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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
5,033 comments Add your comment
George
November 28th, 2011
7:28 pm
AT
My Prayers are with you
Murph
November 28th, 2011
7:32 pm
BMac for McCutchen straight up, Ross/Bethancourt platoon, Prado to supersub, World Series victory, all hail Murph!
nolie
November 28th, 2011
7:34 pm
I doubt they would want to pay Bourn’s salary. If they trade it will likely be for high prospects and perhaps a low cost short term CFer
Even for McC, I do not see the Braves giving up several ogf the top pitching prospects
nolie
November 28th, 2011
7:44 pm
yeah right, the Pirates are gonna pay 11.5mil for a catcher, Its good to see your spirits are back up again Murph
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
7:47 pm
keylargo With McCann making $11.5M in 2012 and $12M in 2013 and a free agent in 2014 I would be very reluctant to trade Betancourt.
Yeah, well, you’re not the GM, are you?…
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
7:50 pm
nolie yeah right, the Pirates are gonna pay 11.5mil for a catcher
What’s wrong with that price…?
nolie
November 28th, 2011
7:54 pm
way too much for the Pirates to pay for anybody, let alone a guy who by definition of position misses 20-30 games a year even when healthy
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
7:58 pm
nolie—
Oh! Well, good! We wanted to hang on to BMac, anyway…
nolie
November 28th, 2011
8:01 pm
yes, we did
ccrider
November 28th, 2011
8:07 pm
nolie: Betancourt( got McCann for a good while), Vizcaino(could be a Starter or a closer), Zeke Spruill(Mid Rotation starter) and Tommy La Stella ( 2nd baseman blocked by Uggla).
Does 3 top ten Braves prospects and a top 15 prospect get it done?
Whatta you think?
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
8:15 pm
A “high ranking” official of the Pirates basically just squashed the McCutchen trade idea says mlbtr. Who cares, no way Wren sends what it’d take anyways.
Me and nolie are negative party poopers.
nolie
November 28th, 2011
8:16 pm
interesting proposal and at least along the lines of what they might want CCR. Viz might not be the pitcher they wanted though, hard to tell
old man
November 28th, 2011
8:18 pm
McCutcheon, Bourn, Heyward. That would be one fast outfield. Wow.
old man
November 28th, 2011
8:30 pm
I would not rule out Pittsburgh wanting JJ plus prospects. Generally speaking, they are really not wanting to pick up salary, but 3.25M for a #1 or #2 starter is actually a pretty good move for a cost-conscious team.
keyLargo
November 28th, 2011
8:33 pm
Another issue not trading Betancourt (Besides McFann will hurt us all some way) is that this is the last year David Ross is under contract with no option.
nolie
November 28th, 2011
8:33 pm
too many questions about JJ for any team to give up a talent as good as McC in trade for, especially a low budget team that would be absolutely devastated if JJ never came back to his previous level. Never happen
old man
November 28th, 2011
8:37 pm
You’re probably right. But I would sure make a run at him if the rumor turned out to be right. It’s gotten your interest, right Nolie?
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
8:48 pm
keylargo Another issue not trading Betancourt (Besides McFann will hurt us all some way)
What do you mean? I won’t hurt anybody if Bethancourt is traded…
nolie
November 28th, 2011
8:57 pm
sure I would make a run too, but I seriously doubt it is anything more than a rumor.based on the fact that he will get a pretty big arb amount and they are so cheap. but no matter how much he gets his first year he will still be a value. I would think they might get more serious about trading him this coming winter. But who knows for sure? Owners can be crazy….
Lew
November 28th, 2011
8:58 pm
Pastornicky at short, Prado in left and at thrid and Diaz/Hinske in left when Chipp[er is out. A ton of pitching.
I’m ready for Spring Training.
nolie
November 28th, 2011
9:00 pm
if most of the other players hit close to their mean, we can carry one poor bat in the 8th hole IMO
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
9:05 pm
Lew I’m ready for Spring Training.
