“We’re not playing hard enough”, say the Hawks

Is that all it has really come down to? Every time you turn around, some guy wearing a Hawks jersey is saying, “we’re not playing hard enough.” Oh, wait just a second. I forgot the rest of what has become a sickening cliche. They’re not playing hard enough “…all the time.”

Really. Is that your final answer?

It’s amazing. A fan base that is constantly accused of not caring enough is now being told by the team’s players that apparently, they don’t care enough. For all the criticisms of the moves that the Atlanta front office made or didn’t make (for whatever reasons), nothing is as ominous as that which just keeps coming up in print after every game, win or loss. The assertion being made at the moment is that it’s not about what the Hawks can’t do, it’s about what they won’t do.  Now of course, your first indication might be to point to the Hawks’ record, which at 7-4, would not indicate that things are nearly as bad as we make them sound. That is, until you examine precisely who the Hawks have beaten, and in what fashion.

Let’s not push the panic button. Why? Not because it’s too early in the season. That would be the easiest cliche to latch onto. No, we don’t need to push the panic button because panic is what happens when that what you least expected and least predicted to happen, is exactly what happens. It’s when you have nearly every reasonable expectation of being safe, then finding out you’re in a lot of danger. Panic is when you don’t know what to do. But the Hawks swear up and down that they do know what to do. They just won’t do it…all the time.

 A mere eleven games into the season, Larry Drew sounds like a man who isn’t beaten yet, but you have to wonder just how much he can take. The man has listened to and observed the same issues for the last six years. Now, as head coach of the same crew, he has to find a way to convince a group of guys to do the very things they already seem to know that should be doing.

The Fault Line

Where do you place Larry Drew on the infamous “fault line?” Is he doing his job? Has he given the team a good guideline and gameplan? Despite the turnovers, which some would argue are a natural by product of the situation and obligatory learning curve, Drew’s offense seems to take better advantage of the team’s talents than we’ve ever seen before. With the exception perhaps of Jamal Crawford, guys “get theirs” without having to make a concerted effort to do so. In fact, it’s good enough to where some teams find themselves going to a zone offense just to slow Atlanta down. All during camp and preseason, everything out of the mouths of the players suggested that they were very pleased with the new offensive scheme. Okay, so then why deviate from it?

Defensively, Drew has decided against scheming to hide the abilities or efforts of some players, and simply holding guys accountable for defending. It doesn’t always work (the argument here is usually that it centers on ability), but there have been concerted flashes of effort from previously unlikely sources. So is Drew to blame here? What is he doing wrong?

Two guys need to be paying very close attention right now. Michael Gearon and Rick Sund. If you think the idea of the core of this team comes from Rick Sund, you might want to think again. Two theories abound here. Either Sund has come up with the idea of the core of Hawks players, and has sold Gearon on the concept…or the concept is Gearon’s , and Sund simply complies with his wishes, offering little or no input. Perhaps neither theory matters at the moment. What does matter is how much attention these guys are paying to what their players are saying and doing. Obviously the answer to the fan base during the offseason, was that the team as constructed merely needed a new guide. Now the new guide is saying some of the exact same things the old guide was saying. Again, didn’t the new guy bring a new plan? Didn’t the players say they liked the plan? Has there been any evidence to suggest that the new plan is ineffective or otherwise flawed?

All this time, we as fans screamed for changes, horrified at the efforts and results of last season’s playoffs. Sure, there was a lot of hollering about coaching, and that had plenty of merit on it’s own. But there was also a lot of hollering about the roster. Of course, that was when times got tough, especially at the end of the season. Here we are at the beginning of the season, and already the looks have started, with the finger pointing right around the corner. And the noise…the noise is coming from the players themselves.

Is this overreaction? Analyzing too early? Well, after which of the Hawks seven wins has there not been a caveat of some type attached, by the players themselves? Why all this noise from a group of guys with a winning record so far? And what ever happened to being one of the best home teams in the League? Seven games in, the Hawks are an even 3 and 3 at home, and 4 – 1 on the road. Should we rejoice in this?

