How much money we have coming free next year? I see anywhere from 25mil to 45 mil. I could see 12-13 mil for Bourn and another 15mil at least for Greinke (seems alot for the Braves to invest in a pitcher though)
My thoughts are that you would definitely have to overpay to retain Bourn, but that you would probably be paying Greinke about what he is worth.
I’d agree with that. and I’m not keen on loading up salary on a legs guy, at Bourn’s age. But, big picture, I like the pitching enough that I’d throw my wallet the the other direction. That doesn’t mean I don’t think another quality starter wouldn’t be useful, just that I think LF and CF in 2013 deserve more focus than a 2012 pitcher.
Hey, if we’re lucky, they do it all, LOL. No complaint from me.
Braves Lineup:
1. Michael Bourn (L) CF
2. Jason Heyward (L) RF
3. Martin Prado (R) LF
4. Brian McCann (L) C
5. Dan Uggla (R) 2B
6. Chipper Jones (S) 3B
7. Freddie Freeman (L) 1B
8. Andrelton Simmons (R) SS
9. Tommy Hanson (R) P
Hey, it worked out last night. Must suck to be Uggla when everyone else is getting 2 or 3 hits and you can’t get one. The HBP and run should make him feel a little better.
We talk about the mental side of the game, but I’m not sure we talk about it enough. That’s HUGE!!!
You’re 3-hole hitter needs the average, needs the power, needs the plate presence (as well as plate discipline), needs to be respected by umps and will get calls, needs to be able to diagnose pitchers well and report back to the dugout properly, needs to be the best at situational hitting, and needs to lead.
Who does this on out team?
No one.
Who does this best on our team?
Chipper.
He doesn’t have the power anymore and needs to be out once every 4 games, but he has really only hit in his hallowed spot in the order while coming back from injuries this season or when he had Brian right behind him (while DEEP in his own slump) with no one on base and pitchers were attacking him diligently. Chipper needs, and has earned, the right to be our leader one last season when he is healthy and has his timing correct. NOT after not seeing major league (or, heck, even live) pitching in weeks.
With the struggles B-Mac is having, along with the grind of catching, I would like for him to be hitting in the seven spot and Freddie Freeman in the 5th spot. Move Uggla back to 4th.
“Is he serious? 35 million total for both is far away from “possible”, imo. Are the Braves going to spend like drunken sailors this year?”
Id say he’s real serious. There is alot alot of money coming off the books after this year. The Braves will spend, spend, spend at the deadline and/or in the offseason. Feels nice to know we can actually make multiple moves at the deadline and offseason and not have the money constraint on us.
So, how much are the Braves owners going to spend on the Braves out of that $950 million court victory? (if they actually were paid that amount today, which they will not be)
Absolutely none.
Bourn’s gone at the end of the season for so many reasons (1) Boras client (2) glut of CF’s on the open market this winter (3) He disappears in big games ala Tex in his Brave days – pretty but meaningless stats.
I’ll speak in less general terms from now on so as not to offend.
Please Murph, don’t do that. What’s the point of it all if you are going to attempt not to offend? ( :
I never saw that deal as depleting the system. Nor have I ever viewed it as one of the worst deals ever. Teixeira was incredible as a Brave. Couldn’t have asked for more from him. It’s just a shame the rest of the team stunk. And I still remember that deal like it was yesterday, which keeps fresh in my mind that Salty was the “big chip” in that deal. And I had no problems giving him up as he was blocked by McCann. So if the big chip in a Grienke deal is a player blocked by a perennial all star at his position for the next 5+ seasons, trade away, even if it is only for 2 months. I’d be happy with a World Series title.
gotta love all the arm chair managers. just glad to get a win now if they win tonight then its a streak. happy to see big baby freeman back in line up still think he’s a wimp hate to see how long he would sit if got a splinter
Why do so many folks on here have this view that Greinke isn’t an elite pitcher? He is….
I like Greinke. Think he would be great on this team. But I must admit, for some reason, in the back of my mind, I see Jake Peavy. Now that would have been a bad trade (Heyward and Hanson for Peavy… or something along those lines).
Efrim – You made me laugh with the wink. Lol. Let’s just say they’ve all been bad…at times.. Heck Tommy Hanson had that 4 homer game.
I’m hoping the offense can get going any help all 5 of these pitchers. I mean look at Hudson when he had that lead. Just went after hitter after hitter.
RITZ is right on !! Here is the line-up………..McCann should just be dropped to 5 (or more at this point really). Then you can have Heyward batting 3rd and Prado back at 2 so you keep the Bourn-Prado thing going. You also avoid any Lefty, Lefty combos that way since managers seem to love avoiding those.
