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4,357 comments Add your comment
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
12:36 pm
He’d sign Greinke, trade for Bourjos and Doumit and it would be time to play ball.
That would all pretty much have suckage, and it would still be better than signing Cody Ross.
RC
November 14th, 2012
12:37 pm
I like Haren, but the unknown of the medical records scare me. There is a reason that the trade to the Cubs fell through, and while none of us know what that reason was, the medical records are the most likely answer.
extremus
November 14th, 2012
12:38 pm
@ Efrim,
Yeah, I know it’d probably never happen, but a disgruntled player, even one as talented as Stanton, can quickly lose his usefulness to a team. And hey, I can understand his (and Miami fans’) frustration; they literally razed last year’s $200 million team to the ground. Keeping him around wasn’t a show of appreciation or confidence; it’s simply because he’s not free agent-eligible and is therefore cheap. Like Loria, their owner.
I know we don’t like having Liberty Media as an ownership, but I think Braves fans would riot if Loria ever bought the team.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:38 pm
Have you looked at the farm, LOL? If you gutted it, you wouldn’t be much further behind than if you kept everybody.
This is so true. And so friggin depressing at the same time.
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:38 pm
Tyler Colvin and Nolan Reimold to platoon in LF. Or maybe Brennan Boesch and Tyler Moore.
There’s a myriad of options out there that won’t cost a fortune and could probably put up some decent numbers in a platoon.
George_George
November 14th, 2012
12:38 pm
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
12:23 pm
And Prado NEEDS to be the everyday 3B, not some yoyo yanked between 3B and LF.
********
AGREE 100%. On another note I just can’t accept haveing BOSCAN as our catcher opening day come next April. D ROSS we will miss you.
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
12:39 pm
You willing to give up Simmons, Teheran, Minor, and Gattis for him?
I’d give them Minor or Medlen, are you kidding? And all the prospects they could fit in a bag.
But no Simmons. Pitching the Braves got, SS not so much.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
12:40 pm
The Torii Hunter deal isn’t official yet. It is lacking one critical component.
Lew
November 14th, 2012
12:40 pm
scoots – Have you heard me advocate for signing Cody Ross? I don’t think so. I’d like to see Span in center, Swisher in Left and then sit back and listen to everyone else bitch incessantly – which they will do no matter who we bring in to fill the positions now open.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
12:41 pm
“There goes Frank Wren again. Totally dropping the ball on this one. The Braves could have had Hunter if he’d just get off his lazy @ss!”
There. Now the Hunter deal is finalized.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
12:42 pm
which they will do no matter who we bring in to fill the positions now open.
There are a few players this team could bring in and the bitching would be drown out by the cheering. But I still don’t think Stanton is getting traded.
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
12:43 pm
Yes, Lew, I know you like Swisher. And I think he’s only slightly less hurl-inducing than Cody Ross.
You know things are bad when I find Nick Swisher preferable to anybody, LOL.
old man
November 14th, 2012
12:44 pm
I re-ran the Ross-Francisco platoon based on career numbers, not 2012 only. This essentially takes out Fenway. It includes Francisco’s pre-Atlanta years when he hit almost no HRs. I’m getting a combined .840 OPS and 36 HRs.
I still think that’s pretty good. Chipper (the bat we are replacing) had around .800 and 14 HRs in 2012.
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:45 pm
Wright, Headley, or McCutchen.
Make it happen Frank!
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:45 pm
Wren is pushing you prospect huggers pretty hard. I think he’s just trying to find your tipping point.
Trading Julio Teheran and JR Graham this offseason, then drafting a polished, high floor anything in June of next year would just about do it for me. Torch and pitchfork on my way to Turner Field.
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:47 pm
Hell, offer Hamilton 100 million for 5 years. It’s only money.
