On the Braves’ Indian-head logo, future catching and LF

The Braves GM is back in the office after a Christmas-New Year’s vacation, and so am I. So let’s start the new year with an update on the Bravos and the stirred-up controversy over new batting-practice caps that feature the old Indian-head logo.

Story

The logo some don't like.

Oh, the holidays? Well, I saw some great movies, ate some good food, got my snowboarding fix (quick trip to Eldora Mountain near Boulder while visiting my sister) and picked up a bunch of used vinyl (a guy was selling mint-condition collection of rock, country and soul at a flea market in Lafayette, Co.; best of all, someone special gave me a first-pressing Cash “Live at Folsom Prison” LP for Christmas).

How was your Christmas and the rest of the holiday week? Get what you hoped for, maybe a season-ticket package or a Heyward jersey?

OK, let’s get back to our subject.

The Braves, like most teams, didn’t make any moves or announcements since closing their office right before Christmas and re-opening today. But they sure were in the news, and still are.  It’s regarding the proposed new Braves batting-practice cap that prominently features the Mohawk-wearing Indian from the original Atlanta uniforms of the 1960s.

It’s not official and hasn’t been announced by anyone, not MLB nor the Braves, but Paul Lukas, who closely follows all things uniform-related at Uni-Watch.com, got ahold of what we believe to be accurate pictures or depictions of the new designs for all major league teams’ batting-practice caps for the 2013 season. You can see them here.

(Note: On Thursday, a day after this blog was posted, Lukas reported on his Uni-Watch website that the idea was already being reconsidering due to backlash that’s been voiced since the Braves cap design was leaked. Here’s what a Braves official told me when I asked Thursday whether the team would comment about the whole situation, since neither the Braves nor MLB has said anything so far, not even acknowledging any plans for teams to wear new caps at spring training. “We will respond with a statement when/if caps are officially released by MLB,” the team official responded via email. “Before then any statements will come from MLB.”)

The Indian-head logo has drawn plenty of criticism for being politically incorrect and, in the view of some, racist.

We’ve been down this road before, as most of you know. Since at least the early ‘90s there have been protests and increased criticism of schools and pro teams for using Native American mascots and nicknames, and the NCAA beginning in 1996 banned its championship events from being held at schools that opted to continue using them (there were 18 schools that used them before the ban).

A few schools were allowed to continue using the nicknames, most notably the Florida State Seminoles, who got approval from the Seminole tribe in order to satisfy the NCAA.

The Seminole tribe gave its approval of Florida State's use of its mascot and Native American imagery in logos.

The Seminole tribe gave its approval of Florida State's use of its mascot and Native American imagery in logos.

The Braves, who share the same war chant and “tomahawk chop” with FSU fans, decided not to bring back the Indian head logo for the cream-colored home-alternate uniforms that they unveiled in 2012, which are otherwise near-replicas of uniforms the team wore when it moved to Atlanta in 1965. The Indian was replaced by a crossed-tomahawks logo on the sleeve of the new jersey in what was widely understood to be a concession to political correctness.

That’s why I was surprised to see the design on the new batting-practice hats, featuring the Indian-head logo – the “screaming savage” is how it’s been described, though it looks to me like the guy is laughing, not screaming, and he doesn’t look in any way like a “savage.” It’s prominent, right out front, with no other writing or design on the cap.

Honestly, I’ll go on record as saying I like the logo. Sorry if that’s politically incorrect to some. I like it.

Then again, I’m not Native American. And if the majority of those good folks, or just a whole lot of them, are truly offended by the logo, then I could see where it might need to be reconsidered.

But is that the case? So far, as with the Washington Redskins and Cleveland Indians and other teams and schools, it seems to me there were as many or more Native Americans either unaffected or who actually liked the representation as were offended by it. Maybe I’m wrong, but at least that’s how it’s seemed to me.

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Is it racist? Really? That just feels a bit over-the-top reactionary to me, and usually it seems that charge is coming from people who are on the outside of this looking in, like me and most of you. Rather than from actual Native Americans.

If many of them – it doesn’t even have to be a majority, in my view; but it does need to be more than a handful of non-Native American columnists – are offended, then I think it shouldn’t be used. It’s not for us to decide if it’s offensive; it’s for those whom it depicts, and their ancestors, to decide. Right? And if it is offensive to them, then don’t use it. Simple.

notre-dame-fighting-irish-logo-2But let me ask you this: When the Notre Dame “Fighting Irish” logo is plastered everywhere, with the bearded character who has fists up ready to fight, have you ever heard a single complaint from a fan (or a writer, especially one of us of Irish lineage) about it depicting the Irish as a bunch of hostile brawlers?

I mean, it’s not as if the logo has an Irish guy with a bottle of whiskey in his hand. Just a silly green hat and hands balled up in fists. Most of us probably like the image.

Does the Indian-head logo feature a spear or bloody knife somewhere that I’m missing? Or what, is it a Mohawk haircut that’s offensive to some? What specifically about the logo is offensive? Look at it now and please tell me.

If you don’t think the Braves should use the name “Braves,” that’s one thing. But unless you are someone calling for them to drop the name altogether, what about this specific logo do you find offensive (and by “you,” I’m speaking more to the writers who’ve ridiculed it since the cap was unveiled on the website, rather than fans who read this blog, most of whom I’m going to assume don’t mind the logo or even like it as I do).

• Fowler & Upton home/road splits: Question for ya. Why do so many Braves fans point out Dexter Fowler’s home/road split disparity — .984 OPS at Colorado’s Coors Field, .720 on road in 2012; for his career, it’s .882 home and .698 road – as a primary reason he shouldn’t be pursued, yet so few cite the similar disparity of Arizona’s Justin Upton?

In 2012, Arizona’s Upton had a .924 OPS at home and a .670 OPS on the road. For his career, he has a .937 OPS at Chase Field, and a .731 OPS on the road.

Do those who point to the wide disparity in Dexter Fowler's home and road splits realize that Arizons's Justin Upton (above) has a similarly extreme disparity in his home/road splits, both in 2012 and for his career?

Do those who point to the wide disparity in Dexter Fowler's home and road splits realize that Arizons's Justin Upton (above) has a similarly extreme disparity in his home/road splits, both in 2012 and for his career?

Upton not only has a greater disparity in his home and road splits both last season and throughout his career, he actually had a road OPS that was 50 points lower than Fowler’s last season. Think about that. And some here would have you believe Upton is worth giving up multiple young players in trade, then paying $38.5 million over the next three seasons.

Keep in mind, they both played in the same division their entire careers, which means pitcher-friendly Dodger Stadium, AT&T Park (San Francisco) and Petco Park (San Diego) should’ve had similar effects on both of them. And while Chase Field is considered a hitters’ park, it’s not as extremely hitter-friendly as Coors Field. And so, Upton should theoretically have had at least a slight advantage in road OPS, since he gets to play a few series at Coors Field every season.

And yet, Upton’s career road OPS is just 33 points higher than that of Fowler, a leadoff-type hitter with 28 homers in 548 career games.

• Bethancourt, Gattis and catching: Allow me to expand upon something I wrote in the comments section of our main blog on Tuesday, regarding Christian Bethancourt and Evan Gattis and the possible future of the Braves’ catching situation. It was in response to this question from a reader:

My understanding is that Gattis was moved to LF because Bethancourt was blocking him, not because he couldn’t catch.. I don’t know his pct. at throwing out runners but he has a good arm.Wes Jorga

That is correct — the primary reason Gattis was moved was to hasten his path to major leagues at a position (LF) where the Braves anticipated a need, not because of poor catching skills.

Cannon-armed Bethancourt is the Braves’ top position-player prospect and his struggles last season didn’t diminish him in Braves’ view because of two reasons: At 20 he was the youngest player in his league for all or most of the year in the Double-A Southern League, with no previous experience above A-ball, and more importantly he had two injuries that kept him out for nearly half the season combined. He pulled a hamstring early on, and that was slow to heal. Then he broke his hand when hit by a pitch late in season, ended his season abruptly.

The fact that he was still chosen to play in the Futures Game at the All-Star festivities in Kansas City says plenty about the high regard that baseball people have for Bethancourt.

Bethancourt’s agility, quick feet, off-the-charts arm strength and overall skill set — including offensive potential, though he’s shown it only in spurts, notably during an exceptional Arizona Fall League performace in 2011 — is too special for the Braves NOT to have him penciled in as their catcher of the future. If he were to struggle again this season while healthy, maybe they’d start to re-think that. But not right now.

Gattis, from all the folks I’ve talked to — from ex-catchers Eddie Perez to the Braves’ roving catching instructor Joe Breeden and other catchers — is at least decent behind the plate. That’s he’s not going to hurt you back there, and might eventually be better than serviceable behind the dish.

He had made strides in his game-calling before being moved to LF early last season, and in left field he showed a pretty good arm and range despite his thickly muscled build, and took better-than-expected routes for someone without OF experience, showing particularly good ability coming in for fly balls in front of him according to his Double-A manager.

He didn’t play much left field for most of the winter-ball season only because his Venezuelan League team had better options defensively in the outfield and used Gattis as a DH (winter-ball teams don’t serve as developmental teams for major league organizations; winter-ball teams are trying to win games, period).

Gattis has not caught much in pro ball, because he hasn’t played much pro ball, period. Javier Lopez was never a great defensive catcher, you might recall. And that’s not to say Gattis will ever hit like Javy did, but just to point out that if you can hit and hit for power at the big-league level, catching skills don’t have to be Gold Glove-caliber, or even close….

EvanGattisAGUI27102012

Gattis in the Venezuelan Winter League, where he led the league in slugging percentage and tied for the home-run lead with 16 in 195 at-bats.

That said, to me Gattis seems more likely to wind up in left field if he stays in the NL. Ultimately, if he hits anywhere near as well in the majors as he’s hit at every other level in the minors and in winter ball, AL teams would probably come calling with interest in him as a DH and part-time position player, if the Braves don’t have regular spot for him.

Unless they add a big-time left fielder between now and Opening Day, I’d expect Gattis to get a chance to earn some playing time in left field, if not at the beginning of the season then by July. And who knows, if by spring it looks as if Brian McCann will miss more than a couple of weeks early on, maybe Gattis could even be considered for some time behind the plate backing up Gerald Laird.

• Gattis winter update: Speaking of Gattis, he didn’t play in the last few games of the winter league season after coming home last week for the holidays. Still, he finished tied with two others for the Venezuelan Winter League lead with 16 homers in 195 at-bats. The other two, Braves bench hopeful Ernesto Mejia and Eliezer Alfonzo, each had 245 at-bats.

Taking into account that winter-ball stats need to be taken with a grain of salt, and are not a consistent indicator of anything as it relates to subsequent performance in the major leagues, the Braves are still understandably encouraged – to say the least – by Gattis’ performance in Venezuela, especially after he missed much of last season with a wrist injury.

The 26-year-old Texan hit .303 with a .365 OBP in 53 games and finished the Venezuela regular season ranked first in slugging percentage (.595), second in OPS (.960) and third in RBIs (44). He’s not returning for the playoffs, as per an agreement beforehand with him and the Braves (he had considered returning after his Zulia team asked him to).

The winter leagues generally are a motley assortment of big leaguers, has-beens, never-weres, and up-and-comers, and there aren’t many established current major league stars who play there until late in the season and/or during the playoffs. But there were some major leaguers in the Venezuela league this winter, and those who would dismissed Gattis and Mejia’s performances should at least consider how they outplayed big leaguers such as Gerardo Parra, a Zulia teammate of theirs. Parra, the Diamondbacks outfielder, hit .298 with a .340 OBP, four homers and a .774 OPS in 139 at-bats.

But again, it’s folly to try to project winter-ball numbers to the majors. I mean, keep in mind that Eliezer Alonzo, who tied Gattis and Mejia for the Venezuela homer lead this winter, is a 33-year-old catcher who hit .361 with a 1.126 OPS last year … in the Mexican League.

Braves backup 1B candidate Mejia also hit 16 homers for the same Zulia team as Gattis. They shared the league HR lead with one other player.

Braves backup 1B candidate Mejia also hit 16 homers for the same Zulia team as Gattis. They shared the league HR lead with one other player.

Alfonzo last played in majors in 2011, when he hit .267 with one homer in 75 at-bats with Colorado. Has a .240 career average and .648 OPS with 17 homers in 591 career at-bats in the majors in parts of six seasons with the Giants, Padres, Mariners and Rockies. Most of that came as a 27-year-old in his first big-league season with San Francisco in 2006, when Alonzo hit .266 with 12 homers and a .767 OPS in 286 at-bats (87 games).

His next-highest totals were 117 at-bats, two homers and a .643 OPS.

And remember, Mejia turned 27 last month and has 710 games and nearly 3000 plate appearances in eight minor league seasons without a major-league callup.

Still, though, Gattis impressed everyone who saw him in Venezuela, earning the splendid nickname “El Oso Blanco” (The White Bear) from his Latin teammates and batting .340 with eight homers and a 1.051 OPS in 97 at-bats with runners on, including .304 with a 1.060 OPS in 56 at-bats with runners in scoring position.

• Ranking the Braves: The Braves’ left-field situation still is unsettled, but that hasn’t stopped some national writers from ranking Atlanta’s overall roster among baseball’s top 10 and giving lofty nods to its infield, outfield and pitching.

Boston Globe scribe Nick Cafardo ranked the Braves’ roster seventh, just behind the Dodgers and ahead of the Cardinals and Giants. Cafardo noted how the Giants demonstrated again in 2012 that it’s usually not the most talented roster that wins the World Series, but the roster that works best together.

Braves fans will probably not be comforted (or surprised) by his No. 1 ranking: Washington. Yes, the NL East is going to be awfully tough again in ’13.

ESPN’s Buster Olney is in the midst of ranking various parts of teams. He had the Braves ranked eighth in his outfield ratings, noting they would be higher if it weren’t unclear how much Martin Prado would play left field. Big-ticket free-agent signee B.J. Upton replaces Michael Bourn in center field and Gold Glove winner Jason Heyward is back in right after a strong bounce-back year in his third season.

For those of you wondering about the Braves’ left-field situation, the word from GM Frank Wren this morning was that the Braves continue to look for a left fielder, but if they can’t find a deal they like they would be comfortable going to camp with what they have and then assessing the situation later.

If the Braves don't add another left fielder before Opening Day, expect Reed Johnson to see plenty of playing time at the outfielder corner.

If the Braves don't add another left fielder before Opening Day, expect Reed Johnson to see plenty of playing time at the outfielder corner.

If spring training opened tomorrow, I’d expect Gattis, Jose Constanza and Jordan Schafer to compete for playing time in left field along with veteran Reed Johnson, the Braves’ top pinch-hitter, fourth outfielder and capable platoon-type player who hit .311 with a .799 OPS against lefties in 2012.

But I also won’t be surprised if the Braves add a proven outfielder between now and spring training, or at least before Opening Day. There are guys still out there like FA Scott Hairston, and guys perhaps more available than we think, like maybe Fowler … you never know who could suddenly become more affordable or more attractive to the Braves.

Buster ranks the Braves’ infield sixth, just behind the Yankees and ahead of the Jays and Nationals. He has Atlanta’s starting rotation ranked eighth in the majors, behind Toronto and ahead of the Giants.

I’d have to think Atlanta’s highest ranking will come when Buster does his bullpen list. I’d be surprised if the Braves aren’t at least in the top five. I’d have them in the top two or three, perhaps even No. 1.

• Top 50 album additions: Before I post this, I wanted to note that with Christmas gift cards and cash I got several more records that would’ve made my Top 50 albums of 2012 list that came out a couple of weeks ago (click here for that list) or at least made honorable mention. They included Lindi Ortega’s Cigarettes & Truckstops (one of the best country albums of the year); Ty Segall Band’s Slaughterhouse (I’m admittedly late to Segall, who put out three albums in ‘12); David Ramirez’s Apologies (think early Ryan Adams, but rawer and more country); Purity Ring’s Shrines; Dum Dum GirlsEnd of Daze (an EP, but their best record so far); and Wild Nothing’s Nocturne (reminds me of the The Church and some ‘80s dream-pop bands, which is a good thing).

Also, I’ll wait another week to do my Top 10 movies list, since Zero Dark Thirty hasn’t started in Atlanta yet, and there are a couple of others I want to see. I saw Looper and Beasts of the Southern Wild this week and both of those moved into my best-of-the-year list.

Enjoy this Nick Cave tune from the Aussie’s brilliant Let Love In album. Here it by clicking here.

Nick+Cave+nick_cave_1

“NOBODY’S BABY NOW” by Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds

I’ve searched the holy books
I tried to unravel the mystery of Jesus Christ, the saviour
I’ve read the poets and the analysts
Searched through the books on human behaviour
I travelled this world around
For an answer that refused to be found
I don’t know why and I don’t know how
But she’s nobody’s baby now

I loved her then and I guess I love her still
Hers is the face I see when a certain mood moves in
She lives in my blood and skin
Her wild feral stare, her dark hair
Her winter lips as cold as stone
Yeah, I was her man
But there are some things love won’t allow
I held her hand but I don’t hold it now
I don’t know why and I don’t know how
But she’s nobody’s baby now

This is her dress that I loved best
With the blue quilted violets across the breast
And these are my many letters
Torn to pieces by her long-fingered hand
I was her cruel-hearted man
And though I’ve tried to lay her ghost down
She’s moving through me, even now
I don’t know why and I don’t know how
But she’s nobody’s baby now
She’s nobody’s baby now
Nobody’s baby now
She’s nobody’s baby now

– David O’Brien, Braves/MIB blog

2,698 comments Add your comment

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
2:48 pm

Thanks for the work DOB.

I love that logo. Don’t care what others say. It is awesome.

The Real Brave

January 2nd, 2013
2:55 pm

1. Ditch the logo.
2. There is no such thing as a fighting Irish.
3. You need to get over the 17th century. It’s 2013 now.
4. Ditch the logo!

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
2:55 pm

Thanks for the new blog DOB!

Out of Town

January 2nd, 2013
2:56 pm

Why even have the logo that’s going to bring bad press regardless of what you/I think about it. I don’t believe it’s the one they’ll use. No way the Braves want that story following them each day.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
2:56 pm

I love the logo…

Muchas Gracias, Senor O’Brien

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
2:58 pm

2. There is no such thing as a fighting Irish. — The Real Brave

Oh, really?

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
2:58 pm

Thank for the new blog DOB!

RC

January 2nd, 2013
2:58 pm

Wherever you stand on the logo issue, Franklin Rabon over at Capitol Avenue Club has what I think it a very reasonable take on it.

http://capitolavenueclub.com/?p=8109

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
2:59 pm

Wren doesn’t have enough prospect talent to even get the Marlins talking, even if he was willing to unload the farm it wouldn’t be enough. Now the DBacks and Justin Upton are a different story, we have enough to get him I think, problem is Wren doesn’t wanna hurt our already bad farm unless he can totally screw someone like he did with the Astro’s.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:04 pm

Wren doesn’t have enough prospect talent to even get the Marlins talking, even if he was willing to unload the farm it wouldn’t be enough.

Who says it has to be prospects? Are there no young, controllable players on the ML roster (who, by the way, would carry much more weight than any prospect package from any team) you would be willing to deal for Stanton?

Colorado Brave

January 2nd, 2013
3:04 pm

Never was a fan of that logo even when it was one of the primary logos in the early-to-mid 1980’s. It always seemed cheesy and goofy to me, and yes, I too thought the Indian appeared to be laughing. I would have preferred a hat with the crossed tomahawk logo — or, if MLB absolutely, positively needed a throwback look, the feather logo that was on the sleeves of the mid-1970’s uniform.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:05 pm

Wherever you stand on the logo issue, Franklin Rabon over at Capitol Avenue Club has what I think it a very reasonable take on it.

Is Rabon Native American?

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:05 pm

I really have never understood the whole having a issue with team names and logos. I really don’t care but my opinion is people are too sensitive and just need to get over it.

RC

January 2nd, 2013
3:05 pm

As to my take on the logo, I personally think that it looks really cool. That said, I do not find myself qualified to speak on whether not it’s offensive, but the fact that many DO find it offensive, and the fact that the Braves could have very easily avoided this controversy by not bringing it back, make me think that it simply wasn’t a good idea to reintroduce the logo.

Regardless of whether or not it’s overtly offensive, there was no question that it would be received that way by some, making the use of the logo next year a bad PR move and bad business move, IMO.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:07 pm

Okay if was was to offer Mike Minor, Freddie Freeman, and Randall Delgado for Stanton does that make us a better team?? I don’t think so.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:07 pm

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A_IokLZCYAAHhI9.png:large

If the Indians logo is okay for games, why isn’t ours for Batting Practice??

RC

January 2nd, 2013
3:07 pm

Wherever you stand on the logo issue, Franklin Rabon over at Capitol Avenue Club has what I think it a very reasonable take on it.

Is Rabon Native American?

I have no idea. The way he addresses the issue I don’t think it really matters one way or the other.

Reid in EAV

January 2nd, 2013
3:09 pm

Had a pennant with that logo on my bedroom wall as a kid growing up and I still have a soft spot for it. Of course, I still have a soft spot for Chief Noc-A-Homa, and you know he’s not coming back. I’d long ago conceded the fact that the image would have to fade away as a concession to political correctness so I’m a little surprised to see it popping back up officially again. I also note that altered versions of the “Screamin’ Brave” have been making the rounds amongst hipsters for a few years now (I’ve seen skeleton and zombie versions) to the organization may just be trying to make a trademark claim to make the other stuff go away.

JT Grace

January 2nd, 2013
3:09 pm

The same incorrect photo of Gattis was used in a previous blog. That is Ernesto Mejia, NOT Evan Gattis

Al

January 2nd, 2013
3:09 pm

Welcome back DOB!! I like the “screaming” Indian logo and would like to get one of those BP hats.
Jealous of the Live at Folsom Prison LP

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
3:09 pm

The Mets are sporting a baseball headed man on their caps, and I would think any white guy with a large head would be deeply offended the Mets are exploiting his image for the sake of money.

RC

January 2nd, 2013
3:09 pm

Okay if was was to offer Mike Minor, Freddie Freeman, and Randall Delgado for Stanton does that make us a better team?? I don’t think so.

I dunno. I think if the Braves did that, signed Adam LaRoche to a 3-year deal (or played Mejia at 1b), and went out and found a back-end starter to hold the fort until Beachy came back then it would definitely make the Braves a better team.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
3:10 pm

Let’s go back to the Atlanta Crackers and change the face from the screaming indian to the weird kid from Deliverance. We could even change the tomahawk to a banjo.

Maybe that would get all the uppity indians to relax.

RC

January 2nd, 2013
3:11 pm

The Mets are sporting a baseball headed man on their caps, and I would think any white guy with a large head would be deeply offended the Mets are exploiting his image for the sake of money.

As a white guy with a large head, I can safely say that there are a very large number of things that offend me about the NY Mets. Mr. Met, however, is not among them.

BravePack(FreeFan)

January 2nd, 2013
3:13 pm

Agree 100% with DOB. Love the logo and will get the BP hat as soon as it comes out. I still don’t see how it is racist. In fact, I think it shows respect to the Native Americans by honoring them and their name along with the image.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:13 pm

I have alot of family and friends with a good amount of Indian descent and so on, most of them are Redskins fans and have no issues with this at all. My god brother who my parents adopted long long ago his biological father was 100% Indian, my bro loves all sports teams like the Redskins, Indians, Chiefs, and Braves and so on. I’ve never met 1 person that was against any of this, and the only person that I know of in sports that has spoken bad about it is Keith Law, who actually said “I’d never accept a job for the Braves, Redskins, Chief’s and so on”

Slowhiteguy

January 2nd, 2013
3:15 pm

Love the logo….the Indian not only appears as though he’s laughing…he appears a touch stoned.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:15 pm

Okay if was was to offer Mike Minor, Freddie Freeman, and Randall Delgado for Stanton does that make us a better team?? I don’t think so

Well, I don’t think you could offer two of your top 7 pitchers, but certainly one of them. Add Gattis to Freeman, since he would then have no OF spot. Add in some filler pitching prospects, if you like.

Sign Adam for three, score 800+ runs.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
3:15 pm

youre right, DOB. the “screaming savage” isnt screaming, nor is he a savage. he is clearly laughing, or perhaps singing, and despite is rebellious haircut (now a norm for competitive athletes) has clearly had dental work done, and maintains good oral health. obviously he is not a savage.

the FSU guy looks like he just stubbed his toe, is all.

by the way, i love the “screaming savage” emblem and looked very hard years ago for a hat with the symbol. i got one about 4 years ago, but the symbol is becoming more popular, and now i can get the batting practice cap pretty easily, i imagine.

NC Roseman

January 2nd, 2013
3:17 pm

Wren should have spent the $ for Cody Ross, or some veteran outfielder. We need a veteran presence on this club with Chipper retiring, not to mention a proven bat that you can bank on 20 homers, and 75 RBIs. But, we are not in the habit of spending money on anymore than one acquistion per off season, that’s just the way it is.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:17 pm

The Black Sox are offended by the White Sox….

BravesFanInNashville

January 2nd, 2013
3:18 pm

DOB….. Great post thank you! Also great lyrics in the song posted. I make my living writing songs and am also a publisher of several hit writers in Nashville. That lyric is brilliant as it moves you without even hearing a melody.

Thanks for all you do. Happy New Year!

Venice Jim

January 2nd, 2013
3:18 pm

Absolutely horrific logic – I am extremely disappointed…

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
3:18 pm

Love the logo….the Indian not only appears as though he’s laughing…he appears a touch stoned. — Slowhiteguy

Ha.

Braveone

January 2nd, 2013
3:20 pm

From the previous blog which had 6,292 comments, TheOnlyBravesFan led the way with 558 posts. There were 380 different poster names. Here are the Top 25:

Rank Poster Frequency

1 TheOnlyBravesFan 558
2 Tom O’Hawke 398
3 nolie 389
4 VaBravesFan 290
5 Lew 223
6 cabravesfan 200
7 richbrave 154
8 ncgary 119
9 old man 117
10 kenhotlanta 115
11 DS1 108
12 David O’Brien 107
13 JC Brave 104
14 uga-brave 98
15 Venice Jim 97
16 Disgusted 91
17 Half Empty 89
18 Heath 89
19 JasonInFL 88
20 George_George 87
21 Ward 79
22 ncscoots 79
23 SNEAKY PETE 77
24 Murph 76
25 Zing 76

Someone Special

January 2nd, 2013
3:20 pm

“someone special gave me a first-pressing Cash”

What’s his name?

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
3:20 pm

Of all the names the Braves have had, I think the Braves is the best, and the logo is the most awesome there is. I am certainly glad they didn’t stick with the Doves. Ugh. Those are dark times to read about… The Rustler? Bees? Awful names.

CrαZy

January 2nd, 2013
3:20 pm

I love the logo… As soon as they’re available I’ll buy one! Hell I’ll even wear it on my annual trip to Cherokee!!

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
3:22 pm

The same incorrect photo of Gattis was used in a previous blog. That is Ernesto Mejia, NOT Evan Gattis — JT Grace

That is NOT Ernesto Mejia. Not sure if you’re confused about Mejia, but he wears batting glove and has a beard.

To prove the point, I’ll add a photo of Mejia from this winter to the blog.

Oskie

January 2nd, 2013
3:22 pm

Bring back Noc A Homa!

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:22 pm

the only person that I know of in sports that has spoken bad about it is Keith Law, who actually said “I’d never accept a job for the Braves, Redskins, Chief’s

For which I applaud him, as a man who stands by his principles. Where I draw the line is when Keith tells me that I shouldn’t accept a job with the Braves, Redskins, Chiefs, etc. :-)

Jim Thorpe

January 2nd, 2013
3:23 pm

Why doesn’t anyone say the Vikings logo is racist and depicts a white person as a “savage”? Racism has tragically become a weapon that is invoked selectively to the point that we cannot even discuss true racism anymore.

The political correctness in our society effectively limits free speech, one of our basic rights. At least one person is going to be offended by just about anything said or done. Suppressing the right to express ourselves is a far more egregious offense than offending someone.

Keep the logo!

Braveone

January 2nd, 2013
3:23 pm

From all blogs in 2012 which totals 355,471 comments, nolie led the way with 16486 posts. There were 5,989 different poster names. Here are the Top 100:

Rank Poster Frequency Percent Cumulative_%

1 nolie 16,486 4.6 4.6
2 TheOnlyBravesFan 12,541 3.5 8.2
3 Efrim 10,294 2.9 11.1
4 Venice Jim 9,643 2.7 13.8
5 cabravesfan 8,706 2.4 16.2
6 phil 7,861 2.2 18.4
7 Lew 6,922 1.9 20.4
8 ncscoots 6,573 1.8 22.2
9 VaBravesFan 5,402 1.5 23.8
10 Bat Masterson 5,287 1.5 25.2
11 David O’Brien 4,763 1.3 26.6
12 Murph 4,631 1.3 27.9
13 Ward 4,565 1.3 29.2
14 DS1 4,459 1.3 30.4
15 richbrave 4,439 1.2 31.7
16 Brava 4,398 1.2 32.9
17 brian 4,262 1.2 34.1
18 Disgusted 4,235 1.2 35.3
19 jeffrey d 3,770 1.1 36.4
20 TennesseePaul 3,617 1.0 37.4
21 MFin04 3,600 1.0 38.4
22 Jeff R 3,423 1.0 39.3
23 tiger297 3,275 0.9 40.3
24 The A Bomb 2,990 0.8 41.1
25 Brian from SC 2,896 0.8 41.9
26 raleighbravefan 2,848 0.8 42.7
27 ChattTownBrian 2,823 0.8 43.5
28 Shaun 2,820 0.8 44.3
29 Tomahawkin 2,748 0.8 45.1
30 Jerry 2,481 0.7 45.8
31 cricket 2,429 0.7 46.5
32 ChattTownBrian (CTB) 2,416 0.7 47.1
33 DAP 2,408 0.7 47.8
34 Tomahawk Mafia 2,365 0.7 48.5
35 JC Brave 2,355 0.7 49.2
36 Mark 2,347 0.7 49.8
37 CraZy 2,332 0.7 50.5
38 count_schemula 2,301 0.6 51.1
39 Arkansas Transplant 2,267 0.6 51.8
40 George 2,190 0.6 52.4
41 bravesgrl4life 2,173 0.6 53.0
42 Trey 2,167 0.6 53.6
43 JasonInFL 2,144 0.6 54.2
44 Mixxo 2,107 0.6 54.8
45 ncbravesfan90 2,105 0.6 55.4
46 kenhotlanta 2,036 0.6 56.0
47 McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô: 2,029 0.6 56.5
48 uga-brave 1,945 0.5 57.1
49 ACE 1,878 0.5 57.6
50 Capt.Mudd 1,849 0.5 58.1
51 abeeewright 1,828 0.5 58.6
52 Ease 1,823 0.5 59.1
53 Sopheee 1,716 0.5 59.6
54 NickB 1,713 0.5 60.1
55 Tom O’Hawke 1,654 0.5 60.6
56 CB 1,634 0.5 61.0
57 Jimmy 1,611 0.5 61.5
58 MIBravesFan 1,579 0.4 61.9
59 RC 1,504 0.4 62.4
60 keylargo 1,473 0.4 62.8
61 Woody Woodward 1,394 0.4 63.2
62 McFann :Ô: :Ô: 1,324 0.4 63.5
63 noleee 1,318 0.4 63.9
64 BFChris27 1,317 0.4 64.3
65 P-Town Brave © 1,302 0.4 64.6
66 Bay Area Steve 1,297 0.4 65.0
67 George_George 1,292 0.4 65.4
68 Bravefaninok 1,254 0.4 65.7
69 Hugo Z Hackenbush 1,238 0.3 66.1
70 TNScott 1,219 0.3 66.4
71 Mitchell 1,214 0.3 66.8
72 njbraves 1,201 0.3 67.1
73 old man 1,196 0.3 67.4
74 ncgary 1,185 0.3 67.8
75 Veer 1,138 0.3 68.1
76 Ray 1,099 0.3 68.4
77 MiaBchBravesFan 1,077 0.3 68.7
78 CaptMudd 1,073 0.3 69.0
79 LAG 1,060 0.3 69.3
80 Couch Tater 1,030 0.3 69.6
81 SNEAKY PETE 1,027 0.3 69.9
82 monty 1,016 0.3 70.2
83 Kat 1,005 0.3 70.4
84 usnavyvolfaninva 979 0.3 70.7
85 Half Empty 956 0.3 71.0
86 Hillbilly 931 0.3 71.3
87 Soph 931 0.3 71.5
88 Pace 930 0.3 71.8
89 Bobby H 922 0.3 72.0
90 MikeInFl 898 0.3 72.3
91 Animus 849 0.2 72.5
92 flange1 840 0.2 72.8
93 Fols 828 0.2 73.0
94 Frankie Wren 819 0.2 73.2
95 Trader Jack 819 0.2 73.5
96 Lawton 810 0.2 73.7
97 Ralph 805 0.2 73.9
98 TBbravesfan 789 0.2 74.1
99 Frankie 781 0.2 74.4
100 Juan 735 0.2 74.6

Top poster by blog post date:

Date Poster Frequency Percent

02JAN2012 Efrim 429 9.1
10JAN2012 Efrim 307 7.3
17JAN2012 cabravesfan 245 6.5
23JAN2012 nolie 308 6.9
03FEB2012 cabravesfan 253 6.8
11FEB2012 nolie 223 9.5
16FEB2012 cabravesfan 159 8.7
21FEB2012 nolie 101 9.3
23FEB2012 Lew 78 5.7
25FEB2012 nolie 174 16.1
27FEB2012 cabravesfan 183 10.8
29FEB2012 cabravesfan 188 10.9
03MAR2012 Venice Jim 81 4.9
05MAR2012 Venice Jim 302 21.4
07MAR2012 Venice Jim 191 16.8
08MAR2012 Venice Jim 176 20.1
09MAR2012 Venice Jim 210 31.6
10MAR2012 Rick 79 6.5
12MAR2012 abeeewright 107 7.6
14MAR2012 Venice Jim 159 10.6
16MAR2012 Tomahawkin 114 7.8
18MAR2012 Venice Jim 176 9.5
21MAR2012 Venice Jim 161 23.5
22MAR2012 Venice Jim 159 15.4
23MAR2012 Venice Jim 306 13.4
27MAR2012 Venice Jim 310 15.9
29MAR2012 Venice Jim 448 14.5
02APR2012 Venice Jim 109 11.9
03APR2012 noleee 87 6.5
05APR2012 phil 103 4.1
07APR2012 Tomahawkin 208 6.6
09APR2012 Tomahawkin 96 4.1
10APR2012 ChrisfromSacramento,Ca 85 4.2
11APR2012 phil 163 7.0
13APR2012 JasonInFL 93 5.0
14APR2012 nolie 172 6.6
16APR2012 nolie 80 6.4
17APR2012 phil 54 5.0
18APR2012 cabravesfan 74 4.5
19APR2012 cabravesfan 104 6.8
20APR2012 cabravesfan 104 8.3
21APR2012 nolie 240 9.2
23APR2012 count_schemula 131 6.5
24APR2012 cabravesfan 104 5.8
27APR2012 nolie 162 7.9
29APR2012 JasonInFL 64 6.6
30APR2012 phil 80 7.5
01MAY2012 nolie 64 3.9
02MAY2012 VaBravesFan 90 4.1
03MAY2012 nolie 38 5.0
04MAY2012 JasonInFL 115 8.1
05MAY2012 nolie 227 9.2
07MAY2012 nolie 129 7.8
08MAY2012 nolie 121 10.3
09MAY2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 112 5.4
11MAY2012 nolie 142 6.5
13MAY2012 nolie 143 9.6
14MAY2012 phil 68 5.5
15MAY2012 nolie 81 7.2
16MAY2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 105 6.8
17MAY2012 nolie 116 7.2
18MAY2012 nolie 147 11.2
19MAY2012 nolie 123 7.0
21MAY2012 nolie 74 4.9
22MAY2012 J-Man 83 6.9
23MAY2012 phil 74 6.2
24MAY2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 116 8.0
25MAY2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 100 5.9
26MAY2012 nolie 119 8.9
27MAY2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 96 6.0
28MAY2012 nolie 62 4.2
29MAY2012 phil 95 6.2
30MAY2012 nolie 201 8.3
01JUN2012 nolie 159 9.0
03JUN2012 Efrim 156 5.8
05JUN2012 Efrim 75 5.9
06JUN2012 nolie 127 9.1
07JUN2012 nolie 120 6.4
08JUN2012 JNick 119 6.4
09JUN2012 nolie 94 8.7
10JUN2012 Brava 45 3.5
11JUN2012 nolie 165 8.5
12JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 91 3.5
13JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 174 6.9
15JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 94 6.0
16JUN2012 nolie 167 6.0
18JUN2012 Efrim 84 4.5
19JUN2012 Efrim 91 4.3
20JUN2012 nolie 217 8.0
22JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 81 5.9
23JUN2012 nolie 115 8.2
24JUN2012 nolie 171 6.9
26JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 125 8.8
27JUN2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 111 7.8
28JUN2012 phil 92 6.0
29JUN2012 nolie 186 5.9
01JUL2012 nolie 138 7.9
02JUL2012 Efrim 81 4.0
03JUL2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 156 9.0
04JUL2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 137 7.0
05JUL2012 nolie 127 8.6
06JUL2012 nolie 134 9.3
07JUL2012 nolie 153 3.9
09JUL2012 nolie 225 7.3
13JUL2012 nolie 113 5.2
14JUL2012 NickB 71 4.8
15JUL2012 nolie 203 7.5
17JUL2012 Efrim 104 5.4
18JUL2012 DS1 140 6.0
19JUL2012 jeffrey d 60 4.4
20JUL2012 Mark 216 4.8
22JUL2012 Efrim 209 5.3
24JUL2012 Efrim 278 5.6
27JUL2012 nolie 125 8.0
28JUL2012 nolie 75 6.2
29JUL2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 73 4.6
30JUL2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 279 10.4
31JUL2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 106 6.9
01AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 56 4.5
02AUG2012 Efrim 78 7.2
03AUG2012 nolie 79 9.4
04AUG2012 nolie 72 7.6
05AUG2012 nolie 29 4.3
06AUG2012 Efrim 64 4.8
07AUG2012 Efrim 94 8.3
08AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 228 10.4
10AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 102 11.0
11AUG2012 Mark 97 8.4
12AUG2012 Venice Jim 53 6.0
13AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 93 7.8
14AUG2012 phil 70 6.2
15AUG2012 Efrim 76 5.8
16AUG2012 nolie 106 8.0
17AUG2012 nolie 75 5.2
18AUG2012 Trey 67 7.1
19AUG2012 nolie 123 8.3
20AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 124 5.2
21AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 110 6.1
22AUG2012 Brava 92 6.0
23AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 125 6.2
24AUG2012 Brava 130 4.5
26AUG2012 The A Bomb 75 5.1
27AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 105 7.8
28AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 84 6.9
29AUG2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 158 8.2
31AUG2012 nolie 157 9.5
01SEP2012 nolie 62 6.2
02SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 107 7.3
03SEP2012 nolie 83 6.0
04SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 82 5.6
05SEP2012 nolie 202 7.4
07SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 139 6.5
09SEP2012 cabravesfan 74 8.8
10SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 77 7.8
11SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 71 6.7
12SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 123 6.9
14SEP2012 nolie 63 4.8
15SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 86 8.2
16SEP2012 Bat Masterson 53 4.6
17SEP2012 usnavyvolfaninva 57 5.2
18SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 79 6.5
19SEP2012 nolie 144 7.4
21SEP2012 usnavyvolfaninva 42 4.2
22SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 122 6.2
25SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 101 8.1
26SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 75 7.3
27SEP2012 Bay Area Steve 54 7.0
28SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 46 5.0
29SEP2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 129 9.4
01OCT2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 88 7.0
02OCT2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 230 7.4
05OCT2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 210 5.0
08OCT2012 Efrim 134 7.9
10OCT2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 471 7.0
22OCT2012 Efrim 474 7.3
02NOV2012 nolie 526 10.2
12NOV2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 408 9.4
19NOV2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 169 6.8
25NOV2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 446 7.2
04DEC2012 Brava 464 9.6
10DEC2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 388 7.3
18DEC2012 TheOnlyBravesFan 558 8.9

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:26 pm

I think its a joke to be honest. It’s just a logo of a Indian. plsu team names are not racist and so on? How is the Redskins, Braves, Chiefs, Indians racist?