Bourn – L
Prado – R
Heyward – L
Uggla – R
McCann – L
Chipper – S
Freeman – L
Simmons – R
Pitcher.
My bad, ncscoots without an @. Why do you dislike the lineup. Or, on a larger scale, since you’re familiar with The Book, why do you disagree with how it suggests lineups be optimized?
Not that we knew what we had, but in June of 2007 we drafted Heyward and Freeman and in July we signed Teheran. Might of made JS pull the trigger…….
That and the depth chart. Traded some guys way down low in the minors who were 3 or 4 back on the depth chart. The one guy with MLB experience was blocked by McCann. I’m certain it will take some quality talent to acquire Greinke, but I doubt it would take all the young guys with MLB experience. The Brewers could ask that, but they would never get that from any team.
calling out arm chair managers, then calling out Freddie Freeman. Gotta love it.
Anyways guys, I’m out, heading down to the Ted tonight, gonna try to bring home a W for ya guys. I’ll post a lil bit from my phone, but probably not much during the game (cuz I’m well, at the game)
Bowman talking like a fool again about Greinke and Mac, especially Greinke. Best way to read his original stuff that he comes up with on his own, is to put a big NOT after whatever he says….
Let’s see… 3 of the Braves traded (Salty, Harrison, Andrus) were in the BA Top 100 for 2007. The Braves had 4 players in the top 100 that year (Brent Lillibridge being the other).
Feliz made his debut in the Top 100 in 2008.
At the time the trade was made it absolutely depleted the team of its top prospect talent. Back to my original point, should a trade for 2 months of Greinke do the same, I will not be happy.
Getting Greinke doesn’t guarantee a WS title in 2012. It maybe ups the odds, but it’s not a guarantee. Losing a handful of top prospects also doesn’t guarantee that the system will be hurting for years to come, but it ups the odds.
Braves don’t have a #3 or #4 hitter now. McCant and Uggla leave too many R.I.S.P., and for 2 totally different reasons. McCant has never learned how to hit the ball up the middle or to the opposite field. It’s a shame the braves don’t have a legit hitting coach that could have taught McCant how to hit the ball to all fields. This guy continues to pull everything even when teams have a shift against him. Some players just never learn, and unfortunately he is one of them, and because of this lack of adjusting, his average continues to drop. As for Ugly, this guy is the true definition of insanity. Which is to continue to do the same thing over and over again and expect different results=INSANE. This guy swigs for the fences on every swing, and with his ridiculous upper cut swing, there is a reason he either hits a home run or pops up everytime he hits the ball. That is whenever he hits the ball. If this guy had a clue on how to shorten his stoke and trying to just get good contact on the ball, he would be amazed at the results.Yet again, no hitting coach with any intelligence helping this lost free swinger. There is a reason this guy goes into his half the season slumps, it’s called never adjusting to pitchers and always swinging for the home run. Like Mccant, this guy hasn’t hit a ball to right field in along time, if he would shorten his swing and just hit the ball where it is pitched, he would become a bigtime major league hitter. So if the braves think they will make the playoffs with so many question marks, and especially with no legit #3 or #4 hitter in lineup, then God help them. It ain’t gonna happen.
I think Freeman if he is healthy should be the #3 hitter, as the article said the #3 hitter has a mental side to it besides the hitting and I think Freeman is our best choice in that regard. As for another starting pitcher, I think the Braves should go after any pitcher that helps the rotation and does not kill the minors as that Texeria deal did. For any SP worth anything you are gonna have to pay the market price.
Great win, lots of hits but AZ sucks so there is that aspect. The lack of hitting keeps rearing its ugly head whenever this team faces decent to good pitching.
Hats off to Hudson pitching hurt. Not sure if it was force of will or cortisone but he came through. Now let’s see if he can pitch again on regular rest. Bone spurs in the ankle will need to come out sooner or later.
“But frankly, I don’t think Gonzalez knows exactly what to do”
Put a period at the end of this little blurb and Carroll would have nailed the primary reason why the Braves failed to make the playoffs last year and have been scuffling this year.
It isn’t just deciding who to put in the 3 hole where Fredi is lacking as a manager – its pretty much in all facets (except excuse-making – he’s great at that).
really? they were almost all behind other players at the time
So you’re saying that, last season, Teheran wasn’t regarded as the team’s top prospect because he was behind other players? Because that’s what you’re saying.
I said back in ST to trade Mac for whatever we can get before he hits the road on us….
I was slapped silly by most here. Fair enough.
But if this continues, what do we do? Just live with it, exercise the option and resign the guy next year for something decent but nothing like what he was once looking to get? IF the woes continue…..
keithlaw @keithlaw
For three months of Greinke & no picks? I say crazy talk. RT @RyanTopp: Mike Olt straight up for Zack Greinke. Crazy talk or fairish value?