 

HAWKS VS PACERS

Every year there seems to be a team that flies under the radar for a while, before coming up strong. Arguably, the Bucks were that team in the East before suffering the loss of starting center Andrew Bogut at the most inopportune of times. This year, the sleeper team is not what some would call a sexy pick. It’s amazing what an offseason will do for some teams, and some players. Everyone watches the wonder that is John Wall up in Washington, D. C. Chicago’s once bright future is in doubt with the loss of newly signed Carlos Boozer, and the fact that they still must lean too heavily on pg Derrick Rose. But what of Indiana?

No one on their squad short of Danny Granger gets any headlines, yet here the Pacers are, chugging along with a .500 record, not quite the one dimensional joke that they were last season. Indiana has only been truly blown out in one game, a 101-75 loss in Philadelphia back in early November. On the other end of the spectrum, they completely crushed Denver 144-113 about a week later.

Here’s the deal with Indiana – you can’t just game plan to contain Granger and let the rest of the guys do their thing. For the first time in a while, the Pacers have a fairly solid starting lineup. Guess what that means? They also have a somewhat viable bench, as the guys they were forced to start last year are now reserves. Let’s get into the key players.

Backcourt

The addition of Darren Collison to the Indiana lineup has given the Pacers a solid pg with some decent size and shooting capability. Collison has yet to show exactly where he belongs in the East pecking order of point guards, and doesn’t figure to be too very high in a field that boasts Derrick Rose, Rajon Rondo, John Wall, and other credible names (forgive me if I don’t mention them all). But, Collison has proven that last season was no fluke, when he filled in admirably for the injured Chris Paul in New Orleans. Third on the team in scoring and first in assists, Collison is shooting quite well from the field and adds some credible defense as well. Collison’s play allows the Pacers to bring the lightning quick but fragile TJ Ford off the bench, instead of burning him with starter’s minutes.

Point guard play isn’t the only thing that has improved Indiana, though. The return of guard/forward Mike Dunleavy gives them another legit perimeter threat with size. The heady Dunleavy can play the two or the three, and makes it even harder for defenses to key in on Danny Granger. As a result, Granger is shooting 48% from the field and 42% from beyond the arc, scary numbers indeed when you’re talking about a guy with his talent. But that’s not all. Dunleavy also defends a bit, and provides both passing and is a legit rebounder. Better yet, he allows the Pacers to choose between Dahntay Jones and Brandon Rush when deciding who to bring off the bench, rather than having to thrust either one into the starting backcourt.

The Frontcourt

Literally the biggest story for this franchise is the seemingly quite sudden transformation of center Roy Hibbert. Gone is the slow, soft, and largely ineffective first round project that we saw last season. In his place is a guy who is second on his team in scoring, first in rebounding, and someone who looks like he could keep New Jersey’s Brook Lopez from making the all-star team a second year in a row. Whatever Hibbert did in the offseason has paid off, and it’s showing even against the better front lines in the NBA, as his potential looks to be catching up with his size.

Beside Hibbert is the energetic, athletic, and physical specimen known as Josh McRoberts. He’s neither Troy Murphy nor Jeff Foster, but what McRoberts gives up in scoring talent and outright rebounding/toughness, he’ll make up for with hustle and effort. Behind him is Tyler Hansbrough, a smart hustler who shoots a very high percentage from the floor, and provides enough rebounding and effort when McRoberts inevitably gets into foul trouble.

Here’s the Deal

The Hawks are still more talented than the Pacers. I believe they’re still 10 to 12 points better on a given night, in which they play as they should. But the Pacers are on the cusp of proving to be a team that can’t be ignored or run roughshod over anymore. They’re healthier, they’re deeper, they’re experiencing some success, and they would like some more. If the Hawks lose focus in this game, they will lose this game, plain and simple. If they “don’t play hard enough”, I’ll wager that the Pacers will embarrass them. Now is not the time for this foolishness, and this ain’t Minnesota, where the talent pool alone all but guarantees a win for the opposing team.

Matchup to Watch – Al Horford vs. Roy Hibbert

Last season, Al Hoford made Roy Hibbert look like a draft bust, despite giving up a solid 4-5 inches and probably 40 pounds to the 7′2″ 280 lb center. Will the Hawks start Horford at center against Hibbert, and will it have the same results? Hibbert still gives up the quickness and ability to run the floor to Horford, but his improved game could be a load for Al on the other end of the floor. Could Hibbert force the Hawks to adjust the matchups?

