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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
1,698 comments Add your comment
Murph
October 9th, 2012
2:51 pm
If the Twins trade all of their offensive talent for pitching, aren’t they just sort of creating the same problem they have now, only backwards?
Patrick
October 9th, 2012
2:51 pm
1. Move Prado to 3rd. Wren knows Prado is best in the infield.
2. Do NOT sign McCann. He’s done. He’s going to miss significant time no matter who gets him next year. We could use his salary for so much more good.
3. Sign Josh Hamilton to three years 50 millions, with a team option. He’ll replace McCann’s left-handed bat in the middle of the lineup.
4. Sign Bourn but not for anything over $10 million a year. I know, that means he is gone. Fine. He’s a strikeout machine that wears down at the end of the season. He’s valuable but up to a point.
5. Rebuild the bench. We had too many black holes (Hinske, Wilson). Please find someone to compliment Johnson.
6. Let Maholm walk. I’d like to have a second left-hander of course, but we need to give Delgado or Tehran some burn. Medlen, Hudson, Minor, Hanson, and Delgado or Tehran.
7. When Beachy returns, give him the Medlen treatment by letting him finish out the season in the bullpen. Don’t rush him back into the rotation…instead, get him ready to take Hudson’s slot in 2014.
Frank Wren, you’re welcome
I pretty much agree with all of your points, I doubt we’d be able to land Hamilton for that few amount of years. But, I agree with your suggestion of sigining him.
If they McGuirk, Schuerholtz and Wren REALLY want to contend. If they are REALLY serious about putting a winning product on the field. Bourn needs to be re-signed and Josh Hamilton is about the only available option to replace Chipper.
HOWEVER. The Braves are NOT serious about winning a world series. They do NOT care about putting out a product on the field for the fans. So unfortunately, I do not see either of those 2 players in Braves uniforms next year. The Braves only want to dangle the carrot so to speak and give out the illiusion that they want to win. They want to do juuuust enough to get the fans thinking that they can contend, when they really do not in reality.
It will be very interesting to see what the front office does to get attendance up. Because winning doesn’t bring the fans in (sorry to this to all the Georgia residents, but you’re notorious for not supporting the team by showing up to the stadium, even for playoff games). And home grown local talent brings in some fans, but doesn’t sell out the games. That leaves 1 potential option, landing BIG NAME Superstars. I’m not 100% sure, but it did seem to work back in the 90’s when the Braves got Maddux and crew. A good core of home grown talent (THAT YOU RE-SIGN) and the landing of a Star Free Agent or two is the only thing that this current group of front office personnel haven’t tried and it IS the receipe for success in getting fans to come to the games. Or at least I think it is…and if but some miracle, the Braves did that and the stadium still doesn’t sell out…then they may as well pack it up and become the 2000’s chicago blackhawks version of a baseball team where the owners just try and make money at all costs and worry about nothng else.
Tumbledown
October 9th, 2012
2:53 pm
Shaun – What are Rodriguez’s post-season stats starting with Game 4 of the 2004 ALCS? Much of our view of AROD as a post-season player starts with that game, whether fair or not.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
2:53 pm
but Twins are pitiful in pitching and may be willing
They’re pretty feeble, that’s true. But even if the Braves filled out their entire SP rotation, you still got to put eight other guys out there, LOL. Can’t trade ‘em all for pitching.
If they really wanted to go blockbuster, they’d trade Morneau to the Rays and ask for the sun, moon, stars, and a couple of first-borns.
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
2:53 pm
Efrim
Do you think the Braves might go after a top prospect like Mike Olt to fill a void?
CB
October 9th, 2012
2:55 pm
Morneau a free agent in 2014, maybe worth just the sun.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
2:56 pm
He’s RH power hitting LFer who…….is 34 years old and would be a big step down defensively in LF from 2012. So we can’t go overboard trying to get em.
Indeed. Exactly why I wouldn’t trade one of my prized pitchers for him. Had a career year, so he will decline from that, also being 34 doesn’t help things.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
2:57 pm
Morneau a free agent in 2014, maybe worth just the sun.
