Like I said, I partially agree. But it seems like we’ve been talking about the Royals being on the brink for about 5 years. And every time they seem to be getting close, they end up needing one more year, but end up having to trade away all their impending free agents before they get over the hump. Moore doesn’t have 3 years to let the young pitching develop. They have a ridiculously talented core of young positions players right now and I think their brief window to compete is 2014 and 2015. I agree with you that Shields doesn’t help that team much in 2013, but he could help them get over the hump in 2014 and 2015. That might be worth trading Myers.
I agree with you that Shields doesn’t help that team much in 2013, but he could help them get over the hump in 2014 and 2015. That might be worth trading Myers.
Only under contract for two more seasons, so you really have to feel good about your chances in 2013 and 2014 to make a deal like this. I would keep Myers and trade from that next tier of prospects.
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
Too early to make that assumption, but if they go with the “internal options” in April, then yes they absolutely decreased payroll by nearly $10 million.
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
Would you rather have Dee Gordon?
As pout-pout fish as I am about the lack of movement at the winter meetings, I’d take my chances with Francisco/Gattis over Dee Gordon or Dexter Fowler every day of the week, and twice on Sundays.
Rule 5 Draft is complete. 42 players were selected overall. http://atmlb.com/120AYAK #WinterMeetings
………and the Meetings are over. Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings. They couldn’t even sign a bench player.
This very well may be true but if there’s one thing I’ve learned about this club recently over the years… never get your hopes up. They always seem to look in terms of bandaids instead of difference makers.
Can we really say they are cutting payroll. Doesn’t sound to me like its by choice. If there’s not a fit they aren’t just going to spend money on useless players just to keep a similar payroll. If the fit is there they will spend. Right now we all see how high the asking prices are on the trade market. If he were to make one of those trades by trading several top prospects for an above average but not elite player people would be having fits. Right now theres just not a move to be made. The inflated cost of FA for mediocre players plus the cost to trade right now is ridiculous. Really can’t blame Wren for being smart about it.
Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings.
I’d give them an F if they traded any decent talent for Dee Gordon, if they sent Minor and Teheran to COL for Fowler, etc.
As of right now I’d give them an I for incomplete. Can’t grade them on moves that they didn’t make… in fact, one could argue they deserve a B+ for not making some of the ridiculous moves that were rumored to be on the table.
Upton would be nice, but not landing Dee Gordon is just as nice if not nicer……. now watch, because I’m on an anti-Dee Gordon tirade the Braves will land him first thing next week. That won’t make me happy.
While I’m disappointed that nothing got done yet and the Winter Meetings came and went like it never even existed I know there is a lot of time left to get something done and Wren will…In Wren I trust. If the asking price for Fowler was Minor and Teheran/Delgado than I know why Wren didn’t get anything done…f’n ridiculous. Wren will wait it out and a deseperate team will come calling, one that needs pitching.
“Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings. They couldn’t even sign a bench player.”
Can’t give him a grade … he hasn’t made a good deal or a bad deal … he hasn’t done anything … gotta give him an “Incomplete” or a “Zero”
Oh geez, I’d rather take my chances becoming a Cardinals or Phillies fan first. Wow.
“They always seem to look in terms of bandaids instead of difference makers.”
Well I somewhat agree, but BJ Upton, while I disagree with the deal, was a MAJOR deal the Braves made. I hope it works out and they know something that baseball-reference.com doesn’t know. But with Delgado and $10 million left to spend, it certainly is possible that they can get something done before the season. But yes, this team isn’t going to be in the top two in the division as currently constructed. Need a MAJOR acquisition for LF or 3B.
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
I’m not opposed to leaving some budget room going into the season. The last few years, the budget was maxed out and the Braves were only able to work out trades (Bourn, Maholm/Johnson) where the other team was willing to pay most of their salary. Braves can really go get a big piece before the trade deadline if the internal options don’t work. That said, I would still prefer a trade for a left fielder now.
I’m not disappointed that they didn’t do anything at the meetings… still another good active month or 2 to go in the offseason. Much better than trying for Dee friggin Gordon or Schierholtz. Premium part-timers.
FW can not be graded for the meetings yet… who knows, maybe he’s making some progress or Justin or Choo.
For the offseason as a whole, though, B-. He got a good piece for Hanson, wish he did it earlier and got Bourjos, and he signed Upton (who I don’t want). However, he was able to get his target, so I’ll give him cred for that. Hopefully he makes Pence and Price his targets next winter…
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren and Fredi will go to the D.R. this weekend to watch Francisco, Constanza and other Braves. Could influence their final roster decisions
Franwhiffco and Canstandya should make no difference on final starting position player decisions. Bench players, sure (not for Constanza tho), but no more than that.
“Braves can really go get a big piece before the trade deadline if the internal options don’t work. That said, I would still prefer a trade for a left fielder now.”
Well, I don’t think this team as currently constructed is good enough to be in it at the tradeline. Gotta get a bat for LF before Spring Training. We don’t have even depth at pitching or internal options for our bench or LF to wait around that long. Braves lost some serious production from Bourn and Chipper and still aren’t getting that back in Upton. Need a lot more to be comfortable with this lineup especially with McCann out and Dan Uggla in LaLa land.
Patrick: Frank Wren has until April 1 to make a trade or add someone(s) to the roster. Would you go to Vegas and go ‘all in’ that the roster right now will be the same one that starts the season? IF so, I will be happy to take your money.
@patrick, its not very smart to grade the 3 days of the winter meetings. Based on things getting done publicly then about 25 teams would grade F’s. how many times a team wins the winter meetings or gets an A and it gives them a championship. Last year many said the Marlins won the winter meetings or received a grade A. And how did that work out for them?
