Duquette is very sure of himself. Though none of us have the credentials to legitimately debate him, I would have to disagree big time that a good cutter is not a good pitch.
I think it is fine to make the young pitchers hold off on their cutter so that they can develop their other pitches such as the Orioles have done with Dylan Bundy, but to forbid it completely makes no sense. Anytime you get movement on a pitch it is a good thing. Cutters especially looking like a fastball but with late movement are very effective.Tough to get the sweet spot on the ball and a lot of broken bats.
James Shields is not a top of the rotation starter. He is not as good as Huddy.
Disagree. He pitches in the best division in baseball having to face top offenses. Guy is a horse. Might not be a #1 starter, but he’s at least a strong #2, imo.
Wren is not going to go out and sign a number one pitcher next year. There are too many other holes that need filling and Chipper’s bat needs replacing much more than we need a number one pitcher.
There is plenty of pitching already availabe in the system and signed for next year – not, of course, what some of you want – but realistically we have the starting pitching to make it through next year – especiallfter they go ahead and extend O’Flaherty and – again – have the best pen in the league, if not all baseball.
How much is McCann’s shoulder bothering him? Well, only he knows, but consider that he hit .308 with 9 HRs, 21 RBI in 18 games from 7/5-7/31. In 11 games since, he’s hit .118 w/ no extra-base hits and 1 RBI.
I can’t recall ever watching him pitch in a game (though I am sure I have), but if you just look at his stats, yes he eats innings, but he is NOT as good as Hudson. And folks say Huddy is a 2 at best. Just not seeing the love affair with Shields. He might be worth the 9-12 million he can make over the next 2 years.
There might be others out there that are available that we are not thinking of, but for my money, I’d try to develop guys like Hanson, Teheran, Minor, Delgado, etc.
Bourn is going to be the key to the whole formula though…….. and we might not know what’s going on there until December or January. Scott gets in no hurry for anybody.
I think you already have a stable of mid rotation starters. Unless you are seriously upgrading, why deal?
Shaun, like I said hopefully they can do better than Juan, but I’m only judging from the players that we have right now… b/c none of us have a clue what/who Franky will target this off season.
Yes, I suppose if they are limited to the players on the team that are currently under contract for next season, Juan Francisco would have to be the thirdbaseman. But I will almost guarantee that Prado’s the thirdbaseman and the leftfielder is someone outside the organization.
I met Dennis Haskins the guy who played Mr Belding on Saved by the bell, at the doctor’s office this morning LOL. He lives here in Chatt. I knew right away who he was and he sat right next to me. I watched that show everyday before and after school back in the day. You can tell he’s used to being recognized, he was very nice though.
I don’t know if it’s still the case, but Mr. Belding used to make a living off of appearing at various places, like bars and stuff, for promotional value. So it stands to reason he doesn’t mind people knowing who he is/was.
I agree with Chipper that keeping Bourn should be the #1 goal in the off season. There should be more than enough money coming off the books to make it happen. Naturally, this would mean that we could not afford David Wright also (assuming the Mets decline his option). But I doubt Wright is on the Braves wish list anyway. Braves can probably sign an inexpensive outfielder like Angel Pagan and move Prado to 3B.
The lineup would look something like:
CF Bourn
3B Prado
RF Hayward
C McCann
1B Freeman
2B Uggla
SS Simmons
LF Pagan
P Pitcher
Bourn and Headley or Willingham should just about do it. Call it good. The Bourn part might be a little tough pulling off though. And the Headley or Willingham deal will cost a decent bounty.
I didn’t get a chance to respond at all to DOB’s excellent blog yesterday.
But I did want to throw a couple comments out there.
First off, MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA for Melky. As we all know, he SUCKED when he was on the Braves. I’m not the least bit surprised that he took PED’s to get better because he has always been a mediocre player at best, this season was too good to be true and that’s what it proved to be. He is a piece of crap, I thought so when he got traded here, I thought so even more after he left and now he’s hit the top of the POS charts now. One thing I wish is that MLB could breakdown how many wins that he was the main factor in for the Giants and strip them of those wins, thus probably taking them out of, of at least putting a serious dent in their postseason run.
Second, AND THIS QUESTION/COMMENT IS FOR DOB. I’d like to get your opinion.
With regarding signing Bourn. We all know two things. 1. The Braves are cheap and 2. They are not committed to doing what it takes to win it all. They do just enough to make fans think that they are committed, but they aren’t. So, with that being said, we all know that they WILL NOT raise the team’s payroll just to re-sign Bourn. That means, if they really do indeed want to keep him. They are going to have to get creative. My question/comment is would the Braves consider trading McCann? Before everyone freaks out, think about the logic…thanks to St. Louis, they have set a ridiculously high bar with Yadier Molina’s assinine contact. And it has been said already that after Molina signed that contract that it’s going to be very difficult for the Braves to re-sign McCann. So, if the Braves were to trade McCann, not only could they free up a huge chuck of additional payroll not only to ensure that they re-sign Bourn, but also aquire maybe another top tier run producer or ace starting pitcher. At the same time, they could probably get a good package of prospects, or even just 1 highly rated prospect from a team (I’m sure there are many that woudl love McCann) and as DOB mentioned, the Braves do not have anyone in the minors that is anything close to 1. Being an elite centerfielder or 2. A leadoff hitter. and our GM has done a great job of depleting the farm system of depth and gave up our #2 prospect for Maholm and Johnson…when a good GM, could have acquired those 2 players without giving Vizciano up, I’m sure of it.