For the sake of Afterthoughts – Jeff Teague vs. TJ Ford

Quick meets quick. Undeniably, Ford has the better jumpshot right now, but his quickness is a problem anytime he’s on the court. He’ll shoot past Bibby and make Jamal run through one screen too many, so maybe Teague gets another shot to make his presence felt here by keeping Ford from running the Hawks into the ground while Collison gets some rest. In fact, without such an effort, the Hawks could get into all sorts of trouble on the defensive end.

On the other side of the ball, Teague simply must improve his attack. The kid knows how to pass the ball, often to the right people and at the right times, but he continues to be no threat to score.

311 comments Add your comment

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:33 pm

And doc,

i do find it fascinating that the blazer fan called it right the next day

So are you saying that you know that his LLI caused or even contributed to his injuries? That’s pretty impressive considering that you never examined him.

doc

November 18th, 2010
2:36 pm

here is a quote from oden about how he has a limp if he doesnt wear orthotics:

http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/11/12/1810430/ian-thomsen-on-greg-oden

also some interesting comments further down about how the integrity of the body and its mechanics are screwed up on the guy.

limps are not a good thing in a person walking the street, a horse or an athlete, it can portend disaster especially if they are trying to run fast or make cuts quickly or heaven forbid jump and land correctly. if your horse limps, stop riding it same kind of goes for people. limps suggest it is structural and it stresses every joint up and down the body, head to toe. if you want a start up read on how important it is, read a book by pete egoscue, the egoscue method. it is in laymen’s terms, so most folks get it when they read it.

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:36 pm

Melvin,

It’s ok. Maybe you can go back to school for another year so that you can get to the level of reading comprehension where you’ll be able to grasp that “Melvin talks out of his ass” was, in fact, the point I was making. I doubt it, but maybe. It’s just plain sad that you are so dense that you don’t seem to understand that.

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
2:36 pm

No you didn’t hurt my feelings Nire. You are not in any position to hurt me. I really fine you to be laughable, how you get can get pissed off on a blog with people you don’t know personally b/c they dont agree with you. My life is too good to worry about what some say on a blog… Really, I got a GOOD Life man….

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:39 pm

Good find, doc. I hadn’t seen that article yet. That certainly seems to imply that his doctors expressed concern about his LLI causing injuries down the line. From what I understand about his past injuries, that wasn’t the direct cause, but that makes it sound like it affects him enough that it was a contributing factor,

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
2:39 pm

No school needed Nire. I have my degrees and my life is comfortable right now….

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:40 pm

That’s good, Melvin. Stupid people who make spelling, grammar, and punctuation errors every time they type (and who think that they can learn everything they need to know about basketball from looking at box scores) are entitled to happiness too. Ignorance is, after all, bliss.

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:41 pm

I’m glad, Melvin. It’s good to see that you’ve managed to find happiness despite being an idiot, and managed to find friends despite your tendency to talk out of your ass. That must not have been easy.

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
2:43 pm

But I didn’t make the spelling, grammar and punctuation errors when it count. So feel free to keep point that out on a blog….

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:44 pm

No problem, Melvin. You mean “counts” and “pointing.”

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:45 pm

Or, I suppose, “don’t make spelling . . . errors when it counts” or “didn’t make spelling errors when it counted.”

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
2:46 pm

Nire,

Exactly…

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:47 pm

In any case, I can live with typos. I make them myself. I don’t generally notice them, actually, so it really was quite petty for me to use that as an example. What is more worrisome is how much of a simpleton you are when it comes to basketball. To you, everything about basketball can be learned from a box score. How pathetic.

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
2:48 pm

Have a good day Nire. Gotta go, I have other things to do now…
lol

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
2:49 pm

Ok, Melvin. Wouldn’t want you to miss the shortbus.

