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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
1,929 comments Add your comment
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
4:24 pm
Well, then, this is obviously Heaven (since I’m here), and a Braves’ WS win is a foregone conclusion.
Ha! I think the Mayan end date was August 27th/28th, 2011.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
4:24 pm
Pitched three games in a row? 4 pitches and out. Two innings and out and then a start on five days’ rest.
Let’s get real. If that truly affected his performance in thos three games, he’s not what we need anyway.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:24 pm
Sure this has been posted but I just got home from work so here it is again.
The Braves have been connected to several pitchers this summer, but ESPN’s Jayson Stark hears from other teams that Atlanta is only interested in acquiring top-of-the-rotation pitchers at the deadline (Twitter link).
As Stark notes, that contradicts reports that link the Braves to names like Francisco Liriano and Jason Vargas. Atlanta has been linked to Zack Greinke, but GM Frank Wren will reportedly only part with his prized young pitching prospects if he’s able to extend Greinke. Wren is unlikely to exceed $20MM annually in an offer for Greinke. The Brewers themselves are said to be gearing up for an offer in th five-year, $100MM range to retain their ace.
The Braves have seen young arms like Mike Minor and Randall Delgado struggle this season and turned to Ben Sheets in the short-term. Sheets had a brilliant Atlanta debut, but it’s unlikely that he’d be counted on for significant contributions. After losing Brandon Beachy to Tommy John surgery earlier this summer, it stands to reason that they’d seek a front-line arm to replace his fantastic 2012 numbers.
jharber
July 17th, 2012
4:25 pm
I think we have 3 on a short leash, Frank, John and freddi. Mc guirk knows the pressure is on.
MiaBchBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:26 pm
Sheets started in mid-July, which means that the only barrier the rest of the way is health. Count me as one who thinks that Sheets will answer the bell on September 30th, and beyond.
One-Eyed Mac
July 17th, 2012
4:27 pm
Todd Redmond called up by the Reds
Bay Area Steve
July 17th, 2012
4:27 pm
I’ve long wondered how much knowledge is passed from the vets to the younger players. I figure that knowledge is mostly the mental side of the game. The thinking, the preparation, the travel, the grind. All that. But, I wonder how much is actually ball. How often it’s a Chipper saying the right thing to trigger a Heyward’s mind about dealing with fastballs in. Or a Wilson talking to a Pastornicky about reading balls off the bat…
I guess I said all that to say: I hope Ben Sheets curveball has some osmosis to it. I swear that Meds’ hook looked as good as ever in his last appearance. Coincidence, I’m sure. But it had a quick, sharp break. Moved significantly down. Maybe Jurrjens can get a lesson. His slurve was always his third best pitch, but now with the slower arm speed, it’s turned into an ugly, rolling thing with HIT ME written all over it. JJ, Teheran. Heck, all of ‘em, maybe Sheets’ hammer can rub off a little.
jharber
July 17th, 2012
4:28 pm
LEW I agree, think James Shields is on franks radar too.
cricket
July 17th, 2012
4:29 pm
ATL had no idea how much it was getting scre**d by Vick -
“Back when I was involved in those activities, I may have become more dedicated to the deep study of dogs than I was to my Falcons playbook. I became better at reading dogs than reading defenses. That’s just so sad to say right now, because I put more time and effort into trying to master that pursuit than my own profession . . . which was my livelihood . . . which put food on the table for my family.”
He also talked about lying to NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell:
“I knew how to lie with a straight face. Sad to say, Commissioner Goodell bought into what I was saying, and I think he truly believed me that I was telling the truth. I deeply regret not telling him the truth from the outset.
“It was a very nervous time for me. I knew I was going to try to lie my way through the whole dogfighting case and see if money, good lawyers, and manipulating the system could get me out of the position I was in — which was a terrible position.”
Coach (2012 Fredi's Beisbol Fandango)
July 17th, 2012
4:30 pm
The Braves have just 37 quality starts (six innings or more, three earned runs or fewer) this season, second-fewest in a league where nine teams have more than 50…….
You know what’s really lost in this statement?
It’s that ninety-nine percent of the readers here don’t truly understand what a “quality start ” consists of. Six innings and three earned isn’t exactly correct, 6 innings 3 earned runs is the cut off and there is a reason why.
