONLY sport in the world that does not decide its champion on the field with actual games/playoffs?
GREAT article Tony this is why CF will never reach its potential
CHANCE and luck plays too much into the national championship

Matt

July 31st, 2009
11:44 am

To the UGA fans saying LSU did not “prove” it was the best team. Please remember, LSU played for and won 2 Championships in ‘07. UGA played for none. Also, I can guarantee you that LSU would not have been “scared” to play UGA. If that would have been the SECCG, LSU would have been prepared.

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
11:46 am

Take this to the bank: CMR will fire Martinez after the Florida game.

Richt is gonna HAVE to throw SOMEONE on the alter of the UGA BOOSTER MONEY GODS, for redemption, and its gonna be Willie.

That way, Richt will have SOME redemption for what is gonna be a rough year (8-4 or even 7-5). Of course, that will also provide “PR cover” for the upcoming loss to GT in 2009.

Think it aint so?

Then why did CMR recently appoint a “CO-DEFENSIVE COORDINATOR?”

Go ahead and light that alter fire now !!

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
11:47 am

Rational Citizen—-If everyone is laying around smoking dope all day, somehow, I doubt that’s going to stimulate our national economy in the larger sense. Maybe ganja farmers, packagers and distributors will do better financially, but I suspect many others will sleep more, giggle a great deal, eat more snack foods, and work less. Okay, maybe Frito-Lay, Golden Flake and Orville Redenbacher will do somewhat better, too.

All kidding aside, this is a football blog. Please take your political message elsewhere. We have serious issues to discuss here.

Tech guy

July 31st, 2009
11:47 am

Enter your comments here To anyone who follows the game, everything you said is logically obvious – but, emotion usually trumps that. A national championship doesn’t prove you’re any better in personnel or coaching than 5-10 other teams, at least, that year. An occasional national championship only says you’re a top tier program with a top tier coach.

GT

July 31st, 2009
11:52 am

Luck. Ha. Unlucky is when you go undefeated and have to share a title with another team that had a loss, won another game at the end with 5 downs and then got a phantom clipping call in the final seconds of their bowl game. That is unlucky. How many times did ga eek out a game against vandy or kentucky this decade on some botched play? Nice job of trying to water down a national champ tony. Yeah those gators and tigers and buckeyes and trojans were just “lucky” to get there. What a crock. Funny thing is if any team has received it’s fair share of luck over the past 10 years, it’s Ga. Without it, they’d be equal to South Carolina.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
11:53 am

Fair enough Matt. Just don’t go around shoving that fluke national title from 2007 in our faces. That way you won’t have to be reminded about how you conveniently didn’t have to play us. Based on the way the two teams were playing at the end of that regular season, I think we would have wiped the damn floor with you in all honesty, but that’s just my opinion. Your defense was beat up and you were coming off a tough overtime loss to Arkansas. Georgia, meanwhile, was coming off an easy win against Tech and was running on all cylinders. Moreno barely even played in that game and would have been healthy for the SECCG. I mean really dude, that game probably wouldn’t have even been close. Be honest with yourself. Again, just my opinion though.

Long Dawg

July 31st, 2009
11:53 am

Trade School Flunkie… It wouldn’t matter if the BCS stays the same, or if there is a playoff system created or what. Ga Tech ain’t gonna be in a NC game in your lifetime. They will probably not make it to the ACC championship any time soon.
Now all you nerds think CPJ is the second coming simply because he got lucky in Athens. And he did get lucky. Look at Gardner Webb and LSU and North Carolina and Virginia. That is the tech we are all used to seeing and will continue to see. CPJ is a good coach…at the 1AA level. He is in the big leagues now and you will see it manifest itself this year. Any who calls a fake punt on 4th an 8 at their own 22 ain’t very smart.

gfsmith

July 31st, 2009
11:54 am

100% agree Tony. Nothing was more disrespectful to Tommy Tuberville than when sportwriters/talking heads pointed out how many “national championship coaches” resided in the SEC and they omitted CTT. I can even recall you, Tony, doing it on several occasions. When that stat was quoted, at the bare minimum, the circumstances around Auburn in 2004 should have been mentioned. With this article, you have won back that little piece of respect that was lost when you were guilty of said omission. I’m sure the same goes for CTT.

Ben

July 31st, 2009
11:55 am

Tony,

Your insights are always most informed and are probably the only articles on ajc.com worth reading. I look forward to watching your new show in the Fall. From one bulldog to another…I’m ready for kickoff baby! Only 36 Days.

heeltide

July 31st, 2009
11:55 am

Dean Smith had a great response after he won his first title in 1983, when a reporter asked him the obligatory “validation” question. He shrugged and said, “I don’t think I’m a better coach now than I was two hours ago.”

That said, UGa fans have had to watch UT and UA win 1, while LSU and UF win 2 — that’s 6 NC for SEC schools in the past 16 years. In other words, all the other schools are doing it. That has to be frustrating.

plt

July 31st, 2009
11:55 am

I have been saying the same thing for many years. Great to see someone with a platform like yours that will stand up and say it. In the SEC it is about being the Conference Champ. Everything else is gravy. I was a member of the 1999 Alabama SEC Championship Team.If you recall we got beat that year the 3rd game of the season by a Tim Rattay lead LA Tech team on a last second play. The main message after that game was that it was not a conference loss an our team goals of winning the SEC were still attainable. We did win that year and will forever be remembered as a Championship team at Alabama and let me tell you there is nothing like it in this world. Great job Tony. I love reading your column.

Yep

July 31st, 2009
11:59 am

You’re right tony. Coaches shouldn’t be judged by Nat Championships. We should do away with coach of the year awards. No more conference championship games. And no more bowls. Just a 10 game season and whoever scores the most points is the champion. Or better yet, just end college football. Since what a coach and team accomplishes is just luck and doesn’t really matter. Yep I agree.

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
12:02 pm

Actually, “heeltide,” the University of Florida has won 3 national championships (1996, 2006, 2008) in the last 16 years, not 2. Just trying to be accurate. And, yes, the Gators were lucky. Very lucky, in deed. = )

JaxDawg

July 31st, 2009
12:15 pm

Tony well said! No coach no matter how good, can control whether or not they get into the NC game period. All a coach can do is try to put his team in the best possible sitiuation, and wait and see if it’s good enough/they get the right breaks to get in.

Anyone who thinks a coach has any control over that is just fooling themselves. Florida has been fortunate that they’ve gotten the breaks needed to get into the game.
Urban Meyer is a great coach, but he’s also been a lucky coach as well.

BigMike

July 31st, 2009
12:15 pm

Barnhardt, Are you going crazy?? The reason we play sports is to determine a champion. All coaches should not only be judged on championships, but want to make anything less than that a bad season for him.

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
12:18 pm

heeltide, it is frustrating and I think that’s why the national championship issue is such a big deal with Georgia. LSU and Florida have been winning them and we haven’t, and we know we can hang with those teams (last year’s 49-10 beatdown notwithstanding). I don’t think this would be such a big deal if our peers weren’t winning them. If we were in the ACC this wouldn’t be an issue at all. They’re just happy to go to whatever bowl game will take them over there. National championships are a total pipe dream.

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
12:19 pm

Long Dawg:

Its not about whether GT gets to the Orange Bowl, or another BCS game.

THE POINT: is that the current BCS system is a complete SCAM, FOR MOST TEAMS IN ALL CONFERENCES. Why is a TRUE playoff good enough for D2, D3, in EVERY SPORT (even D1 Baseball is a true playoff), but not good enough for D1 football. It’s good enouogh for the NFL afterall.

Did AU get shafted in 2004. Yep.
Did USC(11-1) get shafted last year. Yep.
Did TxTech(11-1)get shafted last year. Yep.

Did Nebraska deserve to be in the NC game against Miami after getting mauled 62-36 by Colorado in the last season game. Nope.

Was it a complete joke that both PennState and Ohio State even got invites to BCS bowls last year. Yep.

Was it a complete joke that Cincinnatti and Utah woud up in a BCS bowls over teams like Ole Miss, LSU, TxTech, USC, etc. etc. Yep. Do I think LSU and Ole Miss were probably MUCH better than Utah and Cincy. Yep.
So, LSU and Ole Miss (SEC teams) got screwed, cause both probably would have gone deep in a TRUE playoff system. Could UGA have gone deep into a REAL-TRUE playoff system last year. Probably.

I’ll repeat my main point here: without a true playoff system:
MOST TEAMS IN ALL CONFERENCES GET SCREWED. Period.

Long Dawg

July 31st, 2009
12:21 pm

Brad, obviously you are not a Georgia fan because you forgot the following in your analysis:

1. 82/22 since 2000- .788 win %
2. 7/1 vs Ga tech – .875 win%
3. 5 AP top ten finishes 2002, 2003,2004,2005,2007
4. 6/2 in Bowl games- .75 win %. 3 BCS bowls .66 win %
5. Blow outs- you wann talk about blow outs?
2002 Ga. 51 tech 7 Ga.30 Ark 3 SEC CHAMPS
2003 Ga. 30 Clemson 0 Ga. 41 Tenn. 14
2004 Ga. 45 LSU 16
2005 Ga. 34 LSU 14 SEC CHAMPS
2007 Ga. 42 Fla. 30 Ga. 45 Auburn 20, Ga 41 Hawaii 10
6. 6 10 win seasons in last 8 years

You, along with trade school junkie and several other derranged jack fans should seek professional help. Your hate/envy/jealousy for the Dawgs is at a sick level. You are consumed by it. You could crack anyday and you will eventually when Tech loses to Miami and Clemson and paybackcomes in Nov. And it is comming and in your heart of hearts you know it.

Bill

July 31st, 2009
12:22 pm

As usual Barnhart, you confuse us all with facts! Great article!!