Efrim, here’s a pre-season ranking of the Braves’ top prospects in 2007:
1. Jarrod Saltalamacchia, c
2. Elvis Andrus, ss
3. Matt Harrison, lhp
4. Brandon Jones, of
5. Van Pope, 3b
6. Eric Campbell, 3b
7. Scott Thorman, 1b/of
8. Jo-Jo Reyes, lhp
9. Joey Devine, rhp
10. Yunel Escobar, inf
Like I said, the Tex deal depleted the team of its top prospects, unless you’re counting guys who were drafted a month earlier and hadn’t played a game of professional ball yet as top prospects (Heyward, Freeman, Kimbrel, etc).
Here were their Top prospects written by Baseball America on November 5th, 2007 – a few months after the Teixeira trade:
1. Jordan Schafer, of
2. Jason Heyward, of
3. Jair Jurrjens, rhp
4. Brandon Jones, of
5. Gorkys Hernandez, of
6. Brent Lillibridge, ss
7. Cole Rohrbough, lhp
8. Jeff Locke, lhp
9. Tommy Hanson, rhp
10. Julio Teheran, rhp
Heyward and Teheran had barely played a lick of professional ball and they were in the Top 10. Obviously the Hernandez/Jurrjens trade made the system better. But there were a lot of guys in the low minors that the Braves loved, therefore they felt like they could trade Salty, Andrus and Harrison.
No such thing as untouchable players, but Delgado and Teheran are as close at it gets. I think we would have to get quite the player if one of those guys was involved in a trade.
no that’s not what I am saying. he is at least equal or above them all. unlike Harrison ot Elvis or Salty none of whom were above others. Feliz was the lone chip that was from less than strength
Like I said, the Tex deal depleted the team of its top prospects
Out of context that looks draconian. But when you realize all those top prospects were blocked at the major league level for several to 6 years, then you realize it wasn’t an awful trade. And then to get Teixeira’s production in return. Totally worth it.
Cole Rohrbough, totally forgot about him. I recall all the hype on that guy. Just looked him up. He’s still in A ball. And stinking. He’s 25 years old. 25!
By the way guys, we are officially in the future. On October 26th, 1985 Marty McFly jumped in the Delorian and took off to see the events of June 27th, 2012.
I said it in February and I’ll say it again…. Put Heyward in the 3 hole and leave him there. It puts power in that slot, while bunching what speed the Braves possess at the top. Don’t tell me the kid has a psychological problem with hitting 3rd- he’s been a star player at every level. He’s probably hit either 3rd or 4th all his life. And if Heyward doesn’t hit well enough to be 3rd, then it doesn’t matter much what the order is, the Braves won’t make the playoffs.
I think it’d cost Mike Minor and 2 more prospects for Greinke…
Thinking the same thing too. Though the 2 “prospects” would be more along the lines of the position players the team has, which is to say, guys this team isn’t going to necessarily miss in the long run.
Though the 2 “prospects” would be more along the lines of the position players the team has, which is to say, guys this team isn’t going to necessarily miss in the long run.
I feel like a geek for pointing this out but that is not true it’s a hoax someone photo shopped June 27th into the picture the real date in the movie is October 21, 2015.
1,427 comments Add your comment
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
3:09 pm
Deport
Only a freaking moron would think the wackos on this blg represent ATL fans. You need to take a look at other teams blogs.
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
3:09 pm
blog
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:10 pm
How much money we have coming free next year? I see anywhere from 25mil to 45 mil. I could see 12-13 mil for Bourn and another 15mil at least for Greinke (seems alot for the Braves to invest in a pitcher though)
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:10 pm
My thoughts are that you would definitely have to overpay to retain Bourn, but that you would probably be paying Greinke about what he is worth.
I’d agree with that. and I’m not keen on loading up salary on a legs guy, at Bourn’s age. But, big picture, I like the pitching enough that I’d throw my wallet the the other direction. That doesn’t mean I don’t think another quality starter wouldn’t be useful, just that I think LF and CF in 2013 deserve more focus than a 2012 pitcher.
Hey, if we’re lucky, they do it all, LOL. No complaint from me.
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:10 pm
“You said the word “season”, not months”
Nope, posted stats for months and used the word months numerous times, but if you want to try and cherry pick…go ahead. All three have had bad MONTHS.
Eric in Tampa
June 27th, 2012
3:11 pm
As much as the Braves lineup is struggling, could be worse. Te Rays have Brooks Conrad hitting cleanup today
Danga
June 27th, 2012
3:12 pm
I like the pitching enough that I’d throw my wallet the the other direction
Gotcha. That makes sense.