Braves are comfortable with the rotation? I’m not really sure how deep it is anymore with Jurrjens and Hanson gone, and Delgado and Teheran yet to show up in a MLB game.
It’s adequate if they have a good offense, which they currently are lacking an entire bench and a power bat that can get on base.
Wow … I guess in the long run, no moves here was best. But I was really excited at the beginning of the week that the holes would be filled. Still time, but if we go into 2013 as is, I think we’ve taken a step backwards.
Cracks me up that people actually post DOB’s tweets on this blog as if people can’t just see his tweets on the right side of the column. If they use Twitter at all, I’m guessing they already follow DOB if they’re also reading this blog. To post tweets by Rosenthal or others makes some sense as I don’t want to hear ALL the drivel from some of these other writers, but I have 3x the opportunity to catch DOB’s tweets when people post them in the blog. Just cracks me up.
“Yeah, and you think JJ is a quality MLB pitcher,”
Maybe not at this point, but if he figures his stuff out he has the possibility of being one and is worth the risk. But you really missed my point.
What depth do the Braves have at starting pitcher?
Hudson
Medlen
Maholm
Minor
Delgado/Teheran (and one essentially has to be traded for a LFer)
Aren’t we pretty much out of pitchers after that? I mean so who is our 6th starter at this point? Last year we had those 6, plus Jurrjens, Hanson, and Beachy. This year at best we have 5 starting pitchers.
Cracks me up that people actually post DOB’s tweets on this blog as if people can’t just see his tweets on the right side of the column.
The DOB twitter feed on the right side was broken until a few days ago, so I doubt most people even look at it anymore. Also, it doesn’t stay in view while scrolling to the bottom, meaning that it’s hidden from view most of the time…
Brava is just building up her post count to try and come in first. I admire the grit and determination shown in posting every single baseball related tweet over the last few days. Mazel… good things, good things.
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren and Fredi will go to the D.R. this weekend to watch Francisco, Constanza and other Braves. Could influence their final roster decisions
Franwhiffco and Canstandya should make no difference on final starting position player decisions. Bench players, sure (not for Constanza tho), but no more than that.
What is the point to this? You know what you have in Constanza, when he first got called up and pitchers didn’t know his holes, he was successful, once they found out how to pitch him, he hasn’t hit.
I don’t care if Francisco is batting 1000 with 15 HR and leading the winter league in RBI’s, it doesn’t mean that he can do that against real MLB pitching, on a consistent basis and under the spotlight. There is a big…a HUGE differnce. The only reason I can see for going to watch him would be to see how good of shape he is or isn’t in and if he has changed his swing like Walker hsa been pleading with him to do so that he can hit to the opposite field. That’s it.
TOBF: Re your man crush on Peter Bourjos: Did you see Mike Scioscia on MLB yesterday or the day before say the Angels were moving Mike Trout to RF to make room for you boy to play CF everyday? That says an awful lot for what the Angels think of Bourjos since Trout was on the highlight shows just about every night last year for his defense in center.
Last year’s Braves rotation started with 3 guys who had 75 or more starts (roughly 2.5 seasons worth). This year, there are only 2, and of the 3 who are below that threshold, 2 have 30 or fewer starts.
“Laird, Janish, Mejia, R. Johnson, Francisco as the bench?”
Schafer? Maybe we can trade for Brooks Conrad and Eric Hinske and sign Greg Norton from coaching to have an even better bench than the one above. Heck maybe even get Corky Miller to come catch. Gosh that is an awful bench. And we don’t even have Reed Johnson yet.
I saw that ken, good for him. He’ll show everyone how he can hit decently while providing near Bourn-level defense. Just sukks that my fave AL team is the Rangers and not the Angels… but I’ll be rooting for the kid.
MFin, show me another team in the league that has the luxury of 8 or 9 MLB quality starting pitchers? There aren’t any.
If the Braves lose a SP for any period of time they have options. First would be the loser of the Delgado/Teheran ST battle. Beyond that they could get innings from Gilmartin, maybe Graham, who knows?
Remember when Beachy was called up, and 99% of the blog went “Who???”. Look at what he’s done. You never know what guy will rise to the occassion when given the opportunity. The Braves pitching staff will be fine.
Besides, with the bullpen as it’s built now, a starter only needs to get through 5 and then hand the ball off. It’s not ideal, but that bullpen is more than capable of slamming the door on any and every team in the league for 4+ innings. You don’t want to burn them out, but they’re there when needed.
at best we have 5? you just named 6. plus, braves have spruill on the 40 man, with gilmartin and graham in reserve, who could start if they needed to. plus beachy coming back from injury in late july. thats 10 pitchers. they might not have the depth they had last year, but they arent having a hard time finding 5 guys.
Interesting times for Braves fans. All the money coming off the board and not alot to show for it so far. Im not an Upton fan but he does bring some positives. He is young and in his prime plus his contract looks alot more sane after the Winter meetings. I sure like Upton at his price more than Victorino at his price.
Wrens problem right now is that Teheran and Delgado have lost some value and he does not want to sell low. 12 months ago he could have traded Teheran for just about any hitter he has been chasing.
I enjoy all the twitter posts as well. I know that Wren is mashing his teeth waiting for grades from us on his performance for the offseason so far. Thus, I will chime in with another incomplete.
“If the Braves lose a SP for any period of time they have options. First would be the loser of the Delgado/Teheran ST battle”
Ok already said that that can’t happen since one of those guys WILL BE traded this offseason if the Braves offense has a chance this year.
