OnlyBraves – What exactly, is it that you’ve seen in Pastornicky so far that makes him untradebale? His defense? His power? Or maybe his on base ability?
Lew: I don’t think he’s untradeable, but I really like the dude. Don’t want to see him go. If he’s traded, I’ll understand, but I am a big fan of the kid. His bat/speed doesn’t hurt.
Plus, playing in Atlanta (Fulton Co./ East Cobb) is a world apart from Anaheim (Orange County south of Los Angeles). Atlanta is a better fit for Greinke, I think.
Is Cliff Lee going to resurrect the Phils? That team has some big problems. I’m guessing Phils’ execs move in the direction of shedding payroll and getting younger. A lot of downsides keeping higher paid older vets and not winning.
And I don’t think it’s an either/or in negotiations with the Dodgers (if they occur). I don’t know that Amaro will say, “Your two top pitching prospects or nothing.” More possibilities than that.
Is Cliff Lee going to resurrect the Phils? That team has some big problems.
I actually don’t think they have big problems. They are old, and that’s a problem. But Hamels, Halladay, Lee, Worley, Kendrick is still a solid rotation. And despite last night’s performance, they have the makings of a good bullpen with power arms + Papelbon. Their outfield is a mess and the infield is old – so they need a good bench and 2-3 new outfielders. I think one more run is in store for 2013.
I’m guessing the Angels will throw scads of money at Greinke to stay in Anaheim.
Well, they’re 0-3 in his starts so far, so guess he’d better start performing for them. Got pounded again by Oakland last night. One good game out of 3 for LAA.
His ERA since July 1 is over 6. I know that’s a small sample, but that’s not what an ace is s’posed to be about. I’d be very leery about giving him megabucks for megayears.
The league has adjusted to this kid… For a once-every-four-generation talent, he’s really not setting up props for that generation. Mike Trout on the other hand is dominating.
Their outfield is a mess and the infield is old – so they need a good bench and 2-3 new outfielders. I think one more run is in store for 2013.
I’m not sure Phils’ execs agree. They did unload players before the trade deadline. I think Amaro would have dealt Lee had he gotten his return (and the window for negotiations was small).
Maybe the Phils will give it one more go in 2013. But the signs might suggest otherwise.
I’m not ready to declare that Uggla has turned the corner, I’d like to see what he does over the next few games first. Although, 2 multi hit games in a row is quite promising.
Glad to see Uggla finally doing something with the stick. Maybe he’ll keep it up. Still want his butt gone, but I guess it won’t happen until that monster contract expires in 15 yrs or so….
Dan Uggla is staring down his first non-30HR season since his rookie campaign… or he’s going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
Doesn’t sound like someone who going to shed payroll and go with the kids for now
They can win the World Series next year, I think. But it’s a whole new mess of roster reshaping after 2013. And like I said, letting Halladay, Utley and Kendrick walk makes the most sense.
I’m not sure Phils’ execs agree. They did unload players before the trade deadline. I think Amaro would have dealt Lee had he gotten his return (and the window for negotiations was small).
They unloaded players that made sense to unload. Victorino and Blanton are free agents at the end of the year, and as much as I like Pence, he isn’t worth the 14 million he’ll get in the last year of arbitration. Getting Lindblom, Martin, Joseph, and Rosin was solid overall(although I feel like he should of gotten more for Pence – Gary Brown?).
or he’s going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
I’m predicting at least one low-arc laser over the wall at Citi this weekend. Last time I made that prediction, he struck out 4 times in the next game, so let’s not repeat that again, Dan.
And like I said, letting Halladay, Utley and Kendrick walk makes the most sense.
I think that depends. They aren’t in a position where they need to slash payroll by half. (If they are, then by all means avoid the contracts). Halladay is not a bad one to bring back.
They unloaded players that made sense to unload. Victorino and Blanton are free agents at the end of the year, and as much as I like Pence, he isn’t worth the 14 million he’ll get in the last year of arbitration.
Yep. That “fire sale” was a wise move to do in the world of no comp picks. Those guys were going to walk and they’d get no benefit from it. So instead they pulled in talent. Talent they can keep or utilize to make a contender next season.
I sure hope Hudson can fix whatever is ailing him this offseason. He’s obviously worth his option year, but I certainly wouldn’t sign him to any kind of extension or anything. The guy is damaged.
I certainly wouldn’t sign him to any kind of extension or anything.
Take his 9mil option and re-do it into a 2yr deal at 5mil each… Save some money next year, have him really cheap for 2014. If he’s hurt, it’s not entirely bad.