Astro Joe

November 18th, 2010
2:56 pm

doc

November 18th, 2010
2:59 pm

nire i really try to be accurate in what i talk about, to the best of my abilities. i am a lot more comfortable talking about the body than contract law. ;-)

i know we differ on our opinions about management but i do have some background there as i was a management consultant before medicine so i am a bit more observant having seen how business’ are run close up and inside the organization. i saw it from a different side, more the productivity side, therefore we have disagreements there as well. my side was not as firm as the law so i understand if you dont perceive some of my insights as credible or even meaningful and that is all right. some are dead right some are dead wrong. in the field of human productivity it wasnt always black and white just as in medicine for example of, in leg length discrepancy, is it relevant.

ok, i will say this to clarify, could i perdict these injuires in oden? if that is your argument that you have been trying to make, uh no. if you change it to the more appropriate in the case of oden, if i am going to spend big bucks on the guy ….would i have signed off on his health that he would not have a higher predictability of having problems, uh not on your life. a horse trader i am not and i would not have put my medical credibility on the line with such a statement. even then i backed up the guy on the blog who was being guffawed at how we are want to do when he brought up the leg length issue because they truly did not know of what they spoke.

glad to have found the article and glad you took the time to check it out. it was pretty topical and timely.

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
3:15 pm

Fair enough, doc.

Really, I think what lies at the root of my gripe about people’s beef with the ASG is not even when they call them “cheap.” It’s when they say they are “poor” or imply that somehow their personal finances affect the operation of the team – or vice versa. People seem to think that the owners themselves take a profit or loss whenever the Hawks sign a free agent or make a trade, or that when they trade a player or pick for cash, that cash goes into the owners’ pockets (an assertion that was made so often this summer that I was blown away). I know from my experience that not only is that not the case, but that can’t be the case given the type of business organization ASG is (LLC operating under a franchise agreement) and the strict operating agreements that all teams have with the NBA. The owners sometime have to make capital contributions, but those are mostly non-discretionary. Beyond that, they only ever “make” or “lose” money when they buy and sell their stake in the team. To paraphrase Thomas Jefferson, the NBA ensures that there is a wall of separation between the team’s finances and the owners.

I think that fundamental misunderstanding affects a lot of people’s thinking about ASG. It has made me very jaded when it comes to reading people’s posts regarding team finances. I think even when people get the basic “wall of separation” concept down, many people still don’t quite get that there is no incentive for the owners to make spending decisions based on anything except projected future revenues. Anyway, I’ll stop myself before I go off even further on a tangent…

doc

November 18th, 2010
3:36 pm

well nire, i think personal finances do affect it when it comes to cash calls which it is rumored to have happened but that is not the daily grind most of us are talking about. i think sydel is a lesser owner because he couldnt cough up some extra dough. i think it was written in more than one place but it too is probably conjecture.

i am more concerned about the culture of the organization, nire. it could be a “cheap” culture or one that extravagant. it doesnt matter which the culture it better be one of value and one that seeks value. that is the one that i find missing here, they sometimes dont go after value. if an extravagant one does not find value then the fan suffers as well. money had been an issue especially when it was in the courts and it affected how the team was run, my read. i was pleased to see the commitment they made with bibby though he is expensive and maybe not the value we could have found if more diligent and smarter before hand. that is where we have come up short. i would not like to watch extravagance wasted and maybe more so and be more vocal, if you catch my drift.

in the mean time, LD seems to earning his money and being of prime value as at least we hear from the players through the press the concepts he is trying to come across with. he has also made some pretty nifty in game changes or pre game plans to execute. now, can we beat a true playoff team on our home court? it has been a while, like may, since we did.

Big Ray

November 18th, 2010
4:15 pm

NIRE !

No you did NOT drag that old blog post back up after all this time! LOL, I forgot all about writing that post. Man, that was some foolishness (but I had fun writing it). OMG….I’m embarrassed now….

Melvin ,

Cyber bully? ROFLMBBAO…..that was funny, yo…..

Vava ,

You’re killin’ me. I had to laugh at your comments on Oden, but I totally see where you’re coming from. You know what struck me about him back in college, though? How often he had to go to the bench, and how he was puffing like a bellows on the bench. I mean, dude was breathing with his mouth open. I thought, if his conditioning is this much of an issue NOW, how’s he going to deal with the NBA game?

