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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
4,357 comments Add your comment
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
12:41 am
Would love a UGA/UF title game, any title game involving UGA is something we have not had in a while — some fans have not had the chance to enjoy that in their lifetime.
First order of business is to beat Tech convincingly.
ND, UF or anyone — just bring it on.
UGA and Alabama got what they needed today — good.
MikeInFl
November 18th, 2012
1:09 am
Well, best teams in the country are probably Alabama and Notre Dame. That wouldn’t be a bad N.C. game, at all. But of course I’d love to see UGA bow up and earn their way in.
Just amazing how close that Oregon/Stanford game was:
Stanford/Oregon
Total Yards: 411/405
Passing Yards: 211/207
Rushing Yards: 200/198
Penalties: 5 for 64; 5 for 59
But despite almost identical numbers, time of possession favored Stanford bigtime, 37 minutes to 23. Got to wonder if Oregon wouldn’t have been better off huddling up, slowing it down and giving the Cardinal less time to score.
David O'Brien
November 18th, 2012
1:18 am
It’s weird reading so many calling out this, Dexter Morgan dude, but not seeing his posts. Apparently, DOB has been reading his blog, to — Bobby H
Yes, I have.
Negative Vibe
November 18th, 2012
1:44 am
Braves Fans are the number one whiners.
Wish you had a taste of what it’s like to root for the Rockies, Pirates, Astros and all the other teams who are usually sub-.500 and rarely make the playoffs.
You have poor attendance given that there are few MLB teams anywhere near you.
You have a mid-market payroll that squeezes your GM’s options. You forget that all team sign players who underperform/fail to perform. You forget that you have a great mix of home-grown talent and free agent/traded players that help you compete most years.
You threaten to jump ship, make doomsday predictions and throw management under the bus when the free agent signing period has just started.
What is wrong with most of you?
old man
November 18th, 2012
8:18 am
Juan Francisco Dominican League, 2011, and 2012 to date, with K% and BB%
2011 .300 /.367/.444/.811 21% 9%
2012 .347/.377/.653/1.030 27% 4%
So, he really is having quite a year so far, except his K/BB problem. In his defense, 70% of his SOs are against lefties, but he still has a 20% rate against righties.
It’s hard to believe you could actually miss the ball outright that often, and also square it up that often.
So it’s not entirely a lower level of pitching. He really is having a pretty good year down there. Again, except for the K problem.
Efrim
November 18th, 2012
8:49 am
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
No, but but it could be soon. I think it will be. RT @TylerMooney11: @ajcbraves @mlbbowman Any indication when word on Upton will break?
Patrick Dailey @patricksdailey
@ajcbraves @mlbbowman Soon, as in this weekend?
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
@patricksdailey no way. Closer to the winter meetings. Maybe even during the WM
Would Upton really visit two teams between November 12-15 and then wait three weeks before making a decision?
I guess. I mean, I don’t know what the true timeframe is for things like this after a player meets. I know most high profile free agents wait until closer to the Winter Meetings. Week before the Winter Meetings is probably a good bet.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
8:57 am
Did it really take y’all until last evening to figure out Dexter was Lentz? I called that one at 11:44 yesterday morning after he’d made two posts. The TV Character name and the continual vitriol was a dead (in keeping with the Dexter theme) giveaway.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:06 am
Miami Marlins fans are not the only ones feeling betrayed by ownership’s decision to break up the club.
Shortstop Jose Reyes and left-hander Mark Buehrle, two of the five Marlins headed to Toronto in a pending blockbuster, are upset that the team broke verbal promises to them regarding trades, according to major-league sources.
The Marlins do not award no-trade clauses, but club officials, while recruiting Reyes and Buerhle as free agents last offseason, assured both players that they would not be moved, sources said.
– Ken Rosenthal
What a shoddy, slimy organization Jeff Loria’s runs. It all starts at the top – of the garbage dump!
flange1
November 18th, 2012
9:07 am
Couch,
The workout routine is very easy, it involves doing MANY reps of 12 Oz curls every night.
It is important that you show dedication to your love of the game, by not ,missing a night.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:09 am
Would Upton really visit two teams between November 12-15 and then wait three weeks before making a decision?
Why shouldn’t he? It’s all about negotiating and bidding up suitors. Leverage, my man, leverage.