For Example

A team name like the “Georgia Cotton Pickers” Or as posted about the “Atlanta Crackers” or we can go ahead and say the “Atlanta Indian Givers” “Atlanta Spear Chuckers” Those ARE racist names… The current teams are not even close to this stuff.

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
3:26 pm

It was reported today that Bobby Womack has been diagnosed with Alzheimer’s Disease. But since Disgusted has never heard of him and didn’t know he was in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, I guess it doesn’t matter to some folks.
Womack wrote and recorded “It’s All Over Now” as The Valentinos in the early 60’s…that song became the first number one hit by The Rolling Stones. He also wrote New Birth’s “I Can Understand It”, which became a world wide dance hit in the late 70’s by Kokomo. As a singer he is most notable for the hits “Lookin’ For a Love”, “That’s The Way I Feel About Cha”, “Woman’s Gotta Have It”, “Harry Hippie”, “Across 110th Street” and his 1980s hit “If You Think You’re Lonely Now”. In the last 30 years, he made some excellent solo albums that are worth a listen if you can find them.

bucky oneil

January 2nd, 2013
3:27 pm

Like the logo. Will probably buy a batting pratice cap with it on it. And I’ll wear it while playing my new squareneck lap steel resonator guitar that I got for Christmas while listening to my copy of Ray Wylie Hubbard’s Grifter’s Hymnal that I believe was somewhere around # 30 on your countdown.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
3:27 pm

I finished 12th in ‘12. Nice!

Ward finished 13th. That means he is due for lots and lots of bad luck this year. Remember the guy who finished 13th last year? Didn’t he die of syphilis or something?

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
3:28 pm

That’s my personal take, and that’s all it is. I have no interest in arguing that one way or the other.
–Franklin Rabon

Got to that point and paused. Figured, that’s fair. It’s his personal take and he has not interest in arguing one way or the other, so why read the rest of what he writes on the topic? Then I came back here.

I love the logo and the name. That’s my personal take on the matter. I think it’s awesome.

UKUGA

January 2nd, 2013
3:29 pm

Does anybody think the Braves may end up changing their name at some point (less than 100 years out, I mean)?

Something that originally struck my attention about 7 years ago was the use of the term “Brav-os” on occasion on the scoreboard. Specific example, “Let’s go Brav-os” during late inning rallies.

It just kind of made me wonder if there was some kind of subtle preparation for a name change down the road. Probably not. And I suspect that a name change would be to something besides “Bravos”. More likely to be Pelicans, or Mosquitos, Nutria, or Rougarou.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:29 pm

8 ncscoots 6,573 1.8 22.2

Oh, man, retirement has sucked me into a blog-posting vortex from which I despair ever escaping. :-)

This is totally insane. There is zero possibility that I had something worthwhile to say 6500 times in a year. Zero.

RC

January 2nd, 2013
3:31 pm

I finished 12th in ‘12. Nice!

Ward finished 13th. That means he is due for lots and lots of bad luck this year. Remember the guy who finished 13th last year? Didn’t he die of syphilis or something?

Was it Kenshin Kawakami?

Or Garrett Anderson?

BravesFanInNashville

January 2nd, 2013
3:32 pm

One thing that I find to be an imbalance in the one game WC playoff is that one team could win 99 games and fight down to the last game of the season trying to win their division to avoid the 1 game playoff scenario and another team could win 89 games and finish 10 games out of 1st place in their division and have rested the final weekend because they had the WC wrapped up. So the 89 win team could start a rested Ace whereas the 99 win WC team might have to pitch a #3 or #4 starter because they had to pitch their Aces the final weekend trying to win the division.

I know this can also happen to division winners when they start series but they have 5 games to try to sort it out so they’ll at least get to pitch their #1 and #2 pitcher once each and then they might only need one more win to with the series. In a 1 Game WC it’s really not fair to that 99 win team to have to put their whole season in the hands of a #3 or #4 starter when the 89 win team gets to start their ace and also has a rested #2 to come in if needed.

There has to be a better way. They have changed the playoff format already so why don’t they just start from a clean slate and design a playoff system that is the best option instead of adding on as they go without a good plan like they’re doing now? The All – Star game is supposed to be an exhibition for the fans and a reward to the games best players let’s stop giving home field advantage to the winning League. Why not just alternate years NL and AL? It’s only fair as the DH rule in home games changes strategy so much.

I say MLB should take a cue from the NCAA and get the playoff system figured out like college football did starting in 2014.

Simpson's Homer

January 2nd, 2013
3:32 pm

1. Anyone who says that there are NO fighting Irish has spent NO time in Ireland, or in certain northern neighborhoods in the US. What about James Cagney, anyway!?!?

2. Anyone who is offended by the old Braves logo is far too sensitive to be allowed on the internet. With all of the problems in this world, what sort of fool would list ANY team logo as worthy of a moment’s thought?! Political correctness is a drain on our society – we have REAL problems to solve!

3. If you watch the video clips of Gattis hitting those homers in Venezuela, he seems to have a sweet, powerful swing. It’s hard to imagine him NOT being a future major leaguer, regardless of his age. Plus, we need someone on the team with a cool nickname, and now he has one.

4. Dave, don’t know if you’re familiar with Bill Mallonee’s Americana music via Athens’ Vigilantes of Love, but he has a new solo album called “Amber Waves” that has gotten good reviews in the past month.

5. Happy New Year to everybody — maybe 2013 will be the year that one of our local teams finally wins a championship!!!

UKUGA

January 2nd, 2013
3:32 pm

When my second child is born this spring I plan to have that logo tattooed across his/her chest.

So there!

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
3:33 pm

to me, it seems like the terms “braves”, “indians” and “fighting irish” are pretty generic, not specific. thats why i dont understand any offense. you have to be trying to be offended to get emotionally injured by such a generic thing. the “redskins” i can kind of understand more, because i believe it was a racial slur at one time.

Enquiring Minds Want To Know

January 2nd, 2013
3:33 pm

Anybody who is worried about a sports team logo has got too much time on their hands.

Well, I guess that would be us, wouldn’t it.

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
3:34 pm

Murph @ 3:10: “Let’s go back to the Atlanta Crackers and change the face from the screaming indian to the weird kid from Deliverance. We could even change the tomahawk to a banjo.”

I resemble that remark!

UKUGA

January 2nd, 2013
3:34 pm

Very pleased to not be in the top 100 for 2012.

Happy New Year again everybody.

Go Braves!

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:34 pm

Wow, can’t believe I finished 9th overall. Didn’t realize how much time I’ve spent on here lol. Also only 1 time did I place 1st for a single blog. I blame the economy, I was laid off for 4 months in 2012 lol

UKUGA

January 2nd, 2013
3:37 pm

That is not Gattis or Mejia. That is Justin Upton.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:38 pm

Plus, we need someone on the team with a cool nickname, and now he has one.

Good point. Published nicknames (non-locker-room versions) for Braves’ players leave a little to be desired.

Does Stanton have a nickname? I mean, other than “Mike”? :-)

chipl1960

January 2nd, 2013
3:38 pm

40 days til pitchers and catchers report. Yes!! Thanks David for the blog. Maybe the counters will shut up now. Some on here believe DOB does nothing between Oct. and Feb. and then coasts through the season working 3 or 4 days out of 7 just watching baseball games, listening to music, and eating BBQ. The only part of Davids job I envy is the access to the players and cultivating those relationships over the years. The rest of it, the travel, airports, hotel rooms, deadlines, ignorant and sometimes mean spirited posters, no thanks. I know your job is demanding and you are probably underpaid. But, thanks again for all you provide. Those of us with a brain appreciate it.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
3:39 pm

10paul The Mets are sporting a baseball headed man on their caps, and I would think any white guy with a large head would be deeply offended the Mets are exploiting his image for the sake of money.

i cant help but think of the brewers mascot…haphazardly sliding around during games. i mean..beer brewing is serious work, and they are being made fun of. if im a brewer in pissed.

maximum

January 2nd, 2013
3:39 pm

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
3:39 pm

Like the logo. Will probably buy a batting pratice cap with it on it. And I’ll wear it while playing my new squareneck lap steel resonator guitar that I got for Christmas while listening to my copy of Ray Wylie Hubbard’s Grifter’s Hymnal that I believe was somewhere around # 30 on your countdown. — bucky oneil

Sounds good to me. I love that album.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:40 pm

That is not Gattis or Mejia. That is Justin Upton.

I don’t think even the blindest graphics guy employed by the AJC could mistake Justin Upton for Evan Gattis, could they?

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:40 pm

I can understand the term “Redskins” a little. It’s basically the same thing as calling a black person the N word or calling someone who’s white a Cracker. But were talking about a sports team, and they didn’t create the team with intended racism toward Native Americans.

Bud

January 2nd, 2013
3:40 pm

For the record, I am of Irish ancestry, and I HATE the Note Dame nickname and logo. I would love to see it ditched. Therefore I say, get rid of the Native American batting practice logo.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
3:41 pm

That’s sad to hear about Bobby Womack, kenhotlanta. And it happens when he’s riding a wave of renewed interest and picked up some new fans after the release in 2012 of his best in a long time, The Bravest Man in the Universe.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
3:42 pm

Does Stanton have a nickname?

He does, but it’s highly offensive. Can’t be repeated here.

Disbott3000

January 2nd, 2013
3:44 pm

I don’t have a problem with the logo, but it is already starting to create a negative distraction around the team and we aren’t even in spring training yet. Part of a teams balance is about avoiding unnecessary, negative distractions, and that’s what this is rapidly turning out to be. Also, can you imagine these players having to answer a bunch of questions about race and stereotypes, over and over again? Someone’s eventually going to step in it and say something offensive to someone, which will just create more negative energy around the team.

I guess my point is, don’t upset the apple cart. We don’t use that logo now and we’re doing pretty well without it. Keep it in the past, where it wasn’t causing a ruckus.

Homer the Brave

January 2nd, 2013
3:44 pm

Would the new batting practice logo be acceptable if it showed an Indian scalping a white man? Would that make the liberals and the tree-huggers happy?

What are you looking at?

January 2nd, 2013
3:46 pm

The Notre Dame logo isn’t an Irishman. It’s a leprechaun. A mythical creature. Doesn’t depict or purport to depict a human being in any way, shape, or form.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:46 pm

We could probably nit pick every single sports team and find something wrong. Basically boils down to how sensitive you are.

Cliff Fiscal

January 2nd, 2013
3:46 pm

I realize that it would cost a truckload of talent to get Stanton and that it will not happen. But, an outfield of Stanton/B.J. Upton/Heyward would be incredibly dynamic and a must-see proposition. I certainly would dish out more dough to come to the ballpark.

Slowhiteguy

January 2nd, 2013
3:46 pm

Homer….lmao….

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
3:47 pm

has clearly had dental work done, and maintains good oral health. obviously he is not a savage.

ill add to this that i suspect those who are opposed to the logo to be anti-dentites.

Cliff Fiscal

January 2nd, 2013
3:47 pm

I agree with DOB’s take on the logo issue.

fan

January 2nd, 2013
3:47 pm

Keep the Brave logo.

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
3:47 pm

The laughin’ injun with a buzz on…..I like it.

Very apropos if we become the laughingstock of the NL East.

I suggest the peeps who don’t like it…..deal with it.

Being of Norwegian heritage, am I offended by the Vikings logo? Absolutely not. Quite proud of it actually. :)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:49 pm

Does Stanton have a nickname?

He does, but it’s highly offensive. Can’t be repeated here.

Haha! I’m trying and trying to come up with a way to post a nickname for him (which is offensive) but I can’t… I’ll just say it starts with the letter M.

coachx

January 2nd, 2013
3:50 pm

Scandinavians are not offended with a savage looking Viking running around the Metrodome in Minnesota.
The Irish are not offended of Notre Dame’s Irish midget mascot who likes to fight.
Renecks are not offended by the Tennessee or West Virginia parading around a white guy in racoon hat with a musket.
Cowboys are not offended by Dallas and Oklahoma state using cowboys with guns as their mascots.
The Seminole tribe has no problem with FSU using their tribal name with a drawing of an Indians in war paint.
So what the
problem with the Atlanta Braves using a smiling young Brave as a logo ?

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
3:50 pm

DOB, the recent additions/updates, would it be safe to say that, wherever they might rank in your top 50, they would just bump off the last 7, or would some higher rated ones be dropped out of the list?

I’m trying to build my purchase order, and this does impact it. There are ramifications for such late entries.

jerry

January 2nd, 2013
3:50 pm

“Cafardo noted how the Giants demonstrated again in 2012 that it’s usually not the most talented roster that wins the World Series, but the roster that works best together.”

27 titles won by the Yankees, not because they “worked” together but because they were more talented.

Thadsdad

January 2nd, 2013
3:50 pm

Until the Redskin, a blatant racist term, is eliminated from the list of sports nicknames I can’t badmouth any sports logos, no matter how they’re interpreted. Look at the long fight North Dakota State University had over using the “Fighting Sioux” as the school’s mascot. After being threatened with not hosting an NCAA ice hockey tournament, the school finally relented. But what the heck is wrong with the fighting Sioux? It seems Native Americans have been screwed over by American society in a lot more harmful ways than using the names of tribes for athletic teams.

jmart1951

January 2nd, 2013
3:50 pm

I believe that unless the major leaguer is a first year major leaguer the Marlins would not want him. Their goal is to stockpile high talent at first through 3rd year cost. This means that a minor league ready player or a player that has performed well in the majors but did not give up their first year of eligibility doing it would be most attractive to them.

If it were me I would offer Minor or Medlin (their choice), Delgado, Freeman or Mejia (their choice), Amhed, Gilmartin and Cunningham
The Marlins could certainly take Freeman and then trade him to another club for a couple of very good prospects. Same with Medlin

I believe that might do it.

Then extend Heyward and Prado.
This should result in the Braves having a very good chance of winning for the next four to five years.
Stanton is a huge difference maker. He is a five tool player and would lead the team in RBI. An outfield of Stanton, Upton and Heyward would be very good defensively and outstanding offensively.
Prado playing third base full time with Simmons at his side really covers the left side of the infield. Mejia, if they chose Freeman, has good splits for both right handed and left handed pitchers. He only made 7 errors in 135 games last year. He could end up being a very good replacement for Freeman.
Pitching staff of Medlin, Maholm, Hudson and Tehren would mean that the Braves need to sign another major league starter for 2013.
2014, they could extend Hudson, add Beachy back in and either go with Graham or a free agent starter. Plus you never know who may develope rapidly in 2013 that would be a surprise starter in 2014.

I know that this trade would be a risk and weaken the Braves pitching depth but Stanton in his prime years at very reasonable cost would be worth having to rework the starting pitching staff.

Chief Knock-A-Homa

January 2nd, 2013
3:51 pm

Bring ME back!

BTW – @braveone 3:23 p.m. – seriously?!

chipl1960

January 2nd, 2013
3:52 pm

have the Mets and Marlins as laughingstocks already. no worries about that.

Cliff Fiscal

January 2nd, 2013
3:52 pm

I am so out of the loop now when it come to music. That wasn’t the case back in the 80’s when I was into the Athens music scene and also enjoyed a particular band called Winter Hours (combined the best of REM’s jangly rock/ alt-country/Jim Morrison-sounding singer). At least I listen to Alejandro Escoveda sometimes.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
3:52 pm

I guess my point is, don’t upset the apple cart.

Oh, man, screw that. That’s not a good enough reason to do one or the other. The path of least resistance leads only to an ethical abyss.

One-Eyed Mac

January 2nd, 2013
3:54 pm

How come anytime someone has a disparity in home/road splits, it’s just assumed he can’t hit outside the park that is currently his home ballpark. Maybe the guy just likes being at home with his family and sleeping in his own bed.

Juan

January 2nd, 2013
3:55 pm

History Fact:

Notice the Braves Logo with the Mohawk cut is from a “Mohawk” Indian tribe.
Their territory ranged to present-day southern Quebec and eastern Ontario.
For that their not Native American

jmart1951

January 2nd, 2013
3:56 pm

Sorry…. Pitching staff of Medlin or Minor (one not chosen), Maholm, Hudson and Tehren

single white dove

January 2nd, 2013
3:56 pm

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
2:59 pm
Wren doesn’t have enough prospect talent to even get the Marlins talking, even if he was willing to unload the farm it wouldn’t be enough. Now the DBacks and Justin Upton are a different story, we have enough to get him I think, problem is Wren doesn’t wanna hurt our already bad farm unless he can totally screw someone like he did with the Astro’s.

Mike Stanton would be sweet, if we got him.

Voice of Reason

January 2nd, 2013
3:56 pm

In reading the Denver Post, I see that the Rockies are in need of starting pitching. They supposedly offered Fowler for Minor, but the Braves turned that down. (that was a good decision by Mr. Wren IMHO) But they still have Mike Cuddyer on their roster and are looking at him as a part-time OF & 1B – I think his bat, savvy, leadership, and skills would fit very well in LF for the Braves and if offering either Delgado or Vizcaino, as well as a AAA position player, that might do the trick. It looks like the Rockies were hoping that they would get a FA to fill pitching needs but now are more open to trade for prospects to fill out their staff. What have you heard, DOB?

coachx

January 2nd, 2013
3:56 pm

This just in.
The Dog Whispers says Bulldogs are pissed off about being exploited as mean mascots !
The Bird Whisper says Hawks, Falcons, Eagles, Cardinals, and Owls feel the same way.
The Fish Whisperer also says Dolphins, Sharks, and Rays are OK with being mascots but feel they should be compensated. They request a lifetime supply of food of their own chosing.

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
3:56 pm

nolie – Way to go, Buddy. You even beat out TOBF for the year (a Herculian Task), even in spite of periods of illness, and even a brief, undeserved banning period. Well done, my (retired) friend.

JK

January 2nd, 2013
3:57 pm

Great logo. You can’t please everyone. Nothing pleases everyone. I say make shirts with the logo as well.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
3:58 pm

is “el oso blanco” racist and offensive, or is it ok since its in spanish and about a white guy? just curious about where the tolerance threshold is for this stuff…

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
3:58 pm

What about people who hail from pirate ancestry? Have you seen that thing that parades around their stadium? WTF is that all about? Not the parrot, but the other one. I noticed that they gave him yellow skin… because it has scurvy? So now you’re mocking people with scurvy??

Or the Padres friar mascot… I once saw him and the Philly Phanatic do something between innings that would have started a war in the olden days. Yet people don’t seem to have a problem with a man of the cloth parading around the field, dry-humping a giant green alien?

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
3:59 pm

Wow. 26. Almost as low as my draft lottery number. Thank goodness for the ole college deferment.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
3:59 pm

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
4:00 pm

Notice the Braves Logo with the Mohawk cut is from a “Mohawk” Indian tribe.

Unfortunately, the Mohawks were not the only tribe to wear their hair in such a fashion. Pawnee and Osage warriors, among others, had a similar style. The Laughing Indian might not be Mohawk, is what I’m saying. :-)

chipl1960

January 2nd, 2013
4:00 pm

Vizcaino plays for the Cubs now. In Maholm deal last July.

Voice of Reason

January 2nd, 2013
4:03 pm

I knew that – had my pitchers mixed up. Thanks Chip for setting me straight. My main purpose was to say that Mike Cuddyer was available and he has been an RBI man for both the Twins and Rockies, though a bit injured this last year.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
4:03 pm

But they still have Mike Cuddyer on their roster and are looking at him as a part-time OF & 1B – I think his bat, savvy, leadership, and skills would fit very well in LF for the Braves and if offering either Delgado or Vizcaino

Hey Theo and Hoyer (Cubs), can I have Vizcaino back please?

bravesfaninnc

January 2nd, 2013
4:03 pm

I think we should go ahead and really upset the masses by bringing Chief Nocahoma back!

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
4:03 pm

you know what i find offensive? and this is not a joke. use of the term “native americans” to describe what i would call “american indians”.

RC

January 2nd, 2013
4:03 pm

History Fact:

Notice the Braves Logo with the Mohawk cut is from a “Mohawk” Indian tribe.
Their territory ranged to present-day southern Quebec and eastern Ontario.
For that their not Native American

Isn’t Canda part of North America?….

Reminds me of “Team America”:

“Location: Buenos Aires, South America. 5,160 miles south of the real America”

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
4:04 pm

A fresh take on a classic sound. These cats bring it.

Vintage Trouble…. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThZZnS4Jvwc

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
4:05 pm

Would the new batting practice logo be acceptable if it showed an Indian scalping a white man? Would that make the liberals and the tree-huggers happy? — Homer the Brave

Talk about missing the point….

Cali Brave fan

January 2nd, 2013
4:05 pm

Can’t understand why these guys want to wast money and good prospects on an unnecessary trade for a left fielder we don’t really need. I think its in our best interest to have a position that is not locked up so we can give a chance to a young player from our minors like constanza are Gattis, And as far as leadoff i would go with prado he has a high OBP and forget stolen bases ala moneyball . I like the logo when can i buy one. I have never heard a single complaint from a native american about these mascots are logos and i live in a town in ca where the biggest employer is an indian casino. And ca is the home of these politicaly correct types.

Cali Brave fan

January 2nd, 2013
4:05 pm

Can’t understand why these guys want to wast money and good prospects on an unnecessary trade for a left fielder we don’t really need. I think its in our best interest to have a position that is not locked up so we can give a chance to a young player from our minors like constanza are Gattis, And as far as leadoff i would go with prado he has a high OBP and forget stolen bases ala moneyball . I like the logo when can i buy one. I have never heard a single complaint from a native american about these mascots are logos and i live in a town in ca where the biggest employer is an indian casino. And ca is the home of these politicaly correct types.

Coach (2013, Is the futre now?)

January 2nd, 2013
4:05 pm

I’d put that friggin logo on the home uniforms, the politically correct bastards be damned.

I don’t agree with the rankings concerning the 2013 Bravos. Too many holes, questions, not enough depth in the rotation. We don’t know who our LF or lead off guy is and won’t anytime soon.

But I will say this for our Braves: They are younger, more athletic, less apt to fall apart down the stretch, along with the best bullpen in ML baseball.

Cali Brave fan

January 2nd, 2013
4:05 pm

Can’t understand why these guys want to wast money and good prospects on an unnecessary trade for a left fielder we don’t really need. I think its in our best interest to have a position that is not locked up so we can give a chance to a young player from our minors like constanza are Gattis, And as far as leadoff i would go with prado he has a high OBP and forget stolen bases ala moneyball . I like the logo when can i buy one. I have never heard a single complaint from a native american about these mascots are logos and i live in a town in ca where the biggest employer is an indian casino. And ca is the home of these politicaly correct types.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
4:07 pm

I remember in school in history class we were taught to call them “Native Americans”

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
4:10 pm

Michael Cuddyer to me falls into the “You know what your gonna get” category. Can’t really call him a upgrade. He would be more of a safe pick up to assure we get a certain amount of production. Players like Coco Crisp and David DeJesus I would also throw in that category.

Hillbilly

January 2nd, 2013
4:10 pm

I noticed that they gave him yellow skin… because it has scurvy? So now you’re mocking people with scurvy?? -Murph

Can’t. Stop. Laughing.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
4:12 pm

Maybe they should go in a different direction and, rather than use american indians, use red dot India indians as the logo…. Saree Night would be a pretty awesome promotion.

Just a suggestion.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
4:14 pm

I’d put that friggin logo on the home uniforms, the politically correct bastards be damned.

Yes, spite usually works as a basis for reasonable action. :-)

dylan

January 2nd, 2013
4:16 pm

Personally I don’t see the logo being any more offensive than Washington having their name the redskins.

I think gattis will be an impact bat for the braves, his swing is phenomenal and his low k numbers are incredible

RC

January 2nd, 2013
4:16 pm

Yes, spite usually works as a basis for reasonable action.

Unfortunately, didn’t work when Seinfeld wanted to return the sports coat.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
4:17 pm

jmart1951 Stanton is a huge difference maker. He is a five tool player and would lead the team in RBI.

stanton a 5 tooler? i guess he has enough power to count it twice….

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
4:19 pm

DOB, the recent additions/updates, would it be safe to say that, wherever they might rank in your top 50, they would just bump off the last 7, or would some higher rated ones be dropped out of the list? — TennPaul

No idea. Not going to go back and rework it, either. Sorry, just too time-consuming (it already was a way-too-lengthy task just putting together the 50). Wouldn’t just knock off the last seven; why would I do that? At least two or three of them would make the top 50, the others honorable mention. I’ll leave it at that.

Ken Stallings

January 2nd, 2013
4:19 pm

I don’t like the new hat for a number of reasons.

First, I am tired of marketing being the top criteria of uniform designs. The Yankees have the most recognized uniform in world sports (with the Dallas Cowboys close behind). Those two uniforms are classic becasue they aren’t continuously messed with.

The Braves had the best uniform in baseball but had to muck with it, going to the one tone hat on the road and those ugly as sin “softball” jersey tops that are blue with blue numbers hard to even read. A vote was conducted soon after the Braves changed their uniforms in the late 80’s. The all grey road uniform with the tomahawk and the two-tone caps were voted the best road uniform in baseball.

I also don’t like the “screaming indian” logo becasue I find it ugly looking. There is no immediate association with the Braves franchise. It looks stupid. It invites controversy where there is no overriding need for controversy. In fact, there is not one single viable reason it should even be worn.

Wes Jorga

January 2nd, 2013
4:20 pm

Juan, native american I believe, means the Americas including North and South America. Right on about the Mohawk identity, I know the Milwaukee Braves used the logo. While I don’t know if The Boston Braves used the logo, The Mohawk trail runs right through Massachusetts and continues to western New York.

Jake Mastroianni

January 2nd, 2013
4:25 pm

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
4:26 pm

RIP: Patti Page, the top-selling female singer of the 1950’s with more than 100 million records sold; she was 85. “Tennessee Waltz” and “(How Much Is That) Doggie in the Window” were her biggest hits and she was also an actress.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
4:27 pm

In fact, there is not one single viable reason it should even be worn.

If it increases batting practice hat sales then that’s money that the team can use to not spend on future free agents… so you’re only half right.

Steve

January 2nd, 2013
4:29 pm

One knows it is a slow baseball news week when the Braves batting practice cap has drawn so much attention. Yawn.

Steve

January 2nd, 2013
4:29 pm

Sorry for the multiple posts. Not intentional.

Craig

January 2nd, 2013
4:33 pm

Have to say I dislike the logo…looks pretty ametuerish really.

As for LF please play Gattis. Give the guy a go ….a real go like to the All Star game at least.
He will go through tough periods but every team needs to take a chance to see what they have. I think the guy will hit and lots and may surprise in the field.

For mine we do need one more experienced head in the locker room but have him off the bench in a role like Hinske …(year 1). Not sure who is left but I am sure Frank can find someone who is well regarded to be a leader.

That said it is time for Hudson, Uggla, McCann, Prado and Upton to lead. They all get paid enough and have plenty of games under their belts to step it up and fill the void

Craig

January 2nd, 2013
4:33 pm

Have to say I dislike the logo…looks pretty ametuerish really.

As for LF please play Gattis. Give the guy a go ….a real go like to the All Star game at least.
He will go through tough periods but every team needs to take a chance to see what they have. I think the guy will hit and lots and may surprise in the field.

For mine we do need one more experienced head in the locker room but have him off the bench in a role like Hinske …(year 1). Not sure who is left but I am sure Frank can find someone who is well regarded to be a leader.

That said it is time for Hudson, Uggla, McCann, Prado and Upton to lead. They all get paid enough and have plenty of games under their belts to step it up and fill the void

UKUGA

January 2nd, 2013
4:33 pm

I say we hire Ozzie Guillen as a “special” assistant and let him field questions about the Braves’ new hats during spring training.

We can fire him before the season opener.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
4:33 pm

i like cuddyer. i actually think he is the type of hitter this lineup needs, in order to be very well balanced. good vs. lefties, solid RBI guy, doubles hitter.

Craig

January 2nd, 2013
4:34 pm

Have to say I dislike the logo…looks pretty ametuerish really.

As for LF please play Gattis. Give the guy a go ….a real go like to the All Star game at least.
He will go through tough periods but every team needs to take a chance to see what they have. I think the guy will hit and lots and may surprise in the field.

For mine we do need one more experienced head in the locker room but have him off the bench in a role like Hinske …(year 1). Not sure who is left but I am sure Frank can find someone who is well regarded to be a leader.

That said it is time for Hudson, Uggla, McCann, Prado and Upton to lead. They all get paid enough and have plenty of games under their belts to step it up and fill the void.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
4:34 pm

From all blogs in 2012 which totals 355,471 comments, nolie led the way with 16486 posts. There were 5,989 different poster names. Here are the Top 100:
————————————————
expect that record to be broken by TOBF this year

I am more upset about Old Miss dropping “rebels” that the Indian logo on the Braves hat and I am not even a true fan of theirs…everything has to be politically correct these days….the 70’s.. now there was a generation for you

old man

January 2nd, 2013
4:35 pm

I’m negative on the logo. It’s the Native American version of the smiling Aunt Jemima. I agree that it is only a vocal minority that finds it offensive. I don’t find it offensive directly, because I’m not Native American.

I’m reminded of the Amherst College mascot, the “Lord Jeffs.” Named after the schools namesake, Lord Geoffrey Amherst. He’s famous for giving the Native Americans nice gifts of luxurious blankets, without telling them that he had first rubbed them all over the open sores of dying smallpox victims. Killed thousands. Opened up a lot of land. Sort of offensive to have a mascot honoring that.

We did pretty much bully the Native Americans out of the whole continent, didn’t we? So, I’m indirectly offended by it, or have guilt about it. I think the idea of naming a team the Braves, the Seminoles, the Warriors, etc., can be non-offensive. It seems to me you honor the Native Americans in this way. But Redskins? And the laughing Brave looks a little demeaning to me. So I can see it rubs a Native American the wrong way. And indirectly, it bothers me a bit. Reminds me of a not so wonderful part of the white man’s past.

Which brings me to part two.

We seem to have a very strong attitude in this country of holding our right to do something above everything else. “If I have a right to do, then screw everyone else, I’m gonna do what I wanna do. It’s my frikkin’ right, OK?”

I think it’s a a lot more noble to give latitude to people who make a plausible case that they are offended. You’re offended that our team is called the Braves? I don’t buy that. I smell a lawsuit for money. You’re offended by a ridiculous, borderline demeaning picture of a crazy Indian? Yep, I buy that. Maybe you are truly offended, maybe you aren’t. But it’s plausible. Do I have the right to buy a license plate with that image and put it on my front bumper? Yep. Or on my team’s BP caps? Yep, I got that right too. Do I need to? No, I don’t. My life, my team, my everything will be just fine without it. So why push it? Other than to say I can do whatever the heck I want, and to heck with anyone who does not like it?

So I’m perplexed why the team would even go this route.

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
4:36 pm

El oso bailarín – the dancing bear. Francisco after his slimming down :lol:

Hope this doesn’t offend the weight-challenged among us.

Ken Stallings

January 2nd, 2013
4:36 pm

The Boston Braves used a sillouhette motiff, basically a black outline of a classic indian chief with ceremonial headress (at least as accurate as people in the New England area during that era would use).

I don’t believe the Boston Braves used that logo.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
4:37 pm

I say we hire Ozzie Guillen as a “special” assistant and let him field questions about the Braves’ new hats during spring training.

We can fire him before the season opener.

LOL… best plan of the offseason so far!

Puma

January 2nd, 2013
4:37 pm

I like the logo, always have, but probably more because it just reminds me of the braves when I was a kid and nostalgia and all that stuff.

Bigger question for me is why bring it back? Kind of like poking a hornets nest with a stick, why??

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
4:38 pm

i might bge the only braves fan who feels this way, but i like all the uniforms. the whites, the creams, the navys, the greys, the reds. i like all of them.

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
4:38 pm

ken – Patti Page was my (93 year old) dad’s favorite female singer. Until a few years ago, she sang in the choir at the church in San Diego, that my brother and sister-in-law go to. I visited one Easter a few years ago, and she sang that day.

JoeFan

January 2nd, 2013
4:39 pm

Wren seems to be set on giving Gattis his shot and why not? The Braves have to find out if he is the real deal and certainly the options that might be available to fill LF are not going to knock his socks off. So, unless he gets approached with a trade to good to pass up, expect to see Gattis be given the chance to win the job in spring training.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
4:41 pm

Hope this doesn’t offend the weight-challenged among us.

All this logo discussion now has me worried that I’ve offended Kris Medlen in the past with my posts about his, uh, vertical challenge.

He wouldn’t hold that against me, would you think?

Big Ed

January 2nd, 2013
4:45 pm

I agree with Joe Fan. That makes a lot of sense.

Mr Pitts

January 2nd, 2013
4:45 pm

“Agree 100% with DOB. Love the logo and will get the BP hat as soon as it comes out. I still don’t see how it is racist. In fact, I think it shows respect to the Native Americans by honoring them and their name along with the image.”

I love to watch the white guy response to these issues. I like it. Really? You look at that and conclude that you like it? Whether it’s offensive or not [leave that aside for a sec] ‘I like it ‘ is not the first thing I think when I saw the logo. As a 55 year old white guy I thought: ‘Weird’. Perhaps you guys should commision an artist to creat e a painting and put it above your fireplaces if you really like it. Anyway, the above response from somebody covers the white guy response in its entirety: I like it. It’s not offensive. I will buy it to show everybody. It shows respect. Huh?

Funny stuff.

Wes Jorga

January 2nd, 2013
4:45 pm

Old Man, agree with most of your post. My son goes to UCSC and their logo is the banana slug. while it may fit the character of some of the students, it is useless in rallying the crowd.

Puma

January 2nd, 2013
4:46 pm

I wonder how the players feel about wearing a potentially offensive logo?

cricket

January 2nd, 2013
4:46 pm

How come anytime someone has a disparity in home/road splits, it’s just assumed he can’t hit outside the park that is currently his home ballpark. Maybe the guy just likes being at home with his family and sleeping in his own bed.

doesn’t this just imply that this guy would s*ck for half the games no matter where he signs?