As for other guys stepping up. I’m ok with that logic, seems we have a few pitchers in the minors that could come up, and maybe that is what they are banking on. As for the bullpen, it does appear that we are probably going to be pretty good from the 7th inning on, and have enough guys to get through the 6th. So I agree there.
But this team isn’t nearly as major league ready deep as they once were. And the offense still needs a major piece.
You never know which player is going to get hurt, but looking at our rotation as it is now, the only guy who really is an injury risk out of the gate is Hudson. The other guys are pretty young and durable.
That’s a big difference between this year and last year when we broke ST with Hanson and his issues, JJ and his issues… this rotation will at least be starting out healthy, with Beachy and his new bionic arm waiting in the wings.
As far as a “Leadoff” hitter goes am I the only one that thinks Jose Constanza could do the job. Constanza can steal bases and he always seems to be able to get on base is is a .300 hitter in the minors and when he plays consistantly will hit .300. I just feel this guy just hasnt had a real chance. IMO we would be better placing Constanza in LF and to move Prado to 3B…..Actually we would be better if we moved him to 2nd base and allow Francisco to have a chance. Because Uggla is done IMO.
Going to the DR to look at players? Isn’t that a scouts job? Sounds like a reason for a vacation to me. But they need one after all the hard work this week in Nashville, aye wait…nevermind..
From Mike DiGiovanna in the LA Times this morning:
Wednesday’s moves will push the Angels’ 2013 payroll to about $142 million, and the club has shown no indication it will surpass last season’s record $159-million payroll.
As of Wednesday, Greinke had not ruled out a return to Anaheim, but a person familiar with the team’s thinking but not authorized to speak publicly said the Angels were unwilling to surpass $20 million a year for Greinke, who could command a six-year, $150-million deal.
General Manager Jerry Dipoto would “never close the door on anything,” another person familiar with the team’s thinking said, “but I know he feels good about things presently.”
Angels fans, judging from their harsh reaction on Twitter and Internet message boards, do not. Most think Blanton, who has an 83-75 record and 4.37 earned-run average and gives up home runs in bunches, is a pricey and rather dubious back-of-the-rotation choice.
Wrens problem right now is that Teheran and Delgado have lost some value and he does not want to sell low. 12 months ago he could have traded Teheran for just about any hitter he has been chasing.
There’s more than a kernel of truth to that observation. But Teheran is still a pretty good catch for the right club. The kid’s hit speed bumps, which aren’t necessarily indications of a fall-off in potential.
As far as a “Leadoff” hitter goes am I the only one that thinks Jose Constanza could do the job.
No he cannot. 29 years old, career minor leaguer, and once the league figured him out, he hit .250/.321/.276/.598 at the MLB level. Not all that good of a fielder. 84 career OPS+, he was below avg last year when he was “good”, had an OPS+ of 99.
Pass. Send him and Schafer packing as trade filler.
Matt Kemp’s contract doesn’t include a no-trade clause. Andre Ethier’s doesn’t either.
The Dodgers might be able to outspend their competition, but could their free-agent haul this winter be affected by their reluctance to include this provision in contracts?
President Stan Kasten steadfastly refused to include no-trade clauses in contracts when he was with the Atlanta Braves and Washington Nationals. Kasten wouldn’t say if he instituted a similar policy with the Dodgers when he moved into their front office last spring as part of the new ownership group. But the team wouldn’t grant Ethier no-trade protection when it signed him to a five-year, $85-million extension this spring.
Asked if he would consider including the clause in special cases, Kasten declined to answer.
Multiple agents have said that if the Dodgers refuse to offer no-trade clauses, they could become less attractive to top-tier free agents.
Lew, December 6th, 2012, 11:19 am … “And what grade they get on Winter Trade meeting deals means what exactly?”
It’s a mid-term grade based on no criteria and with no real work completed to figure it out. Just something the “college administration” makes us do to “improve retention.”
Constanza had the highest BA in the International League last season. He is a good player that never has had a chance. in 2011 he played great when he started 20 games in a row. He just hasnt gotten th chance. I’ll be honest wih you I think Constanza can be one of the best leadoff hitters in the league if he ever gets a real chance.
I think fans are placing far too much emphasis on Wren’s comment that he has Constanza and Francisco (to play third while Prado remain in LF) – or somesuch – as fall-backs if he can’t find a bona fide left-fielder. Wren’s comment was more a cover-his-tail device and a means of keeping exceptions from going stratospheric.
The end of the winter meetings don’t end Wren’s efforts to secure a left-fielder. Wren’s got time, and often patience wins a better deal.
I’ll give the Braves a C+ for the off-season so far. I think B.J. Upton is a B+ move but exercising McCanns Option is a mistake because 13 million for a declining player that wont be available until May at the earliest is just a waste of money. But I think trading Hanson and getting his salary and declining arm off the team was a B+ move as well. But to not have a lead-off hitter and a vacancy and some bench spots open unlss Francisco or Gattis will play Back-up 1B and the need for a right handed bench bat is a little disappointing.
Constanza had the highest BA in the International League last season. He is a good player that never has had a chance. in 2011 he played great when he started 20 games in a row. He just hasnt gotten th chance. I’ll be honest wih you I think Constanza can be one of the best leadoff hitters in the league if he ever gets a real chance.
Posting from iPhone as I will need a new computer after this one. 2nd time I’ve spit my coffee on it and shortcircuited the damn thing.
Revere has excellent minor league numbers (for a light-hitting leadoff type) and has been getting better and better in the majors as his playing time increases….
Add in the fact that he’s an Atlanta native and he might not be a bad guy to pursue. Better than Dee Gordon at least.