From Wikipedia:
An early criticism of the statistic, made by Moss Klein, writing in The Sporting News, is that a pitcher could conceivably meet the minimum requirements for a quality start and record a 4.50 ERA, seen as undesirable at the time. Bill James addressed this in his 1987 Baseball Abstract, saying the hypothetical example (a pitcher going exactly 6 innings and allowing exactly 3 runs) was extremely rare amongst starts recorded as quality starts, and that he doubted any pitchers had an ERA over 3.20 in their quality starts. This was later confirmed through computer analysis of all quality starts recorded from 1984 to 1991, which found that the average ERA in quality starts during that time period was 1.91
However, this statement still doesn’t address the concrete answer, as to how John Lowe came up with 6 innings and 3 earned runs as his cut off for the definition of a quality start. This is the Aha moment where the answer appears: Lowe put math to the test and therein lies the nugget of truth.
Since 1950, teams have won at a .677 clip in games where they received a quality start, with the range running from .642 in 1968 to .717 in 1950. It hasn’t been above .700 since 1958, when scoring was just 4.28 runs per game, but it was above .680 11 times from 1994 through 2007, with a high of .698 in 1996.
Here is the basic cut and dried formula: any start ABOVE the threshold of a 4.50 ERA along with 6 innings equals out to roughly a .700 winning percentage, or 70% of all games played when a quality start happens end up as wins. Or as John Lowe so aptly put it…..
“I got the idea in 1983 and ’84,” Lowe said. “I was hearing managers saying they were looking for six innings from their pitchers. I heard Whitey Herzog say ‘all I want from my pitchers is six good innings.’” That’s where six innings came from. And the runs? “Six and two is too stingy, six and four is too much. I wasn’t going to get into a more than or less than. This was new and had to be understandable.”
Woody Woodward
July 17th, 2012
4:30 pm
RC–the fredi moment I have to let go was on June 13 against the yanks. Braves down by one in the eighth, men on first and third with one out and he fails to send the guy to second on a steal to avoid the DP. prado grounds into a double play. Braves lose the game.
cricket
July 17th, 2012
4:32 pm
curveball with osmosis would really dip
phil
July 17th, 2012
4:33 pm
Vick didn’t say anything that’s very surprising there…
By the way, can he pitch 7 strong?
Murph
July 17th, 2012
4:33 pm
This is the first “Last 9 of the Starting 9″ I can remember where there weren’t 2 or 3 of the big bats hitting around .200. Uggla is the last holdout (not counting Janish).
phil
July 17th, 2012
4:35 pm
A quality start is simply arbitrary….
And I don’t see a lot to be thrilled about with 3 ER on the board in 6 innings.
Unless it’s Minor pitching, of course….
Cole Hamels
July 17th, 2012
4:37 pm
I called Frank Wren to see if I could play for the Braves. He didn’t seem to know who I was and asked me if I had ever played in the Japanese league.
Good luck Braves fans with that douche as your GM.
jeffrey d
July 17th, 2012
4:38 pm
And I don’t see a lot to be thrilled about with 3 ER on the board in 6 innings.
Yeah, but that’s the minimum. A complete game shutou is also a quaity start.
Arkansas Transplant
July 17th, 2012
4:39 pm
Much rather have Greinke over Shields… I just don’t see Shields as a number one starter.
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
4:39 pm
JJ, Teheran. Heck, all of ‘em, maybe Sheets’ hammer can rub off a little.
I wish. Though they’ve had Hanson’s yakker up here for a couple years, and that doesn’t seem to have helped anybody.
Ken Stallings
July 17th, 2012
4:41 pm
The return of an effective Jurrjens combined with a very promising outing by Ben Sheets is accounting for the deeper rotation. The starters with the singular exception of Tommy Hanson’s last start have kept the Braves in every game where either a few early runs were enough to win, or the team was able to come from a few runs back to win. That confidence in the pitchers allows the hitters to relax a bit — synergy at work.