Astral

January 2nd, 2013
4:46 pm

That is why Twitter is becoming the preferred communication model for beat reporters and the press. Less stressful. Immediate. You can jump around topically avoiding topic burn out, etc….Ozzie

as ADD sweeps the country….

Matt

January 2nd, 2013
4:46 pm

I am not a Native American, so it really doesn’t matter if I’m offended by the logo.

Mr Pitts

January 2nd, 2013
4:46 pm

“Agree 100% with DOB. Love the logo and will get the BP hat as soon as it comes out. I still don’t see how it is racist. In fact, I think it shows respect to the Native Americans by honoring them and their name along with the image.”

I love to watch the white guy response to these issues. I like it. Really? You look at that and conclude that you like it? Whether it’s offensive or not [leave that aside for a sec] ‘I like it ‘ is not the first thing I think when I saw the logo. As a 55 year old white guy I thought: ‘Weird’. Perhaps you guys should commision an artist to create a painting and put it above your fireplaces if you really like it. Anyway, the above response from somebody covers the white guy response in its entirety: I like it. It’s not offensive. I will buy it to show everybody. It shows respect. Huh?

Funny stuff.

Ken Stallings

January 2nd, 2013
4:47 pm

old man,

I think you made good points. Florida State sought and obtained endorsement by the Seminole nation and therefore there is nothing wrong with their uses. FSU uses historically correct homages in their mascots, uniforms, and merchandise.

I don’t have a problem with the use of objective names and items like Braves, the tomahawk, or feathers. I think the Washington Redskins is perhaps the most hideous of names and they just added to it with their primary logo. But, that’s for them to decide.

At lot more Americans have native American ancestry than is thought. I was mildly surprised to learn that my great-great grandfather married a woman who was native Cherokee. For me, it’s more a nice pride factor than anything tangible, and I certainly would not petition the Cherokee Nation for inclusion. I just think it’s cool they got married.

The problem with that logo is that it tries to be something more than a cartoon. And in the process it distorts reality enough to slide into the offensive region. The Notre Dame logo is a pure cartoon. It’s also a case of Irish-American Catholics starting their own private university and deciding to pay homage to their own distant ancestors. So, that is a bit different.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
4:47 pm

mr pitts, your 4:45 post is racist and i would like you to retract it before i report you to the blog police.

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
4:48 pm

old man @ 4:35 – Pretty much the way I feel about it. Why go there?

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
4:49 pm

But, of course, I’m a bleeding heart libral. :)

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
4:53 pm

covers the white guy response in its entirety

Entirely racist and insensitive. How does Mr. Pitts know the color of the poster’s skin? Why does he immediately jump to such a conclusion? And further more, should blog security be called into question with his statement?

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
4:53 pm

I’m about 1/128th Deleware, so only a very small part of me is offended.

But Lucky Number 7 in posts for 2012? Not bad for an old (basically) Caucasian American.

Bob the Blogger

January 2nd, 2013
4:55 pm

I just don’t see what is inherently offensive about the logo. I can even see the Chief Nokahoma character and dance being a mockery of the Native American lifestyle, but not a simple picture. Maybe it would help if he were more somber, like the Native American on the old TV commercials who was all choked up over people littering.

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
4:55 pm

Lew – You’re good with me, no matter your number or ethnicity, my friend.

cricket

January 2nd, 2013
4:55 pm

old man 4:35 pm

well said

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
4:55 pm

deciding to pay homage to their own distant ancestors

Without seeking the written consent of those descendants not affiliated with the school, yet sullied by the garish “cartoon”. A pox on them.

I can think of more recent cartoons which have incited outrage and violence. Apparently they didn’t know it was “just a cartoon.”

The insensitivity of some people. It is as if no one is thinking of the children.

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
4:56 pm

I think the cap AND the logo look cheap as heck, as do the rest of this year’s BP caps.

That contrasting bill thing is horrid. :(

RC

January 2nd, 2013
4:56 pm

old man @ 4:35,

I kind of feel similarly to you. While I don’t feel like I can say one way or another whether or not it’s racist, I can say that it’s not a very smart business decision, and it should have been obvious that it was going to be bring negative PR on the firm that it didn’t really need. Why push the issue, and even risk having the focus shift away from the team itself?

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
4:56 pm

raleighbravefan: Great story…my parents always liked her too and her hits were some of the first songs I remember hearing on the radio as a small kid. For some reason, I assumed she lived in Nashville or Tennessee, I guess because her last few albums were country.

raleighbravefan

January 2nd, 2013
4:59 pm

ken – Only us old guys give a darn. Glad to share.

Time for me to go.

Puma

January 2nd, 2013
5:00 pm

TennPaul – I assume you are referring to certain Danish cartoons depicting a certain prophet, maybe not an exact analogy, but interesting comparison.

DAP

January 2nd, 2013
5:01 pm

i am 1/16 cherokee and can prove it. so, i can speak with authority that my people and i are not offended whatsoever. carry on, braves.

TennesseePaul

January 2nd, 2013
5:01 pm

We did pretty much bully the Native Americans out of the whole continent, didn’t we?

Sheeesh, I didn’t realize you were that old, old man.

ncscoots

January 2nd, 2013
5:01 pm

And indirectly, it bothers me a bit. Reminds me of a not so wonderful part of the white man’s past.

Wait. Stop right there. Do you feel guilt because your ancestors committed atrocities or because you’re supposed to feel it? How much guilt is required? How much penance must be done to assuage that guilt, to balance the scales, to get to a point where one can look a man in the eye and take him on his own damn terms, not on the basis of what my ancestors or his ancestors did 300 years ago?

Because I don’t judge a man on his ancestry, or his color, or his creed, or any other bleeping thing, except for the man he is. And every man gets to be the man of his choice, regardless of where he came from or who he came from. It’s his choice that counts, not those made by people long dead.

Dan Uggla's Swing

January 2nd, 2013
5:01 pm

If you really want to be politically correct (or un-poltically?) about it, then stop calling them “Native Americans”. Really, because this wasn’t called America at the time. They came here from somewhere else, fought and killed each others tribes, although you wont hear about this anywhere. I dont know what they should be called, maybe Cherokee, Seminole, etc.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:02 pm

I am 1/32nd Cherokee and I am offended to the 1/32nd core.

Can I sue somebody?

:wink:

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
5:04 pm

Hear that the University of Delaware is considering changing their team’s name, the Blue Hens. Seems that some unhappy women are irate.

chipl1960

January 2nd, 2013
5:05 pm

Lew that was me on FB. Thanks for recognizing.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:08 pm

chip – Yep, recognized your name from sending the artwork. I’ll get you on the DOB FB page

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:08 pm

I am not native American, but I have several friends and some relatives who are, at least in part, mostly Cherokee.. . Most are more than happy to see references to their ancestry on sporting team logos. I know none who think they are being insulted

Ralph

January 2nd, 2013
5:09 pm

DOB, I am not a fan of Justin Upton or Fowler, bring on Gattis, if he doesn’t work out it doesn’t cost anything.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
5:10 pm

Whether it’s offensive or not [leave that aside for a sec] ‘I like it ‘ is not the first thing I think when I saw the logo. As a 55 year old white guy I thought: ‘Weird’.

So the concept of the image doesn’t offend you, but rather the execution?

I don’t know what about the execution you find so repulsive. The line work is clean, the proportions and perspective seem pretty accurate… sure, maybe some more time could have been spent on certain areas, but overall I don’t have a problem with some of the choices the artist made.

It’s better than a Jackson Pollock painting. I can at least look at this and tell what it’s supposed to be.

Mr Pitts

January 2nd, 2013
5:11 pm

“Entirely racist and insensitive. How does Mr. Pitts know the color of the poster’s skin? Why does he immediately jump to such a conclusion? And further more, should blog security be called into question with his statement?”

Oh, the irony. Funny, white guys offended. I’m an above-middle-age white guy and know very well how they think and why they think the way they do. These responses scream—white guy. Other than the 1/16 American Indian in some of you, as self-reported, am I wrong?

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
5:11 pm

This research surprised me: I knew most actors playing Native Americans in the movies and TV up until the 70’s were 99% white, Italian, Jewish, etc., but I didn’t know Jay Silverheels (the original Tonto) was the first Native American actor…I always thought Iron Eyes Cody was an Indian, but he was Italian and pretended to be a real Indian for years.
That means almost 70 years worth of movies and TV were politically incorrect and I think that is much worse than this hoopla over the Braves cap.

phil

January 2nd, 2013
5:14 pm

I don’t care what the logo is if we manage to win another world series in our collective lifetimes….

And my apologies for finishing 6th in the rankings for 2012. With as little as I have to say, that’s pathetic on my part. And that said, maybe I’ll finish 5th this year. You guys can only hope….

Happy New Year to all…

Train Wreck Bystander

January 2nd, 2013
5:14 pm

Not only do I approve of the Screaming Savage; I also think the Braves should bring back Noc-a-Homa.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:14 pm

Murph -Almost any artwork – Blue Dogs, Children with Huge Eyes, or even Elvis representations on Black Velvet are better than a Jackson POllock painting. In fact, I’d be willing to bet your four year old is a prodigy in comparison.

The A Bomb

January 2nd, 2013
5:15 pm

Face it Klingons, there are Braves fans who go back to the sixties. The team was not founded by Ted Turner.

I’m all for NOT offending people, but the past 2-3 decades, segments of society have developed wild hairs in unreachable places regarding political correctness.

I’ll be getting the hat to match the logo which has been on my iPhone since I got it. And no, my 1966 Braves yearbook with the logo is NOT for sale.

Now back to hibernation.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:15 pm

Not to forget the infamous Card Playing Dogs.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:16 pm

How come anytime someone has a disparity in home/road splits, it’s just assumed he can’t hit outside the park that is currently his home ballpark

I don’t know who posted that, but it is off the mark. Those splits are only a reference and mostly apply to players who are in either hitter or pitcher friendly parks. in about ⅔ of the parks they hardly apply at all.

Ken Stallings

January 2nd, 2013
5:17 pm

DOB,

Am I right to conclude that you think vinyl LP’s are superior in music quality to CD’s and other digital forms?

I have never seen that to be honest. Perhaps a lot has to do with the quality of your turntable, but for me the CD’s were vastly better in quality and I’ve not understood why many audiophiles consider the LP a superior format.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
5:18 pm

Every year in school we used to go on field trips to the local Navajo indian reservation. It was supposed to be a chance for us to learn about their culture and heritage.

Instead it was a bunch of old women trying to sell us those little capsules that you put in water and, when the capsule dissolves, you’re left with a little foam animal.

So, based on my visits, I concluded that the Navajo were likely the foam animal pioneers of North America and that reliance on the little foam donkeys and horses was probably the tribes’ undoing.

phil

January 2nd, 2013
5:19 pm

Why not the Atlanta Whiteskins?

I CAN see the point where this stuff is concerned, but we have been down this road many times now.

phil

January 2nd, 2013
5:19 pm

Why not the Atlanta Whiteskins?

I CAN see the point where this stuff is concerned, but we have been down this road many times now.

rms

January 2nd, 2013
5:20 pm

A screaming Braves Indian logo…..I always thought that Indian mascot was laughing!

StingerSplash

January 2nd, 2013
5:20 pm

DOB, the first two songs to pop up on my iPod while driving to work today were Neil Young’s “Welfare Mothers” and “Under the Milky Way” by The Church. I will now resume listening to My Morning Jacket on YouTube while I put off doing more work.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:21 pm

Ken – Yeah, I’ll take a CD over vinyl any day. I always had good turntables, used anti static guns and fluid with a disc preener and still liked the clarity of a CD much more.

Honestly, to me, vinyl was more trouble than the difference (IF I could have even heard the difference) was worth.

extremus

January 2nd, 2013
5:24 pm

I find political correctness to be perhaps the most offensive thing in our society today. I personally feel that it was one of the initial footholds that paved the way for a lot of very important personal freedoms and rights to independent thought and conviction to be taken away. But that’s just me (and millions of other American citizens).

Teams of any sport don’t adopt a name to lampoon a race or culture; to do so they’d be lampooning themselves. Whether you’re talking about Braves, Indians, Vikings, Fighting Irish, Spartans, Trojans, Cowboys, or Falcons (or any other animal species), if anything is implied by the names or the logos it’s a sense of pride and honor to be associated with that group, be it a band of fierce warriors or a predatory animal.

A lot of people take the Redskins name to task, and while I admit that it does tread closer to a racial terminology that might be considered offensive than most, I remember an episode of the old 90s TV show Quantum Leap where Sam was helping an elderly Indian who was running from authorities. All through the episode the old man rooted for the Redskins to “beat those Cowboys” and called the Redskins “the best d— team in America”. I’m sure that a fictional TV character doesn’t speak for everyone (or at least certainly for all Native Americans in this case), but the point that I took from it was that most folks just enjoy the game and root for a team regardless of their heritage. The “squeaky wheels” that crawl out of the woodwork at every opportunity aren’t doing so nearly as much out of outrage over a perceived slight as they are for facetime and attention. There are much more pressing issues facing our society right now to be paying these clowns any attention.

Sorry if I offended any clowns with this post, by the way.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:24 pm

But – that being said – many audiophiles prefer vinyl, so more power to em. Choice is always a good thing.

phil

January 2nd, 2013
5:26 pm

extremus – you put that pretty darn well…

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
5:29 pm

As I have related on here many times, I was a huge fan of the Atlanta Crackers growing up, and their players were my heroes. I listened to all the games, collected photos (there were hardly any minor league baseball cards back then), autographs, jerseys, programs, etc. and I still have all that stuff and I don’t ever want to sell it.
The name “Crackers” was never a thought or problem as to what it really meant until a few years ago when (usually) young kids would kid me if they heard me mention the name. And I still don’t know how to answer or react if someone kids me or makes fun of the name Crackers, so I usually never mention it except on here where it might relate to the discussion and I find that rather sad. And I certainly will never wear in public any of the jerseys or the 2 very nice jackets I own, and that sucks IMHO.
scoots, your 5:01 comment was right on point, thanks.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:29 pm

CD any day of the week. most of that vinyl snobbishness about sound has been disproved in hundreds perhaps thousands of double blind listening tests over the decades.
some of the original CDs were indeed harsh, but soon most folks could not tell the difference in tests.
prolly politically incorrect to say that though, all in the mind….. ;)

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
5:30 pm

Not to forget the infamous Card Playing Dogs

Lew- now you have gone too far. Three of my four walls are adorned with Cassius Marcellus Coolidge’s fine art. Known far and wide for his “mastery of light and colour that escapes many artists whose work is taken much more seriously”, Coolidge continues to delight male friends of all ages. :wink:

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:31 pm

scoots was finally right about sumthang???

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
5:34 pm

So one “middle aged white guy” knows how every other white person on earth thinks? Seems logical

Nativebird

January 2nd, 2013
5:35 pm

I am native american.
Love the logo.
Bring it back on all Braves uniform
Bring back Knockahomer homa and the teepee. Mather best

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:35 pm

Day of Rain – Gone too far? I said he was better than Pollock, didn’t I?

As far as I’m concerned, Jackson Pollock was ano talent drunk who likely didn’t have a clue what he was doing. However, the established world of art critics have been known for decades to have an Emporer’s New Clothes approach to art criticism and don’t know their collective butts from the proverbial hole in the ground.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:38 pm

I can hardly wait till we talk about baseball again.

:sad:

Norris Chuck

January 2nd, 2013
5:40 pm

Marlins Will Listen On Giancarlo Stanton

By Zach Links [January 2 at 1:47pm CST]

WEDNESDAY: Though there’s lots of interest in Stanton, Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports hears from sources who all but rule out a trade (Twitter link). One person told Rosenthal chances of a deal are “as close to zero as they can be.”

Read more at http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/#0Boggyq3Wi9A3w2p.99

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:40 pm

DS1- Come on Dude – a little culture could do you good.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:40 pm

how can abstract expressionism be judged as good or bad ?

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:41 pm

isn’t it kinda like rating Rorschach tests? ;)

phil

January 2nd, 2013
5:42 pm

Can Rorschach play third?

Decent OBP?

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
5:43 pm

:oops: Lew, I also think that anyone spewing paint over canvas is a joke. But I still like my poker playing friends.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
5:44 pm

nolie – I don’t know, but I usually look at whether or not it looks as good asd what my son did when he was two.

Art to me has structure, and requires a knowledge of color and composition and a skill set that actualy takes time to develop.

Pollock’s art exhibits none of this – unless you consider the fact he used color as a knowledge of color theory. I don’t.

jbill

January 2nd, 2013
5:46 pm

Welcome back DOB…
I love the logo, always have.
Hope the Braves get Flower.

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
5:46 pm

The Redskins Cowboys Week 17 game was the NFL’s highest rated regular season prime-time game in 15 years!

Because of this, next season the Redskins will play FIVE prime-time games!

Hail to the REDSKINS! Hail VICTORY! BRAVES on the WARPATH! FIGHT for old DC!

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:47 pm

I understand the skill set argument, I have artist friends that insist an artist should be able to draw a straight line even if he never uses one.
just kidding around, I am not an abstract fan, I agree with your above post pretty much

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:49 pm

Lew

My friends say any discussion of culture would be lost on me. My mother-in-law says all my taste is in my mouth. I daresay I need a lot more than culture.

:wink:

phil

Rorschach is has a ceiling as a utility infielder at best……..

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:49 pm

y’all might have noticed over the years that I am not the most politically correct guy in the world. Redskins scalp Cowboys is a great headline IMO

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:51 pm

Truth be known, for such an outspoken conservative, I am actually fairly artistic. Whodathunk?

VaBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
5:52 pm

Hell Yes nolie!!!

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
5:54 pm

is that artistic or autistic?

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
5:55 pm

You guys are forgetting why LP’s are so much better that CD’s: you can’t clean your pot of seeds and stems with those little plastic CD covers near as good as you could with an album cover. Duh!

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:55 pm

is has?? Mrs Brammlett is rolling over in her grave!

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
5:57 pm

Be careful nolie, you’ll be accused of being insensitive!

CB

January 2nd, 2013
5:59 pm

Giants just won another WS, they signed Scott Proctor.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
5:59 pm

Rorschach is has a ceiling as a utility infielder at best……..

It all depends on how you interpret his home/away splits, really…

chuck

January 2nd, 2013
6:00 pm

I wonder if anybody cares about your choice of music or movies. From what I see yo need an update in your choice of music and probably movies as well really bad. I would hate to have to listen to the music you put on every column.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:00 pm

yeah Pammy will come back and call me a meanie again….

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
6:00 pm

You guys are forgetting why LP’s are so much better that CD’s: you can’t clean your pot of seeds and stems with those little plastic CD covers near as good as you could with an album cover. Duh!

:D

You got it Ken!

But, nowadays, you’d be hard-pressed to find a seed in a sack.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
6:01 pm

Well, I could be wrong, but I believe diversity is an old, old wooden ship that was used during the Civil War era.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
6:01 pm

Murph

Depends on what your definition of the word “is” is.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:03 pm

seed in a sack? why WalMart has it in the Home and garden section every day

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
6:03 pm

Depends on what your definition of the word “is” is.

You’re offending me.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
6:04 pm

How bout them Braves!!

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:05 pm

who are the Braves??

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
6:06 pm

Murph

And I was starting to wonder if I was going to do anything useful today……..

:wink:

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
6:08 pm

VaBravesFan-

My ten year old son and I were at old DC stadium in 1972 when the Skins beat the Cowboys for the NFC championship – a Super Bowl year. That old stadium rocked that day, but watching the marching band and crowd singing the song after the Morris touchdown was truly hair-raising. All pro football teams should have a rallying song.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:09 pm

My ten year old son and I were at old DC stadium in 1972 …ADOR

damn, A DAY OF RAIN must be one old f@art……

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
6:10 pm

I will admit that at my age, I miss the larger format of albums – at least I could still read the liner notes without a magnifying glass. Plus, the artwork always looked nicer when you could see all that was going on in it.

Numba1Fan

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

On Andrew Jones ……………….

“And another one bites the dust”
Nicole Jones is seeking joint legal and primary custody of the couple’s 9-year-old son, the complaint said. She is asking for child support, alimony and half of the couple’s property. She also wants a judge to declare their prenuptial agreement null and void………….OUCH!!!!!!!

Andruw may want to ask for plitical assylum while playing over in Japan……. This is going to be expensive and an albatross around his neck doe the next 10 year

Numba1Fan

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

On Andrew Jones ……………….

“And another one bites the dust”
Nicole Jones is seeking joint legal and primary custody of the couple’s 9-year-old son, the complaint said. She is asking for child support, alimony and half of the couple’s property. She also wants a judge to declare their prenuptial agreement null and void………….OUCH!!!!!!!

Andruw may want to ask for plitical assylum while playing over in Japan……. This is going to be expensive and an albatross around his neck doe the next 10 year

Bill Moyet

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

It is clear now that this blog is of a certain mindset. Over 200 comments and no one has the intellectually honesty or decency to admit that reducing victims of genocide to mascots should be offensive to everyone. You shouldn’t need one of the few remaining Native Americans left to come off the reservation and tell you this!

By the reasoning of this blog, I guess it will be ok to have a mascot featuring the victims of concentration camps unless and until someone complains. What is it about a segment of the population that feels the need to have a laugh at the expense of other people’s suffering. Why is it this segment always pretends it is the victim?

I predict that in the coming decades, many of the teams now using these symbols of oppression will stop as younger generations aren’t so sanguine about genocide and find it hard to be proud of such a blatant lack of empathy.

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

nolie- Eighty later this year. Qualifies me for farthood.

Enquiring Minds Want To Know

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

I’m old enough to have owned many, many (probably too many) LP’s, and still have lots. To me, CD’s are a vast improvement because of their superior convenience and longevity. Yeah, I get the assertions of more “warmth” in analog recordings, but that is all more than offset by the pops and hisses that vinyl is heir to.

The thing I do miss about LP’s are the jackets. Cool art, and big enough to appreciate it. I have several framed and hung in my den.

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
6:14 pm

I’ve always wondered why, back in the days of vinyl, they actually got a couple of album covers past the censors – Like the origianl cover of the Blind Faith album, Mom’s Apple pie’s original cover and the one and only cover of Jumpin The Gunne by Jo Jo Gunne.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:16 pm

yup album covers were the best, but I don’t care how careful you are the discs will start to pop and i hate that

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:18 pm

Lew

January 2nd, 2013
6:20 pm

nolie – Exactly – and on a really good turntable with a top line cartridge, those pops sounded like nuclear blasts.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
6:20 pm

80? wow. congrats, I feel aged at 67

Mr Pitts

January 2nd, 2013
6:26 pm

Bill Moyet, I was trying to say the same thing without the depth and eloquence displayed in your post.

Thanks

And a Day of Rain

January 2nd, 2013
6:27 pm

nolie- Hang in there – the best is yet to come.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
6:27 pm

What is it about a segment of the population that feels the need to have a laugh at the expense of other people’s suffering. Why is it this segment always pretends it is the victim? — Bill Moyet

Laugh at them? Hmm, you must know different types of people than I do. People I know don’t laugh at the Brave logo or the name or any of the symbols associated with it. Quite the contrary, they think it’s kind of badass. I doubt they’d want to be associated with it if they were laughing at it. And I don’t speak for others, but I certainly realize I’m not a victim of anything, while Native Americans, blacks and other minorities have been and continue to be.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
6:28 pm

“You guys are forgetting why LP’s are so much better that CD’s: you can’t clean your pot of seeds and stems with those little plastic CD covers near as good as you could with an album cover. Duh!”
——————————————————
while listening to the LP while you do this task ….but I have to admit CD sound quality is quite superior…

Enquiring Minds Want To Know

January 2nd, 2013
6:35 pm

you can’t clean your pot of seeds and stems with those little plastic CD covers near as good as you could with an album cover.

In that regard I recall another technological advance that helped doom the LP: The metal “tip tray” that American Express gave out to all the restaurants. The lip kept the seeds from rolling into the carpet.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
6:40 pm

Ray Lewis…enough already…his retirement announcement is not enough to motivate the Ravens to the Super Bowl….they just ain’t hot at the right time and with Denver and New England in the way…..he had a great career though…also Luck over RG3 any day of the week for a quarterback…why does this guy get overlooked…it is because he isn’t in any commercials

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
6:43 pm

CD any day of the week. most of that vinyl snobbishness about sound has been disproved in hundreds perhaps thousands of double blind listening tests over the decades.
some of the original CDs were indeed harsh, but soon most folks could not tell the difference in tests.
prolly politically incorrect to say that though, all in the mind….
— nolie

Well, that’s a new one. Politically correct to say one thinks vinyl sounds better than CDs. Yep, can honestly say I’ve never seen PC applied to one’s tastes in music recording platforms.

For what it’s worth, CDs are infinitely more convienient and easier to store, etc., and I have about 10 times as many CDs as I do albums. That said, in many if not most cases, I find vinyl, particularly the heavyweight vinyl from the ’60s and the high-grade, heavier vinyl they’ve been using in the past few years, sounds better, richer, fuller than CDs in most cases. And that’s just using a $100 Denon turntable, nothing fancy at all. Sounds great. And if you maintained your albums in pristine condition, or bought them from someone who did (my hand’s raised in both instances), there just aren’t the annoying pops that you and Lew have described.

Maybe if you’re playing them on something much more high-tech than what I have, but the records I’ve bought recently, and the ones from my own collection dating back to the 70s, don’t have scratches and cuts on them, and don’t have the pops and hisses you’ve described. And that’s dozens and dozens of albums from the early ’60s forward.

But as I said, I own far more CDs, because they’re convenient — I can take them from home to car, etc — and actually a lot cheaper (new vinyl goes for around $20 these days, in many cases double the price of the same recording on CD, or more than double if I can find it used).

Bayou Brave

January 2nd, 2013
6:43 pm

I will definitely be buying one of those hats. They look sharp.

Those S. Carolina “‘Cocks” hats are offensive.

Murph

January 2nd, 2013
6:43 pm

The Rangers Caravan is hitting Austin on the 24th… $40 for a ticket, no word on who will be attending.

I think I’ll go in full indian dress and see what happens.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
6:45 pm

Why not the Atlanta Whiteskins? — phil

Because that would be a stupid name and not emblematic of any recognizable group, warrior or otherwise?

Disgusted

January 2nd, 2013
6:47 pm

That logo is just plain ugly — we have better logos in team history.

The Braves name should be here to stay — at least it will be in my lifetime.

Once I am gone they could change the name to the commodes and I will never know about it during my dirt nap.

I hope not.

Disgusted

January 2nd, 2013
6:49 pm

Ray Lewis is one guy I wll not miss.

One of the reasons we have had such trouble getting another SB here.

Not a good guy. You all know the story. No need for rehashing.

Bill Moyet

January 2nd, 2013
6:49 pm

DOB, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I in no way meant to say that you are a KKK’er or someone of that ilk. I hope the main take away from my comment is that we easily forget who the First Americans were and how they came to become mascots and insignia. I disagree that it was because they were badasses, and believe it is because they were victims of genocide. Any discussion of why people find these relics insensitive and racist most include, at least, a mention of genocide.

In other parts of the world genocide is never forgotten. Talk to some Armenians,Rwandans. or Aboriginal Australians if you need examples of how genocide are thought about decades and centuries after they end. I don’t think it is a bad thing that some current North Americans (Canadians are also dealing with the issue) are asking that no one be allowed to pretend history is accurately portrayed in the westerns shown on tv.

That said…I wish the Braves would go ahead and acquire someone or start with the,”we only have tweeking left to do” comments.

Train Wreck Bystander

January 2nd, 2013
6:52 pm

The only thing I miss about vinyl is the large cover art and goodies like posters, booklets and such. The ELO spaceship model in Out of the Blue was the coolest thing ever.

Nowadays, I buy CDs and rip lossless copies to my PC. CDs from legacy artists are dirt cheap right now.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
6:52 pm

those S. Carolina “‘Cocks” hats are offensive.
——————————
Game-Cocks…. isn’t that offensive to non-fighting roosters or hens

Disgusted

January 2nd, 2013
6:54 pm

Too bad about Patti Page — she lived a long life — signature hit the “How much is that Doggie on the Menu” oh oh I mean window song.

Though I am not familiar with Bobby Womack that is sad news about his illness.

Like all of us musicians get old.

mrnatural

January 2nd, 2013
6:55 pm

I don’t find the new BP cap logo offensive. I just don’t think it lands. Not kitch, not class. The only cap I like is the classic blue, red brim, A-logo and red button. That solid blue thing they wear some times is the pits. The blue doesn’t even come close to matching any other blue on the uni

Disgusted

January 2nd, 2013
7:01 pm

The tomahawk logo is the best

I can understand the dislike of the Homer the Brave logo.

I would not like the depiction if I were Native American and its just a god awful ugly logo.

Maybe we should change the name to the Atlanta Vampires. Or, how about the water rats.

On second thought maybe not.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
7:03 pm

I don’t find the new BP cap logo offensive. I just don’t think it lands. Not kitch, not class. — mrnatural

I loved it on the jersey sleeve, but agree it’s awkward as a stand-alone logo on the BP cap. Maybe it’ll grow on me, assuming they actually end up wearing it. (The red jerseys certainly have not, and I don’t like the blue alternate road jerseys much, either. But I think the Braves’ creme-colored home uni’s and grey road uni’s are as sharp as any in baseball.)

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:06 pm

“across 110 street” by bobby womack may have been one of the greatest intro songs for a movie ever

DawgDad

January 2nd, 2013
7:11 pm

I get offended every day and I have to look no further than the front page of the AJC. On the rare day that isn’t the case I just turn to page 2. Simply tune out the demagogues and we’ll all be better off.

No problem with the Braves giving Gattis a look in left field. Wren’s track record on bringing in veteran left fielders is . . . not comforting.

Rating the Braves infield that high is a real stretch. Freeman is good, Simmons looks real good but is unproven over the long haul, no one knows who’s playing third, and please don’t get me started on the fireplug playing second base.

Puma

January 2nd, 2013
7:13 pm

I also love the cream colored uni’s, but I also love the navy road jersey’s as well. Wish they would can the red jersey, not a fan of that one at all. I think they got too much going on these days with uniforms, keep it simple with the traditional home and away, then maybe one alternate uniform.

Unrelated, but I also love the Falcons home alternated uniform, wish they would go back to that full time – black jerseys and red helmet.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
7:17 pm

“across 110 street” by bobby womack may have been one of the greatest intro songs for a movie ever — Lee in S GA

Oh, yes. Absolutely. Pam Grier, aka Jackie Brown, aka Foxy Brown, aka Coffy…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtzRJgZG98I

jeffrey d

January 2nd, 2013
7:18 pm

What does everyone have against the red jerseys??

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:19 pm

“Oh, yes. Absolutely. Pam Grier, aka Jackie Brown, aka Foxy Brown, aka Coffy…”
———————————–
DOB ….oh yeah

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:20 pm

Jeffrey-

They are ugly. The red is horrible

DawgDad

January 2nd, 2013
7:23 pm

” I hope the main take away from my comment is that we easily forget who the First Americans were and how they came to become mascots and insignia. I disagree that it was because they were badasses, and believe it is because they were victims of genocide.”

So, how do you explain the Dallas Cowboys??? I sure hope you aren’t writing history books.

Hugo Z Hackenbush

January 2nd, 2013
7:28 pm

Hey the Braves were the final jeopardy answer tonight!

Hugo Z Hackenbush

January 2nd, 2013
7:29 pm

Or question. Whatever.

jeffrey d

January 2nd, 2013
7:31 pm

Oh….well that settles everything then.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:34 pm

jeffery-

Well, you did ask ;)

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
7:36 pm

Poll added to blog — vote how you feel about the retro-style Indian-head logo.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:37 pm

I like the Braves’ red uniforms but then again me and cabravesfan can only agree that USC …was …well pitiful this season…sorry could not resist

jeffrey d

January 2nd, 2013
7:38 pm

So the 49ers’ home uniforms are ugly too I guess.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:39 pm

Lee-

Why are you sorry? USC had very high expectations (with good reason) heading into this season. The end result was nothing short of disastrous. It is what it is.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:40 pm

jeffrey-

No- it’s the shade of red that I don’t like. It’s too glaringly bright. If it was a darker/softer/less neon looking red, I’d like it a lot more.

keyLargo.

January 2nd, 2013
7:41 pm

What does everyone have against the red jerseys??

They’re Red. Cincy, gNats and Phillies are red. The Braves are blue.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:42 pm

Perhaps they look better in person. On TV, they don’t look good…

bravofan

January 2nd, 2013
7:42 pm

I am very disappointed the Braves have yet to release Caravan details. I asked them on twitter and they said sometime this week.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:43 pm

So they’ve got 2 more days before you should be disappointed :)

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:46 pm

Why are you sorry? USC had very high expectations (with good reason) heading into this season. “The end result was nothing short of disastrous. It is what it is.”
—————————–
just don’t ever remember a team ranked # 1 in the preseason finishing as bad as they did… USC even lost to a sub-par win/loss team… of all people …GA TECH in the bowl game…but I am sure they will turn it around with that great coach they have next season…he needs to be fired ASAP

OldGold64

January 2nd, 2013
7:47 pm

The logo is racist! If it was slang for Africian-Americans…you would have Jesse jackso, Al Sharpton and all the attention grabbers down in Atlanta screaming!

bravofan

January 2nd, 2013
7:49 pm

cabravesfan: Yes they said sometime this week. I feel as if it should have been announced already/earlier than today! It would be nice to make plans.

Charlie Lau

January 2nd, 2013
7:49 pm

Loved the logo. It didn’t start in ATL

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
7:50 pm

I also hate the red jerseys. Love the cream unis and the road blues. Wish we had the DBacks’ color of red….a “warm” red with substance and ‘want.’

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:52 pm

Lee-

I feel that the bowl game would have turned out differently if Barkley had played. Max Wittek was flat out awful (he had at least 4 passes batted at the line and HE IS 6′4″!) – we was supposed to be the heir apparent, but he pretty much played his way into a spring competition…

But I’m moving on. Not the end of the world.

Jimiz

January 2nd, 2013
7:52 pm

Hello my fellow Braves fans. Happy new years to all.
I must say as a Native American fan i really like the logo’s. To me pro sports has done a good job not to use any logo that would be offensive to most of use. Some of our elders are sensative and do not support any reference to Native Americans. But like Dave said alot of the people involved in saying these logo’s are racist are not even Native American. I think most of these people use the race card to draw attention to themselves and could careless about Native Americans.
I really don’t see Atlanta making any new moves until they get a better feel for what they have. Since they really won’t know that until S.T gets here they could be in a holding pattern. Unless the guy they want becomes available for the right deal. I have a feeling about Gattis we need to give him a shot because if he succeeds he would make a great piece to trade to an AL team. He could play LF this year and move back to catcher for a year until Betancourts ready. Then he would be a great fit for D.H. in the A.L.
Just a thought who knows what will happen really. Go Braves

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:55 pm

understand ….but their coach’s bark is more words than action…he is a jerk…maybe next season them and georgia for the nat’l championship

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
7:56 pm

coach can’t do anything if the players are not playing well…

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
7:58 pm

Jimiz
——————
I wish I knew u in person…we could probably drink a few beers together at the Braves game…too much other stuff too worry about in today’s world

keyLargo.

January 2nd, 2013
8:02 pm

I have a feeling about Gattis we need to give him a shot because if he succeeds he would make a great piece to trade to an AL team.

I have a different idea. If he succeedes, he can be a fixture in LF for several years. The revolving door in LF is getting old.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:04 pm

WHAT? Frank has been back to work for a day and no deals so far?

What’s the holdup, brother?

:twisted:

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:07 pm

DS1-

Come on now, you know nothing gets done on the first day after vacation! ;)

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:07 pm

Key

Novel concept!

:wink:

Braveone

January 2nd, 2013
8:08 pm

Total posts on the blog have declined from 453,125(2010) to 426,588(2011) to 355,471(2012). Also, different poster names have declined from 9,976(2010) to 8,150(2011) to 5,989(2012). nolie is the only poster who has been in Top 5 all 3 years.

From all blogs in 2010 which totals 453,125 comments, Trey led the way with 7,845 posts. There were 9,976 different poster names. Here are the Top 100:

Rank Poster Frequency Percent Cumulative_%

1 Trey 7,845 1.7 1.7
2 nolie 7,813 1.7 3.5
3 Tomahawkin 7,732 1.7 5.2
4 David O’Brien 7,466 1.6 6.8
5 jeffrey d 6,643 1.5 8.3

From all blogs in 2011 which totals 426,588 comments, cabravesfan led the way with 12,086 posts. There were 8,150 different poster names. Here are the Top 100:

Rank Poster Frequency Percent Cumulative_%

1 cabravesfan 12,086 2.8 2.8
2 nolie 10,336 2.4 5.3
3 Lew 9,035 2.1 7.4
4 Tomahawkin 8,806 2.1 9.4
5 Efrim 8,290 1.9 11.4

From all blogs in 2012 which totals 355,471 comments, nolie led the way with 16,486 posts. There were different poster names. Here are the Top 100:

Rank Poster Frequency Percent Cumulative_%

1 nolie 16,486 4.6 4.6
2 TheOnlyBravesFan 12,541 3.5 8.2
3 Efrim 10,294 2.9 11.1
4 Venice Jim 9,643 2.7 13.8
5 cabravesfan 8,706 2.4 16.2

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:08 pm

cab

I got a heckuva lot done today…………

Hope you guys had a nice holiday!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:11 pm

DS1-

I worked out this morning…than sat on the sofa and watched a Top Chef marathon all day. Didn’t even turn my computer on until I “officially” stopped working at 4:45 :)

We had a very good holiday- hope Mrs. DS1 & DS1 Jrs did as well!

keyLargo.