May the Phils win Upton’s services. They can have Upton’s “potential” and his strikeouts, boot.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:13 am
I would be satisfied with BJ Upton and Denard Span being added. Only issue would be who plays CF and LF, we all know Span is a much better defender in CF, but Upton is viewed as a CF and that is what is basically making him a hot commodity. If Upton truly was a corner outfielder he wouldn’t be as valuable. Would Upton have a problem playing LF? I don’t know.
BJ Upton is basically Dan Uggla with the bat…. Go compare the past 2 seasons and what they produced. But there is always hope Upton can put his tools together and improve alot.
Span would most likely be the best case scenario in my opinion for a lead off man. He’s a better hitter than Michael Bourn but he lacks game breaking speed and stolen base ability that Bourn has. But the guy can still swipe around 20 bases and provide a boost in the atop the order. He may not be as good defensively as Bourn (who is tho) but he’s a top 5 defender at the position still.
Wren would just have to work out the defensive alignment.
CF Span
3B Prado
RF Heyward
1B Freeman
LF Upton
C McCann
2B Uggla
SS Simmons
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:21 am
BJ Upton has awesome athletic ability but he’s a average defender at best in CF, just doesn’t take good routes on fly balls and such. He would be much better suited in a corner in my opinion. The Upton brothers grew up and went to school in my area. BJ was a Shortstop coming up in the Rays system for those who don’t remember. Justin Verlander went to ODU which is less than 15 minutes away, David Wright is from here, also Ryan Zimmerman. Those few off the top of my head.
I still have a old ticket stub signed by David Wright, when he played for the AAA Norfolk Tides. Later that same week he was called up to the Mets.
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
9:21 am
With the Marlins around we will never have to worry about finishing last.
Cannot envision a worse owner to work for than Loria.
At least our guys are quite up front with what they are.
Also note that if all fails for CF, you know, Schafer did steal 27 bases last yr. He does have one outstanding attribute and that is that speed.
If he could hit .260/.340 imagine what he could do with that speed.
And for old time reunions, if we strike out on getting the big httter than good ole Kelly Johnson is available. The guy does have some pop — and some past moderate success here.
Kelly Johnson for LF anyone??????
Its better to have the $$$$$$$$$$$$$ available and spend it smart than spend the big $$$$$$$$$$$$ on someone you just are not sure about. If its not spent this yr it can be spent next yr.
If it were my choice, between spending the money on Upton or keeping Bourn, I would prefer an extension Bourn being my big FA prize
But, I do understand why Upton is being pursued. .
Worst case scenarioo is we get a couple of stop gaps for now, and even with that we finish no worse than 85 wins. Seriously.
And the Dawgs woke up in the second half and played like the team thay can be. Good.
Coach Richt’s boys are in controll of their own destiny now.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:22 am
BJ Upton is basically Dan Uggla with the bat…. Go compare the past 2 seasons and what they produced. But there is always hope Upton can put his tools together and improve alot.
Partially correct, amigo. In 2012, Upton struck out 169 times – and only walked 45. Danny Uggla struck 168 times and walked a league-leading 94 times (if I recall). Uggla walked twice as much as “Mr. Potential,” B J Upton.
Do the Braves really need two guys in the line up whiffing as much as Upton and Uggla (the “U2s”)?
And we’re reading a lot about Upton’s “potential.” Wow, Upton is about to be awarded a lavish contract not for results and a consistently strong track record of success, but for “potential.”
Kinda a gamble, isn’t it? Why gamble with all that money that Upton will finally live up to his billing when there are other capable and more proven free agent outfielders on the market (or available via trade)?
I’d take Upton’s “potential” for a lot less than he’s going to command. But for a lot less.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:26 am
BJ Upton has awesome athletic ability…
Frankly, big deal. If that athletic ability can’t be translated into real production, it’s just lots of gooey “potential.” Heck, the Braves have a lot of prospects they’re paying far less for their “potential.”
Pursue Span or Fowler, who are better defenders, decent hitters, and cheaper. Go find a LFer via trade, Both would probably cost less than tying up Upton forever and you’d have a better idea of what you’d get for the dough.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
9:29 am
I’ve said it a couple of times – if BJ Upton is who we get, I’ll try to concentrate on his doubles and HR’s and hope our offense is improved. However…….
I remeber getting into it with Shaun a couple of years ago when Upton to Atlanta rumors were floated and never got a decent answer from him (big surprise, right?) – How many years does BJ have to play in the bigs before it’s no longer potential and what you have is what you have and nothing more?