So the pro’s: 1. Free up payroll to re-sign Bourn and another top tier player 2. Re-stock the farm system outweight (in my opinion) the one con. Losing a fan favorite in McCann…who has shown that he is starting to decline in production, it’s sad but true. I’m sure an American League team woudl love to have him, they could part time DH him, part time have him catch.
I realize it probably wouldn’t happen, and the bounty would be huge (costing probably Prado, Teheran, Bethancourt, plus others); but how would Giancarlo look between Heyward and Freeman for the next 10 years?
DOBHow much is McCann’s shoulder bothering him? Well, only he knows, but consider that he hit .308 with 9 HRs, 21 RBI in 18 games from 7/5-7/31. In 11 games since, he’s hit .118 w/ no extra-base hits and 1 RBI.
patrick They do just enough to make fans think that they are committed, but they aren’t.
if you dont think they are committed, and youre a fan, then i guess they DONT do enough to make fans think they are committed.
if your ideas indicate a commitment to winning, why would the braves do any of what you suggested, since we have established beyond a doubt that they arent committed to winning?
And folks say Huddy is a 2 at best. Just not seeing the love affair with Shields. He might be worth the 9-12 million he can make over the next 2 years.
I think both guys are #2 starters. Shields a bit better, imo. Move that guy to the National League and I’d bet his numbers look a ton better. His velocity is actually up this year.
I find it amusing how someone can come to the Braves and make a couple of good starts and all of a sudden they aren’t tradable, they’re our new ace, we need them.. yada yada…
And on the flip-side, quite amusing as well, we’ve got all of the depth which will translate to wins.. sorry folks but quantity does not equal quality, much like adding extra players to a trade doesn’t all of a sudden equal the value you’d want back.
We need a true number one guy, there’s no way around that.
I’m just not certain that the Braves match up with the Rays for a deal.
We really don’t. They need major league ready catching. I think they are locked in with Longoria, Jennings, Joyce, and Zobrist as position players for 2013. If Zobrist plays RF, then the major league needs are SS, 2B, 1B, DH, C. Lots of work to do on their side this offseason. Even in the minors, they have an abundance of pitching. Bethancourt would be of interest to them, but I’d bet they look for a different trade package from another team if they move Shields.
Braves would have to get a 3rd team involved to match up w/ the Rays.
Awright! Let’s get one of those six-teamers going, trading guys from both leagues, pitchers, hitters, prospects, couple of dancing girls; make it so complicated that one team ends back up with a couple of players they traded in the first place.
Frank could do that. Not many GMs could, but Frank could.
Transplant – He’s good. He’s cheap and we have him for next year. Who would you trade him for that would be any better for $6.5 million?
Besides – they will fill either LF, 3B and CF. They aren’t going to revamp the entire team and they already have a decent pitching staff and an excellent bullpenb. WEren isn’t going out and signing Grienke, trading for Josh Jonson or any other of a numer of pitchers people think we have to have.
He’s got more than enough to do filling the positions with no one in them.
Hudson, Hanson, Maholm, Minor and one of Medlen, Delgado, Teheran would not put me on the edge of the roof…..but I’d be very disappointed.
With Chipper and Bourn in the lineup, you could probably live with that (as the team is now doing). Such a rotation’s liabilities could probably be covered up by a top-3 run-scoring team. However, plug in two lesser offensive talents and run differential probably becomes a little more iffy.
Besides – maybe Gilmartin is ready or Sheets proves worth giving a deal for next year. I wouldn’t count on much more – AND they will re-sign O’Flaherty – after the four year stretch he’s hjad with the Braves, they be stupid not to. He’s worth working out a deal with and gives us (still) the best pen around, especially now that it looks like Gearrin and Avilan are good to go.
I was thinking maybe they could DL BMac when Hanson comes back, but that wouldn’t work since they’d need a backup catcher…
Anyway, with Chipper back in there tonight, I wonder if Ross gets to start behind the plate or if Fredi will wait till tomorrow night with the lefty going for LA…
With Chipper and Bourn in the lineup, you could probably live with that (as the team is now doing). Such a rotation’s liabilities could probably be covered up by a top-3 run-scoring team. However, plug in two lesser offensive talents and run differential probably becomes a little more iffy.
That’s pretty much the way I’m looking at it. It’s going to be awfully hard to have as productive of an offense next year with the loss of Chipper and Bourn.
Just a heads up for anyone headed to the game tonight:
LV Ware @LV_Ware
Atlanta traffic going to be HORRIBLE tonight .. #Falcons preseason game & THEN @Braves Chipper Jones bobble head night! Im staying in
Efrim – Juan depends entirely on how much they spend for a CF, I would imagine. If they spend their bankroll on a CFer, I could see them picking up a RH 3B platoon partner with Juan and leaving Martin in LF – or another LFer like Reed Johnson and having Martin move back and forth with RJ (or whomever) playing LF against LHP.
