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TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
10:29 am
ESPN Stats & Info @ESPNStatsInfo
Cano, A-Rod, Granderson combined for 8 hits in 81 AB this postseason. Before his injury in Game 1, Derek Jeter had 9 hits…
They got issues in that lineup.
Wouldn’t it be nice, though, just every once in a while, to be able to get a K with men at 2B and 3B?
Hanson used to do that as I recall. Miss it. We need to get a guy who can throw at least 92-93 consistently. I know of a few, particularly one in A….
Lew
October 15th, 2012
10:30 am
Jeff R – I agree. Best starting pitching in the NL for much of the season, yet couldn’t get runners in scoring position in. More pitching will not improve that one bit. It’s the offense that needs the work eave the pitching for next winter when you have to replace Maholm and Hudson.
Got no problem drafting some 100 MPH throwing starters though.
David O'Brien
October 15th, 2012
10:30 am
Not when the entire rotation and system has no starters that can break 90mph. That’s just stupid. Overkill.
I assume you’re exaggerating to make a point, because Beachy, Medlen, Minor, Delgado and Teheran, just to name guys with major league experience, all work in the low- to mid-90s wtih regularity. And several in the minor league system throw as hard or harder, including J.R. Graham (mid-90s), Zeke Spruill and Sean Gilmartin.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
October 15th, 2012
10:30 am
JeffR—
Oh goody…
Murph
October 15th, 2012
10:42 am
And several in the minor league system throw as hard or harder, including J.R. Graham (mid-90s), Zeke Spruill and Sean Gilmartin.
I was under the impression that Gilmartin was lucky to break 90.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
10:42 am
I assume you’re exaggerating to make a point
Of the current five projected starters for next year, there isn’t a single one who will sniff 93. On his best day. They’re all basic 88-91 fastball guys.
Jeff R
October 15th, 2012
10:47 am
I don’t think anybody is disagreeing with that, Jeff. And if it turns out to be an either/or choice, then offense it is.
But I happen to think there might be a way to do both.
scoots, I’m all for improving the Braves on all fronts. But based on what I’ve seen reported, I think Wren has the budget to address the offense. I don’t think he can or will address the offense and make upgrades to the pitching (such as are needed).
Maybe Wren will surprise us.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
10:48 am
I assume you’re exaggerating to make a point, because Beachy, Medlen, Minor, Delgado and Teheran, just to name guys with major league experience, all work in the low- to mid-90s wtih regularity.
Hudson, Medlen, Minor, Maholm and Hanson are all 86-91mph guys. With 91 being what they touch on occasion.
And several in the minor league system throw as hard or harder, including J.R. Graham (mid-90s), Zeke Spruill and Sean Gilmartin.
I know Graham works there. I didn’t think Spruill or Gilmartin work near that level of velocity. Gilmartin was 86-88mph in August according to scouts per Baseball America.
Matt the Brave
October 15th, 2012
10:49 am
So, essentially get two older outfielders to replace younger ones. Sounds like a great plan to me. How about this? The rumor mill says that Dexter Fowler is on the market. Package Teheran, Hanson, and a low-level position player for Fowler and a prospect bullpen arm. Gives the Rockies what they need (starting pitching this year) and gives the Braves a CF with good upside.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
10:51 am
And I was exaggerating, given that we have Luke Sims, Alex Wood, Mauricio Cabrera, Luis Merejo as starting pitching prospects who can touch 93mph+.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
10:52 am
If anyone was wondering if the 2nd wild card was a good idea, well, guess you’re not wondering anymore. While the Cards are happy they got in as the #2 and lucky at that, the Braves were the unlucky ones for sure. But having said that there is no way Atlanta would have been doing what the Cards are doing. They just aren’t built that way. Not yet. St Louis has legitimized the 2nd wild card for all going forward. Had the roles been reversed Atlanta would already be out and fans all over would have been screaming about the 2nd wild card and how it’s not needed. Kudos to St Louis.
A one-game playoff is a bad idea, regardless of the results. It’s even clearer in the American League. The team with the 7th-best regular season record, in spite of playing in the weakest division in the league, got a pass in the one-game round. Now Detroit may have advanced anyway, but at least make them play in the one-game playoff because they were clearly the worst regular season team in the playoffs in 2012.
