9:51 pm November 29, 2011, by David O'Brien
November 29th, 201111:41 pm
With Hudson having surgery I really think it makes JJ less expendable. You now how the top three of your rotation coming back from injury (Hudson, Jurrjens, Hanson). I really find it hard to see them move Prado unless its a package that brings back a young CF. Detroit has one but I don’t think they’d move him.
I’m not sure someone like Ross is all that low. I am pretty sure that they will not pay what it will take to get a full time OFer who will hit better than Prado might, and they do need a CF backup.Heinke will play a little OF, a bit of first and PH just like last year. He is not a 4th OFer.
another approach would be a lefty like Smith to platoon in LF with Diaz when Prado is at third.
obviously you can never say “never” but a full time 800+ hitting OFer is not all that easy to come up with, they tried for years without success. and I do not see the team overreacting to the collapse with the hysteria of some fans
November 29th, 201111:42 pm
DOB – I agree with Nanny, plus you have helped my marriage by giving me somewhere to still get my Braves fix without talking my wife’s ear off about baseball. She loves it don’t get me wrong but she has her limits…
November 29th, 201111:44 pm
old enuff to know better. Bobby V is 61, will be 62 in April
November 29th, 201111:45 pm
I’m just thankful that Bobby V isn’t a commentator anymore, that was BRUTAL!!!!
November 29th, 201111:46 pm
I liked him as a commentator. Very knowledgeable guy
November 29th, 201111:47 pm
but then I like Don Sutton. I am more interested in what is said than how it is said myself. I know that both are unpopular here
November 29th, 201111:49 pm
Cody Ross stats (career)
vs LHP: .282/ .349/ .563/ .912
@ Turner Field: .300/ .347/ .545/ .893
Someone that can play all 3 OF positions. Spell Heyward/Bourn/Chipper against LHP on occasion.
November 29th, 201111:50 pm
nolie – and I do not see the team overreacting to the collapse with the hysteria of some fans.
Yeah. Acquiring a productive bat in LF (the easiest place to put a productive bat after watching Prado SUCK although I believe he can bounce back), after watching your team put up .308 OBP with a .387 SLG, would be a complete overreaction! Cody Ross will solve our issues!
People need to realize that Prado can still help us out a whole lot as a super sub, and we can absolutely afford to put him in that role if we can find that LFer that will give our offense a much needed boost.
He knows his stuff, I’ll give him that. He will always be a Mutt to me though and he was just terrible at play by play. Good at knowledge about the game though.
November 29th, 201111:54 pm
You mean the team that was virtually the same team in 2010 that was one of the top teams in baseball with OBP. They removed the hitting coach who I think could of had a major effect on the OBP. Its one season that saw a lot of things go wrong, not just our hitting. I guess you’d want to move Kimbrel and Venters to since they sucked down the stretch.
November 29th, 201111:57 pm
Braves are not untreated in a eighty for outfield. They are looking for a lefty to platoon with Diaz. Scratch Cody Ross off the list. Seth smith is off real interest and they are still wanting Wheeler in a deal for Prado.
how hard is it to understand that there is almost nobody out there who will eguarantee a big boost over what Prado supplied for three years? available 820+ LFer are few and far between and costly to acquire. I have nothing against that if it happens, but I think it is HIGHLY unlikely to happen.
November 29th, 201111:58 pm
McCann > Mauer
yeah, play by play was not good
I have a question and because i am poor at math and fairly lazy, i am turning to my friends on this blog to help me out. I am a big Chipper Jones fan and I’d like him to end his career with no less than a career line of .300/.400/.500. I’d like him to be in that exclusive club, to have that on his plaque in Cooperstown. I’d much rather have a girlfriend…but this is important to me as well. He is safe on the slugging percentage….but his current career BA is .304 and OBP is .402. Assuming he can get as many AB’s in ‘12 as he got last year (126) and he retires at the end of this season that would bring him to 2413 career AB’s. Whats the lowest AVG and OBP he could have for his next 126 AB’s that would bring his average below .300 and his OBP below .400? First one to answer correctly gets absolutely nothing but i would be forever in your debt without really owing you anything. Still, i would very much appreciate knowing the answer…any help?
