3/25: Transportation referendum and jobs
By the AJC Editorial Board
Much of the hissing and spitting that passes for civic debate in this age orbits around cries of “job-killing” this or “job-creating” that. Which provides an interesting lens through which to view the upcoming regional transportation referendum.
We suggest that opponents of the Transportation Investment Act penny sales tax listen to a new advertising blitz with something close to an open mind.
Critics also owe it to themselves and their communities, in our view, to examine the sponsor list for the expected $8 million campaign of choir-preaching that points out yet again our epic mobility problems and the need to start addressing them.
Read the rest of what the AJC Editorial Board has to say. Then read another view by Fayette County Commissioner Steve Brown and tell us what you think.
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25 comments Add your comment
Jeff on on Outside
March 25th, 2012
3:48 pm
We need to fix our traffic woes. I wish TSPLOST would help but it will not. TSPLOST is more about reengineering how we live than it is about how best to improve traffic in the Atlanta metro. This project has too much money flowing to ideologes pet projects and not enough to help Joe and Jane Taxpayer get home in the afternoon.
The shills for TSPLOST will remind us of how bad our traffic is and how much we need to “do something”. I wish they had been listening to their own pitch when the project list was being prepared. Instead they were focusing on all kinds of other priorities and only now that we are getting ready to vote do they want to talk about traffic.
Poison Train Pills
March 25th, 2012
3:39 pm
The Roundtable insisted on project CO-035, the train from MARTA Art Center to Cobb Galleria for $700 million dollars of “Cobb’s project money”. This train track is NOT in Cobb.
The train is a poison pill. Why would Cobb citizens vote for a plan that puts most of their project money in another county?
Lots of folks went to meetings, wrote editors, complained on blogs – but the Atlanta Regional Roundtable insisted on the train. Too bad.
Now we have to vote the whole TSPLOST/TIA down. They left us no other choice.
atlmom
March 25th, 2012
2:00 pm
yes , something needs to be done and this is not it. If the legislators want to raise my taxes – raise my taxes.
Don’t do the cowards thing and let us vote on it.
If you found something that works or that you think is the right thing to do – do it. Don’t put the onus on the people – we voted you for a reason (which i can’t recall, but still).
Anyway – stop having *us* vote on stuff.
we can’t agree.
I don’t like this because it has money for roads in it. Isn’t that what the DOT is for? Have a regional transportation system, not what we have. This vote won’t do that.
Hillbilly D
March 25th, 2012
1:41 pm
It is only for a finite time (it goes away at the end of 10 years or earlier if the projects have been fully funded prior to the 10 year limit)
When the original Marta tax was proposed, it was also supposed to be for only 10 years (most people weren’t here then and don’t remember that). The 400 Toll was supposed to go away when the project was paid for. If this tax gets voted in, it’ll never end, just like always.
mottlicher
March 25th, 2012
12:16 pm
Interesting reading on this subject. Here is the big picture folks…this town and a large portion of this area was built on transportation and much of the current and future viability of this region is dependant on transportation. We did a pretty good job of building up our infrastructure in transportation, but fell behind during the growth of the 90s and early 2000s. We now have a huge strain on the system.
One of the main reasons given for firms deciding not to relocate or to expand existing locations in Ga and Atlanta is now we are seen as being as bad as LA when it comes to traffic. Some say “good, we have had enough growth” but history has shown that if you are not growing, providing jobs, better pay and opportunity…your community will slowly start to die and rot (see the rust belt for example). Many say we need to have higher density, more vertical living…more mass transit. Others want the opposite of that. I believe we need both. You can not force everyone into a tower downtown or just off the beltline, nor can we just keep building burbs to Chattanooga. We need a healthy mix of roads and transit (rail, and buses). Everyone needs and deserves a flexible system that serves their needs as best as possible.
The Tsplost proposal is far from perfect, but this is what you get when trying to balance the needs and wants of a variety of communities, local govts and demographics. 65% of the money will go to mass transit projects…Some are for improvements to existing systems, some are actual expansion of existing systems, some bring transit to areas not currently served and will be the beginning point of a future network of transit.
The majority of the road portion is regional in nature as they are aimed at relieving congestion and bottlenecks on regional roads and the surface streets that connect to them. Yes 25% of that budget goes to the locals, but that is for use on their priority list of local transportation improvements/repairs. It is not for the local general fund.
This is our only shot, unless you want a massive increase in the state gas or income tax. The current funding system will not allow these improvements. Further, while I hold many of the same beliefs of the Tea Party…(Washington wasting money left and right and always wanting more…with little to show for it.) I believe this is the best way to jumpstart our way out of this hole we have built and is starting to drag us down.
The Tsplost is a sales tax that gets paid by us…and tourists from other areas. It is only for a finite time (it goes away at the end of 10 years or earlier if the projects have been fully funded prior to the 10 year limit) and you have a limited list of projects that are being funded…not a black hole where your tax dollars disappear. You will see what you are paying for and get to benefit from the projects.