MyWhiskeyClear

July 31st, 2009
12:22 pm

Interesting topic. School football history is made in championships of either type. For instance, Auburn touts its number of SEC titles while Bama can shows us its shiny National titles. Both say good things about the program and its historically great coaches. That said I don’t think you can blame fans for wanting their team to achieve the #1 rank and win it all. I do, however, agree that failing to do that does not reflect on the coach unless you’re talking about a botched game. So it’s probably a good idea to focus on the conference championship more than anything else.

Here’s hoping the Jackets enjoy the glory of a championship soon!

N.GA.DAWG

July 31st, 2009
12:38 pm

When you lose 1 game during the season(before any bowl game)you have to get lucky. It amazes me how many DA fans cant figure that one out. Heck lsu lost 2 and still got in. HERE’S A QUESTION FOR ALL THE LSU AND FLA PEOPLE. Can you go just 1 season undefeated? if not, you can ask the media for a shot. that’s already worked in 07. CMR will be at UGA as long as he wants. He will never be run out of town, i can promise you that! He will start 09 2-0 and beat tech again. MARK IT DOWN.

Tom

July 31st, 2009
12:44 pm

The only people you see making excuses and complaining are the ones who aren’t winning them. i.e. ga fans. It’s been almost 30 years since ga’s last championship. During that span, how many top 10 or top 5 or even #1 recruiting classes have we seen. Ga has been ranked in the top 10 in recruiting probably every year except maybe twice since 1980. That is not unlucky. It’s a TREND. It’s COACHING. It’s not being able to get over the preverbial hump. It’s losing to Sc and Vandy. It’s getting blown out against Tennessee, Bama and UF. These other schools don’t have any better classes than Ga on average the past 30 years. Yet UT has one, Bama one or two, Fla 3. FSU 2. Miami several. LSU 2. You’d think GA would luck out and get one. Ahh, but it’s not luck. It’s a trend. It’s coaching. And ol Tony, the apologizer for anything UGA, is there to make you feel all better. That you’re just unlucky. That CMR is a great coach. Ha. Defense wins cahmpionships. And GA made no changes from last year to this year. So expect more of the same. a 7-8 win season and more articles like this from Tony saying they were just unlucky. Sad.

athensdawg

July 31st, 2009
12:47 pm

I agree with the folks who said that CMR has one “knucklehead” game each year.

That is what keeps us from going to the next level. Last year, we had three knucklehead games…florida, bama, and GT…and an almost knucklehead vs. Auburn.

And all these “knucklehead” games follow the same pattern.
The week before, we won a “big emotional” game. (Bama – victory vs ASU) (Florida- victory vs. LSU) (GT-end of SEC schedule) So…it should be easy to predict the knucklehead games this year….

South Carolina (after a “big” game in stillwater)
LSU or Tennessee (depending on the ranking and situation when we play ASU or LSU…should we win both of those, we will definately have a knucklehead game vs. UT.)
GT (this could be a perinnial knucklehead game….since it is after we have completed the SEC schedule and pretty much locked in our bowl position.)

Florida game is going to be interesting. If we can run the ball and throw to the tight ends, we might have a chance. When UGA runs the ball successfully in jacksonville, we win….and all indications are pointing in that direction. Of course, if CWM don’t get it together, it doesn’t matter if we go into a wishbone and hold the ball for 45 minutes a game…..

However, until CMR and staff learn to overcome the “knucklehead” games – in which the team plays like a bunch of uninspired zombies – they will NEVER make it to the big dance.

with that being said…..i will say that time is on our side. he will figure it out….but it’s gonna take a while.

[...] a NC define a coach? Interesting perspective from the AJC: Coaches should not be judged on national championships | Mr. College Football "I’d rather lose as a Dawg than win as any other team….once a Dawg, always a Dawg—how [...]

Huh?

July 31st, 2009
12:50 pm

Oh darn. Tom really just put us in our place, especially with that “more of the same 7-8 win season” jab. I mean, Georgia has had so many of those recently that I’ve lost count. I’m sure Tony Barnhart would be mentioning Georgia and national championship in the same sentence if 7 or 8 wins seasons were the norm for Georgia. Makes perfect sense.

What a doofus.

Pete

July 31st, 2009
12:51 pm

The only area you can call it unlucky is being in the same division as fla. But LSU has done well with the cards it was dealt. And don’t compare 2007 uga to lsu. You lost your second game to south carolina. You couldn’t even score a TD. you needed ot to beat bama. and you got blown out by tennessee and beat vandy on pure luck. so enough with we were so great in 07. you ended the season strong but guess what. the season is not 6 weeks long. excuse making losers.

GO TIGERS.

Ron Mexico

July 31st, 2009
12:51 pm

Saint Simons works for the AJC. And his moronic posts are just an attempt (a successful one at that) to boost blog hits.

Gen Neyland

July 31st, 2009
12:56 pm

The New Generation of NC’s began in 1998…

how2fish

July 31st, 2009
12:57 pm

Great article as always !

GT fan ...

July 31st, 2009
12:58 pm

Playoff Tony, PLAYOFF …. your points mean squat!

There are probably 8-10 teams, maybe more, NOT in the NC game EVERY season that would have more than a legitimate shot at beating the “best team in college football” as you call each BCS winner. Could Texas, USC, Texas Tech, Oregon, Va Tech, Penn St., Ohio St., Oregon St., Utah, Ole Miss, have beaten Fla last year? Not to mention teams worthy of a 16 team playoff getting a 2nd shot at Fla (i.e. Bama, LSU, GA). Oh wait, one of those ten DID beat Fla last season! Aren’t they the “best team in college football” then?

Sure, you and many others will say it was a fluke win for Ole Miss, a 9-4 team. Well then, was it not a fluke win for Oregon St (9-4) to beat USC thus denying USC a shot at OU? But wait, Maybe Texas-USC for NC, or OU-TexTech, or Oregon-Fla, or Alabama-Penn State, or Utah-VaTech, or GA-LSU, or Ohio St.-Oregon St., or etc., etc., this list goes on.

Too many voters and not PLAYERS deciding which NC game the viewing population will watch doesn’t see fair to the many players, students, and fans of teams that have a truly legitimate & worthy chance to be the “best team in college football.” But then again life isn’t fair, and neither is the BCS.

It’s all about the benjamins ……..

Saint Simons

July 31st, 2009
1:03 pm

I have no life what-so-ever and a short memory to boot! I wish I had went to UGA, but ended up at the Yellow River Institute of Crayon Technology and flunked out. I guess I’ll never get over that rejection letter from the state’s flagship university. Nerds like me though…

Delusional SEC Fan

July 31st, 2009
1:06 pm

Recruiting is not luck. Coaching is not luck. National championships are not luck. If you consistently do a better job than your coaching peers, the championships will come.

“Win” is not spelled with an “h” and “e.”

“Whine” is.

Its a gator world

July 31st, 2009
1:18 pm

Billy Jack,

You said Mark Richt will rival Bear Bryant’s sec championships record by the time he retires? That’s assuming he doesn’t get him fired of course after years and years of losses to Urban.

Just want to know. What kind of super crack, super meth, or ultra super weed are you dog fans smoking to come up with stuff like that?

Warning--this just in

July 31st, 2009
1:28 pm

Drunk UGA fans texting are to blame for their team choking. Don’t worry. Obama wants to have a beer with Richt to discuss the reasons for his lack of championships. It’s gotta be luck. Bwahahaha.

CharlotteGator

July 31st, 2009
1:29 pm

Sorry about the confusion, my “SEC country” comment was meant to communicate that I miss living in Atlanta or other real SEC cities. Living here in NC has been a black hole from a college football perspective.

athensdawg,

I have to say, I totally agree with your post. The one thing that’s hampered UGA is losing a game or two they absolutely should not lose. Either to a team they should beat handily or in a blowout fashion to a team they should be able to hang with and potentially beat. 2002 and 2007 are held up as the banner seasons where UGA got screwed, but I readily admit UF had no business winning in 2002 (we were terrible) and the 2007 UT loss was bad enough that I don’t know you can make the argument that “we’d have whipped LSU” which I’ve seen in other posts.

Really good analysis, and I agree that Richt’s time is coming. All indications point to this year being a turning point, however, selfishly, I hope it’s not until next year that you guys figure it out. :) JAX is gonna be fun and is in my opinion the toughest game on the sched. for the Gators.

ReptilesRule

July 31st, 2009
1:30 pm

Great=Elite and I would not consider Mark Richt to be either one. Very good would be a better description. I think every “great” coach, the Urban Meyer’s, the Pete Carroll’s, the Nick Saban’s, the Bobby Stoops all have consistant success AND a NC to go along with it. If Richt does win a NC and continues to win at his current pace, then you can call him great…

archangeladidas

July 31st, 2009
1:31 pm

All uga had to do was beat bama in their own stadium and couldn’t do it. Had their foot on gt throat and couldn’t hold on to a lead at home. You want to complain that UF has home field advantage in jacksonville. You losers can’t even win at home! CMR is a average coach at best. All you garabagedawgs have to do is win. Then you don’t have to worry about what happens in other parts of the country. LOSERS! GO GATORS!!!

GatorGreg

July 31st, 2009
1:32 pm

Hey, I’m a compassionate guy. I think it’s great that UGA fans have articles like Tony’s to make them feel a little better about themselves while we are winning all of these National Championships!

Don

July 31st, 2009
2:01 pm

Let’s look at UGA’s recruiting class since 2002 along with other sec schools. It’s called COACHING.

2002 Tenn-2 Uga-3 auburn-6
2003 LSU-1 UF-2 Uga-6 Sth car-8
2004 LSU-2 Uga-6 Fla-7
2005 Tenn-4 UGA-10
2006 UF-2 UGA-4 LSu-7
2007 UF 1 Tenn 3 Lsu 4 usc 6 aub 7 uga 9
2008 bama 1 UF 3 Uga 7
2009 bama 1 lsu 2 ga 6

all top 10 classes every year. and no nat champ appearances. what does that tell you? i guarantee you wont find any other school with all top 10’s and not playing in the title game since then. What sucks for ga is amabama is due to win one soon with saban. Gators this year. So soddddy.