Big Ray

November 18th, 2010
4:18 pm

Doc ,

Seydel is the one who always seems to “speak out of turn.” He was the one who essentially was quoted in one article as having said that economic/financial issues had forced him to sell back a percentage of his ownership stake in the team. Wish I could find the article, but it was linked to when the ASG was saying that all they had done since purchasing the team, was lose money. This was back when they were still getting a team appraisal done.

doc

November 18th, 2010
5:30 pm

Ray, exactly. that is part of the culture that i am speaking of when i refer to hawks and ownership. it truly is a very diffrrent business model that is closely tied to the people that own it. it is true for many businesses probbly as many businesses there are. as nire says the payoff is down the road whereas most business models require annual success. here i think cilture has a bigger impact. it is more personsal. look to the cultures of the warriors where they decried the former owner or the direct opposites of the lakers and the clips. sorry most businesses would not survive in a true business environment based on competiton, but the clips move on. i mean didnt we seeenough of the rankin smith culture in atlanta to last a lifetime?

ATLANTA RAISED, INDY LIVING DONT ASK ME WHY

November 18th, 2010
6:26 pm

SEND TEAGUE BACK HOME FOR TJ FORD..GREAT TRADE FOR BOTH TEAMS..always, a HAWKS FAN..MISSING THE ATL..NOT

O'Brien

November 18th, 2010
8:47 pm

It’s always interesting to look at old reports before a draft.

NBAdraft.net compared Oden to David Robinson and Bill Russell before the draft.

NBAdraft.net had a N/A for Marvin William’s NBA comparison.

NBAdraft.net’s comparison for Shelden Williams? Emeka Okafor.

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
9:52 pm

I know how bad the Clips are, but man. I feel like I would trade our whole roster to get Blake Griffin. He’s like Amare on offense and in transition, and is just as tenacious on the boards and on D as he is on offense. If he stays healthy, I would bet that he will be a top 5 player within 3 years.

niremetal

November 18th, 2010
10:05 pm

This was the moment that did it for me more than anything. Saw it live on League Pass…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54SnmzkXLic

If you have League Pass, use it to watch a Clips game sometime. Griffin makes it worthwhile.

doc

November 18th, 2010
10:58 pm

the cat has a motor nire

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
11:14 pm

Yeah, Blake is a freak of nature. I wish Josh would use his athleticism to attack the rim like that. No reason why he shouldn’t get more of his points from dunks…

Melvin

November 18th, 2010
11:15 pm

* I wish Josh would use his athleticism to attack the rim like that more often.

Wally Walker

November 18th, 2010
11:16 pm

Again people need to read before making inaccurate statements, Sam Bowie was the best Center in college basketball the year he was drafted. The Trailblazers needed a center not another guard. Matter of fact, Bowie was a 20/10 player coming out of college and was having a solid rookie year before his injury. No one knows what his career would have been as well as the fortunes of Portland. Hinesight is 20 20!
Moreover, the drafting of Marvin Williams over D. Williams or C. Paul was clearly a huge mistake that the Hawks are still suffering from. However, drafting S. Williams was understandable because the Hawks as stated earlier needed SIZE!!! Drafting another wing player after the trade acquiring JJ would not have made any sense. Now, as before, the Hawks still need SIZE. JC1 should be offered to Portland for Joel Prizbilla. There is no way the Hawks can resign JC1, so it makes sense to attempt to improve the team.
Finally, if the Hawks are serious about becoming a legitimate championship contender, a move for a legit big man is mandatory!

doc

November 18th, 2010
11:28 pm

melvin, that is pure smash territory. i was about to say the same thing, that i wish josh would watch it a say, “hmm that looks more fun than this sheed thing i’m doing, let’s go for it”.

doc

November 18th, 2010
11:35 pm

Melvin

November 19th, 2010
12:40 am

Doc,

Maybe Josh wants to be known for more than just a great dunker…

How would you guys like a Jamal for Troy Murphy trade? He would be a very solid backup PF. Also, Troy outside shooting would allow LD flexiblity to play him alongside Josh and Horford…

vava74

November 19th, 2010
3:06 am

Melvin,

If you guys think powell’s D suck, please watch troy carefully.

This guy is present in more poster shots than anyone else in the NBA.

When Kelly Dyer of yahoo made his players’ ranking troy was in 15 out of 20 photos of the supposed top 20 PF in the league plus his own pic AND was in seveal other photos relating to the top 20 for other positions.

Obviously this is not a scientific assessment but since I already thought his d was atrocious I laughed my ass off when I noticed that.

Note that on all pics involving opposing PF only in one he is not looking helpless and beaten… :-D

vava74

November 19th, 2010
3:21 am

BTW, hilarious historical post digging by nire.

