5:38 pm November 2, 2012, by David O'Brien
November 8th, 20127:39 pm
ain’t gonna let you throw in Stone Mtn, I honeymooned there
November 8th, 20127:40 pm
Nolie — These next two drafts are crucial — but that is nothing new that I ahve said.
Got to — I mean really got to build the system with some players again And we cannot waste money on pieces of rubbish like Salcedo — if we can move him as a throw in — move him.
International players are a risk.
November 8th, 20127:41 pm
Dang. No moves.
November 8th, 20127:42 pm
DOWN ON THE FARM
SS NICK AHMED [.293 BA] 1-4
DH ED SALCEDO [.129 BA] 0-4, 2 SO.
This dude is not only embarressing himself, he’s embarressing the BRAVES talent evaluators. Man!
RJRP CORY RASMUS [8.03 ERA] 2.0 IP, 1 SO.
Well than instead of Stone Mountain we will give up the High Museum LOL.
Or better yet, Phillips Arena, the ATL venue that I choose to boycott.
Throw in an old Illya Kovalchuck jersey while you are at it
And some taped reruns of the Neil Boortz show.
November 8th, 20127:44 pm
Wasn’t it four years ago that the PEDS scandel hit the DOMINICAN system of MLB? SALCEDO?
November 8th, 20127:45 pm
they are all a risk, 40% of first round picks never see the bigs and another 40% never amount to much at all, and it just goes down from there.
November 8th, 20127:48 pm
You can get players well after the first round, Hanson was what, a 22nd round pick.
And Mike Piazza, what was he a 62nd round pick way back in the day.
But a good system will get players in all kinds of rounds — the Braves can get this system built back but they have to do better.
November 8th, 20127:51 pm
Hanson was not really a 22rnd pick, he was a draft and follow which they can no longer do. He signed for the money a second or third rounder would have gotten IIRC. Sure you get players at each level but the lower the round the lower the % that bet to the bibs. Its as much an art as a science and can at times seem like a crapshoot
November 8th, 20127:52 pm
Wren should just offer David Ross a 1 year deal for 2.5 million with plate appearance incentives that could add up to another 500k. With a 2nd year Team option for 2 mil with 250k buyout.
November 8th, 20127:53 pm
November 8th, 20127:54 pm
Oh boy, Adam LaRoche has now won a Silver Slugger to go along with his Gold Glove after having a career year. Cha Ching!
November 8th, 20127:55 pm
ROSS – 2 years 5 million
bryan harveys boy sure looks good.
hunter got lots of movement and command
to go with 90 plus speed at 17 yrs
i think bryan scouts for the rockies now though
“DH” – Designated Hitter… should be “Designated 0-fer” in Salcedo’s case.
The guy is sadly pathetic.
November 8th, 20127:57 pm
Dang. No moves.
It’s okay, you can always take dance classes.
I can’t seem to wrap my brain around all of the possible permutations that apply to our situation. My simple mind requires that I reduce it to this: Get a CF with at least a reasonable amount of speed who will capably hit first in the order, and then obtain a LF with some pop so that Prado can go to 3B where he belongs. Delgado, Hanson and some minor league prospects are available for this. Can Wren work within these parameters?
November 8th, 20127:58 pm
And who did the Braves surrender LaRoche for? Mike Gonzalez, as I recall, superstar reliever.
Not the swiftest move.
November 8th, 20128:00 pm
jeff r it was more about not paying laroche , too many bad contracts on the roster
November 8th, 20128:01 pm
ncgary, good point.
November 8th, 20128:02 pm
And who did the Braves surrender LaRoche for? Mike Gonzalez, as I recall, superstar reliever.
Casey Kotchman too.
And that was 5 years ago.
And Gonzalez was their closer. I liked that move.
November 8th, 20128:03 pm
And we also got Lillibridge for LaRoche who we used to help get some guy named Javy Vazquez.
