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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
5,183 comments Add your comment
nolie
November 12th, 2012
11:33 am
Hyperbole alert above ▲
CB
November 12th, 2012
11:33 am
Tell Frank to trade Heyward for Gregor Blanco,that should Bourjos name off the blog.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
11:34 am
so of course that post ends up in the one position where there is no above
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
11:37 am
Adding a pitcher makes up some of the difference… but I sure hope we don’t go that route with 2 unprovens. .355 SLG for Gentry. Weaker than Bourn
nolie
November 12th, 2012
11:44 am
looks like Bourn has over 23% XBH and he is nothing great , 12% is terrible
Half Empty
November 12th, 2012
11:49 am
That is Constanza level bad, we already have one of them. No need to give up players for another
George_George
November 12th, 2012
11:54 am
CB
November 12th, 2012
11:33 am
Tell Frank to trade Heyward for Gregor Blanco,that should Bourjos name off the blog.
***********
We do not need GREGOR BLANCO, plus JASON is far more talented than GREDOR.
Mixxo
November 12th, 2012
11:54 am
We’ll get Fowler and we’ll ‘like’ it!
Mixxo
November 12th, 2012
11:56 am
So lets see….
Braves failed…. *check*
Falcons will fail…. *check*
Oh well, we still have our Hawks…..right?
Bat Masterson
November 12th, 2012
11:59 am
George_
Do you still think Heyward is another Dave Kingman?
Murph
November 12th, 2012
12:00 pm
We do not need GREGOR BLANCO, plus JASON is far more talented than GREDOR.
I think CB’s comment went about a mile over your head.
Wow.
CB
November 12th, 2012
12:01 pm
Ok George,we won’t trade Heyward for Blanco. How about a 4-1 of Freeman,Medlen,Simmons and Kimbrel for Blanco?
Murph
November 12th, 2012
12:19 pm
The Red Sox are still interested in Napoli, and they just signed David Ross… all signs point to Salty being available soon.
I wouldn’t mind a trade that brought Salty back to ATL. He’s obviously not the long-term answer to catcher after BMac leaves next season, but he’d be a solid backup who hits the ball far (when he manages to make contact).
Plus it would allow Gattis to stay in AAA and work on his game while getting regular playing time in LF.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
12:20 pm
Just saw DOB responding to some posts from Disgusted. I’m assuming the loss of David Ross is causing him to be exceptionally concerned.
David Ross is a solid player, no doubt. But the Braves used him perfectly because they were able to use him perfectly, given that they had a left-handed-hitting, all-star catcher. This is probably a huge reason why his stats look as good as they do. Yes, I believe he would still be a solid player, even if he were in an everyday role. But the fact that the Braves were able to use him as they did, made him look even better than he is.
The Braves are better off with a cheaper option and using the money that they would have spent to match Boston to spend on some bats in leftfield/thirdbase and centerfield.
This is not the disaster some are making it out to be, unless the Braves completely drop the ball on every other possible move this offseason. Anything is possible, but I feel pretty confident that that will not happen.
Juan
November 12th, 2012
12:20 pm
Braves Big acquisition already happen guys…….Jordan Schafer..
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
12:21 pm
Made 2.5mil last year, probably 4+ this year. Probably won’t happen, though I wouldn’t mind it.
BravesFanInMaine
November 12th, 2012
12:21 pm
I am so ready for something to happen with the braves like signing a player or a trade just something….. With no hockey my sports life is a little boring right now although I do have the new england patriots to root for!!
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 12th, 2012
12:22 pm
I see the blog is in chicken little mode today.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
12:23 pm
Murph, Napoli would be a good move for the Sox. He could play DH in some sort of platoon with David Ortiz and could share time with Ross. Napoli could also play some firstbase.
Arkansas Transplant
November 12th, 2012
12:24 pm
I think we’d be alright. I just don’t see a need to lock a lot of money down on some guys just because we have that flexibility this year. I really like the club we currently have and some of the prospects that are coming through the system. Olt would fill 3rd base for a long time and Gentry is very good in the outfield.. yes I know, no power but Bourn wasn’t exactly a power hitter himself before this last season. Of course, we could always look at Castellanos from Detroit.