Me, too. Although I do love Advent/Christmas…
January is the slowest month ever invented. At least last year we got some action when we were snowed in for a week…
old man
November 28th, 2011
9:06 pm
Bourn
Chipper
Heyward
Uggla
Freeman
McCutcheon
McCann
SS
Pitcher
These are in no particular order, but golly our lineup sure looks a ton better with a fearsome offensive threat in left field.
keyLargo
November 28th, 2011
9:07 pm
McFann – I’ve really been doing bad things for me in the last 20 minutes.
ColoradoBravesFan
November 28th, 2011
9:19 pm
1. Hudson (bad back)… or Ultimate competitor, team leader and #1 SP with career ERA of 3.40
2. JJ (bad knee)….or Solid number 2 SP coming off All-Star year in 2011 with career ERA of 3.40
3. Hanson (bad scapula)….or Young Ace potential SP with career ERA of 3.28.
4. Beachy (bad mechanics)…. Well I know nothing of pitching …but this from scout.com. “Tom Glavine says he’s teaching his kids Beachy’s mechanics”, and I have heard Glavine praise Beachy’s mechanics many times so I would tend to think Beachy’s mechanics are fine… maybe inconsistent. I do remember tons of pitches in the dirt when he gets ahead in the count.
5. Minor (bad WHIP)… or a rookie pitcher making adjustments to major league hitters that almost all baseball folks see as a solid #3 SP, but he will be our #5.
GO BRAVES….
keyLargo
November 28th, 2011
9:20 pm
What do you mean? I won’t hurt anybody if Bethancourt is traded…
I’d be scared that you’d sit up and the Devil would start talking through you and next your head would spin around several timess. By then people would be in a panic.
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
9:21 pm
After watching Lance Moore do his little dance after the touchdown, I’m convinced that the NFL should give, at least, a 3-game suspension for anyone doing that freakin’ fairy dance.
Normally, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. But during an NFL FOOTBALL GAME?!?!?!?
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
9:23 pm
keylargo I’ve really been doing bad things for me in the last 20 minutes.
Really don’t think I wanna know what that means…
I’d be scared that you’d sit up and the Devil would start talking through you and next your head would spin around several timess.
If Bethancourt is traded? Now, where’d you ever get an idea like that? I wouldn’t even say “boo”…no offense to the kid…
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:26 pm
Puked in my own mouth! damn! can anyone get over the prospect huggin around here??? Tyler Pastorncky?? kiddin right? this dang kid is NOT READY for the Big Show! I don;’t give a damn if 35000 scouts wash his ass every day, he isn’t ready, in fact I doubt he ever will be! Good Gawd! lookin for last place I suppose! this kid has one good year in the minors and suddenly he is a ML SS! I say BullSH!T!!!!!
richbrave
November 28th, 2011
9:30 pm
FALL BALL
AUSTRALIA
No games scheduled
DOMINICA
LICEY TIGERS
No BRAVES played.
ORIENTE STARS
No BRAVES played.
PUERTO RICO
No games scheduled.
VENEZUELA
CARACAS LIONS
No BRAVES played.
LARA CARDINALS
No game scheduled.
ZULIA EAGLES
No game scheduled.
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
9:31 pm
Don’t worry, Joe. Instead of Pastornicky, I’m sure the Braves will do the right thing and put Prado at SS.
I know you’ve been pushing for that.
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:32 pm
Lew and nolie are old. Just read their posts. Contentment is a sign of geezer-ism. I know, I have a grandfather just like this, although he said God D*** they swing at everything they see … are they stupid”!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:32 pm
The old get even more rickety, the prospects keep getting OVERBLOWN, and the supposed new stars well Hanson=HURT, Jurrjens=HURT, Prado=Hurt, Heyward = Horrible… I hope Freeman , Kimbrel, and Venters can carry this bucket full of over-rated scrubs!
richbrave
November 28th, 2011
9:33 pm
JoeBrave:
Don’t read all the posts so I’m not sure who is ready to plug PASTORNICKY into SS for 2012, but it sure ain’t me, and I know it ain’t DOB ’cause he said so.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:35 pm
Tom, I don’t think I have pushed for Prado at SS, in fact he couldn’t cover a steaming pile of turds at short!