January 2nd, 2013
8:11 pm

DS1 – I’ve never seen more people anxious to trade away the entire farm system. If they’ve heard the name, they’ll propose that he should be traded.

George_George

January 2nd, 2013
8:17 pm

BravesFanInNashville

January 2nd, 2013
3:32 pm
The above 3:32 post says it very well about BUD’s silly playoff system.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:17 pm

Braveone

Very interesting data. But where is the list for most amusing poster? I’m sure I’d be a landslide winner!

:wink:

N8

January 2nd, 2013
8:19 pm

DOB,

I’ve always loved tht logo. My favorite Braves logo. My favorite hat is the Hank Aaron era cursive-lower case ‘a” with the white and royal blue.

I’m in agreement with you, that without being native american, I’m not sure we can really judge their opinion and if any of them dislike it or feel slighted by the use of it, to an extent we should be sensitive of that.

That being said, I also agree with you that it is the minority of native americans that have any real issue with any teams using these logos. Living in ND, we’ve been going through this for years it seems like with the UND Fighting Sioux. MILLIONS of dollars were donated by an Ralph Engelstadt (the name of the arena), and he battled back and forth over future support and what not with the NCAA over this issue.

Keep in mind that there is a very significant portion of our state that is native american. I have native american friends, as does my wife and all three kids. I have NEVER met one that has seemed outraged over the use of the logo. And yeah…… i’ve asked my buddies if it bothers them.

Bigger issues for them and our government, and the NCAA to tackle in my opinion.

Am I going to buy one of these Braves hats? Uh… Yup. Probably as soon as they hit the market. Because as soon as the griping gets too loud….. they’ll get pulled.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:20 pm

Key

Arm chair GM’ing is running rampant on the blog.

cab

Ms DS1 and the DS1Jr’s (which are all taller than me, btw) are all thinking that DS1 is getting WAY too cheap in his old age.

:wink:

But we did enjoy one anothers company during the holidays.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
8:22 pm

What does everyone have against the red jerseys??

People don’t like those? Wow…. I personally like those the most!

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:23 pm

BF Chris

Made some chili last night. Having some with Ms DS1’s outstanding sweet cornbread tonight. This might be as close to heaven as I will get!

:wink:

N8

Buy em up while they last. Better than socking away $$ into a 401K.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:23 pm

DS1-

Well, you can make it up to Mrs. DS1 at least by taking her shopping on Rodeo Drive… ;)

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:23 pm

Red jersey’s and red convertible’s. Can’t beat em.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
8:24 pm

Ben Duronio ‏@Ben_Duronio
Mike Minor will be a 4 win pitcher this year

Think…. think…

Simpson's Homer

January 2nd, 2013
8:24 pm

Our society has become far too intolerant of anyone or anything that some cultural elitist can label as racist or intolerant.

I’m OK with the Braves changing their names to the “Slightly Assertive Pacifists” with a Gerber daisy as the logo,- — IF we could win another World Series before I die………! They could be called the SAPs for short — just WIN a World Series!!!!!

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:24 pm

cab

But, she’s not a cowgirl………….

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:26 pm

Homer

If it were my call, I’d name them whatever ticked off the elitist the most.

MitchC

January 2nd, 2013
8:27 pm

Dave, I dont like the logo, but I just think it looks ugly. If people find it offensive, maybe they shouldnt use it,. It wouldnt be the first time a sports team had changed a logo or name due to people finding it politically incorrect.

Look at the situation with the NBA;s team in Washington,. For many years, they were called the Bullets. Then, when Israeli president Yitzhak Rabin was murdered, Bullets owner Abe Poillin voluntarially ditched the name of the team, saying he couldnt go on using a team name he felt was violent, because President Rabin had been murdered by bullets.

I know this is a different situation. I certainly dont think that this situation merits the Braves changing their team name, but, if a batting practice logo is offensive, my opinion is dont use it. There is enough controversy in the world.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:27 pm

DS1-

Then she’d love it ;) Or you can just give her your credit card and I can show her around…

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:28 pm

cab

Now THAT’s a scary thought!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:30 pm

DS1-

:D I promise we won’t spend too much. Just the right amount

N8

January 2nd, 2013
8:30 pm

Red Jerseys: Ugly as sin. But better at night when they appear to look darker. Than on Sunday afternoons.

Blue Road Jerseys: BAD ASS. Love them. But I despise the red on most of the Braves jerseys. Not a big fan of red in general. Which REALLY sucks for supporting my football team.

Vynyl: Sounds better when in pristine shape and way cooler just because of the inserts, posters and general swag that was inside of them in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s.

CD’s: More convenient/durable.

Nowhere man

January 2nd, 2013
8:33 pm

Ted Koppel reporting. DOB’s new blog was just in time to avoid the cliff. Though many on both sides of the aisle are not happy at least it’s a start.

Ozzie

January 2nd, 2013
8:33 pm

DOB – Why are people not comparing Upton’s to Fowler’s home road splits well bc Upton is a much better and more productive hitter. He is also a year younger.

2008-2012 Totals

Upton

Hits – 708
HR – 106
RBIs – 352
SO – 657
BB – 295
SO/BB – 2.23 (sluggers SO more)
SB – 78
CS – 34

Fowler (same time span)

Hits – 497
HR – 28
RBIs – 168
SO – 483
BB – 260
SO/BB – 1.86
SB – 64
CS – 33

Apart from SO/BB ratio Upton is much better. Put him in Coors field and he will hit 40 HRs/yr when healthy. Fowler will never sniff that number.

Given Uggla and Mac could be black holes at the plate and with the loss of Chipper this team needs another RBI guy more than a table setter.

And for fun here are Justin’s stats at Turner Field

BA – .500
OPS – 1.183
OPB – .583
Slug – .600

and now Fowler’s

BA – .200
OPS – .561
OPB – .294
Slug – .267

Enjoy….

Nowhere man

January 2nd, 2013
8:35 pm

You would expect the number of comments to be down with the posters that have left due to the herd or other reasons.

MikeInFl

January 2nd, 2013
8:36 pm

As a Dawg fan stuck here in Gator Country, I’m lovin’ that first play. Doubt it’ll hold up, but it’s a start.

Mark me as thumbs down on the logo. I just don’t think it’s such a meaningful part of Braves’ history that it merits pushing the envelope.

Nowhere man

January 2nd, 2013
8:36 pm

Thanks for the new blog

[...] The rest of the article can be found here: Atlanta Braves [...]

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
8:38 pm

That shade of red is awful. If it was actually red like the one they were on the white jersey, a scarlet red I think its called, that would be better and more true to the uniform. Just my two cents.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:40 pm

Nowhere Man

Amen on the reason that posts are down. I love the idea of a blog registration. But I’ve beaten that dead horse too many times.

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
8:41 pm

No problem with folks that do not like the red uni’s. I’m just a red guy.

Rich W

January 2nd, 2013
8:43 pm

I’m a Brave fan 1954, through thin and thick!
While I have not read all the posts in this thread, I like to make two points.

1. To some people (both native American and others) the screaming or laughing brave logo is offensive and hurtful in the same way as the old front lawn statue of an African American posed to “hold the reins of your horse” was offensive. The reason is that it (mis)characterizes a group of people and makes an unsympathetic generalization that African Americans are good mainly for slaves or servants, and in the case of the Braves logo, that young native Americans had or have as their primary quality or characteristic to be yelling or screaming or just making noise. Similar simplistic images have been used to marginalize many people. Therefore, they offend and hurt..

2. While we all have freedom of speech, that does not make what we choose to say respectful, intelligent or free from causing hurt or pain. Sure you can say what you want, but words or pictures have consequences, some good, some hurtful. It seems to me that a person would not want to offend or hurt just so the speaker can exercise his/her right. Would you put an African American servant (slave) in your front yard today? You have the right. Would you do it, knowing how it hurts. If the Brave hat logo hurts, you could wear it, but do you want to?

Joey M

January 2nd, 2013
8:46 pm

I have seen more written about the Braves new hats than I ever saw about Benghazi. That’s pathetic.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
8:46 pm

I’m just a red guy.

Neck too? :lol:

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
8:49 pm

I like red- just not THAT red

Train Wreck Bystander

January 2nd, 2013
8:50 pm

If Native American groups were protesting the logo, it would be a different matter. But that’s not the case – it’s the PC crowd that is up in arms and quite frankly, I give not a rat’s arse about the opinions of said crowd.

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
8:52 pm

I don’t love or hate the new hats, but I honestly don’t see how a big deal can be made out of that logo when there is a team in D.C. called the Redskins. I can’t speak to what is offensive to a certain group of people but that one sticks out to me more than anything the braves have done lately.

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
8:57 pm

Whether this score holds or not I thought the Gators were overrated pretty much all year. Maybe they’ll change my mind by the end of the game and just expose the bias I have against them or they’ll prove me right.

David O'Brien

January 2nd, 2013
8:58 pm

Ozzie, nice attempt at twisting stats to make a point (your 8:33 p.m. comment). Face it, Justin Upton’s home-road splits, last season and for his career, are Coors Field-like, which is really not good for a player who doesn’t play for Colorado. That’s an alarming disparity.

And why do you give raw totals (hits, etc.) for 2008-2012 when Fowler was a minor leaguer in 2008 who only came up for 27 plate appearances in majors that season? How silly and irrelevant. Give their 2009-2012 totals or just don’t bother. (Upton had a 43-game, 152-PA stint in the majors as a rookie in 2007, and had 569 plate appearances by the end of the 2008 season.)

Lastly, I don’t know where you got your stats for Justin Upton at Turner Field, but they’re innacurate. The guy is a solid 17-for-58 (.293) with one homer, a .388 OBP and .483 slugging percentage at Turner Field, not the gaudy .500/.583/.600 line you posted.

Otherwise, nice attempt to persuade.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
8:58 pm

“Not a big fan of red in general. Which REALLY sucks for supporting my football team.”

———————————————————

no offense but the cheifs (sorry ..love that commercial where they spelled it wrong) suck…this is not the Len Dawson days any longer ..though I suspect ur too young to remember those…shame being a fan of this forgotten team…do u even remember the Oakland / KC games that meant something..

Couch Tater

January 2nd, 2013
9:03 pm

Open a Cherokee Noc A Homa Casino next door to Turner Field to increase attendance. Caps required for the Cherokee Noc A Homa Relief Man Shuttle to the game. (Proceeds to the House)

Get rid Send your little Braves on their merry way for hours of entertaining Braves baseball.

“Y’all come on back, right after the game, now. Text us, if, Medlen hits a homerun in the 4th. We got him at 700 to 1 on Bobby’s Spike Shoe Jackpot.”

Mr Pitts

January 2nd, 2013
9:03 pm

Jimiz, uh,OK.

USC got want they wanted….Lane Kiffen. He was a horrible hire and just hope they keep him so Oregon and Stanford can continue to abuse them.

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
9:05 pm

Red and Black looks good together for the falcons, but I really wish they would go back to their old jersey’s. I love when they wear the throwback black jersey’s at home and even though its been about 10 years since they have changed to the new jersey I just haven’t fallen for them. They aren’t as ugly as some uniforms out there but I feel we can do better.

MikeInFl

January 2nd, 2013
9:09 pm

Jake, no one really saw UF having such a big year. But, they did beat LSU, S. Carolina, FL State and Texas A&M. They really don’t have a great QB, running back or receivers, and don’t run up big numbers; but they do have a lot of talent on defense and the O line. And they tend to dominate the 2nd half.

Not a fan, I remind you… just get forced to see/hear a lot about them. Go Cardinals!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:14 pm

I have to say I am very amused at how many of you continue to obsess over Lane Kiffen.

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
9:16 pm

MikeInFl

When they were ranked so high before Georgia beat them I was a little surprised and they had some narrow escapes. Don’t think they are bad, just thought they got a little more credit than they deserved at some points during the season. Also I do have a bias against them, not a fan at all so that probably plays into how I see them. They could very well deserve all the credit they were given and if they do i’ll admit it.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:16 pm

I have to say I am very amused at how many of you continue to obsess over Lane Kiffen.
———————————————-
ur right he deserves to be coach of the year

Bravefaninok

January 2nd, 2013
9:17 pm

What a visiting player hits at Turner field is not a good indicator of said players performance as a Brave.

Look up Dan Uggla or Nate Mcclouth and see.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:18 pm

Lee-

My comment had NOTHING to do with coaching- just the fact that so many people here seem to go on and on about him…

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:20 pm

he is such an easy target…..USC is the AL …well no the TN …..of the SEC

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:22 pm

I just don’t see why anyone would care that is not a USC fan. He doesn’t coach your school, or even in your conference. Yet he’s brought up over & over

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
9:24 pm

hate the cream unis, love the red though a little deeper red would be better

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:24 pm

(USC is 22-11-1 all time against the SEC, BTW)

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:25 pm

I just don’t see why anyone would care that is not a USC fan. He doesn’t coach your school, or even in your conference. Yet he’s brought up over & over
———————-
if u ever watch ESPN or their sports programs u would understand PTU and around the horn make fun of him all the time…not saying I agree with them but commercial has an influence on people this day and time

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
9:27 pm

probably what he did to UT….

and I’m out!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:28 pm

Lee-

Again- so what?- still don’t see why anyone would care Also, Around The Horn? People actually watch that crap?

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:29 pm

hate the cream unis, love the red though a little deeper red would be better
——————————————–
maybe the opposing team will make them bleed more Nolie…..Uggla needs something to motivate him…money does not seem to do it

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:30 pm

probably what he did to UT…

Which has certainly never happened before, or been done by other coaches ever…

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
9:30 pm

You would expect the number of comments to be down with the posters that have left due to the herd or other reasons….Nowhere Man

now that is one of the most ironic things that has ever been posted here considering the source :roll:

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:30 pm

Again- so what?- still don’t see why anyone would care Also, Around The Horn? People actually watch that crap?
————————-
no… I had much rather read ur posts of the pertaining event daily…

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:31 pm

Anyways, done with this now. Don’t feel like debating it anymore.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
9:31 pm

DOB – Why are people not comparing Upton’s to Fowler’s home road splits well bc Upton is a much better and more productive hitter. He is also a year younger…ozzie

you missed that one completely Oz

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:32 pm

I had much rather read ur posts of the pertaining event daily…

What does that even mean?

Jake W.

January 2nd, 2013
9:34 pm

The best throwbacks I have seen the braves wear are the ones from Boston. I think they’ve worn them a couple of times on the road. Can’t remember if it was LA or Chi but those were the best looking ones to me.

Mr. T

January 2nd, 2013
9:34 pm

How is it racist?! Just asking. I don’t in any way see how putting that image on a cap portrays the opinion that white people are better than Indians. Nor is it demeaning. And those two are the definition of racism. People need to stop being so damn sensitive and grow a pair….. I think the hat looks great, and I am NOT a braves fan……. That guy on the hat looks like me fool!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:34 pm

What does that even mean?
——————————-
i am finished with u …put ur husband on here

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:35 pm

Lee-

I really have no idea what you meant.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:35 pm

Also, I’m not married

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
9:38 pm

at least not that you have told VJ about, huh?

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:38 pm

nolie-

shhhh! He’s not supposed to know!

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:40 pm

so u and jimmy are the same person…lol…

yep

January 2nd, 2013
9:42 pm

I like the logo. It is classic. As far as left field…please do something Wrenn. Trumbo will be the power guy that we have needed for years!!

yep

January 2nd, 2013
9:42 pm

I like the logo. It is classic. As far as left field…please do something Wrenn. Trumbo will be the power guy that we have needed for years!!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:42 pm

Umm, no. We are most definitely NOT the same person

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
9:46 pm

“Also, I’m not married”

Oh……so there is a chance? ♥♥♥

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:49 pm

Mixxo-

sorry…I’m not married, but I AM taken & happy :)

Mixxo

January 2nd, 2013
9:51 pm

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:53 pm

Oh……so there is a chance? ♥♥♥
——————————-
Mixxo ..let me buy u a beer or 20………

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
9:54 pm

Lee-

So now you decide to get nasty? Why? There is no reason for that at all

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
9:59 pm

truly sorry …just not much of a follower….Jim Jones gave me a complex in the 70’s I guess…no harm intended….

Zing

January 2nd, 2013
9:59 pm

Analyzing potentially racially tinged logos is always tricky. First, you’ve got to understand that there is a history of the “winning” culture lampooning the “losing” culture and turning figures of the losers into silly mascots; it’s a way we have as humans of stomping out resistance, and it’s been going on for thousands of years. (For example, the patron god of a losing town in Greece would always become an evil villain; certain words that were previously just names for common objects became profane in Anglo-Saxon following the fall of King Harold to William the Conqueror. There are countless examples). It’s just kind of what we do.

So, it behooves us to be sensitive… but not TOO crazy-sensitive. We’ve got to negotiate our lives and try not to look for reasons to be upset — for instance, the objections to the “Yellow Line” of MARTA a couple of years ago that travels up the Buford Highway line… that was a case of over-reaction and looking for reasons to be upset in my view. (The objection related to the MARTA line going through or near many Asian-dominated areas of town. A primary color can’t just be a color, apparently.)

So, I take a conservative-but-sensitive approach when thinking about these things. Conservative not in its political sense but more in the legal sense– do not rush to judgment. But sensitive to the concerns of groups that have been traditional oppressed.

NOW. I have never thought the name “Braves” was bad at all — a brave was an historical warrior in North America; particularly a pro pos for a sports team The laughing Brave head is trickier, because here, you’re getting at a caricature of the Brave. Not a bad one, mind you– in fact, a pretty cool-looking one– but if you’re the group being caricatured (or whose ancestors are being caricatured), I think you ask them. So, I pretty much agree with DOB there. Being of some Native American lineage, I feel okay with it, precisely because it’s kind of cool. But I would listen closely to those who would be upset by it.

The Indians logo, by contrast, I have always found offensive — a cross-eyed, stupid-looking round Indian head, clearly part of the faux “cowboys and Indians” false history of our past. It insults all the descendants of the people who were forced to take the Trail of Tears hike across half of America to a crummy, desolate land. (It should insult all of us.) It’s like putting a fake label on genocide. Like I said, I have a little bit of Native American in me — and what I have is part of the tribe that was forced so brutally out of North Carolina and Georgia. I cry foul on that one… and on the “Redskins.”

The Redskins is, in my opinion, the worst. It’s like raising up a mascot like the “New York Hymies” the “San Francisco Slanteyes” or “Atlanta Darkies.” The only reason D.C. didn’t change that name is because there was too much money tied up in the merchandise, and Native Americans just can’t compete with it. It’s awful in my view and always will be.

Those are the blatant ones in my opinion… the ones that cross the line of not being too sensitive and failing to own up to our own history.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
10:03 pm

Lee-

I respect different opinions. Doesn’t mean I won’t question or oppose them, but I never have issue with them (unless they are just flat out make believe, which yours are not). Anyways, appreciate the apology. :)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
10:03 pm

Caricature- exaggeration by means of often ludicrous distortion of parts or characteristics (Merriam-Webster)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A_IokLZCYAAHhI9.png:large

Indians wear their logo on the hat for home games, Braves would wear this in Batting practice.

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
10:05 pm

thanks…and Jimmy is o.k. too…some of the time

Wide Right

January 2nd, 2013
10:13 pm

Enter your comments hereRe: the BP caps. I agree with much of what DOB and the rest of you wrote. But I also think the Braves should think hard about making a change. This problem is not going away and it’s always a killjoy. I just want to pull for the baseball team I loved since I was a kid. I don’t want to offend anyone. I think about the dilemma of the Braves marketing team, the challenge of trying to both build and avoid their image.

Many people find “Indian” mascots offensive. On the other hand, ballClubs want to preserve their history. The Indians and the Redskins are SOL here, unable to bridge this divide. However, IMO, the Braves are not…and could do something Creative…According to Dictionary.com, the definition of the noun brave is…

4.
a brave person.
5.
a warrior, especially among North American Indian tribes.

I think the Braves should do away with all “Indian” imagery…and focus on #4. There are obvious historical examples of great bravery out of ATLANTA. But even today…firefighters, policemen, teachers, soldiers. These people deserve to be honored.

The best looking uniform in baseball is the new braves uni, IMO, and requires no tomahawk. Do away with the chop – it IS offensive, IMO. Doesn’t it come from Bugs Bunny or something like that.

Anyway, I’ll shut up now. I just think, more so than any other sports team with the same undying issue, the Braves have an opportunity to put it all to rest in a bold and creative way that might even invigorate the fan base.

Zing

January 2nd, 2013
10:14 pm

So for the long post… heavy topic. GO Braves!!!

Wide Right

January 2nd, 2013
10:14 pm

Re: the BP caps. I agree with much of what DOB and the rest of you wrote. But I also think the Braves should think hard about making a change. This problem is not going away and it’s always a killjoy. I just want to pull for the baseball team I loved since I was a kid. I don’t want to offend anyone. I think about the dilemma of the Braves marketing team, the challenge of trying to both build and avoid their image.

Many people find “Indian” mascots offensive. On the other hand, ballClubs want to preserve their history. The Indians and the Redskins are SOL here, unable to bridge this divide. However, IMO, the Braves are not…and could do something Creative…According to Dictionary.com, the definition of the noun brave is…

4.
a brave person.
5.
a warrior, especially among North American Indian tribes.

I think the Braves should do away with all “Indian” imagery…and focus on #4. There are obvious historical examples of great bravery out of ATLANTA. But even today…firefighters, policemen, teachers, soldiers. These people deserve to be honored.

The best looking uniform in baseball is the new braves uni, IMO, and requires no tomahawk. Do away with the chop – it IS offensive, IMO. Doesn’t it come from Bugs Bunny or something like that.

Anyway, I’ll shut up now. I just think, more so than any other sports team with the same undying issue, the Braves have an opportunity to put it all to rest in a bold and creative way that might even invigorate the fan base.

cricket

January 2nd, 2013
10:14 pm

Jose Canseco’s top “10″ new year resolutions -

1. spend more time with my daughter
2. get stronger and fitter
3. help people who are getting screwed wherever i can
4. return to pro baseball as player or manager and have dinners with McGwire, La Russa, Bonds, and Selig.
5. Fight Shaq in MMA cage match
5. develop and launch Ponce de CAnseco a real anti aging drink
6. Get elected to a important political office in the U.S. or canada to help all people and governments with there problems
7. Become a world class entreprenur and found at least two great companies that make peoples lives better and funner
8. Write a third book and do a move deal for Juiced!
9. Do at least 100 promotional deals for good companies and products like Animal Rights, Human health, Environmental, and Beer companies
10. Use position as A List entertainer doing reality, TV, movies, blogs, columns, appearances to be able to do more charity

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
10:22 pm

With regard to the logo: I work a good bit with Native Alaskans, though I’m a white guy. After I came to understand the history, the anger and resentment felt by those folks became much more understandable. I’m not sure of the numbers for Alaska, but in the lower 48, there likely were somewhere between 2 and 7 million Native Americans in 1492. In 1885, there were fewer than 200,000. So, many adults died from violence, from disease, and from lack of resources – like food! Also, the natural increase in population one would expect during this time not only didn’t happen, but it also was dramatically reversed.

A caveat: Everyone should recognize that getting accurate figures for native populations in the 15th and 16th centuries, and even in the 19th, is incredibly difficult and relies upon indirect methods. What is crystal clear, though, is that the coming of Europeans and Africans to the Americas resulted in catastrophic mortality for natives here. The chief cause was exposure to diseases for which Native Americans had no immunity. Additionally, those who didn’t immediately die were either killed or removed from their lands. Remember the Trail of Tears? The Bataan Death March was not greatly different from that forced removal and the Cherokees were marched about 1,000 miles. Native Alaskans, and often Natives in the lower 48, were forced onto reservations, and were schooled in white schools in which they were beaten if they displayed any of their Native culture. Speaking their own languages was a punishable offense. Today some Native Alaskans are terrified at the thought of entering a white man’s school.

We cannot undo history, but we can be at least a little sensitive to the reasons why some Native Americans may not feel pleased to see one more instance of the white man’s appropriating his or her image or heritage. The cost to us to at least try to be kinder and more sensitive than our ancestors is minor. How hard is it to understand that hurt that runs that deeply lasts many generations? Political correctness? It’s simple humanity.

ABF

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
10:33 pm

DS1

Nice 8-)

Tell the Ms. that putting the cornbread mix on top of sweet creamed corn in the baking dish makes it a bit better :)

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
10:35 pm

Made some burritos and salad tonight.

Wholewheat flour tortillas and low fat salad dressing for the salad 8-)

Lee in S GA

January 2nd, 2013
10:39 pm

some of u old fossils need to get alive ..i am not going to pi$$u off every night

DS1

January 2nd, 2013
10:39 pm

Chris

Just jumped on and saw your post. She puts cornbread mix and yellow cake mix together. You don’t need nuthin to add to it! And that hint of sweetness underneath my chili!

Well, let’s just say it was goooooooood!

:wink:

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
10:42 pm

DS1

Cool. I always use sweet corn for the sweetness. Tell her, thanks for the tip, next time I make it, I’ll do it that way 8-)

Playoffs!!!

January 2nd, 2013
10:42 pm

It is interesting that the Native American on the new Braves batting practice cap is sporting a Mohawk haircut. The Mohawks were native the area that is now upstate New York (Mohawk Valley)

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
10:51 pm

BFChris28

Do you know how to further enhance the flavor of beer, too?

(Hi LAdy, I know you’re here, somewhere)

Knock-a homer

January 2nd, 2013
10:53 pm

I like the name “Braves”…but not that creepy laughing logo…

and Noc-a-homa was awful ….not someone a real Indian would be proud of…

to me the word “Braves” stand for courage, strength, perserverance, and bravery

this laughing Indian had too much fire water

BravesFanInNashville

January 2nd, 2013
10:53 pm

George-George.. Thanks for the comment on the playoff post. Just seems like a group of smart minds could come up with a plan that beats the one in place now !!!

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
10:55 pm

Tom O’Hawke

Beer isn’t really my forte. Although I do like cooking with it as it enhances different dishes I use it with.

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
10:55 pm

this laughing Indian had too much fire water

That picture was snapped shortly after the passing of the peace-pipe.

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
10:57 pm

Chris

If you accidentally use too much of it in one of your dishes… don’t throw it out. Call me, instead.

Venice Jim

January 2nd, 2013
10:57 pm

Tom – she is busy drooling over the jacket Taylor Swift wore on NY Eve…

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
10:58 pm

That jacket is SO CUTE! I WANT (it’s WAAAY beyond my price range, but still…)

Hi Tom!

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
10:59 pm

Thanks, VJ. I’ll spead a little plastic on my computer for when she does get back here.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:01 pm

Tom-

Feel free to buy it for me- I can send you the link… :D

benchwarmer

January 2nd, 2013
11:03 pm

I had always heard of the logo being called the “laughing Brave” don’t like it though as it just seemed a little creepy. No particular reason, just struck me that way. The old Braves unies with the big feather on them should be left in retirement, pretty ugly even in the disco era. Can we bring back ostrich racing for the 7th inning stretch?

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:03 pm

I’m sure you will be able to find a knock-off that you can afford, cabravesfan.

MikeInFl

January 2nd, 2013
11:04 pm

ABF – Excellent post. I don’t know the numbers either, but clearly some pretty horrible things happened back in the day. The cap is not a real big deal to anyone, I don’t think. But you put forth a great explanation as to why, in general, some consideration on the part of the majority is in order.

keyLargo.

January 2nd, 2013
11:04 pm

I swear I got this solicitation for a Credit Card today. What’s wrong with the proposal? I think I’ll pass on it. I don’t think I’d feel good about them doing my statement every month.

The cost? Only $25.00 for 2- years- that’s 30 cents a day.

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:06 pm

You know, it wouldn’t hurt actually to ASK Native Americans how the image and the term “Braves” might be used in a respectful manner. I never fail to be amazed at how eager many people are to avoid talking about issues with those to whom they matter most. (Gosh, why did the term “Congress” suddenly come to mind?)

ABF

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
11:07 pm

Tom O’Hawke

:lol:

Duly noted!!!!

I only use the essence of beer for flavoring dishes. I usually always cook out the alcohol, but leave the flavor of the beer itself.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:08 pm

Tom-

Knock off??? I don’t buy KNOCK OFFS! It’s only $925! You can swing that! :D

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:09 pm

MikeInFL: Thanks! Like most people, I really appreciate feedback.

keyLargo.: Named after one of my favorite movies and one of my favorite songs! Your post made me laugh aloud. That’s rare, so it’s pretty funny. Your caution is well founded.

ABF

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:09 pm

I know and an related to a fair number ofnative Americans. might be a relatively small sample size but none of them are offended, many think it is cool

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:10 pm

Only $925??? Yeah, I can swing that… but only if Taylor Swift comes with it!

The True Minority

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

I am offended by the amount of energy placed on “Political Correctness” in this country. Me thinks we have bigger fish to fry.

The True Minority

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

I am offended by the amount of energy placed on “Political Correctness” in this country. Me thinks we have bigger fish to fry.

anthony

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

doesn’t matter if the irish are offended or not, as most of them cannot read nor can they understand cartoon depictions of themselves. they aren’t that bright, why i mean, just today i read one who has a blog trying to say that the screamin’ indian isn’t racist. proof enough that they’re all morons.

Half Empty

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

how come whenever this comes up it is always a bunch of white people who tell us how we should feel about it? nothing happening today makes up for the fact that manifest destiny wiped out most of a race

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

Tom-

I’ll see what I can do…would you accept a Kardashian as a replacement? That I might be able to swing…

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:14 pm

nolie: I don’t know you or your relatives, so this comment may be way off base, but I’ve found, in working with Native Alaskans, that they often will say they are not offended when, in fact, they are. It’s a matter of not wanting to get into an argument, or of not wanting to emphasize the fact that they are a minority group.

I really appreciate your comment because I believe it’s very difficult for people of different backgrounds and cultures to establish a channel of communication. Some of the people with whom I work have said they find it helpful to paraphrase back to Natives what they believe they have said, and have found that often what they understood wasn’t what was meant. It has been surprising to them just how hard they have had to work to arrive at true understanding. Now that’s not easy!

ABF

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:16 pm

Half Empty: You make a valid point. Often, though, on blogs like this, almost everyone is either black or white, and Natives hardly are represented. If they’re to have any consideration, someone has to remind us that they have a viewpoint.

ABF

zeke

January 2nd, 2013
11:18 pm

Use it and tell anyone “offended” to go to Hades!!!!

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:19 pm

I think you have a valid point ABF when dealing with relative strangers. Believe me the ones I am talking about would not hesitate to state their feelings to a friend or cousin. Like i said though, a few dozen folks do not make much of a sample size.
where in Alaska are you BTW?

keyLargo.

January 2nd, 2013
11:20 pm

ABF – When I first began to post on this blog I lived in Key Largo, FL but have since moved a hundred miles southwest to the Key West, FL area. And they actually filmed part of the movie Key Largo (with Humphrey Bogart) in Key Largo. And you guessed it – a restaurant in Key West sells pretty good Cheeseburgers – Jimmy Buffet’s.

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:20 pm

cabravesfan

I kidded you about you not being too crazy about your high school classmate. But I got to tell you… I’m right with you, now.
Everytime I read my local newspaper (online) or some other news site, there’s Kim K. She’s done this, she’s done that, she’s ate a plum… WHO CARES???

Now, she’s pregnant! OK, nice… but the media makes it sound as if she’s the first one that it’s ever happened to!

No, don’t want you to swing Kim in the deal.

Bobo

January 2nd, 2013
11:21 pm

There are only 7% of people not in favor of the logo because the old logo is awesome. I’m tired of a small demographic of the population deciding in our free country that they have the right to parent everyone else and be the moral compass for everyone. If you’re offended by the logo, then get over yourself. Seriously. O’Brien is right. I have Viking ancestry and you don’t see me complaining about Capitol One commercials (though they are heinously stupid). I’ll go a step further and say that I hope we bring back the 1980s aqua classic unis that Dale Murphy wore and we should invite Chief Noc-A-Homa back again.

Bobo

January 2nd, 2013
11:21 pm

There are only 7% of people not in favor of the logo because the old logo is awesome. I’m tired of a small demographic of the population deciding in our free country that they have the right to parent everyone else and be the moral compass for everyone. If you’re offended by the logo, then get over yourself. Seriously. O’Brien is right. I have Viking ancestry and you don’t see me complaining about Capitol One commercials (though they are heinously stupid). I’ll go a step further and say that I hope we bring back the 1980s aqua classic unis that Dale Murphy wore and we should invite Chief Noc-A-Homa back again.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:22 pm

Tom-

There are 2 other sisters that are of age…granted, one is married and the other has 2 kids (she’s the one I graduated with), but still…I WANT THAT JACKET!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:23 pm

And for the record, I was NOT classmates with Kim- she was a year below me. I was classmates with Kourtney.

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:23 pm

those powder puff blue unis? Gawd I hope not

Venice Jim

January 2nd, 2013
11:24 pm

I’m tired of a small demographic of the population deciding in our free country that they have the right to parent everyone else and be the moral compass for everyone.

Thank you for taking up the mantle for us stupid people…

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:24 pm

How do I see the jacket that you covet so much?

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:25 pm

Tom-

Look up “Taylor Swift Red Jacket” She wore it on the DIck Clark NYE show

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:25 pm

nolie: I’m in Homer, at the tip of the Kenai Peninsula. Some folks wouldn’t like it here, but to me it’s heaven. We’re right on Kachemak Bay, and the fishing is wonderfully good. Our freezer always is packed with halibut and all three of the best species of salmon. Did you ever watch Northern Exposure? Some people believe it was based on Homer.

Thanks for asking!

ABF

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:26 pm

Bobo

January 2nd, 2013
11:26 pm

If you want to talk offensive….then a few cartoonish sports logos doesn’t even come close to balancing out the unfair reservation laws that allow Native Americans to take full advantage of every legal loophole in the book to lie, cheat, and steal their butts off.

Example: Look at all the pay-day loan companies that are run by Indian Reservations now that are exempt from US usury law and charge 150% interest on their loans. Don’t even get me started on casinos and alcohol.

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:30 pm

Bobo: I hear what you’re saying, and occasionally I feel that irritation, too. The most important facet of democracy, despite what most folks believe, isn’t majority rule; it’s protection of the rights of minorities. A majority certainly has the weight to push the minorities around, unless there are institutional protections for minorities. Our country is just coming to understand how multicultural it has become. Respecting each other’s sensitivities will become more and more important in our efforts just to get along. For a good example of those who just don’t understand the “get along” principle, check out our Congress. Before long, those folks will be caning each other in chambers, just as they did during the 19th century!

ABF

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:32 pm

my father in law was with the BIA in Alaska in the 60s and 70s. He was up in Bethel much of that time. We visited with him for a number of years in a row. Really rugged little town back in those days, could only get in by air or river. Not sure what it is like today.
Pretty interesting place but a little too cold for my taste long term.

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:32 pm

cab – I got it, but used your link to make sure I had the right one. First, I had Taylor in a red jacket in London. Then, red jacket in Paris. Finally, the one you’re talking about. $950 on the site I had. At this rate, you’d better buy it soon.

Seems a little flashy, LAdy. I didn’t think that was you…

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:32 pm

Bobo: Everyone of us, and every group of people in this country, has warts. We start from there, and then we try to reduce the number of warts, knowing that, being human, we never will eliminate them.

Wow! Did I say that?

ABF

The Real Irish

January 2nd, 2013
11:33 pm


The Real Brave
January 2nd, 2013
2:55 pm

2. There is no such thing as a fighting Irish.

Them’s fightin’ words.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:34 pm

Tom-

I WANT THAT JACKET! It’s sparkly and red and leather! I WAAAAAAANT

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:34 pm

guy is gonna get my Irish up if he keeps talkin’ like dat….

Simpson's Homer

January 2nd, 2013
11:34 pm

Let’s just rename them the Atlanta Slightly Assertive Pacifists, which won’t offend even the most easily offended among us. A Gerber daisy logo can not possibly upset anyone, except for daisyphobes, who should be silenced and run through a diversity/sensitivity course…. Who cares if the team wins any games as long as they are culturally aware…….!?!

While we’re at it, the Mariners must offend sailors, the Red Sox must offend the color-blind, the Dodgers must offend those with slow reflexes, and the Padres clearly offend all Catholics and non-Catholics. Oh, and the Giants must offend all midg– I mean, vertically challenged……. The Royals are clearly offensive to the peasants among us. ….Play ball…!!!

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:35 pm

I freely admit I am not the most “girly” of girls, but I do like SOME girly things. Like THAT JACKET

nolie

January 2nd, 2013
11:35 pm

cab
No, you can’t always get what you want
No, you can’t always get what you want
No, you can’t always get what you want
But if you try sometime, you just might find
You get what you need

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:36 pm

nolie: I went out to Bethel in October, and will return in February. It still is a rough place in some ways, but I’m sure it has grown and added at least a few amenities since you last were there. It does seem to get the worst of all worlds in terms of weather. The Kuskokwim River runs right through it, as you probably know, and adds a good bit of flavor to the culture there. My acquaintances there all are winter trappers or summer fisher people. The Native fish camps are really interesting, and the smoked salmon are wonderfully tasty!