November 29th, 201111:59 pm
GG. TTFN y’all.
November 30th, 201112:01 am
where are you coming up with 126 at batsin 2011?and 2413 career at bats?
No. I’d love to keep both Venters and Kimbrel. I’m just thankful you’re not our GM. The “ahh .. it’s just one season, that saw things go wrong” approach is the last thing I’d want in a GM. You don’t play with “could’s, if’s, and maybe’s”. Our two corner OFers are “if’s” right now. That’s a problem. That’s where teams get a lot there offense from, and we were terrible in those two spots last year for lack of a better term. Those corner OF spots are too vital to not go out and improve after a performance like that. I’d like to see DOB weigh in on this, for sure.
November 30th, 201112:04 am
sheet, sorry, nolie…i got AB’s mixed up with Games played. he has 8597 AB’s…assuming he can get 400 more in….
November 30th, 201112:06 am
Sounds like SeeBass is his-to-ry in a BRAVES uni if he doesn’t go for what the BRAVES want a one year ticket out of town…….not that that’s a bad thing.
‘Jumpin’ JACK the flash’ may be the one after all.
PASTORNICKY needs more time in GWINNETT in my opinion.
HERNANDEZ and/or HICKS in 2013 will have to be moved to make room for SIMMONS if he proves out in AA this upcoming season.
I think DIORY and maybe EVAN GATTIS will be traded this upcoming season if not this winter. There doesn’t appear to be much room for either in the HOTLANTA and ‘Big’ JIM’s already 24 coming off a solid season at 1B in ROME.
November 30th, 201112:07 am
I don’t want to move them either but they sucked to down the stretch. Would we all like to add a big bat? Sure but where we going to get one? We aren’t going to get Beltran, Willingham, or Cuddyer. And what bat are you going to trade for if we aren’t going to move our young pitching and JJ and Prado are at their lowest value. Its just not out there to make that big splash. They may find a guy who can start in LF but it won’t be the big name anyone is looking for.
November 30th, 201112:18 am
Hopefully things will pick up Monday and Tuesday next week and we will see more of the direction were heading in.
November 30th, 201112:20 am
wide right, the first step in getting better at math is starting with the right numbers! and looking at the right column goes a long way with that! :- )
November 30th, 201112:24 am
wide right, by my calculations (im not good at math either) chipper could hit as low as .188 over his next 400 ABs and still have a career .300 average.
November 30th, 201112:28 am
wide right, i dont feel like figuring out the OBP thing right now. if you are on tomorrow, i might try to ifnd a way to figure out.
November 30th, 201112:29 am
Does anyone think Chipper isn’t a lock to be a HOF’er? I don’t know about first ballot but I think it’s pretty much a given isn’t it?
November 30th, 201112:40 am
jbailz, yeah, its a given.
November 30th, 201112:41 am
No games scheduled.
Lead-off CF JOSE ‘George’ CONSTANZA [.287 BA] 1-4.
3B DIORY HERNANDEZ [.245 BA] 1-3, 1 RBI .
RHRP JAIRO ASENCIO [0.50 ERA] 1.0 IP, airtight, 1 SO, 3 BF, 1 GO/ 0 AO.
Man, JAIRO is like the energizer bunny. He just keeps goin’ and goin, and goin’. I can’t stress enough the outstanding session he’s having in fall ball. 1 HR allowed in 17 outings and 18.0 relief innings pitched, only eight hits, four BB, and 26 SO with a .131 AvAg. Whew! The dude is on FIRE!
1B MAURO ‘45′ GOMEZ [.152 BA] 3-5, 1 R, 1 2B , 1 HR , 4 RBI .
Finally, a pulse. I thought my man was dead at the plate. I’m wondering what’s up with the first base slot in GWINNETT. Maybe it’s up for grabs with both ERNESTO MEJIA and JOEY TERDOSLAVICH coming up. Could it be in the wind that his days are numbered in AAA with the BRAVES. Here’s another trade piece along with HERNANDEZ/HICKS/GATTIS for FRANK to offer for a LF bat with some juice in my estimation.