Why is it clear that the Braves couldn’t have done what the Cardinals have done, had they gotten past that one game? What in the way that the Braves were built suggest they had as worse a shot as any other NL playoff team?
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
10:53 am
Teheran in a deal for Fowler? Wow, your trade proposal is even worse than Efrim/scoots!
I think Wren has the budget to address the offense. I don’t think he can or will address the offense and make upgrades to the pitching (such as are needed).
Well, there aren’t really any “premium” players available, ya know, the guys making 12+mil. We have about 22mil to spend, 31 if we trade Hanson and Maholm. More than enough to add a good LF, a young CF, and a top SP.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
10:53 am
Got no problem drafting some 100 MPH throwing starters though.
They went the route of ceiling in 2012. Sims and Wood aren’t safe, high floor guys, imo. There is risk there, and they took it. That made me happy. We have plenty of high floor guys in the upper minors.
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
10:54 am
“The rumor mill says that Dexter Fowler is on the market.”
Yeh, when I actually looked into that last week it wasn’t a welcome sight. The guy basically has massive numbers at Coors Field, and below Michael Bourn numbers on the road. Not to mention I don’t think he has the speed or defensive abilities that Bourn does.
Career Away numbers: .248/.331/.367/.698
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
10:55 am
Teheran in a deal for Fowler? Wow, your trade proposal is even worse than Efrim/scoots!
Good god man, I’d trade Delgado straight up for Willingham tomorrow and not think twice about it. We trying to win in 2013 or what?
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
10:56 am
“Why is it clear that the Braves couldn’t have done what the Cardinals have done, had they gotten past that one game? What in the way that the Braves were built suggest they had as worse a shot as any other NL playoff team?”
One word and a smiley: CLUTCH!
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
10:59 am
We trying to win in 2013 or what?
No, they want to get “bang for the buck” and rate very high in third-order wins. Where are your priorities, pal?
Jeff R
October 15th, 2012
11:00 am
Absolutely, Lew @ 10:30 am.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:00 am
Mike Minor lead the Braves starters with an average fastball velocity of 90.3mph. Kris Medlen was 2nd with 90.0mph.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:02 am
One word and a smiley: CLUTCH!
Well played.
Anyone see Delmon Young’s interview after Game 1 of the NLCS? He was asked something like how the Tigers kept their focus, kept battling etc., after blowing the lead in the 9th. He said something like, “we’re big leaguers. We’re supposed to.”
Thank you, Delmon. You’ve done so much for me this postseason. You’ve shown us why we shouldn’t pay attention to postseason stats. Why one-game, one-and-done games should never be played in MLB (because players as bad as Delmon Young could have a great game and precipitate an inferior team advancing). How players truly look at performing when the pressure is on.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:02 am
Good god man, I’d trade Delgado straight up for Willingham tomorrow and not think twice about it.
I mean, there’s a rumor that the Rangers would trade Derek Holland, a ML starter under contract for four flippin’ years for one year of Jacoby Ellsbury.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:03 am
I’d have traded Delgado and Minor for Pence… would have really considered Teheran for Greinke. Doesn’t mean those would have been the right decision. And those guys are younger (less risky) decisions than Willingham.
As a mid-market team, I don’t think we can afford to miss on many trades. We’re not really able to go out into free-agency and fill our needs efficiently. Not that rich a team. If I’m trading a top prospect (or former top prospect), it will be for a player in their prime, w/ a good chance for an extension.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:04 am
No, they want to get “bang for the buck” and rate very high in third-order wins. Where are your priorities, pal
We have to destroy the other GM in a trade, is what I’m guessing. Can’t just give up value for value. It’s gotta be the perfect trade – all the time.
And seriously, it’s okay to strive for such, but some folks are obsessing over making a trade that puts Frank Wren at the tops of the GM rankings. Again, I’d like to keep a couple in the system(Teheran and Graham), but I’m tired of seeing other teams fans having joy in October.