ABF

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:36 pm

Like I said before, I’ll go the $925 $950 $975 for the jacket if she comes with it.
You can HAVE the jacket.

sldkfjslk

January 2nd, 2013
11:36 pm

I bet a lot more people would have voted against the logo if their ancestors weren’t victims of genocide.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:37 pm

nolie-

SHUT IT! Or I will get Stanley to eat you in your sleep.

Alaska Braves Fan

January 2nd, 2013
11:37 pm

slkdfjslk: You said a mouthful!

ABF

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:38 pm

Tom-

DAMN IT TAKE A KARDASHIAN! WHY DO YOU HAVE TO HAVE SUCH HIGH STANDARDS???

abeeeewright

January 2nd, 2013
11:38 pm

I think the old mascot on the cap is a smoke screen to take our attention away from “the left field situation.”

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
11:39 pm

Tom, we were talking XM radio last night: Did you know our own Liberty Media just took them over after months (or years) of trying and buying up stock? The first thing they did was oust CEO Mel Karmazin, who guided them through the merger with Sirius and toward profitability, although he also made massive cuts several years ago when he took over. I did not renew my subscription because they did away with a lot of the programs and DJ’s I enjoyed. And now I imagine there will be more changes.
I have most of the channels on my TV, but I miss it in the car. Plus I got several XM-only systems real cheap at garage sales and now I can’t use them at all.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
11:40 pm

I’ll take Swift… as long as she doesn’t sing

abeeeewright

January 2nd, 2013
11:41 pm

‘course, it seems that all it takes to distract cabravesfan is a snazzy red jacket.

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:41 pm

It’s time to call it a night…Bye all!

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:42 pm

cab, and you offer me a polar opposite? At least try for something in between, will ya?

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:42 pm

Not distracted. But I do love a shiny red jacket

Screaming Brave

January 2nd, 2013
11:42 pm

Bring back the logo……screw what the northeast elite think….
Go Bravos….thanks Dave

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:42 pm

I’ll take Swift… as long as she doesn’t sing

She sings??

cabravesfan

January 2nd, 2013
11:43 pm

Tom-

But I can’t help with anyone else…I may actually be able to help with one of them ;)

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
11:43 pm

Tom, you do realize Taylor Swift is about the size of a pencil?

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:47 pm

kenhotlanta

Did NOT know that. I remember losing some stations that I liked a lot when they merged. My favorite station was Beyond Jazz (fusion), and that was taken away.

I bought a “Lifetime Membership” a few years back. I have to believe the new owners would have to honor that, wouldn’t they. Cuz my life is currently still active…

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 2nd, 2013
11:49 pm

She sings??

Haha, good point. She, umm, well, what can we call that?

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:50 pm

cabravesfan – if you can keep them out of the news for ONE WEEK, the jacket is yours.

ken – I have no idea of her size. I just know what she looks like from pictures & stuff. (that, I like)

kenhotlanta

January 2nd, 2013
11:51 pm

Tom, you should be fine with you membership, it’s just the channel and talent lineup that will prolly get tweaked or eliminated. Remember, it’s Liberty Media…they have no heart or soul. :)

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:53 pm

ken – is that final? I’m surprised I didn’t hear anything about that. I’m listening to Deep Tracks, as I type.

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
11:55 pm

I had the chance to meet Taylor Swift at the Beulahfest a few years ago. Sweet and kind girl. That was when she first started out.

I also got to meet the likes of Blake Shelton, Phil Vassar, Heartland, Daryl Worley and countless others.

Bobo

January 2nd, 2013
11:55 pm

Simpson’s Homer…..there was a rumor that we were going to change our name to the Atlanta Lemurs, but we didn’t because King Julian found it offensive.

Tom O'Hawke

January 2nd, 2013
11:56 pm

Chris – is she the size of a pencil, really?

If not, is she bigger than a breadbox?

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
11:57 pm

Tom O’Hawke

Not sure about now, but then she was a skinny hour glass.

BFChris28

January 2nd, 2013
11:59 pm

Meaning, she was skinny, but had curves.

richbrave

January 2nd, 2013
11:59 pm

SOUTH OF THE BORDER

Elimination play-offs are underway down south.

DOMINICA

EASTERN BULLS

Lead-off JOSE CONSTANZA [.471 BA] 2-5, 1 R, 1 RBI [2]

MEXICO

CULIACAN TOMATOES

Lead-off SS RAMIRO PENA [.000 BA] 0-3, 1 SO

VENEZUELA

LARA CARDINALS

C JOSE YEPEZ [.500 BA] 2-4, 1 SO.

LHRP LUIS AVILAN [H 1, 0.00 ERA] 0.1 IP, 0 H, 0 R/ER, 2 BB, 0 SO.

ZULIA plays tomorrow night.

Venice Jim

January 3rd, 2013
12:00 am

Good to see the stupid people are coming out to support DOB tonight…well done, blogmeister… :roll:

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:00 am

I can deal with a skinny hour glass.

As long as that skinny part isn’t her butt area. (That, I don’t think I’d like.)

Venice Jim

January 3rd, 2013
12:00 am

By the way, where are the SEC people tonight?

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
12:01 am

Nah, her butt wasn’t skinny, had a mini J-Lo butt :D

Venice Jim

January 3rd, 2013
12:02 am

I am gone for a few days – racism does not cease to exist because we pretend it is gone, and dress it up in nonsensical comparisons like a caricature of a leprechaun…

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:02 am

or her chest area ……

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:03 am

J-Lo butt????

cabravesfan – get her with that jacket and I’ll buy everyone in your family one.

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
12:03 am

nolie

Honestly can’t remember that part :lol:

Garrry

January 3rd, 2013
12:04 am

DOB — Don’t really care what YOU think about the logo. Am more curious about the thinking behind the decision. Apparently the Screamin’ Savage wasn’t okay last year, but is okay this year, so what caused the change? How about you do some reporting and getting a statement from the Braves. Did they just figure that bending over backwards for the limp-wristed, no-fun PC police wasn’t worth it any more? (Those folks don’t like sports anyhow!)

Venice Jim

January 3rd, 2013
12:04 am

Maybe I am too sensitive – maybe spending years as the minority member in a household and seeing things through their eyes has allowed me to see a side most of you have not…

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
12:04 am

Right here, VJ. Looks like we may only win half (+-1) of our 9 bowl games. A down year, indeed. You’re not really gonna start after the Trojans got whipped by GA Tech, are you?

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
12:04 am

Tom O’Hawke

Wasn’t skinny, but wasn’t that big, mini J-Lo (Jennifer Lopez).

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:07 am

Chris – things like:

Meaning, she was skinny, but had curves. and mini J-Lo (Jennifer Lopez).

I GET!!! The chef-stuff, not so much. ;)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:08 am

after the Trojans got whipped by GA Tech, are you?

a GT who was 6-7 going into the game, 5-3 in their conference.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:08 am

Tom, yes, it happened Dec. 19th and the CEO change is the only change so far that I have heard about. They may not change anything else, but there usually are changes in situations like this.
What’s strange to me is XM-Sirius has been fighting to make a profit for years and it has been a slow steady climb, but they continue to add subscribers.
They have come close to going out of business several times, so it’s not the kind of company Liberty Media usually looks for, because they want cash cows. And they have been after XM for years, so I figure they have something in mind going forward, but I don’t have a clue. I just hope we still have that option, because local radio in the ATL has sucked for years and there is nothing I will listen to except NPR and I tire of that quickly.
Where’s Bat Masterson, he’s knows all about stocks and business stuff, I haven’t seen Bat much lately.

ugaaccountant

January 3rd, 2013
12:09 am

I see the ridiculous Stanton trades are now numbering 6 guys going out including 2 established major leaguers. This is getting to be a long offseason.

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
12:10 am

Yeah, throw in a couple more pitchers in the Stanton deal, and we can be the 2012 Marlins!

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
12:12 am

DOB — Don’t really care what YOU think about the logo. Am more curious about the thinking behind the decision. Apparently the Screamin’ Savage wasn’t okay last year, but is okay this year, so what caused the change? How about you do some reporting and getting a statement from the Braves. — Garrry

Gary, don’t you think I would’ve gotten a statement from the Braves if team officials were willing to talk about it? As I wrote — apparently you missed this part — neither the team nor the MLB have acknowledged the existence of the new caps. One guy who follows sports uniforms as a beat got the info, and published the photos. The team will comment, I’m sure, when they are told it’s OK to do so. Until then, I’d imagine they’re judging the reactions and, if they want to, they could always say they’re not using the cap and never were.

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
12:13 am

Tom O’Hawke

Touche :lol:

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:13 am

I like voluptuous women, but NOT the Kardashians.

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:13 am

ken

I’m so used to satellite radio after all of these years, I don’t what I’d do if it wasn’t around, anymore.

As far as not making a profit – did you ever see the contract Howard Stern was signed to? People think athletes are overpaid. Man, they don’t even come close to what he’s got/getting.

Ozzie

January 3rd, 2013
12:14 am

DOB making the wrong assumptions about motive.

Why did you ignore the rest of their stats and total contributions? Justin Upton is an RBI guy and Fowler is not. The numbers bear that out (regardless of time frames studied) which is why I posted a pile of them versus just home/road splits.

You looked at one dimension of the players and I presented both stats, cumulative totals and data on how each player performed at Turner Field (the latter as limited as that may be).

You did not do “any” of that but felt it necessary to assume I was trying to throw you under the bus with facts. I wasn’t twisting anything.

I picked that range bc they both were in the major leagues at that time (don’t all ABs count for the team). That said if I drop 2008 and do a 2009-2012 comparison Justin still comes out a head stats wise in addition to total contributions.

BTW – I look at “totals” (in addition traditional stats) bc that is the actual contribution a player makes. It is not uncommon for analysts to track total runs scored and total runs allowed over the course of a season.

Teams that have a positive differential between those totals (for example) tend to be stronger contenders than teams with neutral or negative differentials. The latter being smoke & mirrors teams in many but clearly not all cases.

So it was an very cogent and fair attempt to examine these two players beyond home/road splits.

Nothing you said changes the fact that Justin will likely drive in more runs, hit more HRs and possibly steal more bases than Fowler. I am merely pointing out the differences in their game.

Both will require you to over pay and if you had to over pay I would lean towards a guy who has superior RBI production and slugging ability.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
12:15 am

I am gone for a few days – racism does not cease to exist because we pretend it is gone, and dress it up in nonsensical comparisons like a caricature of a leprechaun… — Venice Jim

If you really believe that I, having been raised in North Carolina and Memphis, having spent countless hours talking to athletes in locker rooms and clubhouse while covering sports for 25 years (including pro sports for 21), don’t fully understand how prevalent racism has been and continues to be in America, then you really have no clue what I’m about or what someone in my position sees when traveling around the country. Not to mention what I read (and delete) from this very blog on a daily basis. So give me a break with the more-enlightened-than-thou attitude.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:17 am

you are still missing the point Ozzie

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:22 am

Yeah, that Howard Stern contract was obscene. Also the unfunny Opie and Anthony show.
When XM started, they hired a lot of old time jocks and put them on shows they were familiar with…I loved this because it added so much to the music and I don’t mind the talking on a commercial free station. Plus they had weekly shows by a lot of musicians and folks in the business that had lots of guests and stories on music, songs, tours, etc. that you could not hear anywhere else. Most of those are gone and I miss them.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
12:23 am

You think a few dozen schools are kicking themselves for not hiring Charlie Strong in the past decade or two? (I sure wish my school — Kansas — had pursued him instead of Turner Gill a while back, but Turner was the hot name at the time.)

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
12:23 am

there are a lot of people here who specialize in reading what they want to rather than what is actually said

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:25 am

nolie, have you seen Bat or know why he’s not around much?

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:27 am

I’m guessing it is because his brother took a turn for the worse ken, but i don’t know that for sure.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:28 am

Damn, I’m sorry, I forgot about his brother…my bad.

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:31 am

ken – he may be on twitter. I remember he said he had an account, but wasn’t using it.

I gave up mine, for now, so I can’t check. But someone on here that has a twitter account could.

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:33 am

there are a lot of people here who specialize in reading what they want to rather than what is actually said — Cherokee Kid

There are a lot of people here who aren’t even people

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:34 am

Tom, thanks.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:35 am

Bat is on twitter…. I don’t know if he wants the name posted on here, but hmu and I can get you the name via twitter.

@bravesfanjulien

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
12:36 am

everybody is a people

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:37 am

TOBF

I think ken (and the rest of us) just want to know if he’s OK.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:37 am

Good, I miss him but I hope that means his brother is ok

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:38 am

not sure if Shaun is a people or not….

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:38 am

Thanks TOBF, past your bedtime, ain’t it? ;)

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:40 am

everybody is a people — Cherokee Kid

Nope, not ALL of the time. On here, many times everybody is a PERSON. (One that’s whacked-out, but a single, one, lonely, messed-up person)

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:40 am

I haven’t seen Shaun in quite a while, did he get committed somewhere or did his core melt down ?

TrishaDishawareagle

January 3rd, 2013
12:41 am

I would generally watch someone die before I’d change my words, thoughts, attitude, or actions that offended them in the first place because I do not care about other people enough to worry about their feelings, and that being said, I think Col Sanders put it best when he said, “If you like my chicken, buy it..and if you don’t like my chicken, f**k off”

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:42 am

In the shop for new circuit boards, new chips, batteries etc. nolie

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:43 am

I hope Shaun knows the The Godfather (Bill James) is on Clubhouse Confidential tomorrow. Efrim hasn’t been around a lot, either.

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:47 am

“If you like my chicken, buy it..and if you don’t like my chicken, f**k off” — TrishaDishawareagle (nice moniker)

I never realized that was Col. Sanders that said it first. I always attributed that saying to Frank Perdue.

You learn a lot on this blog.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:48 am

Bill might be a little too mainstream for Shaun anymore

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:49 am

sounds like he’s okay, but his brother still may have some struggles

Bat Masterson ‏@___
My brother called last night to say he and his sons wanted to come over to watch the Falcons if he felt well enough. He called, he doesn’t

Bat Masterson ‏@____
@JasonInFL, He has hep C and his liver is failing. http://tinyurl.com/Terry-K-Liver-Transplant-Fund

Good night y’all.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:49 am

the Colonel coulda said it he was a grumpy old bastid

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:50 am

sorry to hear that about Bat’s brother

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
12:51 am

Thanks, TOBF

the Colonel coulda said it he was a grumpy old bastid

Or you… ;)

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:52 am

could be, but everybody loves my chicken

fan of the abnormal

January 3rd, 2013
12:53 am

Ok…I love the Logo…I loved it in the 80’s. I am of Indian Heritage, but not full and was not raised in the culture. However, I try to put the shoe on the other foot and imagine a team named the “Afros”. If there was a logo of a black guy with an afro and his mouth open, I dont think id be offended, but the delicious vinyl guy offends me. Yet, i don’t know why- but he does

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
12:57 am

Hello everyone! At first I kind of liked the new hat, but think the logo should be smaller. The Logo kind of scares the hell out of me, so I don’t think I’ll be buying that hat. There are other caps…..

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
12:57 am

TOBF: thanks a lot.

PineNeedle

January 3rd, 2013
12:58 am

I object to the face logo because it is poorly done. It looks like something from a high school rather than a MLB team. Clean it up, make it more professional and something a Native American (as well as Atlanta fans) can be proud of.

Better yet, go back to the crossed feathers.

Braves girl

January 3rd, 2013
12:59 am

I heard Wren paid 55 million for the screaming Indian logo……

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
1:00 am

Since, I’m here. I’ll drop the Delmon Young thing. Just thought I would make a last minute sale, but didn’t work!

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
1:00 am

nolie, It would be a pleasure to try your chicken some day.

BTW, can you believe the amount of Native Americans that DOB has commenting on his blog, tonight? If anyone knows how to get blog-hits, it’s DOB.
Who woulda thought that a blog, partially, on the Braves batting practice caps would bring out so many comments? :roll:
You just never know…

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
1:00 am

sure Frank did

BigGAdawg

January 3rd, 2013
1:02 am

I don’t find the logo offensive.
What I find offensive is calling the stadium “The Ted”, this is lame as #%&#@!$#% and totally unoriginal and sophomoric to boot. Call it Ted Turner Stadium OR Turner Stadium for short.
And I find it offensive to hear (constantly) sports reporters call the team the “Bravos”. They are the Braves–call them that you gooberheadedmorons!!!
I think Bravos comes from someone not wanting to say Braves and “offend” some whiny nosepicking pablum puking bedwetter.
For the record we Americans of Irish heritage don’t mind being depicted as boozers or brawlers–It can be true often enough. And my Scottish cousins have made bar fighting into a national sport.
Hard to understand why someone would be offended by having their ancestors or their contemporaries referenced as great warriors.

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
1:02 am

Plus, that is the uggliest cap I’ve ever scene…….

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
1:03 am

There are a lot of peoples with some native american ancestry in the south, especially the coastal states Carolinas thru Florida

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
1:04 am

Call it Ted Turner Stadium OR Turner Stadium for short.

Or maybe Turner Field.

Nah, don’t know where I came up with that.

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
1:07 am

gooberheadedmorons – Not bad…

whiny nosepicking pablum puking bedwetter — Excellent, BigGAdawg, excellent!

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
1:10 am

Just hope the new cap, does’t curse the Braves, and they end in last this coming season! little humor.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
1:12 am

I don’t find the logo offensive.
What I find offensive is calling the stadium “The Ted”, this is lame as #%&#@!$#% and totally unoriginal and sophomoric to boot. Call it Ted Turner Stadium OR Turner Stadium for short.
— BigGAdawg

How ’bout we call it Turner Field, which is the actual name of the place?

Braves #17 Fan

January 3rd, 2013
1:18 am

Even though I don’t get the issue with the logo as something that’s offensive, I didn’t like it back then and I don’t like it now. Let’s ditch it.

William

January 3rd, 2013
1:20 am

great stuff from top to bottom. happy new year.

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
1:20 am

let’s keep it for BP

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
1:29 am

i feel good gonna beat this crappy disease yet

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
1:30 am

already 2 months past my first expiration date

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
1:31 am

well its bedtime for bonzo
go braves

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
1:36 am

ncgary – Just don’t buy the new cap, and you’ll be fine……

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
1:44 am

ncgary – Prayers are for you buddy…..

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
1:47 am

ncgary, here’s knowing you will beat it! And with some prayers for good measure.

JASon

January 3rd, 2013
1:59 am

“The Indian-head logo has already drawn plenty of criticism for being politically incorrect and, in the view of some, racist.”

What does everyone think about the texans-bengals game this weekend? I think Dalton and the bengals surprise everyone and beat the texans.

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
2:01 am

It’s too bad Shaun isn’t here! We could hear his facts on the new batting practice cap, and all the angles, and time it took to put the new logo on the cap. Little humor.

Ward

January 3rd, 2013
2:20 am

All, have a good one! Just wondering if the Logo enjoyed his pipe, and that stoned feeling??????Peace my friends, and “Go!!!!!Braves!!!!!”

chipontheroad

January 3rd, 2013
2:56 am

Ilove that logo I’m Irish scotts Irish welch Cherokee Creek Cherokee-Blackfoot English German American

GO BRAVOS

chipontheroad

January 3rd, 2013
2:57 am

Oh yea and Georgian

chipontheroad

January 3rd, 2013
3:01 am

I will buy a batting practice cap and tip it to any and all comers

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
3:09 am

I think I will buy one too if they become available

WW

January 3rd, 2013
6:01 am

Everything you do and say is offensive to someone. Some find the red jerseys offensive. Some the blue. Others find it offensive that the Braves use a handful of jerseys rather than just the traditional home white and road grey. Some find the name Braves offensive. Some find it offensive that the braves are the Atlanta Braves rather than the Georgia Braves or even the Southern Braves. Using Atlanta rather than a broader region is too insensitive and not inclusive enough to the actual potential fan base. The colors red, white and blue can be offensive because it is too patriotic in symbolism. Naming the field after Ted Turner can be offensive. Jimmy Carter and Jane Fonda with front row seats offends some. Displaying ads for conservative talk radio stations can offend others. Beer and junk food being sold offends some. Ads for foreign auto companies offends others. Your delicate sensibilities may offend me. My hypersensivity may offend you. That douche over there? His insensitivity may offend both of us. Who cares? Get over yourselves. Vote with your pocketbook. If you think the customer service sucks for you, don’t give them another dime. They’ll take the hint if there are enough people like you. If they don’t then they will lose money. Or maybe they won’t lose money and they’ll just shrug their shoulders and say, oh, well, can’t please everyone. Every Super Bowl Sunday, at least half the country ain’t watching. At least half the country is either so turned off by or so not turned on by the spectacle of it, they can’t be bothered to turn it on. Should we go out of our way to accomodate them for the sake of doing so? Hell naw. You only accomodate those losers to the extend necessary to make them cash paying customers as well

dap01

January 3rd, 2013
7:00 am

Logo is ok. Who has time to worry about a logo?
Who cares about the number of post per person on a blog?
Florida was horribly overrated.
Notre Dame is a made up media (ESPN) sensation. Bama will crush them.
Ray Lewis left 2 people dead in Atlanta. Let’s not act like he deserves reverance.
LF is the easiest position to fill yet the Braves go years with the same need. Same story every year.
Thanks for the updates, DOB.

dap01

January 3rd, 2013
7:00 am

Logo is ok. Who has time to worry about a logo?
Who cares about the number of post per person on a blog?
Florida was horribly overrated.
Notre Dame is a made up media (ESPN) sensation. Bama will crush them.
Ray Lewis left 2 people dead in Atlanta. Let’s not act like he deserves reverance.
LF is the easiest position to fill yet the Braves go years with the same need. Same story every year.
Thanks for the updates, DOB.

dap01

January 3rd, 2013
7:00 am

Logo is ok. Who has time to worry about a logo?
Who cares about the number of post per person on a blog?
Florida was horribly overrated.
Notre Dame is a made up media (ESPN) sensation. Bama will crush them.
Ray Lewis left 2 people dead in Atlanta. Let’s not act like he deserves reverance.
LF is the easiest position to fill yet the Braves go years with the same need. Same story every year.
Thanks for the updates, DOB.

RixPolitix

January 3rd, 2013
7:31 am

Well, the time has come, so may as well change it for the PC police. How about we just change the name altogether?:

“The Atlanta African-Americans Plus a Few Hispanics and Smattering of White Guys” or

“The Atlanta Native-AmericansTimids”

“The Atlanta Timids”

“The Atlanta Izzies”

BravesFanInMaine

January 3rd, 2013
7:35 am

Woke up this morning and it was -11 degrees out…… anyways I am ready for some braves baseball and the season to start….. I like what the braves have done although I would like to see a regular starting right fielder and keep prado at third but you have to do what you have to do and I really dont want to see the braves to over pay for someone…… I still cant believe the Michael Bourn is still available on the free agent market….. I just wonder who is going to sign him…. GO BRAVES!!

Call It Like It Is

January 3rd, 2013
7:35 am

Braves could fix this easy. Just pick a tribe like FSU did. Get their okay for the logo and from here on out for anyone that ask or cares or wants to start something, tell them the logo represents this tribe and their warriors only. Case closed.

Chris White

January 3rd, 2013
7:46 am

It is time we go back to the “way it was”. I know some people think I am ignorant or stupid, but come on, “sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me”. Political correctness is for people who want to control every aspect of someones life. I have a freedom of speech and wish to use it here. The Indian screaming on a baseball hat is nothing to get all worked up about. Come on America, lose the attitude already!

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
7:52 am

You know, it wouldn’t hurt actually to ASK Native Americans how the image and the term “Braves” might be used in a respectful manner. _ Alaska Braves Fan

How do you know they didn’t? Why do people he assume the Braves are run by Jethro Bodine?

Some of the people with whom I work have said they find it helpful to paraphrase back to Natives what they believe they have said, and have found that often what they understood wasn’t what was meant. ABF

Not a bad idea with other people period.

Politically Incorrect

January 3rd, 2013
7:57 am

The FSU logo looks like a contstipated indian in agony.

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
7:59 am

Not he, but Here*

sorry, scoots

Johnny Vaught

January 3rd, 2013
8:05 am

Just get you a Rebel Black Bear for a mascot and everything will be fine.

todd

January 3rd, 2013
8:16 am

91% of Native Americans polled by Sports Illustrated said that they didn’t even find the clearly pejorative term ‘Redskin’ to be racist or even offensive. So who is making an issue over this besides a couple of sports writers? If there were no sports teams with native american mascots would anyone ever discuss native americans or their causes?

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
8:19 am

Where’s Bat Masterson, he’s knows all about stocks and business stuff, I haven’t seen Bat much lately. _ kenhotlanta

Not really, ken. I do know a fair amount about Sirius/XM and Liberty Media. Liberty had not taken over Siri quite yet. They are still working on it but they are calling the shots.

They are waiting on FCC approval before they go over 50% ownership of the stock. It’s a long story but Liberty took a risk on Siri back when the credit market froze up and got 40% for about a $500mm loan. They got paid back quickly at, I think, 15% interest.

Since then Liberty has been buying up stock on the open market and through deals with large holders. They sit at just under 50% and have spent about $1.5B. They want to control Siri and get that money back. So Yeah Mel is out, but his contract was up, and I think it’s probably time for a change anyway.

In December they did a one time special dividend of $.05 and announced a share buyback program that Liberty will be participating in the buy back ,but don’t have to sell all they bought, to get back their investment at todays prices. So they could get over the 50% hump that way.

Siri Is a cash cow and Liberty has made out like a bandit.

johnny

January 3rd, 2013
8:22 am

This is clearly a controversial issue so we should just scrap the Braves name and logo for good. I would like to suggest “Rebels” as the new Atlanta nickname to commemorate our Civil War heritage…Instead of the tomahawk chop the fans could do a rebel yell to get rallies started.

johnny

January 3rd, 2013
8:22 am

This is clearly a controversial issue so we should just scrap the Braves name and logo for good. I would like to suggest “Rebels” as the new Atlanta nickname to commemorate our Civil War heritage…Instead of the tomahawk chop the fans could do a rebel yell to get rallies started.

johnny

January 3rd, 2013
8:22 am

This is clearly a controversial issue so we should just scrap the Braves name and logo for good. I would like to suggest “Rebels” as the new Atlanta nickname to commemorate our Civil War heritage…Instead of the tomahawk chop the fans could do a rebel yell to get rallies started.

johnny

January 3rd, 2013
8:22 am

This is clearly a controversial issue so we should just scrap the Braves name and logo for good. I would like to suggest “Rebels” as the new Atlanta nickname to commemorate our Civil War heritage…Instead of the tomahawk chop the fans could do a rebel yell to get rallies started.

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
8:24 am

how much is that dog in the window

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
8:28 am

Bat is on twitter…. I don’t know if he wants the name posted on here, but hmu and I can get you the name via twitter. _ TheOnlyBravesFan

You don’t know if I want to give out my twitter name here, but you will copy a link I posted there, here, that blows my anonymity here all to hell an gone.

Dadgum.....

January 3rd, 2013
8:39 am

Who in the hell needs batting practice caps. They should be butt-ugly to squash any thought of wearing them in the games. That said…they are.

It’s hard to find a lot of Native Americans. At least enough with a % of Native American in them to qualify for any poll on the subject. I know a few and I can tell you they could give a rip. 50-something’s that have better things to do than worry about a logo on a cap. Ugly logo at that. Look at it this way. I’m part Polish (small part). I’m not offended by the jokes. Not sure this follows in the logo vein but you get my point. Maybe if scribes quit pointing out logos that were perceived offensive then perhaps people wouldn’t care about the logos at all. Let the offended party bring it up. There is nothing wrong with any names such as “Braves” or logos like the Redskins or actions like the Tomahawk Chop (it is different than the FSU chop). Actually the way I look at it is that it is more a tip of the cap than a slap in the face.

Rock on…..ND has the perfect logo for one of the most despised teams in all of sport. I just want to Taekwondo his arse every time I see him. Roll Tide!

Dadgum.....

January 3rd, 2013
8:42 am

Johnny x 4….you rebel you.

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
8:45 am

i feel good gonna beat this crappy disease yet

I pray the you do, gary.

Dadgum.....

January 3rd, 2013
8:53 am

Well , I don’t know many 100% Native Americans but I know thousands of 100% American Rednecks. Using “Rebels” instead of Braves would cause quite a stir between warring Redneck factions. Some that would claim it a 3 syllable vs a 2 syllable word and prepared to wager a bunch of beer they are right. Nah, Rebels would get hung up in Redneck courts for eternity :.)

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
8:53 am

Something in a name; “Braves” always meant someting to me, ” One who endures to the end “, Battles thru to the last man standing, not giving up the fight. I always liked the red – white – blue feather logos on the shoulders(72 -79) as well. The Indian warrior always been cool w/ me.

newkid

January 3rd, 2013
8:55 am

Honesty ought to require us to admit to ourselves that for more than 500 years (and still) our ONE real concern with red people in this hemisphere has been to ensure that we did any and everything we thought necessary to ensure they were ELIMINATED as factor in our lust to exploit these lands and the associated resources. We’ve CARED enough about them for those 500 years to have very willingly almost wiped them from the face of the earth in pursuit of our aspirations, and we care no more about them today than we’ve cared since the Spaniards landed. Why do we insist upon continuing to lie to ourselves with silly discussions about inconsequential crap like this logo? If we really cared, we’d spend our energies on things like assisting the Lakota Sioux with their effort to regain tribal lands rather than with crappy meaningless discussions about a ball cap. We couldn’t care less about red people; never have.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
8:56 am

Gary; Our Hearts & prayers will continue for you buddy.

urban redneck

January 3rd, 2013
9:00 am

anyone know when the caravan schedule comes out? seems like it started in late january last year. go bravos.

Pearls Before Swine

January 3rd, 2013
9:07 am

My issue is not whether the “screaming savage” logo is PC or not. My issue is that many fans and some in the media would embrace a new batting practice hat that featured a steaming pile of cow manure on it simply because it came from the Braves organization.

Can the Braves bring the logo back? Sure they can, but why would they? Just to prove they can?
It would be one thing if they weren’t bowing to pressure to eliminate part of the uni that had been in place for decades, but the fact is the murdering Mohawk has been absent for years now. Bringing it back now only proves the organization off the field is the same as the organization on the field. They simply just don’t have all the pieces in place to make great decisions. A good business head would not want to alienate ANY potential fans. Of course in this day and time, it seems there are lots of folks who think it’s great to swim against the current, fight windmills and engage in other stupid activities just because they feel they have the right to do so.

As my daughter is fond of saying, “who thought THAT was a good idea?”

Fish Bisch

January 3rd, 2013
9:07 am

I find this column racist.

Dadgum.....

January 3rd, 2013
9:12 am

I can see this blog topic wandering into forbidden political territory which is punishable by a DOB thrashing. Having said that……

Left field. I dunno. If we signed Johnson to platoon as needed and project Gattis to help there as it appears he can then are we really gonna give up a lot to get a Fowler-type to patrol LF? Prado will play there some too. This looks, to me, that what we have is as good as what we could get. Not to mention a helluva lot cheaper. I understand that images in the mirror are bigger than they appear but I’m fine with being patient now and seeing what might unfold in the early months of the season. Maybe Gattis turns into the masher we all have been wanting in LF for decades. Maybe.

Joey

January 3rd, 2013
9:22 am

Thanks for the info, DOB.

Love the logo – hope we keep it, if for no other reason than to irritate the panty-waists.

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
9:23 am

i know im not the only one facing med issues on the blog
and what ive found is liable to be a hoax, but ive read alot about royal rife and how he treated people around the turn of the 20th century. if it is a hoax its not a real expensive one, if anyons facing anyhing serious and wants to check out what i have found my emails rxxgary@aol.com. read about him yourself , i have the frequencies that he supposedly used to treat about any imagineable disease. there theory was that almost every disease is caused by poor diets and parasites resulting from this diet inside your body. anyway like i said i have the codes and the freq machines can be built easily enough or you can buy one not at all real expensive. like i said could all be a hoax , i haven’t tried it yet but contemplating it.. anyway if you want the info write me i wont charge ypou or make anything off of this whatsoever. hey if i wanted to join the rat race i would have won it………lol

Don

January 3rd, 2013
9:33 am

Don’t Understand, Don’t Understand — People keep talking about how great, how exciting it is going to be to have the Power Hitting B J Upton in the outfield. Against the 1/3 best best pitchers, he hit .168 with Zero Home Runs. How do you think he is going to produce in the meaningful situations in the late innings of close games when he is facing the team’s set up men and .Closers. (To say nothing of his overall BA below .250 and OBA below .300 and approaching 200 Strike Outs. Just wait.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
9:36 am

dadgum the Tomahawk Chop (it is different than the FSU chop).

it is? how is it different?

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
9:41 am

Me being of European descent, have taken away true-native American’s Freedoms, & we suppose to be the land of the free, they are truely Brave, they are warriors who don’t back down to no one, because they truely stood from Heart within. I love the Logo, Love the name because I would Love to follow even a sports team that would try to represent something close to a great heritage(tho may never touch the surface) but I always admired Native American-Indian culture, the hardships, their land that I (my descendants) came to use, which it really belongs to them, & I sure use resources w/o discretion that should be to them. But out of respect to the Native-American folks, this Scott – Irish man has try to learn not to take things for granted based upon how the native American culture based itself upon. To have a Baseball team w/ the name Braves I would like to think would represent admirably what it would stand for from a certain people whose persona or heritage actually is what it means.

TommyP

January 3rd, 2013
9:48 am

I honestly can’t figure out how some intelligent people on here can’t see the problem with the logo. Or even the use of Native Americans as mascots.

The best comparison would be for a German sports team to name their team after the Jewish and then claim that they are honoring them. Y’know, go ahead and have the logo depicting them with sad eyes wearing dirty and over-sized clothing.

I love the folks pointing to the poll results as proof it’s OK to use the logo. LOL That’s a lot of white males voting, folks.

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
9:48 am

BJ= 6 full seasons in majors= .255 BA 20/75 HR/RBI strikeouts by season 154,134,152,164,161,169. Its so easy to check facts BEFORE you post random sh*t.

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
9:50 am

.255 is not BELOW .250 last time I checked. The strikeot totals are NOT approaching 200. Get your facts straight or STFU.

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
9:51 am

I bet he puts up #’s higher than his career avgs. in 2013. Any takers?

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
9:56 am

Thats like saying Hank Aaron hit around 800 home runs or Cal Ripken played in nearly 3000 straight games. Thats why the stats are kept so that you can look them up and have an intelligent conversation and comparison. Get your facts straight before posting Don.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
9:56 am

Got to get me some screamin’ indian BRAVES batting cap. Will match my screamin’ indian logo tee I bought at East Cobb in 2011.

BYW, he sure looks like he’s smilin’ to me.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:02 am

BJ hasn’t hit above .250, or OPSd above .759 in the last 4 years… 4 year sample sizes are pretty commonly used. We can look at his career numbers, yes, but do keep in mind that Upton hasn’t come close to his 2007-8 numbers at all.

2007-8 .286/.384/.452/.836 121 OPS+ (BABIPs of .393 and .344) avg. 81 walks, 144 Ks

2009-12 .242/.316/.420/.736 102 OPS+ (BABIIPs of .310, .304, .298, .294) avg. 60 walks, 162 Ks

And in the 2009-12 stretch, his best year was 2011, when he hit .243/.331/.429/.759 (114 OPS+). His OPS+ the last 3 years, taking out 2009, where he did struggle shows a .242/.317/.436/.753 line (106 OPS+). He’s improving on power, not so much on walks and avg… babip is around normal for him.

I think he will stay around those numbers

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:05 am

and, as I’ve shown before, BJ doesn’t really replace Bourn…. offense and defense, and this includes Bourn’s sukkage in the 2nd half. He’s still a good 30+ runs or so better.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:07 am

we’re basically hoping that BJ makes some major strides and somehow gets back to the player he was in 2007-8, or at least closer to that… he hasn’t really made any progress on that the last 4 years, as he was approaching and entering his prime, as one would expect him to. Maybe now is the time that he gets it together, we surely need it.

JT Grace

January 3rd, 2013
10:08 am

Glad to see the photos of Gattis and Mejia now corrected. When first posted the article showed a photo of Mejia but had Gattis’ name listed under it.

Slowhiteguy

January 3rd, 2013
10:11 am

TommyP…Easy now.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
10:22 am

Glad to see the photos of Gattis and Mejia now corrected. When first posted the article showed a photo of Mejia but had Gattis’ name listed under it. JT Grace

No, it did not. I changed the photo because you wouldn’t stop with insisting Gattis photo was Mejia, when anyone could clearly see the guy (Gattis) wasn’t wearing batting gloves, and Mejia wears two batting gloves like just about every other hitter. Gattis wears none.]

I merely switched Gattis pictures so you’d stop. And I added a Mejia pic so you could see him in batting gloves with full beard.

You were wrong weeks ago on this subject, wrong again yesterday. But keep insisting otherwise, it’s all good.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
10:26 am

Don (9:33) – Last year, you posted incessently over injuries to the pitching staff, blaming McDowell and Fredi. This year, the object of your constant scorn is the acquisition of B.J. Upton. Do your focus an equal amount of attention on things you like?