BravePack(FreeFan)
November 12th, 2012
12:25 pm
I think some of this can be attributed to the Falcons losing their 1st game so most on here are unhappy and needing something to cheer them up. Don’t worry Wren is just playing possum…he’s gonna sign Hamilton once his price comes down.
Murph
November 12th, 2012
12:28 pm
Murph, Napoli would be a good move for the Sox. He could play DH in some sort of platoon with David Ortiz and could share time with Ross. Napoli could also play some firstbase.
Sure… but then what happens to Salty? What kind of return will he get them? Seems to be a HR or nothing kind of guy.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
12:38 pm
Wren is just playing possum…he’s gonna sign Hamilton once his price comes down.
I’d prefer a certain pitcher….
The Tigers are “very interested” in Hunter, Knobler writes. They see him as a near-perfect fit for their team, on and off of the field. Detroit has prioritized corner outfield help this winter. The Rangers also have interest in Hunter, who lives in Texas, relatively close to Rangers Ballpark.
No Hunter….. go get Justin Upton, Pence, or Willy
DAP
November 12th, 2012
1:05 pm
murph Sure… but then what happens to Salty? What kind of return will he get them? Seems to be a HR or nothing kind of guy.
maybe nothing. they dont really have a 1st baseman. napoli will likely get most of his ABs there, allowing salty and ross to spilt duties at catcher.
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:06 pm
It’s starting to shape up that the Braves can get back almost all the players they gave up in the Tex trade, just with more mileage and more cost.
DAP
November 12th, 2012
1:08 pm
nolie, are you accusing the ajc headline writer of hyperbole?
phil
November 12th, 2012
1:08 pm
News anchor arrested on DUI charges….
*************
After all these years on the air here, are you kidding me? Absolutely disgraceful.
Allegedly….sigh
Jeff R
November 12th, 2012
1:08 pm
Braves Big acquisition already happen guys…….Jordan Schafer..
Juan, not you too? Really, honestly, truly, you think that Wren has settled on Schafer and is going to shut down the shop the rest of the winter?
Really, honestly, truly?
TennesseePaul
November 12th, 2012
1:10 pm
Bourjos 25runs defensively, 90 offensively, 115 runs 500k
So the Angels are just giving this Adonis away? Awesome. Glad to hear no players need be traded for him.
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:10 pm
I remember the Braves gave up Salty, Andrus, Feliz, and Harrison. I thought there was one extra player in that mix?
Ross->Salty back up catcher
Andrus -> Janish back up SS
Feliz -> Durbin back up closer
Harrison -> Delgado sixth starter
Mmm. Hmm.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:11 pm
Apologize for the long post, but the URL won’t link…
For Braves Fans Hot Stove Season Begins Justin Upton To Atlanta?
Let’s consider this little bit of news from a piece by Corey Brock
“Moving forward, the D-backs will look to add a starting pitcher, left-handed reliever and possibly a third baseman. They certainly have some interesting trade chips to offer if they decide to move Jason Kubel, Gerardo Parra or Upton, who could land the team a big haul if Towers decides to move the 25-year-old right fielder.”
Well that’s interesting, the DBacks want a starter, a left handed reliever, and possibly a third baseman. Today came news that the Diamondbacks are shopping him (Upton) at the GM meetings. Who do we know that might be able to fill those needs?
Piecing It Together
Justin Upton – the most talented of the Uptons, is the brightest of stars rumored to be moved this winter. At 25 years old he won’t be in his prime for another three years and though he had a rough year in 2012 – rough for Justin Upton – you should never doubt the potential and talent he possesses.
At age 21 Upton had a slash of .300/.366/.532 with 26 homers, 86 RBI, 30 doubles, 7 triples, 20 stolen bases in 25 attempts an isolated power (ISO) of .232 and 84 runs scored. That all came together for a 4.8 fWAR (3.8 rWAR). . . at age 21.
In June Ken Kendrick questioned Upton’s performance: “I think Justin is an enigma at this point. I know he had an injury early on and may be a little bit of a nagging injury. But he’s played. He’s certainly not the Justin Upton that he has been in the past and that we would expect of him. He’s 24 years old and it’s time for him to be a consistent performer and right now this year he’s not been that.. . . I know this sounds strange based on the performance not being what we would like and certainly not what he would like, but in terms of his body language, on a certain level, he’s shown a little maturity that in past years, I think he’d be too quick to anger before and emote his feelings and he has been more controlled this year in that regard. Yet the actual performance is less than what we’ve seen in the past and what we would have expected out of him.”