I realize I’m not very smart, but I also know I’m not totally stupid either….
I haven’t seen this question asked, but why in the heck didn’t Hudson have these bone spurs removed during the offseason while he was already recovering from his back surgery? I understand they were supposedly not causing him trouble, but wasn’t it likely, if not obvious, that they probably would again at some point? It didn’t take 2 games for them to become a big issue. Now they’re threatening to derail the guy, frankly, when we’ll desperately need him.
I will say this about the Phils’ situation, on further reflection.
Reconstituting the outfield is no small thing. The infield is old, with Utley and Howard having significant injury histories. Improving the bench? That’s not necessarily easy finding the right fits and good caliber players.
And given the disaster that the Phils have been this season, is ownership willing to double-down and spend money for one more run in 2013? Because I’m guessing the Phils would need to spend some real money to meet their needs satisfactorily.
Medlen, Venters, O’Flarety, Pastornicky, Fransisco, Janish, Hanson, Martinez, these guys are all trade bait.
Especially Juan. Maybe he and Hanson can get us a LF or CF.
I would try my hardest to avoid Hanson… and I don’t know that Minor is up for something like that mentally.
I would try to avoid Hanson as well. Maybe put him in the ‘pen. If Minor pitches lights out in September, maybe… But I’d prefer to not have him start that wild-card game.
i dont know why they traded pence. he could have really helped them next year.
14 million is a hefty chunk of change, DAP. Maybe they saw a market for just as productive outfielders this winter for half the cost. Plus, they got players back for him.
Jayson Stark @jaysonst
But just so he knows, Ross wasn’t even the active leader in most games without an SB. The Astros’ speedy Chris Snyder (688) is still No. 1!
since when does something like that matter to the phils? they need him in 2013.
And if they use that money in a different way to strengthen the team? It’s not just “well, they need Pence so that was a stupid move”. They got prospects back for him to strengthen a system that stinks AND don’t have his salary on the books and can spend it elsewhere next year. Maybe they think Michael Bourn is a better fit moving forward. Who knows?
I think I’ve said it before, but I’ll say it again: David Ross is the man. I don’t care if he hits .190…he plays a big part on this team. Proud that he’s a Brave.
We can get enough runs if the pitching does well, I’m sure. We had enough offense in game 162 last year (even after the ump stole a run from us, with Bourn). The pitching “fell short” in that game.
No DH in the NL, for either team. And if Greinke decides to sign with the Rockies… so beit. I was merely angling for him to sign with the Braves, who play in a pitchers park, and speaking with optimism that the Braves and their pitchers park would be in the WS with home field advantage.
Brian: Are you suggesting that Rossy should be starting?
No way…if he started, he would definitely hit .190. His value is veteran leadership, huge clubhouse chemistry addition, and letting Mac get a day off without it hurting the team much.
Yes. It’s been since Eddie Perez that I rooted for and boasted of the back up catcher.
His story also seems similar to me anyway as Diaz’s…
David Ross as a Brave: .274/.364/.469/.833
David Ross as not a Brave .222/.309/.435/.744
Matt Diaz as a Brave .299/.347/.449/.796
Matt Diaz as not a Brave: .257/.306/.349/.655
I think I’ve said it before, but I’ll say it again: David Ross is the man. I don’t care if he hits .190…he plays a big part on this team. Proud that he’s a Brave.
You bet. I really hope he stays with the Braves because I think he’ll make a damn good coach of some sort, if not a manager. I know it’s an overused cliche, but in this case it really holds true: He holds value in veteran leadership and handling of the pitching staff.
efrim, im just saying, when a team has that payroll, im overpaying for the solid hitter and defender in RF for one year at $14mil, because i dont want to try and field a winning team with 4 of 8 starting spots a mystery. doesnt make sense to me, unless they got prospects who are ready to start, in which case…where are they? they need to be playing now. instead we have mayberry and dominic brown.
I hope we’re pretty aggressive on the Greinke front this offseason, if he decides to go elsewhere, then so be it. But I think that would be the best course to travel. That would still leave us with our ability to use our resources in other area as we see our needs.
I was under the assumption that was already gone due to the 6-8 weeks he missed this year.
He must hit all the quals to get it. At least 225IP next year, 415IP over 12-13 and not be on the DL at the end of 2013. He’ll end this year with about 165+ IP if nothing happens. Then next season he’d have to pitch 252 Innings to have it vest. It’s a lot, but that would certainly be worth $20M. He’s done it once, averages 232 IP a season (prior to this season) and has come close multiple times. So it isn’t entirely out of his reach. He could also pitch deep in every one of his games the rest of the season and make the burden next year lower. He goes 8 innings from here on out, he’d have to turn in an average Halladay season and it would vest.