Man, time flies. I thought he had at least two years left on that contract.
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
2:59 pm
It might take Hanson and Deldago to get Willingham alone. two years left, if he moves it will take some talent to get him I think — nolie
I think it would take more. Because they’re taking on Hanson’s salary in 2012 without much reason to think he’ll be better than he was past 1-1/2 seasons. And as good as Delgado MIGHT be, he’s not been a truly elite-level prospect like Teheran, which attracts suitors. (Personally, I won’t be surprised if Delgado ends up the better pitcher of the two.)
With Willingham at such a club-friendly price for next two years, gotta give up more than that to get him, I’d imagine.
Murph
October 9th, 2012
2:59 pm
It would be great if the Braves went after Olt… Texas could field almost an entire 25 man roster made up of former Braves and Braves’ prospects.
With the Astros moving to the AL next season and my chances down to 0% of seeing the Braves play live, I could just drive up to Arlington and watch Atlanta 2.0!
BillEGoat
October 9th, 2012
3:00 pm
DOB, would you considermdoing a column trying to analyze why the Braves, going back a number of seasons, have done SO badly in post-season play? Going back six straight post-season appearances, the Braves have been bumped out in the first round (wild card playooff this year). They have an 8-16 record in those last six playoff rounds. On many occasions, they have lost win-or-go-home games at HOME, where they should have an advantage. This year and in 2010, they lost the games at home on errors by infielders, but it is always something. The Braves finished six games better than the Cardinals in seasonal W-L records this year and still lost. Anything can happened for ONE season or even TWO, but the Braves just come up VERY small consistently in post-season play. Has this happened so often to the franchise that the players are maybe subconsciously expecting it? The costly infield errors this year and in 2010 were on routine plays that ML players make almost all the time–but the Braves didn’t make them, and they consistently fail to hit with runners in scoring position. Atlanta fans might appreciate a column on this topic, athough I guess the players and administration might be offended.
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
3:02 pm
Hey, someone needs to tell Alex Rodriguez there’s no such thing as a great hitter being terrible in the clutch. Right?
Okay…I’ll bite…Rodriguez in the postseason: .271/.380/.484 in 70 games and 309 plate appearances.
Where’s the evidence that he’s not clutch? — Shaun
Serious question: Do you watch baseball games, on TV or in person? Or just consume and analyze stats and pick the ones to your liking, whether or not they are a current, ongoing, representative sample of that player’s performance?
Frankie
October 9th, 2012
3:02 pm
And now for something completely different…..
Ben Zobrist, how do we get him. Good fit for the Braves.
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:03 pm
I think it’s Profar’s time.
Borderline. I could see them playing him in AAA next season and sticking with Andrus in Texas. I believe it will all hinge on what areas they wish to address this winter (which is a factor of Hamilton), knowing they have that position as depth if necessary to use in a trade. But I would be a little surprised to see Andrus come up in rumors instigated from their side this winter.
nolie
October 9th, 2012
3:03 pm
pretty good stuff here the last few hours, but I gotta go for awhile. TTFN
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:04 pm
OBP can improve in young players with proper coaching, I do agree he lacks power but good contact hitter.
I skeptical that Revere will ever be all that good offensively. It’s difficult to put up a good OBP without power. Major league pitchers can just throw strikes and get weak contact. Speed (and defense, definitely) will help him be an adequate enough hitter to probably hold down a job, either as a second-division starter or a bench outfielder. He’ll get on base some by making contact and legging out some hits. But that is only going to take him so far.
I’m not completely against the Braves bringing in Revere, by the way. But they would probably need to add a big-time offensive leftfielder/thirdbaseman if they were to bring him in.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:06 pm
If they really wanted to go blockbuster, they’d trade Morneau to the Rays and ask for the sun, moon, stars, and a couple of first-borns.
Really? I sorta think Morneau is overrated. He does make a ton of sense for hte Rays.
That needs to happen.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:06 pm
Had a career year, so he will decline from that,
This is a totally specious argment, re Willingham, and you make it frickin’ constantly. Try something new.