If that was meant to be a pep talk Mr. Kendrick needs to go back to school on leadership. But he wasn’t alone. His on the air rant encouraged others to jump on the beat on Upton because your team isn’t wining band wagon. In July when Upton was just starting to regain form, Doug Franz/Arizona Sports opined that it was time for Upton to stop being the future and start being what he was expected to be. “You do not pay $50 million and bat a player third in the order to get a .273 BA and 37 RBI for a below average-to-bad outfielder. . .”
Really? And they pay you to write these things? Like the experts who wanted to dump Jason Heyward when he was playing injured, they didn’t realize what they had or were just plain not paying attention to what he’s done. Upton got healthy soon after that and by years end the list of outfielders who were close to Upton’s numbers was short.
And they said Justin Upton wasn’t consistently performing?
Of the men who beat him out statistically in the last four years only Braun made less money last year. Braun is in the first year of a $130M plus contract that takes him through 2021. And those experts complained he’s getting paid too much?
Defense
Defensively Upton is no Heyward but there aren’t many in that class. He isn’t however a hack either. Below are his defensive metrics from Fangraphs along with a chart explaining the color coding. I’m not a big fan on UZR in many ways and the numbers are what they are for all players. In this case Tomorrow’s post (that was to be todays but got pushed back for this one) has a lot more introductory information on defensive metrics. For now this quote from the FAQ at the Fielding Bible is a good guide..
“When evaluating a player using any statistic, you should always be aware of the sample size you’re dealing with. As more and more data becomes available, we can make more definitive conclusions. This is especially true of defense. For example, if a player has Plus/Minus numbers of +2, -5, and +4 over the course of 3 seasons, it is a safe bet that he is a league average fielder.”
Mr Franz was wrong again. Both Defensive Runs Saved (DRS) and UZR agree that 2008 wasn’t very good for him. Since that time however they agree that he’s been an above average defender.
The Personal Attack
When Mr. Kendrick implied that his player lacked maturity there was a lack of maturity involved but not from Justin Upton. Since that ad hominem attack leaks from the club have said similar things. I simply don’t believe that and the numbers don’t reflect it. If he’s loafing and putting up those numbers, heaven help the league when he decides to play all out. Don’t let me sway them from trading him to the Braves however, I’ve always said you pay your money and take your chance. Speaking of money and value, what would it take to land him?
Quality is Expensive
Justin Upton will come at the cost of at least three major league ready or high value prospects who will arrive in the next year. If we are to believe the shopping list from Corey Brock’s article I’d expect that they would want Jonny Venters, Julio Teheran or Randall Delgado, Zeke Spruill and perhaps Christian Bethancourt or Juan Francisco. Before you throw up your hands and start screaming ‘it’s the Mark Teixeira trade all over again listen up. Justin Upton is under contract through 2015 ($9.5M, $14.25M, $14.5M) and for this man that is chump change. Upton is worth two of Josh Hamilton or any other free agent out there and certainly worth a million more than Dan Uggla or Brian McCann. He’s also worth more than an often wild left reliever and some prospects.
Twenty years ago Pirates GM Ted Simmons John Schuerholz had completed a deal that would have brought Barry Bonds to Atlanta for outfield prospect Keith Mitchell, pitching prospect Alejandro Pena, and a player to be named. The deal was done and all that was left was the announcements. Pirates manager Jim Leyland wasn’t told about the trade before hand and when he found out he exploded all over Simmon’s desk and I imagine everyone in a 10 mile radius knew it. Everyone knows that the best of the Upton brothers is available so that can’t happen in 2012 and Frank Wren needs to make the deal. . .period. . .that’s the end of that. Justin Upton is that good.
Kevin Towers knows this and he knows that making a team building deal is like this is a one shot thing. Do it right or suffer for it forever. He will talk to everyone and get the best deal he can get and he should. But if the original article is correct and he wants a controllable lefty reliever to solidify his bullpen we can offer him one of the best in Venters. If he wants starting pitching to bridge the gap until his studs are ready he can have Paul Maholm and Tommy Hanson. If he wants prospects he can have Teheran, and Bethancourt. The only exceptions I’d make are Heyward, Mike Minor, Andrelton Simmons, Kris Medlen, Freddie Freeman, Craig Kimbrel and Martin Prado.