In watching the braves this year they are both exciting and frustrating at times… but I believe the braves have lined them selves up in good position for the starting rotation for next year…. I dont want grienke at all… too much money for him IMO….. next resign bourn…. the braves dont have an outfielder in the system that is even close to being a bourn or andruw jones type….. The braves need an extra 10 million added to the payroll to help with signing an extra player or two….. this offseason is a make or break year for them…. I would also say bye bye to McCann…. hes struggled since the eye problem and he just not the same!!! GO BRAVES AND WIN THE DIVISION!!!!
I’d jump if Juan is at 3rd base, regardless of the rotation. Heck, I’ll jump if he’s still on the team next year! He just doesn’t fit in if we have Janish and Rev, unless he’s gonna learn 1B
It’s going to be awfully hard to have as productive of an offense next year with the loss of Chipper and Bourn.
My plan would be to get the best offensive players I could for the two OF spots in order to minimize the dropoff, and then count on my young players to continue their growth as a cover for whatever shortfall there might be. Might not be quite as explosive as this year, but not by an order of magnitude. I’d hope.
Penn State is paying legal bills for all ACCUSED university officials but they are not paying bills of McQueary, key witness against sandusky. if i had a shred of sympathy for Penn State, it is all gone now.
Yeah, that’s one fact you can’t help but face up to. He’ll get it turned around, though…whether or not it happens this season remains to be seen—it’s entirely possible, though!…
Your answer to the Bourn question is the same as the answer to the following:
Has Liberty Media been know to open the check book for the Braves?
Bourn is going to command more money during the offseason than the Braves will be able to spend. I can almost guarantee that. Add in the fact they have to replace Chipper in the middle of the lineup among other things, and I have no idea what will happen. For all we know, Liberty could use Chipper dropping off the books as an excuse to trim payroll even further.
Dunno. I don’t think they can go full-tilt on all three areas (LF, CF, and SP), so CF might end up a little scrubby. If they can wrangle up a LF with some sock and a front-line SP, I’d guess they’ll go with a good-glove guy in CF and just pray over his bat before each game. But CF would be third on my priority list. The FO may have different thoughts, of course, or the market might force a different approach. Too soon to know, but I’m all for mid-August rampant speculation, LOL.
Remeber in May all those people on twitter kept asking you why was Jason Heyward so hyped and why was he still in the big leagues? Those were funny.
Klaw (2:16 PM)
There was one Atlanta fan in particular who was obsessive about it – kept RT’ing a beat writer who was also running Heyward down, and quoting arbitrary-endpoint stats. Haven’t heard from him in ages.
Well, they were certainly funnier than the .200 BA the kid was sporting, I’ll give you that.
I think there was reason for concern in May, for sure. Once June hit, like the second it hit, he just went off and has mostly been so since. Best yet, his walk rate has been better in the 2nd half.
I mean, look at his full body of work. The only thing he isn’t doing is hitting LHP. Everything else has been elite. Everything.
I’d like him more off the bench, spelling different guys and PH. I don’t get a sense that he has the defensive skillset to play an everyday CF. But I really don’t know enough about him to make a call on that.
You still gonna be disappointed if he doesn’t hit .880?
I keep clamoring for one more .900+ month, and that will probably secure an .850 for the kid – which I’d do backflips for. His defense, basrunning and an .850 – that’s awesome.
I still can’t get over that he was from Jersey and the Northeast high school ranks, therefore the scouts didn’t see this. It’s incredible. He’s going to win the MVP during his 20-21 year old season and he wasn’t even up at the start of the year.
The Nats are gonna collapse….they’ve been supposed to do so all year long!
I would really love that, but they look really strong and their offense is almost unrealistically effective this year. No lead is safe against them and every break seems to go their way. The more Nationals games I watch, the more I believe they may not fall apart; instead, they’ll keep rolling until the end of september.
No lead is safe against them and every break seems to go their way. The more Nationals games I watch, the more I believe they may not fall apart; instead, they’ll keep rolling until the end of september.
Drinking the kool-aid, LOL.
Just think of how much good karma they have used up getting to this point. If the bill gets called this year (and it may not; the baseball gods don’t operate on the same schedule as mortals), they are due for some heartbreak in the last 50.
1,322 comments Add your comment
DS1
August 16th, 2012
12:30 pm
Greinke has a LOT of question marks for the money he is supposedly worth. Does a true ace just disappear like he has with the Halos?
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
12:30 pm
James Shields is not a top of the rotation starter.
This… 3 of his last 4 years have been pretty bad… Not worth trading Teheran/Delgado, Spruill/Graham, + 1 or 2 more .
brian
August 16th, 2012
12:30 pm
Duquette is very sure of himself. Though none of us have the credentials to legitimately debate him, I would have to disagree big time that a good cutter is not a good pitch.