I think you may have had a couple of bacardi’s on you when you wrote that Ray…

vava74

November 19th, 2010
3:58 am

Was it here that someone was “drolling” over Earl Barron? Saying that it looked a better signing than any of our bigs?

Here are his impressive numbers against ORL’s Howard and Gortat (after a 9 minute, 0 points 1 rebound effort):

Earl Barron MIN15 FG0-1 FT2-4 3PT0-0 OREB1 DREB0 TREB1 ASS2 STL0 BLK1 TO0 FOULS3 PTS2

Whooa!!!

O'Brien

November 19th, 2010
8:31 am

Vava,

I’m not sure who was “drolling” over Earl Barron, but I did make the comment that I would have looked into him this offseason (Etan’s spot could have been a possibility).

Barron averaged 12 and 11 over a 7 game stretch for the Knicks last year, so I thought he would be worth a tryout. But nire informed me that Hawks actually saw him up close 2 or 3 seasons ago in camp, and they were not impressed.

That being said, aren’t you a little premature in your judgment? Can you really make a decision on him after one game? Much less in Orlando? In only his first or second game of the season?

Dude was just signed, so it’s not like he was practicing every day with the Suns players, learning the system, etc.

Again, I’m not saying he will be a very good backup player, because the possibility is that he sucks. All I’m saying is 1) I would have given him a look for Etan’s spot and 2) Its hard to make a decision either way after one or two games (regardless of how bad the performance was).

niremetal

November 19th, 2010
8:37 am

Doc,

Several of my friends from college (where I was in a light opera company) were at that “flash Halleujah mob” thing. I would have gone if I still were living in Philly (I moved to Wilmington in May).

O'Brien

November 19th, 2010
8:37 am

Wally Walker,

I think one of the biggest complaints about the drafting of Shelden was how it went down, not the drafting itself.

Before the draft, there was a rumor out there that BK promised Shelden he would take him at #5, so Shelden reportedly shut down all his workouts for other teams.

And ultimately, BK was unable to find a trade partner to trade down, because nobody had Shelden rated that highly.

If BK had traded down, and gotten Shelden with the 12th pick for example, I dont think fans would have been so upset. Because you’re right. We needed help in the frontcourt, and Shelden might have been the highest rated big. But to take him at 5th was too big a reach.

O'Brien

November 19th, 2010
8:41 am

As for the Josh and the dunking, I do wish he would dunk more. Recently, he seems more into jump shots, layups, crossovers etc,. than he does dunking.

And even if he is known as just a dunker, he has shown enough versatility this season, so it shouldnt have mattered. Shawn Kemp was a dunker, but he was awesome.

nire,

Taking salary out of the equation, would you trade Josh or Al for Blake Griffin, straight up?

doc

November 19th, 2010
8:48 am

al horford interviewed on 790 this am.

nire so it was advertised rather than spontaneous. sounded impressive with the organ. is it permanently in macy’s?

have sung the hallelujah chorus many times having done choral work in high school and college just never in a department store.

niremetal

November 19th, 2010
8:51 am

O’B,

Yes, either. Maybe even both. Griffin is, I think, the best PF to come along since Duncan. If he can stay healthy (and really, his recovery from surgery seems so complete that there’s no more reason to think he’s more at risk of injury than Josh or Al), it seems all but a certainty that he’ll be a top 10 player. I think he’s a guaranteed 20-10 guy starting next year and, hard as Al plays, he seems to play with such intensity and such a sense of joy that it’s tough to see how it wouldn’t rub off on his teammates. I seriously think having a guy like him around will all but force the rest of the team to play up to his level of intensity – he already has had that effect on the Clips. They are going to lose a lot, but from what I’ve seen, it’s certainly not from lack of effort.

Astro Joe

November 19th, 2010
9:48 am

If a player (Josh or Blake) can score a bunchof points within 5 feet of the basket, how is that a bad thing? It’s like people who complaned that Childress didn’t have a jumper, while he shot 55% from the field. Isn’t the idea to shoot the ball where you have the best chance to make it? If Derrick Rose has the quicks to get to the rim on virtually every possession, why would he stop that and start hoisting deep bombs? Isn’t that why Vince Carter went from unstoppable offensive force to forgettable guard? Because he stopped attacking the rim and started settling for 30% 3-pointers? The idea is to add to your offensive arsenal, not replace your most effective shots for something sexier.