MikeInFl
June 27th, 2012
3:12 pm
Saw Brooksie belt a HR last night for the Rays…
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:12 pm
Braves Lineup:
1. Michael Bourn (L) CF
2. Jason Heyward (L) RF
3. Martin Prado (R) LF
4. Brian McCann (L) C
5. Dan Uggla (R) 2B
6. Chipper Jones (S) 3B
7. Freddie Freeman (L) 1B
8. Andrelton Simmons (R) SS
9. Tommy Hanson (R) P
Hey, it worked out last night. Must suck to be Uggla when everyone else is getting 2 or 3 hits and you can’t get one. The HBP and run should make him feel a little better.
NitroTwinkie
June 27th, 2012
3:12 pm
We talk about the mental side of the game, but I’m not sure we talk about it enough. That’s HUGE!!!
You’re 3-hole hitter needs the average, needs the power, needs the plate presence (as well as plate discipline), needs to be respected by umps and will get calls, needs to be able to diagnose pitchers well and report back to the dugout properly, needs to be the best at situational hitting, and needs to lead.
Who does this on out team?
No one.
Who does this best on our team?
Chipper.
He doesn’t have the power anymore and needs to be out once every 4 games, but he has really only hit in his hallowed spot in the order while coming back from injuries this season or when he had Brian right behind him (while DEEP in his own slump) with no one on base and pitchers were attacking him diligently. Chipper needs, and has earned, the right to be our leader one last season when he is healthy and has his timing correct. NOT after not seeing major league (or, heck, even live) pitching in weeks.
ChulaDawg
June 27th, 2012
3:14 pm
With the struggles B-Mac is having, along with the grind of catching, I would like for him to be hitting in the seven spot and Freddie Freeman in the 5th spot. Move Uggla back to 4th.
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
June 27th, 2012
3:16 pm
Efrim unless Bowman knows something about Brian or the organizations feelings about him.
Don’t like the way that sounds…
ncbravesfan90
June 27th, 2012
3:17 pm
“Is he serious? 35 million total for both is far away from “possible”, imo. Are the Braves going to spend like drunken sailors this year?”
Id say he’s real serious. There is alot alot of money coming off the books after this year. The Braves will spend, spend, spend at the deadline and/or in the offseason. Feels nice to know we can actually make multiple moves at the deadline and offseason and not have the money constraint on us.
NickB
June 27th, 2012
3:17 pm
Why do so many folks on here have this view that Greinke isn’t an elite pitcher? He is….
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:18 pm
Don’t like the way that sounds…
McFann, don’t worry. Bowman hasn’t been right since The Flood, and that was only because Noah showed him The Ark.
King Arthur should buy Braves
June 27th, 2012
3:18 pm
So, how much are the Braves owners going to spend on the Braves out of that $950 million court victory? (if they actually were paid that amount today, which they will not be)
Absolutely none.
Arkansas Transplant
June 27th, 2012
3:18 pm
Greinke is not coming to the Braves.. certainly not for 22mil a year.
Karl Hungus
June 27th, 2012
3:18 pm
Are there people here who really don’t like this lineup? @ncscoots @ease
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
3:20 pm
Last 9 Starts of the Starting 9
_________AVG__OBP__SLG___OPS_wOBA_L9S9+
Bourn__ .268 .268 .390 0.659 .283 ___83
Heyward .485 .486 .909 1.395 .570 __280
Prado__ .297 .333 .432 0.766 .335 __114
McCann_ .216 .256 .351 0.608 .247 ___69
Uggla__ .125 .243 .125 0.368 .156 ___10
Chipper .257 .333 .343 0.676 .308 ___92
Freeman .278 .316 .417 0.732 .321 __105
Simmons .344 .333 .438 0.771 .331 __115
Hanson_ .000 .000 .000 0.000 .000 _-100
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:20 pm
Are there people here who really don’t like this lineup?
Been reading The Book, have you?
There’s no @ sign in my moniker, thank you. I mean, if you’re going to address me personally.
throw, hit, catch....hasn't changed in 130 years
June 27th, 2012
3:20 pm
we want a (relief) pitcher, not a belly itcher!
sic em
June 27th, 2012
3:21 pm
go get em ncscoots
No Flag Since Lemke
June 27th, 2012
3:23 pm
Bourn’s gone at the end of the season for so many reasons (1) Boras client (2) glut of CF’s on the open market this winter (3) He disappears in big games ala Tex in his Brave days – pretty but meaningless stats.
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:25 pm
“Are there people here who really don’t like this lineup?”
There are some weird parts about it, like McCann in front of Uggla and Heyward in front of Prado but it worked last night, so you don’t change it.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:26 pm
Nope, posted stats for months and used the word months numerous times, but if you want to try and cherry pick…go ahead. All three have had bad MONTHS.