I think it is fine to make the young pitchers hold off on their cutter so that they can develop their other pitches such as the Orioles have done with Dylan Bundy, but to forbid it completely makes no sense. Anytime you get movement on a pitch it is a good thing. Cutters especially looking like a fastball but with late movement are very effective.Tough to get the sweet spot on the ball and a lot of broken bats.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
12:32 pm
James Shields is not a top of the rotation starter. He is not as good as Huddy.
Disagree. He pitches in the best division in baseball having to face top offenses. Guy is a horse. Might not be a #1 starter, but he’s at least a strong #2, imo.
Brave4life-1995 All over again
August 16th, 2012
12:33 pm
I’d take my chances with Maholm in a one game playoff, especially considering the way he has been pitching
Lew
August 16th, 2012
12:33 pm
Wren is not going to go out and sign a number one pitcher next year. There are too many other holes that need filling and Chipper’s bat needs replacing much more than we need a number one pitcher.
There is plenty of pitching already availabe in the system and signed for next year – not, of course, what some of you want – but realistically we have the starting pitching to make it through next year – especiallfter they go ahead and extend O’Flaherty and – again – have the best pen in the league, if not all baseball.
DAP
August 16th, 2012
12:33 pm
i think james shields is a top of the rotation starter, but not an ace. hed be a good pickup.
CB
August 16th, 2012
12:34 pm
Would somebody please buy Greinke for Braves so TOBF will shut the heck up? Dang,man.
raleighbravefan
August 16th, 2012
12:34 pm
I’m not sold on Greinke. Just not.
Tomas
August 16th, 2012
12:35 pm
Dexter Fowler for Tommy Hanson and Juan Francisco
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
August 16th, 2012
12:35 pm
TOBF—
Thanks for the link!…:)
David O'Brien
August 16th, 2012
12:38 pm
How much is McCann’s shoulder bothering him? Well, only he knows, but consider that he hit .308 with 9 HRs, 21 RBI in 18 games from 7/5-7/31. In 11 games since, he’s hit .118 w/ no extra-base hits and 1 RBI.
DS1
August 16th, 2012
12:38 pm
Efrim
I can’t recall ever watching him pitch in a game (though I am sure I have), but if you just look at his stats, yes he eats innings, but he is NOT as good as Hudson. And folks say Huddy is a 2 at best. Just not seeing the love affair with Shields. He might be worth the 9-12 million he can make over the next 2 years.
There might be others out there that are available that we are not thinking of, but for my money, I’d try to develop guys like Hanson, Teheran, Minor, Delgado, etc.
Bourn is going to be the key to the whole formula though…….. and we might not know what’s going on there until December or January. Scott gets in no hurry for anybody.
I think you already have a stable of mid rotation starters. Unless you are seriously upgrading, why deal?
DS1
August 16th, 2012
12:40 pm
DOB
Should the Braves go ahead and bite the bullet and DL him for 2 weeks? Or will that even help? (McCann, that is)
Shaun
August 16th, 2012
12:41 pm
Shaun, like I said hopefully they can do better than Juan, but I’m only judging from the players that we have right now… b/c none of us have a clue what/who Franky will target this off season.
Yes, I suppose if they are limited to the players on the team that are currently under contract for next season, Juan Francisco would have to be the thirdbaseman. But I will almost guarantee that Prado’s the thirdbaseman and the leftfielder is someone outside the organization.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
12:41 pm
LOL CB. Get John Malone on the phone…. besides I’m not as obsessed with him as Efrim is with Shields.
Tomas: I can imagine how many HR Tommy would give up in Colorado….
McFann: No probs.
ChattTownBrian
August 16th, 2012
12:42 pm
I met Dennis Haskins the guy who played Mr Belding on Saved by the bell, at the doctor’s office this morning LOL. He lives here in Chatt. I knew right away who he was and he sat right next to me. I watched that show everyday before and after school back in the day. You can tell he’s used to being recognized, he was very nice though.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
12:43 pm
Thanks DOB for those numbers…
Shields might be worth it for his contract, but not for what we’d pay to get him. Teheran/Delgado + Spruill/Graham+ 1 or 2 more is too much.
Brian from SC
August 16th, 2012
12:44 pm
I don’t know if it’s still the case, but Mr. Belding used to make a living off of appearing at various places, like bars and stuff, for promotional value. So it stands to reason he doesn’t mind people knowing who he is/was.
George
August 16th, 2012
12:47 pm
Did I hear something this morning about MILK-DUD being on PEDs?
CB
August 16th, 2012
12:50 pm
George, you been in a cave the last 24 hours? Wait, don’t answer that.
George
August 16th, 2012
12:53 pm
CB
August 16th, 2012
12:50 pm
If true no wonder he is playing so much better this year, funny I kinda liked the dude when he was here.
Homer the Brave
August 16th, 2012
12:53 pm
I agree with Chipper that keeping Bourn should be the #1 goal in the off season. There should be more than enough money coming off the books to make it happen. Naturally, this would mean that we could not afford David Wright also (assuming the Mets decline his option). But I doubt Wright is on the Braves wish list anyway. Braves can probably sign an inexpensive outfielder like Angel Pagan and move Prado to 3B.