Matt

July 31st, 2009
2:06 pm

The people bashing UGA by using Bama as an example are making fools out of themselves as well. Bama hasn’t won a National Title since 1992 and havnen’t meant much to the SEC this decade. Bama has had one good year under Saban and they were 7-6 the year before. The SEC should be ranked like this for the decade.

Elite:
1. UF
2. LSU

Really Good
3. UGA
4. Auburn
5. Tennessee
6. Alabama

Mediocre
7. Arkansas
8. South Carolina
9. Miss St.
10. Ole Miss

Bad
11. Kentucky
12. Vandy

Oh, can any Bama fan remind me how Saban followed up “great” years at LSU and Michigan St? If you don’t know, the answer is, An 8 or 9 win season. Saban has yet to put together back to back double digit win seasons. This year wont be the start.

Coach D

July 31st, 2009
2:11 pm

I agree that “greatness” is subjective.

There are some coaches that are innovative in terms of coming up with offensive or defensive schemes, and that’s their claim to “greatness”. UGA’s Wally Butts was light years ahead of most coaches during his era in regards to the passing game. So he was great as an innovator but mediocre as a head coach for a variety of reasons.

For some winning over 300 games is greatness. So the Joe Paterno’s and Bobby Bowden’s are great if you use that as your measuring stick even though in terms of winning National Titles, they would only be considered good since they have only won a couple each.

For others, it’s less about how many games you win and more about how many Championships you win or what kind of dynasty you can put together in that amount of time( i.e. Bud Wilkenson or Pete Caroll)

For others, greatness is being able to build a program from the ground up(i.e Nick Saban or Steve Spurrier). For some greatness is being able to come into a decorated program and maintain the same level of excellence(i.e.Urban Meyer or a Lou Holtz). And some have made the argument that greatness is being able to win with lesser talent( Jim Grobe).

Regardless of the criteria one uses for greatness, the one thing that is consistent across the board is a commitment to excellence in whatever area one chooses to be great in. And as long as one can live up to the standards that they set for themselves, then it doesn’t matter what others think. Greatness, like talent, proves itself over time.

Whopper Dawg

July 31st, 2009
2:18 pm

Tony, you are right. The BCS has absolutely nothing to do with deciding what team is the best football team. It is based strictly and solely on human opinion and computer “what ifs”. The preseason rankings alone eliminates 97% of the teams from title contention before the first kick off. A shame really.

EW

July 31st, 2009
2:21 pm

ok, so there are good coaches at all levels of football, but I would contest that only great coaches make it to programs like FL, GA, USC, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State etc.. So yes I think you can call a number of D1 football coaches great, that’s how they got their job in the first place.

EW

July 31st, 2009
2:24 pm

and for the nerds, there hasn’t been a GREAT coach at Tech since the 50’s, but you knew that. The great coaches flock to the best programs, and as much as you want to hang your hat on a 45-42 anomaly, you still aren’t even close to touching the likes of a UGA when it comes to program prestiege.

DT

July 31st, 2009
2:34 pm

EW
Who has more National Champs? That would be GT. 30 years since UGA’s last one. 20 for GT. So such up ignorant fool. Prestiege. LMAO! What a oxymoron. Mark and Paul are both good coaches. I would say PJ has a much better winning pedigree than MR. Remember Tressel at OSU coached at Div 1aa before the move up. You’ll see in 5 years when GT has a Nat Champ and a 5-1 record v/s the rednecks.

ThaMan

July 31st, 2009
2:35 pm

Meyer, THE Bear, Spurrier, Osborne, Switzer, Stoops, Brown. All lucky. However, they were and are lucky every year. Go figure! YEP! ALL LUCK!

NotAgain

July 31st, 2009
2:35 pm

Yeah, Yeah, we want a National Championship eventually!

Greg

July 31st, 2009
2:40 pm

Yeah what prestiege. John Heisman. Bobby Dodd. Bobby Ross. Soon to be CPJ. Yeah no presteige there. Dumba**es.

ThaMan

July 31st, 2009
2:41 pm

Long Dawg -the only thing long on you is you series of infantile posts. Every Single One!

ThaMan

July 31st, 2009
2:43 pm

EW should be EEWWWHHH! Prestige? The fleabags? You’d better get off that stuff, boy. It’s gonna kill you. Already destroyed your brain.

G8R GRAD

July 31st, 2009
2:51 pm

Billboards promoting your football program in neighboring states is a sure way to be eliminated from this great coaches conversation. Does Kiffen have NO shame?

Allen Waters

July 31st, 2009
3:01 pm

Tony:
Excellent article. Give COLLEGE FOOTBALL the same as all other sports. Playoff like the former 1AA! There is no dispute when the Champion makes it through the system. Georgia would have beaten any team in 2007 and maybe even 2002. It is just a matter of time and thanks to the Richt family for re-establishing GEORGIA football! UGA fan in India.

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
3:02 pm

Before CPJ, last truly great GT coach was Bobby Ross (’87-’91)

1988: 3-8
1989: 7-4
1990: 11-0-1 (Beat 9-3 Nebraska for NC)
1991: 8-5

Trade School Junkie

July 31st, 2009
3:08 pm

Just think how great football season would be if we some kind legitimiate D1 playoff system.

Imagine the excitement of March Madness or Fantasy Football…applied to college football.

It would be some of the greatest football games…EVER.

North Avenue Dude

July 31st, 2009
3:24 pm

GT 1990:
10-0-1 before beating a (9-2) Nebraska (who loss to Colorado 27-12)

Colorado 1990:
Colorado was 9-1-1 before beating Notre Dame
(23-22 loss to Illinois, 31-31 ties with Tennessee, and the infamous 5th down 33-31 win vs. Missouri)

Notre Dame 1990:
Notre Dame 9-2 before “bogus” loss to Colorado
(36-31 loss to Stanford and 24-21 loss to Penn State)

Nashville4UGA

July 31st, 2009
3:24 pm

was Tom Osborne not a good coach at Nebraska? Took him 21 years to win a national title. but during the time leading up to the title years in 94,95 and 97 he did some pretty amazing things.
Top 15 in the polls 24 out of 25 years, 13 conference titles.
did he not win National titles in the previous years before the championship years because he was too nice? no. was it because his teams lacked talent? NO..his championship years his teams had to go undefeated. I’m not taking anything away from Florida or LSU’s championships over the last few years. But neither have had undefeated seasons to get their championships and have had to rely on some other teams to do the dirty work for them to get there. UGA could have just as easily backed into a title in 2007 if say either Vandy or Kentucky’s kicker could kick a last second field goal agains UT….

Richt will have his title..at some point, but I’m not judging him by that right now.

Jim morrison

July 31st, 2009
3:27 pm

Keep dreaming Nashvill4UGA!

I do not see UGA ever winning another NC.

Enough Said!

Sam

July 31st, 2009
3:36 pm

Joe M: every team these days has a chance to lose a game they maybe should not lose (really, should UF have lost to Ole Miss last year or Auburn the year before that at home?).

Short Memory

July 31st, 2009
3:43 pm

Allen Waters,

“Georgia would have beaten any team in 2007 and maybe even 2002.”

Yeah, well, except for UT and USCe in 2007 and UF in 2002. Nice try though. Give it a rest.

aztec

July 31st, 2009
3:44 pm

there are only 2 teams that care about the BCS title game, the other 118 teams and there fans could care less

Long Dawg

July 31st, 2009
3:48 pm

Tha man, the truth hurts doesn’t it. Fact are facts even if you don’t want to believe it. Ga Ownes Tech and the program is superior in every way and will reassert itself this november and i hope you are there to witness it. If you are man enough to watch

gbal

July 31st, 2009
3:52 pm

Many want to call Vince Dooley a GREAT coach. He coaches 24 seasons and finished RANKED 11 times, or 45%. He did manage to get the 1 NC in 1980 with a great team and a lot of luck. (and 34 of course). But to finsich ranked 45% of the time… Id say is a good coach.

CMR has coached 8 seasons and renked 8 times at the final pole. 100% Average ranking 10.87 over 8 seasons.

VD had more years and did get the one NC in 24 trys, but given the first 8 seasons of CMR I would say he is probably the “greater” of the two.

Tide Rising

July 31st, 2009
3:53 pm

Matt,

Like you I don’t agree with any posters bashing UGA either by way of using Bama as an example of elite status after just one great season. But I think that you are dead wrong when you confer “elite” status on LSU in the west over Alabama.

Bama has always been the dominant team in the west and the only time we’ve not been dominant was for 5 years of probation in the 2000s when we were playing with 21 fewer scholarship players than everyone else. The bottom line is that when we are at full strength we own the west.

I’ve got nothing against LSU but this is a program that we have so thoroughly dominated historically that we lead the head to head series something like 46-25 and at one point we had a 19 game unbeaten streak in their so called “death valley” until a guy named Saban finally beat us there in 2004. Now we are at full strength and we’ve also have back to back no. 1 rated recruiting classes the last 2 years. The 2010 recruiting class currently ranks 2nd in the nation and I think its safe to say we are back to sitting atop our usual throne in the west.

Also, one thing you fail to mention is that Miles did a lot of winning with all those top ranked recruiting classes that Saban built at LSU with no. 1 classes in 2003 as well as 20004 and that Miles won the 2007 national title with that incredible senior class that was all Saban’s seniors.