Another classic case of sitting on hands by the FO! I will go on record now and tell ya Pastornucky will go the way of Schafer, Francouer, Davies,Reyes and Lillybritches. another over-hyped BUST!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:36 pm
richbrave, I hope not! I really don’t want to see the kid ruined! but I damn sure don’t want to see Gonzoloid back either!
DAP
November 28th, 2011
9:37 pm
y’all, one thought on ethier hitting for power…i dont think he is done as a power hitter at age 29, not after the numbers he has put up in his career. he is a very good hitter, though he struggles against lefties. about 3/4 of pitchers in MLB are righthanded, so the bright side is he is going to hit most MLB pitching really well, just like he did in 2011.
as worried as braves fans get about being so lefty heavy, i wonder if teams like the rangers worry about being righty heavy? does anybody know? im genuinly courious.
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:37 pm
Commercials are so fu**** stupid
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:38 pm
Intentionall left McCann out of the list, He is the ONLY valuable/tradeable commodity the Braves have!
richbrave
November 28th, 2011
9:39 pm
10B:
And I sure ain’t content with this line-up. We need some right-handed juice from the LF slot, and a slick-fielding, decent hitting, SS plus a bench guy to replace CONRAD. So far …….nothin’, but I know WREN has his nose to the grindstone tryin’. I just don’t constantly run my yap abourt it. I ain’t the GM.
Oh, and BTW, I’m the oldest geezer standin’ on this blog…..that I’m aware of anyway.
cabravesfan
November 28th, 2011
9:40 pm
Tom-
You will be happy to know I finally saw the “Not that there is anything wrong with that” episode last night
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:41 pm
Yeah they’re throwing Pastornicky in our faces like he’s a legit prospect. Hell, can’t tell you how many times I’ve already read and heard our announcers even mention his defense is questionable. A questionable glove at short. So pumped for him.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:41 pm
Teheran/Delgado/Vizcaino/Simmons/Bethancourt…. all should be untradeable as in UNTOUCHABLE! the rest, well I watched a pathetic bunch of losers in September! Matt Diaz in a damn platoon aye aye aye! stop! Wren needs to get a solid starting nine, or get another job, damn all this platooning!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:43 pm
Want a deal to fill up the holes without pushing the payroll, here ya go!
LAA get
Jurrjens
Bourn
Prado
Hoover
Atlanta gets:
Bourjos
Torii Hunter
Erick Aybar
Kaleb Cowart
Now there is a trade that makes sense!
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:44 pm
richbrave, I HAVE to get nolie and Lew once in a while. Nothing personal, love all you guys. Love all my fellow Brave fans to the end.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:44 pm
and please for the love of God, if Pastornicky has to be inluded to make that deal happen send him right along too, so I never have to hear his name again!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:46 pm
Bourn aint staying here, and Arte Moreno is Scott Boras’ b!tch!
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:47 pm
Joe, now how would we afford Hunter? Isn’t he making like 17 mill a year or something?
I like Aybar though.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:48 pm
lineup
cf rh Bourjos
ss sh Aybar
1B YES Freeman
LF Hunter
3b Jones
2b Uggla
c Mac
rf Heyward
Bring on Delgado
Beachy,Minor, Hanson,Huddy, hell I’d even take Wandy Rodriguez with that line-up
TnBrian
November 28th, 2011
9:49 pm
joe, who, Pastornicky? Pastornicky reminds me of Lillibridge in a way.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:50 pm
TnB…. Bourn 7 mill JJ-6.5 mill Prado-4 mill there is 17.5 right there, add Aybar at 4.5 that is 22.0 Bourjos is making minimun
tiger297
November 28th, 2011
9:50 pm
did I miss all the sky is falling tim hudson had back surgery posts?