The lineup would look something like:
CF Bourn
3B Prado
RF Hayward
C McCann
1B Freeman
2B Uggla
SS Simmons
LF Pagan
P Pitcher
CB
August 16th, 2012
12:56 pm
George, I knew Melky had at least 1 fan when he was here. Congrats.
George
August 16th, 2012
12:59 pm
Homer the Brave
August 16th, 2012
12:53 pm
Who is this new guy “PITCHER”? Is he any good?
DS1
August 16th, 2012
1:00 pm
Bourn and Headley or Willingham should just about do it. Call it good. The Bourn part might be a little tough pulling off though. And the Headley or Willingham deal will cost a decent bounty.
Patrick
August 16th, 2012
1:01 pm
I didn’t get a chance to respond at all to DOB’s excellent blog yesterday.
But I did want to throw a couple comments out there.
First off, MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA for Melky. As we all know, he SUCKED when he was on the Braves. I’m not the least bit surprised that he took PED’s to get better because he has always been a mediocre player at best, this season was too good to be true and that’s what it proved to be. He is a piece of crap, I thought so when he got traded here, I thought so even more after he left and now he’s hit the top of the POS charts now. One thing I wish is that MLB could breakdown how many wins that he was the main factor in for the Giants and strip them of those wins, thus probably taking them out of, of at least putting a serious dent in their postseason run.
Second, AND THIS QUESTION/COMMENT IS FOR DOB. I’d like to get your opinion.
With regarding signing Bourn. We all know two things. 1. The Braves are cheap and 2. They are not committed to doing what it takes to win it all. They do just enough to make fans think that they are committed, but they aren’t. So, with that being said, we all know that they WILL NOT raise the team’s payroll just to re-sign Bourn. That means, if they really do indeed want to keep him. They are going to have to get creative. My question/comment is would the Braves consider trading McCann? Before everyone freaks out, think about the logic…thanks to St. Louis, they have set a ridiculously high bar with Yadier Molina’s assinine contact. And it has been said already that after Molina signed that contract that it’s going to be very difficult for the Braves to re-sign McCann. So, if the Braves were to trade McCann, not only could they free up a huge chuck of additional payroll not only to ensure that they re-sign Bourn, but also aquire maybe another top tier run producer or ace starting pitcher. At the same time, they could probably get a good package of prospects, or even just 1 highly rated prospect from a team (I’m sure there are many that woudl love McCann) and as DOB mentioned, the Braves do not have anyone in the minors that is anything close to 1. Being an elite centerfielder or 2. A leadoff hitter. and our GM has done a great job of depleting the farm system of depth and gave up our #2 prospect for Maholm and Johnson…when a good GM, could have acquired those 2 players without giving Vizciano up, I’m sure of it.
So the pro’s: 1. Free up payroll to re-sign Bourn and another top tier player 2. Re-stock the farm system outweight (in my opinion) the one con. Losing a fan favorite in McCann…who has shown that he is starting to decline in production, it’s sad but true. I’m sure an American League team woudl love to have him, they could part time DH him, part time have him catch.
So, when you think about it. It does make sense.
DOB, What do you think?
DS1
August 16th, 2012
1:02 pm
I realize it probably wouldn’t happen, and the bounty would be huge (costing probably Prado, Teheran, Bethancourt, plus others); but how would Giancarlo look between Heyward and Freeman for the next 10 years?
Is Loria insane enough to do that deal?
Homer the Brave
August 16th, 2012
1:02 pm
George,
“Pitcher” is better than Jurrgens but not as good as Hudson.
DS1
August 16th, 2012
1:05 pm
Patrick
Do you really think DOB is going to read a question that is so long (and hard to read with few paragraph breaks)?
Just sayin……..
Simplify and retry.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:05 pm
Is Loria insane enough to do that deal?
No way. Teams may try, but I think both Stanton and Reyes are staying put. They trade Stanton and not a soul will show up to that park.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
August 16th, 2012
1:05 pm
DOB How much is McCann’s shoulder bothering him? Well, only he knows, but consider that he hit .308 with 9 HRs, 21 RBI in 18 games from 7/5-7/31. In 11 games since, he’s hit .118 w/ no extra-base hits and 1 RBI.
Aye-yi-yi-yi-yi…
DS1 @ 12:40—
I’m beginning to wonder that myself…
DAP
August 16th, 2012
1:05 pm
patrick They do just enough to make fans think that they are committed, but they aren’t.
if you dont think they are committed, and youre a fan, then i guess they DONT do enough to make fans think they are committed.
if your ideas indicate a commitment to winning, why would the braves do any of what you suggested, since we have established beyond a doubt that they arent committed to winning?
George
August 16th, 2012
1:05 pm
Homer
Ok so he will most likely be our 4th starter.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:06 pm
And folks say Huddy is a 2 at best. Just not seeing the love affair with Shields. He might be worth the 9-12 million he can make over the next 2 years.
I think both guys are #2 starters. Shields a bit better, imo. Move that guy to the National League and I’d bet his numbers look a ton better. His velocity is actually up this year.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
1:14 pm
Shields is probably a better acquisition than any of the FA pitchers, also. I’m just not certain that the Braves match up with the Rays for a deal.