The man hasn’t had an OPS under .810 in seven bleepin’ years, and the .810 was in Oakland, fercrissake. He has a career .870 OPS against lefties, he’s had one year in the last eight with an OBP under .350. He’s 34? So what? The club would only be on the hook for two years at $14MM; they spend more on the damn clubhouse buffet.
Find a new argument, because this one just makes you look foolish.
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:08 pm
Ben Zobrist would be an awesome pick up. He’s comparable to Martin Prado cause he can play just about any position. He hits for lower average but his OBP/SLG is higher than’s Prado. Little older but is a switch hitter.
Under Contract for 2013 at 5.5 million then has 2 option years at 7 mil and then 7.5 mil. His team friendly contract will make is very hard to get him.
Murph
October 9th, 2012
3:09 pm
I wonder how DOB’s stalkers are going to adjust to the offseason schedule, where new blogs are fewer and farther between?
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:09 pm
The Mariners had one regular player with an OBP over .306… he stood in at .316 on the season.
Half Empty
October 9th, 2012
3:09 pm
I disagree about OBP improving all that much with coaching, a bit with some players but m(any)ost go through their careers variating around about the same general mean
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
3:10 pm
Shaun – What are Rodriguez’s post-season stats starting with Game 4 of the 2004 ALCS? Much of our view of AROD as a post-season player starts with that game, whether fair or not. — Tumbledown
I’ll answer that:
Alex Rodriguez hit .363 (33-for-91) with six homers, 20 strikeouts and a 1.062 OPS in the first 23 postseason games of his career through Oct. 17, 2004. Since then, he’s hit .222 (37-for-167) with seven homers, 48 strikeouts and a .759 OPS in his past 47 postseason games.
In his past 22 postseason games, he’s hit .190 (15-for-79) with one homer, 25 strikeouts and a .291 slugging percentage and .611 OPS.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:10 pm
Do they go with Gentry/Martin platoon in CF if they lose Hamilton, or go and sign a replacement? Maybe Michael Bourn?
Maybe they move Kinsler to LF and play Profar at 2nd base?
Plus they have some pitching decisions to make. Darvish, Harrison, Holland, Perez, Ogando, Feliz, Lewis off of surgery.
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:11 pm
So what? The club would only be on the hook for two years at $14MM; they spend more on the damn clubhouse buffet.
Not now that Livan has been released and Dan Kolb has long since retired.
Juan
October 9th, 2012
3:12 pm
Arizona Fall League start Today…The following Braves are playing with the Phoenix Desert Dog:
Pitcher: Ryan Buchter, Chris Jones, Cory Rasmus, Zeke Sprull,
Catcher: Matt Kennelly
Infield: Nick Ahmed, Edward Salcedo
No Outfielder for the Braves this year.
On today line up only Salcedo is DH bnatting 5th.
Half Empty
October 9th, 2012
3:12 pm
Zobrist would indeed be a good pickup IMO too. a 119 OPS+ switchhitter with great versatility
Mikey
October 9th, 2012
3:12 pm
The question that begs to be asked of Frank Wren (as I watch the successful teams continue on in the playoffs) is; Is that really the “best bench” that you could put together to start the season?
ba/ob
Hinski: .197/.272
Diaz: .222/.280
Wilson: 169/.189
Francisco:.234/.278
I will give you credit for bringing in Janish & Johnson to fill voids after injuries forced your hand, but without a doubt that is the worst bench in ML!
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:12 pm
Not now that Livan has been released and Dan Kolb has long since retired
OK, so maybe “more” was a little hyperbole.
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:14 pm
DOB, I do watch games.
Do you think Rodriguez’s 10 plate appearances so far in the 2012 ALDS, whether you and I have watched all of them or not, tells us whether Rodriguez isn’t clutch?
I don’t think those 10 plate appearances tell us much of anything. Just like Chipper’s 1 hit in his final 12 meaningful plate appearances doesn’t tell us much of anything (the final 12 plate appearances before the Nationals clinched).
Sample size matters. Sample size matters whether you are looking at it from a statistical perspective or whether you are watching a player in 10-12 plate appearances.