If Jurrjens and Sheets can remain effective and put up consistent quality starts, then suddenly this is a good starting rotation. Considering the ailments for the once dominant Phillies rotation, the Braves might wind up with the best rotation in the NL. Combined with a better than average lineup of hitters, and this is the mix that can win. I just want to get Simmons back with that glove because I think his defense allowed the starters to relax a bit and have confidence to pitch to contact.
UNCBrave
July 17th, 2012
4:42 pm
Agree Arkansas Transplant…..Grienke is the ONLY #1 starter of the names mentioned..
phil
July 17th, 2012
4:43 pm
I just don’t see much to like in a 4.5 ERA….minimum or not, which yes, it is.
Something about a starter giving up no more thna 2 earned has always struck a chord with me. Arbitrary, sure, but it’s a number I’ve always liked for 5 innings or more, 3 once you hit 8 or 9.
Call me crazy…
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
4:44 pm
This is the first “Last 9 of the Starting 9″ I can remember where there weren’t 2 or 3 of the big bats hitting around .200. Uggla is the last holdout (not counting Janish).
This is the highest 9 game stretch this season for the Braves starters in terms of OBP, SLG, and OPS. The starters have really mashed over the last 9 games.
Arkansas Transplant
July 17th, 2012
4:45 pm
And the best thing about Greinke is the fact he wants to be in Atlanta. It’s nice to be wanted…
Bat Masterson
July 17th, 2012
4:45 pm
“I don’t even know what the letters PHD stand for”
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/saltlaketribune/obituary.aspx?n=val-patterson&pid=158526785
Lew
July 17th, 2012
4:45 pm
Thrilled or not, three runs in six innings means that even if you haven’t scored yourself, the game is at worst three zip and you still are in the game.
Might not be all that important a stat, but as a poinjt of departurte, what it does mean is that – at worst – your starter kept you in the game.
nolie
July 17th, 2012
4:46 pm
Well, then, this is obviously Heaven (since I’m here), and a Braves’ WS win is a foregone conclusion…scoots
and I was thinking it had to be hell since Bitchell is here……
RC
July 17th, 2012
4:46 pm
RC–the fredi moment I have to let go was on June 13 against the yanks. Braves down by one in the eighth, men on first and third with one out and he fails to send the guy to second on a steal to avoid the DP. prado grounds into a double play. Braves lose the game.
That one is tough, but I’ve got to say that I’d probably side w/ Fredi there. Of all the guys you expect to not hit into a DP, Prado is pretty high on the list, and trying to steal a bag runs a risk of getting the guy on first out anyway.
Not walking the hottest hitter in baseball in extra innings with the winning run on 2nd, 1st base open, 1 out (meaning a double play ends the inning), and one of the worst hitters in baseball on deck….that I can’t forgive (until they win the Series).
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:46 pm
John (Tennessee)
Rumors abound regarding the Braves making a move for a top starter — Greinke, Shields, Dempster. Do you see that happening or are they more likely to go for a mid-rotation guy like Liriano or Garza?
Jayson Stark (12:12 PM)
I hear they’re only interested in a top-of-the-rotation starter, a difference-maker, an impact arm, etc. But who is that other than Greinke? Unless someone surprising pops onto the market in the next two weeks, Greinke is the only guy who fits their mold (assuming the Phillies won’t trade Hamels within the division). And he has all the dollar signs attached to him. Ben Sheets could make this whole discussion irrelevant if he keeps pitching the way he pitched Sunday.
Dadgum.......
July 17th, 2012
4:46 pm
I don’t think Wren pulls the trigger on any player he doesn’t expect to keep or sign through at least 2013-14. He could sign Greinke. Couldn’t sign Dempster due to his current posturing at least. Even if Sheets performs as he did in his first start I don’t see Wren sighing a big relief and thinking Sheets is the man. Just doesn’t figure. Beachy is a big unknown now as to timetable. Sheets a long term gamble. I say Wren pulls a big trade for Greinke. Gonna lose two pitchers. Probably Minor and Medlen plus a prospect.