Justin Upton makes this team a formidable force again. He takes the load off of Uggla’s bat, provides right handed thump with good on base numbers and as a left fielder he’s top of the line. This opportunity should not, must not, be passed up. Upton is a generational player; no unproven prospect is untouchable. Make this deal Mr. Wren. Make this deal.
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:12 pm
Really, honestly, truly, you think that Wren has settled on Schafer and is going to shut down the shop the rest of the winter?
yes.
Really, honestly, truly?
absolutely.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
1:12 pm
Murph, I’m not sure how much the Sox can get for Saltalamacchia. He’s not a horrible hitter for a catcher but he’s also not a very good hitter, even for a catcher, plus he also doesn’t seem to be a very good defensive catcher.
He has displayed some skills, especially power, and he’s probably worth the risk for some teams. I just don’t know about him for a team in a position to contend.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:13 pm
Of the men who beat him out statistically in the last four years
Those men are…. Votto, Pujols, Konerko, Hamilton, Adrian Gonzalez, Fielder, Miguel Cabrera, Braun. Except for Braun and Votto, each player made 12mil+ last season
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:15 pm
“Like the experts who wanted to dump Jason Heyward when he was playing injured, … “
I’m not sure random bloogers count as experts.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:15 pm
maybe nothing. they dont really have a 1st baseman. napoli will likely get most of his ABs there, allowing salty and ross to spilt duties at catcher.
From MLBTR… Alternatively, the club could rely on a platoon of Mauro Gomez and Jerry Sands at first base, as GM Ben Cherington recently suggested.
I still think they’ll shop Salty
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:17 pm
News anchor arrested on DUI charges….
*************
After all these years on the air here, are you kidding me? Absolutely disgraceful.
Allegedly….sigh
I might have to switch back to Channel2… such a shame
Juan
November 12th, 2012
1:18 pm
Jeff….yes…i don’t think that the Braves going to sign any big name this off season or make any big trade….Same mo…same mo of last year…Braves have the International league Batting Champ on Constanza in LF and the Big White Hope in Schafer in CF.
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:18 pm
Jonny Venters, Julio Teheran or Randall Delgado, Zeke Spruill and perhaps Christian Bethancourt or Juan Francisco
Substitute O’Flaherty, Delgado, Francisco for Upton … get ‘r done Frank.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:25 pm
I’d sub Teheran, I’ve seen Delgado pitch, he’s been good. Not so sure on Teheran though…
But I thought they wanted a veteran starter, Maholm and Hanson together make that happen. Send EOF, and Juan, get back Upton and David Hernandez (RHRP). I’d take that.
Or a 3-way with Cleveland… Asdrubal Cabrera, Maholm, and EOF to AZ, Teheran, Pastornicky, Spruill to CLE, we get Upton, Hernandez, Bauer.
That was probably too unrealistic… Cabrera, Maholm, EOF to AZ, Spruill or Pastornicky (from Braves) and Bauer (from AZ) to Cleveland, we get Upton and Hernandez
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
1:25 pm
Bourjos would be fine if the Braves get a middle-of-the-order bat for leftfield/thirdbase, say if they could somehow get Justin Upton. I can’t see them going after Bourjos if they don’t get a big bat for the other position they are trying to fill.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:28 pm
Correct me if I’m wrong but wouldn’t the DBacks rather have Venters?
Same age, but lesser service time, cheaper, and controllable….
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:28 pm
Preach it Shaun
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:29 pm
I’d see if they had any interest in Teheran, Hanson, Venters, Francisco, and Spruill
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:33 pm
Doesn’t it make it almost next to impossible for the Braves to make another trade for CF if they have already cleaned out the system for say a Justin Upton?
I mean I’m not saying it would take a lot to get Bourjos —- it shouldn’t…but would we really make TWO trades?