And the reason they are willing to trade him and Span is because of the plethora of outfielders they have in the minors: Hicks, Arcia, Sano, Rosario, Kepler, etc. Hicks and Arcia should see Minny at some point next season. Others further away and position not set in stone, but most see Sano, Rosario as outfielders.
So wait, the Twins traded Span for a minor league pitcher because they had Revere in the wings, now they are going to trade Revere for Vance Worley? WTF!
Well Efrim nothing I’ve said isnt the truth Constaanza was the International League leader in .BA. And Constanza hasnt had a chance to be a starter. Now if wether he succeds or fails is two different things, but I feel the man deserves a chance.
4,816 comments Add your comment
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:33 am
Jayson Stark @jaysonst
Rangers knew Michael Young wasn’t inclined to waive no-trade. So strategy was to make a deal, then present it as better option than staying
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:38 am
MLB @MLB
Rule 5 Draft is complete. 42 players were selected overall. http://atmlb.com/120AYAK #WinterMeetings
Patrick
December 6th, 2012
10:39 am
Can someone clear this up for me please
What’s Cody Ross’s status with the Red Sox as of today???
Lemke's Knuckler
December 6th, 2012
10:39 am
I think they should aim lower and keep Myers.
Like I said, I partially agree. But it seems like we’ve been talking about the Royals being on the brink for about 5 years. And every time they seem to be getting close, they end up needing one more year, but end up having to trade away all their impending free agents before they get over the hump. Moore doesn’t have 3 years to let the young pitching develop. They have a ridiculously talented core of young positions players right now and I think their brief window to compete is 2014 and 2015. I agree with you that Shields doesn’t help that team much in 2013, but he could help them get over the hump in 2014 and 2015. That might be worth trading Myers.
Arkansas Transplant
December 6th, 2012
10:40 am
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
Efrim
December 6th, 2012
10:42 am
I agree with you that Shields doesn’t help that team much in 2013, but he could help them get over the hump in 2014 and 2015. That might be worth trading Myers.
Only under contract for two more seasons, so you really have to feel good about your chances in 2013 and 2014 to make a deal like this. I would keep Myers and trade from that next tier of prospects.
Lemke's Knuckler
December 6th, 2012
10:43 am
And Efrim, just talking about a Shields for Myers swap proves that the most valuable commodity in major league baseball is reliable starting pitching.
Same reason that a lefty that throw strikes for one inning can get a 3 year, $18m contract.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
10:43 am
“Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.”
Or they are just posturing. I doubt the Braves are really comfortable with the guys they have right now for LF or 3rd.
Efrim
December 6th, 2012
10:44 am
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
Too early to make that assumption, but if they go with the “internal options” in April, then yes they absolutely decreased payroll by nearly $10 million.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
10:45 am
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
Would you rather have Dee Gordon?
As pout-pout fish as I am about the lack of movement at the winter meetings, I’d take my chances with Francisco/Gattis over Dee Gordon or Dexter Fowler every day of the week, and twice on Sundays.
Patrick
December 6th, 2012
10:45 am
MLB @MLB
Rule 5 Draft is complete. 42 players were selected overall. http://atmlb.com/120AYAK #WinterMeetings
………and the Meetings are over. Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings. They couldn’t even sign a bench player.
Arkansas Transplant
December 6th, 2012
10:46 am
Or they are just posturing.
This very well may be true but if there’s one thing I’ve learned about this club recently over the years… never get your hopes up. They always seem to look in terms of bandaids instead of difference makers.
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
10:49 am
I’ll go out on a limb and not pronounce it an “F”…
P'cola Brave
December 6th, 2012
10:49 am
Can we really say they are cutting payroll. Doesn’t sound to me like its by choice. If there’s not a fit they aren’t just going to spend money on useless players just to keep a similar payroll. If the fit is there they will spend. Right now we all see how high the asking prices are on the trade market. If he were to make one of those trades by trading several top prospects for an above average but not elite player people would be having fits. Right now theres just not a move to be made. The inflated cost of FA for mediocre players plus the cost to trade right now is ridiculous. Really can’t blame Wren for being smart about it.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
10:49 am
Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings.
I’d give them an F if they traded any decent talent for Dee Gordon, if they sent Minor and Teheran to COL for Fowler, etc.
As of right now I’d give them an I for incomplete. Can’t grade them on moves that they didn’t make… in fact, one could argue they deserve a B+ for not making some of the ridiculous moves that were rumored to be on the table.
Upton would be nice, but not landing Dee Gordon is just as nice if not nicer……. now watch, because I’m on an anti-Dee Gordon tirade the Braves will land him first thing next week. That won’t make me happy.
BravePack(FreeFan)
December 6th, 2012
10:49 am
While I’m disappointed that nothing got done yet and the Winter Meetings came and went like it never even existed I know there is a lot of time left to get something done and Wren will…In Wren I trust. If the asking price for Fowler was Minor and Teheran/Delgado than I know why Wren didn’t get anything done…f’n ridiculous. Wren will wait it out and a deseperate team will come calling, one that needs pitching.
bravesfaninnc
December 6th, 2012
10:50 am
“Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings. They couldn’t even sign a bench player.”
Can’t give him a grade … he hasn’t made a good deal or a bad deal … he hasn’t done anything … gotta give him an “Incomplete” or a “Zero”
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
10:51 am
“I’d take my chances with Francisco/Gattis”
Oh geez, I’d rather take my chances becoming a Cardinals or Phillies fan first. Wow.
“They always seem to look in terms of bandaids instead of difference makers.”