We gotta friggin win, man. And that means putting together a club that beats a 98 win Nationals team, because clearly the Atlanta Braves insulted the Baseball gods – so let’s maximize our chances.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:04 am
it will be for a player in their prime
Name one.
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
11:06 am
I haven’t followed the Tigers all year, but they were picked by most to advance to the World Series and/or win it. That offense is built to win games in the playoffs and with Verlander pitching 2 or 3 games in a series, watch out.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:07 am
Not that rich a team. If I’m trading a top prospect (or former top prospect), it will be for a player in their prime, w/ a good chance for an extension.
You understand that above average players in their prime are rarely traded and when they are, it’s for much more than Randall Delgado. You must understand this, right? You empty your farm system for those players. It hurts the org., bad.
I’m all for finding those players, but it’s going to cost a lot more than folks here are going to be able to deal with.
David O'Brien
October 15th, 2012
11:09 am
Among NL starters, #Braves Hanson tied for highest opp. OBP (.344), 2nd in highest opp. slugging percentage (.454).
Hudson tied with Matt Cain and A.J. Burnett for 3rd-lowest opp. slugging percentage (.361).
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:09 am
Holland averaged 92.6mph on his fastball this year, 94.1 last year… who could we trade them, if the Rangers would be that “dumb”
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:12 am
who could we trade them, if the Rangers would be that “dumb”
Any CF who can take the place of Josh Hamilton. Got one of those to spare?
Lew
October 15th, 2012
11:12 am
Interesting – Just went to Fangraphs (yes, we dinosaurs can use iot for comparison – if nothing else). They have Minor listed first among Braves starters and it seems that – velocity wise, anyway – Minor’s closest comparisons are Tim Lincecum and Adam Wainwright.
Not so sure that it’s the velocity, but the difference in speeds of their pitches and all are in the low 90’s with their fastballs, but drop off to about 83 on sliders and change ups and drop down to 73 on their curves compared to fastballs.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:12 am
Hudson tied with Matt Cain and A.J. Burnett for 3rd-lowest opp. slugging percentage (.361).
Not a heavier fastball in the league than Matt Cain’s. Guy is nails.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:12 am
DOB with some more ugly stats on Hanson. Taking over my job.
Not seeing how he’s traded for anything but “salary relief”
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:13 am
No, they want to get “bang for the buck” and rate very high in third-order wins. Where are your priorities, pal?
Strawman alert!
No one has ever said teams are trying to rank high in third-order wins. Third-order wins are just one way to measure how well a team has played, and they attempt to take things that have nothing to do with how well a team played baseball but could influence wins and losses out of the equation.
As far as bang for the buck, all teams are to some degree tying to get as much bang for the buck as possible. Obviously it depends on a team’s budget as to how much we should care about this when evaluating a front office. I could care less if the Yankees or Angels are getting as much bang for the buck as other teams because they don’t need to worry about such things.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:14 am
Holland averaged 92.6mph on his fastball this year, 94.1 last year… who could we trade them, if the Rangers would be that “dumb”
He’s had some shoulder issues. I love the guy, and think it would do him a world of good to get out of Arlington, though.
That team needs pitching, though. They’ll go hard after Greinke, I think. Them and the Angels battle to the end.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:17 am
Average fastball velocity for starters: http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=pit&lg=all&qual=y&type=4&season=2012&month=0&season1=2012&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0
Mike Minor is rankled 64th among 88 qualifiers. Hudson is ranked 76th. Maholm ranked 83rd.
Lew
October 15th, 2012
11:18 am
Well, if trading Hnson actually relieved salary – but it really doesn’t.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:19 am
Name one.
Corey Hart. Alex Gordon (LH).
Heck, throw in Span for Willingham and I’m game w/ a Delgado+ trade.
You understand that above average players in their prime are rarely traded and when they are, it’s for much more than Randall Delgado.
Pence got traded… all we had to do was add in Minor. (Granted, I still believe our deal was better than the Phils). I love MM, but I’m sure that trade would have helped us greatly. Still have Gilmartin behind him.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:19 am
Strawman alert!