C WILKIN CASTILLO [.258 BA] 1-4, 1 R, 1 HR , 1 RBI , 1 SO
No BRAVES played.
3B DONEL LINARES [.357 BA] 1-4
DH STEFAN GARTRELL [.000 BA] 0-4, 1 SO.
No game scheduled.
LHRP LUIS AVILAN [3.00 ERA] 0.1 IP, 2 H, 1 R/ER, 0 BB, 1 SO, 3 BF, 0 GO/ 1 AO.
1B ERNESTO MEJIA [.287 BA] 1-3, 1 BB, 1 SO.
November 30th, 201112:46 am
I initially liked the concept of Cody Ross until I looked up his splits and saw he was a better hitter against righties than lefties… not what the Braves need, sadly.
November 30th, 201112:47 am
And there’s no way Chipper doesn’t go in the HoF. Numbers justify it, and he’s especially deserving now, since so many of his peers were juiced, and he’s never been implicated or suspected whatsoever.
November 30th, 201112:50 am
November 30th, 2011
Not enough homers. he’ll never make it 536 and 504 look just too tall.
November 30th, 201112:51 am
He just got lucky that’s all.
November 30th, 201112:52 am
But what about Bobby V’s career in commentary?!?!?!
DOB, what are your thoughts on Whiskeytown’s Pneumonia?
I think it’s phenomenal.
Quick Hits: Cubs, McCann, Cespedes, Smoak, Broxton | Forex News
[...] Dave O’Brien of The Atlanta Journal-Constitution wonders if the Braves will offer Brian McCann a long-term contract extension soon. The six-time All-Star will make $ 11.5MM in 2012 and the team holds a $ 12MM club option for 2013, so there’s no urgency to get a deal done at the moment. [...]
November 30th, 201112:55 am
rich: I don’t think so. If you look at pics of Chipper when he was a rookie and how he looks now, he’s pretty much the same person. Do the same with, say, Barry Bonds, and, uh… it’s striking. Numbers were the same from his first season on, with some decline obviously in his later years– unlike Barry Bonds, Sammy Sosa, McGuire, Palmeiro, et al. who had a sudden, odd power surge in their mid-30s.
November 30th, 201112:58 am
Just messin’ with ya’. You know how I feel about JONES. Go to the park and pay some respect to one of the greatest hitters to ever play the game while you still can.
November 30th, 201112:59 am
Time to put on my snaf-face. NYTOL.
November 30th, 20111:02 am
rich — Hey, no one can know 100%, and it’s a sad fact of the game today that we have to always have some lingering doubt about our sports heroes. But yeah, I’m a Chipper fan– I love his approach to hitting and his no-nonsense attitude. Lots of crazy people on this blog yack on about how great it’ll be to free up money committed to him–but the Braves are about to see their second best player ever leave them, and that’s just kind of sad, even if it’ll be time.
November 30th, 20111:16 am
Lets Play Ball!!!!!
November 30th, 20111:21 am
I talked to Brian McCann on Facebook, saying I hopw you follow Chipper’s path and be a Brave forever. He said “god willing I will be”.
November 30th, 20111:31 am
David, I applaud you for recognizing McCann as the best catcher on the NL. However, I believe he is the best catcher in baseball. Period. Thus, he should resign with the Braves. Apparently, the media never sees nor appreciates his accomplishments. From June 10, 2005, McCann’s BA is .289 with 134 HR, 861 Hits and 528 RBI’s. He is a 6x All Star and 5x Silver Slugger Award Winner. Yeah, almost forgot, he also was the 2010 All Star MVP. Mauer, Avila, Wieters, Montero, Martin, Molina? They don’t measure up. Piazza and Pudge will be inducted into the Hall of Fame. There are only three catchers from the modern era in the Hall currently, Carter, Fisk and Bench. I think there’s room for three more. Sadly, I wish more people spoke better of a man that is setting a pace to reach greatness at the C2 position; arguably, the hardest position in baseball. I should know I played it in High School and College.