BJ is 28 years old. He has six full MLB seasons behind him and two others where he played about a third of a seasons’ games. I’m pretty sure by this point that what we have seen is what we will get – if indeed, he signs with the Braves. Now maybe this is fine and it’s the move we feel we have to make or maybe we feel he’s the best option available and I could live with that. But let’s quit throwing out the “potential” crap and realize he’s already the player he’s going to be.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:35 am
Jeff R
Well he is in high demand cause he’s a solid ballplayer who plays CF. 25 HR power with 30+ SB ability, with some mixed opinions about his defense. All the tools are there for him to explode, but if he doesn’t he’s still a valuable player that can help his team.
Back to the Uggla/BJ comparison (Past 2 seasons, average production)
BJ 150 Games 244/315/441/756 28 2B, 26 HR, 80 RBI, 34 SB, 165 K, 59 BB
Uggla 158 Games 227/329/421/750 26 2B, 28 HR, 80 RBI, 162 K, 78 BB
But back in 2007 and 2008 Upton did produce this average season
286/384/452/836 31 2B, 16 HR, 74 RBI, 33 SB, 144 K, 84 BB
So just maybe he can change his approach and improve in the AVG/OBP departments.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:39 am
Lew
I believe the 2013 season is BJ’s last chance to breakout and the whole potential talk we’ll be gone.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
9:47 am
VaBraves – Dude, just because the talk continues doesn’t mean the potential has already been realized.
2013 is his last chance? You mean they’ll make that determination after he’s signed a multi ten million dollar multi year deal? Yeah, that makes sense, doesn’t it. Decide now if what you’ve seen is what you’ll accept for the money he’s asking for, cause you already know exactly what kind of performance you’re going to get – I mean, it’s only been eight MLB seasons.
JasonInFL
November 18th, 2012
9:48 am
I think when a player signs (non-Boras clients) depends on if he sees a fit and gets an offer he is looking for. See Hunter, Tori
Lew
November 18th, 2012
9:48 am
Excuse me – Hasn’t been realized
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:49 am
I could see BJ improving after a change of scenery, I don’t think he’ll break out and be a star player or anything but he can be better. Maybe get up around 260/340 with his current power and sb ability and that’s a darn good player for CF.
We had Bourn who provided very little power and K’d a ton (205 times in 1.5 seasons) While providing Elite Defense and stolen bases (64 total) But with the bat was around a 275/340/375 hitter, 99 OPS+
Upton would provide more extra base power, likely 20+ more HRs than Bourn, while still stealing 30+ bases. OPS+ around 110. Around the same amount of K’s as well.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:49 am
Well he is in high demand cause he’s a solid ballplayer who plays CF. 25 HR power with 30+ SB ability, with some mixed opinions about his defense. All the tools are there for him to explode, but if he doesn’t he’s still a valuable player that can help his team.
He also strikeout a heckuva a lot (nearly a third of his ABs). Ditto Uggla. Combined, these guys struck out a whopping 337 times last season.
The Braves need more guys getting on base and driving in runs with hits versus feast or famine swing-for-the-fences hitters.
Also, center-field defense shouldn’t be underestimated. Up-the-middle defense is critical. Upton is a middling defender. The Braves need to have a better than average glove man in center.
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
9:50 am
Pursue Span or Fowler, who are better defenders, decent hitters, and cheaper. Go find a LFer via trade, Both would probably cost less than tying up Upton forever and you’d have a better idea of what you’d get for the dough.
That is not so bad Jeff R — though the trade pieces we have might or might not get you a player the caliber of a Span or Fowler. Would love either one for CF — I think they could get more than a package of Julio Teheran or Hanson and a couple of even the top prospects we have.
I do not see Delgado as one of the guys they might show around. He will be a part of the rotation for ‘13. And he is more of mid rotation upside — dont think he would blow other GM;s away.
Other teams will shop around and try to get the most for their good players. .
As for LF, later in the FA period there will be some value guys out there — and Kelly Johnson who has had a .370 OBP with power as recently as 2010 is one that comes to mind.
If they can trade for WIllingham fine but why would Minnesota move him unless they are given a real good solid offer that helps them.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:54 am
Dexter Fowler would be a horrible option, the dude can’t hit away from Coors…
I already said BJ Upton would make a much better LFer from a defensive standpoint. I’m just trying to talk about some positives if we happen to sign the guy. Figuring out production and so on.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
9:56 am
Also BJ is from my area and I’m rooting for him to improve and become a better player, which is also why I kept mentioning over the past month or so that Justin Upton is #1 on my list for trade targets.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:56 am
I could see BJ improving after a change of scenery, I don’t think he’ll break out and be a star player or anything but he can be better. Maybe get up around 260/340 with his current power and sb ability and that’s a darn good player for CF.