I still think 1 player is coming via trade and the other via FA….it just seems to make the most sense….I mean its not like we have an endless amount of cash or an endless amount of specs w/ good return value
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:34 pm
possibly P-Town, but EOF has been more consistent
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
1:36 pm
Just saw DOB responding to some posts from Disgusted. I’m assuming the loss of David Ross is causing him to be exceptionally concerned.
Shaun — It goes deeper than the loss of David Ross. Its a pattern of behavior under this ownership that make me pessimistic about the long term prospectus of the baseball operation as long as this ownership is in charge of the Braves.
Are we tying up some of our young cogs loke other teams are?????? Not to my knowledge.
Are we developing an everyday players in the system since Wren put in his own guy in charge of the system????? Not that I can see. Heyward and Freeman were drafted under the JS regime.
Do you realistically expect a long term committment for Mc Cann and Prado????? Hard to guess yes when you have an ownership staying unbudged wth the same payroll yr in and yr out.
The way Prado keeps getting more and more valuable yr in and yr out — he is gonna really get paid nicely — if not by us than someone else
Not to mention the TV deal.
As for Ross — he will be missed — some of the options available for BU catcher save for Shoppach are just not very good. Laird is not the worst if he still has some of the defensive skills he once had. You see that list — it is not good.
I see a revolving door in the future and in time it will catch up with the record. Wait and see.
I do not care about DOB’s retorts — it means nothing to me. I am not responding to him anymore. I am more interested in what the other bloggers are saying.
And I am not convinced the alleged $25 mil is going to be spend — not after recent empty off seasons.
We remain respectable in spite of the corporate austerity the Braves have to run the team by.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:38 pm
TOBF-
I understand that, but EOF is also closer to FA and is another 2M more expensive…
I see that as a big reason they’d want Venters
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:38 pm
O’Flaherty is going to be more expensive than Venters with less service time before FA. If I had to trade one (which I wouldn’t want to do), I’d trade O’ and hope for a bounce-back year by Venters.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:39 pm
If we can keep Hanson out of the trade for Upton, and possibly not have to involve one of our LHRP, I’m sure that’d be enough to get Bourjos. But you’re probably right, 1 from FA, 1 from trade.
The writer above said that he’d consider trading CBet… I’d try to hold onto him. We may not be able to keep Mac, and the FA market is very poor at the catcher position next year.
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
1:42 pm
http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/story/_/id/8623900/mlb-free-agency-torii-hunter-pick-team-two-weeks-source
Makes sense. He picked the Angels soon that year. I think it was Thanksgiving weekend. Probably take less time now and be on a team before next Thursday.
Not sure when things will fully heat up, but I think we’ll get a couple signings or trades this week. Can’t all happen post-Turkey day.
abeeeewright
November 12th, 2012
1:44 pm
I see Disgusted missed Frank Wren’s last big foray onto the FA market … Lowe and Kawakami.
I see the results for the big name FAs this year to be much the same. Hamilton, Bourn, and others will get looooong contracts at big $$$. Whoever signs them will be trading them at the end of the contract and eating some of the salary, so that they can free a space on the 25-man.
We’re almost at the point where the Yankees are ready to part with Rodriguez and Texiera. They’ve already eaten the end of Burnett’s contract.
In short, any five year FA contract is likely to result in … good performance in the first two years, disturbing drop off in year three, major suckage in year four, and a salary eat trade in year five.
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
1:44 pm
SS prospect Nick Ahmed and 3B Edward Salcedo both in PHX Desert Dogs lineup for today’s AFL game vs. Peoria Javelinas. Starts in about 45 minutes here at Phoenix Municipal Stadium.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
1:45 pm
I don’t know about CBet — he better grow his offensive game fast — immediately if not sooner.
He is slow in developing.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:46 pm
So….Torii Hunter was apparently on Hot Stove….he says he knows who he WANTS to play for and says he will make it quick and be signed up soon….
Anyone have any ideas? I’m gonna guess Texas
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
1:46 pm
And leading off for Peoria is stolen-base record-setter Billy Hamilton, the Reds prospect who’s playing CF out here.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:47 pm
Yikes….
How many errors is Salcedo projected for this afternoon?
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
1:48 pm
David O’Brien @ajcbraves
@votanoel2016 To be clear, I don’t think Swisher is likely target for #Braves. And someone will overpay for him.