Your comment that started it: Delgado and Teheran were worse in Spring Training. And Minor and Delgado have been worse this season.
Should have said “at times”….
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:27 pm
but it worked last night, so you don’t change it.
“Yes, I know there’s a hole in the boat, but it didn’t sink last night, so don’t plug it.”
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
3:27 pm
I’ll speak in less general terms from now on so as not to offend.
Please Murph, don’t do that. What’s the point of it all if you are going to attempt not to offend? ( :
I never saw that deal as depleting the system. Nor have I ever viewed it as one of the worst deals ever. Teixeira was incredible as a Brave. Couldn’t have asked for more from him. It’s just a shame the rest of the team stunk. And I still remember that deal like it was yesterday, which keeps fresh in my mind that Salty was the “big chip” in that deal. And I had no problems giving him up as he was blocked by McCann. So if the big chip in a Grienke deal is a player blocked by a perennial all star at his position for the next 5+ seasons, trade away, even if it is only for 2 months. I’d be happy with a World Series title.
MikeY
June 27th, 2012
3:27 pm
I agree, we need a relief pitcher, then move Medlen to the rotation.
I like Brandon Lyon, ERA 2.79, WHIP 1.28. Should not be expensive, money or prospects-wise.
Rick
June 27th, 2012
3:27 pm
Eric in Tampa, granted he’s only been with them for 5 games, Brooks has been scorching with the Rays. 385/429/769 line.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:28 pm
Last 9 Starts of the Starting 9
Can we exclude Heyward and just wait until October 5th?
Rick
June 27th, 2012
3:29 pm
“He disappears in big games ala Tex in his Brave days – pretty but meaningless stats.”
What stats are you using to support this? And what constitutes a big game? They all count the same.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:30 pm
I never saw that deal as depleting the system.
Not that we knew what we had, but in June of 2007 we drafted Heyward and Freeman and in July we signed Teheran. Might of made JS pull the trigger…….
timS
June 27th, 2012
3:30 pm
gotta love all the arm chair managers. just glad to get a win now if they win tonight then its a streak. happy to see big baby freeman back in line up still think he’s a wimp hate to see how long he would sit if got a splinter
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
3:31 pm
Why do so many folks on here have this view that Greinke isn’t an elite pitcher? He is….
I like Greinke. Think he would be great on this team. But I must admit, for some reason, in the back of my mind, I see Jake Peavy. Now that would have been a bad trade (Heyward and Hanson for Peavy… or something along those lines).
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:31 pm
Efrim – You made me laugh with the wink. Lol. Let’s just say they’ve all been bad…at times.. Heck Tommy Hanson had that 4 homer game.
I’m hoping the offense can get going any help all 5 of these pitchers. I mean look at Hudson when he had that lead. Just went after hitter after hitter.
ChattTownBrian
June 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
Rangers will end up with Greinke anyways. We’ll end up with the wild Liriano.
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:33 pm
Now that would have been a bad trade (Heyward and Hanson for Peavy… or something along those lines).
Hanson, for sure. And I admit to have been ready to pull that particular trigger. Or close to it, at least.
Blaze
June 27th, 2012
3:34 pm
RITZ is right on !! Here is the line-up………..McCann should just be dropped to 5 (or more at this point really). Then you can have Heyward batting 3rd and Prado back at 2 so you keep the Bourn-Prado thing going. You also avoid any Lefty, Lefty combos that way since managers seem to love avoiding those.
Bourn – L
Prado – R
Heyward – L
Uggla – R
McCann – L
Chipper – S
Freeman – L
Simmons – R
Pitcher.
RITZ for Manager!
Karl Hungus
June 27th, 2012
3:35 pm
My bad, ncscoots without an @. Why do you dislike the lineup. Or, on a larger scale, since you’re familiar with The Book, why do you disagree with how it suggests lineups be optimized?
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
3:35 pm
Not that we knew what we had, but in June of 2007 we drafted Heyward and Freeman and in July we signed Teheran. Might of made JS pull the trigger…….
That and the depth chart. Traded some guys way down low in the minors who were 3 or 4 back on the depth chart. The one guy with MLB experience was blocked by McCann. I’m certain it will take some quality talent to acquire Greinke, but I doubt it would take all the young guys with MLB experience. The Brewers could ask that, but they would never get that from any team.
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:35 pm
calling out arm chair managers, then calling out Freddie Freeman. Gotta love it.
Anyways guys, I’m out, heading down to the Ted tonight, gonna try to bring home a W for ya guys. I’ll post a lil bit from my phone, but probably not much during the game (cuz I’m well, at the game)
I’ll be around.
Peace
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:36 pm
Hanson, for sure. And I admit to have been ready to pull that particular trigger. Or close to it, at least.
I was against that.
I’ll admit to Delgado for 2 months of Beltran, though…
nolie
June 27th, 2012
3:37 pm
Bowman talking like a fool again about Greinke and Mac, especially Greinke. Best way to read his original stuff that he comes up with on his own, is to put a big NOT after whatever he says….
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:38 pm
I think it’d cost Mike Minor and 2 more prospects for Greinke……
Not really kidding either. 2 months of him with no draft pick isn’t worth more than that. Obviously the “2 prospects” matters quite a bit though.
I think Garza would cost more.
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:38 pm
Rangers will end up with Greinke anyways. We’ll end up with the wild Liriano.
The Rangers still need pitching? They’re due to get all their “good” arms back from the DL before the deadline. But with that FO, you never know.
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:38 pm
why do you disagree with how it suggests lineups be optimized?
Maybe another day, Karl. Honestly, I just don’t have the energy today, LOL, and we just had a little of that action yesterday. Can I get a raincheck?
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:39 pm
And I’d rather take a shot with Liriano than to trade for Edinson Volquez.
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:39 pm
Hanson, for sure. And I admit to have been ready to pull that particular trigger. Or close to it, at least.
I was against that.
I’ll admit to Delgado for 2 months of Beltran, though…
I was against the Peavy trade…. and against the Beltran…. even for Minor. Don’t like trading within the division.
Murph
June 27th, 2012
3:39 pm
Let’s see… 3 of the Braves traded (Salty, Harrison, Andrus) were in the BA Top 100 for 2007. The Braves had 4 players in the top 100 that year (Brent Lillibridge being the other).
Feliz made his debut in the Top 100 in 2008.
At the time the trade was made it absolutely depleted the team of its top prospect talent. Back to my original point, should a trade for 2 months of Greinke do the same, I will not be happy.
Getting Greinke doesn’t guarantee a WS title in 2012. It maybe ups the odds, but it’s not a guarantee. Losing a handful of top prospects also doesn’t guarantee that the system will be hurting for years to come, but it ups the odds.
1991 braves
June 27th, 2012
3:40 pm
Braves don’t have a #3 or #4 hitter now. McCant and Uggla leave too many R.I.S.P., and for 2 totally different reasons. McCant has never learned how to hit the ball up the middle or to the opposite field. It’s a shame the braves don’t have a legit hitting coach that could have taught McCant how to hit the ball to all fields. This guy continues to pull everything even when teams have a shift against him. Some players just never learn, and unfortunately he is one of them, and because of this lack of adjusting, his average continues to drop. As for Ugly, this guy is the true definition of insanity. Which is to continue to do the same thing over and over again and expect different results=INSANE. This guy swigs for the fences on every swing, and with his ridiculous upper cut swing, there is a reason he either hits a home run or pops up everytime he hits the ball. That is whenever he hits the ball. If this guy had a clue on how to shorten his stoke and trying to just get good contact on the ball, he would be amazed at the results.Yet again, no hitting coach with any intelligence helping this lost free swinger. There is a reason this guy goes into his half the season slumps, it’s called never adjusting to pitchers and always swinging for the home run. Like Mccant, this guy hasn’t hit a ball to right field in along time, if he would shorten his swing and just hit the ball where it is pitched, he would become a bigtime major league hitter. So if the braves think they will make the playoffs with so many question marks, and especially with no legit #3 or #4 hitter in lineup, then God help them. It ain’t gonna happen.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:40 pm
Samardzija is starting to really struggle. I still love our chances this entire homestand. I got a feelin….
Venice Jim
June 27th, 2012
3:40 pm
Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN
Andy Pettitte out six weeks with a left ankle fracture, Yankees announce.
Ron
June 27th, 2012
3:41 pm
I think Freeman if he is healthy should be the #3 hitter, as the article said the #3 hitter has a mental side to it besides the hitting and I think Freeman is our best choice in that regard. As for another starting pitcher, I think the Braves should go after any pitcher that helps the rotation and does not kill the minors as that Texeria deal did. For any SP worth anything you are gonna have to pay the market price.
nolie
June 27th, 2012
3:41 pm
it absolutely depleted the team of its top prospect talent….murph
McFann :Ô: :Ô: :ô:
June 27th, 2012
3:42 pm
ncscoots Bowman hasn’t been right since The Flood, and that was only because Noah showed him The Ark.
Hahaha!…
Karl Hungus
June 27th, 2012
3:42 pm
Hah, I’ll check out the comments from yesterday. I don’t get on these threads very often, but I’ll look out for you next time.
ozzie
June 27th, 2012
3:42 pm
Great win, lots of hits but AZ sucks so there is that aspect. The lack of hitting keeps rearing its ugly head whenever this team faces decent to good pitching.