Joke alert, actually.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:19 am
When adjusted to 150 min. IP, Strasburg lead the league at 95.7mph: http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=pit&lg=all&qual=150&type=4&season=2012&month=0&season1=2012&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:20 am
Corey Hart. Alex Gordon (LH).
You’re definition is a lot different than mine, TOBF.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:23 am
Efrim, just looking at some teams who got very little out of the shortstop position, I could see a Andrus-for-Justin Upton trade, in some form.
monty
October 15th, 2012
11:23 am
Walt Coogan-”Teheran’s stuff may have been worse simply because he proved unmotivated by the prospect of a second season at Triple-A. Hopefully he has learned a lesson and will be more focused moving forward, but at twenty-one, he is too young to give up on”
Let’s see, 21 and unmotivated. In other words he was pouting. Probably many poor relatives back home depending on him being “motivated”, but he chose not to be. Hum. Sounds like a winner in my book. Compare him with say Kris Medlen. Your’re a starter, no you’re a reliever, no what I meant was you’re a starter, arm surgery and out a year, you’re a reliever, no you’re a starter, no you’re really a reliever, ok you can start. All that time he never lost his motivation. Now, that’s a winner in my book.
No pouty face there.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:25 am
No pouty face there.
I don’t know that anyone has ever questioned Teheran’s work ethic. Maybe O’Brien has heard something about it, but nothing like that has ever made it into print from any other source.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:26 am
Well, if trading Hnson actually relieved salary – but it really doesn’t.
True. I don’t think the 3.5mil on him will be a problem. Just in my opinion, that’s the kinda “prospect” we can get for him via trade right now.
Average fastball velocity for starters:
David Price leading the way…. there has to be a 3way trade that works where we get him.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:29 am
David Price leading the way…. there has to be a 3way trade that works where we get him.
Sure. And I’m sure it’s where we keep Teheran, Delgado, Graham and Gilmartin………………
George_George
October 15th, 2012
11:29 am
DAN PATRICK has a country singer on his program now named JASON ALDEN who says he hangs out with our CHIPPER.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:31 am
And I’m sure it’s where we keep Teheran, Delgado, Graham and Gilmartin
Well…yeah. If Jesus could hit a curveball, even He wouldn’t be worth a “top prospect” to some of these folks, LOL.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:31 am
Well, Gordon would solve our LF situation through at least 2015, possibly 2016. Hart could be extended through 2017.
it will be for a player in their prime…Name one.
Oh, and how could I forget Wil Myers! I’d trade Delgado, Teheran, Spruill, and prospects for him.
It’s okay to dream, right?
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:31 am
DOB with some more ugly stats on Hanson. Taking over my job.
Not seeing how he’s traded for anything but “salary relief”
Hanson’s not making much anyway.
I could see a team giving up something fairly useful, maybe a major league bench player or something like that. Hanson is cheap and still has the foundation to be a good major league pitcher. His strikeout rate was still very respectable, his walk rate isn’t bad. To me it’s a matter of whether the Braves feel he’s going to be healthy. I think either he’s not fully recovered or he tinkered his delivery to keep from getting hurt again or a little of both. He may already be worn down, so maybe it would be best if the Braves move him for whatever they can get. Or maybe they won’t get as much as he’s likely to be worth, even if he won’t be worth all that much.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:33 am
I don’t know that the Braves have enough that they’d be willing to give up to get Gordon. Maybe the Royals surprise me and give him up for a lot less than it seems they could get.
PDOG
October 15th, 2012
11:34 am
Unless the Braves can trade Hanson I want no part of trading pitching, Delgado or Tehran no. If the braves don’t sign Bourne why can’t they get Victorino to play center and try and sign Hunter for LF. I know everyone wants to win right away but trading your young prospects is not the way to go. I for one like the kids and want the Braves to built from within and trade and sign players just to fill in. Also I want them to lock up Heyward, Freeman, Prado, long term.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:35 am
Sure. And I’m sure it’s where we keep Teheran, Delgado, Graham and Gilmartin…
Now now. I’d consider trading all but Graham in that case. I’ll be a disloyal Seminole fan and trade Gilmartin. Price has 3 more years of control, throws hard, and has pitched remarkably well in the AL East. Only 27, if we can still afford him later, good age for an extension.