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 14th, 2012
12:47 pm
You know the funny thing about all these trade scenarios and the predicament the Braves are in with the OF is the fact that they keep drafting all these pitching prospects instead of OF prospects. I mean think about it, who the H have they drafted other than Heyward for the OF in the 1st round the last how many years? Or even the 2nd or 3rd rounds? Seriously, all these position players they have been drafting are AAAA players because they wait until the late rounds hoping to pull a horshoe out of their azz. I think the Braves need a new scouting team and drafting team who will draft based on needs. How long has this team needed OF prospects yet they still draft pitchers every f’n year. It really is frustrating to know we could have had kids like Myers, Trout, or anyone for that matter in the system. The good thing is when they do decide to draft a position player in the 1st or 2nd round they usually do a good job as evident with Heyward and Freeman, they just need to do it more. Now they have to trade these drafted pitching prospects to get the position players they need.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:47 pm
JimBowdenESPNxm JIM BOWDEN
Angels clearly miscalculated in not making Torii Hunter a qualifying offer to get the draft pick…Bourjos finally gets his 1st legit chance
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:49 pm
Prediction: Gerald Laird as backup catcher. He’s been to 2 WS in a row. Let’s make it 3!
RC
November 14th, 2012
12:49 pm
Great take on the Marlins situation by Jonah Keri.
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/42760/theres-shrewd-theres-genius-then-theres-marlins-owner-jeffrey-loria
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:49 pm
I swear, I am not BravePack(FreeFan) at 12:47pm.
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:50 pm
I’m going to make a bold prediction. Reed Johnson will not be in a Braves uni next season.
D$1
November 14th, 2012
12:51 pm
Later folks. Getting close to burrito time.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
12:52 pm
Bourjos next year: .255/.330/.410/.740 while providing Bourn-caliber defense (maybe better)
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
12:52 pm
I think the Braves need a new scouting team and drafting team who will draft based on needs.
I wouldn’t advocate such a method. I think this team drafted based on “needs” by drafting all these high floor players. I’d like to see a draft goal of acquiring the best talent available regardless of position. Highest ceiling players they can get. Even if they are all at the same position. You can always trade them for what you need.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
12:54 pm
But, for the sake of argument, where do you plan to stash all the players that might conceivably be used in a Willingham trade and why is their future value more important than the current value of Willingham
What would I do with the players used in a trade for Willy? Well, for 1, I’d go after Span instead. Teheran or Delgado (Teheran first) + for Span, Doumit, and a prospect or RP. I’d also look into Hunter Pence, if the Giants would consider a deal. Or look into Justin Upton, possibly involving a 3-way trade (since AZ already has pitching prospects). Or send Texas Maholm and the prospects that they could flip to AZ and get Olt back. Yoenis Cespedes is rumored to be available at a price. I’d look into him. I’m sure the As would take some good young pitching. And at the very worst, we have the pitchers stuck here for another year and we can use them in a trade next fall to get the ace we will need. Lots of ways to go about it.
Willingham is a good fit, I’d like to have him, but just because we have great talent that’s at the door of the MLB but we don’t have room for them, that doesn’t mean that we must trade those guys. Willingham isn’t really worth Delgado/Teheran+ to me. He certainly wasn’t last year, and a career year at age 33 shouldn’t change that.
Next winter, we’ll be looking to replace 2 pitchers, and the likely offense of Mac. 2 of those positions will be critical. We are going to need a big front-line SP, and I’d prefer an OF who would be with us for the forseeable future. Willy isn’t that. And with next year’s market being pretty weak as well (esp. on the pitching side), having the trade capital may be a really good thing
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:54 pm
Jerry Crasnick @jcrasnick
#Tigers paid up for Hunter’s leadership, clubhouse presence and all those things that might get you laughed out of a SABR meeting.
Hey now. Keith Law actually mentioned those as positives for signing Hunter…..
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
12:56 pm
Give up every prospect we have for a 33 yr old… for only 2 years. Sigh. It’s not like he’s McCutchen, Stanton, Hamilton…
Gary O.
November 14th, 2012
12:57 pm
Efrim,
At least Ross would be an upgrade over previous left fielders like Loaf, Melk Dud, and Nate
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
12:58 pm
This is so true. And so friggin depressing at the same time.
Yeah, but there’s something to be said about going “quantity” with organizational filler on a trade package. There’s at least some value in that.
