1:45 pm June 24, 2012, by David O'Brien
June 25th, 20121:30 pm
Great read on Heyward
June 25th, 2012
I said during ST 85 wins this year, THANK YOU FREDI ! It should have been more.
Hold on now…Wait till the season’s over before handing out praises to Fredi…..
They are headed right for 85 wins, but the team said they would finish the regular season strong so it might be more.
Yeah, really. I mean, does anyone really think that, at this particular moment of his career, Minor doesn’t feel his gorge rise a little with two guys on and nobody out? If he doesn’t, he really ain’t human.
It’s not the fear that does you in, it’s handling the fear poorly. And overcoming sports fear is not genetic; that’s a learned trait.
June 25th, 20121:33 pm
fear shmear – aren’t all major leaguers supposed to be at same level mentally? what’s next, believing in “clutch” fairy?
June 25th, 20121:34 pm
Looks like Signable has been watching too many performances from Polished….
5 IP, 8 hits, 5 ER(1 HR), 0/4 BB/K in today’s start vs. Birmingham. Overall ERA up to 3.48 on the year for Gilmartin.
June 25th, 20121:35 pm
I continue to be amazed by people who think we can trade for every superstar out there…
Well, technically, they could trade for just about anyone, or at least anyone who doesn’t have 10-5 status. It’s just a matter of what the team wants to give up to get the superstars.
Most of the time you gotta trade talent to get talent. Wren has made a practice lately of getting good players for next to nothing… not sure if that’s a karma-correction after being wronged himself so often when he first took the reigns (Furcal, etc), but he’s been getting it done.
Not sure that can continue, though. Eventually a top-flight prospect is going to need to be traded or a proven veteran if the team wants to actually get a superstar in return.
June 25th, 20121:36 pm
fear shmear – aren’t all major leaguers supposed to be at same level mentally?
They might all be fired in the same crucible, just not at the same heat.
AT – I was watching his location and he hit the target 90% of the time the first few innings. Then, started missing, as you said, by six inches or so. When he missed outside, he walked them. When he missed over the plate, they blasted it.
I also didn’t like the outside target he was given. It was too borderline and a young pitcher isn’t going to get that call.
June 25th, 20121:38 pm
The Braves have discussed using money budgeted for 2013 to make a trade this year according to MLB.com’s Mark Bowman.
Therefore player would have to be under contract for next season – Matt Garza, Josh Willingham, etc.
June 25th, 20121:41 pm
not only he started missing outside, he seemed to be missing those pitches and walking guys in front of power guys to whom he would then have to pitch on plate and proceed to get really burned, putting up a crooked number on the board
I think I read that right. Unless it meant having a 98 million dollar payroll when it’s all said and done and then going in at 85 million tops in 2013.
Sure to make TenneseePaul a happy camper.
Re Grienke and the Braves… there was NO WAY the Braves would ever sign Greg Maddux was there? Get Grienke here and then win the East, go to the WS, maybe win, and see what euphoria can do to start a dynasty. Nothin’ to it, Guys. (We’ve got money OTA next season to sign just about anyone we want. Starts with absence of the $10M we don’t pay Derek Lowe, and that’s just the beginning of the cash that will be available, even without the bump in payroll that winning BIG will inspire from current and prospective owners.)
Have any of yall seen the Little League story? 11 year old kid over threw the other kid and the ball hit a woman in the face… She’s sueing the kids family for 150,000… Seem’s like you wouldn’t even be able to sue for something like that, guess that’s where lack of common sense comes into play.
June 25th, 20121:42 pm
Matt Garza, Josh Willingham, etc.
Would Theo take less than the moon and the stars, you think? Would he be willing to load up on lower-level upside guys? I mean, they aren’t going to win next year, either, are they?
June 25th, 20121:43 pm
Braves starters rank 13th in the National League in ERA at 4.21 – only ahead of Chicago, Houston and Colorado.
June 25th, 20121:44 pm
Hmm, so no rentals? Sounds great to me.
June 25th, 20121:45 pm
They have to make a decision on minor pretty soon, IMO. He’s been on and off the hot seat for awhile now. I’d really like to see them go with Teheran and keep medlin for long relief. Maybe even move minor tot he pen and get rid of c mart.