I’m hoping they stay clear away from Swisher, Upton and Bourn. Numbers on all three are going to be big, I think. Plus the loss of a draft pick. I know they can’t trade for both LF and CF – but spending big on either of those three isn’t a great idea for our mid-market Braves.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
1:50 pm
I did not miss FW’s foray into the FA market back in 2008, 4 yrs ago.
He was sort of forced into that one cause he really had no options on that staff for 09. We would have been stuck with a rotation of Jo Jo, Charlie Morton, Jose Campillo and some other junk. Only Hudson was worthwile at that time.
We did not know Hanson would have that splash in 09 right away.
Like the Mc Louth deal, it was done with the right intentions, KK was a Q mark from day one.
Lowe did win games and got over 190 IP in both 09 and 10. It was not the total bust some made it out to be — but a big overpay.
No WC in 10 without Derek.
And I do get the Uggla deal, a deal I still like. Also remember the Javy Vaquez salary dump.
Its not all on Wren — I like FW. Fredi too. Wren can only do with what he has to work with.
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
1:51 pm
thoughts on the Justin Upton article Efrim? Agree with the proposal?
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
1:52 pm
Efrim — I think you will get your wish on all three.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
1:53 pm
Disgusted, Andrelton Simmons was drafted under Wren and he could win the next 10 shortstop Gold Gloves. As far as locking up young players, just wait and see. Some of those players aren’t arb-elligible yet and some are arb-elligible this year. It’s the beginning of the offseason so teams haven’t had a chance to sort through what they will offer an arb-elligible player at this point. Patience is a virtue, my friend.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
1:57 pm
Shaun –
Good response and I’m behind you on 99% of it, except the patience part….
In this day and age and w/ all the technological advances we now have, I don’t think many of us have ANY patience these days.
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
1:59 pm
Braves like Torii Hunter, on the field and in clubhouse, but he’s spent his entire career in AL and I can’t see him jumping to NL when teams such as Texas, Boston and Detroit are reportedly in on him. Braves would have to outbid those teams, and I don’t see that happening by any stretch.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
1:59 pm
Efrim, I think Swisher could be reasonably priced or even a steal, but that’s probably more likely to happen with an American League team with more funds than the Braves, as Swisher obviously isn’t a great defensive player so an NL team without a DH might not want to give him what the AL market would. I think his offensive value gets overlooked.
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
2:02 pm
Yikes….
How many errors is Salcedo projected for this afternoon?
I don’t know, we’ll let you set that over-under. I’m told by some folks out here he’s played well defensively, that most of his errors came on plays when he tried to make something happen after getting to balls that most 3B wouldn’t get to, etc. I’m looking forward to watching him play 3B, hopefully get some balls hit his way.
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
2:02 pm
I think Wren has been really good. The only knock on him would be his approach to the draft and giving up of three picks for aging players on two one year and one long term deal. The Glavine and Wagner deals were worse, imo.
P-Town Brave ©
November 12th, 2012
2:02 pm
DOB-
I agree….would be a good fit, but I don’t see it happening….
Plus I think we need more youth (ahem ahem) Justin Upton
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
2:08 pm
Swisher is a fine player – but when you add the loss of a first rounder and a big four or five year deal for a 32 year old – doesn’t make much sense.
Hunter makes sense if the Braves are thinking of going the trade route for a CF and settling for one out of the group of Hunter/Ross/Ludwick.
Murph
November 12th, 2012
2:10 pm
Yikes….
How many errors is Salcedo projected for this afternoon?
Infinity, give or take 1.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
2:11 pm
I get it Shaun.
Its not Wren I point to, its more the parent company and how I am not convinced they have the best interests of winning, the fan experience & interest in the team the way a guy like Arthur Blank has toward the Falcons.
LM has not built that trust with a good part of the fan base. Hence, the skepticisim and cynicisim from me.
These guys have seen what — one game in the time they have been around and that was out in Colorado. That is what I read a while back, so only posting what is what I know.
Heck, I think the ASG as bad as they were with the hockey team actually does really care about the Hawks — whether they are able to do something remains to be seen, but we could have worse basketball ownership.
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
2:14 pm
DOB, let us know how Padres RF prospect Rymer Liriano looks out there. I think he is the main RF for the Peoria team. Although I’m not sure if he is playing today. Would love to have him in a corner outfield spot for us….