Arkansas Transplant
August 16th, 2012
1:19 pm
I find it amusing how someone can come to the Braves and make a couple of good starts and all of a sudden they aren’t tradable, they’re our new ace, we need them.. yada yada…
And on the flip-side, quite amusing as well, we’ve got all of the depth which will translate to wins.. sorry folks but quantity does not equal quality, much like adding extra players to a trade doesn’t all of a sudden equal the value you’d want back.
We need a true number one guy, there’s no way around that.
DS1
August 16th, 2012
1:23 pm
scoots
Braves would have to get a 3rd team involved to match up w/ the Rays.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:25 pm
I’m just not certain that the Braves match up with the Rays for a deal.
We really don’t. They need major league ready catching. I think they are locked in with Longoria, Jennings, Joyce, and Zobrist as position players for 2013. If Zobrist plays RF, then the major league needs are SS, 2B, 1B, DH, C. Lots of work to do on their side this offseason. Even in the minors, they have an abundance of pitching. Bethancourt would be of interest to them, but I’d bet they look for a different trade package from another team if they move Shields.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
1:26 pm
DS1: True… Rays need a catcher…. with the way BMac is going, we might need to keep our catching prospect.
As for DLing BMac, I’m only for it if Gattis gets to come up!
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
1:27 pm
Braves would have to get a 3rd team involved to match up w/ the Rays.
Awright! Let’s get one of those six-teamers going, trading guys from both leagues, pitchers, hitters, prospects, couple of dancing girls; make it so complicated that one team ends back up with a couple of players they traded in the first place.
Frank could do that. Not many GMs could, but Frank could.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:28 pm
The Rays are starting Jose Molina at catcher. Jose Molina.
Lew
August 16th, 2012
1:28 pm
Transplant – He’s good. He’s cheap and we have him for next year. Who would you trade him for that would be any better for $6.5 million?
Besides – they will fill either LF, 3B and CF. They aren’t going to revamp the entire team and they already have a decent pitching staff and an excellent bullpenb. WEren isn’t going out and signing Grienke, trading for Josh Jonson or any other of a numer of pitchers people think we have to have.
He’s got more than enough to do filling the positions with no one in them.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
1:31 pm
The Rays are starting Jose Molina at catcher. Jose Molina
Well, that might be enough to make them desperate, so we got hope.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:31 pm
Wren isn’t going out and signing Grienke, trading for Josh Jonson or any other of a numer of pitchers people think we have to have.
Hudson, Hanson, Maholm, Minor and one of Medlen, Delgado, Teheran would not put me on the edge of the roof…..but I’d be very disappointed.
Lew
August 16th, 2012
1:32 pm
Efrim – Prepare to be dissappointed. And please don’t jump off the roof – Duyde, you just got married – it can’t be that bad already.
DS1
August 16th, 2012
1:34 pm
Efrim
Don’t go out that 2nd story window; we have Ben Sheets too!
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
1:36 pm
Hudson, Hanson, Maholm, Minor and one of Medlen, Delgado, Teheran would not put me on the edge of the roof…..but I’d be very disappointed.
With Chipper and Bourn in the lineup, you could probably live with that (as the team is now doing). Such a rotation’s liabilities could probably be covered up by a top-3 run-scoring team. However, plug in two lesser offensive talents and run differential probably becomes a little more iffy.
Lew
August 16th, 2012
1:36 pm
Besides – maybe Gilmartin is ready or Sheets proves worth giving a deal for next year. I wouldn’t count on much more – AND they will re-sign O’Flaherty – after the four year stretch he’s hjad with the Braves, they be stupid not to. He’s worth working out a deal with and gives us (still) the best pen around, especially now that it looks like Gearrin and Avilan are good to go.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
August 16th, 2012
1:39 pm
I was thinking maybe they could DL BMac when Hanson comes back, but that wouldn’t work since they’d need a backup catcher…
Anyway, with Chipper back in there tonight, I wonder if Ross gets to start behind the plate or if Fredi will wait till tomorrow night with the lefty going for LA…
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:41 pm
With Chipper and Bourn in the lineup, you could probably live with that (as the team is now doing). Such a rotation’s liabilities could probably be covered up by a top-3 run-scoring team. However, plug in two lesser offensive talents and run differential probably becomes a little more iffy.
That’s pretty much the way I’m looking at it. It’s going to be awfully hard to have as productive of an offense next year with the loss of Chipper and Bourn.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
1:43 pm
Efrim – Prepare to be dissappointed. And please don’t jump off the roof – Duyde, you just got married – it can’t be that bad already.
I won’t jump with that rotation,
But I may if it’s that plus Juan at 3rd base.
cabravesfan
August 16th, 2012
1:47 pm
Just a heads up for anyone headed to the game tonight:
LV Ware @LV_Ware
Atlanta traffic going to be HORRIBLE tonight .. #Falcons preseason game & THEN @Braves Chipper Jones bobble head night! Im staying in
Lew
August 16th, 2012
1:50 pm
Efrim – Juan depends entirely on how much they spend for a CF, I would imagine. If they spend their bankroll on a CFer, I could see them picking up a RH 3B platoon partner with Juan and leaving Martin in LF – or another LFer like Reed Johnson and having Martin move back and forth with RJ (or whomever) playing LF against LHP.