November 30th, 20111:36 am
David, I applaud you for recognizing McCann as the best catcher in the National League. However, I believe he is the best catcher in baseball. Period. Thus, Wren should resign him. Apparently, the media never sees nor appreciates his accomplishments. From June 10, 2005, McCann’s BA is .289 with 134 HR, 861 Hits and 528 RBI’s. He is a 6x All Star and 5x Silver Slugger Award Winner. Yeah, I almost forgot, he also was the 2010 All Star MVP. Mauer, Avila, Wieters, Montero, Martin, Molina? They don’t measure up. Piazza and Pudge will be inducted into the Hall of Fame. There are only three catchers from the modern era in the Hall currently, Carter, Fisk and Bench. I think there’s room for three more. Sadly, I wish more people spoke better of a man that is setting a pace to reach greatness at the C2 position; arguably, the hardest position in baseball. I should know I played it in High School and College.
November 30th, 20111:40 am
These are corner outfielders who OPS’s higher than .820 (what Prado averaged for 2008 thru 2010) in 2011.
These are the starters: Bautista, Braun, Berkman, Holliday, Beltran, Upton, Stanton, Cargo, Hamilton, Gordon, Pence, Hart, Quentin, Smith (yes, Seth), Joyce, Swisher and Cruz.
Some guys who were not regulars all season are: DeAza, Craig, Mayberry, Andruw, and Lillibridge.
Everybody else had less than a .820 OPS for 2011.
Some decent guys in the .750-.820 range are: Bruce, Johnson, Willingham, Francouer, Cuddyer, Boesch, Morrison, Heisey, Ethier, Lee, Parra, Hunter, Soriano, and Markakis.
And a LOT of these guys have some hidden warts that are not always easy to identify (poor defense, poor attitude, bad contract, bad splits, etc)
OK, so who is FW going to WOW with his Jurrjens/Prado offer that will make us better than having Prado return to the mean?
November 30th, 20111:46 am
The cold hard truth is this: being a catcher, Brian has to make sure that his priorities are aligned with the Braves needs in years to come. I think he can be a life long Brave, but he probably won’t be a 130 game per year guy at some point in time.
If he is realistic in his contract demands, I don’t see any reason why he won’t be a life long Brave. And I get that feeling about him.
But we don’t want to be paying 15-18 million per year for a part time catcher in 4-5-6 years either. Unless of course he can slide over to another position.
Don’t get me wrong, I love McCann. I just think that we have to be realistic about how many more years he can play 130 game per year behind the dish.
November 30th, 20111:52 am
thanks DAP. Thats all i need to know…and yes, i am bad with math and column recognition.
November 30th, 20112:00 am
Hello everyone! Great article Dob,and right smack on!
November 30th, 20112:02 am
I could see the Braves getting a Cody Ross,or Ryan Ludwick. Some one like that,and play Pastornicky at SS. Go the distance play the Rookie…….
November 30th, 20112:03 am
So is Lionel advocating that Palin catch or play short?
November 30th, 20112:05 am
Sign Mac………save Mac………
November 30th, 20112:06 am
yeah I agree. Tough spot for both sides.
November 30th, 20112:07 am
I think she is more likely the pitcher………
Ludwick has been on a steady decline the past few years. But I do like Cody Ross. And I LOVE Martin Prado. Mark me down as one who hopes Prado stays.
Bobby Valentine a good fit for Boston. Wonder if he has any disguises ready? Just incase he gets thrown out of the game.
November 30th, 20112:09 am
DS1- Prado,and Ross platoon. I like that idea……I’m just throwing Ludwick out there,because he’s in the price range.I wouldn’t mind Ross a Brave. he has good D.
November 30th, 20112:14 am
I could also see Carlos Quentin going to the Braves for J.J. White Sox need pitching……
November 30th, 20112:20 am
Elonbrave: Yes, that’s a classic album. I like all of Whiskeytown’s stuff.
November 30th, 20112:30 am
anybody watched GRIMM yet?
November 30th, 20112:32 am
nolie, the wife is gonna Christmas movie me to blitherage, before I get to watch it.