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
2:15 pm
DOB, let us know how Padres RF prospect Rymer Liriano looks out there. I think he is the main RF for the Peoria team. Although I’m not sure if he is playing today. — Efrim
He’s in lineup, batting third.
860Braves
November 12th, 2012
2:26 pm
DOB…
Thanks for all of these updates. With regards to Torii Hunter, do you think the Garrett Anderson signing will raise any red flags for Frank Wren? Like, perhaps an aging veteran who has been playing the OF since Bill Clinton was president MIGHT not be a strong signing? What does he see in these aging Angels?
If he is so obsessed with the Angels in the OF, why not trade Hanson for Trout and play him in CF with Hamilton and Justin Upton flanking him? That would allow Prado to back up Chase Headley at 3B if the Padres don’t sign him long-term and give Fredi a good second RH option off the bench after Uggla, who could work in a L/R platoon with Cano if NY has interest in one of our young arms like Jair Jurgjens. Cano and Simmons, or Tulo, would be strong up the middle for Grienke, Medlen, Hudson, Bumgarner and Kawakami. Buster Posey’s familiarity with MadBum should really help smooth the transition to the NL East.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
2:27 pm
Disgusted, of course it’s harder when a team doesn’t have fan-types as owners and are more corporate. But that doesn’t spell doom-and-gloom, necessarily. The Braves have a pretty good front office and a pretty good scouting and player development staff. They can overcome corporate-type ownership and win.
Look at the 2012 season. There wasn’t much separating the Braves from any other NL team. Their loss in the postseason wasn’t because they weren’t good enough to win. One can make a very compelling, if not convincing, case that the Braves were the second-best team in the National League in 2012, even with Liberty Media owning the team.
jfp
November 12th, 2012
2:29 pm
Lew
You seemed to be concerned with Pagans lack of runs saved last year. you need to remember that he had 2 centerfielders (Cabrera and Blanco) playing left with him this year. I think he would be a perfect fit for us, just don’t think we can give him a better deal than the Giants will offer him.
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
2:29 pm
Thanks, DOB. Big fan of his potential.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:29 pm
That writer has a real hard-on for Justin, if his opinion is even close to what the team thinks it is no wonder they want to trade him now. One thing for absolute sure is that he is not the crappy defensive RFer that is being claimed. He is always above +10 and led the Bill James site a year or so ago, and won their voting too that year which panel is composed of 10 very knowledgeable baseball folks. Rated 7th this season. Great range, not as high number of kills as some others. would prolly make a really great LFer
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:34 pm
no I was saying that I had used some hyperbole in the post just B4 it
jfp
November 12th, 2012
2:35 pm
Shaun,
Don’t know if you realize it or not but everything spells gloom and doom for Discusted. We could sign every fee agent on the market and increase our payroll 100 million and we would only win maybe 80 games next year.
Murph
November 12th, 2012
2:38 pm
AL ROY: Trout
NL ROY: Harper
AL Manager: Showalter
NL Manager: Johnson
AL Cy Young: Verlander
NL Cy Young: Dickey
AL MVP: Cabrera
NL MVP: Posey
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
2:41 pm
Billy Hamilton reached on a leadoff bunt, stole 2nd base without a throw on next pitch, then scored on a double. Dude is rocket-propelled. Just crazy speed.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
2:41 pm
Shaun at 2:27 —
Absolutely correct — if anything we beat ourselves in the WC game. Sloppiest game of the yr in a one and done but that just happened — could happen to anyone.
This road to the post season was wide open and it could have been any of the 10 teams.
We would have won in spite of LM, but a win is a win by any account.
Its not gloom and doom yet — but down the road who knows. There are signs that I find disconcerning. Guess I have made my point clear on that.
We still have a good young team — have lost a couple of leadership vets in Chipper and Ross.
Lets stay good.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:42 pm
thanx, now I won’t hafta pay attention….
a bit surprised to learn that Dickey is gonna win it
phil
November 12th, 2012
2:42 pm
Why is it so bad for disgusted to express some real doubt about where this franchise is going?
I swear, I understand that some of us can be way too negative to suit a lot of you, but there is a point at which some of you overreact right back in the other direction.