Well I somewhat agree, but BJ Upton, while I disagree with the deal, was a MAJOR deal the Braves made. I hope it works out and they know something that baseball-reference.com doesn’t know. But with Delgado and $10 million left to spend, it certainly is possible that they can get something done before the season. But yes, this team isn’t going to be in the top two in the division as currently constructed. Need a MAJOR acquisition for LF or 3B.
Lemke's Knuckler
December 6th, 2012
10:51 am
Looks like the Braves are decreasing payroll. Already talking internal options for our remaining vacant slot.
I’m not opposed to leaving some budget room going into the season. The last few years, the budget was maxed out and the Braves were only able to work out trades (Bourn, Maholm/Johnson) where the other team was willing to pay most of their salary. Braves can really go get a big piece before the trade deadline if the internal options don’t work. That said, I would still prefer a trade for a left fielder now.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
10:52 am
I’m not disappointed that they didn’t do anything at the meetings… still another good active month or 2 to go in the offseason. Much better than trying for Dee friggin Gordon or Schierholtz. Premium part-timers.
DAP
December 6th, 2012
10:52 am
patrick Does anyone else think Wren and Braves have earned anything other than an “F” as a grade for success at the meetings.
cant grade it until the offseason is over. alot of groundwork gets done at winter meetings. wren might have something going.
Arkansas Transplant
December 6th, 2012
10:52 am
I haven’t seen anything in the way of connections between the Braves and Dodgers on Dee Gordon… Did I miss something?
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:54 am
Andrew Marchand @AndrewMarchand
Yankees are listening to offers on Granderson, Hughes and Nova
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
10:55 am
FW can not be graded for the meetings yet… who knows, maybe he’s making some progress or Justin or Choo.
For the offseason as a whole, though, B-. He got a good piece for Hanson, wish he did it earlier and got Bourjos, and he signed Upton (who I don’t want). However, he was able to get his target, so I’ll give him cred for that. Hopefully he makes Pence and Price his targets next winter…
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:55 am
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
#Braves leave Nashville w/out any deals, but Wren said progress made on all fronts and could have deals for bench players soon.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:56 am
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Braves will exit the Meetings still in search of an outfielder (leadoff hitter?) and two bench pieces.
Rick C
December 6th, 2012
10:57 am
“Can someone clear this up for me please
What’s Cody Ross’s status with the Red Sox as of today???”
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/12/red-sox-notes-ellsbury-starting-pitching.html
Cherington is open-minded about outfielder Cody Ross, but the team has not been in contact with him since news of the Victorino agreement broke.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:57 am
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
#Braves are done with bullpen, comfortable with the depth they have now in both the ‘pen and rotation.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
10:57 am
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren and Fredi will go to the D.R. this weekend to watch Francisco, Constanza and other Braves. Could influence their final roster decisions
Franwhiffco and Canstandya should make no difference on final starting position player decisions. Bench players, sure (not for Constanza tho), but no more than that.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
10:57 am
“Braves can really go get a big piece before the trade deadline if the internal options don’t work. That said, I would still prefer a trade for a left fielder now.”
Well, I don’t think this team as currently constructed is good enough to be in it at the tradeline. Gotta get a bat for LF before Spring Training. We don’t have even depth at pitching or internal options for our bench or LF to wait around that long. Braves lost some serious production from Bourn and Chipper and still aren’t getting that back in Upton. Need a lot more to be comfortable with this lineup especially with McCann out and Dan Uggla in LaLa land.
kenhotlanta
December 6th, 2012
10:58 am
Patrick: Frank Wren has until April 1 to make a trade or add someone(s) to the roster. Would you go to Vegas and go ‘all in’ that the roster right now will be the same one that starts the season? IF so, I will be happy to take your money.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:58 am
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
#Braves will continue to search for a left fielder, preferably who can hit leadoff but that’s not requirement. Trade more likely than FA.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
10:59 am
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren and Fredi will go to the D.R. this weekend to watch Francisco, Constanza and other Braves. Could influence their final roster decisions
Ray
December 6th, 2012
10:59 am
@patrick, its not very smart to grade the 3 days of the winter meetings. Based on things getting done publicly then about 25 teams would grade F’s. how many times a team wins the winter meetings or gets an A and it gives them a championship. Last year many said the Marlins won the winter meetings or received a grade A. And how did that work out for them?
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
11:00 am
Braves are comfortable with the rotation? I’m not really sure how deep it is anymore with Jurrjens and Hanson gone, and Delgado and Teheran yet to show up in a MLB game.
It’s adequate if they have a good offense, which they currently are lacking an entire bench and a power bat that can get on base.
DAP
December 6th, 2012
11:02 am
id take granderson.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:03 am
Oh geez, I’d rather take my chances becoming a Cardinals or Phillies fan first. Wow.
Yeah, and you think JJ is a quality MLB pitcher, so….
Maybe you’ll luck out and either the Cardinals or Phillies will sign JJ, making your transition all the easier.
bravesfaninnc
December 6th, 2012
11:03 am
Wow … I guess in the long run, no moves here was best. But I was really excited at the beginning of the week that the holes would be filled. Still time, but if we go into 2013 as is, I think we’ve taken a step backwards.
Bawlmer Brave
December 6th, 2012
11:07 am
Cracks me up that people actually post DOB’s tweets on this blog as if people can’t just see his tweets on the right side of the column. If they use Twitter at all, I’m guessing they already follow DOB if they’re also reading this blog. To post tweets by Rosenthal or others makes some sense as I don’t want to hear ALL the drivel from some of these other writers, but I have 3x the opportunity to catch DOB’s tweets when people post them in the blog. Just cracks me up.
Rant finished.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
11:08 am
“Yeah, and you think JJ is a quality MLB pitcher,”
Maybe not at this point, but if he figures his stuff out he has the possibility of being one and is worth the risk. But you really missed my point.