O'Brien

November 19th, 2010
10:17 am

nire,

The Clips seem to have some good young players (Eric Gordon, Blake Griffin, Chris Kaman, and even Eric Bledsoe, who I dont know much about). But this being the Clippers, something will go wrong, or somebody will get hurt again.

I remember vava’s favorite writer (Bill Simmons :smile: ) did an article about Blake after the draft. And he basically talked about the Clippers luck when they get really good players. They get hurt, or the team sucks.

If I’m Blake, there is no way I’m staying with the Clippers and Donald Sterling when my rookie contract is up.

AJ,

Exactly. The aim is to score, in whichever way you can. Dunk, FT, jump shots, whatever.

And if Josh continues to improve on his jumper, it will open up driving lanes for him. Or if he is driving and dunking on people, it will open up space for him to shoot. He can do both.

Melvin

November 19th, 2010
10:18 am

Vava,

I omitted the Hoopshype link in my previous post that said Murphy may be on the trading block. That’s the reason why I made the suggestion. Also, didn’t Kelly Dyer feature one player exclusively for his position rankings? I think he used Ty Lawson in all the pics for the PGs.

Astro Joe

November 19th, 2010
11:18 am

OB, not just score, but score in the most efficient way possible. Volume shooters score. Jamal Crawford scores. A 40% shooter scores. After watching this group of Hawks players for the past 5-6 seasons, I’m not of the opinion that perimeter shooting is a missing skill set.

KevinM

November 19th, 2010
11:48 am

Wouldn’t it be nice to be able to offer a package of Marvin/Bibby or Zaza/Bibby for a quick point guard that complements Teague? We need another quick PG to offset the big minutes that quick point guards need to play…they just wear down in this league.
I just looked at out salaries going forward for the next 2 years. Losing Jamal and even with Bibby coming off the books, our numbers do not decrease enough to bring in a significant piece. The only way we get another starter is to move 2 starters IMO.
Those numbers for Marvin/Bibby/Zaza will continue to eat up the cap numbers that are needed to bring in additional help. Our big 3 takes us to 60% of a 70M cap next year and 64% the following year. I don’t see a lot of flexibility, especially if rumors to decrease salary caps 33% are true. Putting the salary cap at 50M will be just suicide for us going forward.

We have to win with our core 3; there just isn’t a true way to improve this team unless Teague and a couple of rookies get major minutes. We aren’t bringing in equal value for Jamal.

I would have loved to see Cousins on this roster, but Teague has got to start getting more minutes for us to take another step.

We have been lucky to miss Collison and Nelson in those 2 games, or this record would be at .500.

Us missing Marvin doesn’t balance out what other teams haven’t played with. How sad is it that Marvin can’t make this Top 25 SF ranking?…….http://hardcourtmayhem.com/cavaliers/?p=38

Its obvious that there is very little respect for our SF around the league.

vava74

November 19th, 2010
12:08 pm

Melvin,

I went back to check and you absolutely right! My bad!

I don’t usually read what Dwyer writes so I only checked the PF ranking because I was curious about Smoove’s position.

Hence I did not notice that he did it for all positions (weird option to say the least)

Nonetheless, I don’t think Murphy would be a good option.

Yes, he rebounds, but he is useless on man to man D and all that with a 11.98 million price tag for this year (his last) and without guarantee that his contract would be of any use since we do not know what the new CBA will bring.

Astro Joe

November 19th, 2010
12:08 pm

If Marvin scored 18 points/game, I wonder if that would fix our defense against quick PGs? If Marvin shot 55% from the field, I wonder if that would help us better defend 3-point shooters? If Marvin grabbed 2 more boards/game, I wonder if that would be the difference in being a good/bad rebounding team? If Marvin shot 8 FTAs/game, I wonder if our bench would be more consistent? If Marvin locked down elite SFs, I wonder if that would improve our PG play?

I can see why Marvin gets so much attention, he really is the root of most of our problems, huh?

Astro Joe

November 19th, 2010
12:12 pm

I’d take Murphy in a heart beat. I would never turn down a chance to get a top 10 rebounder… especially in exchange for something like Jamal and loose change. A 3 big rotation of Horford, Josh and Troy would work quite well, with each bringing a different skill set.