Now that the last of Saban’s great players are gone we saw what Miles did last year. 7-5 with only 3 conference wins. I wonder if you noticed that. LSU people certainly did. They admired Saban and still loved him when he went to the Dolphins. Its only when he came back to Bama that they developed such a vitriolic hatred of the man. Its actually more fear than hate though. They saw what he did at LSU (a pathetic 8 losing seasons in 11 years before he got there) and now they see what he’s building at Alabama. That is why they’re scared and that is why even they know that Alabama and not LSU will be the elite team in the west. .

Mark

July 31st, 2009
3:57 pm

And ceo’s should not be judged on revenue and earnings. Managers should not be judged on performance and achievements. Pilots and train operators should not be judged on crashes because of texting. Chefs should not be judged how clean they are. Same with restaurants.

Yep sure makes sense to me Tony.

Tide Rising

July 31st, 2009
3:59 pm

Matt,

One other thing. I noticed you also have us rated as being behind Tennessee and Auburn in your own personal ratings system. While I respect both Auburn and UT as solid big time programs I don’t think you’ll find two many objective people that have them rated ahead of us right now while they are both in rebuilding, transitional stages. They both have also slipped substantially the last couple years in terms of recruiting relative to not just Bama but the other top tier teams in the SEC.

Long Dawg

July 31st, 2009
4:20 pm

Jim Morrison, well if you predict it then it must be so.. What you really meant to say was I hope Georgia never wins another NC because I am a Tech fan and my inferiority complex is already big enough.

HH

July 31st, 2009
4:58 pm

When a school pays an individual 2 million dollars and up to coach a football program, in UGA’s particular case 2.9 million, the fans who shell out extortion-type sums for the “privelege” of buying season tickets have every right to demand repayment in kind with championdhips or at least possibilities thereof—whether SEC or National. Is the team going to win one every year? Hell no. But the fans ought to have the benefit of having a “serious” contender every year, especially if the school considers itself to be a “big time” program, as UGA fancies itself to be. At the very least, if a program has glaring deficiencies that need to be corrected for it to become a perenial contender, which area apparent for all to see, then the coach owes the fans the effort to attempt to correct them. Georgia fans deserve no less. Based on my observation of Mark Richt for 8 years, the GA fans do not appear to me to be getting their money’s worth.

Beware of the junkyard dawg

July 31st, 2009
5:12 pm

Nice read Mr. Cfb..totally agree. The ‘02 and ‘07 dawgs just didn’t get the breaks the gators hve gotten with their 2 national titles. I think the gators karma will end when tebow leaves. I mean, no program just can continue to have that kind of good fortune forever. Richt will get his national title soon…hey tony, I am real excited bout ur new show starting sept 8th. Keep up the good work with giving us the inside skinny..go dawgs and thank goodness the season is right around the corner..

Reality Check

July 31st, 2009
5:15 pm

Great article, Tony. How dare we football fans have to think about things like coaching with reason and prudence.

GT

July 31st, 2009
5:28 pm

Too much money and ego at stake to have a level judgement call. The ACC hates having Wake win the conference championship, no fans no money. If there was a vote involved instead of actually playing the human weakness would prevail and loopholes would make Clemson or UNC or one of the higher paying schools the champion most every year yet the Wake coach would still be considered the best coach pound for pound in the ACC ,with CPJ a close second, who has never even won one on the field to this date in time.

Tony Barnhart

July 31st, 2009
6:28 pm

There seems to be a number of people here who have either missed my point or don’t care to acknowledge it. Which is fine.

But let’s be clear about the issue I raised. I never said that coaches who make a lot of money should not be held accountable. The question I raised was: What is the most accurate standard that should be used to hold them accountable?

It is the ability to finish in the Top 2 and get to the BCS championship game? Or is it winning or consistently competing for your conference championship. I happen to believe that competing for the conference championship on a consistent basis is a more accurate barometer because there are too many variables to finishing in the Top two.

Others disagree and I respect that.

Have a good weekend.

TB

shane#1

July 31st, 2009
6:32 pm

Is Mark Right a great coach? Ask me ten years from now. Great is tossed around so often these days that the term has been cheapened. Great comes from one’s total body of work, certainly one game does not define a coache’s career. I will say Richt is an excellent coach in all facets of the job. Academics have improved to the point that UGA is tied with Penn State in APR ratings. UGA is also in the top five in net profit for there football program. Those who complain about Richt’s income should be aware that he ranks in the middle of the pack in the SEC. UGA has a bargain!

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
6:42 pm

Tony—-That’s almost a sassy response based on your usual measured tones. Good to see there’s still some life left in the old, uh . . . dawg. Way to bite back.

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
6:44 pm

shane#1—-Be careful of whose so-called college football “profits” you are quoting, old buddy.

Source: Sports Business Journal
All figures for 2007-2008 and based on school disclosures required by federal Equity Athletics Disclosure Act . . .

Top 10 College Football Programs by Revenue:

(1) University of Texas – $72.95 million

(2) University of Georgia – $67.05 million

(3) University of Florida – $66.1 million

(4) Ohio State University – $65.16 million

(5) Notre Dame University – $59.77 million

(6) Auburn University – $59.67 million

(7) University of Michigan – $ 57.46 million

(8) University of Alabama – $57.37 million

(9) Penn State University – 53.76 million

(10) Louisiana State University – 10th with $52.68 million

http://atlanta.bizjournals.com/atlanta/stories/2009/06/15/daily7.html

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
6:44 pm

Top 10 College Sports Program by Revenue
(including football and all other revenue sources):

(1) Texas – $120.28 million

(2) Ohio State – $117.95 million

(3) Florida – $106.03 million

(4) University of Michigan – $99 million

(5) University of Wisconsin – $93.5 million

(6) Pennsylvania State University – $91.6 million

(7) Auburn – $89.31 million

(8) Alabama – $88.87 million

(9) University of Tennessee – $88.72 million

(10) Oklahoma State University – $88.6 million

(12) LSU – $84.18 million

(13) Georgia – $84.02 million

http://atlanta.bizjournals.com/dayton/stories/2009/06/15/daily5.html

Tidewatch

July 31st, 2009
6:57 pm

I suppose most people would consider Bo Schembechler a better coach than Larry Coker,so Barnhart has a point.

TheItalianDawg

July 31st, 2009
6:58 pm

of course no gator will say they will win the SEC because an injured tebow will translate into a disaster!!
Georgia is not getting much respect from the media, but I know they are better team than Alabama, LSU, Oklahoma state and OhioState who all will be ranked higher and of course better than the delusional yellow bugs, and if georgia can fix their D and we saw against Mich State the D was phenomenal, Georgia could have a special year.

matt

July 31st, 2009
7:01 pm

Tide Rising: My ranking system was for this decade only. If it were an overall ranking system, you can believe that Bama would be above LSU (and Florida for that matter). This decade though LSU is an Elite program and top dog in the SEC West, while Bama (for whatever reason or excuse) is not. Not even you can deny that. Also, that would explain why both Auburn and Tennessee are ahead of Bama in the ranking. Tennessee has the national championship in the BCS era (1998) and before the 2005 season they were always in contention for titles. Auburn has the undefeated season and a string of solid years. Bama has been on probation.

I fail to mention anything about “playing” with Saban’s recruits because it is a horrible argument on your part. Les Miles’ still had to coach. From Jan. 05 onward, Saban has had NOTHING to do with LSU. Sure, he is a great recruiter but Les has proven over the past 4 years that he too is a great recruiter. His class last year was ranked #1 and right now Rivals has LSU ranked #2. His classes before that have all been very impressive and ranked top 10-12. LSU is going to be sticking around for a while, count on it. LSU fans are not afraid or jealous of Bama or Saban. Sure there are still some hurt fans but for the most part, LSU fans are over Saban (at least should be at this point). You’ll understand in a few years when he leaves to go elsewhere. My only hope though is that he comes back to coach at Auburn so you guys know just how it feels.

Last year was a fluke for LSU. The problems last year can be traced back to 2 decisions Miles made before the start of the season. Both are well documented and both have been fixed or are being fixed. With Chevis as the D coordinator and JJ looking really good at QB, LSU is set up really well for the next 3-5 years.

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
7:03 pm

TheItalianDawg—-Tebow is unique. Brantley will be a fine replacement, but he has not proven himself in a big game yet. Tebow has. It’s rare that any back-up can more than fully replace the starter on less than a week’s notice. The starter gets twice as many practice reps, he’s usually more experienced, and there are usually other intangible reasons why the starter is the starter and not the back-up (like the starter has proven himself in a quarterback controversy).

So, no, I really don’t want to see Tebow get injured this year, even if I really believe that Brantley will a very good QB in 2010.

TheItalianDawg

July 31st, 2009
7:07 pm

but Georgia is ranked # 2 and first in the SEC in football revenues, our basketball program was a disaster the past few years

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
7:08 pm

TheItalianDawg—-Yeah. I’m not sure I understand your point.

obomaisaclown

July 31st, 2009
7:11 pm

Why not be like bama and just make up championships, the lie had worked for them . Just keep lying and the uneducated in Alabama will grow up thinking it is true .

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
7:12 pm

TheItalianDawg—-Was that an analogy of an injured Tebow = UGA basketball program since Harrick left??

I’ll take the injured Tebow. LOL

TheItalianDawg

July 31st, 2009
7:20 pm

Atlanta Gator, as mush as I admire your D and special teams, I don’t think you can beat Georgia or LSU or FSU without Tebow but I think Florida will beat Tennessee and south Carolina without him. However I want to be clear that I don’t wish any harm to Tebow and I hope he will be injury free all season because its joyless beating you without your star QB

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
7:29 pm

TheItalianDawg—-You ignored my Harrick joke. C’mon. I was only teasin’.

As good as I expect the Gator D to be (emphasis on “expect”), you can’t win unless you score more points than the other guys. With a healthy Tebow in the game, the Gators will score more points—-and more points when they really matter (see the 2008 SEC Championship Game, 3rd and 4th quarters).