June 25th, 20121:46 pm
guess that’s where lack of common sense comes into play.
nothing to do with common sense, just shameless greed
Va–good for you, man. Life’s too short to live like that for eight hours a day.
June 25th, 20121:47 pm
Ya know who would be a good bench guy? Jason Giambi
June 25th, 20121:48 pm
Was thinking about that too, however, let’s try to name those “lower-level upside” guys. They were just drafted, or just practically just signed via international free agency(2010/2011) and most are in DSL with a handful appearing in GCL and Danville. Rome really has nothing – worst roster they have had in years.
Anyway, to your point, Theo usually would take quality over quantity. But maybe there is a deal in there that doesn’t involve Teheran or Delgado.
I say no on Garza…. It would take a pretty solid package to get the deal done. They’d definitely would want a top tier prospect along with 2 B prospects. Then Garza would be entering ARB 3 in 2013 and will likely have a salary around 12 million making it tougher to fill holes on offense.
Re Grienke and the Braves… there was NO WAY the Braves would ever sign Greg Maddux was there?
In 1993, the Braves still were in the top 5 payrolls in baseball, had drawn more than 3MM fans in 1992, and would draw 3.8MM in 1993. Money was not a cause for concern in pursuing Greg Maddux.
Yh, I saw that. Some people are just so dumb Makes me so mad I want to…. never mind
June 25th, 20121:50 pm
I don’t care if you don;’t think Matt Garza is more than a #3 starterm, ya have to be willing to offer Minor + others to get the guy. Garza, Hudson, Hanson, Delgado, Jurrjens for the rest of the season and then Teheran replacing Jurrjens for 2013. I’ll take that.
June 25th, 20121:53 pm
I’m definitely not a fan of Martinez anymore… wouldn’t mind seeing him shipped off or sent away. Over a 5 ERA for the month of June… not counting inherited runners he let score (if any… but I seem to remember a couple at least).
The guy is as streaky or even streakier than the starters who he is supposed to replace with his long relief.
Add a shaky Medlen to the mix and I wouldn’t mind seeing Minor moved to the BP in favor of a starter acquired elsewhere. Minor is good for 3 innings a game, so it’s a perfect fit.
won’t Beachy be back after next year’s ASG?
June 25th, 20121:54 pm
scoots I mean, they aren’t going to win next year, either, are they?
the Cubs might try. if they can somehow move soriano, and get some good pitching, they might think they have a shot in that division next year.
June 25th, 20121:58 pm
nickB Ya know who would be a good bench guy? Jason Giambi
June 25th, 20122:00 pm
efrim, Garza would be nice, no doubt. i would bet that Wren is at least thinking about it.
Garza would basically be taking the spot of our would be offensive addition in LF or CF in the offseason. While we would have rock solid pitching with Garza going forward you can definitely kiss Bourn goodbye for sure and most likely a platoon in LF. I could see Todd Cunningham pushed into action and be a Pastornicky type deal where Wren says he isn’t ready over and over again and then all of sudden said he’s ready lol…
Would Garza really put us over the top this season to be serious WS contenders?
June 25th, 20122:03 pm
We’d then have Hudson, Hanson, Garza, Minor, Delgado, Jurrjens?, Medlen?, Teheran, Beachy(2ndhalf), Gilmartin(Sept) as options in the rotation.
But have holes in CF and LF/3B.
Just looking to win the division right now. Garza improves our chances of that in a pretty big way, I think.
June 25th, 20122:04 pm
Cunningham isn’t ready, he has had a really lucky year on the farm
June 25th, 20122:05 pm
Not with our streaky hitters…
June 25th, 20122:06 pm
Garza will be either Double J or Big Red’s replacement once either one is traded, Bank On It, Wren is thinking down the road because No Way in Hell the Braves lock up both of them because both are Bor@ sshole clients
Did anyone really think they were going to be in on free agents looking for 4-5 year deals and 12-15 million a year? I just don’t see that as an option. I think they were always planning on making a trade for a guy that was getting a decent salary.