November 30th, 20112:35 am
Bautista, Braun, Berkman, Holliday, Beltran, Upton, Stanton, Cargo, Hamilton, Gordon, Pence, Hart, Quentin, Smith (yes, Seth), Joyce, Swisher and Cruz.
how many have done it three times? How many are actually available? How many could the Braves afford?
Long TIme Braves Fan
November 30th, 20112:36 am
What about trying out Bethancourt at Left Field?
November 30th, 20112:37 am
What about transitioning Bethancourt to a Left Field position and keep BMAC?
November 30th, 20112:41 am
nolie – braves could afford a Quentin,and Swisher,and I wouldn’t mind the Braves trying to prye away Alfonzo Soriano from the Cubs. Cub are willing to trade him now.
November 30th, 20112:42 am
Alfanzo Soriano would not be a bad idea……
November 30th, 20112:44 am
Don’t know if I had his name spelled right,but Braves could get Alfonzo Soriano LF,and platoon with Prado.
November 30th, 20112:45 am
I hope you meant McCann in LF
November 30th, 20112:53 am
I have not followed Bethancourt much but from the comments by DOB, he seems to be more athletic than BMAC. I do not think BMAC can transition to LF. He is much too slow for an outfield position. I do not see Freeman giving way to BMAC either – his defensive skills at first base is just as important as the offense he offers at that position.
November 30th, 20113:03 am
Keep Mac,because he can still put up the numbers,and let Bethancourt mature in the minors. Keep Mac……..
November 30th, 20113:09 am
I think that in all likelihood McCann’s at or already past his peak. He’s logged a log of mileage already, and catchers don’t typically last as long other guys. In addition offense is cheaper to acquire at almost any other position that catcher. For a team on a tight budget it doesn’t make sense to send big money on a catcher. Simply put the money would be better spent at another position.
But there are business reasons why keeping McCann makes sense. He’s a fan favorite, a team leaders and a fairly marketable guy.
I’m sure the Twins regret the Mauer contract.
P B Orr
November 30th, 20113:39 am
I can’t stand McCann. His defense is terrible and he’s delusional about his ability to swing a giant bat. He regularly folds in August and September. He’s got weight problems, can’t see, and is stubborn as a mule. He’s not clutch and no fun to watch. It all adds up to rapidly developing mediocrity. Deal him while you can get something for him!
All have a good night,and peace……..
Coach (2011 Fredi G. FAILED)
November 30th, 20114:01 am
About the comparison to Joe Mauer……
He’s headed to first base. In fact, Mauer saw eighteen games of action at first base just this past season. Mauer will also see some time as the twinkies DH. So his days as a catcher are coming to an end.
We made the September 2007 Mets look like the 1927 Yankees
November 30th, 20114:21 am
Great article by Tim Kurkjian on espn.com about Bobby Valentine:
I’m even more impressed with Bobby V. after reading this. He is EXACTLY what the Braves need. Yet we stuck with the Goober, Fredo Gonzalez.
November 30th, 20114:47 am
Umm, most catchers wear down in Aug and Sep. Statistically McCann was one of the top 5 defensive catchers in the NL last year and replacing his production at catcher would be impossible…so no, we shouldn’t be moving him just yet there P B Orr
November 30th, 20114:53 am
IMHO, McCann is a defensive liability. I would not be in favor of signing him to a long term high $$$ contract.
November 30th, 20115:15 am
Yes, Brian McCann regressed on defense this past season. However, I believe this was due to injury. Mac wasn’t healthy after his oblique strain. But his perennial silver slugger status elevates McCann’s overall game to the point that he can’t be improved upon. Now or in the near future.
November 30th, 20115:19 am
I think Wren is going to be very careful about signing McCann to a long term deal similar – or more significant – then the deal given to Chipper. Wear and tear is a fact of life for most catchers as they enter their thirties, McCann isn’t going to be an exception (given his late injury history).
And play McCann at first, when the Braves have Freeman? Wouldn’t make sense.