Frankly, I would rather lose with Tebow than lose with a back-up. The kid has earned the right to lead his team, even when he’s less than 100%. Playing injured, at some level, is part of the game.

TheItalianDawg

July 31st, 2009
7:48 pm

not at all! your joke is quite painful but funny…

old Tech fan in NC

July 31st, 2009
8:40 pm

Charlotte dog and gator, sorry you guys hate it here in ACC country…I love it and hope to see you two football guys at the BOA stadium for the ACC champ game…where football is played outside…as it was intended!

shane#1

July 31st, 2009
8:49 pm

Atlanta Gator and ItalianDawg, good posts guys. To get back to the question at hand, how many of Ya’ll consider Bo Schembechler a great coach? How many NC teams did ol’ Bo coach? In my book Bo was one of the best, but feel free to disagree.

Irishman

July 31st, 2009
9:01 pm

Mark Richt should be judged by his TAN, not his national championships

joe taxpayer

July 31st, 2009
9:10 pm

At almost 3 million a year I want MNC not just SEC titles. Go sell insurance if its unfair and unreal expections.

juvenal

July 31st, 2009
10:05 pm

college football is fun–real life is world cup, super bowl, march madness..i love you cuddly dawg fans, while i was studying how to make (sucess) & wishing i was smart enuf, or rich enuf, to be ivy (they don’t feel lesser becuz of sports, & neither do we) ya’ll were just happy at parties & games–REALITY is that there is no 1st. div, football CHAMPION, just look in their BOOK, there is no PLAY-OFF!unless the trooper does not like my sticker, i don’t care wut u tink

David Granger

July 31st, 2009
10:22 pm

You’re certainly right about not judging a coach based on NC’s, Tony. But with the talent we had last year, there is no way in hell we should have just barely beaten Kentucky and LOST to Georgia Tech. I do think that Paul Johnson is a fine coach, and will win about as much as anyone can at Tech…and I know that most of our talent last year was “skill position” talent, and we were thin on the lines. But last year’s team did NOT achieve what it should have. (And even worse…we finished the season on the way down, unlike the year before.)
I like Coach Richt, but I’m beginning to wonder. He’s an Eisenhower type…good administrator who can build a team….but not a Patton, who can take it and wring the best out of it.

John Rocker rules

July 31st, 2009
10:24 pm

Rich Brooks & Mark Richt have the same number of National Championships… 0.0

Navigator

July 31st, 2009
10:37 pm

I agree with the premise that you don’t judge a coach by Playing/Winning a National Championship. However, I get tired of hearing so many head coaches (when they arrive at a new school) say they are there to win a national championship. If you’re a coach and you know you’ll never be there, why not just say that. Say you’ll put a good team on the field every year and play in quality bowls. That’s what most fans want anyway.

Braves Fan

July 31st, 2009
10:46 pm

I agree, Les Miles wins a championship with two losses and Tuberville goes 13-0 and gets screwed

Atlanta Gator

July 31st, 2009
11:10 pm

Braves Fan—-As one of my classmates used to say, “In order to get the highest grade, you don’t need to get all of the points. You just need to get more points than anyone else.”

Think about it. It’s all relative to the competition in any given year.

Chompin'

August 1st, 2009
2:35 am

I’m sorry, but I disagree. Only fans of a team where their head coach hasn’t won a title say this. I agree that NC’s alone don’t make a coach, but like the poster said above, NC”s do count and add to a legacy. You can’t tell me that only Tressell, Meyer, Miles, Stoops, Carrol and few others have luck because their teams are always in the NC mix. UGA is not. Am I supposed to believe that if UF wins a title this year, Meyer is lucky 60% of the time while Ricth hasn’t been lucky in 9 seasons? C’mon….Does it take some luck to win a NC? Ofcourse, however, “luck is when preparation meets oppurtunity”…great quote by the way….back to the point. It takes some coaching too…it isn’t “JUST” luck

Chompin'

August 1st, 2009
2:45 am

beware, why do you feel that UF’s “fortune will end” when Tebow leaves? All I hear from dog fans is that Tebow isn’t that good, is just a product of the system, etc. etc…If that is the case, shouldn’t it be easy to replace him? Also, didn’t Meyer win a NC with CHRIS LEAK???????

and to finish it off, only 3 starters on Defense in 09 will be seniors and only 3 starters on offense are seniors in 09, so depending on which juniors leave, UF could have 16 starters returning in 2010. UF is loaded and young so they will not just fall off like you are hoping for. Now, there are about 2 juniors that I expect to leave early, but who knows….Regardless, UF’s “run” won’t end…they will still be a very good team beyond Tebow….As a matter of fact, you will get to see a little of the “future” in the games this year. John Brantley will be in games early according to Meyer and is a much better “passer” than Tebow…

Chompin'

August 1st, 2009
2:55 am

Saint Mobile….wtf is 41-30? If you are referring to the 07 game btwn UF and UGA, know your football, follow your team better, and get the score right. If it isn’t, Sorry, but if it is…see above and don’t talk crap about a game in 07 when you got your brains beat in in 08 which is more recent! That is weak

macrotech

August 1st, 2009
3:00 am

PLAYOFF, PLAYOFF, PLAYOFF…….!!!!!!!!!!! History will sort out the great coaches, the good coaches and the bad coaches. Not based on NC’s, but overall winning percentages! In this, I don’t think that it’s fair to judge someone over that which they cannot control. CMR, should prove to be a great coach (already off to a great legendary status at uga) and I believe that CPJ will prove to be worthy of ‘great’ status in time (He’s done much with little so far and has a history of creating a winning tradition where ever he coaches). The system in college football has been inefficient since the beginning and I’m amazed that we can’t come up with a playoff system….works for EVERY other sport…. With the BCS, too many teams are disqualified by preseason rankings….would’ve been nice to see a playoff in those years that ended with mulitple undefeated teams! GO TECH!!!

Dawg of Dawgs

August 1st, 2009
3:37 am

No matter how many times certain GT fans cite 45-42, winning one game in 8 years is not competitive. You have to do better than that!!

macrotech

August 1st, 2009
6:21 am

Dawg of Dawgs, winning one game is not competitive…it’s victory! At least this PAST season… GO TECH!!!

KingGator

August 1st, 2009
8:41 am

I agree, but also disagree. If you are in the SEC, and you run the table, you should be playing in the NC game. We all know the SEC is the best conference in the country. With that being said, if MR had beaten UF a couple of those yrs. where he was supposed to, then UGA would have played for a NC. Plain and simple point is he needs to turn it around against the Mighty Gators, or wish for a lot of luck!!

Dawg85

August 1st, 2009
9:09 am

Great article Tony. I agree. The BCS Championship is a craps shoot. If UCLA doesn’t pull a big upset over USC in 2006 Florida doesn’t get a shot at that one. In 2007 Boston College upsets West Virginia and LSU gets in with two losses. In 02 and 07 UGA missed by a hair being in the big game. O4 showed the need for a playoff. As much love as they get, neither LSU or Florida has won the BCS with an undefeated season while Auburn gets shut out of the title game doing just that.

shane#1

August 1st, 2009
9:20 am

Atlanta Gator, I hope you check this blog again, hey it’s Saturday morning and it’s raining. Anyway, I don’t understand your reply to my earlier post. I stated that Richt and company had kept UGA in the top 5 nationally in net profits in their football program. You posted stats showing UGA at number 2 in football revenues. That seems to prove my point. I have been accused of being a Richt apologist by some UGA fans, but I don’t think Richt can be blamed for the fact that UGA b-ball sucks. On a lighter note, it seems that UH coach McMackin has found an explanation for the decline of the once proud Notre Dame football team. According to him, the Irish would be better suited as interior decorators. I can’t wait for the You Tube video of Tenuta’s reaction when his linebackers show up in ballet slippers. Coach McMackin should take a hint from CMR and be more circumspect when addressing the media. Hey coach, if I had a mascot that LOOKED like one of the Village People and my team did a line dance before every game I wouldn’t be cracking wise about anyone else.

gatorsam

August 1st, 2009
9:24 am

As you can tell by my name, I am a Gator, not a Dawg. You nailed it in your column. Until there is a real playoff, getting a shot a a national title is all about timing, luck, etc. And by the way “ST.Simons” needs to get a life. Mark Richt is a great person and a very good coach!

BruffDawg

August 1st, 2009
9:51 am

Very good article. Until there is a playoff, all I really care about is the SEC title. The rest is just a dog and pony show.

Atlanta Gator

August 1st, 2009
10:19 am

shane#1—-The University of Georgia’s high football revenue totals are not surprising. The program has won two SEC championships under Richt, and has been consistently competitive. The other contributing factor is the near-fanatical fanbase—-someone is paying for those football tickets.

What was surprising to me, given that UGA was second in football revenue, was that five other SEC were ahead of UGA in total revenue. UGA has consistently had the second-best overall sports program in the SEC over the past 20 years. My guess is the big difference is the present state of the Dawgs basketball program has really impacted the overall revenue picture. I would love to see a breakout of SEC sports revenues done by individual sports. On one of the AJC recruiting blogs, a female Tennessee fan said that Forbes had published such a list, but I can’t find it and she never answered my request for a weblink.

Long Dawg

August 1st, 2009
10:38 am

Chompin, Tony did not say winning the NC was luck nit wit. Can’t you read? That was not his point at all. Now trim your mullet and patch your jorts and wash that double wide.

shane#1

August 1st, 2009
10:48 am

Atlanta Gator, when womens gymnastics is second to football in generating revenue I would say a major sports university has a problem in their basketball program. No disrespect meant to the Gymdogs, of whom i am very proud.

Pitbull

August 1st, 2009
10:53 am

How many national championships did Bobby Dodd win? None

Boy he was a crappy coach, wasn’t he?