Lots of money to gamble with. And a lot of time committed by the Braves to Upton. And as Lew said, the guy hasn’t lived up to his “potential” yet. This after more than a few seasons in MLB.
Frankly, I think Wren makes a mistake if he outbids the Phils. Hope the Phils are so set on Upton that the Braves won’t try to beat their offer.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:59 am
Dexter Fowler would be a horrible option, the dude can’t hit away from Coors…
Fowler or Span would be cheaper alternatives (much cheaper) and give the Braves flexibility down the road, unlike Upton, who gets a long term deal and, perhaps, would be nary impossible to move if he’s not performing up to his “potential.”
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
10:00 am
With CF defense being all that critical that is why I would prefer an exrtension of Bourn if they are gonna spend all that jack.
But they will say and rightfully so that BJ has the “tools” to be a GG caliber defender in addition to the power and speed. In essence, they are paying for scouts visions of defacto “tools”.
Why do you think they keep riding it out with Salcedo. Guess he has those “tools they like to look for.
Personally, I’d prefrer results. Don;t tell me what you are gonna or can do just go out there and do it. The world if full of unfullfilled potential
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:02 am
That is not so bad Jeff R — though the trade pieces we have might or might not get you a player the caliber of a Span or Fowler. Would love either one for CF — I think they could get more than a package of Julio Teheran or Hanson and a couple of even the top prospects we have.
My guess, Disgusted, is that the ask for Span and Willingham is high right now. Might be why Wren has diverted to Upton. But the Twins ask could come down as we move toward the winter meetings.
Just guessing, though. No reports to back up my claim.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:05 am
Why do you think they keep riding it out with Salcedo. Guess he has those “tools they like to look for.
My opinion is that the Braves remain committed to Salcedo because they sunk a lot of dough in him to sign and ballyhooed him as the next big deal. Right now management can’t back off Salcedo without more than a few in management having egg on their faces. Or so I believe.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
10:09 am
fowler isnt completely horrible away from Coors… ops’d above 700 in 3 of the last 4 years. avg 703 ,,which is Bourns career OPS. Take out his bad 2010 when he opsd 595 and hes at about 720
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
10:13 am
Another thing to consider Jeff R is that teams are sort of working on the free agent period and getting their plans together before big trades are made.
GM’s have alot of irons in the fire right now & its early.
Wren is a guy who has been known to offer less as I see it — remember the Jake Peavey rumors of 4 winters ago. When he was trying to offer a package of Boyer, Charlie Morton or Jo Jo, Kelly Johnson and Gorkys Hernandez for Peavey.
They wanted Yunel and Locke was one of the prospets they wanted. As it turned out the whole thing fell through. Turned out for the best.
But at the time Peavey was worth a kings ransom. The names Wren were offering was a low ball as I saw it. Even the Mc Louth trade — yea, it did not work out but we did not give up much — that was one that worked for neither side.
And when Frank makes his trades one thing is that I never have said when he has compleed a trade that he has given up too much Bourn, Reed Johnson/Malholm, etc.
And that is a good thing — we can trust him in making trades. He is pretty shrewed at that.
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
10:17 am
Fowler is a good ballplayer — maybe he hits better at home regardless of the park he plays in.
I don’t worry so much about the ballpark splits unless the guy is a power middle of the lineup guy.
If your’re a good ballplayer your’re a good ballplayer. The ballpark should not matter unless you are swinging for the fences.
Fowler;s game is speed and d with some timely power. He should do fine at the Ted if we get him.
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
10:20 am
That might be about right Jeff R on Salcedo –
Yes he is young. And he does have power. But the excuses for his defense is a PR cover you bacon when the results are as bad as they are.
He can have all the range in the world but if he cannot catch the ball he cannot catch the ball.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:27 am
Another thing to consider Jeff R is that teams are sort of working on the free agent period and getting their plans together before big trades are made.
GM’s have alot of irons in the fire right now & its early.
This is possible, though I would think that Wren would be talking trade, too, if he wants Span and/or Willingham (or Fowler). Would think he’d be moving on all fronts to better ensure he ends up with the players he wants.
Disgusted
November 18th, 2012
10:35 am
Perhaps BJ is Frank’s Number One target at this time & he is the guy he really wants.
He seems to be Philly’s top target too.
If it does not work with BJ than he can pursue trade talks in further depth with a Span, Fowlerr or whoelse may be available that makes sense.