What depth do the Braves have at starting pitcher?
Hudson
Medlen
Maholm
Minor
Delgado/Teheran (and one essentially has to be traded for a LFer)
Aren’t we pretty much out of pitchers after that? I mean so who is our 6th starter at this point? Last year we had those 6, plus Jurrjens, Hanson, and Beachy. This year at best we have 5 starting pitchers.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:11 am
Cracks me up that people actually post DOB’s tweets on this blog as if people can’t just see his tweets on the right side of the column.
The DOB twitter feed on the right side was broken until a few days ago, so I doubt most people even look at it anymore. Also, it doesn’t stay in view while scrolling to the bottom, meaning that it’s hidden from view most of the time…
Brava is just building up her post count to try and come in first. I admire the grit and determination shown in posting every single baseball related tweet over the last few days. Mazel… good things, good things.
Efrim
December 6th, 2012
11:11 am
Laird, Janish, Mejia, R. Johnson, Francisco as the bench?
Patrick
December 6th, 2012
11:13 am
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren and Fredi will go to the D.R. this weekend to watch Francisco, Constanza and other Braves. Could influence their final roster decisions
Franwhiffco and Canstandya should make no difference on final starting position player decisions. Bench players, sure (not for Constanza tho), but no more than that.
What is the point to this? You know what you have in Constanza, when he first got called up and pitchers didn’t know his holes, he was successful, once they found out how to pitch him, he hasn’t hit.
I don’t care if Francisco is batting 1000 with 15 HR and leading the winter league in RBI’s, it doesn’t mean that he can do that against real MLB pitching, on a consistent basis and under the spotlight. There is a big…a HUGE differnce. The only reason I can see for going to watch him would be to see how good of shape he is or isn’t in and if he has changed his swing like Walker hsa been pleading with him to do so that he can hit to the opposite field. That’s it.
kenhotlanta
December 6th, 2012
11:13 am
TOBF: Re your man crush on Peter Bourjos: Did you see Mike Scioscia on MLB yesterday or the day before say the Angels were moving Mike Trout to RF to make room for you boy to play CF everyday? That says an awful lot for what the Angels think of Bourjos since Trout was on the highlight shows just about every night last year for his defense in center.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
11:13 am
Last year’s Braves rotation started with 3 guys who had 75 or more starts (roughly 2.5 seasons worth). This year, there are only 2, and of the 3 who are below that threshold, 2 have 30 or fewer starts.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
11:14 am
“Laird, Janish, Mejia, R. Johnson, Francisco as the bench?”
Schafer? Maybe we can trade for Brooks Conrad and Eric Hinske and sign Greg Norton from coaching to have an even better bench than the one above. Heck maybe even get Corky Miller to come catch. Gosh that is an awful bench. And we don’t even have Reed Johnson yet.
CrαZy
December 6th, 2012
11:14 am
Winter meetings over…..
Anarchy!!!
Only 66 days left before spring training Frank WHAT THE Crap are you….. oh wait it’s only Dec 6th… nevermind!!
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:16 am
Thanks, Murph.
… And, Bawlmer Brave, feel free to scroll past any of my posts. It won’t hurt my feelings.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
11:17 am
I saw that ken, good for him. He’ll show everyone how he can hit decently while providing near Bourn-level defense. Just sukks that my fave AL team is the Rangers and not the Angels… but I’ll be rooting for the kid.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:17 am
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Wren’s term for short-term or one-year fixes is “Caliparis” #UK #Braves
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:18 am
MFin, show me another team in the league that has the luxury of 8 or 9 MLB quality starting pitchers? There aren’t any.
If the Braves lose a SP for any period of time they have options. First would be the loser of the Delgado/Teheran ST battle. Beyond that they could get innings from Gilmartin, maybe Graham, who knows?
Remember when Beachy was called up, and 99% of the blog went “Who???”. Look at what he’s done. You never know what guy will rise to the occassion when given the opportunity. The Braves pitching staff will be fine.
Besides, with the bullpen as it’s built now, a starter only needs to get through 5 and then hand the ball off. It’s not ideal, but that bullpen is more than capable of slamming the door on any and every team in the league for 4+ innings. You don’t want to burn them out, but they’re there when needed.
flange1
December 6th, 2012
11:19 am
Funny, I was just getting ready to thank Brava for all of the twitter posts she has put on the blog for the last few days.
Lew
December 6th, 2012
11:19 am
And what grade they get on Winter Trade meeting deals means what exactly? I opt for it means not a damned thing.
flange1
December 6th, 2012
11:20 am
ehhh,
Thanks Brave for all the twitter posts you have added to the blog in the last couple of days. It has been helpful!
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:22 am
Dan Plesac @Plesac19
Not sure how to handicap the AL east on Dec 6th… On paper right now #BlueJays and #Rays look like best 2 teams. #yanks need C,3B&RF.
DAP
December 6th, 2012
11:22 am
MFin Hudson
Medlen
Maholm
Minor
Delgado/Teheran
…This year at best we have 5 starting pitchers.
at best we have 5? you just named 6. plus, braves have spruill on the 40 man, with gilmartin and graham in reserve, who could start if they needed to. plus beachy coming back from injury in late july. thats 10 pitchers. they might not have the depth they had last year, but they arent having a hard time finding 5 guys.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:22 am
Andy Martino @MartinoNYDN
In case any of you were still wondering about Wil Myers, a rival exec said “The Royals are definitely not in on Dickey.”
glord1
December 6th, 2012
11:24 am
Interesting times for Braves fans. All the money coming off the board and not alot to show for it so far. Im not an Upton fan but he does bring some positives. He is young and in his prime plus his contract looks alot more sane after the Winter meetings. I sure like Upton at his price more than Victorino at his price.