How many years did Tom Osborn and Joe Paterno coach before they won one?

They were almost crappy coaches, weren’t they?

The negative posters here are the real losers.

YJ=01

August 1st, 2009
10:56 am

DENVER Dog you must be ignorent of the facts. In 1990 the bowl committes pick who to invite to the bowls. Tech would have ran all over the cheating Colorado teams. No doubt about it!!!

Ga Mountain Boy

August 1st, 2009
12:59 pm

I think our Bulldogs have received more favorable press than most teams in the South since Richt arrived. The AJC writers keep pumping out articles that ring conference and national championships when it is not there. The recruiting is overrated and Athens is the Ga. working mans choice to succeed yearly. It sells newspapers, tickets, and souvenirs.
It is difficult to win a National Championship (there is only one big one) but the expectations have been created by the AJC writers in preseason for several years. Richt is a fine Christian man but success can not be created on paper—it has to happen on the field. See you for the opener.

Big Dawg

August 1st, 2009
1:43 pm

Tony,

I agree with almost everything you said- but you are dead wrong about who was the best team in the country at the end of the 2007 season. LSU was not and IMHO opinion would have lost to Georgia or USC. But as always we will never know as they got to play Ohio State instead of UGA or USC.

The Walking Boss

August 1st, 2009
1:56 pm

Hey Tony – I am glad that placed your NAME next to your PICTURE. The pic is so heavily re-touched and air-brushed, I had no idea who you were!

jerry

August 1st, 2009
4:46 pm

Let me get this straight. If Richt goes to Fla. or USC 8 years ago he has how many NC’s? I mean if he were as lucky as……….I mean it’s just luck, ain’t it?

Jeff

August 1st, 2009
4:47 pm

Luck is the residue of design.

Champions find a way to make their own luck. Or, in the alternative, to place themselves in positions where some of the breaks will go their way. And, once you’ve won a championship human pollsters have an uncanny ability to reward what they have already seen.

Hence, a Nebraska team that had won a few semi-recent national titles gets the nod over an Oregon team without the same pedigree. Or why Florida State received the nod over a Miami team that had been down for a bit prior to the arrival of Butch Davis. Or why Southern California didn’t make the BCS title game in 2004.

The fact is, despite consistent excellence under Mark Richt, GA. has NEVER been in the BCS title game conversation at the end of the year. And, yes, that reflects on Richt’s ability as a coach.

Seems like a fine person and excellent recruiter whose teams, unfortunately for them, have an uncanny ability to lay a stink bomb at the most inopportune times. Luckily for me as a UF grad, there seems to be a bottomless well of acceptance amongst GA fans of consistently good, yet-not-quite-great GA teams. He’s a ‘Hall of Very-Good’ type of coach. Nothing wrong with that.

Meanwhile, I think FL might have won another national championship while I typed my previous few sentences.

reasonable

August 1st, 2009
6:42 pm

You are flat wrong Jeff.
First, UGA WAS in the national championship conversation in 2007 at the end of the year. Heading into conference championship week, Kirk Herbstreit pronounced on national TV that he thought UGA (ranked #4) should play in the national championship game if #1 and #2 lose. Please explain to me how that amounts to NOT being in the conversation. That is actually the very DEFINITION of being in the conversation.

I would further argue that UGA has TWICE this decade done just what you suggest champions do. They have, TWICE this decade, put themselves in a place where things could have gone their way. They just didn’t.

None of that makes Richt a “great” coach, necessarily. I’m just saying that some of the arguments against that fact are off base.

A little more luck

August 1st, 2009
6:55 pm

OK, back to 2007.
Everybody makes such a big deal about UGA not winning their division, much less their conference, thus not getting a shot at the BCS.

But let’s look closer. By the way, I’m not saying UGA should have gotten a shot in 2007. I think the above argument is accurate. What I’m saying is that it was a tremendous amount of BAD luck that kept UGA from getting a shot.

Let’s remember, shall we.
The truth: UGA and Tennessee tied for the SEC East division lead, but UT beat UGA so they obviously and fairly win the tiebreaker.

But in the last 2 games of the season here’s what happened:
week 12, Tennessee vs Vandy. 33 seconds left in the game. tennessee is up by 1. Vandy is lined up to kick a relatively short field goal. Make this field goal, and Vandy wins. And UGA wins the SEC east. The kick grazes the upright, wide left. UT squeaks out a 1 point win over the worst team in the league.

week 13: Tennessee vs Kentucky. The teams are tied at the end of the 4th quarter. In overtime, Kentucky intercepts a UT pass. Kentucky tries a few runs, then lines up for a 33 yard field goal. Make this kick and UK wins, and UGA is the SEC East champ, playing in the SECC game. UT blocks the kick.

Seriously, give me a break. How likely is it that UT wins their last 2 games like that? That’s incredible (and unbelievably lucky).

Again, this does not prove that UGA should have been given a shot at the BCS in 2007. It just means that some pretty remarkable bad luck kept them from getting a chance.

All that said, they still nearly got a shot at the BCS title game. UGA and LSU would have been a heck of an SECC game.

Truth about recruiting

August 1st, 2009
7:04 pm

I get really tired of the argument that with all these great recruiting classes, something must be really wrong with the coaches at UGA.

UGA’s average recruiting class ranking for the past decade is somewhere around 8th. (I’m estimating here because it depends largely on which recruiting service you use for your rankings)
CBS Sportsline just published their rankings of the best teams of the past decade. Guess where UGA finished. 8th.

So with an average of the 8th best recruiting class in the nation, UGA has managed to be roughly the 8th best football team in the nation.

I’m having a hard time buying the argument that these recruiting classes are failing to live up to their expectations.

Don’t get me wrong, this Dawg fan is not remotely satisfied with finishing in the top 10. You better believe there is a HECK of a lot of pressure on UGA’s D.C. to turn things around this year.

mullet13

August 1st, 2009
7:44 pm

Let’s not forget the dismal years of UGA football prior to CMRs arrival. It’s baffling that so many are hyper-critical and selective in their criticism. He does things the right way and his teams are rarely out of the NC picture. And what does being a nice guy have to do with winning a NC? Cut CMR loose and step out of the way so you’re not trampled by the elite programs lining up to hire him. Some of you need to slap yourselves and get a grip!

Mike Bobo 17 INT

August 1st, 2009
9:03 pm

Barnhart

Go ahead and leave the AJC and take your severance with you. Your comments are the reason CMR continues to receive a free pass at UGA. Yes, the BCS is political, but CMR has not been even been close with his level of talent, and should be fired, plain and simple.

Mike Bobo 17 INT

August 1st, 2009
9:05 pm

All these UGAY fans have to quit lving in the past and focus on the future. Donnan and Goff were dismal, but Donnan was successful until he arrived at UGAY, and the program flushed his resume. Hell he could have beat UGAY with Marshall, if he had remained, and word has it he said UGAY was the biggest mistake of his life.

It ruined his life and career.

Kenny Powers

August 1st, 2009
10:35 pm

UGA has the best record (82-22) in the countries toughest conference in the 8 years he has been there

End of discussion.

17 Int has a 17 IQ

August 1st, 2009
10:55 pm

Yeah, Mark Richt gets a free pass.
Because having the best record in the conference this decade, playing in 3 SEC championship games, winning 2 of em, finishing #2 in the country in a year he didn’t even win the conference, and being ranked as the 8th best team of this decade all amount to Mark Richt being a lousy coach who should be fired.

17 Int: You are dumber than my jock strap.

SuperB

August 2nd, 2009
7:59 am

Excellent column and you are 100% correct. It’s take luck and some inexplicable voting sometimes (2007/LSU) to get to the title tilt. As for great coaches– some of the best are at schools that will never win a national championship– they just don’t have the resources. Jim Grobe/Wake Forest.)

SuperB

August 2nd, 2009
8:03 am

I just can’t fathom why all the GT’ers on this site write such victrolic things about Georgia. Now they are trashing Donnan and Goff–whose W-L records at UGA were very good. What was Ray Goff’s record versus GT? (If you can’t walk the walk– don’t talk the talk!)

Chuck

August 2nd, 2009
8:16 am

It’s going to be a strange season in the SEC without Tuberville, Fulmer, and Croom. Just shows you what a demanding conference it is, and the best in the land.

Tim

August 2nd, 2009
8:54 am

I agree with Tony as far as one of the primary measures for a coach to be considered great. I think the second measurable item is how they perform in the biggest games when the spotlight is on.

CMR and the Dawgs have performed great in big games over the years with the exception of Florida. However, that is the biggest of the big games for Dawgs fans. Therefore, until our record starts to even out against Florida CMR will be just good and not great.

GO DAWGS!!!!!!

Long Dawg

August 2nd, 2009
9:07 am

Mike Bobo 17 Int, you need professional help. Your envy/jealousy/hate of UGA shows no bounds. What happened? No smart enough to get in? Your a Tech fan that lives in the shadow of UGA. You should be used to it by now.
All that anger will eat you up buddy. Get ready cause payback is coming.

TNDawg

August 2nd, 2009
9:17 am

Richt’s record stands alone as proof of him being a great coach. Bear Bryant didn’t win a MNC until his 18th season. I guess the Bear was just good until that year. At this point in his career, Richt has more wins than the Bear, Meyer, Saban, Miles, Spurrier & our beloved Dooley did. Go Dawgs!

Paul The Vol

August 2nd, 2009
10:46 am

A Little More Luck…funny you must have forgotten that a little bit of great luck kept Georgia in the SEC race that year, namely at the Georgia at Vandy game. Vandy had Georgia beat and fumbled late in the game. Georgia hits a field goal on the last play of the game to win.

By the way, Georgia at Vandy this year – Georgia’s seventh straight game and second game in a row on the road. It may take some luck this year to beat Vandy as well.