Apparently that guy is in Minnesota. And, despite reports on as much, he apparently can be had for the right package of prospects, something the Phillies just spent the deadline acquiring…
That’s gonna get all the BMac bashers in a frenzy….
I hope we’re pretty aggressive on the Greinke front this offseason. I think that would be the best course to travel. That would still leave us with our ability to use our resources in other area as we see our needs.
im just saying, when a team has that payroll, im overpaying for the solid hitter and defender in RF for one year at $14mil, because i dont want to try and field a winning team with 4 of 8 starting spots a mystery. doesnt make sense to me, unless they got prospects who are ready to start, in which case…where are they? they need to be playing now. instead we have mayberry and dominic brown.
DAP, you’ve spent how many posts talking about outfielders available in free agency, etc. How do we know what they can get through trade? It’s too early to speculate, but they acquired some currency in prospects to make that sort of a move. Pence is good, but at one year and 14 million – that’s a ton of cash for one year of him and they felt it was best to get Joseph, Schierholtz, and Rosin, and spend that Pence money elsewhere – maybe on Josh Willingham, maybe use it to sign Michael Bourn, maybe trade for Denard Span, maybe Mickey Mantle. Who knows? I think it was the smart move to trade Victorino and Blanton and close to equally as smart to move Pence. Depends on what they do this winter, though. But they have a lot more flexibility to make moves than they did before this now that they’ve added Lindblom, Martin, Joseph, Schierholtz and Rosin.
not being a smartazz here but yes D Ross is a good guy. lets not overestimate the importance though. best backup in the league, yeah probably. still who can name Yadier’s backup last season. Buster’s year before? nice luxury and sure a asset, just not a huge asset IMO
Pence is good, but at one year and 14 million – that’s a ton of cash for one year of him and they felt it was best to get Joseph, Schierholtz, and Rosin, and spend that Pence money elsewhere – maybe on Josh Willingham, maybe use it to sign Michael Bourn, maybe trade for Denard Span, maybe Mickey Mantle. Who knows?
You may be right. But I’m suspicious of the Phils turning around and spending a boatload of money on players (or a player, like Bourn), with the obligations they still have on the books. Yes, they’ve unloaded budget, but adding it back (or a significant portion of it) with the question marks they have?
Should be interesting to see what the Phils’ ownership and team execs do this winter. I think the Phils need to keep shedding payroll and position for a rebuild. But who knows what the pressures are? The Phils going from premiere franchise to also-rans in one season has to be tough to deal with.
Will the Bourn/Boras tag team wrestle a 20 mil per annum deal come Nov.? Who is really that well off to pay a 30 year old, line-drive….strike out frequency rich nice guy that kind of loot? The Yanks? They have their guy. Us? Not a chance.
Bourn would do well to continue eating southern grits in Buckhead…..take less, a lot less….and stay put. I maybe off but 11-14k per year for his services seems on target and that is a Wren do good.
Money is not a problem for the Phils. They will not dwell in the basement for an extended period of time. They are by no means a team like say the Astros
2,190 comments Add your comment
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:35 am
Efrim
Bingo – Backloaded deals!
Yeah, the Braves are gonna backload Greinke’s deal
Lew
August 9th, 2012
9:37 am
OnlyBraves – What exactly, is it that you’ve seen in Pastornicky so far that makes him untradebale? His defense? His power? Or maybe his on base ability?
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
9:38 am
What exactly, is it that you’ve seen in Pastornicky so far
I think it’s the plethora of nicknames that can be riffed off of his surname.
Lew
August 9th, 2012
9:40 am
Ten Paul – Didn’t think of that one.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:40 am
Lew: I don’t think he’s untradeable, but I really like the dude. Don’t want to see him go. If he’s traded, I’ll understand, but I am a big fan of the kid. His bat/speed doesn’t hurt.
Plus, playing in Atlanta (Fulton Co./ East Cobb) is a world apart from Anaheim (Orange County south of Los Angeles). Atlanta is a better fit for Greinke, I think.
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
9:40 am
Is Cliff Lee going to resurrect the Phils? That team has some big problems. I’m guessing Phils’ execs move in the direction of shedding payroll and getting younger. A lot of downsides keeping higher paid older vets and not winning.