Wrens problem right now is that Teheran and Delgado have lost some value and he does not want to sell low. 12 months ago he could have traded Teheran for just about any hitter he has been chasing.
Mixxo
December 6th, 2012
11:24 am
So, we’re done?
No surprise in the lack of urgency. Typical for this organization.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:24 am
You’re welcome, flange1.
Tumbledown
December 6th, 2012
11:25 am
I enjoy all the twitter posts as well. I know that Wren is mashing his teeth waiting for grades from us on his performance for the offseason so far. Thus, I will chime in with another incomplete.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
11:25 am
“If the Braves lose a SP for any period of time they have options. First would be the loser of the Delgado/Teheran ST battle”
Ok already said that that can’t happen since one of those guys WILL BE traded this offseason if the Braves offense has a chance this year.
As for other guys stepping up. I’m ok with that logic, seems we have a few pitchers in the minors that could come up, and maybe that is what they are banking on. As for the bullpen, it does appear that we are probably going to be pretty good from the 7th inning on, and have enough guys to get through the 6th. So I agree there.
But this team isn’t nearly as major league ready deep as they once were. And the offense still needs a major piece.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
You never know which player is going to get hurt, but looking at our rotation as it is now, the only guy who really is an injury risk out of the gate is Hudson. The other guys are pretty young and durable.
That’s a big difference between this year and last year when we broke ST with Hanson and his issues, JJ and his issues… this rotation will at least be starting out healthy, with Beachy and his new bionic arm waiting in the wings.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS
#twins seek starting pitchers. Finding FA market high. from philly could seek someone like vance worley for revere
So they trade Span for a guy in A-ball and not Teheran/Spruill/Hanson… mmm kay
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS
#twins seek starting pitchers. Finding FA market high. from philly could seek someone like vance worley for revere
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
I sense some irony in calling someone 8 years older than you are “kid”…
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
I sense some irony in calling someone 8 years older than you are “kid”…
CrαZy
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
Keep the Twitter post involving baseball coming… I’m blocked from Twitter at work.
Joe Dirte (Formally J-Man)
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
As far as a “Leadoff” hitter goes am I the only one that thinks Jose Constanza could do the job. Constanza can steal bases and he always seems to be able to get on base is is a .300 hitter in the minors and when he plays consistantly will hit .300. I just feel this guy just hasnt had a real chance. IMO we would be better placing Constanza in LF and to move Prado to 3B…..Actually we would be better if we moved him to 2nd base and allow Francisco to have a chance. Because Uggla is done IMO.
Jeff R
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
richbrave… your 7:57 am:
Jeff R:
You tell ‘um. WREN’s lying in the weeds, ready to strike a deal.
Yes, indeed, richbrave. Wren’s going to deal, I believe, but not be pushed into any-old deal.
O.M.G.
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
Going to the DR to look at players? Isn’t that a scouts job? Sounds like a reason for a vacation to me. But they need one after all the hard work this week in Nashville, aye wait…nevermind..
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:28 am
Ooops…
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:30 am
From Mike DiGiovanna in the LA Times this morning:
Wednesday’s moves will push the Angels’ 2013 payroll to about $142 million, and the club has shown no indication it will surpass last season’s record $159-million payroll.
As of Wednesday, Greinke had not ruled out a return to Anaheim, but a person familiar with the team’s thinking but not authorized to speak publicly said the Angels were unwilling to surpass $20 million a year for Greinke, who could command a six-year, $150-million deal.
General Manager Jerry Dipoto would “never close the door on anything,” another person familiar with the team’s thinking said, “but I know he feels good about things presently.”
Angels fans, judging from their harsh reaction on Twitter and Internet message boards, do not. Most think Blanton, who has an 83-75 record and 4.37 earned-run average and gives up home runs in bunches, is a pricey and rather dubious back-of-the-rotation choice.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:31 am
Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal
Source: Two Upton blockbuster in play. One is three teams: #Diamondbacks, #Rangers, #Rays. Other is four teams, including #Mariners.
Jeff R
December 6th, 2012
11:31 am
Wrens problem right now is that Teheran and Delgado have lost some value and he does not want to sell low. 12 months ago he could have traded Teheran for just about any hitter he has been chasing.
There’s more than a kernel of truth to that observation. But Teheran is still a pretty good catch for the right club. The kid’s hit speed bumps, which aren’t necessarily indications of a fall-off in potential.
flange1
December 6th, 2012
11:33 am
So it is more important to “have a sense of urgency” than it is to get a good deal for a player?
Interesting concept!
FW, call the Marlis and te;l them you will trade them Francisco, and Teheran for Greg Dobbs.
That will help fix the bench and should happen fast (as in WITH urgency)
No matter that the cost is stupid high and will the team over all in the short and long run.
But at least FW will show he “wants it”. (whatever that means)
Tumbledown
December 6th, 2012
11:33 am
Joe Dirte – You need to think a little bigger. No way Constanza should get the starting job in LF.
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
11:33 am
As far as a “Leadoff” hitter goes am I the only one that thinks Jose Constanza could do the job.
No he cannot. 29 years old, career minor leaguer, and once the league figured him out, he hit .250/.321/.276/.598 at the MLB level. Not all that good of a fielder. 84 career OPS+, he was below avg last year when he was “good”, had an OPS+ of 99.
Pass. Send him and Schafer packing as trade filler.
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:33 am
And from Dylan Hernandez on the other team:
Matt Kemp’s contract doesn’t include a no-trade clause. Andre Ethier’s doesn’t either.