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
9:51 pm
still leaving 5.5 to fill the bench with Betemit, c.Ross, and a loogy
Jim Hertel
November 28th, 2011
9:57 pm
JoeBrave, I for one am pushing and for Pastornicky at short next season, and for the good of the team truly hope that he has an awesome season. This doesn’t seem as unrealistic as you seem to think. Every great player was a prospect at some time that was given a chance and made it. Why not Pastornicky? We happen to pull for a team that builds from the farm. In this case, this year that is not all bad. The crop of free agents at short does not look overwhelming to me. So, I’d say let’s hope and pray Pastornicky is the answer.
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
10:00 pm
Tom, I don’t think I have pushed for Prado at SS… — JoeBrave
You don’t THINK??? My god, man, Noah was less adamant about the rain storm.
Tom-
You will be happy to know I finally saw the “Not that there is anything wrong with that” episode last night — cabravesfan
Awesome! Now my joke will, Finally, make some sense.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:01 pm
Jim, Have you actually seen this kid play short?? have you?? I have and to put it mildly because I actually like the kid, he has nice range, can hit AAAA pitchers but that throwing arm is well LOUSY to but it where evryone can understand! I would imagine pitchers like Halladay, Hamels, hell even the Aaron Cook’s of the world would eat this kid’s lunch and make him like it! how is that for a scouting report! don’t believe everything that comes from the Braves Hype machine! this kid could be a good 2b but at SS he will get CRUCIFIED!!! Bank on IT!
keyLargo
November 28th, 2011
10:02 pm
I’ve really been doing bad things for me in the last 20 minutes.
OK, McFann you caught me. I’ll be down there with you sometime tonight. You have to pay for your sins.
My Sin? I went to the grocery store, minding my own business when a 1/2 gallon of Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup Ice Cream jump into my cart. I couldn’t get it out and snnnniffff, snnnniffff brought it home. It the first time in months I have fallen of the Ice Creamaholic wagon in months.
ANd it took a fine investigation by you to beat that confession out of me.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:03 pm
Tom, Your’e right I don’t think, I KNOW Prado can’t play short, and I know Pastornicky can’t do it either!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:07 pm
I am off of this kid , Robert Andino could do better in the show! that’s all I gotta say! Wren will do whatever, but to bring on absolute regression, will be commiting suicide at the Box Office! A rook at SS, and Prado /Diaz back in LF! I think I will stay home for my 32 games!
tiger297
November 28th, 2011
10:09 pm
couple years ago folks knew Prado wasn’t an everyday 2B…nowadays I think people disagree with that and I’ll bet we could go through a list of players we knew would be successful or always suck where we were dead wrong
not saying either of them can play short just saying what even the experts think is not much more than a scientific crapshoot
tiger297
November 28th, 2011
10:10 pm
except nolie of course
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:11 pm
tiger, I don’t hug up and love on the prospects, they are mere pocket change for deals in my opinion, unless they have a proven track record ala Teheran, Delgado those guys are keepers, the rest TRADE FODDER!
Pcola Brave
November 28th, 2011
10:13 pm
Joebrave
I’ve read reports on Pastornicky and most say he has good range but arm strength is lacking to be an everyday SS. Reports say he should make a useful utility guy at the ML level. From what I’ve read it seems you are more against him being a starting SS than anything?
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:14 pm
.938 umm I don’t think so, I need more from my SS than a .938 fielding percentage!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:15 pm
Pcola, You are correct! at 2b I could go for him, at SS HELL NO! put your eyes on him and see what I mean.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:16 pm
Wren could be smart here, stick this kid at 2b and build value in him like crazy, at SS no way, that arm is pretty bad.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:17 pm
Rainbows and Lollipops! isn’t that what got Yunel traded? well get used to seeing that crap!