And I don’t think it’s an either/or in negotiations with the Dodgers (if they occur). I don’t know that Amaro will say, “Your two top pitching prospects or nothing.” More possibilities than that.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:41 am
I was a Pastornicky fan since we traded for him… Always rooted for him. I even have 3 Pastornicky jerseys!
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
9:43 am
Bryce Harper in his last 41 games since June 13th, 221 plate appearances – .210/.285/.305
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
9:45 am
Is Cliff Lee going to resurrect the Phils? That team has some big problems.
I actually don’t think they have big problems. They are old, and that’s a problem. But Hamels, Halladay, Lee, Worley, Kendrick is still a solid rotation. And despite last night’s performance, they have the makings of a good bullpen with power arms + Papelbon. Their outfield is a mess and the infield is old – so they need a good bench and 2-3 new outfielders. I think one more run is in store for 2013.
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
9:45 am
Bryce Harper in his last 41 games since June 13th, 221 plate appearances – .210/.285/.305
Has he been taking pointers from Dan Uggla?
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:45 am
I hope the Nats keep starting the overrated Harper. It will be essential to their collapse.
Trader Jack
August 9th, 2012
9:45 am
Jeff R
Ruben Amaro has stated that “The luxury tax is an issue, but not the issue, the issue is getting the team back into the playoffs”
Doesn’t sound like someone who going to shed payroll and go with the kids for now
MikeInFl
August 9th, 2012
9:47 am
I’m guessing the Angels will throw scads of money at Greinke to stay in Anaheim.
Well, they’re 0-3 in his starts so far, so guess he’d better start performing for them. Got pounded again by Oakland last night. One good game out of 3 for LAA.
His ERA since July 1 is over 6. I know that’s a small sample, but that’s not what an ace is s’posed to be about. I’d be very leery about giving him megabucks for megayears.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
9:48 am
Bryce Harper in his last 41 games since June 13th
The league has adjusted to this kid… For a once-every-four-generation talent, he’s really not setting up props for that generation. Mike Trout on the other hand is dominating.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
9:48 am
You’re easiest way for payroll flexibility is to play out 2013 and let Halladay, Utley, and Kendrick walk. That’d be over 40 million off of the books.
Lew
August 9th, 2012
9:49 am
They don’t have any kids to go with.
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
9:49 am
Their outfield is a mess and the infield is old – so they need a good bench and 2-3 new outfielders. I think one more run is in store for 2013.
I’m not sure Phils’ execs agree. They did unload players before the trade deadline. I think Amaro would have dealt Lee had he gotten his return (and the window for negotiations was small).
Maybe the Phils will give it one more go in 2013. But the signs might suggest otherwise.
phil
August 9th, 2012
9:51 am
Ross stole a base…..whooopeee
Meanwhile, we’re still 4 games behind. Better focus on sweeping the Mets this weekend, unless we’re ok with likely losing more ground to the Nats.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
9:51 am
Mike Trout on his 21st birthday had a career line of .314/.377/.547/.924 over 128 games, 541 PA… including 25 major league home-runs.
My conquests by my 21st birthday are not something to post in a public forum.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
9:52 am
I’m not ready to declare that Uggla has turned the corner, I’d like to see what he does over the next few games first. Although, 2 multi hit games in a row is quite promising.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:52 am
The more Greinke struggles in the AL, the more the likelihood that the Braves can get him… a mid-market NL team that he loves.
phil
August 9th, 2012
9:53 am
Our “Ace” didn’t look so good last night….sigh.
Glad to see Uggla finally doing something with the stick. Maybe he’ll keep it up. Still want his butt gone, but I guess it won’t happen until that monster contract expires in 15 yrs or so….
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
9:55 am
I for one hopes Greinke doesn’t get comfortable in LA.
Trader Jack
August 9th, 2012
9:55 am
Having seen Mike Trout play high school ball many times, the kid is a complete package,
P.S. You should have seen him pitch
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
9:55 am
Dan Uggla is staring down his first non-30HR season since his rookie campaign… or he’s going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
9:57 am
Doesn’t sound like someone who going to shed payroll and go with the kids for now
They can win the World Series next year, I think. But it’s a whole new mess of roster reshaping after 2013. And like I said, letting Halladay, Utley and Kendrick walk makes the most sense.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
9:57 am
I’d really like to see that happen.
Yeah, who wouldn’t?