And there is always the chance of retaining Bourn who should not be completely unaffordable. No way he gets Carl Crawford $$$$$$$$$ — that deal was ridiculous. That is thefault of Boston at the time And the Dodgers bailed them out iwth a dumm dumm mistake of their own as I see it..
Lew
November 18th, 2012
10:35 am
I’m not so concerned about Fowler’s Home/Away splits. He’s a high OBP guy who walks a fair amount, hits a decent numebr of doubles (though his 2012 total was down a bit) and a LOT of triples. I really don’t see where that would change appreciably in Atlanta nd his OBP was decent (and definitely higher than Upton’s) even on the road.
He’s a switch hitter who can run and play defense and if he can cover CF in that cavern in Denver, he should have little diffiuclty covering center in ATlanta. He’s also a good lead off option and I’d say he’d score a fair amount of runs with Martin hitting behind him.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
10:37 am
How about if they were to trade for Fowler to play center and sign BJ to play LF?
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:38 am
I agree with Lew’s assessment of Fowler. Lower risk, surer return for the dollars.
Who would Denver want for him, though?
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:40 am
How about if they were to trade for Fowler to play center and sign BJ to play LF?
Lew, sorta like shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic. CF, LF – you still have Upton tied up for mega bucks and he may not meet his… potential. Self-defeating, I think.
BraveDan
November 18th, 2012
10:41 am
JEFF R Do the Braves really need two guys in the line up whiffing as much as Upton and Uggla (the “U2s”)?
And how many strikeouts did Bourn have last season? Hmmm…….
Nowhere man
November 18th, 2012
10:43 am
Bama/Dawgs in the Championship game. Get ready to hear whinning from the rest of the country about another SEC Champion.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:43 am
BraveDan, TOO many for a lead-off hitter, IMO. Braves aren’t bringing Bourn back.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
10:44 am
The Rockies would probably love to have pitching – it will always be something they need – though I’m not so sure they;’d target Hanson. I’m also guessing that they will do away with that weird pitching program, too.
And another point in Fowler’s favor – he and his wife are from Atlanta (Alpharetta’s close enough). That should energize him to play well, too.
BraveDan
November 18th, 2012
10:44 am
I know, just saying Bourn had about as many as BJ
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
10:45 am
I doubt BJ would want to play LF… course thats where he should play but his ego probably wouldnt accept that.
Both fowler and span are under control thru 16, right? Whose the better defender… take him
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
10:47 am
strikeouts from the leadoff spot (Bourn) are less important than from a middle-of-the-order hitter like Dan or Upton. They all whiffed too much though…
Lew
November 18th, 2012
10:49 am
JeffR – I have very mixed feelings re: BJ Upton. His OBP is terrible, but I’m an old fossil and really don’ty think OBP is a necessitity from power hitters. However, what DOES concern me here is Uggla and BJ both being exceptionally streaky and going into one of their prolonged slumps at the same time.
Lack of offensive consistency killed the Braves the past several years and though I’m not certain how you make moves to guarantee consistency, it likely won’t be by signing more streaky hitters.
On the plus side – if BJ and Uggs were to get hot at the same time and we have someone like Fowler setting the table with Martin, this could be a devastatingly potent offense.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
10:51 am
All of this is yet another reason I;d like to see Fowler/Span in center and Swisher in LF. Swisher is extremely consistent, has good power (and has shown it in hitter’s parks and also in pitcher’s parks like Oakland), gets on base at a high rate and is a switch hitter.
Doesn’t seem to be much interest in Nick, however.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
10:53 am
I think fowlers XBH numbers may take a hit in ATL… esp. his triples. We dont have huge alleys in the gaps like Coors. Spruill+ is probably too little. But I really like Delgado (hes produced at MLB level, future #2) and Im sure Teheran is too much.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:55 am
JeffR – I have very mixed feelings re: BJ Upton. His OBP is terrible, but I’m an old fossil and really don’ty think OBP is a necessitity from power hitters. However, what DOES concern me here is Uggla and BJ both being exceptionally streaky and going into one of their prolonged slumps at the same time.
Lew, precisely. How does adding Upton to the mix solve the Braves’ offensive inconsistencies?
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:57 am
I know, just saying Bourn had about as many as BJ
The Braves should be aiming for fewer strikeouts and less streakiness from their hitters, not more of the same.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
10:59 am
On the plus side – if BJ and Uggs were to get hot at the same time
And the other side of the coin? If they’re both stinking at the same time?