It’s so unlikely that much of the farm is going to contribute at the ML level in the near future that trading much of that farm before they go bust is logical. If you’re two drafts away from re-filling the system with higher-quality prospects, then go ahead and gulag the ones you got.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
12:59 pm
I think this team drafted based on “needs” by drafting all these high floor players.
Yeah, they saw a gap and filled it with near every early draft pick in 2010. Cunningham, Leonard, Terdoslavich, Gosselin will all be at Triple-A next year and Simmons would of been there if not for a need at SS….and ya know, his 80 glove/arm, 60 legs. That was DeMacio’s first draft. Great job by the department in getting Andrelton though.
I still liked the direction we went in 2012. Better.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:02 pm
If you’re two drafts away from re-filling the system with higher-quality prospects, then go ahead and gulag the ones you got.
Yes, and there is something to this. I’ve said before, take a look at the Braves system and aside from Julio Teheran – every prospect will still be prospect eligible next winter. That has been a rarity over the last few seasons. Seems as if we are graduating 3-4 prospects a year off of the farm.
So, with good drafts in 2013 and 2014 – we should be back in a solid place, I think. Those drafts just need to be a lot more like 2012, imo.
cricket
November 14th, 2012
1:10 pm
And Prado NEEDS to be the everyday 3B, not some yoyo yanked between 3B and LF.
agreed. since umps will call infield fly and give the out anyway, no need to man the yoyo between 3B and LF position..
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
1:13 pm
I hope we do something better than Cody Ross??????
Just save the money and allow Francisco to play 3B and Prado to play left and allow Constanza to play CF.
Either go for Hamilton or save the cash.
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:16 pm
I wonder if Freeman and Teheran would get a listen on Stanton.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:16 pm
http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/jon-heyman/20979584/loria-explains-deal-we-have-to-get-better–we-have-to-take-a-new-course
“We finished in last place. Figure it out,” a defiant Loria said.
Loria emphatically said he isn’t selling the team.
“Absolutely not,” Loria said. “That’s more stupidity.”
“We have to get better,” Loria said. “We can’t finish in last place. We finished in last place. That’s unacceptable. We have to take a new course.”
Get used to finishing in last place.
Dadgum.....
November 14th, 2012
1:17 pm
Well, there goes one of the top 3 players Wren had a chance to get for our outfield. Hunter fits better in Detroit because he has more protection in the lineup but still it is tough seeing him off the board.
Next big piece is Justin Upton then Willingham. Hopefully Wren doesn’t whiff on all three pitches. Things are shaping up for a deal coming out of nowhere because quite frankly there aren’t a lot of sexy plays out there. Span is no great catch and actually a downgrade from Bourn. We have already downgraded at catcher. We downgraded 2nd bbase two years ago. Our franchise icon is gone. We have a broken down catcher we hope can grab hold of a resurgence when he returns. I mean seriously, Wren has to pull off a super deal from somewhere. Time to let go of our pitching surplus and get some bats.
Rock on…….oh what we would give for Stanton about right now.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:18 pm
I wonder if Freeman and Teheran would get a listen on Stanton.
Now you’re talking. None of this 3 of the Braves pitching prospects for Stanton. A real piece needs to be going over there for Giancarlo.
cricket
November 14th, 2012
1:21 pm
Get used to finishing in last place.
all that matters to him is net income at end of every year and the profit he will make when he sells the team anyway
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
1:21 pm
Any way that Tex considers trading Leonys Martin (CF/Leadoff) or Milwaukee does w/ Khris Davis?
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
1:23 pm
The Marlins are not gonna trade Stanton.
Nobody realizes that they sold off only the expensive players because they were in last place with them so they figured they could be the same with a cheaper team.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
1:23 pm
Not excited about C. Ross, Ludwick, or Swisher. Perhaps it is time to think outside of the box. I am not one to propose trade ideas as most are usually nonsensical. However, let me propose this idea, as farsical and nonsensical as it may be: Trade for Stanton with a package centered on Freeman /Teheran and others not including Simmons. Sign Adam LaRoche for 1b. Maybe he will welcome re-signing with the Braves. Then sign Victorino for CF if we have no prospects left over to trade for Span.