November 8th, 20128:04 pm
Michael Bourn will decline the Braves’ qualifying offer, Bourn’s agent Scott Boras told reporters (including David O’Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution). Bourn, one of nine free agents to be extended qualifying offers by their teams, had until tomorrow to turn down the offer, a one-year/$13.3MM contract. Since Bourn has turned down the offer, the Braves will now earn a compensatory draft pick if Bourn signs elsewhere.
Per MLB Trade Rumors
I’m still trying to understand why the Braves sent Salcedo to the Arizona Fall League. I thought that was a showcase for teams’ rising talents?
….who we flipped for Vizcaino who we flipped for Maholm….
Bourn to decline qualifying offer. Boras says…
i wonder how many free agents would sign here if they knew chipper would be managing
November 8th, 20128:05 pm
I thought that was a showcase for teams’ rising talents?
It’s also a chance to get prospects some work over the winter.
November 8th, 20128:07 pm
Since Bourn has turned down the [qualifying] offer, the Braves will now earn a compensatory draft pick if Bourn signs elsewhere.
So the Braves get a draft choice and the Phils or Nats (I believe likely) are saddled with a big five-year deal for Bourn. Advantage, Braves.
November 8th, 20128:09 pm
That’s what Mexico and Latin America are for – and players of Salcedo’s caliber can get work out of the limelight.
Well I gotta hold Wren to the ole “Only interested in Premium Players” comment. I’m pretty excited cause I’m sure he’ll make a move that none of us have thought of or mentioned. But it will be tricky. We could probably already start taking players off the list as possible additions. Mot of them are premium players.
Justin Upton, were not interested…
Michael Bourn, can’t afford, shouldn’t overpay anyways.
BJ Upton, not a Braves type of player, expensive as well.
Josh Hamilton, not happening
Shin Soo Choo, LHB so likely not a fit, rental
I don’t consider any of the following Premium players, Shane Victorino, Angel Pagan, Cody Ross, Ryan Ludwick, Torii Hunter, Melky Cabrera, Delmon Young…. Of course we could debate a few of these guys but come on, there is risk with all of them. Pagan is the best of the bunch but will likely be overpaid still.
That leaves us with Josh Willingham, Nick Swisher, and Denard Span off the top of my head. So Wren must have some other idea’s.
November 8th, 20128:12 pm
Every draft is important. Whether you have the best system or the worst. Always an opportunity to bring in talent.
November 8th, 20128:14 pm
Span would be acceptable to me. He’s a good talent and affordable.
As to Wren having other ideas, possible. I’m sure that not only is Wren approaching other GMs, but others are approaching him.
Agree Efrim. Every draft is important. Teams that get cheap in the draft and scouting pay the price later on
November 8th, 20128:18 pm
I said way bhck when Wren dumped the old crew and brought in his cronies that the approach would likely change and prolly for the worse.
DH- Doesnt hit (Edward Salcedo)….. What a disgrace. Do better at AA next year, boy. Gonna be tough.
It’s gonna be interesting too see what David Ross does, I can easily see many teams offering more money. He only made 1.6 million in 2012, probably safe to say he’ll double that.
Especially with the Yanks interested. May take 2yrs/6mil.
He’ll get creative. We have been talking about the same players for the longest time, hopefully a few more players that we could use get tossed in the rumor mill.
November 8th, 20128:19 pm
I trusted Wren a lot before I read he traded Delgado for 2 months of Dempster. I shall wait patiently and hopefully that wisdom will prevail and we do get those premium players.
November 8th, 20128:20 pm
I would bet that wren is feeling out pagan’s price range and minnesota’s trade demands for both span and willingham. Pagan and willingham would be a great tandem addition but pagan may be too expensive and willingham may not be affordable in price.
Fowler or span in CF and swisher in LF is another potential tandem. It would be interesting to see how swisher does in the NL. If the braves could get dexter and Nolan for Delgado and ? the braves would probably be listening
November 8th, 20128:21 pm
Wren will probably acquire someone we have not talked About here. Has to if he wants a premiere player
November 8th, 20128:23 pm
Anyone think the braves will talk to dempster in regards to a free agent deal?