Uggla’s enough in the that department (feast or famine and whiffing) to suit me, Lew.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
11:00 am
Swisher’s price tag and term of service may be the hangups
northbeach Scott
November 18th, 2012
11:05 am
Think about the potential of Tommy Hanson pitching an entire season for the Rockies. He could make a real assault on the record for most homers allowed in a single season. This would be a real train wreck. All the more reason to deal Tommy for Fowler.
Nowhere man
November 18th, 2012
11:06 am
Opening day infield of Laird, Freeman, Uggla, Simmons, Prado.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
11:07 am
Swisher’s price tag and term of service may be the hangups
And loss of draft pick
I’d really hope that he’d accept a 3yr 35-38mil deal with a 4th year option… 4 guaranteed years is a bit much for me
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
11:15 am
Diamondbacks GM Kevin Towers was never really in the hunt for Jose Reyes, and he has yet to be overwhelmed with an offer for Justin Upton.
Both the Red Sox and Diamondbacks are interested in Asdrubal Cabrera of the Indians while Boston also has some interest in Stephen Drew.
Get Cleveland on the phone, tell them to send Cabrera to AZ, we’ll send them Ahmed/Pastornicky… Send Maholm and a lefty reliever to AZ; AZ sends us Upton and a RH reliever, and they send Bauer to the Tribe.
Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
11:32 am
And loss of draft pick [for Swisher].
Yes, that too!
Heath
November 18th, 2012
11:41 am
Jeff R:
I’m all for trading for Span… The problem is the Braves have 2 OF spots to fill this year, not 1. The chances of them being able to trade for 2 “premium” OFers in one offseason is pretty slim. To do so, a lot of talent would have to be traded away and that’s just not something the Braves typically do (the Tex trade being the exception–from which I think they learned their lesson). So, if trading for 2 premium OFers (and I use that word because that’s what Wren said he was going to get–his word) then the realistic option is to sign 1 and trade for the other. I’m not waying that I WANT BJ Upton, just saying the reality is that based on the organization’s needs, payroll, and propensity to value their prospects, I think we’re more likely to see them sign a guy and trade for one–and right now, Wren is targeting BJ Upton as the guy to sign. It just is what it is.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
11:44 am
Lew:
If Wren whiffs on BJ Upton (You like what I did there?
) they I can see him going after Swisher for LF. I actually like the Span/Swisher combo quite a lot actually.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
11:47 am
Jeff R / TOBF:
I think the rule changed so that the signing club does NOT lose their pick, the club losing the guy just gets and extra pick. The Braves don’t have to worry about losing picks to sign Swisher. He probably just has to wait for the Upton/Bourn market to shape up before interest (and dollar amounts) become more clear for him.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
11:53 am
JIM BOWDEN @JimBowdenESPNxm
Frank Wren confirmed with us that Josh Hamilton is in their mix along with Michael Bourn and B.J. Upton as possible CF for next yr XM 89
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 18th, 2012
11:57 am
Royals are listening on offers for all young offensive players including Gordon, Moustakas, and Myers. Make the call Wren. Go get Gordon.
ncgary
November 18th, 2012
11:57 am
3 team trade
braves get mike morse nationals get ss cabrerra from indians
and which pitcher do we give up to the
indians can we try d lowe again snark snark snark
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 18th, 2012
11:57 am
Royals are listening on offers for all young offensive players including Gordon, Moustakas, and Myers. Make the call Wren. Go get Gordon.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:00 pm
Gordon’s fine… but if they’re taking calls on Myers, I’d try him first. Maholm or Minor, Delgado…. something. That kid is gonna be a beast. A RH Heyward.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:00 pm
It would really be nice to fill the needs without having to surrender a draft choice. Somehow add a solid CF and LF and Bourn gives us a draft choice we’ll have two 1st round picks. I guess Dexter Fowler would be an ok choice considering he’s not expensive salary wise, but Denard Span would be a much safer bet to produce. Wren is gonna have to get creative to make this happen, BJ Upton and Nick Swisher both cost a pick and a salary atleast 10 million a season for sure.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:03 pm
Heath- (from MLB website)
The current compensation system for losing “Type A” and “Type B” free agents will be eliminated. Under the new system, teams will receive compensation for losing a free agent only if they offer — and the player rejects — a guaranteed one-year contract equal to the average salary of the league’s 125 highest-paid players. Compensation for losing such players will consist of one Draft pick at the end of the first round.
• When clubs sign a compensation-eligible player, they will forfeit their own first-round selection, or their second-round selection if they pick in the top 10.