Abnerish

January 3rd, 2013
10:30 am

If it ticks off the politically correct crowd, then I am all in. I will be purchasing a cap in the near future. If that logo and the Braves name is politically incorrect, then Gattis’ nickname “El Oso Blanco” should be downright racist.

Thanks for being brave enough to share your true feelings, DOB, and not to cower to the politically correct mob. That took guts.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
10:31 am

DOB – People often have a hard time admitting when they are wrong. Better to insist on being right than to be humble.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
10:39 am

For those who can’t understand or just refuse to accept my explanation that the Braves aren’t talking about the logo and caps because they haven’t been acknowledged much less unveiled and put on sale yet, here’s the response this morning when I asked a Braves official in charge of such matters:

“We will respond with a statement when/if caps are officially released by MLB. Before then any statements will come from MLB.”

Todd Gakk

January 3rd, 2013
10:46 am

“If it ticks off the politically correct crowd [fill in the blanks with uneducated white people comments]”

Gosh, my view on this has nothing to do with political correctness. A LOL image of an Indian warrior head? Is this typical of what you’d see or are we taking liberties here? Gosh, some of you guys are nitwits. Exactly why would the warrior being laughing hysterically? Like somebody said yesterday, a couple braves interns looked at a couple vendor samples and liked this one because bubbas would snatch ‘em up.

Todd Gakk

January 3rd, 2013
10:46 am

“If it ticks off the politically correct crowd [fill in the blanks with uneducated white people comments]”

Gosh, my view on this has nothing to do with political correctness. A LOL image of an Indian warrior head? Is this typical of what you’d see or are we taking liberties here? Gosh, some of you guys are nitwits. Exactly why would the warrior being laughing hysterically? Like somebody said yesterday, a couple braves interns looked at a couple vendor samples and liked this one because bubbas would snatch ‘em up.

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
10:47 am

Is this the same Don or .Don from last year? I hope not.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
10:47 am

If the PC crowd had its way, we would have been singing last month “I’m dreaming of a multi-colored holiday.”

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
10:48 am

Chip – I believe it is the same Don. I could be wrong.

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
10:50 am

Enough about the caps already folks. Good God what has our society come to? Seriously?

chipl1960

January 3rd, 2013
10:53 am

David= alert for rampant idiocy on the blog.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
10:56 am

Thanks for not being afraid to write about such a topic, DOB. We need more of that in the media, in journalism, etc. It’s become too politically incorrect to avoid such topics, which gets us nowhere, in my view.

I tend to like the logo and don’t see the big deal, at first glance. But admittedly I think that sort of thinking could be offensive. If some logo is offensive or might be offensive to some in a particular group, probably best to avoid it, if for no other reason than PR. Why test the limits of offense? Why even come close to the line? Why not just stay far from the line, where possible, especially when bringing in something new?

I understand not changing team names, from a business perspective, when a brand has been built around a team name, as cold as that sounds. Plus I’m sure there are a lot of legal hoops to jump through with the league office and merchandising, etc. to completely change a team’s name. But maybe it’s wise, again if from nothing more than from a PR perspective, to make things as least offensive as possible.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
10:59 am

“Scream’n Braves”

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
11:00 am

This is one time when I’m glad our blog poll only permits one vote from any individual IP address. Believe it allows poll voting to reflect how our readers feel about the subject, rather than if the poll permitted individuals to vote multiple times and potential skew the results toward whichever folks had the most time and determination to vote repeatedly.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
11:01 am

“Braves Warrior”

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
11:02 am

Thanks for not being afraid to write about such a topic, DOB. We need more of that in the media, in journalism, etc. It’s become too politically incorrect to avoid such topics, which gets us nowhere, in my view. — Shaun

Thanks, Shaun.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
11:03 am

Shaun and Abnerish: Thanks.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
11:04 am

Shaun – I understand what you are saying. But, where does the line get drawn? People and groups have different ideas of where the line should be? if we take the PC idea to the extreme, we would eventually have a team named the Atlanta Toys in non-descript solid uniforms playing the Miami Water in solid non-descript unifiorms.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
11:04 am

It is &^%$*ing cold today. Minus 14 when I got up and a high of (maybe) 8 by this afternoon. If I’d known it would be this cold, I never would have scheduled everything I had to do for today.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
11:07 am

That is, unless the names “Toys” and “Water” are offensive to some people.

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
11:09 am

David O’Brien

Sorry for the bolding. When you get a chance, would you delete the comment from The Only Braves Fan at 12:49 am. It has a link to some personal information, a fundraising site, that I would not have posted here without clearing it with you first, if at all.

Thank you

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
11:09 am

So now we’re debating not just the logo but the team name too?

Ri-freakin-diculous.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
11:09 am

Cliff – Depends on what “Toy” you’d use for a Mascot. I’m certain we could find fault with anything they decided on. Political correctness knows no bounds, nor does insanity in it’s adherence to PC.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
11:10 am

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
11:13 am

Hi Murph!

Happy New Year. How was Christmas and the now 5 year olds birthday?

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:13 am

Pat Lackey ‏@whygavs
The DH is coming to the NL sooner rather than later with regular interleague play. The sooner we all accept it, the happier we all are

:D

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
11:15 am

I forgot that the mascot would be ripe for attack by the PCers. This slippery slope is quite a problem.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
11:15 am

Cliff Fiscal, I certainly think political correctness can be and perhaps has been taken too far in our culture and society, no doubt about it. But just because it may be difficult to find the line doesn’t mean there isn’t one or that people or businesses or sports teams should just ignore making their best judgements in where it might be.

I think there is harm in being overly sensitive for no reason, when being insensitive is necessary. But I don’t see the harm in being cautious when it comes to possibly offending certain groups, especially from a business perspective when it could hit a business in the wallet.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
11:16 am

Bat, thanks for taking the time to check in and clarify the Liberty/XM Sirius deal, the info I found wasn’t too clear with the facts. I just hope they don’t make massive cuts or changes with the basics, like Clear Channel does when they take over a radio station.
Plus, it’s good to see you and prayers still going up for your brother.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
11:21 am

Shaun, did you see the post advising you Bill James is the guest on Clubhouse Confidential today? I’m even excited about that, he doesn’t do many of those shows on MLB.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
11:22 am

Shaun- Agreed when looking at it from a business perspective. Caution is probably best, although it might be that the publicity and discussion taking place could impact the wallet positively. In any event, I would love to hear the opinions of native americans on this topic.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
11:23 am

Shaun – I pretty much agree with you for once. However – The necessity of insensitivity? Yeah, that’s you all right.

Bat Masterson

January 3rd, 2013
11:25 am

ken,

Sure thing. I don’t think Liberty would do much programming wise with Siri/XM but whatever they do with the company you can rest assured tax avoidance on their profits will be the driving force. That’s how they ended up with the Braves, asset swaps plus getting. Billion dollars in cash tax free.

Thanks for the thoughts and prayers for my brother.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:27 am

Tim Brown ‏@TBrownYahoo
Scout on Javier Vazquez in PR winter ball: Physically looks great, ball coming out of his hand well, could be a sneaky good pickup

RC

January 3rd, 2013
11:29 am

Shaun,

Very well put in your 10:56 post. Whether it’s offensive or not, it seemed fairly predictable that it would be perceived as such by some, and in that light it’s just a poor business decision to introduce controversy where it could have been easily avoided.

Joey

January 3rd, 2013
11:30 am

Why not picture a native american more in line with our Cherokee culture here in the south. Or just stick with the tomahawk.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
11:33 am

DOB; Any word how Francis’co is look’n like lately? Is he a Lean Mean Thump’n Machine yet? El oso Francisco gonna Look Like a second com’n lefthanded Mike Schmidt?

SC Dawg

January 3rd, 2013
11:38 am

Why not let the Cherokee Eastern Tribe in North Carolina if the Logo is ok. I for one like it.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
11:43 am

I like the Florida State approach: Get approval from the Seminoles. I would think at least some Irish people had some say in Notre Dame’s mascot and team name. This seems like a good idea. I think it would do a lot of good for the Braves to present themselves as trying to be just a bit of a source of pride for American Indians, for what that’s worth. Baseball, like all businesses and entertainment ventures (and probably everything to some degree), should be about people.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:44 am

Juan did well in winter ball last year…. stunk in ST and wasn’t real good during the season….

UKUGA

January 3rd, 2013
11:51 am

The more effort you make to stay clear of the line, the more closely the line will be pulled in.

It works the same going the other direction as well. Test the boundaries, and the boundaries will grow.

UKUGA

January 3rd, 2013
11:52 am

Meanwhile, it seems this hat, which hasn’t even been released yet, has generated quite a bit of buzz.

How much have the Braves paid for this attention?

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
11:53 am

TOBF – Yes, we get it!

BJ = BAD
Greinke = GOOD

Time, my very young friend, to move on to new topics.

DH

January 3rd, 2013
11:59 am

Love the logo. Keep it! And I’m half Irish and not the least bit offended by the Fighting Irish logo. I wish people would stop being so sensitive and politically correct.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
12:00 pm

Wait, when did the BRAVES bring in GREINKE?

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:03 pm

did I say BJ was bad? or just that I expect him to be what he has been the past 4 years….

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
12:04 pm

richbrave – Where ya been? :)

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
12:05 pm

Which you consider, at the most, not very good.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:09 pm

was just saying, sure BJ has a career line of .255/.336/.422/.758 (102 OPS+), .255/.338/.430/.768 (109 OPS+) since 2007 when he became a regular…. but the BJ Upton of 2007-8 who posted OBPs over .380, hit .270+. and OPSd near 800 hasn’t been seen the last 4 years. Highest avg. is .247, highest OBP is .331, and a .759 OPS

He’s been pretty bad the last 4 seasons, and I even took out 2009 when he really struggled, and it’s still not all that good. .242/.317/.436/.753. Hasn’t really improved in the last 3 years, as he’s approached his prime.

Now, if we can get him posting babips of .393 and .344 as he did in his first 2 seasons….

Frankie

January 3rd, 2013
12:10 pm

Damn, wish I grew up in the era of Sinatra, Mitchum and the Duke. Sure they wouldn’t spend hours being sensitive lil candy azz posting. nuff of the oversensitivity for the love of John Wayne.

Oh yeah, Jeff Keppinger would have been a solid fit here taking over hot corner. Missed the ball here.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
12:11 pm

tommyp I honestly can’t figure out how some intelligent people on here can’t see the problem with the logo. Or even the use of Native Americans as mascots.

The best comparison would be for a German sports team to name their team after the Jewish and then claim that they are honoring them.

um…do you consider yourself a intelligent person? if you do, and think the above comparison is logical, than im happy to not be in the same intelligence category as you.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
12:12 pm

“Did I say BJ was bad?” If not in those words, you paraphrased it in any other way possible.

For crying out loud – he hasn’t even played a game for the Braves yet and we’re already tired of hearing about it. If you keep this up for five more years someone will take out a contract on you.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:12 pm

average, or just above. Not a premium player, but given his age, he shouldn’t drop of on us at the end of the deal… still doesn’t replace Bourn’s production from last year though.

Jordan Schafer ‏@JordanSchafer
@C_Johnson28 n u lost to NC state… What they ranked? N I’m still waiting for u to tell me last time ACC won a national championship

:roll:

haggard

January 3rd, 2013
12:12 pm

David O’Brien

Thanks for the new goods. And the use of the old logo? Nothing but good, in my opinion. It reminds me of my first baseball game as a ten year old at Atlanta Stadium in 1969;short sleeve Sundays in the southern summer; the three piece Dixieland band that roamed the stands; the guy who brought his trumpet to home games, sat in section 107–field level–and would stand up to play “Charge” three times as the crowd bellowed the word; Marshall Mann’s voice booming around the stadium, “First baseman, Orrrr-land-oooo Ce-peeeee-da!; a large brown bag of roasted peanuts we brought from home–washed down with hometown Coca-Cola–and the ever increasing pile of shells at our feet; my dad’s cupped hands at his mouth as he yelled, “That wasn’t a strike!”; and my asking him one more time as I pointed to the on deck circle, “Dad, is that Hank Aaron?”.

haggard

January 3rd, 2013
12:13 pm

Later good folks

Joe casey

January 3rd, 2013
12:20 pm

Leave the braves new batting cap alone. The Indian logo looks great. No one should be offended. John Lukas has nothing better to write about. The Indian logo shouldnbenon the sleeve of the braves uniform.Next thing you know the ACLU will stick their noise in to a simple thing as a logo.Enough of this BS.

[...] From Other Great Blogs issue #1 Posted on January 3, 2013 by Dugout Online Editor On the Braves’ Indian-head logo, future catching and LF – blogs.ajc.com 01/02/2013 The Braves GM is back in the office after a holidays vacation, and [...]

[...] From Other Great Blogs issue #1 Posted on January 3, 2013 by Dugout Online Editor On the Braves’ Indian-head logo, future catching and LF – blogs.ajc.com 01/02/2013 The Braves GM is back in the office after a holidays vacation, and [...]

klaus

January 3rd, 2013
12:23 pm

Don’t really have an opinion on the cap apart from its ugly. :) It won’t see the light of day but who really cares it is a batting practice cap for god sake.

The only retro thing I want from this team is from the 90s and it is called winning, a butt load. Not leaving ?marks and platoons on the team and going for it.

Hats, banners, fan caravans, etc are just noise. Winning and investing in players to win are what counts.

klaus

January 3rd, 2013
12:25 pm

Full disclosure I have a headache today :)

Hat is still ugly though ;)

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
12:25 pm

DH, I think there is a difference in the standing of the Irish in America, ultimately, and the standing of the American Indian in America. That’s probably why some are offended by representations of one but not the other.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
12:25 pm

OF

LF – RH PRADO/JOHNSON
CF – RH UPTON
RF – LH HEYWARD

Inf

C – RH GERALD LAIRD / LH BRIAN McCANN
1B LH FREDDY FREEMAN
2B RH DAN UGGLA
SS – RH AL SIMMONS
3B RH MARTIN PRADO – RH utility / regular 3B / back-up LF / 2B / 1B

Bench

JUAN FRANCISCO – LH power bat / back-up 3B
ERNESTO MEJIA – RH power bat / back-up 1B
EVAN ‘Bear’ GATTIS – RH power bat. / platoon LF / back-up C
PAUL JANISH – RH back-up SS / 2B
REED JOHNSON – RH platoon LF

Does anyone else see why FRANCISCO is more likely than others to make the 25-man?

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
12:26 pm

RC it’s just a poor business decision to introduce controversy where it could have been easily avoided.

are you sure avoiding controversy is a good business decision?

besides, you have to know your audience. the braves’ audience is not offended by such things. (very few people are)

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
12:28 pm

The best comparison would be for a German sports team to name their team after the Jewish and then claim that they are honoring them.

I don’t think this view is completely unfair. I can certainly see that side of things. Though I do think the history of American Indians is probably more complex.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:33 pm

still being lectured by the PC Po-leece I see

lefty Dave

January 3rd, 2013
12:33 pm

DOB Happy New Year. Wanted to know why Braves are not looking at switch hitter Nick Swisher. With our only switch hitter gone in Chipper I think Nick Swisher would be a good fit. If not Swisher what about Stanton from the marlins. Thanks.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:34 pm

WASP guilt rules

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
12:35 pm

shaun I don’t think this view is completely unfair. I can certainly see that side of things.

no, it is completely unfair. i left out the part where tommyp said the logo would a skeleton looking person with baggy clothes. its not even close to the same thing, and comparing the two shows ignorance and a huge leap of logic. sorry, such a view is not viable.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:37 pm

MLB Trade Rumors ‏@mlbtraderumors
Nationals Interested In Javier Vazquez http://bit.ly/10UeGTr #mlb

Damn. Strengthening a strength, they’ve got a top 2-3 rotation.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
12:38 pm

are you sure avoiding controversy is a good business decision? – DAP

You are right. In some cases avoiding controversy may not be a good business decision. I’d even argue that in some organizations controversy is welcomed rather than avoided (hello Marlins). However, I feel that the Braves organization prides itself on being “professional” and trying to stay above this type of controversy. I think we will see from their reaction to this where they stand on it. If the reaction is to remove the logo from the new hats (or not admit that it was ever part of them), then to me that says the organization had things go in a way they didn’t anticipate, and I view that as extremely short-sighted and obtuse. If the organization stands by the design and moves forward anyway, then it would seem they knew what they were doing the whole time, and I’ll stand corrected.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
12:39 pm

How much could Vazquez possibly go for? $5mil a season? Seems he’s worth picking up with an option year… would make dealing Teheran or Delgado… or Maholm… hurt less at the deadline.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
12:40 pm

DOB Happy New Year. Wanted to know why Braves are not looking at switch hitter Nick Swisher.

He’s no longer a free agent. That might have something to do with it.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:40 pm

Wanted to know why Braves are not looking at switch hitter Nick Swisher.

Indians won’t be trading him, and I believe they’re banned from doing so anyway… newly signed FA

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
12:42 pm

All this controversy about the caps is really a ploy to distract us from the fact no “premium” player has been acquired thus far for LF. Very sneaky, Braves’ management :)

TDub

January 3rd, 2013
12:44 pm

…Doesn’t the old Brave logo look a little like Scatman Crothers?

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:44 pm

Tim Brown‏@TBrownYahoo
Scout on Javier Vazquez in PR winter ball: Physically looks great, ball coming out of his hand well, could be a sneaky good pickup.

Dude was $$ for us… maybe he can do it again, move Maholm for a hitting prospect or two :D

Cliff- Ha!

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
12:47 pm

move Maholm on the off chance that Javi can come back effectively after a year off?
I don’t think so

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
12:50 pm

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:02 am
BJ hasn’t hit above .250, or OPSd above .759 in the last 4 years… 4 year sample sizes are pretty commonly used. We can look at his career numbers, yes, but do keep in mind that Upton hasn’t come close to his 2007-8 numbers at all.

2007-8 .286/.384/.452/.836 121 OPS+ (BABIPs of .393 and .344) avg. 81 walks, 144 Ks

2009-12 .242/.316/.420/.736 102 OPS+ (BABIIPs of .310, .304, .298, .294) avg. 60 walks, 162 Ks

And in the 2009-12 stretch, his best year was 2011, when he hit .243/.331/.429/.759 (114 OPS+). His OPS+ the last 3 years, taking out 2009, where he did struggle shows a .242/.317/.436/.753 line (106 OPS+). He’s improving on power, not so much on walks and avg… babip is around normal for him.

I think he will stay around those numbers
*************************************************
Good day all
AGREED, What is very telling is BJ’s best full seasons were his first two, then the fall off. It means AL pitchers fould a flaw in his hitting and his numbers dropped, as soon as NL pitchers find that flaw WE ARE SCREWED. BJ will hit in low .240s and LAUGH all tje way to the bank with BRAVES money, It is NOT going to be pretty to watch.

Peter R.

January 3rd, 2013
12:51 pm

The Braves are definitely sitting there with their fingers crossed with high hopes that Juan Francisco, Dan Uggla, and B.J. Upton have better than average years. Who knows maybe the Braves’ frugality will pay off in a big way and Juan will hit 20+ homers. That’s what they need if they want to beat out the Nationals: above average production from everyone because that’s how good the Nats potentially look to be. Maybe Uggla can turn it around again and the same goes for Upton with him going 30-30. Then they’re probably also sitting there hoping that they see an increase in production from both Heyward (higher OBP) and Freeman, which is definitely possible. The Braves definitely need McCann to bounce back in a big way. If all this happens, then damn, the Braves could wind up dominating. As an added plus, the Braves seem to have Strasburg figured out. So in my ideal lineup with everyone producing: 1) Simmons 2) Prado 3) Heyward 4) Upton 5) Freeman 6) Uggla 7) McCann 8) Big Juan. The Braves need to start hitting with average again to make their offense as productive as possible. But if Uggla doesn’t produce, then they’ll be hurting in the worst way possible and same with McCann. If the two of them turn it around and the Braves get something out of the 25million they’re getting, then they’ll be in fine shape. I just hate how bad Uggla looks against certain pitchers, i.e. Cole Hamels. The Braves could be a top ten offense this year and to do so they’ll need big time production from Upton, Uggla, and Francisco. Those are the Braves’ “X Factors”.

Macdaddy

January 3rd, 2013
12:53 pm

Ahhh!!! Caravan Schedule is out. I wonder when they’ll put up the players at each stop?

TDub

January 3rd, 2013
12:54 pm

Wonder if there’s any chance of getting Gyorko from SD to play 3B, since he’s blocked there by Headley. That would let Prado stay in LF and fill in the IF when necessary.

Simpson's Homer

January 3rd, 2013
12:55 pm

Wow – this blog has covered more topics than an issue of the National Enquirer! I’m almost surprised that the “let’s trade for Lastings Milledge” crowd hasn’t weighed in yet!

Maybe we should ALL just decide to be offended at everything — then the team could play in dull gray t-shirts with no logo and no markings and no numbers. Maybe THEN we can win a World Series..! The team could be called the Atlanta _______. A blank can’t offend anyone!

NashBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:56 pm

Anyone interested in what some Native Americans think about the depiction of their culture should check out two documentaries: “Reel Injun” and “In Whose Honor”. Not the exact same issues but food for thought.

NashBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
12:56 pm

Anyone interested in what some Native Americans think about the depiction of their culture should check out two documentaries: “Reel Injun” and “In Whose Honor”. Not the exact same issues but food for thought.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
1:02 pm

“Bear” Gattis; Very Cool nickname; The Bear, hat’s the sub name for the Radio station down in Senoia.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
1:02 pm

move Maholm on the off chance that Javi can come back effectively after a year off?
I don’t think so

No no no… sign Vazquez and, if he does come back strong, you have then have more options come trade deadline time.

Simpson's Homer

January 3rd, 2013
1:05 pm

Here’s a good question – will Uggla show up at spring training with even bigger biceps than last year? That’s what he did in the spring of 2012. It SEEMS like his off-season conditioning program would deal more with hand-eye coordination and flexibility. His problem isn’t a lack of biceps – it’s a lack of making solid contact. If his biceps become too big to fit in a jersey, can he play shirtless?

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
1:15 pm

McCann’s rehab is going well, set to begin light throwing in a few weeks, then dry swings. When I asked someone familiar with the situation (not McCann himself) whether the 2-4 weeks missed estimate at start of season still sounded about right, he said it was too early to say and that McCann is actually targeting Opening Day.

Not that he’s taking any shortcuts or rushing things, he’s just aiming for Opening Day if no setbacks and things keep progressing. (Braves might determine they don’t want him to return that quickly, but I think just him targeting that date says something about how well things are going and his state of mind this winter.)

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:17 pm

I think that Indian is laughing at all the white folks on the blog agonizing over him.

DS1

January 3rd, 2013
1:18 pm

Reading all this talk about the logo for me is probably similar to most of you folks having to listen to my once every couple of years’ political rantings.

Not enjoyable.

What about them Braves???

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
1:18 pm

OD… hmm. Certainly sounds as if things are going well….

… then I remember how he came back from the oblique. Take your time,man!

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:19 pm

you obviously never saw Steve Bilko or Ted Kluszewski play, Simpson

Dum-Bass

January 3rd, 2013
1:22 pm

DYSOBWTSTIPM
Different year, same old Braves with the same totally inept pathetic manager! Mediocre is the best the Braves can be expected to attain.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
1:23 pm

Derek (New Jersey)

How do you think Javy Vazquez will perform this year, given the chance?
Klaw (1:20 PM)

I’m clearing room on my CYA ballot in anticipation

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:24 pm

sure like last year, 94 wins of mediocrity

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
1:25 pm

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:19 pm
you obviously never saw Steve Bilko or Ted Kluszewski play, Simpson

************************************************************************
TED played with cutoff jersey sleives.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:27 pm

as did Steve at times, huge arms on both of them

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
1:28 pm

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
1:29 pm

lloyd95

January 3rd, 2013
1:29 pm

Maybe those offended by the logo should channel their energies into protesting the deplorable conditions of most tribal communities, including those with lucrative casinos within their boundaries. Or the staggering rates of substance abuse in those communities.

gordonguy1969

January 3rd, 2013
1:31 pm

I find it difficult to put any credence in anything the NCAA has to say about the use of Native American logos and such as long as they are based in INDIANapolis, INDIANa.

Lane Kiffin

January 3rd, 2013
1:31 pm

Great to see DOB took Venice Jim to task for his always holy than thou attitude. no matter the subject he always manages to put himself above everyone else.

i don’t often agree with DOB but on this one I have to give him a big like.

Mark's for the Braves

January 3rd, 2013
1:32 pm

Thanks for the blog Dave. LOVE the logo. To heck with political correctness. Why can’t they even wear the logo on their caps when the season starts?

Still look for a LF move sometime this spring, but would be ok with Francisco at 3B and Prado in LF and then a Reed Johnson LF platoon. May not be a good idea to switch Prado back and forth from 3B to LF, however.

Come on spring!

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
1:34 pm

I’m almost surprised that the “let’s trade for Lastings Milledge” crowd hasn’t weighed in yet!

A golden oldie, a blast from the past, LOL. Thanks, man, that one really did make me laugh out loud.

Rob

January 3rd, 2013
1:35 pm

DOB,
You need to start doing your own Podcasts. The info and insights are always spot on.

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
1:38 pm

DOB and any other music lovers, good doc. on HBO about the making of the Album Union by Elton John and Leon Russell. Cameron Crowe did the doc.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
1:46 pm

It is a lot easier for them just to bitch about logos Lloyd

The Blogger Formerly Known as Billy

January 3rd, 2013
1:50 pm

I do not really think it matters what a bunch of non-native Americans think about the cap. Ultimately its the Indians who should decide what offends them or not. As far as bringing up the other stuff such as the redskins and irish, well thats pretty much like a kid saying….Look they are doing it too…..two wrongs dont make a right.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
1:55 pm

Zach Sanders ‏@zvsanders
Mike Jacobs once hit 32 homers in a season. He was good for -0.7 WAR that year.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
1:56 pm

I see that 9% are offended.

If you are in the 60%, do you still want it, even knowing 9% are offended?

RC

January 3rd, 2013
1:58 pm

I see that 9% are offended.

If you are in the 60%, do you still want it, even knowing 9% are offended?

Not to mention that the 9% is of Braves fans who care enough to come to an AJC blog and cast their vote. The general public might provide a different ratio altogether.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
1:59 pm

I love farting in elevators.

I don’t give a crap if someone is offended. There’s no law against farting in elevators, is there Jack? See get over your political correctness.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:00 pm

*So get over your political correctness.*

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
2:01 pm

Fred (NYC)

Better 1 year deal: Javy Vazquez or Lance Berkman? Any chance either one replicates their last full season in the majors?
Klaw (1:56 PM)

Vazquez.

Last season was decent… about the same as Maholm, but with more Ks and higher velo… 2-3mil?

Tom O'Hawke

January 3rd, 2013
2:03 pm

As an American patriot, I find it incredibly offensive what that football franchise from New England calls their team.

That silly mascot makes me so irate I can’t even think straight. Show me one, just ONE, patriot that looks like that foolish thing.
INSENSITIVE BASTARDS!!!!

That being said, I like the Braves new logo.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:03 pm

There are times when it would feel great to let one rip, but I’m in a crowded elevator. I like it. It feels good. I have a legal right to do it. I want to do it. In fact, from a biological standpoint, it is literally my “God given” right to do it.

But I don’t, because others might be offended.

It’s called good manners.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:03 pm

TOBF Zach Sanders ‏@zvsanders
Mike Jacobs once hit 32 homers in a season. He was good for -0.7 WAR that year.

i dont think that stat is correct.

chipontheroad

January 3rd, 2013
2:04 pm

I wonder how Tom Waits feels about the the smiling warrior

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
2:06 pm

I see that 9% are offended.

If 9% of customers aren’t satisfied with something a business does that could be avoided, that should be a concern for the business.

Mr Pitts

January 3rd, 2013
2:08 pm

“If you are in the 60%, do you still want it, even knowing 9% are offended?”

60% is very close to the white demographics of metro-Atlanta. Go figure.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
2:08 pm

RC

January 3rd, 2013
2:11 pm

TOBF Zach Sanders ‏@zvsanders
Mike Jacobs once hit 32 homers in a season. He was good for -0.7 WAR that year.

i dont think that stat is correct.

The stat is correct. Jacobs also had an OBP under .300 that year, and played terrible defense as a 1b (which is already penalized by WAR for being “easier” defensively than other positions).

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
2:13 pm

.247/.299/.514/.812 that year and was a terrible 1B.

Felix

January 3rd, 2013
2:14 pm

I don’t get it re: controvery about the logo. After all, they are the Braves. It is a way of paying tribute to Native Americans. I see nothing offensive in the picture.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:16 pm

TOBF, ok, fWAR. when i look at WAR i look at BR, which has a quite different number. either way, jacobs had a bad WAR that year mostly because of the position he played. 1B gets the shaft in that dept. why are we bringing up jacobs again?

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:16 pm

No one can look at the “laughing hyena” Indian and seriously say that it in any way honors Native Americans.

He looks like he has had to much firewater. Or he is celebrating all the shiny beads he just got in return for Manhattan Island.

If the British had won the revolution, then hung George Washington and massacred several thousand other “patriots,” and confiscated their land, and today still lorded over us like they owned the place (which, of course, they would), and then named one of their soccer teams “the Continentals,” and used a picture of George Washington laughing like that on their uniforms, I think you might be a little offended TOH. Assuming of course, you don’t come from a family line of Revolutionary loyalists. In which case you would think it was just plain hilarious. Stupid continental patriot. Look at him laugh!

I’ve looked at all of our US currency, the one, the five, the ten, etc. Lots of pictures of “patriots.” I can’t find a single one laughing like he just finished smoking some hemp in bed with his mulatto house servant. Injuns drink firewater. Make laugh. Patriot planter want slave woman. Make laugh too.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
2:19 pm

If 9% of customers aren’t satisfied with something a business does that could be avoided, that should be a concern for the business.

Especially when the 60% that like it wouldn’t have noticed had you not done anything.

Problem for the team now is that they’ve already made the decision, and the “customer” is aware of it. If the poll was truly representative of all Braves fans (which is way too small a sample to be accurate), then the right business decision from this point forward would PROBABLY be to stand their ground and stick with the design. The decisions they made have essentially guaranteed that SOME of their customers will be upset now, as opposed to none of them being upset prior to this snafu.

jbailz23

January 3rd, 2013
2:21 pm

DOB – Thanks for the blog and having the nad’s to talk about something that is considered a difficult issue (anything with a touch of racism is difficult).

I for one love the logo, it’s old school and I love it. I never thought of the logo as screaming, I honestly thought it was showing him chanting along with the chop… Just my take.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:24 pm

old man and then named one of their soccer teams “the Continentals,” and used a picture of George Washington laughing like that on their uniforms, I think you might be a little offended TOH.

still not the same thing. people using this logic, or trying to compare it to germans naming a team “the jews” and using a concentration camp victim as the mascot…do you even know what the term “braves” means? what it refers to and the history of it? and if you cant see the difference between our modern situation and the one you described, or the one tommyp advocated earlier, then you need to think this issue though a little more before commenting.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:27 pm

RC, yes, from a business prospective, it was a dumb move.

How can educated, experienced businessmen look at the picture of the laughing Brave and not at least see the potential for this sort of problem, even if they personally like the logo?

I think they have opened a can of worms which only an idiot would open.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
2:27 pm

Don’t like the hat? Don’t show up to batting practice. Don’t buy one. Avert your eyes when you see a fan wearing one.

You’re going to be ok. You’re going to be….. ok.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
2:33 pm

Nowhere man: What’s the name of the HBO doc on Elton and Leon? Thanks.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:36 pm

shaun I see that 9% are offended.

If 9% of customers aren’t satisfied with something a business does that could be avoided, that should be a concern for the business.

i doubt 9% of braves fans are offended. in fact, probably only 9% will ever even hear about the controversy.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:40 pm

DAP:

I’m already on record as being OK with “Braves.” It is possible to honor Native Americans, but when your mascot is part of a group you have committed genocide against, you have to be careful. I might want to honor the dead of Hiroshima somehow, but I’m not going to put a picture of a mushroom cloud on the invitation. (And yes, I know the historical issues I raise here are not the same, and neither are 100% clear cut).

So, if you are going to name your team after Native Americans, or people of color, or any ethnic group for whom there is a history of discrimination/genocide/human bondage/etc., go ahead and honor them, but be careful. If you want to be safer, name your team after an animal, as most teams do.

My point, if you read carefully, is that the laughing/screaming/drunk/insane Native American image is sort of risky. If you have made the risky decision to choose or keep an ethnic group as a mascot, you need to make darn sure you ARE honoring, and NOT demeaning. It goes with the territory.

alanfalcon

January 3rd, 2013
2:42 pm

Ever ask yourself as to why races other than white resent any characterization of themselves as being racist, it might do them good as a whole to be able to laugh at themselves and appreciate the honor, in no way are Indian logo’s meant to bruse their race, there seems to be an across the board reseiment to any depiction other than whites.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
2:43 pm

when your mascot is part of a group you have committed genocide against, you have to be careful.

There are some really old guys on here, so I can’t speak for them, but I can say with 100% certainty that I have committed zero genocide in my day. And I feel zero guilt for something that happened 100+ years ago.

Not… my… fault.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:45 pm

Murph:

It’s not your fault.

It’s just your moral responsibility. No one said it was your fault.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
2:45 pm

So…..thoughts on LF?

Now that the D’backs have signed Ross, I wonder if Parra might be a reasonable option for the Braves? I’m not really enamored with him as a hitter, but he does have some history as a lead-off hitter, and might serve as a safety net is Simmons doesn’t prove to be up to the task. On the other hand, he’s yet another LH in the lineup, and he’d probably cost a lot more in prospects than the marginal upgrade we’d get from him is worth.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:46 pm

old man part of a group you have committed genocide against,

wait wait…what now? i committed genocide? did you? i didnt, nor did anyone i know.

you keep talking about “honoring” indians. why is this about honoring them? perhaps its not about about honoring them or dishonoring them. maybe its not really about them at all.

the term “braves” is pretty generic. it doesnt refer to a specific “ethnic group” as you call it, or a specific individual. also, there is nothing negative in the logo. nothing. you have to try to be offended for such a thing to bother you.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
2:47 pm

Braves’ April 1 (Monday) season opener vs. Philly at Turner Field will be part of prime-time Opening Night doubleheader on ESPN2 (Cards vs. Dbacks at 10).

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:48 pm

old man It’s just your moral responsibility.

no its not. that is a moral fallacy. murph and i are not responsible to people we dont know because other people we dont know did something unjust to them.

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
2:48 pm

old man – Your “good manners” comment kinda says it for me.

This discussion has become…not “are you offended”, but if you SHOULD be offended…which the majority thinks no one should be. My attitude is that I am not personally offended (and also am an old fat white guy)….but why risk the UNNECESSARY contoversy? Doesn’t seem to be good business or good PR.

And for those who say people are too sensative, and should “just get over it”…well, as old man said…I see it as kinda about good manners. AND not telling someone whether or not they have a right to be offended or feel bad about something…especially something that could easily just be avoided.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
2:53 pm

RC , I wonder if Parra might be a reasonable option for the Braves? I’m not really enamored with him as a hitter, but he does have some history as a lead-off hitter,

hes not a bad option vs. righthanded pitchers. he would have to be super duper cheap, and would fill a similar roll as reed johnson, except from the left side. he would have to be used as a bench/role player.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:54 pm

Murph:

You sit here in a country with the highest standard of living in the world. Never been hungry a day in your life. Nice car. Nice house. Health care. Living in the luckiest population in this history of human civilization.

And you don’t even think you might want to be just a smidge aware that a decent argument can be made that your family (and mine) stole all of this? At least enough to not make it a habit to insult the people we may have stolen it from?

You did not steal it. I did not steal it. But you and I have sure benefited from it a ton.

But you have a legal right to have the screaming Indian on your hat.

Sort of like people who have the stars and bars or the old Georgia state flag on their front bumper. I got no time for that nonsense either.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:54 pm

raleighbravefan

I’m a skinny old white guy.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
2:56 pm

I’m gonna shut up about the hat.

jmart1951

January 3rd, 2013
2:57 pm

Pick a topic that makes you mad. A topic or issue that inspires you to respond whenever that topic or issue is discussed or demonstrated. It could be a racial issue but it could be something like people cursing in public in front of your wife and / or kids.

When its personal it is important, even though that same behavior might not make any difference to me. I might say “that’s life, get over it”. My opinion is that you are over reacting – “hey lighten up’

Unless you (me) have a disability, as a caucasian we do not live in a world that seems to have a bias against who we are or what we need. When we walk down the street we don’t see people walking toward us cross the street so that they don’t pass by us on the sidewalk.

Things that are not personal to us individually tend to get downplayed because “what’s the big deal?”. “Those people are too sensitive”

I am not in favor of changing the Braves name but I am in favor of being respectful to American (Native) Indians in the way that the Braves emblems, trademarks, merchandise, attitudes, etc.. are portrayed by the organization.

