Update: Thrashers sale not done, still details

After a full day of reporting, there is little new on the sale and relocation of the Thrashers to Winnipeg.

According to multiple sources, the deal between the Atlanta Spirit and True North Sports and Entertainment has not been completed. There are still details to work out. I have also been told by multiple sources that it is “unlikely” a deal will be agreed upon in time for an announcement Thursday.

Of the minor details that still need to be worked out, the sale price is not one of them. The terms remain $170 million with the Atlanta Spirit getting $110 million and the NHL getting $60 million as a relocation fee.

Once the final details are finalized, all that really needs to be done is the official announcement that an agreement of sale has been reached.

I will provide updates if there are any new developments.

261 comments Add your comment

R. Stroz

May 25th, 2011
4:14 pm

Bettman Swallows

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
4:25 pm

I posted this over at the NJ Devils on what sums up what happened here. Your thoughts appreciated.

Being in Atlanta, I will give you my best take on what happened here.

First year attendance, I think, set records. Hockey is and has NOT been covered in the local sports radio station market. Not even the flagship station for the product, 680 The Fan, hypes the team. The radio signal for the actual games cuts out at 6 pm everywhere outside of the city limmits, ie: where all paying hockey fans are. Thrasher games aren’t even televised for the entire season.

Dany Heatley. He killed his own teammate in a car crash in 03-04. The NHL lockout in 04-05 stopped any momentum the young team was gaining. Savard was shipped to Boston, we get Hossa and ship Heatley to Ottowa… Heatley goes bonkers.

During our existence, Carolina and Tampa Bay BOTH win Stanley Cups – Atlanta can’t make the playoffs, partly because of the tough competition within the division. Tampa Bay could yet again make another Finals this year.

We finally make the playoffs, get swept away by the Rangers – who in all honesty the Thrashers had owned for many years in the regular season. Building was packed, energy was high – we fall flat on our face and again, all momentum killed.

Coaching – of the 5 coaches we had, only 1 had previous coaching experience at the highest level of the NHL. Bob Hartley was fired 6 games into the 07-08 season and replaced by DON WADDELL for the entire season. A coach he was not and we finish 14th place after making the playoffs the year before. Next year we hire an AHL coach in John Anderson and miss the playoffs for two more years.

Hossa leaves and goes to 3 Stanley Cups finals in a row with 3 different teams. Kovy leaves to the Devils the next year. We are back at square one.

Throughout this entire process, our owners spend less money each year or near league minimum. We still don’t have good radio or TV coverage or media coverage in general. Fans are apathetic at this point. Season ticket holders are told to “shut up” and “Deal with it” when asking questions of owners to their FACE. Discount tickets abound and STH feel duped.

The long and short of it is that our owners have run this team into the ground. Don Waddell is 7 years past his expiration date. We had Chris Chellios on our team last year at age 87! There is only so much a fan can take year in and year out…

Bring back Knobler

May 25th, 2011
4:30 pm

all that needs to happen is an official announcement that isn’t happening or pending though the announcement could happen depending on new developments.

gotcha.

Ugh

May 25th, 2011
4:31 pm

ATLBobb

May 25th, 2011
4:34 pm

“ThrasherFan” I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head…

OHL

May 25th, 2011
4:35 pm

Mr. Vivlamore,

I think you might look into something else that has been reported up here. You may have heard that there is going to be a ticket drive in Winnipeg once the announcement is made? Well, if that is true, and it does seem to be true, then it only makes sense to have the announcement on a Monday. That way you get 5 full business days to sell tickets. If you do it any later, or at the worst on a Friday, you have the layover from the weekend where very little happens.

Last Monday was a holiday. So it may be that it’s delayed to next Monday for that reason. No one knows the facts but that sounds like it makes a lot of sense.

Trista

May 25th, 2011
4:35 pm

Thrasherfan, I have no problem with the majority of your comments; however, I think you crossed the line saying Heatley killed Snyder. You don’t think he would do anything to take back what happened? You could have said the team lost Snyder… you did not have to go and say he killed him. It was unintentional and the crash killed Snyder, not Heatley.

Puck Like A Porn Star

May 25th, 2011
4:37 pm

Read this article and replace “Screen on the Green” with “Atlanta Thrashers.”

http://www.ajc.com/news/sponsors-come-forward-for-957354.html

FrustratedThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
4:39 pm

ThrasherFan-Great Summary! ASG not only demoralized us they demoralized the players.

ATL TOM

May 25th, 2011
4:40 pm

Telfo

May 25th, 2011
4:42 pm

you mean nothing new besides the fact that ASG has 20 million reasons to not bargain “in good faith” with local interested parties???

http://www.thehockeynews.com/articles/40467-Source-Thrashers-sale-to-True-North-Sports-and-Entertainment-complete-decision-on-announcement-looms.html

“And it appears to have favored the Atlanta Spirit and owner Bruce Levenson, who will reportedly receive $20 million of the $60 million relocation fee that is included in the purchase price.”

thrasherfan

May 25th, 2011
4:43 pm

With just the final details to wrap up, all that really needs to be done is the official announcement that an agreement of sale is in place. I’m told, this late in the day, that it won’t happen Wednesday.

I know there are other reports out there, but my sources close to the negotiations say no announcement is pending. It is still possible an announcement could come this week.

wtf???

R. Stroz

May 25th, 2011
4:46 pm

Telfo – Bettman Swallows

da' boomer

May 25th, 2011
4:46 pm

OHL

May 25th, 2011
4:47 pm

ThrasherFan,

What kind of records could you have possibly set? I would love to see some sources for this information. Someone else on these blogs claims you sold out every game your first season but that can’t be true. Your arena holds 18,545 for a Thashers game. Your average attendance for your first season was 17,206. Not only did you clearly not sell out every game, but what records could you have possibly set?

Also, why the 2,000 tickets/game drop from year 1 to year 2? These are people who were already at the games. Please don’t blame anything on the radio reception being bad. I am sure Atlanta is a very affluent city where homes have tv’s and cable.

Brendan

May 25th, 2011
4:47 pm

R.Stroz. He spits.

ATLfan

May 25th, 2011
4:57 pm

@ThrasherFan: post it everywhere… it’s not because of atlanta fans

canofpeas

May 25th, 2011
4:58 pm

@OHL.: we do have tv’s and cable. apparently you don’t have local websites. let ThrasherFan grieve in peace.

PoweRForgeD

May 25th, 2011
5:00 pm

uuGGH, Attendance numbers mean nothing in ATL, now many of those tickets were given away to try and put buts into seats. 13k avg you say, why is half that building emptyevery night. Reported numbers are a complete farce

ThrashersGal

May 25th, 2011
5:03 pm

@OHL go back to canada and get your own team. Stop trying to steal our team.

ATLfan

May 25th, 2011
5:08 pm

@PoweRForgeD – it’s because your eye balls were half frozen in manitoba

clark kent

May 25th, 2011
5:08 pm

Hey CViv, how about some information on the complete and utter disinterest by the city in keeping the franchise here and everything that comes with it (you know; jobs, money, tourism)? Or would that actually require investigative reporting and not a story handed to you by someone else?

BIG BUFF

May 25th, 2011
5:11 pm

MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY PUCK LIKE A PORN STAR.

glovesave29

May 25th, 2011
5:12 pm

OHL – Philips arena is a strange layout. One side of the arena is inaccessable unless you have a ticket to the suite / club level side. The first few years, if you had a suite – it also came with 2 club seats. Most of the time the fans stayed in the suite and the club level seating in the lower bowl went unused. Many people liked to be able to move back and forth between the suite and the club seats…but since you needed you suite ticket to get on to the elevator – you kept both tickets on you. That’s why it could never be COMPLETELY full.

sobaka

May 25th, 2011
5:14 pm

Some observations: OHL fan likes to think support in Atlanta was bad; it was, because the product is putrid. But the current Columbus support isn’t going to keep the Blue Jackets in central Ohio, lest you gloat. The ThrasherFan points to the 2004-2005 lock-out as one of the reasons for the downfall of the franchise. It is in fact the main reason why hockey interest has plummeted in so many of the newer American markets, e.g., Columbus, Dallas, Denver, Phoenix, and Miami. As the commissioner knew when the last round of expansion franchises were granted in 1997, the sport would have to be “grown” in these new markets. Canadians took that as a direct threat to “their sport” being over-run by neophytes with only a tepid interest in the sport. While Canada went into withdrawal during the 2004-2005 lockout, the new-found American followers of the sport were infuriated by the audacity of the sport to shut down just after it had taken root in these markets. Americans had other sports options besides hockey, Canadians didn’t or won’t, as can be seen by the flight of the Grizzlies and Expos, and the plunging attendance of the Blue Jays.

Americans’ turn-off became the opportunity for Canadians to lay claim to control of ice hockey again, and their media have incessantly ridiculed attempts to grow hockey in the Sunbelt, despite its current success in Carolina, Nashville, and San Jose, and its past success in Dallas and Denver. Without a doubt, had those cities had a hockey team with the performance record of the Thrashers, they would be in the position that Atlanta is in now. And I doubt that any Canadian city, save Toronto or Montreal, would have supported such a franchise. Furthermore, no one is going to emotionally invest in a sport that has a track record of threatening to pull out of town in a few years because attendance isn’t good enough. Baseball, football, and basketball paid their dues to get the support that they get in America; however, the NHL believes that by merely throwing a product with the NHL label on it, fans should flock in droves. It works in Toronto, why not elsewhere is the thinking.

The Thrashers situation resembles the North Stars situation in 1993 in the Twin Cities, and that of the Browns and Oilers in Cleveland and Houston in 1995, respectively. The NHL knows that soon the fans will crave the sport again, and this time the city and its fans will come to the league offering an awful lot more than they are now. Knowing human nature, the fans eventually will do what it takes to get the sport back in town. Just look at the following and support of the Wild in the Twin Cities, and the new Browns and Texans in Cleveland and Houston, respectively. Everybody knows that the atmosphere regarding hockey support is too poisonous in Atlanta right now to let a team stay there. Time heals wounds and attitudes will change. While the prospect of losing the Thrashers is very painful now, realize that this isn’t death; the league will come back again, as it clearly needs to show that it can survive in a market as prominent as Atlanta.

NHL Ready

May 25th, 2011
5:16 pm

Well said Thrasherfan I echo your words. I hate to lose the team the NHL turned their back on us as well as the City of Atlanta.

Puck Like A Porn Star

May 25th, 2011
5:20 pm

@BIG BUFF: it’s amazing what the corporations and Mayor believe is worth saving. 20-year-old movies in the park trump a pro hockey team, thousands of jobs, and boatloads of tax revenue?

Wow, just wow!

Atlanta Shortsighted $ Grab, LLC

May 25th, 2011
5:21 pm

Check the 11Alive website for more information on how we screwed you out of a hockey team by totally ignoring Anson Carter’s $350M bid.

Puck Like A Porn Star

May 25th, 2011
5:21 pm

“Had it not been for Atlanta’s strong corporate and philanthropic and civic partners, we would not be here to make this announcement today,” Mayor Kasim Reed said.

Too bad he’s not referring to the Thrashers.

sobaka

May 25th, 2011
5:24 pm

Why is it that Canadians feel some compelled to justify excuses as to why hockey failed in Winnipeg and Quebec City, while totally discrediting the reasons provided for the failure of the Thrashers to gain an adequate following? Would you Canadians have supported a franchise as inept as the Thrashers? Oh wait, you do, it’s called the Maple Loafs. Next time Canadian carpetbaggers come south of the 49th parallel trying to market the ice game, please see to it that you do so honestly. We have standards, which might sound strange to you.

I see where the Canadian media is bashing us in Columbus for not backing the Blue Jackets; excuse me, but why should we, when the coach states after every loss (and that is often) that the team “is not competing” ? We are not fair-weather fans, but we are discriminating consumers. Boy won’t the NHL be great with franchises in Churchill, Yellowknife, Red Dear, Saskatoon, and Flinn Flon? I can just see the marquee on Madison Square Garden announcing the arrival of those “must see” teams coming to play the Rangers. Almost as compelling as the Red Sox-Yankees or the Patriots-Jets.

I.C. Wiener

May 25th, 2011
5:25 pm

LOL @ Denver being in the Sun Belt!!

Thrashers27

May 25th, 2011
5:25 pm

Mr. Vivlamore,

Who are your “sources”? I hate to bust your chops, but that’s journalism 101, man. Not good form to state facts without substantiating them. Any of us faithful fans following the situation could go on all day about what “sources” say without even trying to dig for info on the situation. If you have no new info, then you have no new info. Feel confident in saying that and keep digging and waiting for something new.

If you can’t substantiate, you gotta hold that info until you can confirm, otherwise you’re just part of the rumour mill.

Steve-o

May 25th, 2011
5:37 pm

LOL @ Denver being in the Sun Belt!!
——————–
Well, Sobaka made some excellent points, even if that description doesn’t fit Denver. Anyway, Denver is very sunny & warm in the summer!