If you would prefer, I can put it to you without using any sort of statistical terms. When watching a player, you need a whole heck of a lot more than 2-4 games to learn much of anything. I think a scout would tell you that, a stat guy would tell you that, anyone in the game would tell you that.
bobbymahlon
October 9th, 2012
3:14 pm
I saw and heard Wren on an interview this year say that they were going to find Prado a permanet position. I’ll bet that will never happen as long as Wren and Freddie are running the Braves.
Half Empty
October 9th, 2012
3:15 pm
Mac and Francisco make up for those two easily
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:15 pm
Would yall rather have Ben Revere, Peter Bourjos, or Gentry? Who would cost more to get in trade? I just think were gonna end up with a player like this. I believe we will make defense the #1 priority for our new CFer while Wren works hard to finally secure a slugger for LF.
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:15 pm
So, it appears the D-Backs got the better end of the Kelly Johnson trade… still think that was an effort to exploit draft pick comps in FA which backfired.
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:17 pm
DOB, so did Rodriguez suddenly become un-clutch after his first 23 postseason games? Did he stop working on his clutch skills?
The fact that there is such a drastic difference is a good indication that Rodriguez’s failures are not the result of some sort of a distinct lack of a clutch skill or clutch ability that is separate from his overall baseball skills and abilities.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:18 pm
So, it appears the D-Backs got the better end of the Kelly Johnson trade… still think that was an effort to exploit draft pick comps in FA which backfired.
Sometimes dudes need a change of scenary and it seemed like it helped for Hill – who I thought was always a good player even while in Toronto.
And yes, we’re talking about Anthonopolous here. Of course it was geared towards the draft and player development.
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:18 pm
2013 Bench (hopefully)
David Ross
Juan Francisco
Paul Janish
Reed Johnson
Tyler Pastornicky
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:19 pm
Mac and Francisco make up for those two easily
Huh-uh. Even if Heap and Juan were All-World in that department (and I’m not saying they are), Livan and Kolb were All-Universe. Named the trophy after ‘em and then retired it.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:19 pm
AA traded for Miguel Olivo just so he can get a comp. pick and it worked when Seattle signed him while he was a Type B free agent.
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
3:19 pm
I wonder how DOB’s stalkers are going to adjust to the offseason schedule, where new blogs are fewer and farther between? — Murph
Hopefully the 2-3 of them will work themselves into a tizzy each and every day that I don’t write a blog, and assume I am off every day that I don’t write. That would cause great consternation in their households, wondering what I’m up to, why I don’t have a new blog up after several days, etc. This would be good.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:21 pm
There may be some here in Braves land that now believe any player traded for will just fail to meet expectations…….
Me, I think you have to keep doing things that make sense – and trading for Willingham makes sense as long as the cost isn’t insane.
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
DOB, would you considermdoing a column trying to analyze why the Braves, going back a number of seasons, have done SO badly in post-season play? — BillEGoat
The teams have very little in common, save for a couple of hitters (McCann was on a few of those teams; Prado DL’d in 2010; Chipper on all of those teams, though DL’d in 2010) and a couple of coaches. Different pitching staffs, different lineups, different managers, different hitting coaches.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
So you’d trade Delgado and/or Teheran + for 2 years of a 34 yr old slugger? Who just had a career year?
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
Maybe Gattis might get a shot for a bench spot this spring. Maybe he can hit enough to be kinda like a Eric Hinske or Ryan Doumit type.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
Well, at least we’re only one offseason away from Wren for sure going after frontline starting pitching…..
I mean, it has to happen next winter, right?
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
Do you think Rodriguez’s 10 plate appearances so far in the 2012 ALDS
I’m not getting into this, but this is a strawman… DOB sited well over 10 plate appearances. It was around 230 PA in his sample…
Tumbledown
October 9th, 2012
3:23 pm
Shaun – Regarding AROD, DOB seems to be offering you stats that span many more than 2-4 games. Call me crazy, but if my life depended on whether a player could get a hit with RISP, I would not enlist AROD. I would start with Jeter and pick many other players before AROD.
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:26 pm
Not to mention, doesn’t the fact that he’s hit poorly against lefties the last 2 years worry you? His road splits the last 2 years have been poor; heck, he struggled mightily down the stretch, Uggla outperformed him since August 1. He has a great contract, maybe the Braves should have signed him. I’m not trading for him though, not for what the Twins will want.
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:26 pm
I mean, it has to happen next winter, right
Next year there will be any number of washed up former all-stars pitching in crawl spaces and basement throughout America from which Wren can pick and choose…
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:28 pm
So you’d trade Delgado and/or Teheran + for 2 years of a 34 yr old slugger? Who just had a career year?
I don’t remember seeing scoots ever say he’d trade Delgado and Teheran for Josh Willingham. Obviously these targets come with a price, and if that price is insane, then you have to move on, or decide that it’s something you’re willing to do.
I would not trade Teheran for Willingham. Delgado, yes. And I just have to trust my people that Teheran has a higher ceiling than Randall.
TennesseePaul
October 9th, 2012
3:31 pm
Maybe [Gattis] can hit enough to be kinda like a Eric Hinske or Ryan Doumit type.
Gattis? Please. He shall only stoop to such a level if, and only if, he has been beaten down and bound by kryptonite chains, buried near the Earth’s core while be perpetually bombarded with photons by stimulated emission of radiation.
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:31 pm
Va-
I would rather take a shot w/ that than bringing in another has been vet for the bench….
It seems to have worked for the Nats with their young guys (Moore, Lombardozzi)
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:31 pm
Efrim
Maybe Medlen or Beachy are considered one of those types by 2014. Have to be happy with Mike Minor progress he’s shown. He could be as good as a #3. Still havent seen enough of Delgado and there’s still Teheran. While we really do lack that Ace or #1 we still have a good group of starters going forward.
What I’d like to see is actually having a couple starters pitching 200+ innings for us.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:31 pm
I mean, [elite starter] has to happen next winter, right?
Bubba, please. With Sean Gilmartin in the wings?
DAP
October 9th, 2012
3:33 pm
vabravesfan 2013 Bench (hopefully)
David Ross
Juan Francisco
Paul Janish
Reed Johnson
Tyler Pastornicky
uh….mayday!
TheOnlyBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:33 pm
Scoots didn’t say that, but I’m sure the Twins will try for Teheran and Delgado to start. They’d be selling sky-high on him.
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:35 pm
TennPaul
Well atleast I’m being realistic when it comes to Evan Gattis. He’s too old for AA and has been way overhyped, my opinion is his ceiling is likely a MLB bench player at best.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:35 pm
Bubba, please. With Sean Gilmartin in the wings?
I’m posting from another computer because my last one is covered in coffee after seeing that comment from scoots.
Is it against Wren’s religion to have a starter in the rotation who can touch 94mph?
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:36 pm
TennesseePaul, Tumbledown and DOB, No one in their right mind, whether they be a scout or a stat guy, would draw any definitive conclusions about a player based on 23, 22 or 43 games.
If my life depended on a hit with RISP, I would not separate out clutch performance. I would go with a guy likely to hit the ball hard and who isn’t likely to make an out: probably someone like Joey Votto, Miguel Cabrera or Ryan Braun. If there were two outs, I might go with someone like Mike Trout or Andrew McCutchen, to limit the chances of him getting thrown out at first. Lots of good choices. But I certainly wouldn’t want to make my choice based on a limited number of plate appearances, like only plate appearances that we would call clutch. I would look at everything a player has ever done.
CB
October 9th, 2012
3:37 pm
There are really a lot of people on here who use several monikers,then accuse only the negative people of doing it. I mean, if you can’t justify your arguments under one name what does that say about you?
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:37 pm
I’d give the Twins Julio Teheran for Josh Willingham and Denard Span, but I’m sure they wouldn’t do it :p
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:38 pm
While we really do lack that Ace or #1 we still have a good group of starters going forward.
Nationals, Phillies, and hell, even the New York Metropolitans have one. If I were Wren, I’d make sure I had one too.
This is all Tommy Hanson’s fault.
Murph
October 9th, 2012
3:40 pm
Well atleast I’m being realistic when it comes to Evan Gattis. He’s too old for AA and has been way overhyped
Mr Gattis would like a quick word with you.
And whatever you do, don’t look him in the eyes.
Tumbledown
October 9th, 2012
3:42 pm
Given that the Twins struck a bit of gold with Scott Diamond (did I really write that), maybe they will be prone to overvalue Teheran or Delgado. Still, the Braves better get a whole lot in return for one of those two pitchers.
CB
October 9th, 2012
3:42 pm
Efrim. is it against your religion to not be happy without a starting pitcher who throws 94mph?
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:43 pm
Phillies I can agree….
I still think even given his record, I’d have to see another solid year from Gio to believe he’s a #1…
And who is the Mets….? Dickey…..once again, would have to see another good year to believe that….and given he’s a knuckler, I doubt thats sustainable….
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:44 pm
Tumble-
You mean former Brave farmhand Scott Diamond?
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:44 pm
In Chipper’s final 23 games, he hit .217 with a .360 and a .246 slugging. In his final 43 games, he hit .231 with a .347 on-base and a .350 slugging.
Most of those games were pretty meaningful in that the Braves were trying to win the division and avoid a one-game playoff. Many of those games were also against non-playoff teams. Anyone want to argue that the reason Chipper didn’t hit and slug better because he isn’t clutch? Or is that only reserved for players you don’t like, where you can go along with the narrative of the mainstream media?
It’s absolutely ridiculous to assign some grand meaning about Chipper or A-Rod’s clutch abilities to a narrow subset of games.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:46 pm
is it against your religion to not be happy without a starting pitcher who throws 94mph?
Hey, it’s all of those darn elite pitchers on the Television that sit in the mid-90’s, CB. Tough to see all of em and scratch my head as to why we don’t have those types.
DAP
October 9th, 2012
3:48 pm
ptown, youre forgetting about strasburg, and santana.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:48 pm
I still think even given his record, I’d have to see another solid year from Gio to believe he’s a #1…
I know he only pitched 160 innings, but good lord man, if Strasburg isn’t a #1 starter then who the hell is?
abeeeewright
October 9th, 2012
3:48 pm
When Trader Frank “goes ugly,” he usually has time to clean up, sober up, and return to the bar for one more “last call” before closing time (e.g., Chad Durbin).
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
3:49 pm
Efrim
It it! He was suppost to be our Ace! Instead he’s decided to follow Jair Jurrjen’s path LOL well not that bad, but it’s almost to the point where I rather see what one of these younger guys can do instead of giving Hanson another shot to get back to the old Hanson.
Tumbledown
October 9th, 2012
3:49 pm
P-Town- Yeah, I believe that the Twins acquired Diamond from us. He did fairly well for the Twins this year, hence my reference to a bit of gold.
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:49 pm
DAP-
Didn’t count Strasberg since they were treating him like a b*tch and Santana outside of the no hitter hasn’t pitched like an ace since 2008
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:50 pm
Heading into next season, I look at the Braves front 3(Hudson, Medlen, Minor) and sorta think they are more on the level with the Mets(Dickey, Niese, Santana/Harvey) than the Phillies(Hamels, Lee, Halladay) and the Nationals(Strasburg, Zimmermann, Gonzalez).
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:51 pm
Frankly, if he doesn’t get a full year in next year guys, I’m going to have to pronounce Stras the next Mark Prior…..
And I guess maybe I missed the memo on when Tommy Hanson was supposed to be an elite ace pitcher
abeeeewright
October 9th, 2012
3:51 pm
In Chipper’s final 23 games, he hit .217 with a .360 and a .246 slugging. In his final 43 games, he hit .231 with a .347 on-base and a .350 slugging.”
I think Chipper’s last season was kind of like a closer. He put his foot on the gas pedal at the start and just kept running til the tank was empty. I think the tank emptied out before those final 50 ABs.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:51 pm
This is all Tommy Hanson’s fault.
Actually, Tommy Hanson’s shoulder, LOL. And maybe his beard. Yeah.
The Truth....
October 9th, 2012
3:52 pm
Frank should be a used car salesman. He’s just that slick! He did a terrible job in the off season last year and he’ll probably do the same this year…Too bad Braves fans..
P-Town Brave ©
October 9th, 2012
3:53 pm
Efrim-
Maybe, but the Cards proved that the Nats top 2 were beatable….
Zimmerman got roughed up BADLY and if they had any clutch hits at all, Gio would have been too….I believe he had 5 walks before he got through 3 IP….
A MUCH improved offense could help our pitching staff….just ask Minor and Delgado
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:54 pm
I think Scott Diamond and Glen Perkins may be the only pitchers in the entire organization that they have for the 2013 Twins pitching staff. They need it in bunches.
I guess they can kid themselves into thinking that they can grab pitching this winter by trading Morneau and Span, and then wait for the bat calvary to come in from the minors(Hicks, Arcia, Sano, Rosario). But that’s a stretch for even 2014.
CB
October 9th, 2012
3:55 pm
scoots,weren’t you supposed to bring us a victory against Cards. Dang, it was your fault. Did you throw any trash?
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:55 pm
Maybe, but the Cards proved that the Nats top 2 were beatable….
So did a few other teams this year as they didn’t go undefeated. What’s your point, man? That they can lose?
The frequency at which they spin bad outings is low. That’s why those three are what they are – frontline starters. All of em.
richbrave
October 9th, 2012
3:56 pm
AZL kicks off the fall-winter ball season today.
Playing for the PHOENIX DESERT DOGS
Pitchers
RYAN BUCHTER – LHSP
ZEKE SPRUILL – RHSP
CHRIS JONES – LHS/RP
CORY RASMUS – RHRP
Position
MATT KENNELLY – C
EDWARD SALCEDO – 3B
NICK AHMED – 2B/SS/3B
In today’s starting line-up 10/9
ED SALCEDO – DH
Powder Blue
October 9th, 2012
3:58 pm
Good article on Dale Murphy’s recent visit to the MLB Fan Cave:
http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121008&content_id=39613728&vkey=news_atl&c_id=atl
Powder Blue
October 9th, 2012
3:58 pm
Good article on Dale Murphy’s recent visit to the MLB Fan Cave:
http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121008&content_id=39613728&vkey=news_atl&c_id=atl
Shaun
October 9th, 2012
3:59 pm
Funny, I don’t see anyone eager to say Chipper isn’t clutch based on his final 20-40-something games in which the Braves were in a race for first place and a place in the NLDS instead of a coin-flip game. Anyone?
That’s right, because the reason Chipper didn’t hit and slug better probably had nothing to do with his ability or lack thereof to come through in the clutch, overcome or thrive on pressure, etc. But somehow it’s different for A-Rod
Hey, someone needs to tell Alex Rodriguez there’s no such thing as a great hitter being terrible in the clutch. Right?
Also, the above statement is a strawman. Who said there’s no such thing as a great hitter being terrible in the clutch? The argument is that a great hitter will perform more or less to his norms, given enough of chances, whether those chances be in clutch situations, non-clutch situations, on Wednesdays, whatever. The question is whether a player coming through or not coming through in the clutch says something about his clutch abilities or his abilities to overcome or thrive on pressure. If Chipper or A-Rod fail in situations that we could call clutch, it’s very unlikely it’s because of a lack of clutch ability or lack of ability to overcome pressure or thrive on pressure.
Players, even great players, have poor 20-40 games stretches. How many times do we see great players struggle through the first month or so of a season, everyone freaks out and by the end of the season his numbers look normal for him? Why is it so hard for folks who I’m sure know better to forget that 20-40 games is not enough to tell you much of anything.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
3:59 pm
Yeah, scoots, have you even written a word about Friday night? I hate to bring it up.
I’m trying to think of a good, well run franchise in sports that has worse playoff luck than us(whether it be our fault or not). It’s hard to find one, really.
KYBravos' fan
October 9th, 2012
3:59 pm
I haven’t read all of your messages, but I do know we can’t go into next year with so few right-handed sticks. The stats show that we really struggle against LH starters–and now Chipper’s retired and he hit righty when necessary. Prado is an excellent situational hitter. We need to be able to make PRODUCTIVE outs when the hits aren’t coming. I don’t have the answers to the offense, but the defense and pitching look to be very solid going forward. I believe the braintrust will make some solid moves to improve the club. 94 wins is very good y’all. Let’s hope we can win 100 next year in a tough division. Go Braves!
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
3:59 pm
But that’s a stretch for even 2014.
Those guys have to know that they can’t fix their pitching in one offseason, so club control years ought to be a big factor in any such trades. Whether they are willing to just gut the offense for two years to make that happen, who knows? Not exactly a PR bonanza.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
4:00 pm
ED SALCEDO – DH
Of course he’s at designated hitter……
David O'Brien
October 9th, 2012
4:02 pm
Funny, I don’t see anyone eager to say Chipper isn’t clutch based on his final 20-40-something games in which the Braves were in a race for first place and a place in the NLDS instead of a coin-flip game. Anyone?
That’s right, because the reason Chipper didn’t hit and slug better probably had nothing to do with his ability or lack thereof to come through in the clutch, overcome or thrive on pressure, etc. But somehow it’s different for A-Rod — Shaun
Uh, Shaun, how to say this? Chipper was 40, playing on shot knees and in the last two months of a two-decade career.
By the way, I wish I had the stat they used on TBS last night. But it was something along the lines of, A-Rod has hit .133 with RISP and two outs in the postseason.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
4:02 pm
Not exactly a PR bonanza.
They have no one to blame but themselves for terrible pitching drafts. They’ve gone after command/control guys who top out at 89mph and even those guys have gotten hurt. What a disaster. And Terry Ryan takes the interim tag off of himself. Them and the Rockies – lost.
Murph
October 9th, 2012
4:04 pm
Chipper was NOT CLUTCH on Friday.
There. I said it.
Efrim
October 9th, 2012
4:04 pm
I’m hoping for good scouting reports to come from the AFL on Salcedo. Although the scouting reports were glowing on Bethancourt last Fall and he fell flat on his face this past summer. Those two have to turn those tools into positive results. Both will be at Mississippi to start 2013.
The Truth....
October 9th, 2012
4:08 pm
The Braves brass don’t want to win a WS…They just want to make $$$! So keep buying those tickets! Want to fill the stadium? Put a quality baseball team on the field…and stop shopping at the dollar store for players FRANK! You really thought you could win with that team coming out of spring training? You were lucky to make it to the playoff game. Pure LUCK! AND you signed Diaz to play LF??? Be real!
Tumbledown
October 9th, 2012
4:11 pm
Shaun – Why are we comparing Arod’s last twenty or so playoff games verses Chipper’s last twenty or so regular season games as an injured 40-year old player? The better comparison would be to Chipper’s last twenty or so playoff games. In that case, I would definitely not want either player to hit for my life with RISP. Neither player has really come through recently in the playoffs.
I notice that many posters are not touching this subject and for good reason.
VaBravesFan
October 9th, 2012
4:13 pm
zuke354 (missouri)
I hear a lot of people talk about the “late” infield fly rule. How come nobody talks about the late time out that negated a strike out?
David Schoenfield (1:06 PM)
Not sure it’s the same thing. Ross probably heard the ump call time right before he made his swing. PLUS, Lohse still had a chance to get Ross out. The Braves didn’t get a chance to see what would have happened with the bases loaded.
ncscoots
October 9th, 2012
4:14 pm
Dang, it was your fault. Did you throw any trash?
I did not, no, but I was pretty much on the island, as far as that goes, LOL. Lotsa lotsa upset folks around me. Terrible call, I thought, but still…not the difference in the game. Chunkin’ the rock all around the field took care of that.
Despite the loss, I stuck around ATL for a couple and hung out with some cousins I have down there, so it was still a good weekend.
Medlen looked shorter in person, BTW.