I am not a “bleeding heart liberal” but I do believe that we as individuals contribute to an overall lack of respect for others within our society. Overall, there is a general lack of respect of others rights, whether given or earned. Individually, we decide what is important in our actions, expressed thoughts and deeds and if someone else says that is stepping upon their individual rights we typically ignore them, confront them or make fun of them. Because, “it’s no big deal”
Try walking in their shoes, living their lives, try to understand their perspective. Until we do that we do not really understand the problem.

Malcolm Gladwell wrote a very good book “Blink” that discusses our “unconscious prejudices”. It is a very insightful read.

old man

January 3rd, 2013
3:02 pm

jmart1951

[silently, lips moving] Amen.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
3:02 pm

It’s just your moral responsibility. No one said it was your fault.

If this is the discussion, then we’ve moved way beyond the topic of a logo. This is the ground of 18th- and 19th-century morality and ethics, demographics, and societal norms, plus the impact of such on modern enlightened man as it pertains to his vision of the past and present.

Personally, I’d just as soon forgo that conversation in lieu of a root canal.

Lumas Harris

January 3rd, 2013
3:06 pm

Excellent points, Old Man.
Thanks for standing up for your beliefs (which I happen to agree with).

Drawing Dead

January 3rd, 2013
3:07 pm

Well, I like the one game play-off concept. Winning the division should be rewarded with an automatic slot in the play-off series. I dont see the fairness in the two Wild Cards in each league getting the same automatic bids into a 5 game series as the division winners. There should be the stress of having to play a winner-take-all one game play-off when it comes to the Wild Card teams.

If a team doesnt want to deal with the stress or so-called unfairness of a 162 game season coming down to a one game play-off….then take care of business during the regular season and win the division. When the Braves were winning 14 division titles in a row…I wish the Marlins had to play the one game play-in game.

To me..it’s very fair to make Wild Card teams deal with the drama and lucky/unlucky bounces/plays/umpire decisions that come into play when one game decides who advances to play in the 5 game Division Series

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
3:07 pm

oldman/raleighbravefan,

You’re making perfect sense @ 2:40 and 2:48. What everyone seems to be suggesting with the constant “political correctness” attacks is the idea that other people do not have good *reason* to disagree with them. That somehow, people of color haven’t the wits to see the issue in a reasonable manner, and therefore can be made fun of. Or, that people who don’t want to offend these people are somehow being “panty-waists”, as someone posted earlier.

It’s the height of douchiness to not respect another’s opinion. Disagree if you like, but don’t assume they haven’t thought it through and don’t have a reasonable disagreement.

What then

January 3rd, 2013
3:13 pm

I’ve had other white people tell me they think the Tomahawk Chop is racist. I don’t get the logic. What is racist about chanting a song portraying a culture in a celebratory way? My arguement is – what if I were to go salsa dancing? Is that offensive to a Cuban American? What if I sang Opera? Is that offensive to an Italian? Am I not allowed to listen and sing along to Tejano music or Lady Black Mambazo? Is Eminem racist because he is a hip-hop artist?

I don’t think so.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
3:13 pm

ncscoots,

That’s exactly the point: we haven’t moved into a different conversation. It’s the same conversation, but people want to be cavalier about other people’s feelings on it. If you want to talk about using Native Americans as a professional logos, then THIS is the discussion. It does get messy, and you do have to talk about history.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
3:13 pm

voice of harold That somehow, people of color haven’t the wits to see the issue in a reasonable manner, and therefore can be made fun of.

this thought seems to have been plucked right out of your rear end. certainly not from anything thing anyone here has said. scoots is right. the discussion of the braves logo has somehow pulled in 19th century genocide. i say the only way something like this happens is people being extreme and illogical.

Drawing Dead

January 3rd, 2013
3:16 pm

Personally, I’d like to see a platoon of Jordan Schafer/Reed Johnson play left field and hit lead-off. Both have speed and play good defense, which is what we need at the top of the order. However that’s a big if, because Schafer has yet to prove that he can consistently hit at the ML level.

Not sold on Gattis or Francisco at all. If Schafer bombs in Spring Training, then the Braves may have to make a move to get someone to play left field regularly because Reed Johnson isnt a 150 game a season type player. He’s more valuable coming off the bench to provide spark, pinch hit, pinch run, late inning defensive replacement, platoon and hit lefties (if Schafer can show he can hit righties)….I dont see him holding up having to hit righties over the course of the regular season.

What then

January 3rd, 2013
3:18 pm

If a white guy is singing along to a rap song, and the lyrics include the n-word, who in the room do you think gets more flustered – white people or black people? Like Chris Rock said – get your Dre on.

My point is media types have to make a story, so they ramp up the outrage more than necessary.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
3:19 pm

A Schafer/Johnson platoon is an interesting idea. I still worry that Schafer is going to K WAY too much to be effective as a leadoff guy, but he does seem to have the tools for it. I kind of feel like that’s plan G or H at this point though, and I really hope they don’t end up that for down their list of plans.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
3:19 pm

Like I said earlier, if you don’t like the hat, don’t buy one. If you’re deeply offended by the logo, don’t go to games. Protest with your wallet. It’s the only “voice” that really makes an impact anymore.

If they actually release the hat I will purchase one. I won’t think twice about it. Won’t stop to consider the plight of people currently living on reservations. Won’t hesitate and ponder the acts of people hundreds of years ago. I’ll make sure it fits. I’ll give the brim a little bend. I’ll pay my money and leave the store.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
3:22 pm

Well played Braves’ management. This logo controversy gets us all worked up. Braves’ brass then clears it up by adhering to the public’s general wishes on the issue. We applaud management and the handling of the issue. Smiles abound. Before long, as the dust settles and it is opening day, the radio address announcer at Turner Field says “Your starting leftfielder, Jose ConSTANZAAAAA!”

Disclaimer- The above represents a lame attempt a humor and not an actual belief that Constanza will be starting in leftfield.

mwhitebass

January 3rd, 2013
3:24 pm

how about getting a real owner for this lack luster team instead of worrying about a logo.Braves will play 2nd an 3rd fiddle to Washington and the Phillies

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
3:26 pm

I’ll make sure it fits. I’ll give the brim a little bend.

Flat-billers will probably be offended. :-)

O.M.G.

January 3rd, 2013
3:27 pm

Maybe the Braves can donate the profits from the sale of the cap to the American Indian Scholarship Fund or some other fund.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
3:27 pm

Flat-billers will probably be offended.

Flat-billers aren’t real people anyways. I care not.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
3:30 pm

Maybe the Braves can donate the profits from the sale of the cap to the American Indian Scholarship Fund or some other fund.

Yes, then they could be thought racist and condescending, LOL.

keyLargo.

January 3rd, 2013
3:30 pm

A Schafer/Johnson platoon is an interesting idea.

Until you realize you have blocked Francisco and Gattis.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
3:33 pm

Murph,

I won’t think twice about it. Won’t stop to consider the plight of people currently living on reservations. Won’t hesitate and ponder the acts of people hundreds of years ago.

You summarized my point beautifully. Thanks.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:33 pm

David O’Brien

January 3rd, 2013
12:15 am

I am gone for a few days – racism does not cease to exist because we pretend it is gone, and dress it up in nonsensical comparisons like a caricature of a leprechaun… — Venice Jim

If you really believe that I, having been raised in North Carolina and Memphis, having spent countless hours talking to athletes in locker rooms and clubhouse while covering sports for 25 years (including pro sports for 21), don’t fully understand how prevalent racism has been and continues to be in America, then you really have no clue what I’m about or what someone in my position sees when traveling around the country. Not to mention what I read (and delete) from this very blog on a daily basis. So give me a break with the more-enlightened-than-thou attitude.
*************

How about he gives the rest of the poor blog readership a break from it too?

RC

January 3rd, 2013
3:33 pm

Maybe the Braves can donate the profits from the sale of the cap to the American Indian Scholarship Fund or some other fund.

While that’s a nice idea, I have a feeling that doing that would simply serve to draw more attention to the iconography used by the team, nearly all of which could be considered offensive by some (especially the tomahawk).

My guess is that they change the logo and pretend like they never intended to use it.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:36 pm

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
2:48 pm

old man – Your “good manners” comment kinda says it for me.

This discussion has become…not “are you offended”, but if you SHOULD be offended…which the majority thinks no one should be. My attitude is that I am not personally offended (and also am an old fat white guy)….but why risk the UNNECESSARY contoversy? Doesn’t seem to be good business or good PR.

And for those who say people are too sensative, and should “just get over it”…well, as old man said…I see it as kinda about good manners. AND not telling someone whether or not they have a right to be offended or feel bad about something…especially something that could easily just be avoided.
************
Raleigh is fat, you know…lol

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
3:39 pm

My guess is that they change the logo and pretend like they never intended to use it.

Yup… no way that logo see the light of day on any official team uniform or cap. Not gonna happen.

I’ll just have to go back to wearing my headdress and deer skin outfit to games I s’pose.

McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:

January 3rd, 2013
3:40 pm

DOB I think just him targeting that date says something about how well things are going and his state of mind this winter.

True that. Although I seem to recall a few people calling him a wuss or like terms this past season…your source must be totally wrong… ;)

Seriously, thanks for the info! BMac is top-notch in his work ethics, and those who don’t like it cann lump it.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
3:40 pm

and, I’d like to support Venice Jim’s point, DOB. The issue goes beyond the Irish. Not a reasonable comparison, IMHO.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:41 pm

Exactly, Murph…no way, jose.

Oooops. That was probably racist.

TennesseePaul

January 3rd, 2013
3:42 pm

A golden oldie, a blast from the past, LOL. Thanks, man, that one really did make me laugh out loud.

Well, he was the #9 overall prospect prior to his call up, that alone should be worth two starting pitchers.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
3:44 pm

I see that 9% are offended.

If 9% of customers aren’t satisfied with something a business does that could be avoided, that should be a concern for the business.

Actually, it’s rather startling the total is that low, when you consider this blog was posted yesterday, tweeted and then re-tweeted again and again by Native American activists (a couple of different Native American groups were on Twitter debating it with me and others). I mean, you’ve got to think this thing was linked and emailed to others in those groups around North American, right? And yet only a couple of people with access to Internet have commented that they are offended?

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:44 pm

McFann – Should I say it or just let it lay there?

Ok, I’ll keep quiet…nice to “see” you.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:46 pm

A cold, gray January sky….

Few things are more beautiful.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
3:49 pm

If you don’t care for someone’s posts, just don’t read them.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
3:50 pm

Oooops. That was probably racist.

fire phil!

TennesseePaul

January 3rd, 2013
3:52 pm

If the British had won the revolution, then hung George Washington and massacred several thousand other “patriots,” and confiscated their land, and today still lorded over us like they owned the place (which, of course, they would), and then named one of their soccer teams “the Continentals,” and used a picture of George Washington laughing like that on their uniforms, I think you might be a little offended TOH

Please. This fails to even acknowledge the fact that, given your premise, people today would have no connection to the “America” we have now. This is quite simply and entirely rooted in your premise, which is, America as we know it now would never have existed. In such an event, Washington and other “patriots” would be portrayed as terrorist and heretics against the King, or Queen.
And secondly, what we do have is the America today, as we know it, with George Washington kicking the Red Coats across the pond, and a Baseball Team with the name “Royals” which no British person, or descendant, has once uttered a semblance of offense.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
3:54 pm

you know I spent the last half of the 60s organizing black folks to vote, marching in demonstrations and getting whacked around in sit -ins. Sure seems a lot easier to get my self-righteous validation on a blog whining about political correctness and not doing a damn thing about the conditions that still abound regarding the Native Americans to this day.
Get the hell out and do something if you are so full of anger piousness about what happened, instead of sitting in front of your keyboard telling other folks what they should or shouldn’t do.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
3:55 pm

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
3:49 pm

If you don’t care for someone’s posts, just don’t read them.
*************
If I have time, i read them. Same thing you surely do as well based on the number of times others face correction from you. Let’s don’t start down this road, please.

McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:

January 3rd, 2013
3:59 pm

phil Ok, I’ll keep quiet…

Uh…that’s probably the best idea…

Nice to “see” you, too—so far… ;)

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
4:00 pm

nolie, well said at 3:54 p.m.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:00 pm

It’s hard as heck to help those who don’t want, or don’t seem to want, help…

Much as it’s hard as heck to help those that actually do.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
4:00 pm

Factual errors should be corrected.

abeeeewright

January 3rd, 2013
4:02 pm

Pat Lackey ‏@whygavs
The DH is coming to the NL sooner rather than later with regular interleague play. The sooner we all accept it, the happier we all are

“Dr Strangelove or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the DH”

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:03 pm

it was hard as heck getting beaten with billyclubs too., but changes were made.

McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:

January 3rd, 2013
4:04 pm

Fire the DH!!

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
4:04 pm

I’m not sure if 9% is a startling low total for such a poll, considering how it was passed along, etc.

All I’m saying is that 9% dissatisfaction with something a business does is a pretty high rate. Not enormously high but if a business made a decision, surveyed their customers and got a 9% dissatisfaction rate, they would most likely view that as a concern. That’s all I’m saying. Looking at this purely from a business perspective, 9% isn’t completely insignificant.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:04 pm

not according to Bud or anybody I know or have read, the DH in the NL is not gonna happen any time soon

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:05 pm

McFann, you must know that even at my “worst” on here, I’m a McCann guy deep down and always will be, much as I have greatly enjoyed you and your sense of humor and insight on this blog and likely always will as long as it lasts…Mac is awesome, even if I express my “doubts” at times.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:06 pm

All I’m saying is that 9% dissatisfaction with something a business does is a pretty high rate..Shaun

you are kidding, right? That leaves 90% satisfied, and business would likely thrive greatly with a 90% satisfaction rate.

TennesseePaul

January 3rd, 2013
4:06 pm

The DH is coming to the NL sooner rather than later with regular interleague play. The sooner we all accept it, the happier we all are

That’s one way to look at it. I’ve always viewed it this way: With regular interleague play, the DH is on its way out of baseball and into the dust bin of history.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
4:08 pm

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:08 pm

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
4:00 pm

Factual errors should be corrected.
***********
Yes. Every single time, no exceptions.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
4:08 pm

For all the Braves problems of having a too-left handed lineup at times last year, Jeff Fletcher of the Orange County Register posted a crazy stat about the 2012 Angels today:

AB vs RHP as RHB 2646
AB vs RHP as LHB 1406
AB vs LHP as RHB 1477
AB vs LHP as LHB 7

I can see why they weren’t that worried about Hamilton making them “too left-handed”.

Jordan

January 3rd, 2013
4:09 pm

Dave, I appreciate you being willing to take a position contrary to most other reporters. I am glad you are willing to ditch the logo if Native Americans want it ditched, I think a process seeking their approval should have occurred first though. Also, the Fighting Irish analogy is flawed. It is flawed because Notre Dame has very real connections to actual Irish Catholics, I assume there are many Irish Catholics in high positions there. Are there any high ranking Native Americans in Braves management, ownership, or anywhere in their history? A more appropriate analogy would be for Notre Dame to make their mascot a silly “fighting Anabaptist” (a group persecuted by Catholics during the reformation). If Notre Dame did that, I would definitely protest, and I hope some journalists would as well.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:11 pm

Ok, nolie, since factual errors should be corrected, apparently always, here goes….

It’s 91%, not 90%, when one subtractts 91 from 100.

I feel pretty darn superior now.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:11 pm

you are kidding, right? That leaves 90% satisfied, and business would likely thrive greatly with a 90% satisfaction rate.

Beyond that, let’s not think that a blog poll is in any way a scientific survey, or has even a passing resemblance to an accurate sampling. I mean, come on.

TennesseePaul

January 3rd, 2013
4:11 pm

That’s all I’m saying. Looking at this purely from a business perspective, 9% isn’t completely insignificant.

You’re looking at a lopsided and limited data set from a closed point of view Payne. Your assumption is that the business had 100% satisfaction and took a course of action which resulted in 9% dissatisfaction. Or worse yet, assuming the business could gain back a significant portion of that 9% by bowing to their demands while not losing any of the 91% it currently has.

What then

January 3rd, 2013
4:11 pm

If you haven’t had enough racial discussion today, pop over to Grantland. They just posted an article about ‘Django’ and the use of the n-word. Have a ball:

http://www.grantland.com/blog/hollywood-prospectus/post/_/id/64541/django-the-n-word-and-how-we-talk-about-race-in-2013

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:13 pm

then again, subtract has only one t and it’s actually 9% when 91 is taken from 100%…..

It’s good to be right.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
4:13 pm

shaun if a business made a decision, surveyed their customers and got a 9% dissatisfaction rate, they would most likely view that as a concern…Looking at this purely from a business perspective, 9% isn’t completely insignificant.

except that it isnt 9% of customers. its 9% of people who know about the issue, read the aritlce and cared enough to vote on it.

the poll has 2600 votes total, which is about 17% of Turner Field on a Friday home game. out of THAT 17%, only 8% are offended by it. thats about half of 1% of the people at Turner Field on a Friday home game. thats not a significant number, especially considering, as DOB pointed out, that some of the offended people who voted arent even Braves fans.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:14 pm

Also, the Fighting Irish analogy is flawed.

That would merely put it in the company of every analogy posted here in the last day or so. :-)

I know we’ve been trying, but our analogies have been weak, people! Weak, I say! Let’s man up out there!

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
4:15 pm

All I’m saying is that 9% dissatisfaction with something a business does is a pretty high rate.

I dunno…. if Dennys changed the bread on their infamous (and delicious) Moons Over My Hammy sandwich and 1 out of 10 people didn’t like it, I doubt they’d change it back.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:16 pm

Now it’s only 8 percent?

I tell ya…

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:17 pm

Moons over my hammy….hadn’t thought of that in years!

Time for a visit….

McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:

January 3rd, 2013
4:18 pm

phil

Haha, oh yeah! And thanks, man…

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
4:19 pm

RC I can see why they weren’t that worried about Hamilton making them “too left-handed”.

yes, because the vast majority of pitchers are right handed, and having lefty mashers is a good way to score alot of runs off those guys.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:21 pm

nolie,
for my part, I’m pointing out that comments like Murph’s 3:19 and 3:39 are the problem. I appreciate your perspective, and your work.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
4:21 pm

phil-

If one’s entire point is based on faulty facts, why shouldn’t it be mentioned? I suppose we should just let them go on arguing something that is just not true.

I don’t know what I did to make you act the way you do to me, but I suspect nothing will change, so I’ll just move on.

Mr Pitts

January 3rd, 2013
4:23 pm

“how about getting a real owner for this lack luster team instead of worrying about a logo.Braves will play 2nd an 3rd fiddle to Washington and the Phillies”

20+ teams each year play 2nd or 3rd fiddle. It happens and is all to common in some markets.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
4:23 pm

yes, because the vast majority of pitchers are right handed, and having lefty mashers is a good way to score alot of runs off those guys.

And cause picking up Hamilton is a good way to score runs off of nearly any pitcher.

It just surprised me how few left-handed hitters they had on their team last year. It would appear to be none in the starting lineup.

ohhhhYEAH

January 3rd, 2013
4:24 pm

And this is why racism still exists. These liberal, hippie, over-sensitive crybabies that want to cry “RACISM RACISM!” at any hint of an opportunity. Now they’ve taken it so far as to whine about a logo on a freakin hat, one that, by the way, almost everyone I’ve talked with seems to love. Since a bunch of you idiots still think this picture is racist, allow me to give you the definition of racism: hatred or intolerance of another race or races. Now, would the Atlanta Braves, a team that many love (opposite of hate) put on their bp hats a symbol of a people that they hate? The Atlanta Braves are proud of their namesake, and in that pride they express it by including this proud warrior on their-caps and all you crybaby liberal “anti-racists” want to do is cry about it because YOU think it’s offensive. If people such as yourselves would just drop the whole racism thing, people would stop getting so uptight and irrationally overly sensitive. Now, I’ve said my piece, can’t wait to order mine

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:25 pm

that was cab, not me phil. though in general I agree that flaws should be pointed out if they are egregious .I was giving ol shaun the benefit of the doubt of 1 %, I really can add and subtract. Glad you are feeling so superior now though ;)

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:27 pm

Cab, you did nothing. I’m not mad at you or anything like that, if it even matters. I’ve just always found that trait about you to be amusing,and annoying, and I’m very direct in saying so. Of course you’re right that if untrue, correct it. I’m just not so sure it always makes sense to do so over every little thing. It reminds me of the daily tongue-lashing from my wife, usually over next to nothing. Maybe that’s why I react like this?

After all, you guys pound on me if i say Mac is, well, you know., because it annoys you.

Anyway, you’re fine by me.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:31 pm

Ron Burgundy: Boy, that escalated quickly… I mean, that really got out of hand fast.

mercy.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:31 pm

ohhhhYEAH has ended the discussion with his/her definitive manifesto on this issue…

Thank you.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
4:31 pm

I’m pointing out that comments like Murph’s 3:19 and 3:39 are the problem.

Again, I had no part in the “genocide” of American Indians, I had no part in the formation of reservations. Neither did any of my family or my wife’s family. We’re fairly fresh off the boat in the grand scheme of the United States history. What they’ve done on other continents is another matter, but here? Fine, upstanding citizens.

I feel no guilt for liking the logo. I won’t allow anyone to make me feel guilty for liking the logo. And I won’t hesitate to buy a hat featuring the new logo should it actually be released.

I don’t feel that anyone is wrong for being offended by the logo. I just don’t feel like I need to be offended because you are offended.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:33 pm

Now they’ve taken it so far as to whine about a logo on a freakin hat, one that, by the way, almost everyone I’ve talked with seems to love

I wonder how different their perspective is from yours.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
4:33 pm

ohhhhYEAH – Could it be that you are “so uptight and irrationally overly sensitive” about the people complaining about the logo on the hat? Otherwise, why would you immediately call these people racist and crybabies and hippies, etc.

The point is that rather than resort to such namecalling, maybe it is best to engage in a dialogue with reason, intelligence, and a touch of humility. There are intelligent people all over with views that differ. But then again, it is easier to attack then engage.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
4:35 pm

I wouldn’t be so all fired certain that everyone who thinks the logo is offensive is a bleeding heart liberal, or that everyone who really doesn’t care is some kind of Neo Con or some such creature.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:36 pm

“…reason, intelligence, and a touch of humility.”

Wrong place for that, friend.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:36 pm

Murph,

All I hear you say in that explanation is that you don’t give a rat’s arse about how other people feel or think. Which was my point. Moving on.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
4:37 pm

phil-

On a blog like this, where people make arguments based on stats and comparisons between players, I do think in is important to be factually accurate when doing so. Even if it’s something as simple as “Player X won 14 games last year” when he really won 15. It may not seem like much, but it does matter to me. I don’t do it to feel superior or to make others feel dumb. It really is a simple matter of being accurate. Which is why I always look up stats, if I am going to use them, before I post something.

Anyways, thanks :) We’re good

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:37 pm

for my part, I’m pointing out that comments like Murph’s 3:19 and 3:39 are the problem.

I’m just spitballin’ here, but my guess is that, of all the things we might find problematic about our society, Murph is kinda low on the list. :-)

In fact, I’d suggest that even the most obtuse, most culturally unaware, most historically ignorant fraction of our society that would go “Huh?” at even the most eloquent explanation of the catastrophic back-story of the proposed Braves’ logo, is kinda low on the list.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:37 pm

Agreed, Lew.

Cliff Fiscal

January 3rd, 2013
4:38 pm

“Wrong place for that, friend”

My bad.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
4:39 pm

All I hear you say in that explanation is that you don’t give a rat’s arse about how other people feel or think.

This is true.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
4:39 pm

nolie, anyone who is angry and personally attacking folks and getting righteous about this need to read your 3:54 pm post.

I can see both sides. My view is simply that if something could be construed as offensive to a certain group, probably best not to do it, if you don’t have to, especially a business.

I don’t know that any of the more reasonable critics are sitting behind their keyboard telling others what they should or shouldn’t do. I think the reasonable critics are simply pointing out that the mascot may be offensive to some and why is may be and why it may not be the best idea for the Braves to proceed with using it. To try to turn this in to some fight over gaining American Indians any rights that were taken from them, particularly during early parts of American history, is absolutely being self-righteous and annoying. For those that think the mascot thing is a bad idea, I think they are more concerned with just avoiding something that is easily avoidable that might happen to offend some people. It’s essentially about trying to be respectful and nice to people. Not some grand fight about human rights. Anyone who is trying to make it in to that (and is not backing it up with more serious actions) is going overboard, in my opinion.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:40 pm

ncscoots,

I actually disagree with some of that. I think civility is something we’re missing these days. Cliff Fiscal has it right.
But there are a lot of big fish to fry.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
4:41 pm

I’m just spitballin’ here, but my guess is that, of all the things we might find problematic about our society, Murph is kinda low on the list.

We’ll see if you feel the same way when Murph’s Manifesto is released.

You’re either with me… or against me.

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
4:41 pm

nolie – Hang in there, my friend…and thanks a bunch for your good works in the 60’s. Ironically, I had a hard time understanding “what the big deal was” at the time…I was young and naive, never considering how things may be affecting someone else.
Looking back on those times, I am embarrassed that I didn’t really understand discrimination, and couldn’t see how some in our society were treated. I feel we have come a long way, which is a good thing. As with most things, there’s always room for improvement.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:42 pm

Holy Crap! I agree with Shaun! What does this mean?

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
4:42 pm

This is a great country. If you don’t like a candidate, you are allowed to vote against him/her. If you don’t like a product, then you are not forced to purchase it – buy another one that pleases you or does not offend you. If all that is hurt are your delicate sensibilities, the likelihood is you’ll get over it with no permanenet damage done.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
4:44 pm

I’m Scott Irish; I respect & admire the Native-American Culture for what it stands for, & some of my friends who are native-americans don’t see the big deal. Native Americans are tough people, matter of fact, it didn’t make a difference to them who they faced whether the opposition had machine guns, cannons, etc…. what they stood for & fought for for centuries, they knew what being a true warrior was about, the true meaning living off the land, not being wasteful. They lived,fought,died w/honor. Having a baseball team w/ native American warrior persona would stand for Honor, that they took on a challenge, not buckle, American Natives did not snub their noses when opposition came, they faced trouble head on, didn’t take no crap from anyone that crossed them. I admire those who lived for just causes w/backbone, they knew how to be crafty when needed to, & planned, schemed wisely when trouble came. A Brave was rewarded w/ a feather(eagle) for taking on opposition weather greater numbers, or for protecting a village. To be Brave is Bold,Cunning,willing to die for just cause. These people as any (as you & I do or should)value Bravery. My Native American friends appreciate that there’s a baseball team carrying the word that they’ve for centuries strived for as a people. They are Brave & tough against any that crossed them, & enduring people against odds whether seasons & circumstances. Braves Endure to the end. It would be an honor to show admiration of what a certain set of people lived for,& they can say others from outside want to show appreciation for their fortitude, their genuiness, not deceiving, a very genuine culture that stood for not bending,breaking down but stared down hosts who moved in on their territory. My ancestors did that & they(native-americans) withstood that, not scared at all. Many, not all, but many are the Genuine article as a person, my native american friends appreciate a baseball team w/the word they strive for & showing an native american warrior giving a rallying cry or yell against any opposing them wrongly.

RC

January 3rd, 2013
4:44 pm

Holy Crap! I agree with Shaun! What does this mean?

In this particular case, I think it means you are a reasonable, well-meaning human being. Congratulations :)

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:44 pm

We’re fairly fresh off the boat in the grand scheme of the United States history.

Well, from that viewpoint, I probably have as much cred as anyone here on the the issue of ancestral guilt. Members of my family have served this country since 1812, including some in The Indian Wars. I have no doubt that those men fought giving no mercy and no quarter, because they expected none. I cannot hold them guilty for that, nor myself for their actions.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
4:45 pm

Murph – IF you give a rat’s arse, the Package is in the mail – . But if you DO give a rat’s arse, please don’t send it to Vermont.

You should have it either on Saturday or Monday.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:45 pm

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:36 pm

Murph,

All I hear you say in that explanation is that you don’t give a rat’s arse about how other people feel or think. Which was my point. Moving on.
*************
He said nothing of the sort.

Change

January 3rd, 2013
4:46 pm

I thought all the Indians were made to walk out of Georgia on the Trail of Tears? So why use them in a sports logo for a team based in Georgia? Knock, knock!

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
4:46 pm

The Fighting Irish analogy would work better if some English soccer team, perhaps located in Northern Ireland, named themselves the Fighting Irish.

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
4:46 pm

Murph – I’m not against you…I’m mostly amused by you. At any rate, I consider you relatively harmless, but PLEASE don’t sic your younger daughter on me. :)

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:47 pm

I think civility is something we’re missing these days.

On that, we can agree, with equal lamentation. :-)

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:48 pm

Then again, apparently he did! lol

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
4:48 pm

Great idea to introduce this subject to the blog. Nah, the logo couldn’t possibly be divisive; look at how well it’s pulled everyone together here.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:50 pm

phil,

actually, he did. read his comments.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:50 pm

What has EVER pulled everyone here together, aside from some tragic news perhaps?

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:51 pm

I saw that, Harold, though the initial comment led me to believe otherwise…

Oh well. He can think what he wants anyway.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:53 pm

NOTHING can pull everybody here together ;)

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
4:53 pm

yeah, he can think what he wants. at least now I know where he’s coming from.

raleighbravefan

January 3rd, 2013
4:53 pm

phil – True….but this would be a pretty dull forum if we all agreed.

I’ve always said you cannot learn anything new by only talking to people with whom you always agree.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
4:54 pm

change I thought all the Indians were made to walk out of Georgia on the Trail of Tears? So why use them in a sports logo for a team based in Georgia? Knock, knock!

not all of them.

they started being called the braves in boston. an important thing to remember…the term “Brave” or “Braves” is not specific to any particular people group. its was applied across ethnicities. it isnt referring specifically to american indians in the southeast region, northeast region, mid west region, ect. it is a broad term, not a specific one.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
4:54 pm

actually 8% disagreement is about as close to unanimous as this place gets ;)

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
4:55 pm

Murph – I’m not against you…I’m mostly amused by you. At any rate, I consider you relatively harmless, but PLEASE don’t sic your younger daughter on me.

I should run this by her and see what she thinks. And then, when she has spoken, I will come back here and tell you all how you are expected to think. Heaven help you if you don’t fall in line with the soon-to-be 5 year old. Reservations will look like resorts compared to what she has in store for the dissenters.

DAP

January 3rd, 2013
4:55 pm

let me clarify…not all of the cherokee left on the trail of tears.

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
4:57 pm

Good points taken about the ancestory guilt deal, & none here given nor taken, but it’s just the measure of what the original natives that were on this land 1st are not all offended about a baseball team w/ an a native american warrior as a logo. They appreciate Bravery as many of us do.

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
4:57 pm

sure didn’t DAP

RC

January 3rd, 2013
4:57 pm

What has EVER pulled everyone here together, aside from some tragic news perhaps?

Killing Bin Ladin? Even that has it’s tragic side to it (not that he’s dead….the event that started the hunt for him)

phil

January 3rd, 2013
4:59 pm

Heck, I like the disagreement….well, most of it.

ncscoots

January 3rd, 2013
4:59 pm

Reservations will look like resorts compared to what she has in store for the dissenters.

Gulags will look like Club Med.

(Word on the street is that she will be Director Of Security once the Manifesto is in place. You have been warned.)

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
5:00 pm

Nah, not even tragic news brings everyone here together. When Skip died, there were a few who cast aspersions on his chacracter.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:01 pm

Harold, you don’t know me from anyone else around here. Let’s just say…. take what I say with a grain of salt.

If you knew anything about me, where I grew up, the kind of people I grew up around, and the kind of person I am you’d know that all I’m doing here is trying to keep the blog lively.

I meant what I said, though, when I said that I don’t judge people who are offended by the logo…. and that they shouldn’t judge me for not being offended by the logo.

phil

January 3rd, 2013
5:01 pm

RC – there has to be at least one blogger out there who thought Bin Laden should’ve just been arrested. That person may never speak up, but surely he or she exists.

I actually had someone suggest to me yesterday that Bush was probably behind 9/11. An otherwise intelligent person. You can’t make this stuff up.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:04 pm

Not to open up another can, but I do have a question: can someone suggest a good website for baseball stats?

I’m not a stats freak (sorry, Shaun. and I was just agreeing with you a minute ago…) but I do occasionally need a resource.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
5:04 pm

phil- You don’t need to make things up – someone else likely beat you to it anyway and posted in on MLBTR.

TLH Gator

January 3rd, 2013
5:05 pm

Why open this can of worms just to sell some caps and t-shirts? Just stick with the traditional Braves script and tomahawk as the logo of the club. The team wisely moved away from the Indian logo in 1987 when it updated the uniform by bringing back the tomahawk. That was and is the best uniform in baseball.

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
5:05 pm

Beulahfest’s lineup this year here is …

Randy Houser
Confederate Railroad
John Anderson and The Kentucky Headhunters

I have no idea who they are. They any good?

phil

January 3rd, 2013
5:05 pm

I’m sure they did, Lew…ridiculous since we all knew about Skip’s issues for years.

Even Ernie Johnson, lord love the man, surely had his demons too.

We need to mine through them, I suppose, in an upcoming blog.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
5:06 pm

Harold – BaseballReference.com

74bravesjersey

January 3rd, 2013
5:07 pm

Glad Ya’ll stood yer ground all these years, ye native folks, I commend you for holding yer ground, no cap tipp’n here, mabey a glass. Here’s too ya native sons. keep doin’ so for generations to come. Go scream’n warriors, & stand you’re ground!

Youth in Asia

January 3rd, 2013
5:07 pm

I propose a gorilla mascot with the caption: “Does this mascot rustle your jimmies?”

phil

January 3rd, 2013
5:07 pm

Confederate Railroad….

racist name.

I’m kidding.

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
5:08 pm

Voice of Harold, baseball-reference.com is probably the most widely used.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:08 pm

Speaking of bin laden, is anyone here as excited to see Zero Dark Thirty as I am? Can’t wait for that movie to come out.

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
5:08 pm

ESPN has some good stats, some team ones that are otherwise harder to find, but for individual player stats Lew is right, BaseballReference.com shines

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
5:09 pm

Voice of Harold, Baseball Reference, if you are looking for something that is like an online baseball encyclopedia. There is no site like it.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:10 pm

Murph,

Okay. It’s true that I don’t know you, but you have put some things out there for our view. But, I’m not going to get too caught up in what you’re saying or doing on here, not going to speculate about why you would want to “keep the blog lively” by appearing to be incredibly insensitive. It’s all good.

Bay Area Steve

January 3rd, 2013
5:10 pm

Something Atlanta, Posnanski, and Springsteen has got to be link-worthy, right?

http://joeposnanski.blogspot.com/2012/12/springsteen-and-atlanta-shave.html

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:14 pm

Thanks all. I’ll check out Baseball Reference.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
5:14 pm

yes I am Murph, I think Jan 11 gets a wider distribution

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:15 pm

not going to speculate about why you would want to “keep the blog lively” by appearing to be incredibly insensitive.

What did I say that was “incredibly insensitive”?

Cherokee Kid

January 3rd, 2013
5:16 pm

pretty controversial flick from what i read

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:20 pm

Murph,

See your 4:39 post for a start. I referenced others earlier.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
5:20 pm

Voice of Harold, I don’t consider myself a stat geek either, so don’t worry. Just a baseball geek.

Lane Kiffin

January 3rd, 2013
5:21 pm

Cab is Venice Jim going to stay away a few days after that slap down from DOB?

On one hand you say errors should be corrected and on the other you say if you don’t like someone’s post don’t read it. Which is it.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:25 pm

Murph,

See your 4:39 post for a start. I referenced others earlier.

That was “incredibly insensitive”? Wow. Stick around here long enough and I bet I make you cry.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
5:25 pm

yeah It is, comes across as pro-torture according to some

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
5:25 pm

VJ is at work. And since he made his comment before DOB responded, he may not have even seen it.

Reading someone’s post & correcting an error have nothing to do with one another.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:25 pm

Then I’m with you on that, Shaun. Love the game.

HooRah

January 3rd, 2013
5:26 pm

I am pretty sure that Harold is Lou, Murph. I doubt you can make him cry.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
5:27 pm

Let me make that a little more clear- deciding to read or not read a post has nothing to do with correcting an error in fact.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
5:29 pm

see y’all later dudes and dudesses…

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:30 pm

I am pretty sure that Harold is Lou, Murph. I doubt you can make him cry.

Lou has no soul… but that won’t stop me from trying.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:31 pm

Murph,

you’re in no danger of making me cry. I’ll be alright. But, I and others were talking about the lack of civility and general concern for others well being that seems lacking in society as a whole, and your blog posts in particular. If you feel comfortable saying “I don’t give a rat’s arse about what other people think or feel”, then I’d say that’s incredibly insensitive. There are other adjectives I could use, but I would hope you get the point.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:32 pm

I plead ignorance. Who is Lou?

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:32 pm

Later, nolie.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
5:36 pm

Harold, I just love baseball information. If someone can provide a better way to get a snapshot of a player, to get loads of information in one fell swoop without stats, I would be glad to go with something other than stats because I don’t feel I have a knack for math. Perhaps I’m better at it than I realize but I still add on my fingers, to be honest.

But math, stats, numbers as information and language is a helpful approach for me. Not all information is good information, so it’s a matter of examining your assumptions and biases and interpreting the information as best you can in ways that actually reflect reality.