John Leonard
August 16th, 2012
1:51 pm
Don’t kill me to quick,but what if Macs done?Ross won’t hold up for a full season,and I have not heard of a catcher in our system ready.
flange1
August 16th, 2012
1:52 pm
Traffic horrible?
In Atlanta?
NEVER!!!
Ha
Trey
August 16th, 2012
1:53 pm
Ouch
http://aol.sportingnews.com/mlb/story/2012-08-15/umpire-kicked-in-head-greg-gibson-torii-hunter-angels-indians?icid=maing-grid7|maing6|dl16|sec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D193211
BravesFanInMaine
August 16th, 2012
1:55 pm
In watching the braves this year they are both exciting and frustrating at times… but I believe the braves have lined them selves up in good position for the starting rotation for next year…. I dont want grienke at all… too much money for him IMO….. next resign bourn…. the braves dont have an outfielder in the system that is even close to being a bourn or andruw jones type….. The braves need an extra 10 million added to the payroll to help with signing an extra player or two….. this offseason is a make or break year for them…. I would also say bye bye to McCann…. hes struggled since the eye problem and he just not the same!!! GO BRAVES AND WIN THE DIVISION!!!!
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
1:55 pm
I won’t jump with that rotation,
But I may if it’s that plus Juan at 3rd base.
I’d jump if Juan is at 3rd base, regardless of the rotation. Heck, I’ll jump if he’s still on the team next year!
He just doesn’t fit in if we have Janish and Rev, unless he’s gonna learn 1B
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
1:55 pm
It’s going to be awfully hard to have as productive of an offense next year with the loss of Chipper and Bourn.
My plan would be to get the best offensive players I could for the two OF spots in order to minimize the dropoff, and then count on my young players to continue their growth as a cover for whatever shortfall there might be. Might not be quite as explosive as this year, but not by an order of magnitude. I’d hope.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
August 16th, 2012
1:59 pm
BMAC IS NOT DONE!!!!
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
2:03 pm
cab: Traffic is always bad in Atlanta… worse than LA
I’m staying in too…
cabravesfan
August 16th, 2012
2:04 pm
Just passing on the info in case anyone didn’t realize there was a football game going on too
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
2:04 pm
I hope so McFann…. but it’s hard to deny that he has not done too well since the last 2 years, esp. since the oblique… Hope he gets it turned around.
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:05 pm
My plan would be to get the best offensive players I could for the two OF spots in order to minimize the dropoff,
Willingham and who?
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:06 pm
insane to think Mac is done
Fish Bisch
August 16th, 2012
2:07 pm
So what is up with all the Cheetah ads?
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:10 pm
Penn State is paying legal bills for all ACCUSED university officials but they are not paying bills of McQueary, key witness against sandusky. if i had a shred of sympathy for Penn State, it is all gone now.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
August 16th, 2012
2:15 pm
TOBF—
Yeah, that’s one fact you can’t help but face up to. He’ll get it turned around, though…whether or not it happens this season remains to be seen—it’s entirely possible, though!…
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 16th, 2012
2:16 pm
I find it insane to go to a pre-season game for a good team like the Falcons… I’m not going until the reg. season. Waste of money, imo.
Mike S.
August 16th, 2012
2:16 pm
Your answer to the Bourn question is the same as the answer to the following:
Has Liberty Media been know to open the check book for the Braves?
Bourn is going to command more money during the offseason than the Braves will be able to spend. I can almost guarantee that. Add in the fact they have to replace Chipper in the middle of the lineup among other things, and I have no idea what will happen. For all we know, Liberty could use Chipper dropping off the books as an excuse to trim payroll even further.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:17 pm
Willingham and who?
Dunno. I don’t think they can go full-tilt on all three areas (LF, CF, and SP), so CF might end up a little scrubby. If they can wrangle up a LF with some sock and a front-line SP, I’d guess they’ll go with a good-glove guy in CF and just pray over his bat before each game.
But CF would be third on my priority list. The FO may have different thoughts, of course, or the market might force a different approach. Too soon to know, but I’m all for mid-August rampant speculation, LOL.
David O'Brien
August 16th, 2012
2:17 pm
Heyward’s past 50 games: .292 with 22 extra-base hits (11 homers), 29 RBIs, 40 runs, .364 OBP, .526 slugging (.890 OPS)
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:19 pm
Garrett (California)
Remeber in May all those people on twitter kept asking you why was Jason Heyward so hyped and why was he still in the big leagues? Those were funny.
Klaw (2:16 PM)
There was one Atlanta fan in particular who was obsessive about it – kept RT’ing a beat writer who was also running Heyward down, and quoting arbitrary-endpoint stats. Haven’t heard from him in ages.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:20 pm
.364 OBP, .526 slugging (.890 OPS)
The kid has simply GOT to get that OBP up, LOL.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:22 pm
Remeber in May all those people on twitter kept asking you why was Jason Heyward so hyped and why was he still in the big leagues? Those were funny.
Well, they were certainly funnier than the .200 BA the kid was sporting, I’ll give you that.