So we would lose the draft pick.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:08 pm
TOBF:
Thanks for clarifying. I thought the losing a draft pick was removed. Dumb rule.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:12 pm
Royals Gordon bats from the left side. We do not need a lefty in LF.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:14 pm
Thanks for clarifying. I thought the losing a draft pick was removed. Dumb rule.
No problem… I agree it is a bad rule. Hurts the smaller-market teams.
Bravefaninok
November 18th, 2012
12:14 pm
JIM BOWDEN @JimBowdenESPNxm
Frank Wren confirmed with us that Josh Hamilton is in their mix along with Michael Bourn and B.J. Upton as possible CF for next yr XM 89
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:14 pm
Haha.. I find it unbelievable that Josh Hamilton and the Braves are mentioned in the same sentence.. The Braves are NOT interested in him. Wren is not willing to spend all of our money on 1 player. Other teams are willing to offer longer and higher salary deals. Now if he was willing to do a 3 year 56 million deal if would make some sense… We’d have enough money left to fill the CF spot threw trade. But I bet many teams are offering more.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:15 pm
TOBF:
Royals’ Myers could be a good trade pickup, but for next year? Probably a year away still, no?
George_George
November 18th, 2012
12:16 pm
Good day all
The post below makes good sense to me, thanks Jeff.
************************************************Jeff R
November 18th, 2012
9:26 am
BJ Upton has awesome athletic ability…
Frankly, big deal. If that athletic ability can’t be translated into real production, it’s just lots of gooey “potential.” Heck, the Braves have a lot of prospects they’re paying far less for their “potential.”
Pursue Span or Fowler, who are better defenders, decent hitters, and cheaper. Go find a LFer via trade, Both would probably cost less than tying up Upton forever and you’d have a better idea of what you’d get for the dough.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:17 pm
Good reason Jim Bowden isn’t a MLB GM anymore.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:21 pm
I don’t think he’s really a year away… he demolished AAA this season. He may be a bit slow to start, he’s not an established big-leaguer, but I still think he can hold his own.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:21 pm
VaBravesFan:
If the Rangers are not willing to go higher than 3 years with Hamilton, maybe no one is… we just don’t know. A 3 year deal is not all that risky in baseball, especially for Hamilton. Upton wanting 5 years and Bourn wanting 5-7 years, maybe, just maybe it’s smarter to give a little higher annual salary to Hamilton for less years and then trade for Span to play LF.
1. Span
2. Prado
3. Heyward.
4. Hamilton
5. Uggla (Break up the lefties
6. Freeman
7. Simmons
8. Laird
Still a lot of lefties in the middle for my liking…but maybe it’s not as far-fetched as we once thought. I don’t think I’d do it.
ncgary
November 18th, 2012
12:22 pm
i like mike morse for left field
Lew
November 18th, 2012
12:22 pm
Y’all do realize that to get the best player in there we may well have to give up a draft pick, pay more than we’d like, give more years than we’d prefer or give up way more of our farm system than we’d be comfortable with?
Actually, I could see it being ALL of the above. Get used to it – there’s no way that it doesn’t get much worse in the next several years.
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 18th, 2012
12:24 pm
Myers will cost a ton because he’s young and their best prospect and controllable for years while Gordon won’t cost as much and is an excellent lead off hitter and gold glove defense. Who cares if he’s lefty if we sign a RH CF. some of you are too hung up on the lefty thing if a good player is available. If they sign Upton you have 4 RH bats and 4 LH bats. Hardly too much of a LH hitting line up like some are crying about.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
12:24 pm
Mike Morse might well be a good acquision, but there’s npo way i hell I’d be willing to trade ANYONE to the Nats that might possibly make them better than they already are – unless they want to trade some front line pitching to us. I certainly don’t see THAT happening, so let’s go elsewhere.