ATL Insider
July 17th, 2012
4:47 pm
Frank Wren is known for pulling off a deal no one has really thought of. He is said to be seeking a top of the rotation guy. While Greinke has the stuff and Atlanta is not a high pressure market, the pressure of the postseason may be too much for him. I think someone along the lines of Josh Johnson of the Marlins could be more the ticket. He is signed through next season ($13.75M) and has ace stuff. He has had some injury problems, but he is not on a long-term deal. MLBTR is reporting the Marlins would consider trading him. I think a package centered around Delgado would be perfect. Of course other pieces would have to be included, but Delgado would be the main component. The deal could also be expanded to include Infante, who is also signed through next season ($4M). He could provide additional flexibility and depth for 3B and OF. I don’t know what it would take to make the deal happen, but there is a possible match.
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
4:47 pm
Arbitrary, sure, but it’s a number I’ve always liked for 5 innings or more
Man, I see a pitcher lasting only 5 and I get bummed. Couldn’t care less if it was 5 shut-out no-hit innings. He only pitched half the game. That’s not good. I like seeing over 6 innings. A starter getting into the 7th as a minimum is what I want. That, and the team holding a lead at that point.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
4:47 pm
phil – No, you can’t be crazy. Crazy already is and they don’t tolerate identity theft on the blog.
UNCBrave
July 17th, 2012
4:48 pm
KC Royals DFA LHP Jonathan Sanchez (former Giant)…..Wren will probably think that’s a front-line starter
kenhotlanta
July 17th, 2012
4:48 pm
Bruce Augustin: Dave Alvin played for X in 1987 while they were recording the “See How We Are” album and has been with them as a fill in off and on for years.
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
4:48 pm
and I was thinking it had to be hell since Bitchell is here……
Even in Heaven, one has to have context. Else, how would one know just how heavenly it actually is?
nolie
July 17th, 2012
4:49 pm
3.80 ERA is a poor man’s Ace
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:49 pm
Nick (Charlotte, NC)
Once Simmons returns for the Braves, does Janish provide the infield depth necessary to allow Prado to play full-time in left field? I am not sure how many more times I can watch Diaz/Hinske play the outfield. If not, is there a chance another trade could be made?
Jayson Stark (12:54 PM)
The Braves are looking for righthanded-hitting outfield bats. But it seems as if I’ve typed that sentence 10,000 times over the last year or so. I don’t see them making a major deal for a hitter. But they’re looking.
timthebrave
July 17th, 2012
4:49 pm
RemoW Blows me away that Chipper is retiring and is a better hitter then 50% of the players on MLB rosters.
I think it has more to do with injuries than skills
Ozzie G.
July 17th, 2012
4:50 pm
Hey Dave. Remember me? I was a Brave once. I played for Mr. Cox. These crazy Cubans in Miami are after my job just because I love Fidel. Now a 19 year old Nats’ rookie has been making fun of me.
….I’m losing it fast.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
If that one play turned you against Fredi, it’s doubtful that you’d ever find a manager that made you happy. Pretty certain that all managers screw some situation up during the course of every season.
And Fredi hate aside, the Braves have ghone 136-112 since he took over. Somehow, the Braves have been a winning team since he took over.
Shaun
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
Last 9 of the Starting 9 is something statheads look at. The enlightened look at how good the players are at baseball. And the only stats they look at are ones that give us insight in to that.
Just be facetious, mostly, trying to get under your skin. Trying to stir the pot and poke at many of you.
Shaun
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
Sorry. That should read “just being facetious.”
Brian from SC
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
RC, I have to disagree with one point. I don’t mean to run the guy down, but Prado is actually probably the most likely Brave to ground into a double play. He’s a ground ball hitter and not very fast. He’s led the Braves in GIDPs the last two years.
richbrave
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
DOWN ON THE FARM
GCL – ORLANDO
MOUSEKATEERS defeated once again by the PIRATES 6-5.
RHSP ROBERTO ‘Star’ ESTRELLA [4.34 ERA] 5.0 IP, 6 H, 1 R/ER, 0 BB, 4 SO.
Solid start.
RHRP ADAM HOLLAND [6.35 ERA] 2.0 IP, 1 H, zeros.
Excellent middle-relief.
RHRP RICHIE TATE [L 1-1, 2.41 ERA] 1.1 IP, 5 H, 1 HR, 5 R/ER, 0 BB, 3 SO.
Sucky closing. Walk off yard-shot…..
Lead-off 2012 12th rounder CF CONNER LIEN [.259 BA] 2-5, 2 R, 1 3B [1], 1 RBI [6], 1 SB [7], 1 SO.