McFann O O o
November 28th, 2011
10:18 pm
keylargo You have to pay for your sins.
Who, me?
Which sins…?
I went to the grocery store, minding my own business when a 1/2 gallon of Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup Ice Cream jump into my cart.
That ice cream, I tell ya…when it sees a cart, it just gets so excited and has to jump on in…
DS1
November 28th, 2011
10:18 pm
Meaning no disrespect JoeBrave, but I think I’ll put my trust in the Braves folks when it concerns prospects.
Either Pastornicky has a decent enough arm to be considered a SS, or the Braves are using that as a ploy to help them in other negotiations.
And to be honest, I highly doubt the latter is the case.
And when you consider how bad most SS’s are, what is so wrong with Gonzo?
If the rest of our hitters return to their mean in 2012, we can easily hide a Gonzo or Hicks or Pastornicky at SS if need be.
We’re not talking about a high payroll team here………..
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:19 pm
Nite Folks! maybe Wren will grant someone’s wish, good, bad, or indifferent!
Pcola Brave
November 28th, 2011
10:20 pm
Joebrave
I believe more in Simmons as our long term Ss than Pastornicky. Ultimately I think he will ne moved at some point or be a utility guy. I can’t hate on the guy to much as I’ve never seen him play. But he seems to be a scrappy ballplayer and the kind of guy who is more suited for a specific role than an everyday starter.
DS1
November 28th, 2011
10:22 pm
and why are we quoting minor league fielding stats??? And also, isn’t it possible that players get better and improve?
Seen it many times.
Now, don’t get me wrong, I don’t know if Pastornicky will ever be a legit major league SS, but I’m not about to guarantee it tonight either.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:24 pm
Wayne, If is the key word, If Chipper was 30 again the team might be ok, If JJ could stay healthy, If Heyward could get it going, If Uggla could get over his slow starts, If Hanson… well see what I mean, If’s are what collapsed this team, I have no faves I love the Braves, period, but currently constructed, no way, there are too many if’s! no disrespect to ya there, I really mean that, none intended! just my view from the catbird seat. Should’ve kept Prado at 2B and filled the LF position with Power, that’s what should have happened, now the Braves are saddled with a 12 million dollar solo homer hitting .230 hitter with a piss poor OBP! Uggla is one personally I never wanted to see here! but He is here and now, well we’ll see what Wren does!
Pcola Brave
November 28th, 2011
10:25 pm
DS1
Even back when he was in HS the knock was on his arm. The scouting company said it was in his throwing mechanics. Don’t know how much its changed. I know he was clocked at 92least across the diamond in HS so the potential is there. I believe back then he struggled to consistently find the same arm slot.
NORRIS
November 28th, 2011
10:27 pm
There are no rumors any where about possible short stop for the braves. I am very curious as to what management has up their sleeve…
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:27 pm
But to have a piss poor fielder at SS, 2B and an eroding statue at 3B that infield defense would be a sieve! more inclined to think that Wren is seeking a better course of action!
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:29 pm
28,19,26 those are the error totals in 3 seasons in the minors, I don’t see any improvement from one year to the next.
JoeBrave
November 28th, 2011
10:30 pm
Oh! well good nite all, have a great evening!
nolie
November 28th, 2011
10:39 pm
Joe would trade Pastornicky
for a good gin rickey
Zing
November 28th, 2011
10:39 pm
A word on our favorite topic, Mr. Pastornicky.
I did a very little bit of reading and research about the young man. Turns out he actually was rated a good prospect as a pitcher due to his 90 mph fastball (and apparently he also had a good curveball). He’s been clocked on throws across the diamond in the lower 90s.
Joe– dude, really? Bad arm? The numbers don’t lie on velocity.
Not saying this kid is the next Ozzie Smith or even Jeff Treadway, but I think we can stop with the complaints that the kid is all hype or something. Please. If Pastornicky is the Braves’ starting SS, it’ll be because he’s good enough to do the job, nothing more, nothing less.
Zing
November 28th, 2011
10:43 pm
Exactly correct, nolie.
Pcola Brave
November 28th, 2011
10:46 pm
If I remember correctly, Elvis Andrus had similar numbers to pastornicky in the minors. Not to worried about that. I think he could do an adequate job if required to do so but wouldn’t be my first choice.
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
10:48 pm
Sorry, VJ & Ward. Not looking very good for your G-Men.
Pcola Brave
November 28th, 2011
10:48 pm
I’m referring to Andrus minor league defense.
Zing
November 28th, 2011
10:50 pm
Pcola: Totally agree.
It’s also worthwhile to note how awful AGOn’s bat was. Let’s say Pastornicky would be a downgrade defensively… but batted 40 points higher. Is that so bad? Is that worse?
I just think people are getting a little hysterical on this issue, frankly.
nolie
November 28th, 2011
10:52 pm
if he is now throwing across the diamond at 90 someone must have worked with his mechanics cause in HS down here he did not throw as strong from short as he did when pitching. That would be good to hear
DS1
November 28th, 2011
10:54 pm
I just think it’s a little wreckless to make statements about players who have yet to play in the majors. Players improve. Sometimes they don’t pan out. And often times their error totals can be very misleading.
Not statements I am prepared to make.
kenhotlanta
November 28th, 2011
10:54 pm
McFann O O o,
Blue Bell Butter Pecan Ice Cream does the same thing to me, too…it just jumps in my cart every time I walk past the freezer door. And if it’s on sale, sometimes I’ll find 2 or 3 cartons in my cart when I get to the checkout. I don’t understand it.
nolie
November 28th, 2011
10:54 pm
Defensively Gonzo led baseball with 22 runs saved at short this year, no way Tyler approaches that at all IMO
Moe Berg
November 28th, 2011
10:56 pm
richbrave–I’m guessing that you won’t see this for a bit. I went to see Chick Corea’s Elektric Band on Saturday night at the Blue Note. I sat about seven or eight feet from Dave Weckl. He was incredible. Also had a great vantage point for John Patitucci and Frank Gambale. Pretty good point of view for Chick, but not so great for Eric Marienthal. I did not get home from the show until 3:00, but it was worth it.
Venice Jim
November 28th, 2011
10:56 pm
Tom – O ye of little faith (says the guy who hasn’t watched since halftime)…
nolie
November 28th, 2011
10:57 pm
Chipper made 130 or so errors in three years IIRC
kenhotlanta
November 28th, 2011
10:57 pm
I watched the Mid-Season Finale to The Walking Dead just now…I hope everyone that was going to give up (DOB) stayed with it. Each week got better all the way to a very intense cliff hanger.
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
10:58 pm
I just think people are getting a little hysterical on this issue, frankly.
(cough) Just one (cough, cough) person, Zing (cough)
nolie
November 28th, 2011
10:58 pm
like with many other products I am a Publix ice cream kinda guy.great selection of regular flavors and limited edition specials….yum yum
Venice Jim
November 28th, 2011
10:59 pm
At least we have an easy game next week…
(apparently the referees are unaware if the fumble rule even when watching a replay that makes it obvious)…
Venice Jim
November 28th, 2011
10:59 pm
I miss Publix ice cream…
Tom O'Hawke
November 28th, 2011
11:00 pm
Tom – O ye of little faith (says the guy who hasn’t watched since halftime)…
I have plenty of faith that they won’t play this badly next Sunday, dang it!
Venice Jim
November 28th, 2011
11:01 pm
Chipper made 130 or so errors in three years IIRC
I guess you only watched half the games…
Venice Jim
November 28th, 2011
11:03 pm
Players improve
Not when subjected to the negatively aligned techniques taught by the Braves’ staff…