Often times numbers do this better than anything else (unfortunately for those of us who don’t feel like we have a knack for math). There is just no language as precise as looking at a player’s stats from 2012 and, for instance, seeing that he was a firstbaseman playing his home games in a neutral park and that he hit .259/.340/.456.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:37 pm

The Diamondbacks are once again “very much open” to discussing Upton trades… and their demands have reportedly changed, although there’s no indication as to what they’ve changed to.

Simmons
Prado
Heyward
Upton
Freeman
Upton
McCann
Uggla

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:39 pm

If you feel comfortable saying “I don’t give a rat’s arse about what other people think or feel”, then I’d say that’s incredibly insensitive.

Well, obviously, if I were incredibly insensitive, I wouldn’t give a rat’s arse about what you think as far as whether I’m indeed incredibly insensitive or not… so… wait… ah… well, ok, your point is proven. I am incredibly insensitive.

Oh well.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
5:41 pm

Of course baseball language, if you will, is not limited to the appropriate statistics. That’s just a huge chunk of it. There’s also information about tools and positional profiles and all sorts of things that go in to even the basics of baseball language. I think that’s what makes it so fun. It allows us to escape in to almost this entire foreign world within the real world.

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
5:44 pm

Trade Ahmed, Bethancourt, Venters, and Delgado to AZ for Upton. Without a LF of his caliber, this ATL team will be below average.

Shaun

January 3rd, 2013
5:50 pm

Trade Ahmed, Bethancourt, Venters, and Delgado to AZ for Upton. Without a LF of his caliber, this ATL team will be below average.

I’m all for going after Justin Upton aggressively and all but below average? If McCann bounces back to something remotely close to his career norms and if everyone else plays to their normal expected skill levels, based on ages, etc., the Braves should approach a win total in the high 80’s to low 90’s.

fairbrave

January 3rd, 2013
5:53 pm

Would anybody trade Prado straight up for Justin Upton?

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
5:54 pm

high 80s to low 90s doesn’t win divisions and counting on 3-4 players having miraculous turnarounds is unrealistic.

David O'Brien

January 3rd, 2013
5:55 pm

Trade Ahmed, Bethancourt, Venters, and Delgado to AZ for Upton. Without a LF of his caliber, this ATL team will be below average.

How does a team go from 94 wins to being below average, after seeing Chipper Jones retire, replacing Michael Bourn with a 30-30-type (albeit with a low OBP) in Justin Upton, and likely getting at least marginably better (and perhaps significantly better) production at SS, C and 2B than it got the previous season, when players at those positions missed significant time due to injuries and/or had career-worst seasons well before what should be the downside of their careers? Rotation should be as strong or stronger, bullpen as strong or stronger.

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
5:55 pm

fairbrave – YES! I would have traded Simmons straight up for him too though.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:56 pm

If McCann bounces back to something remotely close to his career norms and if everyone else plays to their normal expected skill levels, based on ages, etc., the Braves should approach a win total in the high 80’s to low 90’s.

Gotta do better than that if they want to avoid the play-in game… hell, high 80’s/low 90’s might not even get the team into the play-in game.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
5:57 pm

In general, I agree with you, Shaun. I’m just cautious when making a player’s numbers the “end-all be-all” of that player’s ability. I tend to look as much at how hard a player plays, his decision-making, as much as the raw numbers. Tough to quantify really.

And I agree with you on Nick’s comment. No way we are “below average” as currently constituted.

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
5:59 pm

Ken the name of the doc is The Union.

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
6:01 pm

DOB – Agree BP will be superb. Rotation worries me for obvious reasons and a lineup with 3 or 4 150 strikeout guys won’t win many games IMO. Last years 94 win team lost its leader and arguably most consistent hitter in Chipper Jones and lost its leadoff hitter in Michael Bourn and replaced him with a guy who can’t get on base. Oh, and they still don’t have an everyday LF. Too many question marks on this team to lead me to believe they will finish anywhere close to 85 wins (average-below average).

ncbravesfan90

January 3rd, 2013
6:05 pm

“The Diamondbacks are once again “very much open” to discussing Upton trades… and their demands have reportedly changed, although there’s no indication as to what they’ve changed to.”

According to reports the Diamondbacks are no longer asking for a shortstop in return for Upton. So we should match up much better on a trade with the DBacks now that they are not demanding a shortstop in return.

Bill M.

January 3rd, 2013
6:06 pm

I love the Old Braves Logo, wish they would use them all the time.I think all of the Native American logo’s shows their fighting spirit. I’m sick and tired of everything we say or do is polititcalley incorrect. About 7yrs. ago I started out on mission to research my family. I didn’t know much about my family, boy oh boy did I uncover a bunch. First I found that the name given to me at birth was wrong. Should have been another name. My grandpa changed his name before he married as he was born out of wedlock. There was murders and alot of other stuff in my family. My cousin just found out that her grandmother was not Native American but part African American. So if you don’t know about your family start researching it’s fun. I have indian bloog in me and I see nothing racist in the logo. Go Braves!!!!

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:11 pm

team isn’t below avg… not enough to catch the Nats imo, but still a good team. 88-90 wins. Problem is, Nats probably win 95+. We haven’t really replaced Bourn by adding BJ (based in value in runs)… Chipper shouldn’t be too hard to replace since he missed so much time

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:14 pm

I’ve got Qs on the rotation, but we’ll see… solid, but not exceptional. A bit better than average, I’d say, we’ve got a good collection of mid-rotation guys. No top guy who “scares” the competition…. or throws 92+ ;)

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
6:18 pm

There was a report on XM earlier this evening that both the Rangers and the Braves are in on JUpton.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
6:20 pm

No top guy who “scares” the competition…. or throws 92+

All we need (like it’s a small thing) is for our starters to get through the 5th/6th innings. Best bullpen in baseball with plenty of giddyup.

Tennbravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
6:21 pm

Fairbrave – If ATL can sign Prado to an extension, then NO I don’t trade him for Upton. In my opinion Martin Prado is one of the most valuable players in all of baseball. However, if Prado isn’t gonna get signed, then I trade 1 year of Prado for 3 of Upton. On a different note, Richard Justice on the MLB network just said he has Murphy on his Hall ballot.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
6:22 pm

There was a report on XM earlier this evening that both the Rangers and the Braves are in on JUpton.

I know the price is going to be high, but I don’t see how the Braves can not go after J Upton with everything they’ve got. He’d completely change the landscape of the offense, take a lot of pressure off of certain players, etc.

keyLargo.

January 3rd, 2013
6:23 pm

14 States have Indian populations of over 100,000 but GA is not one of them. FL yes.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
6:25 pm

And NO, I don’t trade Prado – straight up or as part of a ackage for anyone. Sign him top a four year deal and be done with it. You’re not going to find a better third baseman out there.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:26 pm

There was a report on XM earlier this evening that both the Rangers and the Braves are in on JUpton.

Nice…. but I can’t see us beating the Rangers. They’re desperate! Teheran, EOF/JV, and another prospect… Juan or Terdo? Nice start

Phil Sheridan

January 3rd, 2013
6:26 pm

The only good Indians I saw were dead.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:28 pm

Sign him top a four year deal and be done with it.

five…. but if only it were that easy. He’s got to agree to it to. Likely meaning he can’t be a yo-yo ;)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:30 pm

best bullpen in the game didn’t catch us up to the Nats….3 insanely good streaks got us within 5 games. Can’t count on that happening again. And their ‘pen is pretty good too.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
6:31 pm

TOBF – Just because you keep beating a drum doesn’t make it so. There is not a damned thing wrong with Prado playing mulitple positions. He has every year he’s been in the bigs, will again this year for the Brave, will every year of any extension he signs with the Braves and will with whatever team he signs with if not the Braves.

It’s a strength and not a weakness and has not been an issue with him ever.

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
6:33 pm

Actually, had the Braves beaten the Nats twice more last season, they’d have tied for the Division lead.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:40 pm

Nats get Ramos back…. better than Flores and Suzuki…. Strasburg for a full year, Harper as well… Span in CF, giving them the leadoff hitter they need, and good defense. Upgraded their rotation by adding Haren over EJax.

We have Simmons for a full season, Medlen and Minor (but doubtful they will be as good for the full season as they were for the 2nd half… ERAs around 2 or lower), McCann should bounce back, and we lost production (runs wise) in CF. Chipper’s value shouldn’t be too hard replaceable, since he missed games. Despite the bad year at the plate in the 2nd half for Uggla, he still was worth nearly the same # of runs for the season as he averaged for his career… the walks helped.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
6:42 pm

but the season should be fun…. Braves Nats… start winning on Mondays and beat the Nats a few more games. Beat up on the Phils, Mets, and Fish. Looking forward to it.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
6:48 pm

Voice of Harold: Murph is a pimp for Rally Strippers…you might not want to mess with him. He knows people.

Voice of Harold

January 3rd, 2013
6:54 pm

Hah!. I have no idea what that means, but I’m sure it’s hilarious.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
6:54 pm

If the Braves were able to land Upton they’d be more competitive with the Nats… at first… but… they’d have to give up a lot to get him. Delgado? Teheran? Both are likely to make double-digit starts for the Braves this season. Giving them up would also leave the team with basically nothing to trade at the deadline.

Talk about going all-in.

kenhotlanta

January 3rd, 2013
7:01 pm

BFChris28: Confederate Railroad is a country band from Marietta, GA and had some hits in the 80’s and 90’s.
The Kentucky Headhunters had one hit album in 1989 that had boogie-rock leanings and they have never came close to that sound or success. And they may not even be the original members.
John Anderson had the original massive hit “Swingin’” and ha shad a very good country career with lots of hits. His voice has a ‘twang’ that you either like or you don’t.
I am not familiar with Randy Houser, except he sings country.
Sounds like a crowd pleasing show for the masses.

JoeFan

January 3rd, 2013
7:01 pm

Wren’s been burned to many times by over paying for players. He want go all in for Upton and mortgage the future. He will see what he has in Gattis before he makes any trades and that likely means late March.

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
7:01 pm

Murph is a pimp for Rally Strippers…you might not want to mess with him. He knows people.

Don’t make me invoke The Hanna Rule.

I’ll do it.

ncbravesfan90

January 3rd, 2013
7:02 pm

“If the Braves were able to land Upton they’d be more competitive with the Nats… at first… but… they’d have to give up a lot to get him. Delgado? Teheran? Both are likely to make double-digit starts for the Braves this season. Giving them up would also leave the team with basically nothing to trade at the deadline.”

The locks in the rotation are Medlen, Minor, Hudson, and Maholm…that leaves one spot left for either Teheran or Delgado, not both. If you send either one of them back to Gwinnett for the third year there at Gwinnett their trade value takes a huge hit. Not to mention that Beachy comes back around the all star break which means they both could be in AAA at that point. Therefore, I think Wren trades one of them before Spring Training.

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
7:02 pm

Murph

January 3rd, 2013
5:37 pm
The Diamondbacks are once again “very much open” to discussing Upton trades… and their demands have reportedly changed, although there’s no indication as to what they’ve changed to.

Simmons
Prado
Heyward
Upton
Freeman
Upton
McCann
Uggla

**************
Murph
Your posts are great , but PLEASE one UPTON is one to many. The BRAVES got SCREWED on the BJ signing. He will hit in the high .230s to low .240s with 10 to 15 HRS 55 RBIs, another NATE THE GREAT.

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
7:09 pm

Lew

January 3rd, 2013
6:25 pm
And NO, I don’t trade Prado – straight up or as part of a ackage for anyone. Sign him top a four year deal and be done with it. You’re not going to find a better third baseman out there
**********************************************************************************************
AGREED , most likely the best all round position player on the team.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
7:09 pm

George_George-

BJ has averaged 18.8 home runs a year for the last 6 years (which covers his full seasons in the league) and 23 his last 3 seasons. What makes you think he won’t hit for power anymore?

As for RBI, his average over 6 seasons is 70.8 and 73.6 over the last 3. Again, what makes you think they will be as bad as you claim?

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
7:17 pm

Hi cab
BJs best full seasons were his frist two BA .286 next four years BA .242 normaly a player of his age would be getting better not worse. It tells me AL pitchers found a flaw in his hitting, when NL pitchers find it, it will not be good.

BFChris28

January 3rd, 2013
7:18 pm

kenhotlanta

Thanks.

Should be a good festival this year.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
7:20 pm

George_George-

That is not what I asked. His home runs have gone up each of the last 4 years and again, he has averaged over 73 RBI over the last 3 years. (62, 81, 78) so why do you think there will be such a drop in those numbers? THAT is what I asked…

jeffrey d

January 3rd, 2013
7:22 pm

And NO, I don’t trade Prado – straight up or as part of a ackage for anyone. Sign him top a four year deal and be done with it. You’re not going to find a better third baseman out there

Now I’m a big Prado fan, but you can’t expect to get anything without giving up anything.

keyLargo.

January 3rd, 2013
7:24 pm

So many obviously do. Constanza and Schafer for Upton makes sense to them.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
7:24 pm

he won’t be that bad George…. no reason to expect him to get worse, he’s been consistent he last 3 years… . .242/.317/.436/.753 23 HR, 71 RBI… I could see his HR numbers going down, as he has usually hit most of them in a 2-3 week stretch, and may have gotten some in stadiums like Fenway and Yankee…. but no reason to expect that, even if Turner is hard to hit HR in. He is in his prime (for a year or two now), and may still get a bit better.

.240/.320/.440 22 HR, 75 RBI…

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:24 pm

I would not trade Prado even for Upton

jeffrey d

January 3rd, 2013
7:29 pm

Well it’d be dumb to trade Prado, given that unless we got some weird 3B/LF combo for him we’d just be opening up another hole. Just saying….unless it’s Juan Cruz or Edgar Renteria, you usually won’t get much value for scrubs or aging expendable players.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:33 pm

agreed Jeffrey, though Frank has skinned a GM a couple of times so far

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
7:36 pm

Sign him (Prado) to a four year deal and be done with it.

Just sign David Ross to a one or two year deal to stay in Atlanta and be done with it…. he wants to be here.

:oops:

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:38 pm

just sign Chipper to an extension for a coupla years….

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
7:39 pm

Chipper is busy ripping the Gators on Twitter.

Wes Jorga

January 3rd, 2013
7:39 pm

Is it wrong to assume that Fredi will be better this year?

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
7:40 pm

Where is Bourn going to end up?

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:41 pm

if I tweeted I’d rip the Gators too

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
7:43 pm

We have to hope Fredi will be better. He has never won a playoff game.

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
7:43 pm

We have to hope Fredi will be better. He has never won a playoff game.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:43 pm

I didn’t think Fredi was all that bad last year

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
7:46 pm

spear and chop the Gators….

Nowhere man

January 3rd, 2013
7:48 pm

I see, it okay to rip the gators but not okay to rip Chipper for throwing away a playoff game.

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:51 pm

the Gators are not a person in case you didn’t notice that

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:54 pm

only you would come up with such a comparison :roll:
It is like ripping the Phils, if you wanna rip them I ain’t gonna complain. sigh

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
7:55 pm

jeffrey d

January 3rd, 2013
7:22 pm
AWW jeffrey, PRADO for J UPTON ? Oh PLEASE NO WAY.

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
7:58 pm

I believe the BRAVES mostly because of good pitching will be over a 90 win team again this year.

HooRah

January 3rd, 2013
7:59 pm

You are wasting your time with that schmuck noles

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
7:59 pm

one always hopes……

Wes Jorga

January 3rd, 2013
7:59 pm

I thought Fredi lost games by unneccesarily putting marginal relievers in high leverage situations. He did improve as the year progressed. His lack of faith in Heyward was scarey.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
8:00 pm

SOUTH OF THE BORDER

No news yet from DOMINICA or MEXICO.

No BRAVES playing in PUERTO RICO.

VENEZUELA

LARA CARDINALS

LHSP YOHAN FLANDE on the bump tonight. Two strong innings so far.

C JOSE YEPEZ pulling an O’fer to this point.

ZULIA EAGLES

1B ERNESTO MEJIA 0-1, 1 SO bottom of the first.

EL OSO BLANCO not in the line-up. What’s up with that?

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
8:02 pm

and the year before he was lambasted for using his good receivers too much. someone can complain about either approach

nolie

January 3rd, 2013
8:04 pm

Gattis is gone rich, not playing any more there this winter

Hugo Z Hackenbush

January 3rd, 2013
8:04 pm

Mmmm…believe Gattis is done with winter ball.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
8:06 pm

Several on here will cook up any old trade scenerio and throw it out there willy-nilly. I’ve given up trying to make sense of it, or provide rational analysis to them. I just leave them alone.

ncbravesfan90

January 3rd, 2013
8:07 pm

From MLB Trade Rumors:

The Braves and Mariners have inquired on Upton along with the Rangers, major league sources tell Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. One source said that Atlanta “made strong overtures” for Upton earlier in the offseason but came away thinking that the Diamondbacks were not motivated to trade him.

And from Rotoworld:

FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi report that the Rangers, Mariners and Braves have all “expressed strong interest” in Justin Upton.
The Rangers, of course, have long held interest in the talented outfielder, and the Mariners were mentioned earlier Thursday by ESPN’s Buster Olney as a potential landing spot. The Braves reportedly dropped out of the Upton sweepstakes last month after the D’Backs insisted that Andrelton Simmons was part of the deal, but Arizona has other needs now after the acquisition of Didi Gregorius. The report notes, though, that the D’Backs “continue to send mixed signals about their intentions” regarding Upton, as some believe they’re still more likely to deal Jason Kubel. They’ll almost surely trade one or the other.

George_George

January 3rd, 2013
8:07 pm

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
8:08 pm

Thanx guys….hadn’t caught that change on GATTIS’ status.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
8:10 pm

And I approve. Time for some R&R before ST. Keep in shape, do some BP. Make sure that wrist is completely healed.

keyLargo.

January 3rd, 2013
8:11 pm

I heard the Braves shut Gattis down due to an agreement made before he left for Venez.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
8:11 pm

I guess George_george didn’t want to tell us why he thinks BJ Upton will have such a drop in power or RBIs this year…

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
8:16 pm

Looks to me as if MEJIA stays in VENEZUELA because he’s a native playing in his country’s baseball league. I wonder if he might also have been called home except for that. Obvious to me, the BRAVES are very serious about GATTIS’ role on the big club in 2013. They wanted him home, rested, and ready for ST.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
8:16 pm

what exactly do the Snakes want? Already got their SP in McCarthy, and a SS in Didi… and imo they almost have to move Upton… a LH reliever and a top prospect to replace Bauer? Maybe a 3B?

JasonInFL

January 3rd, 2013
8:19 pm

Yes, it will be hard to replace Chipper’s production despite the fact that he missed some games.

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
8:21 pm

BJ will hit a few HRs but will strike out at least 180 times. Thats a little over 6 and as half games of Ks just for BJ. Then you have to add in Uggs 6 games worth…

We will set the major league record this next year for Ks by one team! Since Ks don’t seem to be a concern we should go ahead and sign Bourn for 1 year and fill it with incentives. He would be a better fit than the nothing we have in left presently.

JasonInFL

January 3rd, 2013
8:26 pm

Chipper was still top 10 3B in WAR and was top 8 in wRC+. He also was in the top 7 in OPS and top 3 in OBP.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
8:27 pm

BJ will hit a few HRs but will strike out at least 180 times.

He’s never struck out that many times in a season- why do you think he will now? (genuinely curious…)

JasonInFL

January 3rd, 2013
8:27 pm

Prado
Upton
J-Hey
Upton
Freeman
Uggs
Mac
Simmons

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
8:31 pm

That was quick…

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
8:37 pm

cabravesan

He struck out right at 170 times last year. Actually 1 more time than Uggs I think. Can you imagine watching another Brave in the same lineup as Ugg strike out more and watch it day after day. Its going to be brutal.

Hope I’m wrong but I didn’t like the signing but nobody asked ;)

JasonInFL

January 3rd, 2013
8:37 pm

Man, Chipper was remarkably consistent throughout his career. Home/Away, batting Left/Right, 1st half/2nd half, by month, Day/Night, etc.

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
8:39 pm

cabraves

Sorry I forgot to put my answer to your question. I’m afraid he’ll try to liv up to the contract and be a 75 million dollar player and pressing more to drive the ball will account for at least 10 more Ks. IMO

Wes Jorga

January 3rd, 2013
8:42 pm

Upton had 14 more strikeouts than Bourn did.

DiamondDave

January 3rd, 2013
8:44 pm

In all the fuss over the Braves name, has it ever occurred to anyone that they were originally the Boston Braves, and that the name is a reference to the disguise worn by those who took part in the original Boston Tea Party?

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
8:45 pm

Mark-

Fair enough :)

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
8:47 pm

Kind of in a mood tonight so I’ll throw it out there – Anyone that would trade Simmons for Upton should be banned from the blog and have to wear a baseball dunce hat.

Shortstops with Simmons skill set is one or 2 a life time. Did those advocating this rediculous trade see the plays he made last year. They were Ozzie like but with a much better arm. Yet some want to trade him for a athletic Outfielder. An outfielder?? Really??? Geez!

Wes Jorga

January 3rd, 2013
8:47 pm

DD. That makes perfect sense! Thanks for the info.

MIBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
8:51 pm

I don’t think anyone knows what Bossman Junior can do, and I’m sure no one knows what he will do – seeing what players actually do on the field is the joy of watching actual baseball games. No one knows what Evan Gattis can do in MLB, although a whole lot of people on this blog have spent the winter writing him off before he’s ever had an AB – part of the joy of watching actual baseball games is seeing what rookies can do, and become. Spring Training cannot get here fast enough for me.

Felix

January 3rd, 2013
8:56 pm

What we are hearing from a lot of these anti-indian logo bloggers is knee jerk uninformed, illogical, self-righteous, moralizing baby talk.

abeeeewright

January 3rd, 2013
9:23 pm

DiamondDave, January 3rd, 2013, 8:44 pm … “they were originally the Boston Braves, and that the name is a reference to the disguise worn by those who took part in the original Boston Tea Party?”

That was such a racist disguise. Those Bostonians should feel some moral responsibility for trying to pin the blame for their misdeeds on a British ally.

Since they were also the Boston Beaneaters, that casts a little more light on the nature of the logo “Indian’s” comi-tragic expression.

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
9:27 pm

I don’t give a crap about logos or names. I just want the mlb team playing out of Atlanta to find a left fielder and a leadoff hitter!

phil

January 3rd, 2013
9:38 pm

cabravesfan
January 3rd, 2013
8:27 pm

BJ will hit a few HRs but will strike out at least 180 times.

He’s never struck out that many times in a season- why do you think he will now? (genuinely curious…)

***********
curse of the witch, curse of turner field, curse of most georgia teams in general?

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
9:42 pm

phil-

I’m looking for…an actual reason ;)

phil

January 3rd, 2013
9:42 pm

Has Bourn landed anywhere yet?

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
9:43 pm

A belated Happy New Year to all.

Just got back from vacation

phil

January 3rd, 2013
9:45 pm

There may in fact be an actual reason, but with our luck in this state over the past 18 years or so, a curse or two must be involved….

Just watch what’s about to happen to the Falcons.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
9:49 pm

I have faith in Nolan, Smith, and Ice…. Asante helped too.

You watch, phil!

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
9:50 pm

phil-

To be honest, the only Atlanta team I care about at al is the Braves. Obviously, love them. All the others, I really don’t pay much attention to

(ducks & covers…)

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
9:51 pm

Apparently one of the “L’s” in ALL decided to not show up….

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
9:53 pm

Along with contract pressure for him to try and be more than he ever has been he will be stuck in a lineup of several other strikeout machines.

Remember that within the last 4 or 5 years this team has 5 guys that broke Andruws K record for the Braves. Bottom line is that this team places zero importance on cutting down on Ks. They don’t mind the most useless out there is – K.

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
9:54 pm

cab

I waved to you as I flew over – LOL

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
9:57 pm

Trader Jack-

Where are you headed? (or returning from?)

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
9:57 pm

cab

Spent 2 weeks in Hswaii

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
9:58 pm

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
9:59 pm

Trader Jack-

Nice- I love Hawaii. Which island/s?

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
10:01 pm

Waikiki – Just settled for Honolulu this time. It was a tough time for me this holiday season

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:01 pm

Oregon’s offense is just so impressive. And TV doesn’t begin to do their team speed justice

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:03 pm

Trader Jack-

If you ever get the chance to go back, go to the Big Island and spend some time on the Kona Coast. My absolute favorite place. It’s just beautiful and totally different from the super tourist Waikiki.

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
10:07 pm

cab

Been there a number of times and agree. I lost my wife last January and just had to get the hell out of NJ for a while

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:10 pm

Trader Jack-

Sorry to hear that- I can understand (have never been in that position, fortunately, but I do know the need to get away from things). I just love the pace of Kona- even the mega resorts never feel crowded like the beaches of Honolulu do (not that I don’t like Honolulu- hard not to- I just prefer a less crowded paradise :)

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
10:13 pm

Trader

Sorry for your loss.

Hawaii is a long boat ride for this Georgia boy.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:14 pm

Waikiki too touristy for me….

johnmiltonrocks • an hour ago −
Okay, the Diamondbacks have been wanting to trade Justin Upton forever. How about they just do it?

I actually feel bad for Justin Upton-he really has no choice but to hear the noise. He can’t trade himself. He’s got to play for a team that doesn’t want him, hasn’t wanted him, and talks about that fact at every opportunity.

If I were a GM, I wouldn’t offer anything near what Upton is worth. I’d just keep reminding Towers that he’s been trying to trade this guy for a couple of years now.
1 •Reply•Share ›

Andy Forrester johnmiltonrocks • 14 minutes ago
Look at how little the Dbacks got for Trevor Bauer? All the dbacks do is trash their players publicly, and then trade them for next to nothing. Ryan Roberts, Chris Young, Stephen Drew, Trevor Bauer, now Justin Upton

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:16 pm

condolences, Trader Jack…

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:16 pm

Mark-

It’s worth the trip if you can swing it- in order of places I love (and have been to)- Kona- the Big Island, Maui, Kauai, Oahu/Hololulu (although if you have never been, Waikiki is a good place to start)

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
10:19 pm

Would love to some day. Would be a blast to see the beauty and I’d like to see Pearl Harbour.

klaus

January 3rd, 2013
10:19 pm

Justin would be a great addition but if you trade Prado you need a huge improvement from Juan F. Not sure a P90X winter and DR BB is enough to expect that from him. That said I do like the kid and hope he gets a shot.

Overall I cannot see Wren parting with Prado but nothing is impossible.

Uggla is the guy I would want to go bye bye but he will be as hard to move as Lowe (at least now).

Ahmed, Delgado, Spruill, Venters gets you a return phone call from Towers. Maybe not the deal but a deal starter.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:21 pm

Mark-

Fortunately, If you make your main place to stay on any island, there are plenty of very short flights to the other islands to see what they have to offer…or to spend a day in Honolulu and see Pearl & various other interesting sights without having to actually spend the night there (I promise I don’t hate Honolulu! :) )

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
10:24 pm

Mark

Do it if you get the chance. Took my wife on one of my many trips, and did the Pearl Harbor and Punch Bowl Cemetery
tour. Very impressive

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
10:25 pm

cabraves

Maybe one day. Only island I ever been to is St. Simons ;)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:25 pm

Climb Diamond Head…. lots of steps up, but worth it.

Good exercise too ;)

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:27 pm

Mark-

It really is worth the trip (it’s so weird to me that it is like an 8 hour flight from Atlanta/ the east coast when it is just over 4 for me ;) )

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
10:29 pm

Trader

Hope so. Memories are special regardless of where they come from but I would expect that they are extra special from Hawaii!

MIBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:34 pm

“phil

January 3rd, 2013
9:45 pm
There may in fact be an actual reason, but with our luck in this state over the past 18 years or so, a curse or two must be involved….

Just watch what’s about to happen to the Falcons.”

You want to talk curses? Lol! :)

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
10:34 pm

cab

Try 9 1/2 hours for me . Honolulu to Newark

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:35 pm

Trader Jack-

Yuck…I could be in Europe in 9 1/2 hours :)

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:36 pm

Or on a beach in Hawaii with a drink in my hand…

Mark

January 3rd, 2013
10:37 pm

Gotta work tomorrow so its time for me to hit the hay guys.

Going to dream about blue water and big waves and some good fishing. They gotta have good fishing in Hawaii,

Nite all

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:39 pm

Night Mark!

(They have excellent fishing in Hawaii…)

Trader Jack

January 3rd, 2013
10:40 pm

cab

You haven’t lived until you’ve done 14 hours LA to Sydney

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:44 pm

Trader Jack-

I did 15 LA to Hong Kong. Limped off the plane and fell asleep at dinner… (and 4 from Hong Kong to Tokyo + 12 Tokyo to LA on the way home…and did I mention I hate flying?)

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:46 pm

Chipper on twitter is really really cool…

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
10:46 pm

Also did 10 from LA to Belfast…

Scott

January 3rd, 2013
10:47 pm

Trade for Parra, not Upton or Fowler. Much cheaper, elite defensive OF, hit him leadoff and move Prado to 3B.

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
10:52 pm

Parra is not enough of an upgrade to trade for… rather try Gattis.

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
10:58 pm

Braves will be below average this year. They MIGHT win 80.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
11:03 pm

Nick, you really think they are 14 or more games worse than they were last year?

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
11:05 pm

cab – Yes, I do.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
11:07 pm

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
11:08 pm

Of course, you thought they would be below .500 last year too…

TheOnlyBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:09 pm

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:10 pm

lanai is nice if yoiu know the locals if not halle beware

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:14 pm

gonna go to the rain forresat in belize and honduras, make a wish foundation. they wouldn give me my first three dreams had to settle for something

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
11:15 pm

They won’t have their best pitcher for half the season. They still havent replaced Chipper and they replaced Bourn with a guy who can’t get on base and strikes out more than Uggla. They replaced Ross with Laird (ughh). They lost a bit of defense in CF and 3B too. Simmons is unproven as you could tell from the WC game. He’s not going to be as good as people think offensively. Francisco for 120 games will be a disaster. Uggla is Uggla, and hes declining fast. This team has MEDIOCRE written all over them. But hey, bullpen will be great.

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:20 pm

so count you in at 82 wins nick?72?61-101?

MIBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:21 pm

Reposting something DOB posted a while ago (a year or so?), which was great (I think this is the same version, but not sure) – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHOHi5ueo0A In any case, it’s a great reading and a great poem.

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:21 pm

i see 92 to 85 possibly more if he makes the right move

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:23 pm

pay selig enuff stranger things can happen

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:24 pm

probably takes at least 98 to win nl east

ncgary

January 3rd, 2013
11:25 pm

and cinnci on paper looks awful good , they probably get homefield adbantage thru out

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
11:36 pm

Final Prediction – Braves 84-78 3rd place in NL East, no playoffs. Unfortunately, I’m usually right.

MikeInFl

January 3rd, 2013
11:38 pm

LAA looked good on paper last spring, too, but finished third in their division. Most of the predictions on here seem to me to overlook that the Braves’ best players were, for the most part, kids last year, and have lots of room for improvement.

We haven’t seen the best yet of Heyward, Freeman and Simmons. Will have Medlen (and Simmons) for a full year. If McCann comes back healthy, he should be at his best, and rested for the late season… and we hopefully get Beachy back.

Some things have to go right – a lot rests on Delgado/Tehran, and Uggla to play a positive role IMO – but it’s not impossible for the Braves to win the division.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
11:39 pm

Nick-

Please, share ONE example of when you were right. Just one…

Nick

January 3rd, 2013
11:43 pm

cab – my track record speaks for itself.;)

benchwarmer

January 3rd, 2013
11:44 pm

Why would anyone want to trade Prado? He’s the team MVP and heart of the team.

cabravesfan

January 3rd, 2013
11:45 pm

Nick-

Truer words have never been spoken.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
11:47 pm

SOUTH OF THE BORDER

DOMINICA

EASTERN TOROS

Lead-off CF JOSE CONSTANZA [.364 BA] 0-5, 1 R, 1 BB, 1 SO.

LHRP JOSE LUGO [0.00 ERA] 0.1 IP, zip.

MEXICO

CULIACAN TOMATOES

Lead-off SS RAMIRO PENA [.250 BA] 1-4, 1 SO.

VENEZUELA

LARA CARDINALS

C JOSE YEPEZ [.375 BA] 1-4, 1 SO.

LHSP YOHAN FLANDE [1.69 ERA] 5.1 IP, 4 H, 1 HR, 1 R/ER, 1 BB, 3 SO.

ZULIA EAGLES

1B ERNESTO MEJIA [.000 BA] 0-3, 1 BB, 2 SO.

Semiballcoach

January 3rd, 2013
11:48 pm

I would rather overpay for Stanton than Justin upton

MIBravesFan

January 3rd, 2013
11:50 pm

richbrave – thanks as always for the winter leagues (and the minor leagues) updates!

Nick's Record

January 3rd, 2013
11:51 pm

Nick
March 3rd, 2012
3:12 pm
Wow, what a pathetic, embarrassing display by the Braves. Gonna be a long season. Looks like my 90 loss season prediction is highly plausible.

Nick
March 6th, 2012
2:30 pm
This Braves team will lose 100 games. Bad starting pitching, bad relief pitching, horrible offense, nonexistent bench, worst manager in baseball, bad GM, and terrible ownership. This team has become pathetic and embarrassing.

Nick
April 9th, 2012
11:48 pm
50-112

uga-brave

January 3rd, 2013
11:54 pm

oregon sure looks fast. yeah tell stanford that.

stanford stopped them in their tracks on their home.

chip kelly getting out of town like a hot town cat much like someone else before the NCAA nails him.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
11:55 pm

The burning questions to be decided in ST

Will GERALD LAIRD who replaces DAVID ROSS be a grade better or worse?

Will WALDEN, JAIME, or CARPENTER supplant C-MART and FA CHAD DURBIN in the pen?

Will JUAN FRANCISCO hit for average and power?

Will ERNESTO MEJIA finally get a ML shot at 27?

Will EVAN GATTIS make the club as a platoon LF?

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
11:56 pm

Inquiring minds want to know.

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
11:57 pm

MiBravesFan:

De Nada, Amigo!

richbrave

January 3rd, 2013
11:59 pm

Thanx to whoever dug up Nick’s horrific prognostications for 2012. This should put an end to any credence one might still hold in reference to his swill.

Lane Kiffin

January 4th, 2013
12:02 am

Venice Jim never made it??

That slap down from the chief must have been too much.

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:04 am

Oregon will be on probation in one year. the NCAA is way up Chip kelly’s arse.

cabravesfan

January 4th, 2013
12:05 am

Lane-

Again- He has not been on the blog since he said he would take a break. Never saw that comment from DOB…Let it go

cabravesfan

January 4th, 2013
12:06 am

uga-

are you really going to jump on Oregon for losing to a team that will finish in the top 5?

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:11 am

since 2006 by the way, the sec is 9-3 in BCS bowl games.

Lane Kiffin

January 4th, 2013
12:12 am

I think it’s safe to say that Nick’s record is Venice Jim. He enjoys that sort of thing.

Not often that the Chief puts a smack down on one of the herd. Why should we let it go.

As you put it before if you don’t like my posts don’t read them.

Lane Kiffin

January 4th, 2013
12:14 am

I am sure you have told him about it.

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:17 am

cab, no way i have huge respect for Stanford.

Lane Kiffin

January 4th, 2013
12:19 am

People have said a lot of things about DOB on here but I have never seen anything to suggest that he is racist.

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:22 am

cab, stanford’s front seven reminds me of your niner’s.

really big and fast.

cabravesfan

January 4th, 2013
12:25 am

uga-

Which is why they were the only team that managed to beat Oregon. I can’t stress enough how fast & impressive Oregon’s offense is in person. I knew they were good, but seeing them live is a totally different experience. Seriously- what they do is nothing short of amazing

And I am off for the evening. Good night!

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:27 am

what six all-pros on defense right?

bowman and willis are absolute studs.

the two smiths off the edge rushing passers.

no doubt the most scary defense in the NFL.

cabravesfan

January 4th, 2013
12:29 am

uga-

for once, I completely agree with you :) The Niners D is the best in the league, and they are, for the most part, very young. I like watching them (I have always been a defense first person- I would rather watch a good D than a good O, but that’s just me…)

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:30 am

good night cab, and good luck in the playoffs until atlanta.

cabravesfan

January 4th, 2013
12:33 am

uga-

Thanks! Same to you, except for the Atlanta thing ;)

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:34 am

anyone that would not agree that the niners have the best and scariest defense in the league does not watch football.

Seattle is getting there too, by the way.

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:49 am

So let me put my half ass comment about what the rest of you folks have been commenting about.

i gotta roll with Murph.

uga-brave

January 4th, 2013
12:51 am

just because i like a crease in my cap.

HooRah

January 4th, 2013
1:06 am

Unfortunately, I’m usually right…Nick

not on anything you have ever posted here you haven’t been

kenhotlanta

January 4th, 2013
1:10 am

Michael Wilbon is the worst commentator in the history of sports and he has proclaimed the Redskins and Seahawks are better than and will beat the Falcons. So, I am putting it on record and lets see how bad he really is.
He’s also racist, but we have had way too much talk of that today, so I will leave my rant on him for another time.
Good night, uga.