Throw some names out there that you could possibly see on the trade block at some point this offseason that would fill a need for us. We need some more ideas. So far as we all know the top 2 most wanted players on the blog is Justin Upton and Josh Willingham…
November 8th, 20128:24 pm
The only work Salcedo’s been doing is walking back to the bench.
November 8th, 20128:25 pm
Agree vabravesfan – has to be someone that we have not thought of yet. We could easily throw out all sorts of crazy ideas such as getting Ryan Braun for package starting with Teheran or Delgado and then the brewers sign hamilton
Bourn will decline his qualifying offer from Braves, which was a foregone conclusion. “The market for him is going to be much greater than a one-year contract,” Boras said when I asked him in the lobby here a few minutes ago.
November 8th, 20128:26 pm
I wouldn’t mind Spann in CF but I would rather sweeten the deal and get Revere. A Torii HUnter in LF would be fine with me too. He isn’t the player he was 5 years ago, but he still can hit with a little power and for a good average. His obp is good. His defense isn’t what it was 5 years ago either but he is still a good OFer. He can play a pretty good LF. — southgabrave
While I don’t think this would be a bad tandem at all if team had budget constraints, I think at this point if they were to trade for Span then they need to spend more of their available funds at get a better hitter to play LF or 3B than Hunter.
One alarming stat about Hunter, which won’t go unnoticed by Braves or other teams that now use all the sophisticated stats in addition to the traditional ones in evaluating players: His BABIP (batting average on balls in play) was a gaudy, highly unusual .389 in 2012, nearly 100 points higher than the previous season (.297). That’s likely to have a major correction in ‘13, back closer to his career .307 or lower I would guess.
I assume salcedo is very available for trade
Braves OF prospect Todd Cunningham is 5-for-7 with a double, two homers and four RBIs the past two nights in Mexican Winter League, batting .298/.441/.553 (.994 OPS) in 47 ABs over 14 games, with three homers and three steals.
November 8th, 20128:27 pm
and chasing down ground balls that he has butchered, that is work too
Wren said Braves haven’t given up on Juan Francisco, will have opportunity to compete in spring training:
“We need him to show a commitment, by coming into spring training in better shape,” Wren said. “We also need to see him continue to work on the swing corrections that Greg Walker put in place at the end of the season and sent him back to the Dominican with. And we’re following up. We’ve had a number of meetings with him in the Dominican to reinforce all those things.
“He’s hired a personal trainer. He’s working out every morning for a couple of hours. And he’s serious about getting himself in the best possible condition coming into spring training.”
November 8th, 20128:28 pm
I vote NO for Fowler, he is complete crap away from Coors…. I wouldn’t mind Pagan on a 2 or 3 year deal around 7 million a year tho, he would be a huge downgrade defensively in CF and probably should play a corner spot to be honest. The only thing he’s great at is baserunning and he’s already 31 years old. Still a solid all around player but nothing special in my opinion.
is Cunnibgham playing center do you know?
November 8th, 20128:30 pm
I hope DOB did not get rid of Wayne because of his remarks after the election. Wayne is a good guy and good poster.
What made you say that (before the fact)?
I trusted Wren a lot before I read he traded Delgado for 2 months of Dempster
Me. Too!!!! Wren was an absolute ninja for most of his trades (Jurrjens and a prospect for Renteria??!) but my gosh……Delgado for a rental of Dempster? I wouldn’t even do that if Dempster was signed through 2013. Yuck.
good for cisco, how if he could just learn what is a ball and what is a strike and which you are s’posed to swing at
November 8th, 20128:31 pm
because I was aware of how those guys drafted
November 8th, 20128:33 pm
Wonder if Todd Cunningham can do enough in Winterball to affect Wren’s offseason plans. After last offseason he said Pastor wasn’t ready to then changing his mind a week or 2 later and naming him our starting Shortstop. Cunningham is at that age where he should be close to making the 25 man roster, but most of us just see a 4th OFer at best in the bigs.