I have not thought this through so I am sure this idea is flawed and not really possible as there are many moving parts. I just want to get a discussion started as to whether there are any other ideas out there that might be better than the options currently contemplated.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
1:24 pm
Oh, I just saw your post Efrin (1:18).
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
1:25 pm
and yours ncscoots (1:16)
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
1:25 pm
A real piece needs to be going over there for Giancarlo.
So there is where the Rangers “creativity” comes in… Braves can offer Mike Olt, Chase Headley, and two AA relief pitchers from the Rockies plus cash for Stanton…
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:26 pm
A real piece needs to be going over there for Giancarlo.
That would depend on which way they would lean, hitting or pitching. Minor, Medlen, Freeman…just guessing, but I don’t think you pick him up for Nick Ahmed.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:27 pm
Yeah, I don’t think they are trading Stanton either. Not right now at least. I’m sure they will field offers for him next winter or the winter after.
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:28 pm
Tumbledown’s got it. Trade Freeman for Stanton, sign LaRoche for three years, and start sizing the rings.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
1:28 pm
Besides, Loria likes the bottom line. I bet he’d be interested in a deal for Stanton… Braves send Loria $20M, he gives the Braves Stanton.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:29 pm
That would depend on which way they would lean, hitting or pitching.
Honestly man, for Stanton, both. All of it. Everyone.
And not just some pitching prospects like Teheran, Delgado and Gilmartin for Stanton. Even if they were leaning pitching, I’d want better.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
1:30 pm
Honestly man, for Stanton, both. All of it. Everyone.
Everyone? This is Stanton… he just doesn’t have that much value, when you dig really, really deep into the numbers.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
1:31 pm
Tumbledown’s got it. Trade Freeman for Stanton, sign LaRoche for three years, and start sizing the rings.
I have already scouted my position to view the victory parade down Peachtree!
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:32 pm
Yeah, I don’t think they are trading Stanton either.
Nah, nor do I. He’s gonna have to brood and cop ‘tude for a year, maybe have a domestic disturbance or a DUI, and be an all-around doodie-head, first.
I’m just trying to get my trade scenarios ready beforehand.
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
1:34 pm
But I think we should offer Hamilton 6 years 25 million a year. But heres the catch every year is an option year to where is he doesnt perform or has a slip up then it would be easy to not be stuck for a bad contract.
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
1:34 pm
But I think we should offer Hamilton 6 years 25 million a year. But heres the catch every year is an option year to where is he doesnt perform or has a slip up then it would be easy to not be stuck for a bad contract.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
1:36 pm
I seriously doubt Hamilton would take that…
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:36 pm
Everyone? This is Stanton… he just doesn’t have that much value, when you dig really, really deep into the numbers.
Hah! Oh, Payne…..(shaking my head)……
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:36 pm
Everyone? This is Stanton… he just doesn’t have that much value, when you dig really, really deep into the numbers.
beekay
November 14th, 2012
1:37 pm
Lets see how Hunter does with the Tiger’s Latino players in the clubhouse. Thank goodness he is not a Brave. Don’t sleep on Gattis or Bethancourt making the roster. Who would of thought Simmons would have produced like he did at this time last year.
Trader Jack
November 14th, 2012
1:37 pm
TennPaul
$20 mil? Wouldn’t surprise me if one of the wealthy teams offer $50 mil over 4 years, takes him thru Arb, and then ink him to a new deal
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:38 pm
Scott Lauber @ScottLauber Shane Victorino drawing “realistic” interest from 8 teams, 11 overall including Detroit pre-Hunter. At 32 on 11/30, he seeks more than 2 yrs
Some team is giving him three years and $27-30 million, I think.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:39 pm
Lets see how Hunter does with the Tiger’s Latino players in the clubhouse.
Huh? What is that suppose to mean?
Trader Jack
November 14th, 2012
1:40 pm
Victorino will shoot for 3/$30, and someone will probably pay it..
tony austin
November 14th, 2012
1:41 pm
But I think we should offer Hamilton 6 years 25 million a year. But heres the catch every year is an option year to where is he doesnt perform or has a slip up then it would be easy to not be stuck for a bad contract – Joe Dirte
I’m sure most GMs would love to sign every player to a contract with similar terms, but I dare to say agents and the players union would have something to say about that.