June 25th, 20122:08 pm
June 25th, 2012
“Not with our streaky hitters…”
Co-Sign, this team as of right now is a 1 and Done team, I can taste us getting screwed out of the stoopid elimination WC game for the final postseason seed…
June 25th, 20122:09 pm
Oh yeah, and Take it to Vegas People that we will be seeing some of Sean Gilmartin the last 6 weeks of the season…
We need pitchers to hold em when we’re not streaking. Right now, I don’t trust minor to do that. Delgado has become more reliable. Middle pen is also weak in that regard, especially c mart. Nobody’s really said this yet, but our defense is pretty solid right now with Freddie at first and Simmons at third. Left can be weak, but we can suck that up. Defense helps the right pitchers.
June 25th, 20122:11 pm
MikeInFl @ 1:23 pm
Good read, thanks for the link.
I agree he would bolster our rotation alot, I just think what it would take to get him wouldn’t be worth it. What do you think it would take?
Minor, Spruill, Moore
June 25th, 20122:13 pm
As it stands, I’m not sure the Braves even manage to win a wild card spot unless the rotation is upgraded, and/or Minor and Delgado become more consistent.
June 25th, 20122:14 pm
Sorry, Simmons at short.
I think I read that right. Unless it meant having a 98 million dollar payroll when it’s all said and done and then going in at 85 million tops in 2013.
That’s actually how I read it. “Bump up” this year’s payroll then go into next year with a lower ceiling payroll. Yippie.
June 25th, 20122:22 pm
While he was still drawing walks, the moderate power wasn’t offsetting the outs he was making, and his sophomore season was a pretty big step backwards for the Braves right fielder.
The first two months of 2012 brought more of the same, as he ended May hitting .233/.327/.413. He was still drawing walks, but he was making contact at the lowest rate of his career and still not hitting for a lot of power. After his early career brilliance, Heyward had racked up 600 mediocre plate appearances, and the questions about his ability to produce at a high level were only growing louder.
This line should actually read:
While he was still drawing walks, the moderate power wasn’t offsetting the outs he was making, and his sophomore season was [actually right in line with reasonable expectations] for the Braves right fielder.
The first two months of 2012 brought more of the same, as he ended May hitting [at reasonable expectation levels]. He was still drawing walks, but he was making contact at [reasonable expectations] and still [hitting a reasonable expectation in] power. After his early career brilliance, Heyward had racked up 600 [reasonable expectation] plate appearances, and the questions about his ability to produce at a high level were only growing louder [by unintelligent, ignorant people].
June 25th, 20122:26 pm
Gauntlet thrown down by 10Paul
June 25th, 20122:30 pm
Hell has froze over!!! The Hawks actually did something right!!!
June 25th, 20122:31 pm
VaBravesFan We’d then have Hudson, Hanson, Garza, Minor, Delgado, Jurrjens?, Medlen?, Teheran, Beachy(2ndhalf), Gilmartin(Sept) as options in the rotation.
nope, since someone (maybe 2 someones) out of minor, gilmartin, delgado, medlen, tehran would be gone in the trade for Garza. (not tehran or delgado hopefully)
June 25th, 20122:33 pm
Goodbye 2013 free agent signings if that is indeed the case… extensions and arbitration will eat all available funds.
Same ol story, just a different year.
June 25th, 20122:35 pm
Blog post of the month laid down by TenneseePaul at 2:22pm, January 25th 2012.
Well done, sir.
June 25th, 20122:37 pm
June 25th, 20122:38 pm
I would not use any of next years $$$ to grab Garza….. I’d rather take my chances with Teheran or Correia and have the bread next year to fill LF/3B and CF, and still maybe add a starter then
June 25th, 20122:41 pm
I really don’t think that should surprise anyone. Maybe offering a 3 year deal worth 36 million is the max contract they would offer a player? But I certainly wasn’t expecting them to invest 5 years, 85 million like Ethier got – in any player.
June 25th, 20122:42 pm
I disagree (respectfully of course). I don’t think it was unreasonable to expect an .800 OPS from Heyward in his 2nd year, after mashing the minors in ‘09 and mlb pitching as a rookie in ‘10.
I don’t understand why it’s so hard to admit that he had a very bad year (injury-aided) in 2011.
Teheran maybe, Correa? NWIH, as he’d cost a prospect to be mediocre.
June 25th, 20122:43 pm
I’d rather take my chances with Teheran or Correia and have the bread next year to fill LF/3B and CF, and still maybe add a starter then
Tired of always saying next year. As long as it doesn’t cost us Teheran or Delgado, Wren should be willing to do anything he can to updgrade the team for 2012. As I’ve said before, the National League has never looked so winnable.