Dumb and Dumber
March 24th, 2012
10:12 pm
Well that settles it, if the Editorial Board of the Dunwoody Journal Constitution is “fer it”, I’m “agin it.”
What these shills don’t tell you is that this sales tax funds a bunch of unconnected projects and that nothing is being done to create a regional governance of transit operators. Don’t throw money at local politicians, they will just waste it on provincial projects that will not increase connectivity.
WeNeedAlternatives
March 24th, 2012
9:36 pm
Yes, I agree that air quality is really important in all of this, and won’t improve if we don’t get out of our cars. (or come up with another type of non-polluting car.) I do remember the air quality downtown during the ‘96 games – rather pleasant. Nobody drove downtown!
The scope of what the referendum is trying to accomplish is too large – I agree. The result spreads too little in funding over too large an area in need. We actually need something bigger – we’ve let this go way too long. But how to pay for it? (and how to keep our short-sighted representatives hands out of the till…)
Our transportation infrastructure is pathetic, and relies on only one mode. That’s not healthy, and it doesn’t give us a backup if the primary mode has an issue. Consider how we depend upon some river bridges in Atlanta – and most people don’t realize they are riding over them! What if one of them began to fail?
One problem with counties ‘partnering’ is that one county has a need, and the next one doesn’t want to pay for it. Check Fulton and Cobb and the Johnson Ferry bridge debacle. Fulton put it’s penny tax into transit, Cobb into roads. Cobb widened the road to the river, and Fulton responded to the tune of ‘Why should I have to pay for your desire to travel through my neighborhoods?’. It also is happening on Hwy41 as we speak. Cobb sends massive numbers of automobiles into Atlanta, and would really like Atlanta to pay for their passage. Is it right? I don’t know. Is it a problem? Absolutely! The problem is regional, and traffic becomes regional once it leaves the local jurisdiction. Our main issue (and this is a stretch) is we have WAY too many government entities in the area, each looking after itself.
Road Scholar
March 24th, 2012
5:14 pm
Bug: It is 15% which is in the law, but all local govm’t I know are using it for capital programs or to match other funds like federal projects (80 %F- 20% local match)- Check with your local governments reps- some may have their project/use list up on their websites.
W N Alts: Good points! We’re already behind on maintaining our infrastructure. Does a bridge or sewer system have to collapse to make that point? Deaths? (Does Minn. ring a bell?)
What about improving our air quality by reducing congestion and excessive idling in traffic?
SAWB
March 24th, 2012
5:09 pm
“Do you build a 100,000 seat sports venue in a rural area and hope people come?”
Well, Gwinnett County did or at least a pretty fair representation of one. So, do we trust all these studies to be any more accurate than the ones that said the Braves would draw in Buford?
Look I am not necessarily saying I will vote no, but I am considering it. While I believe a sales tax may be the proper funding mechanism I am concerned that the scope of this project is too large. Any project in the Metro area will most likely involve a certain amount of corruption, waste and cronyism, but this is so large it is almost guaranteed. A better choice would be for each County to fund very limited projects and then to partner with neighboring Counties for joint projects. At least it will be easier to catch the crooks.
WeNeedAlternatives
March 24th, 2012
2:57 pm
It’s all very simple. Things change, population changes, everything changes. Live with it.
If we had a static world, our current transportation system would probably be just barely tolerable. But that’s not the case. People have babies, population grows, shifts and changes, while fuel and other resources get more expensive – you can’t do a whole lot about any of that. (fuel is a limited resource sold on a world market – free enterprise stuff there…)
So, if we just sit here, and don’t do anything, the world passes us by. And the Atlanta area (with all apologies) will begin to look like some of the cities we don’t really envy (read: Detroit … sorry).
Yes, everyone has a right, if they can afford it, to live in a palatial spread way out in the burbs, and has a right to waste incalculable time in their commute and countless dollars on enriching the oil producers of the world. That’s fine. But sprawling out can’t go on forever. People want services, entertainment, sports teams, good restaurants, great events etc. to improve their quality of life. Do you build a 100,000 seat sports venue in a rural area and hope people come? Hardly. You put in in an area with population density, and provide ways of getting to that venue – several ways of getting to the venue. The same goes for anything else that might enrich life…. and that includes jobs.
Cities that have had the forethought to build a good transportation infrastructure have thrived over many years. Those that haven’t have been bypassed by potential businesses, their economies have diminished. (this is a human sociological thing that can be witnessed worldwide – not just in the good ‘ol USA.)
So we don’t do anything – things are guaranteed to get worse.
If we do the TSPLOST thing, things may get a bit better.
If we wait for something better to come along – it’ll be too late.
It’s all about economics – do we wish to improve the situation, or do we stick our head in the sand and hope nothing changes. You can get involved, and make a difference in the world, and be a participant, or you can just sit by and complain.
It’s your choice.