Hats off to Hudson pitching hurt. Not sure if it was force of will or cortisone but he came through. Now let’s see if he can pitch again on regular rest. Bone spurs in the ankle will need to come out sooner or later.
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:44 pm
And I’d rather take a shot with Liriano than to trade for Edinson Volquez.
Agree.
Ted
June 27th, 2012
3:44 pm
“But frankly, I don’t think Gonzalez knows exactly what to do”
Put a period at the end of this little blurb and Carroll would have nailed the primary reason why the Braves failed to make the playoffs last year and have been scuffling this year.
It isn’t just deciding who to put in the 3 hole where Fredi is lacking as a manager – its pretty much in all facets (except excuse-making – he’s great at that).
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:44 pm
if he would shorten his swing and just hit the ball where it is pitched,
Some folks here would want Ted freakin’ Williams to “shorten his swing” and “hit to all fields”, I swear.
Jimmy
June 27th, 2012
3:46 pm
Rangers just called up their own young stud pitcher.
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN
Andy Pettitte out six weeks with a left ankle fracture, Yankees announce.
Shame
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
Mark Bowman now that’s a man that should stay away from a buffet!!
DAP
June 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
i dont think grienke would be worth $20mil. im not convinced any pitcher is worth that.
ncscoots
June 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
Karl, any time, man. It’s a fun bunch here, you’ll like ‘em.
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:48 pm
“I’ll admit to Delgado for 2 months of Beltran, though…”
Still, sign me up for that!
“Edinson Volquez”
Always liked the way he looks on the mound.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:49 pm
Braves had a ton still in the minors when the Tex trade was made. Think of all the young players currently on the roster.
Murph
June 27th, 2012
3:50 pm
really? they were almost all behind other players at the time
So you’re saying that, last season, Teheran wasn’t regarded as the team’s top prospect because he was behind other players? Because that’s what you’re saying.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:53 pm
Mark Bowman @mlbbowman
Teheran and Delgado would garner the most interest among pitchers @ESmith311 Which prospect gathers most interest?
Delgado isn’t actually a prospect and this means we should keep both!
phil
June 27th, 2012
3:54 pm
I said back in ST to trade Mac for whatever we can get before he hits the road on us….
I was slapped silly by most here. Fair enough.
But if this continues, what do we do? Just live with it, exercise the option and resign the guy next year for something decent but nothing like what he was once looking to get? IF the woes continue…..
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:55 pm
keithlaw @keithlaw
For three months of Greinke & no picks? I say crazy talk. RT @RyanTopp: Mike Olt straight up for Zack Greinke. Crazy talk or fairish value?
Murph
June 27th, 2012
3:55 pm
Efrim, here’s a pre-season ranking of the Braves’ top prospects in 2007:
1. Jarrod Saltalamacchia, c
2. Elvis Andrus, ss
3. Matt Harrison, lhp
4. Brandon Jones, of
5. Van Pope, 3b
6. Eric Campbell, 3b
7. Scott Thorman, 1b/of
8. Jo-Jo Reyes, lhp
9. Joey Devine, rhp
10. Yunel Escobar, inf
Like I said, the Tex deal depleted the team of its top prospects, unless you’re counting guys who were drafted a month earlier and hadn’t played a game of professional ball yet as top prospects (Heyward, Freeman, Kimbrel, etc).
phil
June 27th, 2012
3:55 pm
Karl Hungus – This bunch also contains some angry, delusional sorts….wear the asbestos britches when you drop in.
ncbravesfan90
June 27th, 2012
3:55 pm
“Delgado isn’t actually a prospect and this means we should keep both!”
So just because they would get the most attention in trade talks, we shouldn’t trade one of them? Ye must give to receive.
MFin04
June 27th, 2012
3:56 pm
Do Teheran and Delgado really have the same value? I find that hard to believe.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:56 pm
Similar to Beltran and the Mets, Brewers should target one prospect and go with that. Last years trade may set up what the price is for Greinke.
So…..Mike Minor straight up for Greinke is fair value….
urban redneck
June 27th, 2012
3:59 pm
first is dumb. please stop.
can’t greg norton hit third?
Bat Masterson
June 27th, 2012
3:59 pm
Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN
Andy Pettitte out six weeks with a left ankle fracture, Yankees announce.
So lying for Clemens did not get him off the hook after all.