I would disagree, though, about the NHL coming back to Atlanta some day. Ain’t gonna happen after two failed franchises. It’s a shame that City Hall provided no support and made no attempt to keep the Thrashers here — because once the Thrashers are gone, I believe the NHL is done for good in Atlanta. It’s also a shame that the AJC has been so passive in its coverage. This paper should have taken the city to task for its apathetic response to this situation. There should have been front page articles, etc.

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
5:39 pm

Trista,

I take your point to heart but I also believe in personal accountability. Heatedly chose to drive his car, as he was at the wheel, in the manner he did. What happened past that point is on him. His actions led to the death of a person, therefore, he did kill him. Of course he would take it back if he could, my point was more about a turning point in the franchise.

I'm surrounded by idiots

May 25th, 2011
5:41 pm

Basically ThrasherFan hit the nail on the head. Poor drafts, cheap and bad owners, poor GM. Poor choices on players that either didn’t reach potential or bolted for more money or a “fresh start”.

I will never go to the Hawks games as long as the ASG are the owners. They don’t deserve my time or my money. Hockey died in Atlanta because of many factors. Good night Canada….

Nile Uno

May 25th, 2011
5:50 pm

There got to be better ways to punish the ASG without hurting the Hawks, besides we Hawks fans have to keep dealing with their stupidity on all fronts and that not fair.

Big Daddy Dave

May 25th, 2011
5:51 pm

One thing regarding ThrashersFan’s assessment. Savard was not “shipped off”. He became a UFA and the Wad didn’t think he was worth the cash so he let him walk.

sobaka

May 25th, 2011
5:57 pm

Steve-o: I think that most owners are well aware as to what went on with the Thrashers, and if a responsible owner comes up with the cash to buy a new franchise in Atlanta, it will happen. The money will make them forget the failures in Atlanta, just as it did in Minnesota. Also, keep in mind that the current major league baseball team in Washington, DC is its third.

Actually, because of the incredibly bogus circumstances surrounding the reloaction of the Thrashers, I believe fans of the sport will rally together and show enough support for a new owner to put down the money. Strangely enough, this issue seems to have generated a lot of interest in pro hockey in Atlanta. The city and its fans have been constantly berated, and I think that they will bounce back to show that they can come through and support the NHL, given the chance to do so, which they clearly weren’t with this group of owners. I was raised in Cleveland, and having seen what Art Modell did to the Browns and Ted Stepien did to the Cavaliers, I tend to agree that in most cases bad management is to blame for franchise failure.

The lack of ownership interest in Atlanta is not due solely to the poor attendance; the deal to sell the Thrashers to a local group was skewed so that they would get no arena revenue. That was the poison pill, as even under the best circumstances, the team could not have made a profit.

BTW, why is it that owners of the Thrashers and Coyotes claim to lose $30 million annually, when they have such incredibly low pay-rolls, and use that as an excuse for selling to owners that will relocate teams, while owners of the Blue Jays and Mets claim to lose $70 million annually, and no threat of relocation is involved? As the famous politician said, “there are lies, there are damned lies, and then there are statistics.”

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
5:57 pm

OHL is just a tool who wants to come on here and rub our faces in it. When he is not on this board he goes to Children hospitals to make fun of kids with cancer.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
6:03 pm

glovesave29,

Thanks for the explanation. But that still doesn’t quite make sense. I could see how not wanting to go back & forth would make the arena look empty, but the seat is still sold and counts in the NHL attendance figures whether the ticket holder sits in it or not, right? So if in year 1 you had 17,206 and people were running back & forth from the suites, yes the arena would look more full. But in year 2 you still had sold all those suites, the arena may look a little emptier but what about all the other fans that didn’t buy tickets at all and thus the drop in attendance to 15,262?

Whether the suite ticket holders were running back & forth only has to do with appearance. Their tickets still count as sold in Year 1 and Year 2. So something else happened that almost 2,000 people stopped showing up and since it was only the first year of the team’s existence I don’t think you can blame it on the GM, players, or Turner Broadcasting who owned the team back then.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
6:11 pm

Big Wally,

I am actually supporting expansion hockey much more today than I would 2 weeks ago. The problem is that the numbers just don’t support any arguments for the Atlanta market. So when I read some things on these boards, I am just pointing out what the truth of the matter is. Unfortunately for you that means that Columbus looks far better than Atlanta. That’s all. You actually do have some good fans down there, but the truth is still the truth.

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
6:16 pm

@glovesave29

You are spot on in regards to the layout of Phillips. Camera side always looks empty and being in the arena itself and looking at that section is terrible.

On free tickets – I’m not joking when I say this, I once got a free ticket through a friend who worked at a drug and alcohol rehabilitation center. Basically they gave a bunch of drunks free tickets and I literally sat with them the entire game. They had no idea what hockey was and were only there because it was their allowed “night out” with supervision. Insane.

@OHL

I don’t know where you are from but in the 99-01 timeframe there was a downturn in the US economy. That could explain why less ST were sold. I had ST at one point and then my wife lost her job and we struggled for years. Should I buy ST anyway and go into debt for an inferior product?

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
6:21 pm

@BigDaddyDave

You are correct, Savard wasn’t “shipped out.” However, they felt he wasn’t worth the money. We know how that story goes with the Thrash. It’s basically the same thing.

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
6:24 pm

OHL, the fact that you are on here to bash/question/challenge every comment you don’t like proves you are only here to rub Thrasher fans face in it. You must derive some sick, personal gratification in knowing we’re losing our team and you want to get more shots in us. If you want the truth, why don’t you look at some of the player’s comments? Chris Mason said ownership was never committed to winning here. Moose Hedberg who isn’t even with the team anymore said basically the same thing as did Chris Thorburn. I think they know more about the situation here than you do. Court documents verify that ASG was trying to get rid of the team basically from the start of their ownership. What new prospective owner would want to buy the team and keep them here when they would get the shaft in regards to arena revenue at Phillips? ASG has never invested in the team like they have with the Hawks. Is that not the truth?

11 Alive Confirms Carter Offer - ASG Did Nothing

May 25th, 2011
6:30 pm

The media now agrees with with our hypothesis related to Anson Carter’s group. According to 11 Ailve:

http://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=152322681503800&id=188894621145432

“Last year, the Atlanta Spirit Group was approached by a group of investors led by former NHL player Anson Carter (@AnsonCarterLA), the source told 11Alive’s Matt Pearl (@MattPearlWXIA11) on the condition of anonymity. The group led by Carter made a preliminary, non-binding offered to buy the Atlanta Thrashers, The Atlanta Hawks and the rights to Philips Arena from Atlanta Spirit. The group intended to keep the Thrashers in Atlanta and had serious financial backing, Pearl’s source said. That offer was never put through due diligence by the Atlanta Spirit Group, the source told Pearl.”

Sherry Taylor

May 25th, 2011
6:31 pm

Chris Vivamore: Is there any truth to the story that Anson Carter and group had $350 million in hand and made a non-binding preliminary offer that was pretty much ignored in lieu of the TNSE deal? Isn’t this the same type thing that ‘bought’ the teams and arena in the first place? Ignore the rules, do it behind closed doors?

glovesave29

May 25th, 2011
6:31 pm

OHL – I gotta agree with Wally. I don’t know your intentions or reasoning for being here, but you are coming across as condescending and judgemental. You ask questions – and when you don’t get the answer you want, you just rephrase it or use certain parts of our answers our of context to make your point. We are losing our team. We are pissed. Common courtesy says to leave us be and let us vent our spleens.

Sherry Taylor

May 25th, 2011
6:33 pm

BTW, Dan Heatley did NOT kill Dan Snyder. It was an accident! yes, he was stupid, driving too fast with one beer too many, but he did not set out to kill Dan Snyder, so please don’t put that out there. I’m sure Heatley thinks about Dan Snyder every day and wishes he could take it all back. So, don’t be a boar, don’t say stuff like that.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
6:34 pm

ThrasherFan,

What was it the Bush tax cuts that just got renewed? Well when they first got implemented they would’ve sparked the economy right around the time Turner Broadcasting still owned the team and you guys were still just a growing expansion franchise. Instead you didn’t support the team owned by a big Atlanta based Fortune 500 company that was on the upturn.

The truth is (and this is for you Big Wally) you had multiple years of being owned by Turner Broadcasting and you didn’t come out to support your team when it was either in infancy or was starting to bring in young talent like Heatley and Kovalchuk. This is before ASG, before Heatley’s accident, before any of mgt’s moves, before anything you can complain about. You just didn’t support it from the beginning like Columbus did.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
6:37 pm

glovesave29,

It’s not that I don’t like the answers you give me, I just call bull when I see it. Yes, your arena may be shaped differently. But the tickets that are sold to suite owners in BOTH year 1 and year 2 had no impact on the drop in ticket sales between year 1 and year 2. I am sorry that you guys don’t like the fact that I am just providing factual rebuttals. But if you just want to vent, vent. But don’t make up stuff that is factually incorrect when you vent. If you just want to vent that you are losing a team, then fine. But don’t vent by saying “a Fortune 500 company is all we need” when you already had a Fortune 500 company. Is the economy going to be any better now than it was in 1999?

I’m sorry, but if you want to say hockey is great and you will miss it, I will support that. But I will not support some of the other things that are being put out here.

OHL is "The Return of the Bud"

May 25th, 2011
6:42 pm

glovesave29

May 25th, 2011
6:43 pm

Sherry – Dany DID kill Dan. YES, it was an accident. No one ever would say it was on purpose. But his irresponsible actions DIRECTLY attributed to the death of another human being. Certainly not a murder – no premeditation or intent – but a killing nonetheless.

I have friends who work for the team. I’ve been told Dany is not the nicest, friendliest or most caring individual. I cannot say for certain or not that he thinks about Dan everyday. I do notice his photo is never in any of the charity events that are held in Dan’s name. He never performed his civic duties as ordered by the court. If ANYONE could have taken #37 – he could have. Personally, he SHOULD have.

Puckface

May 25th, 2011
6:46 pm

Maybe if Thrashers only sell tickets to the side of the arena that the cameras are looking it would look full and encourage people to go. That’s the only hope I think you have. Then they wouldn’t have to give away so many free tickets. Instead of lying that there are 13,500 people at the game you could just put 9000 or so on one side of people who actually pay.

geoff

May 25th, 2011
6:50 pm

Can’t wait for them to leave. One less NHL team posting fake attendance numbers.

OilFan

May 25th, 2011
6:51 pm

OHL.. You are embarrassing us other Canadians. Why do you have to fight them on having additional reasons for losing there team. Have some respect for their loss, and stop posting here.

Very good post ThrasherFan, pretty much sums it up.

glovesave29

May 25th, 2011
6:51 pm

See OHL – ya proved my point again. We are here . We are confronted with this every day. We tell you the facts – you don’t listen and use it against us. We all admit to dwindling attendance. EVERY OTHER MARKET (save Toronto) WOULD HAVE DONE SIMILARLY!!! You questioned someones comment about the sellouts the first season and I GAVE you an answer. Call it Bull. I couldn’t give one flip. Judge us from 1500 miles away. Do you feel superior? Well good for you. Ive tried to be nice and thoughtful towards you. You just don’t let up…now let us comiserate in peace ya troll.

Steve-o

May 25th, 2011
6:52 pm

Hey, did I get blocked for writing something critical of this publication?

Tsk Tsk

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
6:52 pm

Any news ftome the Canadian Crap and Mail tabloid? What a hack reporter, I wish that guy would choke on his feces. Canaians cannot be trusted. Go Sun Devils and Yotes.

moriler

May 25th, 2011
6:53 pm

dudes, isn’t it obvious yet that OHL will simply deny anything you put forth as an argument, and then repeat himself? He’s only here to be a dick, just like Sage and stende* always were. He isn’t discussing in good faith, he’s just another troll posting from his mother’s basement who just wants to see how many people will keep responding to him.

He isn’t as obvious as the ones who post GO JETS GO from a nick “Winnipeg Forever”, but he’s close.

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
7:01 pm

I got coyote season seats for $10 !!
I bet I could have gotten thrasher tickets for $4

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
7:01 pm

… if you still had a team

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
7:03 pm

@DarrenDreger
Darren Dreger
Atl-Wpg is not done yet. Sources say it may not get done this week.

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
7:03 pm

The Thrashers are going NOWHERE.. The BoG would rather have a team in Kabul than loserpeg..

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
7:05 pm

then again they keep a team in glendale
i’m so confused

Guffman

May 25th, 2011
7:09 pm

The sad thing is that part of the relo fee will be used to prop up those losers in Glendale. Subsidies from both your government and now Winnipeg… we should be jacking the Coyotes team since they can only survive year to year through handouts.

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
7:10 pm

i tried jacking a coyote.. i liked it

Brown164

May 25th, 2011
7:14 pm

As someone who has lived in Atlanta for the entire duration of the Thrashers, I have a couple observations. First, the management of the team ran it into the ground pure and simple. The Thrashers never had any depth, especially on defense. One would think with all those 1st round draft picks, a few would have worked out with the team. Draft picks were always thrown in too early and then dealt when they did not perform. In spite of what many Thrashers fans say, Kovalchuk was a very good player for the team, he was just not a playmaker.

The second point is that Atlanta is not a good PRO sports town. It is a college sports town that happens to have pro teams. On TV and radio (especially radio) during the NHL season, the Bulldogs and Jackets would get tons of airtime along with the Falcons, the Thrashers may get a box score just before a commercial. I hold the “fans” in Atlanta responsible, but I do not hold them at fault. Atlanta is a city of transplanted people. As a result of this, many of these people are fans of the teams they grew up with and subsequently moved away from. I went to a Thrashers/Rangers game last season and it was amazing to see the number of Rangers jerseys as compared to Thrashers, there was a 2 to 1 difference. It was that way when many teams came to town.

Personally, I will be a little sad to see the Thrashers go, but only because I can’t go see the road team.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
7:21 pm

glovesave29,

You say that “EVERY OTHER MARKET (save Toronto) WOULD HAVE DONE SIMILARLY!!! ” But that’s simply not true. COLUMBUS did not do similarly, they did far superior than what you did. You were bottom’s in the league, they had repeated years in the top 12

You say that I “questioned someones comment about the sellouts the first season and I GAVE you an answer.” But your answer never even addressed my question. You said people who had tickets didn’t want to run back and forth from their seats to the suites. My question was how can Philips Arena have a capacity of 18,545 and only have an average attendance of 17,206 when someone claimed they sold out every game? You’re math is off by 2,300+ seats. You never answered that question. People who paid for a seat and are running around the arena doesn’t answer how you are 2,300+ seats short of a sellout for the year’s average.

I’m sorry that the truth bothers you guys so much but I deal in reality.

Pointing the finger

May 25th, 2011
7:27 pm

There is only one entity to blame for the loss of Hockey in Atlanta and that is the Atlanta Spirit. They will tell you that they had to sell because of poor support from fans. Well that poor support from the fans is a the resulto of their putting a pi$$ poor product on display.

The Falcons are successful and that is because they have a single vision…and that vision is winning. The Thrashers (and Hawks for that matter) have no clear vision and zero commitment to winning from the Atlanta Spirit. People support winners…people ignore teams that consistently sell off their best players to save money or hire coches on the cheap all the time.

How do you get increasingly poor ticket sales over a period of years? You remove the positives that fans saw the previous year.

The Atlanta Spirit is just like the evil owner of the Cleveland Indians in Major League…only the Spirit got their way and ran the team first into the ground and then out of town. Kudos Atlanta Spirit…you rich a$$holes represent the biggest problem in professional sports and the reason I quit going to Thrasher’s games.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
7:27 pm

Ooops, 1,300+ is what you were off by. Not 2,300+. Either way, the math just doesn’t add up so there’s no way you could’ve sold out every game your first season.

Just saying

May 25th, 2011
7:39 pm

OHL-go find another hobby other than trolling on Atlanta message boards. Enough.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
7:49 pm

Just saying,

Sorry, but this has actually been very informative for me. Game’s almost starting so I should be good now. Although I can’t promise anything at intermission if Grapes doesn’t have anything good to say.

Tired of all this

May 25th, 2011
7:53 pm

OHL, obviously Glove is talking about the ASG puposefully ruining the Atlanta market and not making any effort to put a good product on the ice. The Blue Jackets, although have similar lack of success are not comparable because they are trying to build a winner, the team has not been secretly for sale for 7 years, and they do not have any other competition in that market for pro sports. Now let us all move on.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
7:56 pm

Days and days keep going by and all I continue to see is Blame Management, it’s all their fault. Give me a break. All the other southern markets aren’t looking at relocation…for the second time. Why can’t the fans, what few of them there are accept the fact there isn’t enough of you to sustain a franchise. You all keep writing here like the few of you that are flooding this thread represent the masses, you don’t, you represent the few who can’t come to grips that ownership can’t be expected to carry a team out of their pocket when there’s little or no revenue coming in from ticket sales. Sure YOU bought tickets, but YOU are not buying out the entire stadium, you’re buying one seat. I see the same people here, so if you do represent the fandom the writing on the wall should be crystal clear – IT was a mistake to even put this team here, sorry but it’s not going to be here next season, you had 9 years to give them support and once they stopped winning out the door the masses went and here comes the putting of blame on the owners. They might not be the best owners at all, but Business 101, if there’s no money coming in then you can’t keep putting money out. If you had a broken down car how long would you keep pouring money into it before you came to the conclusion it might be time for a new one and junk the old? (Oh wait, I forgot where I am)

Do people here even know how much it costs to operate a hockey club? This isn’t basketball folks, hockey is a costly investment, equipment is expensive, maintaining the ice, transporting a team etc, it’s all costly, but since the owners didn’t fork over enough to buy a Stanley Cup team for you in 9 years it’s their fault, hell you went to the playoffs in a winning season but they still lost $20 million…what a joke. Look at how many teams fill arenas all season, year after year and have loyal fans and they haven’t won anything in years, but they show up, not here, you expect to win, and now…what a load. Get over yourselves. Oh wait, you can’t, you’re too busy blaming the whole world on the Thrashers leaving, but won’t take an ounce of the responsibility for why they’re heading north of the border…boo hoo!

IRNWKR

May 25th, 2011
8:04 pm

Let me start by saying I’m from Winnipeg. I have been watching this story unfold for some time now. Like most people here I’ve been cautiously optamistic, but every day it seems like we are getting a team. Sadly it sounds as if it’s at the expence of some truly great fans. The posts that i have read from the people of Atlanta (for the most part) show the true spirit of hockey fans, true hockey fans, world wide.
Some of the comments made by a few of my fellow Winnipegers have been truly awful. I will not apologize for them because in my eyes those idiots do not deserve anyone to try and defend them.
Basically what I’m trying to say is fight to the bitter end. That’s what I would do, as a true hockey fan.
Good luck.

Wolfman Chris

May 25th, 2011
8:09 pm

As a former Atlanta Flame season ticker holder all I can say is that this is a sad day for Atlanta sports but not the end of the world. At least it’s not the Braves or Falcons leaving. Unfortunately we’ll still be stuck with Atlanta Spirit as the Hawks owners. Hopefully someone will come buy them before they’re run into the ground. The Winnipeg Thashers/Jets/ whatevers will probably fold within 5 years time as will the Phoenix Coyotes, Florida Panthers, Columbus Blue Jackets and NY Islanders before it’s all said and done. If the Atlanta Spirit was the worst run ownership then the NHL is the worst run professional sports league. Half the teams are tottering on backruptcey, way too many playoffs teams, a stupid way of keeping the standings where an overtime loss is awarded a point. Maybe the NHL will collapse and we can start all over again with a new version of the WHA….

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
8:11 pm

IRNWKR: I thought you were rewarded the Atlanta team on Tuesday by a Canadian writer who obviously worked himself into a frenzy and shot his load. You all relax and let the US take care of its own business. Clean the cream out of the Canada media’s drawers while you are it. You’ll know soone enough.

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
8:13 pm

Coyote tixs cost $10. That will sustain this team. Atlanta needs a new airport.

Sir Hat Trick

May 25th, 2011
8:15 pm

When was Time Warner, or AOL Time Warner, ever an “Atlanta-based” Fortune 500 company?

Smoothie

May 25th, 2011
8:20 pm

For the love of God people stop wasting your time arguing with all of these trolls who only care about trying to make us look bad. Focus your energy and anger towards the shady deal that is taking place right under our city’s nose. If sources continue to come out like the one who is supporting Anson Carter’s GOOD FAITH attempt to buy the teams, then perhaps we can continue to pressure all media interests in Atlanta to keep digging for proof of A$G’s duplicity and fraudulent handling of this sale. While Bettman seems complicit in helping A$G sell off our Thrashers, perhaps he feels painted into a corner by the PHX situation and the fact A$G has/had no intention of running the hockey team. If enough evidence was unearthed to shed more light on A$G’s dirty dealings and lack of forthright dealings in trying to find a LOCAL prospective buyer, then perhaps the move can be blocked at least for another year.

Even if you don’t agree, just stop wasting your time arguing with Peggers who, by and large, will not ever concede a point or understand our Atlanta POV. They weren’t here for 11 years and don’t know the reality that is sports business in this town.

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
8:21 pm

OHL believes that attendance figures–alone–are enough to draw a sweeping conclusion. There are many factors and variables, both qualitative and quantitative, to be considered…and to compare Columbus to Atlanta on one factor alone is statistically haphazard and completely indefensible.

So, when OHL and his superior intellect can lay out even a representative portion of the equation, I will listen. Otherwise, I will disregard his bleatings and consider them for what they are….mathematically invalid and thus wholly unreliable.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:22 pm

@Smoothie…you’re right, all this last minute support and rumors of other buyers will put the current deal to bed. Why can’t you understand that only a legitimate buyer with cash is going to be let in the door and where were all of these buyers and support before the current group made thier move? Too little too late, they’re knee high in the required paperwork, these owners see an out and they’re going to take it. I bet you believe in Santa, the Easter Bunny and Tooth Fairy as well.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:27 pm

@Sage of Blueland…in other words if YOU can’t dazzle us with brilliance you’ll baffle us with BS right? Say goodbye BLUELAND. Whatever the hell that’s supposed to mean.

rustynail

May 25th, 2011
8:28 pm

Great post Thrashersfan. But in all honestly I hope Atlanta is never given another oppurtunity to have a NHL Hockey franchise. Mostly because we can’t find an owner who is willing to sacrifice the good years and bad years. An or owners who will pour out the money to make Atlanta the best in the NHL. If the Thrashers would have won the Cup this year would the Spirit still be whinning and crying for a sale?PROBABLY FOR 100 % CERTAIN Goodbye Thrashers Thanks for the ride and the memories.

Mark

May 25th, 2011
8:29 pm

Spirit sux…my shadow will not enter Phillips…may it fall in…

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
8:29 pm

NHL commissioner Gary Bettman went into fire-fighting mode again today with some cold-water words for those convinced the league has received a finalized deal to move the Atlanta Thrashers to Winnipeg.

Appearing on Tampa, Fla., radio station WDAE this morning, Bettman was served the Atlanta-Winnipeg question with a little too much certainty for his liking.

“I think you’re being a tad presumptuous on what’s going on in Atlanta,” Bettman said. “Nobody’s announced anything and frankly if there is something going on nothing is going to happen until it actually happens, which means it may not happen.

“So I think people need to take a deep breath and pause.”

Pointing the finger

May 25th, 2011
8:30 pm

Getthepuckouttahere…This is a chicken and egg argument but clearly the ownership failed to create a quality product. Using “Business 101″, I think, is your attempt at condescention. Try this…Remedial Business Class: IF YOU DON’T CREATE A PRODUCT PEOPLE WANT, YOU WILL FAIL.

The Atlanta Spirit has been totally disfunctional for years and now it has cost great fans in a god city a Hockey team.

Why would you defend these people?

Pointing the finger

May 25th, 2011
8:31 pm

Err…good city not god city.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:33 pm

@Pointing the finger…didn’t you make the playoffs? Wasn’t that a good team? Yet they were supposed to pour more money into a playoff team when they lost $20 million dollars that season? Remind me to never let you do my books, I’ll be broke in the first qtr.

Ward

May 25th, 2011
8:38 pm

Hey Chris, Just read a recent Hockey News release(6:50pm) which said the usual stuff about the sale coming along soon but then had mention of Carters’ group and 350 million for all three ASG holdings. Would Board of Governors delay a deal to give the Carter story time to work out? It isn’t too farfetched to think even Winnepeg might get frustrated with ASG………………

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:40 pm

A true hockey fan is supportive, goes to the game for the love of the game not just for a championship team. But in Atlanta they’re different, you have to win a Stanley Cup in 9 seasons or less or the so-called fans walk away. It’s sad when a city of this size can’t find 18,000 loyal fans, but you’re going to sit there and blame manageement. You really DON’T deserve a team and sure as hell shouldn’t be calling yourself a fan of the game. You’re probably one of the many who have never even played the game let alone donned a pair of skates. Fairweather fans, who needs them. A city that’s going to lose it’s second franchise and it’s only managens fault. You and the rest of those crying on here really are narrow-minded and in denial.

goose

May 25th, 2011
8:41 pm

OHL-to answer your question with the sellouts for the first season I believe there were 38 sellouts leaving 3 games that were not sold out.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:42 pm

Typo (new laptop)
Fairweather fans, who needs them. A city that’s going to lose it’s second franchise and it’s only managements fault.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
8:42 pm

@ Getthepuckouttahere – Your right, Basketball cost way more, just look at how much NBA guys are making. The Hawks payroll was $70,927,923 and the Thrashers payroll was $46,113,333 that is a difference of $24,814,590 so that means basketball cost more.
Oh, and if you think that the Hawks attendance is way better than the Thrashers because of the difference in payroll, think again. The Hawks attendance was 15,648 (22 in NBA) and the Thrashers was 13,469 (28 in NHL) that is 2,179, not the chasm that the payroll difference between the two teams is.
It is obvious where A$G priorities are at. Oh, OHL Columbus was 27th in attendance, 13,658, just 189 a game better than the Thrashers; get those moving vans to Quebec ready. I just took your guys arguments and “Threw them on the Ground!”

Big Daddy Dave

May 25th, 2011
8:44 pm

It’s over gang, Hate to say it, but it’s the cold hard fact. Nothing’s gonna save them. No Knight in shining armor to swoop in. If there were, it would have happened by now. Final blame rests with the Atlanta business community, period.

FrustratedThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
8:46 pm

Why does the Winnipeg ownership need to have a ticket drive once the deal goes through?
All we’ve heard from the Winnipegers is how much they love Hockey and that they’ll fill their arena every night.

soonahockeywidow

May 25th, 2011
8:47 pm

Ward: although I appreciate yor hopefulness…..do you think we here in winnipeg would get frustrated ASG..and walk away…..time is all we have. But hold on to hope (not being sarcatic honest ATL fans) when all you have is hope you hold on..we would too!

Although some Peggers should be posting under the name ’summer’s eve” some of us do get your frustrations…been there!!

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:48 pm

Again, the operating costs of a hockey team, along with salary is still more than a basketball team. It’s no secret that hockey players are generally underpaid. What was the salary of this team when they went to the playoffs with Kovy and Hossa? It’s not going to matter, this isnt’ a hockey town, you know it and I know it…say goodbye!

:)

May 25th, 2011
8:48 pm

I gotta go, My Bruins are up 2-1 over TB and I’ve been a Boston fan since I was playing squirts in Charlestown. That’s Bunker Hill for ya’ll that have never been to Boston. See ya!!!

HillMan

May 25th, 2011
8:52 pm

All I think there may be a last minute angle here if Anson Carter truely had the backing and is still willing to make the same offer. Jesse Jackson would probably love to help us.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
8:52 pm

Yeah, that’s it, m dad who died and is buried in Malden Mass. is one of the ASG owners. Douche bag.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
8:54 pm

@ Getthepuckouttahere, You do know that players cost is the number 1 expense of any pro sports team (that is why the NFL is locked out and the NBA soon will be). Once again I know facts don’t matter to most people but the payroll gap is $24,814,590. What gives is your dad one of the A$G owners.

why not

May 25th, 2011
9:04 pm

I know this would never happen but…what if the two towns shared the team. Split the home games in half and you would sell out every game in both cities. The NHL could spread it’s brand and be a trail blazer in professional sports. Would having two cities share a team be that crazy of an idea? Two tv contracts, two cites worth of merchandise to sell, and double everything but the gate. Heck you would actually have a hard ticket to buy in both towns and could charge a ransom. Something…anything…this town will never see professional hockey again and it sucks. Go to heck ASG!!!

soonahockeywidow

May 25th, 2011
9:05 pm

To frustated: As a Winnipegger I am wondering that too..so are others…????
Reality rumour rumour reality…blurry blurry blurry

Wolfman Chris

May 25th, 2011
9:08 pm

Bottom line, the loss of the Thrashers to Winnipeg means the NHL is the biggest loser. MLB bent over backwards to keep the Expos in Montreal, yet the they still wound up in Washington. Does that make Montreal a bad sports town? Of course not, just not an MLB town. Atlanta is a great sports town as well as a great city to live and work, just maybe not a good NHL town. Goodbye and good riddence, maybe when the Calgary Flames go belly up Turner could pick them up at yard sale prices…

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:08 pm

Maybe I am Douche bag, but you come on this board and spew a bunch of junk with facts you can’t back up and defend A$G like you are one of the owners and or got family involved. There are a lot of people, and I know some, that have spent a lot of time and money one this club (the Thrashers) and they are getting hosed.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
9:09 pm

Sir Hat Trick,

When you ask “When was Time Warner, or AOL Time Warner, ever an “Atlanta-based” Fortune 500 company?” I refer you to Turner Broadcasting, the major cog of TW which even I know is based in Atlanta having seen Ted & Jane at the Braves games.

Sage of Bluesland,

When you claim “OHL believes that attendance figures–alone–are enough to draw a sweeping conclusion. There are many factors and variables, both qualitative and quantitative, to be considered…and to compare Columbus to Atlanta on one factor alone is statistically haphazard and completely indefensible.”

How many times have I referred to Nielsen ratings on this blog? Here, look at this chart and tell me how SportsSouth does with the Thrashers and compare it to Fox Sports Ohio with the Blue Jackets – http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2009/01/20090119/This-Weeks-News/Nhls-Attendance-TV-Ratings-Both-Showing-Increases.aspx

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
9:14 pm

I hate the TV ratings issue as the Thrash have never had all of their games televised, yet alone advertised. I watched every game for every season I could and got pumped when they would be on ESPN. We always seemed to save our best for those games. However, at least 20 games were never televised.

No pregame – no advertising – sometimes bumped for something that was in progress. It’s been a joke…

Billsen

May 25th, 2011
9:15 pm

OHL = JK Sockey.

Not saying they are the same guy, but they deserve equal respect – which is to say NONE at all.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:20 pm

SB Nation…Red it and Weep!!!

Atlanta Thrashers Sale Complete As Final Obstacles Are Overcome, Report Says
May

25

4:16p
by Travis Hughes

At last, the Atlanta Thrashers sale is complete. That’s according to a report from Ken Campbell of The Hockey News, who says that the only step left is an official announcement that the team has been sold and will be relocated the Winnipeg.

The hold up had been caused by a fight between the NHL and Atlanta Spirit, the current owner of the Thrashers. Campbell reported last week that Gary Bettman and the league wanted the full $60 million relocation fee, as well as a chunk of the $110 million sale price, at the expense of Atlanta Spirit.

According to Campbell, that’s been resolved, and Bettman hasn’t won.

In fact, one source close to the situation said the final obstacle holding up the sale – how the $170 million purchase price would be split between the NHL and Atlanta Spirit – has finally been overcome.

And it appears to have favored the Atlanta Spirit and owner Bruce Levenson, who will reportedly receive $20 million of the $60 million relocation fee that is included in the purchase price.

Campbell also reports that there’s a bit of in-fighting at the NHL on when to make the announcement about the team moving to the ‘Peg. Some want it to come between the Conference Finals and Stanley Cup Finals, while others believe it should come after the Finals and before the Draft, as not to take away from the NHL’s championship round.

Whenever the announcement is made, it seems like everything’s wrapped up now.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:20 pm

READ IT AND WEEP!

Billsen

May 25th, 2011
9:20 pm

I also wonder this – if the south is so bad for hockey, why is Tampa Bay still playing?

Sir Hat Trick

May 25th, 2011
9:21 pm

OHL,

Since you tend to specialize in splitting hairs, here is a counter-argument using your own logic. The team never was locally owned. True, it fell under the Turner umbrella, but the ultimate owner of title was Time Warner. And then AOL. Neither of which were “Atlanta-based”.

Thanks for taking the bait, Frenchie.

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
9:22 pm

That’s but one…one…of a quantifiable element. Now, I look forward to how you quantify the qualitative factors involved regarding:

1. The cities themselves;
2. The demographics;
3. The ownership situations;
4. The opportunity costs of alternative options;

Etc.

Looking forward to more of your “analysis”. Until a respectable equation is presented which even begins to consider all of the complex factors involved, I will consider it a statistically invalid and, thus, unsupported, conclusion.

(That means “ignorant”, in case you’re wondering)

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:22 pm

EXCUSES, EXCUSES, EXCUSES!!!!

Billsen

May 25th, 2011
9:24 pm

@Getthepuckouttahere – I read that same news in the Toronto Globe and Mail last week. Funny, the Thrashers are still in Atlanta. Why don’t you go and do your beer-chugging jig on Portage and Main?

(Psst – You might could do with a few other intersections up there – sources tell me that’s all ya got.)

OHL

May 25th, 2011
9:25 pm

goose,

Thanks for the reply. But to make that formula work (18545 capacity, 17206 average, 38 sellouts) that would mean the 3 non sellout games would only have 250 at each game. We both know that’s just not true.

So it’s got to be something in between. To have an average of say 15,500 for your non-sellout games (in order to pull the average down to 17,206) you would’ve only had 23 sellouts. I have to think you couldn’t have much less than 15,500 average given the number of season tickets you were required to have the first year and just normal walk-ups on any given night.

But still, only 23 sellouts then your first year? At most you could play with the numbers and get it up to 30 sellouts max given the numbers we already have. If you did have 30 sellouts that would mean your non-sellouts would be 11 games of 13,550. There’s no way you can have a lower non-sellout average lower than that.

So definitely 30 sellouts or less for your first year for a 41 home game season. That’s not good, I’m sorry.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:26 pm

Good comeback Billsen. Another who I’d have a psychological battle with, but you come to the table so unarmed it’s just not fair. BOO HOO…Thrashers go to the Peg!!!

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:26 pm

Hey Getthepuckouttahere now who is the Douche bag!

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:26 pm

Your mother, that’s who!! :) bwahahahaha

OHL

May 25th, 2011
9:29 pm

Sage of Bluesland,

Atlanta – 5.3 million people
Columbus – 1.8 million people

Do you really want to bring demographics into this argument why you didn’t perform as well as Columbus?

Ownership – you were owned by TBS, local giant that won the World Series with the Braves. During that time TBS owned the team you were bottoms in the league in attendance while Columbus was in the top 12.

Do you really want to continue this analysis?

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:30 pm

11 Alive NEWS http://www.11alive.com/news/article/192249/3/Hockey-News-Thrashers-deal-done-team-says-its-not

Who is the Douche bag now? And I don’t care what the team says, they just don’t want to announce the inevitable.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:32 pm

If you’re ASG why would you WANT to announce the sale, you’ve all said they’re the bad guy. They’ll let the league announce it. Think about it.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:32 pm

Hey, Getthepuckouttahere my mother died less than two years ago so by your logic and mine you are a real Douche bag!

OHL = EOB

May 25th, 2011
9:32 pm

same turd, new initials

OHL

May 25th, 2011
9:33 pm

Sir Hat Trick,

If TBS or TNT are not “Atlanta-based” then why are all your basketball studios in Atlanta? Doesn’t Barkley have to live there for a few months a year? Keep calling me Frenchie too, that’s hilarious.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:34 pm

No…now that I think about it, YOU’RE THE DOUCHE BAG just for opening the door about MY DAD. Typical Atlantan…pass the buck, pass the buck, it’s the other guys fault. IDIOT!

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:42 pm

No, I was right…you’re a douche bag. And I have facts you’re completely blind too…this is not a hockey town, the Thrashers are leaving, and none of you are bright enough to see the writing on the wall. Or are you going to tell me that there will be a local buyer, the team isn’t moving to Winnipeg and I’ll also grow hair on my palms?

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:43 pm

Hey Getthepuckouttahere,
So, you the d**kless wonder who comes on a Atlanta Thrashers message board and start saying crap about stuff you had no facts to back up and then YOU brought up your dead Dad. Then when I call you out for being a Douche Bag for doing the same thing with the mom comment, you call me am idiot. I might be an idiot, but your still a Douche Bag!

glovesave29

May 25th, 2011
9:45 pm

Hillman – y’know, the same thing crossed my mind this afternoon. If only Hosea were alive today…he’d be out raising cain!

Sitting here with my two little daughters watching the Idol finale. Lil Jon came out – and I was hoping against hope to see our logo, or some sorta shout-out to save the Thrashers.

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
9:46 pm

This “TBS ownership equals great ownership” argument is laughably silly. It is amateurishly presented as a simplistic fait-accompli, but is actually steeped in utter ignorance.

Please provide an in-depth analysis of the expenditures and infrastructure provided for each of the sporting interests.

That’s just a start.

I have more variables for you before you can even begin to present a comprehensive case that the people of Atlanta failed the franchise.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:50 pm

That’s it…Lil John will be the local Saviour! Boy you folks are digging deep into the bottom of the barrel. It’s entertaining though, I’ll give you that.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:54 pm

Hey, Getthepuckouttahere you win you have proven you are the bigger Douche Bag, so I am going to let you get back to Trolling Thrasher message boards and watching the Soap Opera channel, while I have the third period of Bruins @ Lighting to watch.

ATLThrasher

May 25th, 2011
9:56 pm

Does the Peg have a lot of Sunshine Girls like Krista Erickson of Sun News Network, preferably single, to help out all the Thrashers players that are going to get divorced when they get moved to Winter-Peg?

Interesting trivia tidbit from the Flames move to Calgary is that the divorce rate amongst the player went up dramatically after they were move from the ATL to CowTown.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
9:58 pm

I didn’t win, I just proved you are a docuhe bag, and you won’t admit and you fail to accept the fact this team is leaving. Btw, it’s intermission in the game, I’m watching it. unlike you I can do two things at the same time. Nice chatting with you though.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
9:59 pm

Never said the team wasn’t leaving, it going to happen, still doesn’t change the fact that A$G is a lying bunch of A-holes, that you don’t know s**t and you are a multi-tasking douchebag troll.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
10:00 pm

Sage of Bluesland,

So TBS can win with the Braves but they were bottoms in the league with the Thrashers, and again it’s not the fans fault. Why would I have to “provide an in-depth analysis of the expenditures and infrastructure provided for each of the sporting interests”? Can you say why they were bad owners? Stop blaming everyone else. Stop making all these arguments. The more analysis you make me do the facts I come up with why it was the FANS that failed.

Before tonight I had no idea that you sold out so few games your first season. But someone made some claims, I looked at the facts, and now after running the numbers I can conclude that you couldn’t have sold out more than 30 games for your first 41 home game season in the league. How is that the owner’s fault? How is that management’s fault? Why do you need someone to show you TBS’s financials to see that you guys didn’t show up to the games your very first year in the league?

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:05 pm

Funny, that’s not what your sister is telling me.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:06 pm

Ooo, you think of that all by yourself? You’re really quick for a redneck.

TJ

May 25th, 2011
10:06 pm

Thrashers franchise leaves town, pro hockey is dead to me. ASG should be run out of town.

Old Time

May 25th, 2011
10:07 pm

Well if I had a sister, I think that is more like you, your dog and a jar of peanut butter, douchebag troll :)

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:12 pm

2 franchises come to town, 2 franchises leave town…this isnt’ a hockey town it’s a death wish for a franchise…a fate worse than death.

Billy Bob

May 25th, 2011
10:13 pm

Peg deal not done yet. Bettman still wants thrashers in Atlanta. 11th hour Atlanta group starting to get together. May meet with Bettman soon.

Thrashers27

May 25th, 2011
10:18 pm

Sir Hat Trick,

The Thrashers were owned initially by Turner Broadcasting, which was locally owned before the AOL merger. Then it was AOL/Time Warner. So, actually, once upon a time the team was locally owned. TNT and TBS are HQd in Atlanta.

Wolfman Chris

May 25th, 2011
10:18 pm

NHL=Not Here Long!

Wolfman Chris

May 25th, 2011
10:22 pm

The NHL will never be more than a cable channel league outdrawn by WWE wrestling…

ThrasherFan

May 25th, 2011
10:25 pm

These trolls are seriously annoying. I bet they are 13 and don’t even remember the Jets.

Moving on now – have to watch a southern team who doesn’t belong in the NHL destroy Boston.

thrasherdawg

May 25th, 2011
10:25 pm

Even though a deal gets done doesn’t mean the team is moving.

A buyer…which I hear is on the horizen…can still come in after the fact and keep the team in Atlanta. NHL says so. Take a guess to who it is.

Furthermore, if the A. Carter group is inclined, they could file a suit against the ASG & the NHL and get an “injuction” which could put this situation in absolute turmoil.

Bettman was only allowing this whole process to happen to cover his a*# …to get the 60 million, now it’s down to 40 million (that ASG is something). Maybe before it’s over, the NHL will get nothing…how classic. Bettman, a word of advice, never make deals with the devil.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:29 pm

That’s the best you morons have…Boston gets destroyed? I’ll do you one better – Next season Boston has a hockey team, sellout crowds and you won’t have either!! Put that in your pipe and smoke it Billy Ray Jim Bob! Btw…there’s 7 games in a series, but how would you know that, you’ got swept in your only playoff appearance by the frickin Rangers! Talk to me again when you’ve got better than Boston getting destroyed while your team is in the process of packing and leaving…for the SECOND TIME>>>> Losers.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:33 pm

oh, and it’s 5-4…DESTROYED? You must have gone to Ga. Public Schools.

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
10:36 pm

I’m sorry, but your assertions that this is entirely the fans’ fault is simply unconvincing. Try as you might to parse the data in your favor, you leave much room for reasonable doubt.

Your belief in assumptions are quite faulty–and foolhardy, to say the least. If you honestly believe that ’since TBS was a good owner with the Braves and they won’, then the same relationship must hold with its other sport entities, then you are quite naive and young.

But, there was a time when I was an idealist, as well, so I do understand. Ignorant? Yes. But, it is somewhat amusing to see these blunt-tools of “analysis” keep being presented ceaselessly…

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:37 pm

I’l be watching my team on Center Ice next season, just like this year, what will EX-Thrasher fans be doing? Still sitting here blaming ASG for losing a second franchise. BOO HOO!!! :(

lombardi

May 25th, 2011
10:40 pm

THRASHERFAN ; While 680, as usual, continues to suck, the ATL is no more a hockey town than Cleveland.

Getthepuckouttahere

May 25th, 2011
10:41 pm

If your definition of a troll is anyone who disagrees with you and can back it up, then half this thread will disappear. Deal with it. Freedom of speech pal!

OHL

May 25th, 2011
10:41 pm

Sage of Bluesland,

While you claim that “If you honestly believe that ’since TBS was a good owner with the Braves and they won’, then the same relationship must hold with its other sport entities, then you are quite naive and young” you then have to provide proof then that TBS was a bad owner. THAT, you don’t seem to be able to do.

Why was TBS a bad owner when you didn’t attend the games of the team they owned?

Keep Hockey in Atlanta

May 25th, 2011
10:42 pm

“Freedom of speech pal!”

Someone fails at understanding what the 1st Amendment means.

ATLThrasher

May 25th, 2011
10:43 pm

“… One thing to be thankful for: There are few married veteran players on the Thrashers: When the Flames moved to Calgary in 1980, the divorce rate among players was crazy high. ”

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Atlanta/2011/05/21/pf-18177716.html

Not to get all factual and deal in reality like OHL does so well . . .

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
10:58 pm

But, I’m NOT the one making the claim that the fans are exclusively to blame–which is the foundation, as best as I can interpret, of your “analysis” (as you can likely tell, I use that term very loosely in your case).

You have yet to prove this assertion definitively with the scattered “evidence”, if you can call it that. I would more properly categorize it as simplistic assumptions and the workings of a fertile, if young, mind.

Al

May 25th, 2011
10:59 pm

I have to say sorry to you all for the chance of loosing your NHL team to Canada. I am in Canada and was searching the web to see what is going on with the sale. I rmember not to long ago when there was another Atlants team that went to Canada. Yes I am talking about the Calgary Flames back in 80-81 season. Back then you were able to keep the Flames for 8 great seasons. What was learned was that Atlanta still really needed a NHL Hockey Club so during Bettman’s “I gotta a feeling campaign” there was a need to put a team back in Atlanta in 99. Well since then there has been lock outs and well lets face it the economy has really been hit. There is so many excuses that could be used for the team going up for sale to it’s current owners group to ticket holders so on so on.

I grew up in Vancouver and was there for the expantion when they came to town in 71. What have I seen was a city that embraced them through the 70’s when they were mediocore @ best and then came the 80’s where we had our “Miracle on Ice” but found our team swept in 4 games by Mike Bossy and the rest of the New York Islanders. It takes time to build a team and I have to say with the tough economic times your team is up for sale. IAs an owner they look to make money and if revenues are down and cost of travel is up as well as everything else. Atlanta average ticket price $45.00 Vancouver average $62.08. You don’t have to be einstein to see that there is a noticable difference and considering right now our Dollar value is higher than the American Green Back.
In order for a team to be able to sustain in a market it has to be able to support it self.
If the Thrashers do move to Winnipeg remember to cheer for them regardless if they are in Canada or not, they were your team 1st.

Sage of Bluesland

May 25th, 2011
11:05 pm

Oh, and may I add this asinine comparison to the city of Columbus? I haven’t seen such foolish stretches of logic since apples were compared to oranges back in the day….

(for you young, ignorant, pups who actually may believe everything you read…)

hockey fan

May 25th, 2011
11:17 pm

bettman may be a problem but ownership is the real reason hockey failed here

Billsen

May 25th, 2011
11:18 pm

“I don’t know about Winnipeg. I don’t think the guys (players) want to go because (Atlanta) is a great city. When we made the playoffs here a couple of years ago this city (Atlanta) was buzzing. We sold out every game. At some point ownership has to do something.” – Ilya Kovalchuk (AFTER he joined the Devils.)

Oh, and for the record, tonight’s score:

“Non Traditional Hockey Market in the South”: 5
Team that averaged 1600 less than the Thrashers in 2006-07″: 4

Bring on Game 7.

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
11:19 pm

Said it before and I’ll say it again. Cases like “get the puck” and “OHL” are only here to rub our noses in it, while in the midst of losing our Thrashers. By bashing the fans (in our darkest hours), it gives them some sort of sick, perverted happiness. I suspect that these two have some sort of deep rooted emotional issues, since they continually feel the need to bash Thrasher fans. Perhaps “daddy” didn’t hug them enough when they were kids, they got picked on in school, were always last in sports, etc. We may be losing our hockey team, but these two have lost their dignity.

OHL

May 25th, 2011
11:21 pm

Sage of Bluesland,

Both Atlanta and Columbus came into the league the same year, both have 1 playoff appearance, neither won a playoff game, I think it’s apples to apples to compare Columbus to Atlanta in terms of what you want an NHL market to look like. But to see how Columbus supported the team very well right from the start and to this day still has shown great interest in hockey. Atlanta on the other hand can’t provide proof of either of those things.

I would also like to know, why didn’t Atlanta support NHL hockey when TBS owned the team? Can you tell me that Sage of Bluesland?

Mark

May 25th, 2011
11:22 pm

Reality check: the Thrashers lowest average attendance for any season in Atlanta is higher than the Winnipeg Jets average attendance during their last season in Winnipeg in 1995-96

Thrashers addict

May 25th, 2011
11:29 pm

As a person who lives in Atlanta but previously lived in Canada for many years I would like to let everyone know that most Canadians are very nice and friendly. The majority of Canadians posting on this site are giving the rest of the citizens a bad name. I am embarrassed that these people are representing a great country in such a pathetic manner. I hope to have the Thrashers remain in Atlanta, there are arguements on both sides that are valid. It hurts any hockey fan to see their team leave regardless of the reason but to represent your country in a such a demoralizing manner lacks class.

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:33 pm

Mark… dumbass… everyone knew the team was moving that year. did you expect a sellout ?
no, instead it was like a braves playoff game… plenty of seats available

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
11:34 pm

Nobody EVER went to the jets games, it is why it was just not practical for the city to build a facility for the poorly supported team..

OHL

May 25th, 2011
11:34 pm

“We sold out every game”

Oh man, there were only 2 games!! I would hope you could sell BOTH of them out.

“Team that averaged 1600 less than the Thrashers in 2006-07″

That’s great, you only had to go back 4 years to find when that last happened. Instead of using years to point that out, you should’ve said “team that only had lower attendance than the Thrashers once this decade” Oh wait, maybe something else. How about “team that got 14 times the Nielsen rating of the Thrashers this year” No, that doesn’t sound too good either.

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
11:35 pm

The only thing “traditional” about the loserpeg market is they traditionally do not show up for pro-hockey..

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:36 pm

oh wait, that’s Glendale

my bad

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:39 pm

last team out of Asslanta turn out the lights

G52PIM228

May 25th, 2011
11:40 pm

loserpeg had 190 million for a CFL stadium but NOTHING for the jets..

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:44 pm

wish we had an owner for our team

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:44 pm

I heard the chicken hawks are going to leave asslanta too ?
we could use a 2nd NBA team in the valley

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
11:46 pm

You can have ours.

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
11:49 pm

Hawks won’t leave. Our mayor would actually do something to keep them.

Big Wally

May 25th, 2011
11:52 pm

You had Joe Johnson once and we got him. The rest couldn’t tell you what state Glendale is in.

G52PlM228

May 25th, 2011
11:54 pm

I hear the players would rather play in glendale than atlanta.

RC

May 25th, 2011
11:55 pm

I’m glad mayor Reid wasn’t dumb and pay a niche sport 25 million to run a league-owned team lol!

Big Wally

May 26th, 2011
12:00 am

Actually I blame Phoenix for this whole Thrasher mess. If Phoenix would have resigned Joe Johnson, the Hawks wouldn’t have signed him. If the Hawks didn’t sign him, then there wouldn’t have been a lawsuit between the owners. No lawsuit, would have meant more money to put into the Thrashers instead of attorneys. Thrashers would have then kept Heatley and Kovy and won the Stanley Cup. Ok, it’s time for bed.

G52PlM228

May 26th, 2011
12:00 am

well 50 million now, but what’s your point ?

Brian

May 26th, 2011
12:01 am

I’m from Winnipeg and am sorry to see a city lose their team, but am I ever stoked about getting one again. I would rather have had the one that was taken from us in the first place, but yours will do. We promise to take good care of them.

Sir Hat Trick

May 26th, 2011
12:11 am

Thrashers27,

Technically, that’s not correct. Turner Broadcasting was acquired by Time Warner in October, 1996. Three years before the Thrashers hit the ice. Atlanta wasn’t awarded the franchise until June, 1997, a delta of 8 months. Obviously Ted Turner spearheaded the bid to acquire the franchise prior to the acquistion by Time Warner, but the actual founding of the team did not occur until after Time Warner controlled Turner Broadcasting. The franchise then obviously fell under the same Braves/Hawks/Thrashers sports umbrella, but Ted Turner did not have the open checkbook authority to spend on these teams after the merger like he did during the overspending Andy Messersmith/Bruce Sutter “heydays” with the Braves. Ultimately, a bean-counter outside Atlanta made the bottom-line team budgeting decisions. And after the Time Warner/AOL merger, the franchises became even less of priority on the corporate balance sheet. Thus, the Thrashers eventually becoming the sacrificial lambs of the ASG.

The whole point of my post was to counter the incorrect assumption by the Huguenots posting here that the Thrashers have always been locally owned (locally HQ’d and locally owned are two different things) and well-funded, and thus the failure of the franchise was due to other factors…ie, the fans. That is simply not true. The Thrashers failed here because (pick any ownership group: Time Warner, AOL and ASG) simply didn’t give a rip. However I sincerely believe that had Ted Turner remained autonomous, if for no other reason than because of his competitive nature, the Thrashers would have least been able to compete with the same resources being invested by other owners in other market.

Bottom line for any Atlanta sports team: if team ownership consistently demonstrates they are either not interested in winning, or have no idea how to win, the average fan (of any sport) in this town easily tunes out. The Falcons are a prime example. I disagree with the prevailing thought that the Smith’s didn’t care when they owned the Falcons. They definitely cared, but could never bring together all the elements needed to produce a winner. Anyone who has lived in this city for any amount of time can tell stories of more tumbleweeds than fans at Falcons games in Fulton County, and later at the Georgia Dome. Just like the Thrashers today, the Falcons had a hard-core group of fans, but they (we!) were virtually outnumbered by “Dunwoody 49ers” in the Stadium during the 80’s. And “Jonesboro Cowboys” in the Dome during the 90’s. The general Atlanta sports fan was just as ambivalent towards the Falcons at that time as they are towards the Thrashers today. But thankfully for us all, a local guy who GAVE A CRAP bought the Falcons and made a commitment to the fans that his team would be well-managed with the only ultimate goal being the Super Bowl. Since Blank took over the Falcons we haven’t always been good (PETRINO!), but NEVER did Arthur Blank ever insult the fanbase and tell them to “deal with it”. Even in hard times, you had the sense better days were inevitable. And that’s all a fan of any team ultimately really needs to maintain faith and the expenditure of precious dollars: Hope.

The ASG kicked Thrashers fans hopes in the nuggets on Day 1 and never ceased. And that’s why we’re here today enduring taunts from a bunch of frogs.

Thrashers addict

May 26th, 2011
12:26 am

still a disgrace to the country of Canada

ATLThrasher

May 26th, 2011
12:43 am

The divorce rate issue for players is relevant cuz it can affect the quality of player that goes to Winter-peg. It is going to be a harder sell to attract top talent to small markets than to larger markets like Vancouver, NYC, L.A., Montreal, etc.

Just ask Gretzsky that moved from Edmonton to L.A. to NYC after marrying a Hollywood actress.

BTW, the Winnepeg posters that show politeness and tact are much appreciated by this Thrashers fan at least.

The other Peg posters with etiquette issues are duly *ignored*. Sorry . . .

Thrasher Hi-life

May 26th, 2011
12:48 am

Does anyone have a good link to the history of the Spirit Group Ownership? This is a fasinating case study in stupid business practices

ATLThrasher

May 26th, 2011
12:59 am

BTW, I think an owner of Arthur Blank quality with Dmitroff type GM running the team would have put the Thrasher on par with teams like Nashville and Tampa Bay with the commiserate game attendances, local TV ratings and financial strength.

The only big difference between traditional hockey markets and new Sourhern markets is that there not much room for error for mis-management before the team’s first Stanley Cup Finals series appearance.

sobaka

May 26th, 2011
1:05 am

Hey Billy Bob, Thrasherdawg, and Hillman: Is this Anson Carter rumor just a last-minute ditch to give Thrasher fans some reason to hope, or is there some credence to it? As for all you Atlanta-bashers: no city would have supported the Thrashers any better had they been your team. As for OHL, I live in Ohio and have followed hockey far longer than you. I’ve gotten significantly discounted tickets on many occasions, and no question that the attendance figures at many CBJ games have been grossly inflated. There is no point in trying to humiliate Thrasher fans who have stuck with the team through all of this. When hockey came in as a new sport in 1999 and offered not a sniff of respectability save one playoff year, then it’s hard to find fault with the fans. Also note that CBJ season ticket holders fell of by 25% last year, so don’t act like Cowtown is the second coming of hockey town.

MB

May 26th, 2011
1:11 am

A few comments here:

1) Atlanta is not a hockey town. Sorry, but it’s not. Hockey is the 5th most popular sport here following college football, NFL, MLB, and NBA. The percentage of residents who would rank hockey as their favorite sport is relatively low. The opposite is true in Canada, where there is really only one professional sport…okay, 1.5 (CFL). Average Thrashers attendance increased noticeably following football season, and suffered significantly on days when either college or pro football was played.

2) For an NHL team to prosper here, it has to win and the populace has to perceive that it’s being run the “right” way, I assume similar to MLB or NBA in Canada. This is where the Thrashers and the ASG (and AOL/TW) failed. In its inaugural season, the team averaged 17,206, about 93% of capacity at Philips Arena (and better than places with “good” fans such as Boston, Chicago, Pittsburgh, Calgary, Edmonton, and Vancouver). Once the novelty wore off, the team had little success and faith in ownership/management waned, and not surprisingly attendance fell.

3) Winnipeg, I wish you and the Thrashers/Jets/Falcons (really?) well, but you’re going to have to do better than last time. Unlike the well-documented rally of 35,000, Jets games averaged just over 13,000, about 85% of capacity (and only 3 of 11 sellouts in playoff games?). With MTS Centre only holding 15,015 (is that correct?), you’ll need to sell out every single game just to be 26th in the NHL in attendance. BTW, we’ve averaged more than that 6 seasons here. And no more 8,000 for a playoff game like in ‘86 (was that held at a high school?).

4) For OHL and his comparisons of ATL to Columbus, hey, give Columbus credit…from 2000 to 2003 they ranked in the top half of NHL attendance, better than some traditional markets and even Canadian markets such as Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, and Ottawa. From ‘06-’08 attendance numbers in the two markets were very comparable, and this year the two finished 27th and 28th in the league. Population-wise Atlanta should outdraw Columbus, though you’d also have to take into consideration the presence of greater competition here (NFL, MLB, NBA, and, of course, sunshine).

I hate to see us lose the NHL for a second time, though I think it’s inevitable. I’ll try to support the Gladiators, but truthfully they’ve been so bad when I’ve gone, it’s almost painful to watch. I anticipate some road trips to Nashville and maybe even Raleigh for a hockey fix now and then. Who knows, maybe I’ll eventually make it up to Winnipeg for a game…maybe when they’re playing Calgary.

OHL = Formally Known As Earl of Bud

May 26th, 2011
1:22 am

trolling away again in Thrasherville

Brian

May 26th, 2011
1:36 am

In Winnipeg, when the jets left attendance wasn’t the reason the team couldn’t remain profitable. Winnipeg enterprises owned the arena and leased it to the Jets. The team never got profits from the concessions or other attractions the arena had. (concerts and other revenue generating events) They got ticket sales and team jersey sales only. The Canadian dollar was about $0.62 US and no salery cap. For teams today the building is what makes money and all the tenants, with all the ticket and concesions. If you don’t own the team and the building you won’t be profitable. It’s happening right now in Edmonton, new owner wants a new building because being a tenant of Northlands (the group thats owns the arena) means he doesn’t get the profit from the money events. And being a tenant won’t make a profit. The thrashers had a deal to stay in the building for so many years along with your basketball team, to pay the massive cost of the building. But with no TV revenue and low attendance, the Thrashers are a drain on the deal. Their opperating cost are to high and cost the building money rather than add to the bottom line. It all comes down to billionares ego, they want to own a sports franchise to show off to their billionare friends, all at the expence of sports fans. I know what this feels like. It sucks!

Columbus

May 26th, 2011
1:52 am

NHL hockey will be back in Atlanta. I do not care what others think, it will be when the economy turns around in 5 plus years. The ownership is the key and it must be an owner like Arthur Blank who knows business and knows people and will hire the RIGHT people and who will SPEND money. You cannot only make the PLAYOFFS ONCE in 11 years and have people in the seats. I do not care what people say about the attendance in the early years or the NHL lockout. It comes down to having a team to get EXCITED about who also can make the playoffs frequently. You have to win baby! You also MUST have some big names people want to see play. Thrashers got rid of the only names they had. Oh an by the way Heatley did kill his teammate although it be indirectly. He was at fault for the death of his teammate indirectly as it was caused by his unintentional actions.

Kelly

May 26th, 2011
2:13 am

thrasher27: Chris is using a long-accepted practice in journalism of using sources who speak on the condition they not be identified. Mark Felt would never have been Deep Throat and Nixon may never have been exposed had Felt not trusted Woodward and Bernstein to not identify him.

Just because Chris can’t tell you who the sources are doesn’t necessarily mean he’s not being honest about their existence or what they are telling him. If he outed them, they would stop giving him any information at all. And then you, faithful reader, have only ‘official’ communiques to go by. Without anonymous sources, Big Brother wins.

BPhil

May 26th, 2011
2:37 am

OHL- “I would also like to know, why didn’t Atlanta support NHL hockey when TBS owned the team? Can you tell me that Sage of Bluesland?”

Lets clear something up first: Turner Broadcasting Systems never actually owned the Thrashers. As Sir Hat Trick notes, TBS merged with Time Warner in 1996, the Thrasher’s inaugural season wasn’t until 1999. I guess you could credit TBS and Ted Turner with getting the NHL to award a franchise to Atlanta, but as far as funding the team, day-to-day operations, etc., Ted and TBS really did not have a say as Sir Hat Trick once again noted (good post, btw).

Anyway now that we have that cleared up, back to your question OHL. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong but I’m pretty sure Time Warner only owned the Thrashers for tax reasons. Note that during the time Time Warner owned the Braves, payroll was cut significantly. So if TW wasn’t going to invest in arguably Atlanta’s flagship sports team (sorry guys, I realize this is a hockey blog, but I think you guys would agree) why would it make the Thrashers a top priority? To answer the question it didn’t, so as soon as TW had exhausted all the tax benefits the Thrashers (and the Braves and Hawks, for that matter) provided them TW promptly dumped them to their prospective owners.

Just wondering, OHL, but why are you giving TBS/TW/whatever all the credit for the Braves winning? Doesn’t John Schuerholz (spell check? Sorry John) or Bobby Cox deserve any of the credit? I know you like doing research OHL so if you look into it you might find that the Braves didn’t start winning until Ted Turner hired some competent people to (let them) do their jobs and run that team the right way. And that makes me wonder why Don Waddell is escaping all this finger pointing? He was there at the start and was given the keys by BOTH TW and ASG to run the Thrashers. Beats me, I guess. Also it should be noted that Atlanta Fulton County Stadium could have been mistaken for a ghost town until that turnaround happened, and the Braves were cellar-dwellers (a couple of exceptions, but for the most part) for twenty years previous to that. When the Braves started winning the fans started coming, how ironic.

OHL I’m sorry if that was a roundabout way to answer your question but TW never cared about the Thashers, and it didn’t care about the Braves either-Ted Turner did. The Braves flourished when they had a local, passionate owner. The same thing now with the Falcons (irony is everywhere). Are you catching on, OHL? Passionate ownership = success, or at least an ecouraged fan base.

Fans are not to be blamed for this situation, we support what we believe in. If ASG/TW/Don Waddel gave us a reason to believe, we wouldn’t be talking about this right now. Atlanta is not a bad sports town, we would support a MLS or even a MLL team if the ownership gave a darn about what he/she was doing.

So give credit where credit is due, OHL, and blame where blame is deserved. I’m sorry this was such a long answer, and I look forward to your reply.

Chris

May 26th, 2011
6:19 am

Thrasherfan,

680 the Fan and 790 the Zone definitely bear some responsibility in not covering the Thrashers with the same intensity and professionalism as other pro sports. If I had a dime for every time they ran a sports blast the day after a Thrashers game and didn’t even give the score I’d buy the team myself.

The final straw for me was this year the day after the Thrashers were eliminated from the playoffs they didn’t even give the score, but they lead off with a recap of the Braves SPRING TRAINING game!

Whomever the programming director is at 680, he needs to go, nobody gives a rip about a Braves spring training game and its obvious that they spend way too much time covering the Braves because they have a deal to air the games. They should just change the name of the station to “680 the Braves”.

blazerdawg

May 26th, 2011
6:25 am

Hold out for $200M+ ASG – they want the Thrashers bad and can taste it – don’t give them away – try to make it one more year and let us fill Philips Arena.

Bring back Custance

May 26th, 2011
7:06 am

the ASG is sadly the best thing we Thrasher fans have goin for us. They can’t agree on anything and if this were a done deal, it’d obviously be done now wouldn’t it? The longer it drags out, the more of a microscopic hope we fans can have. C’mon ASG, start suing each other.

I don’t buy the Anson Carter stuff, sounds more like Canadian media, believe it or not, who knows type of stuff. Even if the offered amount was valid, that is fairly low for a basketball franchise that makes the playoffs, a hockey franchise + a serviceable arena. Just sayin’..if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is, not to mention the fact that again, buyers are dealing with the ASG..not all of the ‘Spirit’ even want to sell all 3, thus the problems..thus it drags out and hopefully we few but loud Thrasher fans get our wish.

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
7:14 am

Oh look who’s here from Glendale G52 you horse’s kock you. Tells all the Winnipeg fans were trolls when we try and intelligently discuss his team, then comes on here to spout crap. I saw a post by this worm last week here saying Atlanta doesn’t support their team. One word comes to mind Hypocrite. You loser. Truth is clown can’t trust two faced slime bag Americans Like YOU. The rest of you, your all good. This board has a 1000 times more class then the boneheads I dealt with on the Glendale rag. Just a bunch of desert hillbillie’s straight up. Drop dead G52.

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
7:18 am

Oh yeah G52 must suck cheering for a rental team. Glendale can cover the loss’s for a few more years then bettman wil move them out of there. L.V Kansas maybe even Quebec. And you’ll be stuck with the bill and no team. Watch and see if it does not happen. Seriously wish this tunred out the other way around cause the fans I ran into in Atlanta were a classy bunch compared to the losers at the yotes games, drinking too many 1 dollar beers. G52 is a fool!!

Bomb Canada

May 26th, 2011
7:34 am

Winnipeg fans are here to discuss the team they are poaching? Who knew!??!
Funny how it’s the same Canadian fans who hated the Thrashers months ago before this was public, now you vow to worship them.

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
7:58 am

And G52 from Glendale the laughing stock of the NHL cities, your still a worm.

Bomb Canada

May 26th, 2011
8:10 am

@And for you bomb Canada your a tool

..sorry egg, I stopped right there as I refuse to bombard you with wit and the understanding of basic grammar in which you obviously lack. Try again. Oh wait, you did.

G52PlM228

May 26th, 2011
8:48 am

asslanta wishes they were glandale
sports capital of the USA

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
8:51 am

Yeah hide behind your keyboard little boy. I have done two tours in Afghanistan (No thats not north of St Louis simpleton) and fought alongside many excelent brave american soldiers. We had each others backs many times and I consider them friends. you on the other hand i would let one of those rag heads drop you on the spot, Oh sorry I was not paying attention. You represent your country well, my simple little friend, good luck for your Grade 7 math test, hope you get your C+ Your a tool face it, even your mother told me.

G52PlM228

May 26th, 2011
9:13 am

i’d be more impressed if you did 2 tours in East St. Louis.
wimp

Craig

May 26th, 2011
9:14 am

Thrasher Fan has made the best points on the failure of this organization I have seen. Every media outlet in this town has a large share of the blame when it comes to coverage. many a night when the game was not televised I had a hard time getting the score or after game report from the AJC. Usually the game report wasfrom the A/P and not local. On local stations the Thrashers were usually a “oh, by the way” story. Between ownership not caring, local media not caring (until the past 3 weeks) and the fans not wanting to spend big money to see a consistantly losing team who can blame the NHL for shipping this team out of Atlanta? I think we have seen the last of the NHL in Atlanta and that is a shame.

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:14 am

Bomb Canada goes by the name of AYF4 on the ArizonaCentral.com boards or thru the Arizona Republic website.

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:16 am

G52PIM228 uses G52PIM228ver2 on the same board as AYF

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:21 am

I apologize on behalf of Arizona for their existance

Bomb Canada

May 26th, 2011
9:28 am

Amazing how some pubescent little worm knows someone’s nationality by the text they type on a comment board. Wrong.

..not to mention you spew about someone being a “simpleton”..here’s one genius: You + are = you’re, tool. Now tell me how smart you are, basic grammar isn’t your strong suit, nor is intellect. Seriously don’t play the “smart” card..I’ve forgotten more than you’ll ever learn about anything.

@Beans

wrong. unlike most of you i’ve posted on this comment board for years and years. i’m an actual thrasher fan.

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:28 am

Feel free to give them a taste of their own medicine on their own board
http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coyotes/

Bomb Canada

May 26th, 2011
9:32 am

^ unlike you parasites most of us regulars here ..stay here, talking about OUR team.

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:34 am

liar
you’re busted !!
and your side kick G52PIM228

Spilling The Beans

May 26th, 2011
9:36 am

I understand you don’t want anyone returning the favor at your board. Too late now troll

Billsen

May 26th, 2011
9:54 am

A troll by any other name is still a troll. No apology needed Spilling the Beans.

What is annoying about this is that the trolls simply won’t acknowledge certain truths. The fact is this: As a rule, if a team fails to produce on the ice (or any playing field), fans become disenchanted. Couple that with a lack of effective marketing and community outreach (PR/Media coverage), and it is easy for a team to become and after thought. That then feeds on itself in a negative way – the media can make the argument that they don’t cover the team as much because the fans don’t care. Fans can make the argument that they don’t follow the team because it isn’t covered.

To further this notion – it is a well known FACT that when Chicago’s owner refused to allow local broadcasts of home games, it limited the Blackhawks appeal to the diehards. (I lived there in 96-97, so I have much first hand knowledge of this – even if I did take advantage of that apathy to get tickets when ever I wanted to go.)

Of course, all that changed with the passing of “Dollar Bill” Wirtz. Games get on TV, fan interest in recharged, they have more $$ to work with, draft well, sign free agents, and voila, they win the Cup last year.

Also in very recent memory – Pittsburgh was coughing up blood, LAST in the league in attendance, bankruptcy, and everyone (I’ll admit, including me) thought they were going to be moved to Kansas City – even with Lemieux’s 11th hour purchase wasn’t enough, and they had to trade Jagr and Kucera for prospects and about $5Million. The bleeding continued while they got Malkin and Crosby. New CBA comes into play, and they can compete with a cap. The rest, you probably know.

I’ve already mentioned the years when that other Original Six team, the Bruins were also sucking wind at the gate when they missed the playoffs and were not performing too well in the middle of the last decade, but when they get back to winning? People came out.

This isn’t rocket science, OHL and the rest of the trolls – it is reality. With very few exceptions fans are not eager to support losers on the field or owners who don’t care. However, when those aspects change, then the fans get excited and put the $$ on the line.

And that is a fact.

VivlaPeg

May 26th, 2011
9:59 am

it must be incredibly difficult to switch monikers on here.

Kevin

May 26th, 2011
10:21 am

Its so nice when the Mayor of atlanta back said we Need keep this NHL team here..Now u new stupid Mayor sayin Bye Bye no wonder people movin out now…As for why we goin what broadcast coverge hell u barely get reports from channel 2 n 5 and 11 and 46…unless they movein.What hurt was we not honor any former Flames players there at all we did have Boom Boom Geffion…But to have former team to start are 1st year was a bad idea by NHL start with.And fact never seen owners at hockey game in there suites they to buzy with Don(Teflon) Waddell to his 12 year plan to Move out ….enjoy u new home Don Waddell that why detroit was laughin when we pick u nose to GM here and also u were a Loser coach who fired best coach in Hartlywhy fire after 6 games u jerk! Rest in piece and take 680 the Fan to winipeg to!

taudawg

May 26th, 2011
10:22 am

Nah, Heatley did kill Synder. When you get behind the wheel of a car a break laws, you are personally responsible.

Heatley killed Synder. Sugar coat is all you want.

schmeckdawg

May 26th, 2011
10:25 am

@Billsen

2nd paragraph, 2nd sentence, that is all that needs to be said. You either get good or your get gone PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!! This franchise has sucked for 10 out of the 11 years that they have been here. Waddell and the ASG are a freaking joke. So what even remotely is out there to say that if they stayed, there would be ANY improvement.

Great call!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

schmeckdawg

May 26th, 2011
10:26 am

taudawg

You are 100% correct…sorry Trista!

RCH2011

May 26th, 2011
10:32 am

A few points….
-Who is the captain of the team? How are you going to establish a fanbase when every other year the GM trades the captain, who SHOULD be the face of the team.

-The arena? Phillips is a lousy arena. The brainfart of putting all the luxury boxes on one side and shoving the real fans up the other into the stratosphere makes it a horrible fan experience. By comparison, look at the glowing reviews Staples and Pepsi got when they opened.

-The GM? Waddel should have been gone YEARS ago. How many stars and potential stars has he traded away? How many captains has he traded away? How many ‘past their prime’ players has he traded for? HE has done more to hurt the franchise than anyone.

-The fans? Atlanta historically has the worst fans in the country, due largely to a history of some of the worst teams in the country. When you look at sports history in Atlanta, it’s no wonder it has become the fair weather capital of the the world. 2 championships in how many pro seasons, and one of those was the Knights, who we ran out of town to make room for the Thrashers!

-Media support? What support?!

Goodbye Thrashers.

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
10:43 am

So we have G52 and AY4 two of the biggest clowns in Glendale. Where’s Global delusion? How about Ditsy that sack of monkey spunk? All of you are hypocrites, keep hiding behind your keyboards you warriors you. Crap all over my country, my city for questioning why no one wants to buy the Yotes with there own money so they poke fun at teh fact we just had a major flood here in Winnipeg.Class act you guys!!

Spilling The Beans thanks for pointing out these slugs for what the are. Scumbags. As for G52 don’t ever come up here, we don’t want America’s discards and thats all you are. Waste of Amercian air. Thats it thats all. Unreal. Oh and to the fine Professor, thanks for the grammar points like I give a rip enough to sit and proof my entry. Who care’s. I don’t

DawgDad

May 26th, 2011
11:17 am

I normally don’t hold grudges or ill will toward people, but I’m making an exception in the case of ASG. Justice would be well served by them getting tied up in court until all of their profits evaporate. The NHL could use a $60 million drain on their bank account, too.

Not likely to EVER see me at a Hawks game. I used to be a die-hard Hawks fan and attended many games, growing up in St. Louis.

Reptile

May 26th, 2011
11:17 am

If the Thrashers leave, I’ll never attend ANYTHING at Philips Arena as long as the ASG owns it… what a joke.. spent the last god knows how many years suing eachother. Idiots.

bail out

May 26th, 2011
11:33 am

A 35.3% relocation fee? Rip Offs still exist. Hope the check bounces.

Stick Together

May 26th, 2011
11:36 am

All events at Phillips Arena should be boycotted from here on out.

Maybe that will teach the unprofessional and greedy ASG a real lesson.

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
11:43 am

So still no team in loserpeg..

SHOCKING..

THRASHERS FOREVER!!

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
11:48 am

When do you think the announcement of the NHL returning to Winnipeg will happen?
Wednesday 3%
Thursday 11%
Friday 20%
Next week 29%
Never 33%

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
11:51 am

All this ends with all the Americans joining all Canadians in laughing at stupid little loserpeg..

THRASHERS FOREVER!!

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
11:51 am

I’m pretty sure the NHL is no more interested in moving teams to Canaduh than I am..

THRASHERS FOREVER!!

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
11:53 am

Most people are horrified to learn that baby seals have their skulls smashed in or are shot to death each year during Canada’s annual war on seals. So how will your friends and family members find out about the slaughter and how to help stop it? You need to tell them!

http://www.canadasshame.com/Stop.aspx#online

Jimmy

May 26th, 2011
11:58 am

Love Georgia,.!!!!! Don’t listen to the rust belt holdouts..They all wanna be in the south but food stamps don’t buy travel.. Love pictures of them in the winter and its not hockey on their minds..all and all, feel sorry for them.Hockey is all they got..”THANK GOD I”M FROM THE SOUTH”…

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
12:05 pm

I’m begging to get the impression that 2 years of relentlessly making fun of stupid Canadian snow monkeys has made a few of them mad..

Snow monkeys love their frozen wasteland environment..

pegger 36

May 26th, 2011
12:08 pm

announcement of move will be made day after tomorrow (saturday).

G52..is the your I.Q.?

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
12:10 pm

“announcement of move will be made”

Brunt, is that you..

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
12:11 pm

Are you mind numb idiots really going to bring back that stupid funking picture of the Queen..

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=capress-hkn_winnipeg_jets_queen-6960238

Oh wait the Thrashers are not moving to loserville, so it is just more presumptuous garbage from the insane minds of snow monkeys..

OHL

May 26th, 2011
12:40 pm

BPhil,

I got through most of that answer, but it still doesn’t add up. Your claims of “tax breaks” just don’t add up and seems extremely unsupported, not to mention a company that size just doesn’t go loose money like an individual would for a tax break. I still don’t see what you are claiming that TBS did so bad when they owned the team. Right out of the gate, you seemed to have mediocre attendance in year 1. There are only so many Mark Cubans to go around, 90+% of sports teams that succeed don’t have ownership that you claim is imperative. What exactly was TBS not doing that they should have done in their first year or two?

Egghead

May 26th, 2011
12:49 pm

G52 = Hugh Hypocrite Face it buddy your a loser, unfortunately for the true Thrahsers fans this is going to suck and I feel for them. Why them and not you G? Well its simple, they actualy have intelligent life in Atlanta and for the most part are not crapping on those of us who are here to discuss hockey. You can say whatever you want about my hometown because you don’t matter. You on the other hand when they move Yotes out of Gongdale after they spend 75 million renting them, now that will be epic. I will be on your small town clown rag to remind you Mr Smug. C u around. The bus runs by your tent at 2:30 be under it!!!

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
1:08 pm

@OHL:

“Right out of the gate, you seemed to have mediocre attendance in year 1.”

Attendance for First Year Clubs Since 1989-90:
ATL (1999-00): 17,206
ANH (1993-94): 16,938
CAR (1997-98): 9.086
COL (1995-96): 16,017
CBJ (1999-00): 17,457
DAL (1993-94): 16,119
MIN (2000-01): 18,328
NSH (1998-99): 16,202
OTT (1992-93): 10,485
PHX (1996-97): 15,604
SJS (1991-92): 10,888
TBL (1992-93): 10,014

“Mediocre,” really? I do not think that word means what you think it does.

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:11 pm

“I will be on your small town clown rag to remind you ”

I will put you on the list of 1000 other frozen peggers snow moneys that are just DYING to say “I told you so” to me..

I predict your stupidity will be no more effective in moving the Thrashers than it was the Coyotes..

OHL

May 26th, 2011
1:12 pm

Crass Bonanza, can you provide a source for those numbers please?

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:18 pm

Crass, you are wasting your time, relocationists only consider the NHL viable in frozen toilet bowls..

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
1:19 pm

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
1:21 pm

OHL, while you’re looking, seriously, take a look at some of the ups and downs of more established hockey markets. Pittsburgh, Washington, St. Louis, Chicago…the narrative that ATL is a lousy hockey town is oft repeated but specious. We even outdrew the Vancouver Canucks one year.

The bottom line is that most fans don’t flock to see/support bad teams, and few markets are immune to this basic truth (MTL, TOR, CGY, sure Canadian teams are usually well represented).

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:28 pm

Crass, understand this temporary blimp of Canadian “prosperity” is probably the only opportunity Canada will have to get back an NHL team in our lifetimes.. You have to figure they will make embarrassing exaggerations in the name of this insane quest, right..

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
1:29 pm

Anyone is free to answer this question:

Give me ONE valid reason why Atlanta, among all major North American markets, is uniquely unable or unqualified to support NHL hockey – especially when it works in smaller Sun Belt markets like Tampa, Carolina, and Nashville.

Could stable ownership and good hockey have *something* to do with it?

OHL

May 26th, 2011
1:33 pm

Crass Bonanza,

Interesting figures, but they still don’t look good for Atlanta. In Tampa Bay’s 2nd year in the league, they were #2 in attendance. 3rd year, again #2.

San Jose was #11 their 2nd year in the league. #7 their 3rd year in the league.

Columbus I have already covered. They were in the top 12 their first few years in the league.

Anaheim was #9 their first year, #8 their 2nd year.

Atlanta never cracked the top 20. Their 3rd and 4th years in the league they were #28 out of 30.

Again, you make me look up something and the evidence just shows that Atlanta couldn’t support a team as well as San Jose, Anaheim, Columbus or Tampa Bay.

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:34 pm

“Give me ONE valid reason why Atlanta, among all major North American markets, is uniquely unable or unqualified to support NHL hockey – ”

The only way to justify placing a team in such a tiny undesirable location is to degrade the market it comes from..

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:36 pm

Pretending attendance in these southern markets will never be more than 15,000 is a root LIE that renders ALL relocationist gibberish moot..

OHL

May 26th, 2011
1:42 pm

Crass Bonanza,

I think I already answered your question when I compare Atlanta directly to Columbus. Columbus supports hockey far better than Atlanta in terms of NHL attendance numbers and tv ratings in ways that they are competing with the rest of the league, Atlanta just beats out Miami or avoids being dead last.

While it is true that every other team in the league, whether it be expansion or established northern markets have had a down year here or there. But, they all seemed to have some good years that you can point to. Atlanta never had a good year in the league. That’s why other teams can have a few bad years, because they are good again eventually. Why couldn’t Atlanta have a few good years like Columbus has? You both had the same product. Columbus supported hockey at the beginning whereas Atlanta never did. They were always at the bottom in attendance and tv ratings.

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:42 pm

More than likely the Good Saint Bettman is dispelling the relocation myth because a consensus of BoG members is pointing to the Thrashers not moving, relocation, voted DOWN..

G52PIM228

May 26th, 2011
1:46 pm

Shoalts did a count of BoG types on loserpeg concluding, “They are not receptive”..

This was not widely reported, missed completely by big fat Gary the Walrus..

BPhil

May 26th, 2011
2:09 pm

OHL,

As far as the tax break issue goes, when Time Warner sold the Braves look into who they sold them to and why the new owner (corporation) bought them. And if that isn’t enough evidence for my point try to break it down yourself with evidence of the contrary rather than just saying it “doesn’t add up” or “is extremely unsupportive”. And I don’t understand why a large corporation wouldn’t go looking for any kind of tax relief as long as it is a feasible possibility because big corporations pay millions (sometimes even billions) worth of taxes to the government. So why wouldn’t large corporations try to make their assets non-taxable so they can save money? Because in this case the money that is saved would be enough to cover payroll (for more than one season) for that asset if that is the way the corporation chose to allocate the money.

Anyway you did make a good point about the shortage of the Mark Cuban type owners in the world. The point I was trying to get across was that as long as a team is managed with success as the goal then the fan base will respond. Time Warner’s first mistake was hiring Don Waddell to run the franchise but their biggest mistake was not investing any more than what they had to in the Thrashers. As other people have noted in this blog the Thrashers payroll was at or near league minimum this entire stretch and when it came time to lock up one of our stars we either shipped him off at the trade deadline (Heatley), or let him walk in free agency after low-balling him with our offer to keep him (Kovalchuck). And it wasn’t just the Thrashers, either. As soon as TW took control of the Braves they cut payroll back 20M and the Hawks operated in a very similar situation to the Thrashers. Lucky for the Braves they have great management and as for the Hawks, well, thats an issue for another blog.

The Thrashers as a franchise was not managed, and TW did not care. That is what they did wrong OHL. Along with the Braves, Hawks, and Philips Arena they were just another asset to put into their portfolio until another buyer came along so they could make a profit. The Thrashers got the short end of the stick because even their new owners didn’t care about them, which we new from day one when their first move was to keep Waddell at the helm.

Let me rephrase my formula: Competent management = success, or at least fan support. Not all management is lucky to have an owner with a bottomless checkbook, but competent management finds a way to win anyway. Don Waddell is not competent. And rather than trying to fix it, Time Warner showed just how much they cared by making it somebody else’s problem.

If you have any more questions OHL just let me know, I’ll be glad to answer them for you.

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
2:24 pm

@OHL,

Columbus has supported their team better than we have so far – no disagreement there.

To which I say: so what? Columbus has less competition for the sporting dollar – CBJs are the only thing that makes the city “major league,” and no, The OSU does not count. There are a million variables as to why one market is more supportive than another, few of which are permanent. A market’s fortune can rise or fall on the basis of one star (look how PGH’s attendance spiked after Crosby arrived and the team began winning again. Oh, and Mario’s stewardship as owner didn’t hurt).

Columbus > Atlanta for 12 years. Big deal. To think that’s instructive is to take a pretty narrow view of history. For the first 20 years of the AL, the Boston Red Sox won 5 World Series, the NY Yankees not even one pennant. Their fortunes, and no doubt their identities as baseball cities, reversed dramatically from 1920-2004.

Twelve years is but a tiny snapshot that proves little about Atlanta’s viability as a hockey city.

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
2:41 pm

@OHL,

One more thing. You say you answered my question when you compared Columbus to Atlanta, but I disagree. Saying “Atlanta hasn’t been as supportive as Columbus,” despite the superficial similarities between their situations, does not directly answer my challenge as to why NHL hockey can’t work here. It just demonstrates that Atlanta *hasn’t* supported hockey as well as Columbus, not that it *can’t* or *won’t.* I need something more valid than shaky inductive reasoning.

The thing is, Columbus’s attendance trajectory could very well invalidate your premise. You realize that CBJ attendance was about as bad as ours in 2010-11, right (13,469 for ATL, 13,658 for CBJ). Hypothetically, if the young Thrashers started winning and attendance rose to the point where we outdraw Columbus for 10 straight years, what does that suggest?

Since this *is* possible, your evidence is not based on first principles, and is thus invalid.

OHL

May 26th, 2011
3:22 pm

BPhil,

You said in a post earlier that “As far as the tax break issue goes, when Time Warner sold the Braves look into who they sold them to and why the new owner (corporation) bought them. And if that isn’t enough evidence for my point try to break it down yourself with evidence of the contrary rather than just saying it “doesn’t add up” or “is extremely unsupportive””

But that IS extremely unsupportive. I don’t know who the new owners of the Braves are, but just because they needed a tax break doesn’t mean TBS needed a tax break. What, TBS wasn’t losing enough money with CNN so they bought the Thrashers? You can’t argue that because someone else did something it proves that TBS did the exact same thing. And what did TBS do so awfully those first couple of years?

OHL

May 26th, 2011
3:25 pm

Crass Bonanza,

I have said this before and I’ll say it again – when you make the argument that “Columbus has less competition for the sporting dollar – CBJs are the only thing that makes the city “major league,” and no, The OSU does not count.” then you are making the argument that the Thrashers will do better in Winnipeg. Afterall, just like in Columbus, there is no competition for the sporting dollar in Winnipeg.

Crass Bonanza

May 26th, 2011
3:53 pm

@OHL,

“you are making the argument that the Thrashers will do better in Winnipeg. Afterall, just like in Columbus, there is no competition for the sporting dollar in Winnipeg.”

It’s possible they will but that does not follow from my argument. You are inferring from *one* plausible explanation why Columbus has supported NHL hockey better than Atlanta has, so far, that this is a valid, universally true principle. It is not. That’s reductionist and dumb. If it were true, Flin Flon would be a more “successful” market than NYC. Really, you think that’s my argument?

Reductio ad absurdum.

BPhil

May 26th, 2011
4:32 pm

OHL,

For your info., Liberty Media now owns the Braves. For a story regarding the tax advantages for both sides in the deal, just go to this article: http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_5214612

I never said that any corporation needs a tax break, but if you were the owner of a multi-million dollar corporation and an opportunity arose that could result saving millions of dollars worth of taxes, wouldn’t you do it? (The question is asked in retrospect, so no answer is needed from you).

And Time Warner never bought the Thrashers outright. The franchise was included in a package deal that included the Hawks and Philips Arena when Philips Arena was built (so Atlanta would have an arena that was capable of hosting both basketball and hockey events when the Thrashers came to Atlanta) so in effect they were more or less stuck with them. They acted like it too and couldn’t wait to get rid of them (sound familiar?). And I never tried to prove the Thrashers were part of some tax relief deal, I proved the Braves were. TW sold the Thrashers, Hawks, and Philips Arena to cut their losses because of the situation at CNN. They did not buy the Thrashers after the fact.

As for your last question, I’ve answered it in both my previous posts. So if you want to keep going around in circles and splitting hairs OHL I understand, but if you’re going to write like you know everything at least know what you’re writing about.

Peg trolls swallow

May 26th, 2011
8:15 pm

@ bio sen

“What is annoying about this is that the trolls simply won’t acknowledge certain truths.”

Don’t get annoyed. Would you be annoyed if you couldn’t teach a pig calculus?