Chris

August 2nd, 2009
10:47 am

Mark Richt is a heckuva coach. But 50 years from now he won’t be remembered as great unless he wins a NC. When you get the kind of talent he does, and the exposure in the conference he’s in, you should have to win a NC to be great.

Pitbull

August 2nd, 2009
10:47 am

Michigan State won the 1952 NC.

Go to http://www.collegefootballpoll.com/champions_national.html

The whole idea of a coach having to win a nc to be outstanding is bogus.

So are the sports writer like Mark Bradley that preach it.

Ray

August 2nd, 2009
11:07 am

College football is a lot about recruiting. Winning a National Championship may be due more to your ability as a recruiter than as a coach

Jack Schitt

August 2nd, 2009
11:18 am

Its obvious a lot of you UGA kool-aid drinking rednecks do not know me. But after Tennessee wins the SEC and plays in a BCS bowl in Kiffin’s first year, you will know me then. So keep on thumping your chests and swilling your Pabst Blue Ribbon purchased at WalMart. The Vols are on the move and UGA is still going to suck the big one. Then you can truly say you know Jack Schitt.

pete nose

August 2nd, 2009
11:37 am

Jack Schitt—Tenn and The north ave trade school wound’t make a pimple on the dawgs arce.

Jim

August 2nd, 2009
12:45 pm

What a bunch of horse manure you guys spread around here!

Jim

August 2nd, 2009
12:46 pm

And Ray is right! You do not win your games on Saturday, you win your games when you recruit.

Jack Schitt

August 2nd, 2009
1:41 pm

Hey Pete Nose…..does your mama know you are using her computer again? At least get her to show you how to use spell-check….dumbazz, You might want to stock up on PBR because its going to be a long season for you GA mullet-wearing rednecks. Goooooooooo Vols!!! Rocky Top Baby!!!!!

Navigator

August 2nd, 2009
1:49 pm

Be careful quoting which poll you quote on these blogs. For decades through the 40’s, 50’s and 60’s the AP Poll was noted for picking primarily teams from the MIdwest and West, even when their records and competition didn’t warrant it. Barry Switzer and a few other big name coaches felt the Coaches Poll was always more fair (one of Oklahoma’s Championships is split on Coaches Poll). If it makes you feel good to use any of these polls to make your point, do it, but it’s no more valid than someone who uses another. The reason GT was not the picked in the AP Poll in 1952 is because they refused to play San Francisco who had some black players. It was very wrong to do it, but don’t forget that was the SEC leadership speaking as much as the GT. I have a rule when blogging, just say it if you believe it, after all it’s only an opinion.

Diggity Dawg

August 2nd, 2009
1:59 pm

“Our goal was to always win the SEC championship. That was the thing we could control,” Spurrier said. “If we won the conference championship, we figured there was a pretty good chance that we would get to play for the big title. But it doesn’t do any good to focus on that because you have no control over it.”

Steve Spurrier was right (for the only time in my memory), and you were right for quoting him.

Deepinenemyterritory

August 2nd, 2009
2:48 pm

Coaching is as big as the players themselves in college football. That’s why thees good on make the money they do.A good or great coach for that matter can make a program just as a bad coach can do the oppostite.It’s allways been that way.

Deepinenemyterritory

August 2nd, 2009
2:53 pm

Oh yeah Ray…recruiting is coaching as well…its alot of what makes some coaches sucessful at all

matt

August 2nd, 2009
3:19 pm

Tony: Here is a great quote from Les Miles. Maybe this will answer your question.

“I think championship is how we’re measured,” Miles said. “I understand how that happens. But it’s not any fun. I had somebody ask me ‘Is that something you expect?’ You never expect to finish second, not at LSU.”

So maybe at UGA coaches don’t get measured by Championships but at other places they do and should . While a national championship is no the defining stat on a coaches resume, it sure does help to to separate the good from the great. As soon as Richt wins a National Championship, he’ll be considered a GREAT coach. At the same time though, Les Miles has a national championship and I still wont call him a great coach (great recruiter though, yes!!). If he can turn around next year and post a 10+ win season, then we can start putting great next to Les’ name.

Long Dawg

August 2nd, 2009
3:45 pm

Hey Jack S. You been drinking too much moonshine. Tenn. just hired themselves about the most nothing of a coach that ever coached at TENN. The big orange will be howling by mid-season. You best keep your powder dry till your new coach lame sniffin actually coaches a game.

Tide Rising

August 2nd, 2009
4:01 pm

Matt,

I don’t think anyone takes quotes from Les Miles very seriously. This is a guy who said at a pep rally where there were women and children. “And we got a new rival in F—-ing Alabama.” You must be very proud of this eminently classy guy.

Actually he was wrong about us being a new rival. LSU fans have always considered us to be a huge rival and hence the record crowd when Saban came to baton rouge (our home away from home) last year. I think when someone owns you head to head something like 46-25 and went unbeaten in your house for 19 straight tries that it becomes a rivalry when we say its a rivalry.

I also found your statement that Saban is gonna leave Bama and then come back to Auburn a few years later to be one of the funniest posts I’ve ever seen. Saban just opened talks to have his contract extended to 2016 and last year he committed to donating 1 million to the school to be spread out over 10 years. Does that sound like someone who’s leaving. You are way too funny!

BravesFan79

August 2nd, 2009
5:24 pm

I agree… College coaches should not be judged on national championships…. BECAUSE COLLEGE FOOTBALL HAS NO REAL CHAMPION!!! Haha… thank God im from a state with REAL sports! Go Falcons and Braves!!

BravesFan79

August 2nd, 2009
5:38 pm

Im a strong believer in playoffs. Its what makes sports exciting! I always thought Joe Hamilton could of led GT to a national championship given a 8 team playoff, just like i felt the David Greene/ David Pollock team could of won the national title given a chance. Because those teams were never given a chance, i have since found CF boring and pointless. Oyea… the 2010 champion will either be USC, Florida or Ohio State…..just like almost every other year! BORING!! I cant believe the # of people that waste their money on such a sham of a sport!

matt

August 2nd, 2009
7:01 pm

Tide Rising

You have proven twice now that you cannot read or you choose to not read a full post when it does not agree with your point of view. You are a Bama homer who sees nothing but Crimson. You’re fooling yourself if you really think Saban will sign a contract that long. The man does not stay in one place longer than 5 or 6 years. Look back at his ENTIRE coaching career. Do you know what 1 million over 10 years comes to? I do. It’s 100,000 year. Chump change to Saban and any program in the SEC. What, is Saban paying for the new Outhouses on campus? He’ll hand over the remaining amount in cash as he is cleaning out his office in the next 4 or 5 years. Also, I said, my only hope is that Saban comes back to coach at Auburn after leaving Bama. I know you are laughing but every LSU fan had a little chuckle when the rumors starting coming out about Saban and Bama. We all said that wouldn’t happen. Guess what? It did.

Is the f-bomb really that bad? I’ve heard worse from the women and children of Alabama so I’m sure nobody was really that offended. I’m sure though that you are really proud of Nick “I’ll NEVER be the coach at Alabama” Saban. Yeah, what a role model he is. “Just lie to them son, everything will be ok.” Cursing is a word, lying is an action. Actions speak louder than words. You stay classy Tuscaloosa!

As for the rivalry. You are right, any LSU fan who says Bama is our biggest rival is wrong. Since Bama hasn’t really meant much in the past 12 years or so (to anyone), Bama is about 6th on LSU’s radar. You choose to ignore the fact that LSU has owned Bama for the past decade or so but I’m sure you’ll come back with something like “Bama has been on probation most of this decade.” To that I ask, Isn’t Bama ALWAYS on probation?

LSU is 7-3 against Bama in the past decade. Including now 4 wins in a row on the road against Bama. In a sport who’s motto is “What have you done for me lately” I find it amusing that you have to dig so deep into history to find stats. Oh by the way, who else did Bama own during their glory days? EVERYONE. So it doesn’t really hurt my feelings when you bring up the fact that Bama won a ton in Baton Rouge during the 60’s and 70’s. LSU is winning a ton NOW. And that is all that matters.

I’m sure you didn’t make it this far because you got a headache trying to sound out words. But remember, LSU almost beat undefeated Bama last year with Pick-6 Lee and a shoddy defense. Next year will be much different in your backyard. Have a great day!

matt

August 2nd, 2009
7:13 pm

Bravesfan79—

The UGA’s of earlier this decade were given a chance to play for a national title. They lined up and played a 11-12 game schedule like every other team in the nation yet they lost too many games. That is nobody’s fault but their own my friend. While a playoff is the best way to decide a champion, in the system we have right now, every game is a playoff and the final weekend of the season is a HUGE playoff. In ‘07 UGA did not make it to the final weekend and in ‘03 they lost in the final weekend. Nobody’s fault but their own, once again.

What’s the excuse going to be when there is a playoff and UGA or GT still gets left out?

matt

August 2nd, 2009
7:23 pm

Bravesfan79

The UGA’s of this decade have been given a chance to win a national title. Unless I missed something they lined up and played a full schedule while not on probation or any other punishment that would have excluded UGA from competition. They simply lost too many games. As the system is now, the full season is a playoff. The last weekend being the most important. In ‘03 UGA lost during the last weekend and in ‘07 UGA didn’t even make it to the last weekend. Nobody’s fault but their own my friend. In ‘03 Oklahoma played for a national championship without winning their conference. Everybody with the exception of OK fans complained and the system was changed. However, we are still hearing from UGA fans that they were screwed in ‘07 becuase they were the “best team” in the nation. You cannot have it both ways guys.

MLB has a playoff but I can tell you now that either the Yankees, Red Sox, or Dodgers are going to win the World Series. The NFL has a playoff and I can tell you right now that either New England or Pittsburg is going to win the Super Bowl. The NBA has a playoff and I can tell you right now that the Lakers will win next year as well.