2012 14th rounder DH TY TEWELL [.350 BA] 2-3, 1 R, 1 2B [2], 1 RBI [12], 1 SO.
2012 28th rounder 2B K.C. CLAYBOUGH [.417 BA] 2-2, 2 R, 1 BB, 2 SB [2].
Soph 1B JACKSON LAUMANN .288 BA] [2-5, 1 2B [4], 1 SO.
2012 4th rounder LF JUSTIN BLACK [.172 BA] 2-4, 1 BB, 1 SO.
SS ERIC GARCIA [.111 BA] 1-5, 1 2B [1], 2 RBI [2], 1 SO.
RF FEMELYS SANCHEZ [.235 BA] 1-5, 2 SO.
nolie
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
I don’t even know what the letters PHD stand for …BAS
Education Degrees….
BS = well we all know what that stands for
MS = More of the Same
PHD = Piled Higher and Deeper
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
4:51 pm
I am not sure how many more times I can watch Diaz/Hinske play the outfield.
Yet another guy not paying attention.
UNCBrave
July 17th, 2012
4:52 pm
ATL Insider,
You must not have read DOB’s post on the last blog re: Johnson….An ace with a 4+ ERA and owed 13.5 million?
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:52 pm
What do you make of the Braves’ recent hot streak?
David Schoenfield (1:14 PM)
Deepest lineup in the NL (along with St. Louis). Not surprised. If Sheets can hold up, Braves may not rate as wild-card No. 1 favorite.
cricket
July 17th, 2012
4:53 pm
Jonathan Sanchez is available
MiaBchBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:54 pm
Just a thought.
If Wilson can’t hit anymore, and he has the range of a postage stamp these days, it stands to reason that when Simmons is healthy again, Paul Janish should be the backup SS by virtue of his superior glovework and equal hitting output. Hell, it’s not like Wilson played for those outstanding Pirate playoff teams of the early/mid 00’s or those division winning Mariner teams of the mid/late 00’s, and has valuable experience to bring to the fore. We have bench coaches for that.
Just sayin’.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:54 pm
Brian (Mexico)
Hola David! Do you consider Kimbrel best reliever in all MLB (considering present and future)?
David Schoenfield (1:29 PM)
Yes
Bay Area Steve
July 17th, 2012
4:54 pm
“trying to get under your skin. Trying to stir the pot and poke at many of you.”
Yet only managing to make yourself look like an arrogant, humorless asshat. Again.
KK
July 17th, 2012
4:55 pm
I’m available.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:55 pm
Brian (Mexico)
In therms of total career (fame and aura put away) I consider Chipper superior player than Jeter. Jeter has more hits because of he’s been leadoff batter and has had less injuries, but Chipper gets more on base, has a lot more power, and better defense. What do you think?
David Schoenfield (1:32 PM)
Hmm, without looking at it, pretty close, no? I think Jeter’s position advantage and durability give him the slightest of edges.
Shaun
July 17th, 2012
4:56 pm
Lew, I agree. I don’t think there are very many good tactical managers. Most managers screw up quite often, in terms of doing things purely based on tradition and convention as opposed to what would actually work best. Most of the tactics that nearly all managers use are based on tradition and convention instead of what actually would work best, based on all sorts of data, evidence and research. I think many baseball fans could do at least as decent a job as most current managers, possibly a better job than most managers.
The things that most fans couldn’t do are things like earning respect in the clubhouse, working the media, organizing, motivating, etc.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:56 pm
Dale (KY)
Garza to the Braves still seems extremely logical to me. Tehrehan and Minor for Garza fair?
David Schoenfield (1:35 PM)
I don’t know what to make of Teheran right now. Keith Law still likes him and he’s still very young. I’m guessing the Cubs make that deal; not sure about the Braves.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
4:56 pm
KJ (Charlotte)
Nationals fans are way too convinced that they will steal Bourn away from the Braves this offseason. He likes it in Atlanta and the Braves have lots of payroll room to bring him back next year.
David Schoenfield (1:35 PM)
Agreed. And not sure where the Nats are getting all this money from.
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
4:57 pm
Now a 19 year old Nats’ rookie has been making fun of me.