Dadgum.....
November 14th, 2012
1:41 pm
I would say the following Braves are untouchable. Medlen, Beachy, Hudson, Freeman, Heyward, Prado, Kimbrel, and Simmons. Pretty much everyone else is in play if the right deal comes along. I’m not losing hope that Wren can pull off a big deal as it’s early. However, it is pretty clear the man is approaching the Mendoza line for GM’s.
Rock on…..if Wren was a member of the Sons or MC, I would feel a little better about our chances of landing the right people. In fact if he does pull this off then I will nickname him “Pope”.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
1:41 pm
Not much value? Haha. Just as valuable, if not more so, than Heyward. Well, maybe his better defense and baserunning put JHey ahead, but the slugging (and rest of stat line) + the fact that he’s improved every year and Hey hasn’t quite fully replicated his 1st season numbers…
He’d be a better get than Willingham, Pence, Upton etc.
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
1:45 pm
Honestly man, for Stanton, both. All of it. Everyone.
Now, Efrim…I realize that just the mere thought that the phone might even be picked up on Stanton can make one giddy, but maintain some perspective, LOL. A top 3 starter with 2 or 3 years of control, a good-hitting 1B with even more years of control? That’s pretty solid bank as a centerpiece, even for Stanton. I don’t know that I could hike up my skirts much more than that.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
1:52 pm
So, what if the deal was Teheran, Minor, Freeman, and Gattis for Stanton. Is this too much or too little for Stanton? Would you pull the trigger on the deal
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
1:52 pm
Tim Brown@TBrownYahoo
MLB has not yet received official documentation from Tor-Mia trade. Understand cash to Tor could be at least double the $4m reported.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 14th, 2012
1:54 pm
Trade Gattis and we lose our next slugging catcher
I’d probably do that.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
1:54 pm
A top 3 starter with 2 or 3 years of control, a good-hitting 1B with even more years of control?
You mean Freeman AND Medlen? Yeah, that’s definitely fair.
I thought you just meant one of those two plus some pitching prospects like Teheran. I don’t think that would push me to deal Stanton if I were Miami. Honestly, I’d be on the phone with St. Louis and Texas – those two teams have exactly what I want for Stanton.
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
1:58 pm
“JimBowdenESPNxm JIM BOWDEN
Angels clearly miscalculated in not making Torii Hunter a qualifying offer to get the draft pick”
I disagree. The market hasn’t really been set at what that pick is worth. But, if the Angels offer, Hunter’s value goes down, and by more than a little. At least 50/50 he’d accept, I think, and the Angels want to give their younger guy a shot. I suppose they might’ve received a Jesse Chavez in return, but perhaps didn’t want to do that to a long-time player.
I wonder if there is anything to teams being reluctant to offer qualifiers on older, franchise-type guys (no longer expecting long-term deals). Or handshake agreements? ‘Cause if the Halos had offered, and Hunter’d rejected, his $26 million probably turns into $18 million, right-quick.
Ozzie
November 14th, 2012
2:03 pm
Wren loves FF too much and usually doesnt trade quality pieces like that in the division.
Plus he is not going to want to pay LaRoche what he can get from WASH or in the FA market.
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
2:03 pm
“Yeah, that’s definitely fair.”
Efrim, I think that was GV’s point last night. I don’t think anybody’s saying the Braves have more chips, but it ain’t really about that. It’s about do we have enough, and are we willing to part with ‘em. Fully agree with you, it starts with cheap, big-league ballplayers. Not prospects. Though, it’d probably take a healthy dose of them, too.