However, in a sport where only one single loss may or may not eliminate you from contention, the pressure and excitement are always top notch.

matt

August 2nd, 2009
7:28 pm

sorry for the double post, computer messed up.

Army Vet

August 2nd, 2009
8:11 pm

UGA will be lucky to win 7 games this year……no NC for CMR this year.

southgadawg88

August 2nd, 2009
8:23 pm

Personally I am sick of all the Saban this Saban that talk!!Let’s look at THE GREAT SABAN’S actual coaching record…LSU 2000 he went 8-4 2001 10-3 2002 8-5 2003 13-1 2004 9-3 2007 ALA 6-6 2008 10-2 WOW…That’s sooooo impressive!!Considering his history look for ALA to be around 8-5 this year.For the record at MSU 95 6-5-1 96 6-6 97 7-5 98 6-6 99 9-2 .Those are the FACTS…SOMEBODY PLEASE TELL ME WHY THIS MAN IS SUCH A GREAT COACH?

southgadawg88

August 2nd, 2009
8:31 pm

BAMASTAN,TideRising,Tony all you other Saban lovers….ANYBODY?

BravesFan79

August 2nd, 2009
9:05 pm

Matt: First of all… the CELTICS are the REAL champs and will beat the lfakers in the finals again just like when they were healthy! (i also root against Queen James just to be fair)
And as far as college football goes… the idea of “every game is a playoff” is a VERY weak argument. You might have a argument if all the teams played the same schedule! Is the pac 10 not weaker than the SEC? Dosent the fact that Ohio State dosent have to play a confrence title game make them more likely than other schools to be a lock for a title game slot? All is NOT fair in college football scheduling, so that argument does not work.
And as far as baseball goes… Atlanta will win the wild card, beat the Dodgers in the 1st round, and then beat the Phillies in the NLCS. Then beat the Red Sox in the World Series. But hey i have the blind faith of a true fan….. ; )

matt

August 2nd, 2009
10:17 pm

Southgadawg

I made the same statement a couple of days ago. Bama fans just seem to ignore those facts. The fact remains though, Saban has yet to put together back to back double digit win seasons. However, he is labled a great coach because he has a national championship. I do not agree with it but it is what it is. LSU fans are greatful though for what he did for LSU. Although, Les has done better!!

Bravesfan: Yes, I agree that not all is fair in college football scheduling (I’m looking at you Ole’ Miss). That still doesn’t take the excitment away for me though. In no other sport can one single regular season loss shatter the hopes and dreams of the players and fans of a program. In baseball a team can lose 40-45% of their games and still make the playoffs, giving them a chance at a championship. In Basketball, teams with losing records always seem to sneak into the playoffs and in football, we’ve seen teams with 7 or 8 losses make the playoffs and go to the superbowl. In 2007 LSU was the first two loss National Championship for quite some time. USC is always 1 loss away from being eliminated. We are starting to see now moreso than ever in college football teams realizing that they need to schedule better teams. USC plays in a weak conference so they must go play the likes of Ohio St., Virginia, Auburn, Arkansas, etc… Same goes for Ohio State. Florida though can afford to play The Citadel or Bama will play Louisiana-Monroe because the SEC is tougher on the whole.

Gotta give you credit for your faith in the Braves though. Maybe, just maybe!!

H. OBAMA

August 2nd, 2009
11:10 pm

JUST ONE THING TONY. LSU WAS NOT THE BEST TEAM ON 07. UGA AND S. CAL WOULD HAVE DEFEATED LSU IF GIVEN THE CHANCE. OHIO ST WOULD NOT HAVE HAD A CHANCE. LSU WAS LUCKY AND BEING A MEDIA FAVORITE ALLOWED THEM TJE OPPORTUNITY TO MOVE INTO THE NC GAME WITH LATE SEASON LOSSES THAT SHOULD HAVE ELIMINATED THEM. LSU WAS NOT EVEN THE BEST TEAM IN THE SEC IN 07.

matt

August 2nd, 2009
11:48 pm

H. OBAMA

LSU won the SEC in 2007 though. And that is all that will be remembered!!

MiamiDawg

August 2nd, 2009
11:55 pm

Loser talk.

The goal is to win a NC. Why else spend the kind of money Georgia’s athletic dept does?

aaron

August 2nd, 2009
11:56 pm

Enter your comments here

aaron

August 2nd, 2009
11:59 pm

Sunny boy, 3 of those 5 don’t play in the SEC…meaning they play an easier schedule oveall in comparison.Richt has finished as high as #2, & #3 in the nation…playing in the conference. I definitely think Meyer & Saban are great coaches, but it definitely takes a little luck, or at least for things to fall the right way to play for, & win a championship.

southgadawg88

August 3rd, 2009
12:09 am

True Matt and they never respond when it’s put out there.I look forward to the season though ..college football is so unpredictable it has to be the most exciting sport in my book.I see the media is pumping OKL,TEX and FLA to be the super teams again which means that 1 or 2 of them is going to fall flat on their face.OU is in serious danger of becoming the next Ohio State…I really don’t care what kind of numbers they put up this year I want to see them beat SOMEBODY in a bowl game…Stoops is running out of excuses.Tex plays in the same weak Big12 but they seem to step it up more in Bowl games.FLA has it’s own issues..Harvin was a special player,they lose their top WR as well..Tebow is not going to morph into some great passer his SR year and I just don’t think Tebow left,Tebow right,Tebow up the middle is going to get it done.Somebody else will bring home the NC this year…who that might be is up in the air but I’m sure it’s not gonna be one of those schools.

Mike Bobo 17 INT

August 3rd, 2009
1:05 am

Dog Fans

If you want to kick around worthless statistics, then fine. However, National Titles are all that count and for a program to only have 1 title in 116 years, and only 2 Heisman winners is pathetic.

Someone from Athens please get real and start hammering your own program. UGAY fans continue to support a program and a coach that is in the tank, plain and simple.

Ron Mexico

August 3rd, 2009
9:05 am

Whether or not a coach is good or great has nothing to do with the answer to the question “will he win a NC at UGA”. You can be good and win a NC, and be great and not win one. The question is do you think it will ever happen for him?

Jeff

August 3rd, 2009
10:32 am

When you look at all the “fortunate” things(I won’t say luck) that happened to open the gates for some teams/coaches you’ve mentioned, and compare that to Auburn/Tuberville in 2004, it lets you know that it’s never a level playing field when you start rating teams or coaches by awards they won.

DawginLex

August 3rd, 2009
11:02 am

Move the above post from the interception idiot to the top of the dumbest post ever list:

UGA ruined donnan’s career?

UGA caused Donnan to do the following:

1.) Play Quincy Carter even though the whole world knew he was a drug using low life

2.) Recruit Sanks instead of Jamal Lewis even though Lewis was bigger and stronger and just as fast and was begging to come to UGA.

3.) Decided to run “just 1 more play” against GT in 1999 instead of taking a knee and kicking the game winning FG.

4.) Running reverse after reverse even though the whole stadium knew they were going to be run and continue to lose yardage.

5.) Promote Rodney Garner to DC and let him run the same defensive alignment the entire first half against Auburn in 1997 with no adjustments. This denied UGA a chance to go to ATL for the SECCG.

Donnan made all these decisions on his own. UGA had nothing to do with it. He made his own bed and got fired because of his own decisions.

BIGBOY

August 3rd, 2009
1:26 pm

DAWGINLEX Rodney Garner has never been a DC at UGA….EVER…As for as Quincy Carter if he was using drugs while at UGA that would mean the entire Athletic Department was in on the cover up of his failed drug test including Dooley

BIGBOY

August 3rd, 2009
1:32 pm

Furthermore you claim to have played for Dooley…if that’s true you of all people should know that drug use was rampant in Athens during the 80’s remember Nate Lewis?Or do you even know who he is?

Will

August 3rd, 2009
1:47 pm

IN 2000 11-1 Washington beat 11-1 Miami and 11-1 Oregon State, lost to 10-2 Oregon. Yet No Mention of them, wonder why?

BIGBOY

August 3rd, 2009
3:08 pm

DAWGINLEX I guess you don’t anything to say.For the record the DC you are talking about was actually TENN secondary coach(name escapes me at the moment)Donnan overreached on that call and the guy only lasted 1 year.As for the drug use that’s not a knock on Dooley but it was rampant all over college football during the 80’s.Guys got away with a whole hell of lot more than these kids today could even dream about.A lot of players didn’t even go to class and that was also happening all across the college football back in the 80’s.

Tom

August 3rd, 2009
4:08 pm

You made an error in your reporting ..Ohio State was 13-0 in the regular season and ended up 14-0.. By the way, it does not matter if a team wins by one point or 21 points, a win is a win.
That same OSU team snapped a @34 game win streak Miami had going and OSU also sent a record 14 players off that team to the NFL.

[...] Just ran across this. Lots of good points in this article….. Coaches should not be judged on national championships | Mr. College Football [...]

CC

August 21st, 2009
7:35 am

“Tech…tried to find a team not to play. They could’ve played Colorado in the Orange bowl, but chose not to”

Denver Dog, what’s your basis for that statement? Source? Link please? Maybe some UGA friend made it up and you thought it sounded plausible somehow?

I think that GT would have loved to play Colorado, but they were REQUIRED to represent the ACC in Orlando. So they went there and pounded Nebraska by 24. Big Eight champ Colorado was contractually obligated to go to the Orange Bowl.

(And Colorado needed a late questionable clipping penalty call and a missed PAT by Notre Dame earlier just to win their bowl game by a single point.)

I wish GT could have played Colorado instead…or Notre Dame for that matter. I watched both of those bowl games, and based on the way they everyone played I would have REALLY liked Tech’s chances against either of those teams that day.

As much as the BCS sucks, if it had been in effect that year we probably would have had that GT-Colorado matchup. Oh well…