November 8th, 20128:34 pm
Jason Bay. Will he get a free agent offer? Non-guaranteed, contingent on making a club? Or will he just get to choose between a handful of invites to spring training?
Looked at his pre-2010 stats, just to get reminded. Wow.
I do NOT want them passing on signing a CFer because of Cunningham or a LFer cause of Gattis. That way lies madness….
November 8th, 20128:35 pm
November 8th, 20128:36 pm
Nice. Cunningham doing it right south of the border.
You guys heard it here 1st- Francisco is our 3B and Cunningham is our CF.
November 8th, 2012
“……It’s also a chance to get prospects some work over the winter.
That’s what Mexico and Latin America are for – and players of Salcedo’s caliber can get work out of the limelight……”
Except here on the blog that never sleeps. Nowhere to run and nowhere to hide.
Could Jason Bay be the Mets’ Melky Cabrera? Come into town, suck for 2 or 3 years, leave, and then pound the ball?
November 8th, 20128:37 pm
DeMacio had poor drafts for Baltimore. I believe he did draft Markakis, though. But overall, not good. We are unlikely to see someone different unless Wren is no longer the GM.
100% agreed, hey we could gamble on Jason Bay as the RH power guy for LF, just like we did with Troy Glaus lol …
November 8th, 20128:39 pm
The pics of Juan do look better…. But I thought he wasn’t fat! Really hope he isn’t the answer at 3B. Needs better plate awareness. But 25 mil to spend on CF and pitching…. Oh my.
From the side blog…….
Longtime Twins fan here. I watch most of the Twins games and Josh Willingham is every bit as frustrating as Dan Uggla. It seems nobody strikes out with RISP more often than JW. He does hit a lot of home runs, but it’s usually when they’re way behind and the other team’s pitcher is grooving fastballs to get the game over with. You also need a late-inning defensive replacement for JW because he makes Matt Diaz look like a Gold Glover. On the other hand, Span is a great guy on and off the field, but he is an injury waiting to happen.
SOUTH OF THE BORDER
RHSP JULIO TEHERAN [6.75 ERA] 3.2 IP, 7 H, 3 R/ER, 2 BB, 3 SO.
I don’t know who’s worse today, SALCEDO or TEHERAN. Wretch!
damn it CB, now I gotta get a refill on my depression meds….
Liberty Media has decided to make Frank Wren name Todd Cunningham as the starting CFer who will split time with Jordan Schafer and to sign Jason Bay to be the LFer with Constanza all while reducing the Braves payroll by 20 million in 2013 hahaha..
November 8th, 20128:41 pm
At least JUAN FRANCISCO [.310 BA] is becoming much more consistant at the plate. 1-2 tonight with a double so far.
November 8th, 20128:43 pm
The Rangers, Mariners and three other teams have “serious interest” in free agent Nick Swisher, reports Mark Feinsand of the New York Daily News (via Twitter). Unsurprisingly, Swisher plans to reject the Yankees’ qualifying offer and look for a long-term contract on the open market.
Nice to see someone performing well in Winter Ball. Makes Rev and Salcedo’s failures sting less!
And now Teheran…. The struggles continue. What’s wrong?
whats his OBP?
CUNNINGHAM is in CF nolie MEXICAN LEAGUE, HERMOSILLO ORANGES.
November 8th, 20128:44 pm
Swisher in LF and Victorino for CF would make me happy
November 8th, 20128:45 pm
Anyone holding out hope or still buying the Greinke rumors or asking about other starting pitchers, here’s Wren on subject:
“We’re not in the pitching market. We may need a bullpen arm, but other than that we’re out of the pitching market. We’re happy with our pitching.”
don’t really wanna give up a pick for da Swish
November 8th, 20128:46 pm
.326 OBP – fair
November 8th, 20128:47 pm
HIDE THE MEDS FROM TOBF.
November 8th, 20128:50 pm
For once, Wren needs to focus on offense. Pitching is fine. Heck, OFFENSE needs to be picked in 1st round next year’s draft.