November 30th, 20115:20 am
McCann was in the top 5 defensive catchers, voted # 3 in NL by BBA. y’all are freakin’ nuts with all the bitching about his D
November 30th, 20115:22 am
BEST DEFENSIVE CATCHER
1. Yadier Molina, Cardinals
2. Carlos Ruiz, Phillies
3. Brian McCann, Braves
November 30th, 20115:30 am
Where have all the alter egos gone, lomg time passing?
November 30th, 20115:33 am
McFANN…….McFANN you should be here.
long time passing till they come back, we can hope rich
November 30th, 20115:35 am
So nolie, are you like me? Fall askeep at the keyboard and wake up with your fingers typing?
November 30th, 20115:36 am
Alfonso Soriano… why not? Supposedly, the Cubs are willing to pay a large part of his salary… Sounds like he had a decent year last season!
November 30th, 20115:38 am
nolie’s wrong again.
Check the numbers you old goat. Mac threw out thirty percent of potential base stealer’s in 2010. 36 out of 84 runners, and regressed in 2011 by giving up 104 stolen bases while throwing out just twenty-two percent. His errors did improve from 14 down to 5 but Mac started 11 fewer games.
November 30th, 20115:39 am
What do you make of this need to improve the line-up? It seems to me that standing pat in LF and letting PASTORNICKY ‘improve’ the SS slot doesn’t get it as far as stability of the franchise goes. The money box we’re apparantly in is pretty unpalatable as well.
November 30th, 20115:41 am
I’ll pass on Soriano. They are unlikely to pay enough since he is owed 18 mil per for three more years.until he is 38. terrible contract
November 30th, 20115:43 am
I guess that at that rate, he is too expensive…
November 30th, 20115:45 am
I am not wrong. I told you exactly what BBA said about him and they know a hell of a lot more about it than you do.
and basing it on runners caught? a stat that is highly dependent on the pitcher?
give me a freaking break coach
November 30th, 20115:47 am
I don’t know rich. Like most here I’d like to see a significant improvement, but I’ll believe it when I see it.
November 30th, 20115:48 am
So are you saying that McCANN would or should have had 8 E in those 11 games? Not probable I think. Possible, but not likely.
November 30th, 20115:50 am
coach is being coach, rich
November 30th, 20115:54 am
I’m saying what I said at 5:15, Mac was hurt and it showed. Teams ran at will against our Braves in the second half of the season. The 2011 Braves gave up 128 stolen bases which was second worst in the NL behind Houston’s 131. The 2011 Braves also stole 77 bases, which again, was ranked 14th in the NL out of 16 teams. 2011 was an awful fundamental season for our Braves on the base paths, period.
November 30th, 20115:55 am
Looking at last year, we made a major move PDQ getting UGGLA. Without any corresponding action this off-season, I’m inclined to agree that we have the need but short of paying out some serious monies, we don’t improve the LF slot by much. It’s all about the money in the final analysis it seems.
I sure wish ADAM MILLIGAN could stay healthy. I think we could have had the answer to cutting this Gordian Knot otherwise.
November 30th, 20115:57 am
Would a pectoral injury to a starting catcher cause the opposition to increase their base-stealing attempts?
November 30th, 20116:01 am
I have no idea because Mac injured his oblique which contributed to his poor defense at throwing out base runners.
November 30th, 20116:06 am
From the previous blog which had 5,030 comments, nolie led the way with 462 posts. There were 260 different poster names. Here are the Top 25:
Rank Poster Frequency
1 nolie 462
2 Efrim 405
3 cabravesfan 304
4 Ward 284
5 JoeBrave 210
6 jeffrey d 201
7 TnBrian 146
8 Lew 145
9 Tom O’Hawke 144
10 Venice Jim 120
11 CB 109
12 DS1 106
13 McFann O O o 91
14 keyLargo 91
15 ncscoots 89
16 Bat Masterson 85
17 Arkansas Transplant 80
18 Murph 80
19 Trey 79
20 VaBravesFan 76
21 RC 71
22 richbrave 66
23 DAP 61
24 David O’Brien 60
25 TennesseePaul 55
November 30th, 20116:08 am
“……..I have no idea because Mac injured his oblique which contributed to his poor defense at throwing out base runners………”
Was that a statement or a question?
November 30th, 20116:10 am
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