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
9:58 am
Our “Ace” didn’t look so good last night
And hasn’t looked so great recently either… I think he’s hurting. If we had Greinke…
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
9:59 am
I’m not sure Phils’ execs agree. They did unload players before the trade deadline. I think Amaro would have dealt Lee had he gotten his return (and the window for negotiations was small).
They unloaded players that made sense to unload. Victorino and Blanton are free agents at the end of the year, and as much as I like Pence, he isn’t worth the 14 million he’ll get in the last year of arbitration. Getting Lindblom, Martin, Joseph, and Rosin was solid overall(although I feel like he should of gotten more for Pence – Gary Brown?).
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:00 am
I could careless what the Phillies decide to do or not do.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:01 am
I for one hopes Greinke doesn’t get comfortable in LA.
Me two! I am not worried about his AL struggles. Just hope the Angels don’t want him back.
he’s going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
Me too… that’d be a great way to finish the season, and go into the playoffs. Talk about being on fire.
Hillbilly
August 9th, 2012
10:03 am
or he’s going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
I’m predicting at least one low-arc laser over the wall at Citi this weekend. Last time I made that prediction, he struck out 4 times in the next game, so let’s not repeat that again, Dan.
phil
August 9th, 2012
10:03 am
If Uggla hits 18 homers in the next 50 games, I’ll eat my keyboard…
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:04 am
And like I said, letting Halladay, Utley and Kendrick walk makes the most sense.
I think that depends. They aren’t in a position where they need to slash payroll by half. (If they are, then by all means avoid the contracts). Halladay is not a bad one to bring back.
Lew
August 9th, 2012
10:04 am
If he can’t win AL games, then he really won’t be much help in the WS, would he?
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
10:05 am
They unloaded players that made sense to unload. Victorino and Blanton are free agents at the end of the year, and as much as I like Pence, he isn’t worth the 14 million he’ll get in the last year of arbitration.
Good points.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:06 am
They unloaded players that made sense to unload.
Yep. That “fire sale” was a wise move to do in the world of no comp picks. Those guys were going to walk and they’d get no benefit from it. So instead they pulled in talent. Talent they can keep or utilize to make a contender next season.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:07 am
If he can’t win AL games, then he really won’t be much help in the WS, would he?
He’d be pitching in NL parks…. because the NL dominates the All-Star game.
Murph
August 9th, 2012
10:08 am
I sure hope Hudson can fix whatever is ailing him this offseason. He’s obviously worth his option year, but I certainly wouldn’t sign him to any kind of extension or anything. The guy is damaged.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:09 am
If he can’t win AL games, then he really won’t be much help in the WS, would he?
Only let him pitch in the Ted, a pitchers park. Keep him out of those hitter’s parks.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:09 am
If we make the playoffs as a wild card, who do we start in that decisive game?
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:10 am
I certainly wouldn’t sign him to any kind of extension or anything.
Take his 9mil option and re-do it into a 2yr deal at 5mil each… Save some money next year, have him really cheap for 2014. If he’s hurt, it’s not entirely bad.
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
10:11 am
If we make the playoffs as a wild card, who do we start in that decisive game?
You’re asking in early August? Ask me again the last week of the season, and I might be able to answer it.
Lew
August 9th, 2012
10:11 am
Yep, no hitter’s parks in the NL.
phil
August 9th, 2012
10:12 am
I realize I’m not very smart, but I also know I’m not totally stupid either….
I haven’t seen this question asked, but why in the heck didn’t Hudson have these bone spurs removed during the offseason while he was already recovering from his back surgery? I understand they were supposedly not causing him trouble, but wasn’t it likely, if not obvious, that they probably would again at some point? It didn’t take 2 games for them to become a big issue. Now they’re threatening to derail the guy, frankly, when we’ll desperately need him.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:13 am
AT: Probably Hudson, though if Sheets can keep this up, he’s a good option. A power pitcher. Exactly what you need in the playoffs.
DAP
August 9th, 2012
10:13 am
Medlen, Venters, O’Flarety, Pastornicky, Fransisco, Janish, Hanson, Martinez, these guys are all trade bait.
phil
August 9th, 2012
10:13 am
If we have to play in the wild card game, who we start won’t matter at all….
What will matter is will the bats show up for that game? We all know the likely answer based on years of history.
Murph
August 9th, 2012
10:14 am
If we make the playoffs as a wild card, who do we start in that decisive game?
Good question. Right now I’d say just go with whoever’s turn it is in the rotation. All of the starters have warts this season.
If it’s close to his turn, I’d actually opt for Hudson… hurt or not, the guy is a gamer, and he knows how to pitch in “the big game”.
I would try my hardest to avoid Hanson… and I don’t know that Minor is up for something like that mentally.
Hudson or Sheets would be my choice.
DAP
August 9th, 2012
10:15 am
efrimTheir outfield is a mess and the infield is old – so they need a good bench and 2-3 new outfielders.
i dont know why they traded pence. he could have really helped them next year.
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
10:15 am
I will say this about the Phils’ situation, on further reflection.
Reconstituting the outfield is no small thing. The infield is old, with Utley and Howard having significant injury histories. Improving the bench? That’s not necessarily easy finding the right fits and good caliber players.
And given the disaster that the Phils have been this season, is ownership willing to double-down and spend money for one more run in 2013? Because I’m guessing the Phils would need to spend some real money to meet their needs satisfactorily.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:18 am
It would definitely be a tricky decision as of right now. I’d be leaning towards Hudson myself, but I wouldn’t do it without some sort of concerns.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:18 am
Medlen, Venters, O’Flarety, Pastornicky, Fransisco, Janish, Hanson, Martinez, these guys are all trade bait.
Especially Juan. Maybe he and Hanson can get us a LF or CF.
I would try my hardest to avoid Hanson… and I don’t know that Minor is up for something like that mentally.
I would try to avoid Hanson as well. Maybe put him in the ‘pen. If Minor pitches lights out in September, maybe… But I’d prefer to not have him start that wild-card game.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
10:19 am
i dont know why they traded pence. he could have really helped them next year.
14 million is a hefty chunk of change, DAP. Maybe they saw a market for just as productive outfielders this winter for half the cost. Plus, they got players back for him.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:20 am
It would definitely be a tricky decision as of right now. I’d be leaning towards Hudson myself, but I wouldn’t do it without some sort of concerns
And a short, short leash. Shorter than what he had yesterday.
Venice Jim
August 9th, 2012
10:21 am
Jayson Stark @jaysonst
But just so he knows, Ross wasn’t even the active leader in most games without an SB. The Astros’ speedy Chris Snyder (688) is still No. 1!
DAP
August 9th, 2012
10:23 am
efrim as much as I like Pence, he isn’t worth the 14 million he’ll get in the last year of arbitration.
since when does something like that matter to the phils? they need him in 2013.
Mixxo
August 9th, 2012
10:24 am
“If we have to play in the wild card game, who we start won’t matter at all….
What will matter is will the bats show up for that game? We all know the likely answer based on years of history.” – phil
This.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
10:25 am
Halladay is not a bad one to bring back.
I’d consider bringing Doc back. Just not at 20 million a year, but perhaps he proves he’s worth that next year.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
10:27 am
since when does something like that matter to the phils? they need him in 2013.
And if they use that money in a different way to strengthen the team? It’s not just “well, they need Pence so that was a stupid move”. They got prospects back for him to strengthen a system that stinks AND don’t have his salary on the books and can spend it elsewhere next year. Maybe they think Michael Bourn is a better fit moving forward. Who knows?
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
10:27 am
I think I’ve said it before, but I’ll say it again: David Ross is the man. I don’t care if he hits .190…he plays a big part on this team. Proud that he’s a Brave.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:28 am
We can get enough runs if the pitching does well, I’m sure. We had enough offense in game 162 last year (even after the ump stole a run from us, with Bourn). The pitching “fell short” in that game.
Trader Jack
August 9th, 2012
10:28 am
What concerns me most is that the Braves don’t lock in a playoff spot prior to the last series in Pittsburgh
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:29 am
Yep, no hitter’s parks in the NL.
No DH in the NL, for either team. And if Greinke decides to sign with the Rockies… so beit. I was merely angling for him to sign with the Braves, who play in a pitchers park, and speaking with optimism that the Braves and their pitchers park would be in the WS with home field advantage.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:30 am
but perhaps he proves he’s worth that next year.
If he proves that much next year, he’d be performing at a rate which would vest his 2014 option.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:32 am
Brian: Are you suggesting that Rossy should be starting?
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
10:33 am
If he proves that much next year, he’d be performing at a rate which would vest his 2014 option.
Ah, I was under the assumption that was already gone due to the 6-8 weeks he missed this year. But I was unsure on that.
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
10:34 am
Brian: Are you suggesting that Rossy should be starting?
No way…if he started, he would definitely hit .190. His value is veteran leadership, huge clubhouse chemistry addition, and letting Mac get a day off without it hurting the team much.
Mixxo
August 9th, 2012
10:34 am
Brian from SC @ 10:27
Agreed. Guy is the consummate pro.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:35 am
10Paul @10:30…. Hit it right on the nail!
tiger297
August 9th, 2012
10:35 am
I want meldeen starting my wild card game…
DAP
August 9th, 2012
10:38 am
efrim Maybe they saw a market for just as productive outfielders this winter for half the cost.
id like to know where they saw that.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:38 am
I want meldeen starting my wild card game
That might not be so bad…
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:39 am
David Ross is the man.
Yes. It’s been since Eddie Perez that I rooted for and boasted of the back up catcher.
His story also seems similar to me anyway as Diaz’s…
David Ross as a Brave: .274/.364/.469/.833
David Ross as not a Brave .222/.309/.435/.744
Matt Diaz as a Brave .299/.347/.449/.796
Matt Diaz as not a Brave: .257/.306/.349/.655
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
10:40 am
Since 2009, catchers OPS with at least 500 PAs:
1. Mauer, .891
2. Napoli, .863
3. Posey, .863
4. V. Martinez, .852
5. Ross, .833
6. Ruiz, .829
7. Montero, .818
8. McCann, .815
9. Posada, .807
10. C. Santana, .805
keylargo
August 9th, 2012
10:40 am
Here’s why the Marlins won’t move Jose Reyes this year or next.
2012 29 Miami Marlins $10,000,000
2013 30 Miami Marlins $10,000,000
2014 31 Miami Marlins $16,000,000
2015 32 Miami Marlins $22,000,000
2016 33 Miami Marlins $22,000,000
2017 34 Miami Marlins $22,000,000
2018 35 Miami Marlins *$22,000,000 $22M Team Option, $4M Buyout
Earliest Free Agent: 2018
Hillbilly
August 9th, 2012
10:42 am
I think I’ve said it before, but I’ll say it again: David Ross is the man. I don’t care if he hits .190…he plays a big part on this team. Proud that he’s a Brave.
You bet. I really hope he stays with the Braves because I think he’ll make a damn good coach of some sort, if not a manager. I know it’s an overused cliche, but in this case it really holds true: He holds value in veteran leadership and handling of the pitching staff.
DAP
August 9th, 2012
10:42 am
efrim, im just saying, when a team has that payroll, im overpaying for the solid hitter and defender in RF for one year at $14mil, because i dont want to try and field a winning team with 4 of 8 starting spots a mystery. doesnt make sense to me, unless they got prospects who are ready to start, in which case…where are they? they need to be playing now. instead we have mayberry and dominic brown.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:42 am
I hope we’re pretty aggressive on the Greinke front this offseason, if he decides to go elsewhere, then so be it. But I think that would be the best course to travel. That would still leave us with our ability to use our resources in other area as we see our needs.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:44 am
I was under the assumption that was already gone due to the 6-8 weeks he missed this year.
He must hit all the quals to get it. At least 225IP next year, 415IP over 12-13 and not be on the DL at the end of 2013. He’ll end this year with about 165+ IP if nothing happens. Then next season he’d have to pitch 252 Innings to have it vest. It’s a lot, but that would certainly be worth $20M. He’s done it once, averages 232 IP a season (prior to this season) and has come close multiple times. So it isn’t entirely out of his reach. He could also pitch deep in every one of his games the rest of the season and make the burden next year lower. He goes 8 innings from here on out, he’d have to turn in an average Halladay season and it would vest.
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:44 am
or he’s (Uggla) going to hit 18 HR over the next 50 games. And honestly, I’d really like to see that happen.
He hit 16 over 53 games last year… from Aug. 1 to season’s end. From August 9th to season’s end, he hit 12.
keylargo
August 9th, 2012
10:45 am
I want meldeen starting my wild card game…
is that james deen’s younger brother? Dizzy Deen?
keylargo
August 9th, 2012
10:46 am
The Uggla love by bloggers filled with hatred last week is remarkable.
TennesseePaul
August 9th, 2012
10:47 am
id like to know where they saw that.
Apparently that guy is in Minnesota. And, despite reports on as much, he apparently can be had for the right package of prospects, something the Phillies just spent the deadline acquiring…
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:48 am
Uggla love?
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
10:49 am
5. Ross, .833
8. McCann, .815
That’s gonna get all the BMac bashers in a frenzy….
I hope we’re pretty aggressive on the Greinke front this offseason. I think that would be the best course to travel. That would still leave us with our ability to use our resources in other area as we see our needs.
Agree.
Arkansas Transplant
August 9th, 2012
10:49 am
I think your missing the point.. it’s more Uggla optimism.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
10:56 am
im just saying, when a team has that payroll, im overpaying for the solid hitter and defender in RF for one year at $14mil, because i dont want to try and field a winning team with 4 of 8 starting spots a mystery. doesnt make sense to me, unless they got prospects who are ready to start, in which case…where are they? they need to be playing now. instead we have mayberry and dominic brown.
DAP, you’ve spent how many posts talking about outfielders available in free agency, etc. How do we know what they can get through trade? It’s too early to speculate, but they acquired some currency in prospects to make that sort of a move. Pence is good, but at one year and 14 million – that’s a ton of cash for one year of him and they felt it was best to get Joseph, Schierholtz, and Rosin, and spend that Pence money elsewhere – maybe on Josh Willingham, maybe use it to sign Michael Bourn, maybe trade for Denard Span, maybe Mickey Mantle. Who knows? I think it was the smart move to trade Victorino and Blanton and close to equally as smart to move Pence. Depends on what they do this winter, though. But they have a lot more flexibility to make moves than they did before this now that they’ve added Lindblom, Martin, Joseph, Schierholtz and Rosin.
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
11:01 am
Alex Wood going for Rome tonight. Julio Teheran starting for Gwinnett as well.
MAD
August 9th, 2012
11:06 am
not being a smartazz here but yes D Ross is a good guy. lets not overestimate the importance though. best backup in the league, yeah probably. still who can name Yadier’s backup last season. Buster’s year before? nice luxury and sure a asset, just not a huge asset IMO
Jeff R
August 9th, 2012
11:06 am
Pence is good, but at one year and 14 million – that’s a ton of cash for one year of him and they felt it was best to get Joseph, Schierholtz, and Rosin, and spend that Pence money elsewhere – maybe on Josh Willingham, maybe use it to sign Michael Bourn, maybe trade for Denard Span, maybe Mickey Mantle. Who knows?
You may be right. But I’m suspicious of the Phils turning around and spending a boatload of money on players (or a player, like Bourn), with the obligations they still have on the books. Yes, they’ve unloaded budget, but adding it back (or a significant portion of it) with the question marks they have?
Should be interesting to see what the Phils’ ownership and team execs do this winter. I think the Phils need to keep shedding payroll and position for a rebuild. But who knows what the pressures are? The Phils going from premiere franchise to also-rans in one season has to be tough to deal with.
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
11:09 am
Haha…from Buster Olney’s tweet just now, I did some math:
When Craig Kimbrel throws a first pitch strike (gets ahead 0-1), this is what batters this year have done:
64% have struck out
13% have reached base
23% have put the ball in play for an out
Capt.Mudd
August 9th, 2012
11:11 am
Will the Bourn/Boras tag team wrestle a 20 mil per annum deal come Nov.? Who is really that well off to pay a 30 year old, line-drive….strike out frequency rich nice guy that kind of loot? The Yanks? They have their guy. Us? Not a chance.
Bourn would do well to continue eating southern grits in Buckhead…..take less, a lot less….and stay put. I maybe off but 11-14k per year for his services seems on target and that is a Wren do good.
Lew
August 9th, 2012
11:12 am
Shorter than the leash they had on Hudson yesterday? He gives up an ERA of over 7 in the firt inning. How short is that leash? Three batters?
Efrim
August 9th, 2012
11:12 am
Wow. Just noticed Wood went 5 IP, 2 hits, 1 ER, 1 BB, and 8 K’s in his last start. A real solid debut for him so far: http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?pos=P&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=622072
Be interested to see how he does at the upper levels. His breaking ball needs work, but the kid brings the heat and has a great changeup.
Brian from SC
August 9th, 2012
11:14 am
I feel strongly that Boras will get at least $15 million a year for Bourn.
Trader Jack
August 9th, 2012
11:15 am
Jeff R
Money is not a problem for the Phils. They will not dwell in the basement for an extended period of time. They are by no means a team like say the Astros
TheOnlyBravesFan
August 9th, 2012
11:15 am
Alex Wood going for Rome tonight. Julio Teheran starting for Gwinnett as well.
Wonder who does better tonight…. I say Wood
David O'Brien
August 9th, 2012
11:17 am
Braves are 18-8 with a league-leading 3.18 ERA since the All-Star break; Nats are 19-9 with a 3.42 ERA since break.
Capt.Mudd
August 9th, 2012
11:18 am
@Trader Jack……..They are the ‘Yanks’ of PA in terms of pocket depth!