As I’ve said before, it’s like little girls some of the time….good grief.
So now I’ll overreact a bit….Fire FW!!!
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
2:43 pm
MONDAY: If the sides complete the deal it’s expected to be for about $18MM and three years, ESPN.com’s Buster Olney reports
The Phillies are comfortable paying Josh Hamilton a high annual salary, but they have concerns about committing to the free agent outfielder on a long-term contract, ESPN.com’s Buster Olney reports
TheOnlyBravesFan
November 12th, 2012
2:44 pm
3 years, 18mil for Affeldt. (SanFran)
jfp
November 12th, 2012
2:45 pm
DOB,
Thanks for the tip on Sons of Anarchy, started watching it from that beginning. Almost finished with the second season. They have a way of making each show like it could be season ending. Always keeping you there wanting to see the next one.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
2:46 pm
“News anchor arrested on DUI charges….
*************
After all these years on the air here, are you kidding me? Absolutely disgraceful”.
I hope the person who was hurt is not hurt too bad. Hope that he/she recovers from injuries quickly.
Shaun
November 12th, 2012
2:48 pm
Disgusted, I think there is a decent chance the Braves will be better offensively and defensively, even with the loss of Chipper and Ross.
I don’t mean to discount leadership, I really don’t. I know people will accuse me of not seeing the “human side” of the game for saying this, but I don’t think Chipper and Ross’s losses will hurt the Braves all that much, if the front office does what they are indicating. I guess your argument is that there is no chance that the front office can find good players for left/third and center, and maybe add a pitcher or two. And maybe you are also betting against any of the young players taking steps forward.
Without Beachy they could be worse from the pitching side of things, but I don’t see that aspect of their game taking a major hit, either.
I would be surprised if the Braves don’t go in to the season as they have the last couple of years, with a ~90-win roster.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:48 pm
c’mon man even you must recognize how irritating the constant repetition of the same things can get when a blogger just goes on and on and on and on….
say anything you want, but obsession is ugly no matter what it is about, heck folks get POed at TOBF for it and he is being positive.
DAP
November 12th, 2012
2:49 pm
3 years, 18mil for Affeldt. (SanFran)
uh…wow. that is something right there.
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
2:51 pm
“Why is it so bad for disgusted to express some real doubt about where this franchise is going?”
And that is preciscely how I see the future in a few yrs Phil.
Its not bad to express real doubt cause I am not the only one seeing it this way. Its not like Liberty Media is beloved around here. They aren’t.
BravesFanInMaine
November 12th, 2012
2:51 pm
geez would like to have billy hamilton!!…. thanks for the updates dob!!
Murph
November 12th, 2012
2:54 pm
Affeldt gave up 1 HR in 63 IP with 8 SO/9.
Gotta love a reliever who can keep the ball in the park.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:54 pm
fine Disgusted, but you don’t have to do it very 15 minutes all day long, we get it, actually we got it long long ago
Disgusted
November 12th, 2012
2:57 pm
Shaun — I do not think they will replace Chipper’s presence and OPS.
I do see them going for a platoon type for LF like a Johnny Gomes or Scott hairston, and while flip flopping Prado between LF an third and working a lineup platoon with Francisco and whomever they get for LF.
For CF, if a trade cannot be made there will be a hodge podge of lesser available talent.
We know what BU catchers are available.
I won;t say we won;t win 90 games but will not put the rent $$$$$$ on it. More like 84 to 86.
You could be right —- the games don;t start till next yr.
You have more faith in the establishment of the team than I do. Fair and square.
Efrim
November 12th, 2012
2:57 pm
Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN If the Giants finish their deal with Jeremy Affeldt, it’s expected to be for about $18 million over three years.
Awful. Eric O’Flaherty is doing backflips. He just needs to produce one more solid campaign and he’s set for around $15-18 million.
David O'Brien
November 12th, 2012
2:57 pm
Nice at-bat for Nick Ahmed, hitting third after lineup change. Lined a 2-1 pitch to left for 1st-inning single, puts runners on corners.
nolie
November 12th, 2012
2:58 pm
and I agree entirely, some time in the future the Braves are gonna hit a down time…just like every other freakin’ baseball team in the bigs has done and will do again. You will just hafta man up when that time arrives.