Speaking of Harper, which of these players is the “generational” talent?
Through 67 games:
A: .273/.346/.451 – 8 HR, 15 2B as a rookie
B: .259/.378/.473 – 11 HR, 13 2B as a rookie
unbelievable
July 17th, 2012
4:57 pm
No chance the Braves trade two of Minor, Delgado, and Teheran unless its for an ace. Garza isnt one.
tony austin
July 17th, 2012
4:57 pm
Down on the farm:
Corn and soy beans are growing.
Sorry richbrave and everyone else, just my ill fated attempt at humor. Everyone enjoy the rest of your day!
Arkansas Transplant
July 17th, 2012
4:58 pm
Josh Johnson could make sense depending on the price expected in return and whether or not the Marlins pick up some of the tab. But I’d hate to think if he was to come over and get injuried.. plus adding another question mark to the rotation.
Honestly, what rotation doesn’t have a question mark above it’s head? Everyone is an injury risk.. just matters if the risk is worth the reward.
RC
July 17th, 2012
4:58 pm
RC, I have to disagree with one point. I don’t mean to run the guy down, but Prado is actually probably the most likely Brave to ground into a double play. He’s a ground ball hitter and not very fast. He’s led the Braves in GIDPs the last two years.
I honestly didn’t realize he led the team. I still think that with him batting you are better off trusting him to get a hit (or at least NOT hit into a DP) than risking the runner at 1st being thrown out. But obviously in this case I would have been wrong.
Really
July 17th, 2012
4:58 pm
Yeah good call Nolie education is for idiots
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:00 pm
Brent (Iowa)
Who do you think the Braves go after in the end Dempster, Garza, Greinke, or Liriano? Any chance of getting Justin Upton?
David Schoenfield (2:15 PM)
I still wonder if Ben Sheets IS their acquisition. Braves are not big spenders. Although Cubs are willing to pay most of Dempster’s salary if it means getting a better prospect.
ATL Insider
July 17th, 2012
5:01 pm
UNCBrave,
No, I didn’t read DOB’s last article. But I’m looking at a pitcher who, despite the struggles this year, owns a career 3.15 ERA and is 28 years old. He has ace type stuff, but like many who have played for Ozzie in the past is struggling. The entire Marlins team is struggling. I think he could really do well here. While he is not a 2/3 month rental, there is no long-term committment either. In order to get a young, promising hispanic pitcher (amongst other pieces), they may be willing to eat some salary, at least for this season.
I’m saying the deal would pan out. I’m just saying this is a realistic possibility.
I wouldn’t touch Greinke with all of his issues and Hamels would cost too much.
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
5:01 pm
No worries Payne, I draft up the L9S9 for all the rest of baseball fans who take pleasure in every aspect of the game.
But just so you didn’t feel completely shunned by me and the rest of baseball, I included wOBA just for you. So, go ahead and feel special. Not too special, but you know, you’re normal level of haughtiness with a tad higher nose lifting.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
5:02 pm
Garza just isn’t that good. Don’t really think he’d provide much more than what we have and Wren certainly would NOT give both of those pitchers for him (shouldn’t either).
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:02 pm
Noah (Minnesota)
I am confused why Greinke is viewed as a top pitcher in the game. He has a career 3.80 ERA, if you throw out the one year it is over 4.00. Why rip up a farm system for him? I hear the Brewers may go 5/100 for him? Why?
David Schoenfield (2:30 PM)
Greinke’s peripherals have been better than his ERA for the past couple years. So … yes, any team willing to spend that money is making a bet that those even out. Which they don’t always do.
richbrave
July 17th, 2012
5:03 pm
tony austin
July 17th, 2012
4:57 pm
“…..Down on the farm:
Corn and soy beans are growing…..”
Need rain
jjj?
July 17th, 2012
5:03 pm
I have nothing against Jair but the fact of the matter is his stuff is not that good. His fastball used to sit in the low 90’s and top out around 95. Now his fastball sits in the high 80’s and tops out at 90. That makes the fastball more hittable. His change is low 80’s so there is only 5 or 6 mph difference now. That makes his change more hittable too. Since his return from AAA he has pitched 25 innings and given up 24 hits and 5 walks. He has been more lucky than good. Hell, he might throw a perfect game tonight. More likely to get bombed.
ncbravesfan90
July 17th, 2012
5:03 pm
With the Braves front office saying they will use some payroll from next year on this year’s trade deadline if the acquisition improves the ball club, they will make a move for a front line starter and more(bullpen help and bench help) before July 31st.
MiaBchBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:04 pm
Here’s hoping Ben Sheets IS the acquisition.
Just say an emphatic “NO!” to any acquisition involving any of the Upton brothers.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:04 pm
Michael (Huntsville, AL)
Do you see both sides agreeing to swap Grienke for Delgado/Teheran and another B prospect? That’s obviously assuming that Wren believes he can sign Grienke going forward. I don’t see Minor being included in the deal as the Braves still have faith in him. At least more than Delgado.
David Schoenfield (2:48 PM)
I don’t think the Braves would be in the running to sign Greinke long-term. Libery Media (owners) keeps the payroll pretty tight.
Bay Area Steve
July 17th, 2012
5:04 pm
“your normal level of haughtiness with a tad higher nose lifting.”
That’s kinda awesome.
nolie
July 17th, 2012
5:05 pm
I don’t mean to run the guy down, but Prado is actually probably the most likely Brave to ground into a double play. He’s a ground ball hitter and not very fast.
Prado has 10 in a lot of at bats
Mac has 8 in quite a bit fewer
Freeman and Jones have 7
those are all pretty small tiotals compared to their other production. The Braves are one of the least likely teams to hit into a DP so far, and have turned the most
MiaBchBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:07 pm
The only pitcher I think the Braves would not have to give up the farm for is Dempster. Anyone else would cost dearly. With Dempster showing Chicago-love as of late, I don’t want a pitcher who does not want to be in Atlanta.
Say “YES! DONE!” to Ben Sheets.
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
5:07 pm
Speaking of Harper, which of these players is the “generational” talent?
Well, since one of them is only worthy of being traded for the other…
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
5:07 pm
I don’t see Minor being included in the deal as the Braves still have faith in him. At least more than Delgado.
Probably too late for the world, as this guy has likely already started breeding.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:08 pm
If the Braves make any additions before the deadline I just hope were going after players who will be here for 2013 as well.
brian
July 17th, 2012
5:09 pm
Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, Liriano, JJ
Greinke, Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, JJ
Hudson, Dempster, Hanson, Sheets, JJ
Hudson, Volquez, Hanson, Sheets, JJ
Shields, Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, JJ
Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, JJ, Minor
which would you choose??
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
5:09 pm
Garza just isn’t that good. Don’t really think he’d provide much more than what we have
He’d be replacing Polished. And the fact is, Garza is better than Polished. But I hope Wren can aim even higher than Garza. Time will tell though.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
5:09 pm
Josh Johnson (due to shoulder issues) started fading from the middle of July, 2010 and his ERA rose almost a run poer game until, he was shut down in early September of 2010.
He made 9 starts in 2011 and then missed the entire season – again with the shoulder issues.
He has not been the same pitcher since returning this year and we should realize by now that shoulder problems are much more serious than elbow injuries. He’s also owed the rest of his $13.5 mil this year and $13.5 mil for next year.
And y’all are concerned that Sheets missed two years and might not make it to the end of this season? I’d be much more concerned with giving up prospects AND paying Johnson that kind of money and hoping he would last tilthe end of this year – much less through his contract then I am of Ben Sheets making it through this year at what he’s making.
Coach (2012 Fredi's Beisbol Fandango)
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
Here you go Dr. Phil…..something even you can understand.
Our 2012 Braves are 26-11 (.702) when receiving a quality start. 23-28 (.450) when they DON’T GET THE REQUISITE QUALITY START. God how I love it when I already know the answer before I even have to look it up!
Woody Woodward
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
There’s lots of baseball to be played, but this is not a very good rotation to take into September. Fragile, unpredictable. Who is the guy the other teams dread facing? Can’t say we’ve got that guy. Jurrgens might emerge as an ace, but that’s a bet I wouldn’t make.
Say the playoffs have SF, Nats, Reds, Braves. Who’s at the greatest disadvantage with starting pitching?
David O'Brien
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
Ed Mangan was in the TV room/radar room annex by dugout, looking at radar. I asked him how it looked for later, and he said pretty good once the current stuff got past.
I think we’ll play ball, maybe even without a delay. But we’ll see. Braves are finishing BP, they’ve done so while tarp sits on back edge of infield ready just in case.
brian
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
or Hudson, Hanson, SHeets, New pitcher, Minor
and JJ is traded for a prospect
jeffrey d
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
I’d choose Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, JJ, Minor
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
If the Braves make any additions before the deadline I just hope were going after players who will be here for 2013 as well.
I don’t care if the guy packs his bags the day after the WS ends and tells his travel agent he doesn’t even want to fly over Atlanta. If the deal is right and the player is an asset, you make the deal.
VaBravesFan
July 17th, 2012
5:10 pm
Here is a interesting point about how much the Braves will spend on a top pitcher.. We paid 15 million a season for 4 years for 36 year old Derek Lowe.
You gotta think they would spend more on a 28 year old Zack Grienke if they believe he is an Ace.
Shaun
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
MiaBchBravesFan, I think Janish has options and Wilson doesn’t. Both are back-ups. So Janish, while the better player, may be the odd man out until September. Now, if a postseason roster spot were on the line, it would be a different story. But both players would be eligible so that’s a non-issue. Also, it’s not like we are talking Andrus versus Alex Gonzalez are something. We are talking two back-ups.
I think Wilson is slightly better than you give him credit for. I think he’s still a serviceable major league shortstop defensively, though I agree he’s not nearly the same player he was 2-4 years ago. I think Paul Janish is basically that player.
TennesseePaul
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
Speaking of Harper, which of these players is the “generational” talent?
Through 67 games:
And, I noticed a lack of this guy being included:
C: .348/.403/.569/.972 – 12 HR and 19 2B as a rookie.
nolie
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
exactly Lew, there has been concerned expressed around baseball for a coupla years now on Josh. I would be hesitant to give much for him. Shoulders are career killers
ncbravesfan90
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
“Here is a interesting point about how much the Braves will spend on a top pitcher.. We paid 15 million a season for 4 years for 36 year old Derek Lowe.
You gotta think they would spend more on a 28 year old Zack Grienke if they believe he is an Ace.”
Excellent point here. I’ve said this all along since we have been in the Greinke discussions.
Lew
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
Just not all that enamored of Garza and what he’s done in his career and am not in favor of trading anything for what little he’d bring over what we have now. If they’re going to trade away prospects and pay serious money for someone, I’d certainly hope they aimed for much more than Garza.
Even less impressed with him after seeing him pitch a couple weeks ago. Just don’t think he’s a difference make.
ATL Insider
July 17th, 2012
5:13 pm
Lew,
If Johnson’s problems really are health, then I agree the Braves should stay away. I assumed his struggles this year had more to do with Ozzie and his insanity than anything else. If the scouts think his problems are physical then leave him be. I just remember how good he was prior to the injury last year.
ncbravesfan90
July 17th, 2012
5:14 pm
“I’d choose Hudson, Hanson, Sheets, JJ, Minor”
You’d also choose no playoffs if you chose that rotation. Or at best a loss in the wild card game.
David O'Brien
July 17th, 2012
5:15 pm
Venters throwing a full bullpen today, after throwing 20 fastballs Saturday and feeling great. Said he’s worked on his delivery every day and that he’s confident he’ll be his old self when he returns. Braves will probably have him pitch once or twice at Gwinett this weekend and activate him at beginning of next week.
David O'Brien
July 17th, 2012
5:16 pm
Braves will start Sheets and Delgado in Saturday’s doubleheader. Gonzalez was waiting to talk to Sheets before determining which order they’d pitch in Saturday.
ncscoots
July 17th, 2012
5:17 pm
And, I noticed a lack of this guy being included
That’s because I don’t get tired of hearing about Mike Trout.
Plus, he actually may be a “generational” talent.
My point is that Harper has gotten an awful lot of love (even beyond the early Heyward hype) with a performance, so far, that doesn’t even equal the rookie year of a hurt 20-year-old from only two years ago. This leaves me a few steps short of “generational”.