Sucks we can’t know. I’d love to know what the market is for him. You’ve gotta think the Marlins have already fielded a dozen calls trying to set some parameters…
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:03 pm
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
@AndyLipman1 Hunter was always a secondary target. I still think most significant move will come via trade.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
2:03 pm
Despite my postings, I realize Stanton is just a pipe dream. I just do not want to think about a possible signing involving purported premium players such as Cody Ross, Ludwick, or Swisher.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:05 pm
Efrim, I think that was GV’s point last night. I don’t think anybody’s saying the Braves have more chips, but it ain’t really about that. It’s about do we have enough, and are we willing to part with ‘em
Yes, if we add in Freeman or Medlen – I agree with it. I’m not sure GV meant that though, as I saw the names Teheran, Delgado, Spruill and Gilmartin mentioned. I believe other teams would be able to beat that if we are just talking prosects, easily.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:06 pm
Cause if the Halos had offered, and Hunter’d rejected, his $26 million probably turns into $18 million, right-quick.
And he certainly wouldn’t be signed in November….
Although, Billy Wagner was signed in November and the Braves gave up a first – so what do I know.
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
2:08 pm
“He’d be a better get than Willingham, Pence, Upton etc.”
In your giddiness to enter every debate, in your enthusiasm to post all-day, every-day, might you at least maintain some perspective, and not instruct us on the value of Mike Stanton? Might you read and understand, at least as much as you blather? Might you comprehend a joke was being made? Do you think anybody here needed to be told that he has more value than Hunter Frickin’ Pence?
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
2:08 pm
You mean Freeman AND Medlen? Yeah, that’s definitely fair.
Actually, I think that would be too much. One or the other as a centerpiece, and then add with one or two top prospects. Maybe some filler, if you’re getting some filler back.
Even for Stanton, you’re trading performance and control, and I don’t think you should just invite banditry. There’s a fair middle to be had.
Really, I’m just spitballing, so I don’t have to talk about Cody bleepin’ Ross.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:08 pm
Nolasco in a big home ballpark like San Diego makes a lot of sense. Guy always had strong peripherals – but was so home run/big inning prone.
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
2:10 pm
“I believe other teams would be able to beat that if we are just talking prosects, easily.”
Good call. He was talking prospects. I just wanted to say that you can have the worst ranked system in ball, and still get the best traded player available. Makes it a whole lot harder, of course.
Dadgum.....
November 14th, 2012
2:10 pm
Ross, Ludwick, or Swisher are a downgrade to what Prado can provide us in LF. I am fairly certain Wren is aiming much higher than that. I hope so anyway. None of those three will add any excitement to the off season or regular season for that matter. Ditto Dennard Spann or Dexter Fowler.
Rock on….it’s gonna take a Justin Upton to get me excited.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:11 pm
I’d go straight to Texas for Profar or to St. Louis for Taveras. I’d want a position player as the main centerpiece for Stanton, so Freeman would make some sense.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
2:12 pm
Lets see how Hunter does with the Tiger’s Latino players in the clubhouse.
Totally. I read Torii and Albert were at each others throats all season. The fued was so bad Macier was thrilled to learn he wasn’t going to be back, even if Hunter wasn’t either. Hunter apparently is just one hot headed racist…
ncscoots
November 14th, 2012
2:12 pm
You mean Freeman AND Medlen? Yeah, that’s definitely fair.
Maybe they just wait a year, and once Medlen has won the Cy, they can trade him straight up.
Dadgum.....
November 14th, 2012
2:14 pm
Blacks and Latinos not getting along? Oh wait stop the presses…..
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
2:14 pm
Only move hat makes sense for the Braves is Hamilton or Upton.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:14 pm
I just wanted to say that you can have the worst ranked system in ball, and still get the best traded player available.
White Sox and Tigers are two prime examples of team that have consistently had bad farm systems for the last 3-5 years and have still been able to trade for players. In the Tigers case because they are always like 2 prospects deep, but those two are pretty damn good ones. Certainly not the way you want to do business.
Joe Dirte
November 14th, 2012
2:15 pm
But the Braves are awful quiet. Which could be the calm before the storm
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:16 pm
….it’s gonna take a Justin Upton to get me excited.
Yeah, I’d have to agree. Him or Willingham.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
2:17 pm
I hope that Wren is aiming higher than the “premium” tifecta I now dub “Rosswicker”. It looks like we will have to make a splash via a trade. I could get on board for Upton.
Efrim
November 14th, 2012
2:17 pm
But the Braves are awful quiet. Which could be the calm before the storm
Other than say, the Tigers, Marlins and Jays – isn’t every team awfully quiet?
Shaun
November 14th, 2012
2:18 pm
Good stuff here from, guess who….Nate Silver: http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/11/14/the-statistical-case-against-cabrera-for-m-v-p/
On Thursday, the American League will announce the recipient of its Most Valuable Player award. The winner is likely to be Miguel Cabrera, the Detroit Tigers star who won the league’s triple crown by leading in batting average (. 330), home runs (44) and runs batted in (139).
It might seem as if these statistics make Cabrera, the first triple crown winner in either league since 1967, a shoo-in for the M.V.P. But most statistically minded fans would prefer that it go to another player, Mike Trout of the Los Angeles Angels.
The argument on Trout’s behalf isn’t all that complicated: he provided the greater overall contribution to his team. Trout was a much better defensive player than Cabrera, and a much better base runner. And if Cabrera was the superior hitter, it wasn’t by nearly as much as the triple crown statistics might suggest.
It is an argument enabled by the improved ability to measure different elements of the game – defense, base running, and situational hitting – that were once weak points of statistical analysis.
…
Perhaps 10 or 20 years ago, when evaluations of base running, defense and clutch hitting were murkier, stat geeks would have argued that Cabrera deserved the M.V.P. on the basis of the hard evidence.
Now that some of the “intangibles” have become measurable, we know that Trout did more of the little things to help his team win.
It’s the traditionalists who are using statistics in a way that misses the forest for the trees.
beekay
November 14th, 2012
2:18 pm
Efrim
Here is one of a dozen racist quotes that I can post regarding Hunter…thank goodness we didn’t blow half our money on this guyFans look down from their seats onto the
baseball field, see dark-colored skin and might assume they are
African-American players. But increasingly, the players instead hail
from the Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico or Venezuela.
“People
see dark faces out there, and the perception is that they’re African
American,” Los Angeles Angels center fielder Torii Hunter says.
“They’re not us. They’re impostors.
“Even people I know come up
and say, ‘Hey, what color is Vladimir Guerrero? Is he a black player?’
I say, ‘Come on, he’s Dominican. He’s not black.’ “
“As
African-American players, we have a theory
that baseball can go get an imitator and pass them off as us,” Hunter
says. “It’s like they had to get some kind of dark faces, so they go to
the Dominican or Venezuela because you can get them cheaper. It’s like,
‘Why should I get this kid from the South Side of Chicago and have
Scott Boras represent him and pay him $5 million when you can get a
Dominican guy for a bag of chips?’
“I’m telling you, it’s sad.”
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
2:19 pm
“just one hot headed racist…”
The worst part (ok, there’s probably worse) of the boom of sports marketing today is the nothing which is spewed from virtually every athlete’s pie-hole (pie?) when placed in front of the media. So that a thoughtful guy, with something to say, and with life-experiences which ought to be heard, gets ostracized for even the smallest idea that isn’t in line with the masses.
I will say, I think twitter might be bringing the pendulum back a bit. I like that.
Tumbledown
November 14th, 2012
2:22 pm
But the Braves are awful quiet. Which could be the calm before the storm
Why do I picture Wren as Elmer Fudd saying “Be vewy vewy quiet, I’m huntin’ fwee agents”!
Bay Area Steve
November 14th, 2012
2:24 pm
” a dozen racist quotes”
I don’t see racism. I see a guy who’s watched black involvement in the sport go from something like 10% down to less than 3% (numbers culled from an alcohol-riddled mind; margin of error 100%), and has a few things to say about it. At least he’s saying something rather that shilling for Bud Light.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
2:26 pm
I think, if I’m a Free Agent and the Marlins come talking to me, I ask for a front loaded deal. That’s the give and the take for a no-trade to stay in Miami for a year.
3 years $60M including a $16M bonus 100% payable upon signing, first year salary of $27M, then $12M, then $5M. This way, even when the Marlins trade me a year later, I’ll have taken most of my money from Loria. And I’d aim to turn in a mediocre season with strong “peripherals” making me a “change of scenery” candidate.
TennesseePaul
November 14th, 2012
2:27 pm
full disclosure, my 2:12 was a sarcastic joke