June 25th, 20122:44 pm
great, now you’ve flashed the dreaded shaun-signal..
June 25th, 20122:46 pm
i dont want to compromise next year’s team, but if we are getting a guy we are going to have next year too, whats the problem? its just getting him now instead of in the offseason.
June 25th, 20122:47 pm
That was a challenge for Shaun from 10Paul.
A funny one to boot.
June 25th, 20122:48 pm
Thanks, mystery Braves employee who signed the horrible 2.5 decade long TV deal.
Low ceiling draftees, no impact free agent signings, unable to sign players to extensions… fun fun fun.
June 25th, 20122:49 pm
Oh… slow on the uptake.
Now what about that problem with Youth In Asia. How could anyone be against Youth in Asia!!!
oh …. nevermind.
June 25th, 20122:50 pm
I interpreted it to mean that any funds used this year to grab a big $$ guy counts against next year.
So if Garza was owed $4 mill this year and $11 mill next year, Braves would count all $15 mill towards next year. that sux
June 25th, 20122:51 pm
Frank Wren just called and inquired if anyone knows where he could get a good used printing press, so that he could begin printing money to acquire all of the players being mentioned – because that’s the only way he could do it
June 25th, 20122:52 pm
I don’t care about stats other than the one regarding hits with runners on with two outs. Those are the one’s that count the most. Let’s get a couple hitters…..guys that raise their level of play with the chips down. Dang, I’m tired of seeing their guys get hits with runners and two outs, and we hit outs more often than not.
nickB So if Garza was owed $4 mill this year and $11 mill next year, Braves would count all $15 mill towards next year. that sux
i get that, i just dont think its such a bad thing.
June 25th, 20122:54 pm
Low ceiling draftees, no impact free agent signings, unable to sign players to extensions… fun fun fun
Indeed… we need someone other than LM to own this team pronto!
richbrave: Hope your safe up there, there are storms in your area.
June 25th, 20123:03 pm
It’s the “Wimpy” school of team management… I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today.
Spending next year’s dollars on this year’s team, with the streaky hitting/pitching, the injuries that have taken key guys out of the lineup for weeks at a time, etc…. it just sounds like a really, really bad deal.
I said it last week, probably said it again today, but it bears repeating… if the FO does an honest evaluation of this team (and i mean really, really honest) and decides this is the year they can win it all, then great. Make your moves, future be damned. However, the same FO decision-makers also need to be held accountable in case the gamble doesn’t pay off and the team goes into the crapper for the next few years due to the failure.
I, personally, don’t think risking the future based on this team is a good idea. Too many question marks.
I think the 4 year old is good at soccer, but I wouldn’t put a $30k soccer camp on my credit card, expecting her to get signed by Manchester United next year to help pay for the advanced soccer training. I just don’t think she’s there yet, no matter how much of my yet-to-be-earned money I put up to help advance her.
I’d rather not sign a guy who has a career 4 ERA for a ton of money when we have cheap options who can consistently pitch with 4 ERAs in normal ballparks.
Might want to get a bat for when Chipper hangs it up mid-season because he can’t continue being hurt everyday…would not be surprised to see it happen.
June 25th, 20123:08 pm
June 25th, 20123:09 pm
June 25th, 2012
No mystery, you can thank the folks at Time Warner who put it together, and who still get a chuckle every time a game is on Peachtree.
June 25th, 20123:12 pm
Great. Now all I can think of is dudes farting around a campfire.
murph It’s the “Wimpy” school of team management… I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today.
except the braves will be able to use the hamburger on tuesday as well.
its not really like that at all. its more like overpaying him next year so you can have him for free this year.
and before you slam it, you have to ask “what would we spend it on next year if we had it?” there might not be as much opportunity cost as you think.
Might want to get a bat for when Chipper hangs it up mid-season because he can’t continue being hurt everyday
that might be what they are doing.
June 25th, 20123:13 pm
My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives. – Hedley Lamarr
June 25th, 20123:14 pm
I don’t like the whole idea of adding a contract from this year to next year or whatever….just seems like another way Liberty Media can fudge numbers and lower payroll again next year…like they ALWAYS do.