George_George
October 15th, 2012
11:36 am
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:02 am
I would like to have ELLSBURY patroling CF at THE TED next season.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:36 am
Gordon would solve our LF situation
If the “situation”called for a doubles-power LHH, you’d be right. Since the Braves need a guy who is all the way around the world from that, you aren’t.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:37 am
I’m not a whacked-out prospect hugger! I just want them traded in good situations.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:41 am
Gordon would solve any leftfield situation for any team. He’s one of the game’s better players, in spite of what ncscoots says. That’s also why the Braves are unlikely to trade for him. The Royals could and should ask for quite a haul.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:43 am
I’m not a whacked-out prospect hugger! I just want them traded in good situations.
Perfect situations.
I could see a team giving up something fairly useful, maybe a major league bench player or something like that.
I was thinking some sort of stud RH relief prospect, or a present young RH reliever who is on a team with a deep bullpen. Not sure who that player is. Aaron Crow comes to mind.
George_George
October 15th, 2012
11:44 am
My realinement plan to replace the awfull 2 WC post-season. repost
East Div
NYM, PHI, WAS, PIT.
Central Div
MIL, CHI, STL, COL.
West Div
LAD, SF, ARI, SD.
Southern Div
ATL, CIN, MIA, NO.
Each team would play teams in thier division 18 times=54 games. they would play all other teams in league 6 times = 72 games, they would play 6 AL teams 6 times = 36 games playing a total of 162 games. There would be no WC teams, the 4 division winners would play 4 of 7 sreies, those winners would play a 4 of 7 series. then on to WS.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:44 am
Efrim, Crow would be solid return for Hanson.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
11:47 am
Gordon would solve any leftfield situation for any team. He’s one of the game’s better players, in spite of what ncscoots says. That’s also why the Braves are unlikely to trade for him. The Royals could and should ask for quite a haul.
Lots of his value in defense the last year. Would like to see some more power and better vs. LHP – wasn’t great in 2012, but better in 2011. I just can’t get on board with a lineup where we have so many middle of the order bats that are LHH’s. Not smart.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:47 am
When Shaun is on my side, I’m not sure if I should be glad or afraid…
It solves that situation because we don’t have to find another LF until 2017. He hits .300, with doubles power, and some good HR power as well. He’ll drive in runs. Heyward and Freeman will both be better next year, Uggla and Mac can’t be as bad as they were, and Simmons should hit capably.
I think our offense will be fine next year. Willingham doesn’t really need to be our main power hitter, even if he’s RH. I think Jason could hit 35. Victorino, Pagan, Jay can all be guys who come in and hit well vs. lefties. Much “cheaper”
Lew
October 15th, 2012
11:47 am
George-George – Given Ellsbury’s playing time two of the past three years, there’s little guarantee that he would patrol anything other than the Disabled List. Very good player when healthy – unfortunately, that’s a rare occurence two of the past three seasons.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:48 am
George_George, the thing I don’t like about having so many divisions is that you will likely get at least one or two very weak division winners and one or two very strong second or even third-place teams.
I’m all for doing away with divisions, going with a balanced schedule, seeding playoff teams by record and expanding the playoffs to as many games as the schedule and weather will allow.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:50 am
He’s one of the game’s better players, in spite of what ncscoots says.
You try hard, but that reading comprehension thing just keeps slipping away from you.
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
11:50 am
Mike Minor for Hunter Pence? Nah, don’t think so. Bad deal. Mike Minor was the 3rd best pitcher in the majors in the 2nd half of the season. He’s still young and learning how to pitch, could get even better. Who knows. But it is good to see him succeeding. And it is good to see the Braves with a couple of lefty starters. Heck if we can’t throw the ball harder than 89 as a staff, at least we can switch between lefty and righty pitchers.
flange1
October 15th, 2012
11:51 am
What we think prospects are worth is not important.
What the Braves think they are worth is important.
And FW showed us what he thinks Delgado was worth by trading him (unsuccessfully) for Ryan Dempster, a 35 year old pitcher that would have been under team control for 3 months.
Again NOT a short term position player that could have played all of the games left in the season, a starting pitcher that would pitch in 1/5th of those games.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:53 am
Heck if we can’t throw the ball harder than 89 as a staff, at least we can switch between lefty and righty pitchers.
…and see gap doubles to both alleys.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:53 am
Efrim, I would think Gordon’s overall game would be more than worth dealing with his deficiencies, although I do agree the ideal would be a right-handed version of Gordon. But, again, it’s a moot point because Gordon isn’t going anywhere without the Braves giving up a ton.
The problem I see with Ellsbury is that there are too many red flags for the Red Sox to give him up for equal value. He’s an extraordinary talent but they aren’t getting an extraordinary return, so why deal him, if you’re in their shoes?
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
11:55 am
ncscoots, if the Braves could get Gordon, they should do it, and not be all that concerned about his deficiencies. The problem is they couldn’t get him for what they’d be willing to give up. The fact that he’s left-handed, etc., is nitpicking in the case of Gordon because he’s so strong in other areas.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
11:55 am
Perfect situations.
Nah, not really. Just not ones that have potential to go bad. Pence and Greinke weren’t perfect, yet I was for those trades.
I was thinking some sort of stud RH relief prospect, or a present young RH reliever who is on a team with a deep bullpen
Ryan Cook (OAK), David Hernandez (ARI), Frieri (LAA) All 3 are high strikeout guys, a plus.
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
11:59 am
The problem is they couldn’t get him for what they’d be willing to give up.
Good. No reason to bring his name up again, then.
Murph
October 15th, 2012
12:00 pm
The problem is they couldn’t get him for what they’d be willing to give up.
Unless you have a hotline that goes directly to Wren’s desk, I doubt you know what they’d be willing to give up for Gordon, or anyone else for that matter.
Wren showed with the Dempster trade that he’s willing to deal those we once thought to be off the table.
It wouldn’t surprise me to see him offer up anyone to get the right deal done.
richbrave
October 15th, 2012
12:03 pm
ncscoots
October 15th, 2012
9:22 am
“…..rich, do you have the rosters of the Dominican teams? I believe Teheran and Delgado are pitching there this winter……”
SCOOTS:
I haven’t seen them yet, and I sorta’ kinda’ scanned all the rosters before this weelend.
Google up Caribbean Winter Leagues and click on the search string, then pick a league followed by ‘roster.’
That’s what I did for each team in each league DOMINICAN. MEXICAN, PUERTO RICO and VENEZUELAN.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
12:05 pm
Murph, obviously I don’t know for sure. But I think it’s so unlikely that the Braves would give up what it would take. Gordon ain’t Dempster.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 15th, 2012
12:08 pm
Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS
glad to see braves execs rewarded. wren extended, manno/coppolella promoted. stayed a winner w/ same $90M payroll for 6 yrs
Kat
October 15th, 2012
12:12 pm
So a Yankee fan’s explanation to me as to why the attendance was lack luster at the last two games is not because of the price (since there were $25 tickets on stub hub — someone mentioned on Twitter) but because of the expectation that they will get to the WS so no need to go to playoff games. Not a shock to me that that’s their attitude since I live around these folks and know it’s an all or nothing thing with most of them.
Must say I’m enjoying the Tiger’s effort. Makes work nice to come into. No talk of baseball by any Yankee fans.
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
12:14 pm
“Heck if we can’t throw the ball harder than 89 as a staff, at least we can switch between lefty and righty pitchers.
…and see gap doubles to both alleys.”
Well if they are throwing 93-98 you don’t have to worry about those hits being doubles to the alleys. Fans just get more souvenirs.
Murph
October 15th, 2012
12:15 pm
I think it’s just as unlikely that Wren goes into next season with an OF that’s 2/3 scrubs. He simply can’t go the aged veteran, once had a name but is one or two years away from retirement route again.
Wren is going to bring some talented players to the team… and given the lack of young, talented players available on the FA market, he’s going to have to trade. I’m sure Wren knows than we do what the cost of talent will be.
It’s up to him. Trades that retain the top “prospects” aren’t likely to bring the return that Wren needs to fix the problems entirely.
Maybe he doesn’t need to make up 100% for the loss of Chipper’s and Bourn’s production to make it to the postseason. Seems that things were close enough the last season that he’d want to try and eclipse their total production to go into 2013 with any feeling of confidence about the team making the postseason.
Replacing that production won’t be cheap. Bettering that production is going to be downright expensive.
Gonna make for an interesting December.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
12:15 pm
Kat, I think that’s kind of what happened with the Braves. The first round lost it’s appeal, especially after they failed to reach the World Series, often failing to get out of the first round.
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
12:20 pm
Murph, I don’t think there is any doubt he’s going to fill at least one of the holes with a fairly big trade.
My point about Gordon is just that I would think the Royals could get more than he Braves would be willing to offer. I wouldn’t mind being wrong about that.
But I don’t think there is any doubt there will be at least one big trade. You’re right. It’s going to be difficult and it won’t be wise to make a big splash on the free agent market alone.
TennesseePaul
October 15th, 2012
12:20 pm
We gotta friggin win, man. And that means putting together a club that beats a 98 win Nationals team, because clearly the Atlanta Braves insulted the Baseball gods – so let’s maximize our chances
That’s the spirit! That’s the friggin baseball spirit right there.
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
12:21 pm
“It’s up to him. Trades that retain the top “prospects” aren’t likely to bring the return that Wren needs to fix the problems entirely.”
Which goes back to the whole thing about not having a 100+ million dollar payroll. Instead of just signing an elite free agent guy like Josh Hamilton to play LF/CF for the Braves. We have to trade a top prospect in order to get a guy that has a cheaper long term deal already. Then as soon as that guys contract is up, he’s no longer a Brave even though we REALLY wanted that guy to begin with. Teixeira, Bourn, etc.
TennesseePaul
October 15th, 2012
12:23 pm
If Jesus could hit a curveball…
What do you mean “if”? Pretty sure he could hit anything…
TennesseePaul
October 15th, 2012
12:25 pm
Strawman alert!
Doesn’t even know what a strawman is…
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
12:26 pm
MFin04, well, if a team would spend part of its $100+ million payroll budget on players like Josh Hamilton, Michael Bourn and Mark Teixiera, I’m not sure how far they would get anyway.
richbrave
October 15th, 2012
12:26 pm
Some thoughts for this day.
I’ll pass on the junior GM stuff as far as new players and trades are concerned. FRANK will pull us through. I’m a believer. I like PAGAN, FOWLER, WILLINGHAM whatever works without breaking the bank prospect-wise.
‘Big Jim’s’ doing well [.313 BA - 4G] down in VENEZUELA with ZULIA right now. That’s encouraging especially with his return from that wrist fracture. That’s looking great at present. If he keeps this up I wouldn’t be surpirsed at all to see him take HINSKI’s former role out of ST. LF, 1B, C. He could supplant both DIAZ and HINSKI if he continues to progress this rapidly.
I still want FRANCISCO as the 3B back-up, and I definitely want PRADO signed long-term and moved into CHIPPER’s slot just as DOB sees it.
At SS, we could move the REV back to AAA as he still has a couple options, and keep JANISH until later in the season, or keep both as bench players at either 2B or SS. Not likely though.
It’s UGGLA at 2B, ugly or not, and FREEMAN at first.
McCANN has to have his option picked up with or without an extension. This will be his make or break year long-tern with ATLANTA. I’m betting on him because McFANN has his back. Recovery for that shoulder is absolutely essential for him.
HEYWARD long-term moving forward. Forgo the arb stuff. Sign him. FRANCOUER, he is not.
I could see the option picked up for HUDDY with a year extension. Lower guarantees for the two years and easy incentives to give the org relief if he faulters, and give him a raise if he qualifies. I love the guy. He overcomes injury, gives the BRAVES breaks with the finances, and is money when the chips are down. The guy’s a warrior in my book.
DAP
October 15th, 2012
12:27 pm
lew Well, if trading Hnson actually relieved salary – but it really doesn’t.
the braves havent been paying the guy?