Juan’s played LF before I believe…. If he is gonna be a starter (please no) play him in LF. His below avg defense will be fine there. Upgrade the IF defense by adding Prado. And maybe with the weight loss and new trainer, he’d be able to cover a bit more ground out there.
Wonder who that trainer is…. Hopefully not Melky’s or Balco Bonds…
The other day I mentioned Nick Swisher for 3 years 40 million or less and I’d be good with that, but I forgot about the loss of draft pick. I’m not in favor of adding him that much now. I don’t think Wren would be either. So now our top list is down to only Josh Willingham and Denard Span lol
November 8th, 20128:51 pm
unfortunately the difference between 310 and 326 means he still can’t take a walk and when his BA drops the number of outs he makes will skyrocket
November 8th, 20128:52 pm
I am still campaigning for Victorino!!!
Would yall rather give Pagan 4 years 40 million or Victorino 2 years 16 million? My answer would be neither.
November 8th, 20128:53 pm
Sounds to me like they are looking to add 1 player via trade and 1 via free agency. So the best bet would be to get the FA signed up first, as there seems to be a limited number that would fit our needs. Bourn and Pagan for CF. Maybe Victorino, but he quite possibly is in decline. And for LF it’s Swisher, Ross and Hamilton (too much $). Maybe Boss Man Jr for LF.
Trade candidates are all over the board, with Span and Fowler getting the most attention by speculating bloggers.
I’d sure love to see us get our backup catcher and utility OF’er signed. If not Reed Johnson, maybe we could look into Scott Hairston.
DOB: Any thoughts about how the Braves will cover the catching duties while Mac rehabs? I guess that decision might be made in the spring, depending on how Bethancourt and Gattis do.
he had 21 chances in LF in the minors and a few at first
November 8th, 20128:54 pm
I wouldn’t mind Victorino on a 1 year deal around 6-8 million. After his bad season and declining bat speed I wouldn’t do a 2 years. Good bet he’d be a expensive 4th OFer in 2014.
November 8th, 20128:56 pm
VA and Chris
I’d take THE Angel Pagan for 4/40 over Victorino. Victorino’s last years numbers really fell off significantly over his career norms. Maybe it was a fluke, but do we want to risk it?
one year guaranteed and one team option would be Ok I guess
I hope that rotation works…. I’ll believe it when I see it.
.326 obp? And he’s hitting .310?
For once, Wren needs to focus on offense. Pitching is fine. Heck, OFFENSE needs to be picked in 1st round next year’s draft….BFChris
That I definitely agree with. But with few really good hitting options available, I’d still take a look at upgrading my rotation. Bet we get another pitcher first next year though LOL
Pagan would be decent choice, but I want Victorino.
Whether his bat speed is slowing down or not, I feel there’s other variables to Shane than just that. I think being in the NL East against his former team would light a fire under him, he’d have a chance to revamp himself in a lineup where he won’t be depended on as he was for a while in Philly and I think health slowed him down a bit last year, but I believe he is fully healthy now or is on the verge.
Plus he is a pest to the opposition and doesn’t give away at bats, he grinds and makes pitchers work.
November 8th, 20128:58 pm
Trading for Coco Crisp could possibly be just as good as signing Victorino or Pagan…. It’s not a stretch to be honest.
November 8th, 20129:00 pm
His numbers fell off due to injuries I think. Shane was battling injuries and it caught up to him. I think if he were to be signed to Atlanta, he’d have a lot of intangibles he could bring to the team.
And the same thing can be said for Pagan, was his year a sign of things to come or was it a fluke and he may regress down the line. I know may not be likely, but he’s no guarantee either as is Shane.
Both are risks, but I’d rather have Shane on a shorter contract than Pagan on a longer contract.
November 8th, 20129:02 pm
Nolie: What’s your opinion on trading for bench players? Supposedly Schumaker and Betemit are available, and I’d also look into Ryan Doumit.
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