Efrim
June 27th, 2012
3:59 pm
Here were their Top prospects written by Baseball America on November 5th, 2007 – a few months after the Teixeira trade:
1. Jordan Schafer, of
2. Jason Heyward, of
3. Jair Jurrjens, rhp
4. Brandon Jones, of
5. Gorkys Hernandez, of
6. Brent Lillibridge, ss
7. Cole Rohrbough, lhp
8. Jeff Locke, lhp
9. Tommy Hanson, rhp
10. Julio Teheran, rhp
Heyward and Teheran had barely played a lick of professional ball and they were in the Top 10. Obviously the Hernandez/Jurrjens trade made the system better. But there were a lot of guys in the low minors that the Braves loved, therefore they felt like they could trade Salty, Andrus and Harrison.
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
3:59 pm
No such thing as untouchable players, but Delgado and Teheran are as close at it gets. I think we would have to get quite the player if one of those guys was involved in a trade.
Danga
June 27th, 2012
4:01 pm
exercise the option
You absolutely exercise that option, and I don’t care what happens the rest of the season.
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
4:02 pm
Mike Minor straight up for Greinke is fair value
I think your joking, but honestly that’s all I’d give up for him if we just get him for 3 months.
nolie
June 27th, 2012
4:03 pm
no that’s not what I am saying. he is at least equal or above them all. unlike Harrison ot Elvis or Salty none of whom were above others. Feliz was the lone chip that was from less than strength
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
4:05 pm
Like I said, the Tex deal depleted the team of its top prospects
Out of context that looks draconian. But when you realize all those top prospects were blocked at the major league level for several to 6 years, then you realize it wasn’t an awful trade. And then to get Teixeira’s production in return. Totally worth it.
Bat Masterson
June 27th, 2012
4:06 pm
I don’t get on these threads very often, _ Karl Hungus
Uh Huh
nolie
June 27th, 2012
4:06 pm
where is that pre-season ranking from Murph? cause I do not remember Harrison as being all that highly thought of
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
4:07 pm
Cole Rohrbough, totally forgot about him. I recall all the hype on that guy. Just looked him up. He’s still in A ball. And stinking. He’s 25 years old. 25!
And people discount Evan Gattis.
nolie
June 27th, 2012
4:08 pm
man that top 10 was full of loosers
TheOnlyBravesFan
June 27th, 2012
4:09 pm
there was only 1 bad Teixeira trade. The one to the Angels.
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
By the way guys, we are officially in the future. On October 26th, 1985 Marty McFly jumped in the Delorian and took off to see the events of June 27th, 2012.
So, welcome, friends, to the future.
phil
June 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
All bumbs and pinheads, the lot of em…
Enquiring Minds Want to Know
June 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
I said it in February and I’ll say it again…. Put Heyward in the 3 hole and leave him there. It puts power in that slot, while bunching what speed the Braves possess at the top. Don’t tell me the kid has a psychological problem with hitting 3rd- he’s been a star player at every level. He’s probably hit either 3rd or 4th all his life. And if Heyward doesn’t hit well enough to be 3rd, then it doesn’t matter much what the order is, the Braves won’t make the playoffs.
1. Bourn
2. Prado
3. Heyward
4. Uggla
5. Freeman
6. Jones
7. McCann
8. Simmons
This is a dangerous lineup. Fredi, quit mucking around with it. Your tinkering is only messing with your player’s heads.
Danga
June 27th, 2012
4:11 pm
So, welcome, friends, to the future.
I still don’t have a hover board.
Sweet Old Buck
June 27th, 2012
4:12 pm
Fredi is being too clever by half with the batting order. Ritz and a couple of others it right.
I would hate to make a trade before Medlen gets a real shot. Sit Minor, Fredi/Frank.
TennesseePaul
June 27th, 2012
4:13 pm
I think it’d cost Mike Minor and 2 more prospects for Greinke…
Thinking the same thing too. Though the 2 “prospects” would be more along the lines of the position players the team has, which is to say, guys this team isn’t going to necessarily miss in the long run.
Ralph
June 27th, 2012
4:13 pm
Abnerish
June 27th, 2012
2:44 pm
What’s wrong with asking a player his opinion? He wasn’t letting him make the decision, just asking for input
What if Heyward had told Fruti he didn’t want to hit 2nd and wanted to bat 3rd or 4th, then what would Fruti have done?
Danga
June 27th, 2012
4:14 pm
Though the 2 “prospects” would be more along the lines of the position players the team has, which is to say, guys this team isn’t going to necessarily miss in the long run.
I’d do that without thinking twice about it.
Fish Bisch
June 27th, 2012
4:14 pm
Cadehill owns us
Bob
June 27th, 2012
4:16 pm
When does Evan Gattis come off IR
CrαZy
June 27th, 2012
4:17 pm
TennesseePaul
I feel like a geek for pointing this out but that is not true it’s a hoax someone photo shopped June 27th into the picture the real date in the movie is October 21, 2015.