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:25 pm
But CF would be third on my priority list.
in that case, will Reed Johnson do in CF? Bourjos will cost sacrificing a chicken before each game for hitting..
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:25 pm
Well, they were certainly funnier than the .200 BA the kid was sporting, I’ll give you that.
I think there was reason for concern in May, for sure. Once June hit, like the second it hit, he just went off and has mostly been so since. Best yet, his walk rate has been better in the 2nd half.
I mean, look at his full body of work. The only thing he isn’t doing is hitting LHP. Everything else has been elite. Everything.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:26 pm
I don’t know, scoots. Simmons and an all glove CF hitting 7-8? What are we, the Rays?
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:29 pm
in that case, will Reed Johnson do in CF?
I’d like him more off the bench, spelling different guys and PH. I don’t get a sense that he has the defensive skillset to play an everyday CF. But I really don’t know enough about him to make a call on that.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:29 pm
The kid has simply GOT to get that OBP up, LOL.
You still gonna be disappointed if he doesn’t hit .880?
I keep clamoring for one more .900+ month, and that will probably secure an .850 for the kid – which I’d do backflips for. His defense, basrunning and an .850 – that’s awesome.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:31 pm
Simmons and an all glove CF hitting 7-8?
There’s at least hope for Simmons to hit.
You want a dang pitcher, dontcha? A lightweight CF might be part of the price.
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:31 pm
The only thing he isn’t doing is hitting LHP.
just like Francisco?
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:32 pm
You want a dang pitcher, dontcha? A lightweight CF might be part of the price.
Good call. Go get that Bourjos kid.
DAP
August 16th, 2012
2:34 pm
You want a dang pitcher, dontcha? A lightweight CF might be part of the price.
rick ankiel.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:34 pm
You still gonna be disappointed if he doesn’t hit .880?
A tad, yes. But it’s pretty hard to pick up a .390 OBP when you’re hitting .270; just a few too many outs on balls in play.
But I won’t be overly disappointed.
Arkansas Transplant
August 16th, 2012
2:34 pm
But CF would be third on my priority list.
Pretty much the way I would categorize it.
Brian from SC
August 16th, 2012
2:35 pm
Baseball Reference WAR for major league outfielders (Melky removed). This is their total ranking, but I grouped them by position
CF
1. Mike Trout, 8.1
2. Andrew McCutchen, 5.9
3. Michael Bourn, 4.8
7. Austin Jackson, 4.1
LF
4. Matt Holliday, 4.5
5. Ryan Braun, 4.3
9. Alex Gordon, 3.8
10. Martin Prado, 3.7
RF
6. Josh Reddick, 4.2
8. Jason Heyward, 4.1
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:36 pm
Good call. Go get that Bourjos kid.
rick ankiel.
Kee-rist, I said “lightweight”, not “germ-weight”.
cricket
August 16th, 2012
2:36 pm
rick ankiel.
willingham from LF can then hit ankiel in CF as a cut off man and he will throw runners out at home..
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:38 pm
1. Mike Trout, 8.1
Total coma. Kimbrel might have to relinquish the nickname “Nintendo”.
Eight? EIGHT? My goodness gracious.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:38 pm
7. Austin Jackson, 4.1
Boy, did he improve of what? Talk about a three team trade working for all sides….
Although Detroit and New York definitely got mroe value than Zona did, imo.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:40 pm
Eight? EIGHT? My goodness gracious.
I still can’t get over that he was from Jersey and the Northeast high school ranks, therefore the scouts didn’t see this. It’s incredible. He’s going to win the MVP during his 20-21 year old season and he wasn’t even up at the start of the year.
Arkansas Transplant
August 16th, 2012
2:41 pm
I wanted to trade Bourn for Jackson before the season began.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:42 pm
He’s going to win the MVP during his 20-21 year old season and he wasn’t even up at the start of the year.
Think the Angels are all that concerned about Super 2 status for the kid?
Arkansas Transplant
August 16th, 2012
2:44 pm
If we’re going to make a trade this off season, I’d rather try to acquire Gary Brown from the Giants to man CF.
JC Brave
August 16th, 2012
2:44 pm
The Nats are gonna collapse….they’ve been supposed to do so all year long!
I would really love that, but they look really strong and their offense is almost unrealistically effective this year. No lead is safe against them and every break seems to go their way. The more Nationals games I watch, the more I believe they may not fall apart; instead, they’ll keep rolling until the end of september.
Arkansas Transplant
August 16th, 2012
2:45 pm
or possibly even Bubba Starling.
Efrim
August 16th, 2012
2:45 pm
I wanted to trade Bourn for Jackson before the season began.
You saw this 2012 from Jackson? I mean, come on AT. No one saw this sort of improvement.
ncscoots
August 16th, 2012
2:47 pm
No lead is safe against them and every break seems to go their way. The more Nationals games I watch, the more I believe they may not fall apart; instead, they’ll keep rolling until the end of september.
Drinking the kool-aid, LOL.
Just think of how much good karma they have used up getting to this point. If the bill gets called this year (and it may not; the baseball gods don’t operate on the same schedule as mortals), they are due for some heartbreak in the last 50.