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
12:29 pm
That’s the spirit! That’s the friggin baseball spirit right there.
Not sure I’ll have that same baseball spirit when that same 98 win Nationals team adds Josh Hamilton…..but what the heck……
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
12:31 pm
Doesn’t even know what a strawman is…
Sort of like when Coach used to tell people to “eat crow” and didn’t really get what it truly meant.
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
12:32 pm
Well if they are throwing 93-98 you don’t have to worry about those hits being doubles to the alleys. Fans just get more souvenirs
You mean from the catcher after the strike out? I thought he’d just throw the ball back out towards the mound………………..
Shaun
October 15th, 2012
12:32 pm
Doesn’t even know what a strawman is…
It’s implying that I think MLB gives trophies for or teams are trying to rack up third-order wins.
DS1
October 15th, 2012
12:33 pm
Now that we have the front office signings out of the way, it’ll probably only take 2-3 more days for FW to make all his winter deals.
THEN, what will you talk about the rest of the 3+ months before ST starts??
Lew
October 15th, 2012
12:36 pm
DAP – Of course they have – pre arb dollars. This is his first arb appearnace and given that he missed the second half of 2011 and pitched poorly for much of this year, his salary will still be relatively low (all things considered) and is hardly a weight on the Braves payroll.
Next year – IF he doesn’t return to form (kind of like Jurrjens), maybe you think of non tendering him or trading him for a couple of boxes of baseballs. But right now? He’s young. He has a track record of better pitching prior to getting injured and unless they can get a decent return for him, what he’ll make really won’t hamstring the Braves in any manner.
richbrave
October 15th, 2012
12:37 pm
MFin04
October 15th, 2012
11:50 am
“…..Mike Minor for Hunter Pence? Nah, don’t think so. Bad deal. Mike Minor was the 3rd best pitcher in the majors in the 2nd half of the season. He’s still young and learning how to pitch, could get even better. Who knows. But it is good to see him succeeding. And it is good to see the Braves with a couple of lefty starters. Heck if we can’t throw the ball harder than 89 as a staff, at least we can switch between lefty and righty pitchers……”
I agree.
BRAVES are determined
1 – to add speed to the line-up with the demise [except for the MELK-DUD] of PED’s in MLB.
2 – A balance in starters [ two LH] reliefers [three LH] and the bats between LH-RH.
Lew
October 15th, 2012
12:37 pm
Where has Coach been lately? Did he finally implode?
richbrave
October 15th, 2012
12:38 pm
BTW on the subject of LH starters, our #2 pick had a solid rookie season – ALEX WOOD.
Lew
October 15th, 2012
12:39 pm
Third order win? I could give a flying %$^* what kind of a win it is – just so we have a lot of them.
DS1
October 15th, 2012
12:39 pm
scoots, Efrim, Lew, richbrave, MFin04, TOBF, Shaun, Murph, 10Paul, Kat, and flange1
A veritable “who’s who” of blogging going on today!
I finally buckled under the intense pressure and watched the last 3 baseball games. Damn shame about Derek Jeter! And as much as I try to get up for the Tigers, it’s still hard. But I will darn shore pull for them over the Yankees.
And if the Giants don’t beat the Cards, I’ll be totally bummed. Though the Cards have a heckuva team. Their pitching sure came together in the late second half.
DAP
October 15th, 2012
12:41 pm
lew, so after half a mil this season, what will get get in his first arb year? you gotta figurehes gonna get a $2mil raise at least, right? it wont cripple the braves, but i still say hes trade bait if wren can talk someone into taking him.
but its really a sell low. he could pitch well and improve his value to the team or in a trade, or he could continue to struggle and get non tendered after 2013.
richbrave
October 15th, 2012
12:43 pm
Efrim
October 15th, 2012
12:29 pm
“….That’s the spirit! That’s the friggin baseball spirit right there.
Not sure I’ll have that same baseball spirit when that same 98 win Nationals team adds Josh Hamilton…..but what the heck……”
Well, I hope they keep running DETWILER and JACKSON out there. Both those guys should switch to BRAVES uni’s when they start against us. We OWN them!
We’ve got SEAN BURNETT’s number too.