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:24 pm
TOBF:
I don’t think they’d trade Myers though. He’s probably the reason they’re willing to trade some of their other offensive talent. He’s probably the guy they want to keep (unless over-whelmed, which the Braves don’t need to do).
ncgary
November 18th, 2012
12:25 pm
anyone else like morse he sure killed the braves pitching anyway
ncgary
November 18th, 2012
12:28 pm
christian martinez and a lower level pitcher might get it done, shoot promise cmart a job back here and watch him implode
Heath
November 18th, 2012
12:29 pm
BravePack:
If the Braves got Gordon, besides Upton, who else would the Braves sign to play CF that bats right-handed? If the Braves are convinced Upton is the middle of the order RH bat they need, then so be it.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:31 pm
yeah, I’m sure they are more willing to trade Gordon. Just saying that if Myers is available, I’d look into what they want for him first, before going after Gordon. Same with Texas and Olt. I’d try there first, before getting something done for Gordon, Span, Fowler, etc.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:32 pm
I’d really prefer Hamilton as a LF though if we signed him… unless we’re getting Justin Upton, Olt, or Myers
Larry Gibbs
November 18th, 2012
12:34 pm
I hear Gincarolo Stanton is unhappy with the fire sale in Miami and would like to go elsewhere. Maybe the Braves can help by sending Tommy Hanson & Jar Jurgens down there for him. Wouldn’t he look nice in a Braves uniform in the outfield in 2013!!!!
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:39 pm
Loria is such a horrible owner It wouldn’t surprise me to see him trade the star (Stanton) within the division. Look how little he accepted for Uggla who at the time was considered the most powerful 2nd baseman in baseball at the plate. Theyu traded him cause they knew they were not gonna work out a extension, there’s no way there working out one with Stanton either, unless they offer 100+ million or something. But he’s too young for that type of contract.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
12:47 pm
How many times do the Royals need to repeat their claim that they don’t want to trade Myers before people actualy believe they aren’t trading him?
And Stanton may not want to be left in Miami, but he has absolutely no bargaining power cause he’s under contractual control for a couple more years, so unless someone blows them away with a deal that sends much young, under control talent their way, Stanton remains a fish bone.
Lew
November 18th, 2012
12:49 pm
And not to mention that at this point, were the Marlins to trade Giancarlo, they would like not put a thousand fans per game in the seats and even Luria likes a little bit of concession sales.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:53 pm
The Royals are listening to offers for Eric Hosmer, Mike Moustakas, Alex Gordon, Billy Butler, and even Wil Myers. The Rays, meanwhile, are listening on James Shields and Jeremy Hellickson.
The Royals’ rotation ranked 26th in the majors with a 5.01 ERA in 2012. And their best starter, right-hander Jeremy Guthrie, is seeking a big-time raise in free agency. Kansas City, after committing $12 million to Santana, could be hard-pressed to sign Guthrie or someone in his price range. As a result, the Boston Herald reports, the club is listening to offers on its top position players, including first baseman Eric Hosmer, third baseman Mike Moustakas, outfielder Alex Gordon and DH Billy Butler. The Royals even appear willing to dangle super prospect Wil Myers, who Baseball America named its minor league player of the year after he annihilated Class AA and AAA pitching in 2012
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:53 pm
Marlins have traded away so many good players over the years who in the hell would want to play for em lol.
Jose Reyes, Josh Johnson, Hanley Ramirez, Dan Uggla, Mark Buehrle, Heath Bell, Dontrell Willis, Gary Sheffield, Josh Beckett, Mike Lowell, Luis Castillo, and I’m there are a few more notables.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
12:54 pm
JIM BOWDEN @JimBowdenESPNxm
Dayton Moore is not playing….he is prepared to trade one of his top young position players for a top of the rotation starter
Minor! Medlen!
Nicolas Brody
November 18th, 2012
12:59 pm
2 homers and 11 RBIs in 180 at-bats in 2012. Why did we sign this guy?
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
1:01 pm
Frank Wren, Atlanta Braves General Manager, described the recruiting of BJ Upton and talked about his interest in Josh Hamilton on the front office with Jim Bowden and Jim Duquette on MLB Network Radio
http://siriusxmsports.posterous.com/frank-wren-atlanta-braves-general-manager-des
Bobby Cox, Greg Walker, and Fredi were all there to meet with BJ. Walker supposedly talked with BJ on his philosophy on hitting. Frank said that he really doesn’t know how involved they’ll be in Hamilton talks, the “dance” hasn’t started yet, no $$ figures tossed about yet.
VaBravesFan
November 18th, 2012
1:02 pm
It doesn’t matter how good of a prospect Wil Myers is he isn’t gonna land a James Shields type or better byhimself. But If I’m Wren I would roll the dice and offer a few guys for Myers, take a shot.
Randall Delgado, Sean Gilmartin, and Matt Lipka for Wil Myers.
That trade is kinda risky tho, I think it’s safe to say Delgado will be a MLB caliber starter, the question is how good? Gilmartin has promise as a MLB starter, Lipka gives them a 20 year old for 1st round pick. Quite a bit for 1 single prospect regardless of how good he is.