The Dodgers might be able to outspend their competition, but could their free-agent haul this winter be affected by their reluctance to include this provision in contracts?
President Stan Kasten steadfastly refused to include no-trade clauses in contracts when he was with the Atlanta Braves and Washington Nationals. Kasten wouldn’t say if he instituted a similar policy with the Dodgers when he moved into their front office last spring as part of the new ownership group. But the team wouldn’t grant Ethier no-trade protection when it signed him to a five-year, $85-million extension this spring.
Asked if he would consider including the clause in special cases, Kasten declined to answer.
Multiple agents have said that if the Dodgers refuse to offer no-trade clauses, they could become less attractive to top-tier free agents.
Rick C
December 6th, 2012
11:37 am
Glad to hear they won’t be bringing Durbin back. He was an extremely valuable part of the bullpen, but he seems like an every other year kind of guy.
abeeeewright
December 6th, 2012
11:37 am
Lew, December 6th, 2012, 11:19 am … “And what grade they get on Winter Trade meeting deals means what exactly?”
It’s a mid-term grade based on no criteria and with no real work completed to figure it out. Just something the “college administration” makes us do to “improve retention.”
Joe Dirte (Formally J-Man)
December 6th, 2012
11:38 am
Constanza had the highest BA in the International League last season. He is a good player that never has had a chance. in 2011 he played great when he started 20 games in a row. He just hasnt gotten th chance. I’ll be honest wih you I think Constanza can be one of the best leadoff hitters in the league if he ever gets a real chance.
Jeff R
December 6th, 2012
11:40 am
I think fans are placing far too much emphasis on Wren’s comment that he has Constanza and Francisco (to play third while Prado remain in LF) – or somesuch – as fall-backs if he can’t find a bona fide left-fielder. Wren’s comment was more a cover-his-tail device and a means of keeping exceptions from going stratospheric.
The end of the winter meetings don’t end Wren’s efforts to secure a left-fielder. Wren’s got time, and often patience wins a better deal.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:42 am
Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS
superstar logjam at moment. waiting on deals for greinke, upton & hamilton. & they affect each other since tex is in on all
Jeff R
December 6th, 2012
11:43 am
Try “expectations” in my last post.
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:43 am
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
#Braves are interested and have spoken with Twins about Revere. RT @Tgreg2121: @ajcbraves why aren’t WE talking to Twins about Ben revere?
Brava
December 6th, 2012
11:43 am
DKnobler @DKnobler
Looks like Ben Revere may be the Phillies’ top choice for center field. Twins need pitching, and Phillies could move one for him.
Expand
Venice Jim
December 6th, 2012
11:43 am
Kevin Towers – “Hoping Hinske’s the lucky charm”…
Rick C
December 6th, 2012
11:45 am
Hm I’m surprised they are open to moving Revere. I thought he is why they moved Span.
Joe Dirte (Formally J-Man)
December 6th, 2012
11:45 am
I’ll give the Braves a C+ for the off-season so far. I think B.J. Upton is a B+ move but exercising McCanns Option is a mistake because 13 million for a declining player that wont be available until May at the earliest is just a waste of money. But I think trading Hanson and getting his salary and declining arm off the team was a B+ move as well. But to not have a lead-off hitter and a vacancy and some bench spots open unlss Francisco or Gattis will play Back-up 1B and the need for a right handed bench bat is a little disappointing.
MFin04
December 6th, 2012
11:45 am
Ben revere?
The Nationals are coming…the Nationals are coming….
Efrim
December 6th, 2012
11:45 am
Constanza had the highest BA in the International League last season. He is a good player that never has had a chance. in 2011 he played great when he started 20 games in a row. He just hasnt gotten th chance. I’ll be honest wih you I think Constanza can be one of the best leadoff hitters in the league if he ever gets a real chance.
Posting from iPhone as I will need a new computer after this one. 2nd time I’ve spit my coffee on it and shortcircuited the damn thing.
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:46 am
Revere has excellent minor league numbers (for a light-hitting leadoff type) and has been getting better and better in the majors as his playing time increases….
Add in the fact that he’s an Atlanta native and he might not be a bad guy to pursue. Better than Dee Gordon at least.
Efrim
December 6th, 2012
11:48 am
I think I’ll pass on Ben Revere.
And the reason they are willing to trade him and Span is because of the plethora of outfielders they have in the minors: Hicks, Arcia, Sano, Rosario, Kepler, etc. Hicks and Arcia should see Minny at some point next season. Others further away and position not set in stone, but most see Sano, Rosario as outfielders.
Rick C
December 6th, 2012
11:49 am
Joe Dirte, I hope you don’t have any future aspirations as a scout.
Arkansas Transplant
December 6th, 2012
11:49 am
I hope we don’t move anything to get Revere.
O.J.
December 6th, 2012
11:49 am
So wait, the Twins traded Span for a minor league pitcher because they had Revere in the wings, now they are going to trade Revere for Vance Worley? WTF!
Murph
December 6th, 2012
11:51 am
Who landed the other Cuban OF last year? The A’s got Cespedes, but who got the other guy? The Cubs?
TheOnlyBravesFan
December 6th, 2012
11:52 am
Hinske’s the lucky charm”
haha… I’m sure he hits tons of them, but he isn’t a lucky charm any more. Cooked.
Joe Dirte (Formally J-Man)
December 6th, 2012
11:53 am
Well Efrim nothing I’ve said isnt the truth Constaanza was the International League leader in .BA. And Constanza hasnt had a chance to be a starter. Now if wether he succeds or fails is two different things, but I feel the man deserves a chance.