June 25th, 20123:15 pm
Negotiate a new deal with somebody else, offer a settlement on the old deal, or just tell ‘em “Sue us for value of the contract.” Defer the settlement money, earn the interest, and so forth and so on. The worst that could happen is that there is no Braves’ TV deal, at all, for a period of time.
Spin the wheel, break the deal.
June 25th, 20123:19 pm
Twitter is such a valuable and reliable source for news. In that one phrase, Bowman gives us every angle of the story, every possible implication, even the unspoken, right down to the body language of the source.
June 25th, 20123:20 pm
I proposed the same thing when the details of the deal came to light and was mocked by DOB and others for not understanding how contracts work.
June 25th, 20123:21 pm
ncscoots & Murph,
Yeh I do remember that it was raining fire and brimstone when someone suggested that last time…
June 25th, 20123:23 pm
Litigation costs alone would drive potential buyers away, not to mention the very deep pockets Liberty Media has that would wear down any one making a run
June 25th, 20123:24 pm
How about supper @ArthurTreachers…..scoots? Swell then be there @6pm….no game tonight so we’re good……….cheers, ncscoots!
The worst that could happen is that there is no Braves’ TV deal, at all, for a period of time.
And what in the wold do you expect me to do in the evening for 6 months of the year????????????? Actually spend time with the family?? Yeah right!!!
June 25th, 20123:29 pm
for not understanding how contracts work.
Oh, they’re probably right about that, anyway. But that wouldn’t mean much to a p***y litigant with good lawyers and money.
At some point, a good attorney might even be able to make the case that such a contract falls under the “financial suicide” area. That doesn’t mean that Peachtree or whoever goes uncompensated, just that the compensation comes in a different form than advertising revenue from the broadcast rights.
That just depends on who you want to get the money: the old contract partner or the attorneys.
June 25th, 20123:30 pm
And what in the wold do you expect me to do in the evening for 6 months of the year????????????? Actually spend time with the family??
You mean your kids leave you alone and let you watch baseball? How did you do that?
I’ve bribed, threatened, ignored, all in the name of trying to catch an inning here or there. It usually ends with a naked 4 year old standing in front of the TV singing songs about her butt.
June 25th, 20123:31 pm
yep, murph got the JJ treatment for the same suggestion and scoots will be handled with kid gloves like Minor
June 25th, 20123:32 pm
Murph – I can always count on you for a laugh.
June 25th, 20123:33 pm
Oh, they’re probably right about that, anyway.
Without going into details and dropping a lot of names, I’ll just say that I’ve put my signature on some pretty high-value contracts in my day… don’t let my blog persona fool you, I’m a wheeler-dealer.
June 25th, 20123:34 pm
not to mention the very deep pockets Liberty Media has that would wear down any one making a run
I’m not saying they could do anything to change it, but I fail to see why Liberty would be opposed to a more lucrative TV deal.
Hello every one! nscoots – I liked your 1:48pm post. Just missed some thing. Braves didn’t have Wren back than, and didn’t worry about budget problems. All you hear about is budget problems now, and cheap signings.
June 25th, 20123:35 pm
So to summarize, with the current 25 year TV contract, for all intensive purposes, we are screwed.
Back than the Braves had Ted Turner, and TBS, and now the Braves have Wren, and Braves Management.
June 25th, 20123:37 pm
“my signature on some pretty high-value contracts in my day”
Posting bail isn’t really a “contract”.
cricket, yeah, but I’ve actually signed contracts, and been on both sides of broken ones.
And I shouldn’t make it sound like such a thing would be easy, or pretty, or even a choice, if some other remedy is available. It would be messy, a public relations nightmare for all concerned, and costly enough to scare a Saudi. None of that makes it impossible.
In case any of you were wondering how long this season before SEAN GILMARTIN makes his appearance in ATLANTA, wondewr tis. He started for the Bandits in BIRMINGHAM this afternoon, and gave up an earned-run an inning. Included was one yard-shot. Pretty good huh!
June 25th, 20123:38 pm
June 25th, 2012
Both the fans and the Braves organization is ROYALLY SCREWED
We talk baseball, other sports, music, movies, BBQ and whatever (except politics or religion)
Atlanta Braves RSS feed
Previous entries »
Send a feedback technical issue
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution