Braves prez Schuerholz pitches “Murph” for HOF

The Braves today sent a letter from team president John Schuerholz to Hall of Fame-voting members of the Baseball Writers Association of America and others in the media, supporting former Atlanta standout Dale Murphy’s election to the HOF on the upcoming ballot.

Time is running out for HOF consideration for “Murph,” a Braves icon who is on the ballot for the 14th year and hasn’t come close to election. The maximum eligibility is 15 years on the ballot.

Murphy was a two-time National League MVP (1982, 1983), seven-time All-Star and five-time Gold Glove winner. He finished his career with a .265 average, .346 on-base percentage, 398 home runs and 1,266 RBIs in 18 seasons, 15 of which were spent with the Braves.  He finished 12th or higher in the league  MVP balloting six times.

His career average and OBP declined significantly during his final six injury-plagued seasons, after his last great season in 1987 when he hit .295 with a career-high 44 homers, 105 RBIs and a career-best .997 OPS for the Braves.

After hitting .279 with 310 homers, a .362 OBP and .500 slugging percentage in his first 12 seasons through 1987, Murphy hit .234 with 88 homers, a .307 OBP and .396 slugging percentage in his  final six seasons.

He had four consecutive seasons with 36-37 homers and 100 or more RBIs from 1982-1985, hitting above .280 with an OBP above .370 while playing all 162 games in each of those seasons. In 1983, he led the NL in RBIs (121), slugging percentage (.540) and  OPS (.933), and led the league in homers in 1984 (36) and 1985 (37).

Murphy has not been named on as many as 25 percent of the ballots in any of his first 13 years of eligibility, and last year he was named on fewer than 13 percent of the ballots cast. Election requires 75 percent.

After a maximum of 15 years on the ballot, a player can only be elected to the HOF by the Veterans Committee, and far fewer are selected that way than by the conventional election.

Below is the letter from Schuerholz, which was accompanied by two pages filled with Murphy’s statistics and accomplishments.


November 15, 2011

Dear Hall of Fame Voter:

As you prepare to vote for the National Baseball Hall of Fame’s Class of 2012, please accept this letter in support of Dale Murphy.

The Atlanta Braves organization is extremely proud of Dale’s outstanding accomplishments during an extraordinary 18-year Major League career, 15 of which were spent with the Braves.

Not only on the field, but off the field as well, Dale represented himself and the city of Atlanta with the class and professionalism consistent with the ideals of Major League Baseball and the Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. Even today, he continues to be one of our game’s greatest ambassadors.

On the following two pages, please review Dale’s remarkable accomplishments produced over what the Braves family feels is a Hall of Fame career. On behalf of our organization and Dale individually, I thank you for your consideration.

Sincerely,

(signature)

John Schuerholz

President
Atlanta Braves
755 Hank Aaron Drive
Atlanta, GA 30315

199 comments Add your comment

stamper

November 16th, 2011
12:08 pm

Florida Braves Fan

November 16th, 2011
12:11 pm

I hope he is elected because he deserves it. Murph is what’s right about baseball and is a true ambassador of the game.

Nick Paste

November 16th, 2011
12:11 pm

Can you get the 2 pages?

Jerry Willard

November 16th, 2011
12:16 pm

Nick Paste acts like he was cheated or he has a vote..

Just be thankful for the info and go away..

ramblingman

November 16th, 2011
12:20 pm

Murph’s numbers support his election. What has kept his vote totals artificially low was where he played.

Murph earned a spot in the Hall.

Go Braves.

meh

November 16th, 2011
12:20 pm

Dale Murphy should most definately be in the HOF

BlueMoon

November 16th, 2011
12:21 pm

This should have been started long ago. Murph has been the single best ambassador for the city of Atlanta (speaking of former athletes here) that the city has ever had. Not to mention the fact that he performed at a remarkably high level without the use of performance enhancing drugs. Baseball writers have just quit looking at comparables of the generation which is a shame because if they did Murph ranks with the best of them already in the hall.

ChopperToChipper

November 16th, 2011
12:25 pm

The Murph is a class act and absolutely was one of the dominant players of his era. It would be a travesty if he is not a member of the Hall one day.

PMC

November 16th, 2011
12:26 pm

Well it’s about Fing time if freaking Glen Rice is in the HOF.

Jorge

November 16th, 2011
12:26 pm

Dave, Can you post the stats pages too?

don

November 16th, 2011
12:29 pm

Murphy is a fine human being who is a credit to baseball. However, he did not have a career which would warrant electing him in the Hall of Fame.

The Hall already has far too many members who were good, popular, or both. It needs to be much more exclusive.

Brave New World

November 16th, 2011
12:30 pm

Murph’s numbers are not quite Hall of Fame on their own, but he was an MVP 2 X’s playing for some truly dreadful teams. He and Mike Schmidt were the dominant NL power hitters of their day. Most compelling argument for Murph as a Hall of Famer: If candidates with better stats are barred from entry to The Hall because of questionable integrity and character (i.e. Rose, Sosa, Clemens, etc.), than conversely, the Hall should put extra weight on a player of exceptional character like Dale Murphy who represented all that is decent and honorable in baseball. GO MURPH!

David O'Brien

November 16th, 2011
12:31 pm

I just added this paragraph to the Murphy story above: Murphy had four consecutive seasons with 36-37 homers and 100 or more RBIs from 1982-1985, hitting above .280 with an OBP above .370 while playing all 162 games in each of those seasons. In 1983, he led the NL in RBIs (121), slugging percentage (.540) and OPS (.933), and led the league in homers in 1984 (36) and 1985 (37).

David O'Brien

November 16th, 2011
12:32 pm

Jorge, you can find Murph’s career stats at this link: http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/murphda05.shtml

Orange Brave f/k/a Billy jacks bbq

November 16th, 2011
12:33 pm

Ditto. Should be in, particularly when compared to his peers of the day.

ChillyMutt

November 16th, 2011
12:37 pm

Jared

November 16th, 2011
12:38 pm

Murph is a Hall of Famer, No Question, if he wouldn’t have had holes all around him in the batting order, or would have cheated by using roids, as other Hofer’s had, I believe he would have been elected a long time ago. It’s unfortunate that he had the health issues the last few years, and might have been better off to have retired before the trade fro Jeff Parrot.

I agree that if you look at his peers, he was among the elite, in spite of the offensive lineup around him for at least 10 years, but I’m not sure if that is enough longevity for the Hall. I sure hope it is, because there hasn’t been a finer person in the game!

Ron Sinclair

November 16th, 2011
12:39 pm

Class act on behalf of one of the classiest men ever to play professional sports.

cosmo

November 16th, 2011
12:43 pm

good luck to Murph- if all those pitchers had not thrown him those low outside pitches he’d be a sure thing

Luke

November 16th, 2011
12:43 pm

Don,

“The Hall already has far too many members who were good, popular, or both. It needs to be much more exclusive.”

I would agree that the Hall should be much more exclusive, but it’s exactly because it’s NOT that Murphy absolutely should be there. Peak-wise, he was the best player in the league multiple years. Career-wise, his numbers are impressive if you scrape away the comparative numbers of all the roid users.

Kevin W

November 16th, 2011
12:46 pm

Murph was #2 in the 80s in HR and #2 in the 80s in RBI. Compared to his peers (and not to the subsequent Steriods Era) he definitely should be in the HOF. Growing up, I never would have thought that guys like Gary Carter, Jim Rice, Andre Dawson, Bruce Sutter, Ryne Sandberg, Goose Gossage, etc. would be IN the Hall and Murphy would be OUT. I’m not going to argue for or against any of those guys, but there’s no way that any or all of those guys are Hall of Famers and then Murphy is not. He is their equal or superior in so many categories.

And I echo Blue Moon… this candidacy should have started a long time ago. Gary Carter campaigned his way in. The Reds campaigned for Tony Perez several years ago. Murphy is too humble to do that, and so I am glad to see the Braves are finally taking up his cause.

David O'Brien

November 16th, 2011
12:48 pm

Murphy hit .279 with 310 homers, a .362 OBP and .500 slugging percentage in his first 12 seasons through 1987, then hit .234 with 88 homers, a .307 OBP and .396 slugging percentage in his final six seasons.

dean

November 16th, 2011
12:48 pm

Does anyone remember when Tom Glavine “plunked” Dale Murphy in Philly? THAT was a HOF-worthy moment. It was hilarious.

I hope Murph’ gets in.

Tommy

November 16th, 2011
12:58 pm

If they’ll put Jim Rice and Ryne Sandberg in, then Murphy should be there by default. Rice had Dwight Evans and Wade Boggs around him in the lineup, Sandberg had Andre Dawson and Mark Grace, and Murphy had Dion James and Ken Oberkfell.

That he wasn’t walked 200 times a year is a miracle.

btw, that letter would have been useful about 10 years ago.

MARK

November 16th, 2011
1:00 pm

Folks sorry ,he is not a hallof famer, .265? with 398hrs. hall of fame should be .300+ avg and 450hrs,only halll player i’ve seen that ain’t a pitcher for the Braves in the last 30 yrs. is Chipper

Skeezix

November 16th, 2011
1:01 pm

I hope he gets in because he is one of my all time favorite Braves and put up some great stats for many years despite playing for some miserable Braves teams. But even better, Dale is a person of the highest character – an asset to Atlanta and to society in general (not like so many of today’s ‘prima donna’ pro athletes who are a detriment to society).
I really can’t differ with those who argue that his career stats don’t quite measure up. But he is definitely in my all time HOF.

rogeriter

November 16th, 2011
1:06 pm

Just as Pete Roses’ bad behavior carried weight in his denial to the HOF, Dale Murphy’s outstanding representation of Major League Baseball ought to count on his side!

railman311

November 16th, 2011
1:09 pm

def in the “nothing but class” HOF..

Dan C.

November 16th, 2011
1:11 pm

Dale Murphy deserves the HOF. He may have the most class of any one whoever wore a Brave’s uniform. If stat’s is all you need to be in the HOF. Pete Rose should be in to. Murphy had class on and off the field. You won’t find a better person.

T-Bone

November 16th, 2011
1:13 pm

DOB, I know that 400 hrs is sort of a majic number, but how do his stats compare to others in the Hall? I think he should be there, but what do I know!? His career avg seems a bit low, but

DHD

November 16th, 2011
1:24 pm

The 2 teams he was MVP for finished first and second. Hardly “dreadful.”

Go Murph!!

Andy

November 16th, 2011
1:26 pm

Classy thing to do. Probably won’t work but still good.

Hoosier Aaron

November 16th, 2011
1:47 pm

By today’s voting standards, Sandy Koufax would not be elected to the HoF.
He was 36 – 40 the first six years of his career which ended with only 165 wins.
The last six years (we all know) he was a monster…129 – 47.
He certainly did not dominate for a extended period of time…six years.
However, many consider him to the be “Greatest LH Pitcher of all time.
Sandy is certainly a HoF – but if his career ended today with those numbers and today’s voters and voting standards…no way he is in.

Murph and MJ Schmidt were the most dominate players in the 80’s….check their stats.
Murph is worthy.

Kevin W

November 16th, 2011
1:53 pm

Spot on Hoosier Aaron. I agree completely.

Abnerish

November 16th, 2011
2:01 pm

If Kirby Puckett is a Hall of Famer than Murph should’ve been one years ago. The sad fact is that if Murph had hit TWO more HRs, he would’ve been in the HoF already.

Ted

November 16th, 2011
2:02 pm

Murph deserves this more than a lot of self promoting player such as, let’s see: GARY CARTER — who basically kissed more butt to be elected than anybody will ever truly know!
Andre Dawson was never a better player than Murph – maybe they were very close in every way that they played. Compare Dawson and Murphy and tell me that Murph doesn’t belong in the HoF.
Dale Murphy CARRIED this team – if the Braves had not have had Murphy and Phil Neikro, (Bob Horner gets an nood here too!) The Braves would never have won 60 games in a season!

Let’s give the man his due! He’ll never ask or seek promotion for this – he let his bat, glove, speed, and FAITH speak for him!1

Bob the Blogger

November 16th, 2011
2:09 pm

I’ve always thought of Murphy as being boarderline HOF worthy, having only five seasons of 85+ RBIs, the .265 career average, etc. The career .815 OPS, while better than Andre Dawson’s and Ryne Sandburg’s, is not exeptional. The gold gloves certainly need to be considered, but overall, Murph only had five or so HOF caliber years. The other years, he was quite average.

Dawgster7

November 16th, 2011
2:09 pm

Dale Murphy exemplifies everything that is right about sports! Here’s hoping the Murph gets his just due into the Baseball Hall of Fame!!! Regardless you will always bea HOF in my book Murph!

PMC

November 16th, 2011
2:15 pm

Jim Rice only had 382 hrs, he did hit .298 as a career, but if he’s not a Red Sock he never gets in with those numbers.

Murphy was among the finest players of his era, he should be in.

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:18 pm

@Bob the Blogger, I almost agree with you except that Ryne Sandberg is a no-doubt Hall of Famer because of the position he played. But yeah, a few years ago I though Murphy was a borderline candidate and while I wanted to see him in for sentimental reasons, I understood why many may see him as just short. However, with the elections of Rice and Dawson the bar has been lowered, and sufficiently lowered such that Murphy should be inducted. He was a better player than either of those two, and this revisionist history of how Rice was “feared” or Dawson was paid to drive in runs, not get on base, makes that no less true. That said, while I can’t think of a rationale for leaving Murphy out of the current Hall, lowering the bar is something the voters should strive not to do.

Milledgeville DAWG

November 16th, 2011
2:23 pm

How can you say no to this Atlanta sports icon. He always was and will be the ultimate professional. Go MURPH-you deserve to be in the HOF!!!!

extremus

November 16th, 2011
2:27 pm

Dale Murphy was the face of the Braves the first year I began watching them regularly; it was 1982 and on Channel 17, WTBS. He was not only arguably the best position player in the game at that point (and certainly in the Top Five), but as has been stated MANY times since, carried himself professionally and humbly. He was a class act both on and off the field.

The detractors who tend not to place him in the same company as his contemporary Andre Dawson (who entered the HOF last year) point to his lifetime batting average, his high strikeout totals, and the fact that his dominant years weren’t quite as many in number. Some factors they forget to consider, I believe, are that Dale Murphy played on a lot of Braves teams (especially 1985 and afterward) where he had NO ONE around him in the batting order who posed nearly the same threat. Without that protection he didn’t get nearly as many good pitches to hit as he did in the often great summer days of 1982-84. Sadly he missed the initial Miracle Season of 1991 and the ones that followed after injuries and a trade (to the now-hated Phillies!) ended his Braves career. It would’ve been awesome if it’d been Murph running the bases instead of, say, Lonnie Smith in Game 7 in the Metrodome wouldn’t it? One has to wonder if the results would have turned out differently.

The other factor I think Major League Baseball should consider is Dale Murphy’s aforementioned character. We’re living in a generation that has disenchanted many fans withe grossly overpaid players, players with no loyalty to any team beyond how much money they’re offered, character issues from drugs and steroids to outright criminal behavior. The Grand Old Game needs an image change in many regards. A step toward that would be inducting Dale Murphy into the Hall of Fame, because whatever statistical categories he may have fallen short of eligibility to some folks (and where he did he was usually VERY close), his CHARACTER should serve to make up the difference. Acknowledging and rewarding such character would go a long way toward reestablishing the priorities and ideals that made so many of us fall in love with baseball in the first place (namely team, loyalty, character, professionalism).

Murph gets my vote, for whatever that’s worth.

B.Dawson

November 16th, 2011
2:33 pm

Murph is an all time great and deserves this as much as anyone. His numbers and awards stack up with the best from his era and he did it with integrity. It would mean so much to atlanta and ME the guy that wore my #3 jersey for every little league team i ever played for, pretending to be Murph. it will be a shame if he doesn’t get in!!!

Homo the Brave

November 16th, 2011
2:35 pm

The 1981 player’s strike cost Murphy the chance at 400 HRs and a chance in the HOF.

The 1994 player’s strike cost Fred McGriff the chance at 500 HRs. I hope it doesn’t cost him a chance at the HOF, too.

urban redneck

November 16th, 2011
2:35 pm

I’m a Mormon!!!

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:35 pm

@extremus, the Lonnie Smith trek was/is painful but he also homered in 3 straight games in that series. Without the offense, where 2 of the games were decided by one run, there may not have been a game 7. As for Murphy, forget batting average. His on-base percentage was .346. Dawson’s was .323. I believe Dawson’s is the lowest of any corner outfielder in the Hall of Fame. Again, not arguing for Dawson’s exclusion but if he’s in then Murphy is in too.

njbraves

November 16th, 2011
2:36 pm

He hasn’t come close to election in 14 tries because he doesn’t deserve to be elected. Its the HOF, not the Hall of very good. Nice player, excellent at times, but clearly not a HOF’er.

extremus

November 16th, 2011
2:38 pm

I wish Dale Murphy and Hank Aaron could both do a “Field of Dreams” and return to their youth and dominance. Boy, THAT would sure end the Braves’ current outfield woes in a hurry, wouldn’t it?

And while you’re at it, give Maddux, Glavine, and Smoltz a sip from the Fountain of Youth (and save some for Chipper, I might add). Instant dynasty.

Ah, it’s fun to dream sometimes, if only for a momentary diversion…

Ralph Garr

November 16th, 2011
2:40 pm

If Murph doesn’t make it in, he’s easily a starter on a team featuring the best players never to make the HOF.

njbraves

November 16th, 2011
2:40 pm

All of you who are calling for his election, look at his baseball reference page. he had 6 very good seasons and a few other decent seasons…that’s not a HOF’er.

extremus

November 16th, 2011
2:41 pm

@DetroitBraves,

You’re correct about Lonnie Smith’s contributions during the ‘91 World Series. Sorry, I didn’t mean to detract from that or to diminish Smith’s worth as a player; I only meant to say it would’ve been great to see Dale Murphy be able to participate in a great season after so many awful years. He deserved better…a lot better.

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:42 pm

If you want to use a saber number to compare players Murphy stands up better compared to Rice in WAR, though not as well as Dawson. Just glancing at players around his number, he’s just behind Puckett, who is in, and Berkman, who probably would get some support today. He’s just ahead of Vizquel, who will probably also get some support, Hack Wilson, who is in, and Jose Canseco, who strongly supports his own candidacy.

Delbert D.

November 16th, 2011
2:44 pm

How about a plea for a left fielder who can hit with power?

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:46 pm

@extremus, I got what you were saying. Just pointing out you can’t really remove the bad without the good. But actually, you know Lonnie Smith wasn’t even supposed to be the guy that year even with Murph gone. It was supposed to be Otis Nixon but a funny thing happened on his way to October……

extremus

November 16th, 2011
2:50 pm

Okay, last post and then I’ll quit. I know the debate rages about how much (if anything) character should play in helping Murph get into the HOF. Going by numbers alone, however, as an above post made the point, Pete Rose and Barry Bonds should both be first-ballot HOFers, but character was ironically enough of an issue to keep them OUT.

No answer will satisfy everyone, I’ll admit. But if you put a young Dale Murphy entering his prime into the middle of, say, the current Braves lineup (which, while it has its holes, is definitely better than it was in the mid-to-late 1980s), I think he REACHES those Hall of Fame numbers provided he stays healthy. Imagine how many games Phil Niekro would’ve won if he had pitched on the 90s and 2000s Braves teams instead of the 60s through the mid-80s; the players around you CAN make a huge difference.

Yeah, it’s all imaginative speculation which can never be quanitified, but it’d be fun to know, wouldn’t it? At any rate a young, healthy Murph would be a huge and welcome improvement over what the Braves have in the outfield currently, lol!

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:51 pm

@njbraves, I don’t disagree with you and I still don’t have a major problem, objectively speaking, of Murphy not getting into the Hall. But the lack of support he gets relative to recently elected contemporaries like Dawson, and especially Rice, doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. Of course, opening the door to more of the “very good” is probably not what a lot of us want but with the current elections the voters have moved towards a Big Hall. I don’t like the Big Hall idea myself but a Big Hall includes Murphy.

Kane337

November 16th, 2011
2:52 pm

Please put Dale Murphy in the HoF. He deserves it.

NickB

November 16th, 2011
2:55 pm

It’s a very tough call. There is something to be said for not allowing anyone in who makes the HOF worse…. and I fear Murph does that.. (he was my favorite player as a kid too…)

However, his last 6 years really hurt him. If it was the Hall of the Very Godd I think he gets in, but I don’t think using the excuse that others got in who might not should have (Rice,Dawson,Carter) as a reason to include Murphy is not valid… (you forget that when he retired Sandberg was one of the all time leaders in nearly every 2nd base offensive category).

I loved the Murph, but his career got derailed by injuries too soon.

DetroitBraves

November 16th, 2011
2:57 pm

@extremus, character is only keeping Rose and Bonds (theoretically, I mean he hasn’t been on the ballot yet has he?) out in that they had poor enough character to cheat (and get caught). Rose gambled on baseball, which is explicitly forbidden, and Bonds is stongly linked to PEDs. However, had their crimes been domestic violence, DUI, tax evasion (actually, didn’t Rose get in some trouble like that) and that was the extent of it they would be in the Hall. Character may be important for borderline guys, maybe, but they get in with their numbers without the issues tied directly to the game. Ty Cobb got in.

Mcnuggets Sandwich

November 16th, 2011
2:58 pm

DOB,

Nothing to do with Dale Murphy, but with the reports online of Terry Francona not coaching in 2012 do you think that the Braves would look at him if Freddi has a horrible 2012 season?

John Adcox

November 16th, 2011
3:01 pm

Well done and well said, Mr. Schuerholz. A classy move for a classy guy.

Ken Stallings

November 16th, 2011
3:02 pm

Glad to see the Braves do this — long overdue in my view. It is outrageous that the HOF voters snub Murphy as they have. He should at least be knocking on the door vice shunned to the infernal regions. That his vote tally declined over the years is more a product of overly restrictive voting rules. But, the steroids era should have polished his resume as he did it honest.

Joe in SoCal

November 16th, 2011
3:12 pm

HR totals should have nothing to do with HOF cred. How many people think that a player like Ichiro or Gwynn shouldn’t be in because they didn’t hit 400. Its nit picking. Murph is the real deal. He was top of the class in his ERA and thats what should take precedence.

smallmouth6

November 16th, 2011
3:15 pm

Dale Murphey was the best player for sevral years in all of baseball. Among my favorite Braves.

Abnerish

November 16th, 2011
3:18 pm

If Murph played for Boston or the Yankees, he would have made it 12 years ago. He was one of the 5-7 best players of the 1980s. AND he is the posterboy for everything that is right about sports. If Dawson, Rice, and Puckett deserved it, so does he.

Just the facts

November 16th, 2011
3:26 pm

If Murph had played for Boston he would have had 500 HRS when you consider the lineup the Red Sox had in the late 70s and 80s.

Instead he played on some horrific Braves’ teams and had to carry them.

Having said that Murph was an All-time Braves’ great, but not a Cooperstown inductee. His career numbers are not good enough.

Put your team loyalty aside for a minute and study the numbers !

Just because he was a nice guy doesn’t mean he’s a Hall of Famer !

The HOF includes drunks, druggies, a murderer and a cast of other characters.

Babe Ruth used to go to the local brothel before a game.

bravefan1

November 16th, 2011
3:27 pm

Here’s hoping Murph makes it but I doubt it will happen. My favorite player of the 80’s played every day, played the game the way it was supposed to be played, and played with a class unbeknownst to most ball players in any era. He dominated for a decade in the NL and won 2 MVP’s on a horrible team, possibly the worst team in the NL in the 80’s. There’s more to candidacy than stats and with today’s gaudy stats Murph’s pale in comparison. He was a leader, was community minded, and a fan favorite. With all that has happened to baseball’s image you’d thinkthe sport would beg to have him voted in. Murph we love you!!

Character Counts

November 16th, 2011
3:27 pm

There should be no Baseball Hall of Fame if Dale Murphy is not in it.

Top

November 16th, 2011
3:33 pm

For the decade of the 80’s he and Gerald Riggs were the only sports stars in Atlanta. He is the only person to win back to back MVP’s NOT in the HOF. He, Schmidt, and Andre Dawson were the big NL bats in the decade and what do the other two have in common??? It is only fair that the players that dominate a specific era be recognized with such an honor. He should be in!! Should have been years ago. Jim Rice is in, Dawson is in. Their numbers were not so outrageously better than Dale Murphy’s. Put him in, or the Hall of fame will continue to be what I have longed suspected it to be… A Big Fraud!!!

Dan Uggla

November 16th, 2011
3:46 pm

I date porno chicks. Do you think that may hurt my chances of getting in the HOF some day?

dap01

November 16th, 2011
3:47 pm

Bottom line is that is he had played in the ESPN favorite cities of Boston or New York, he would have been in the HOF many years ago.

wjones

November 16th, 2011
3:49 pm

Dale Murphy & Roger Maris are the only two back-to-back MVP’s not in the HOF. Murphy’s stats outweigh Maris’ by a sizable margin. The comparison to Puckett is certainly interesting. Puckett’s eye problems caused him to retire, so the six bad years at the end of his career that Murphy had were not played by Puckett, so his numbers artificially look better because he didn’t have a decline phase which would have probably dropped his rate stats. At his best, Murph was as good as most HOF’ers. I agree with those who say he is borderline, and also agree with those who say that a borderline candidate with his character gets a push into the Hall.

Some Sense

November 16th, 2011
3:50 pm

Nice gesture and all, but he was never that good. Plus the Braves never won anything while he was playing.

vesaversa

November 16th, 2011
3:53 pm

I hate to bust the bubble over Dale Murphy becoming a HALL of Fame’er. Murphy is only a Hall of Fame’er in the hearts and minds of the Atlanta Braves fans . His baseball stats doesn’t pan out he was a over achievement .

extremus

November 16th, 2011
3:57 pm

@Dan Uggla,

No, but your 2011 numbers might, lol!

Too Tough

November 16th, 2011
3:58 pm

Yes, he was Mr. Brave, after Hank left! He deserves the Hall of Fame…! Go Braves!!!

Just the facts

November 16th, 2011
4:02 pm

The horrible Braves’ teams of the 70s-80s kept 318 game winner Phil Niekro out of the Hall for many years until some common sense finally prevailed & he got elected..

If Knucksie had played for the Reds or Dodgers in that era he would have won 400 games.

Murph was good but if his career BA was .285 and not .262, he’d be in Cooperstown today. Two more HR’s would not have put him in either.

aaron in arizona

November 16th, 2011
4:03 pm

urban redneck……………….GOOD FOR YOU!!!!!! CAN’T BEAT THAT!!!

[...] Atlanta Braves great Dale Murphy has only two go-rounds of Hall of Fame ballotry left before he’ll have missed his chance at Cooperstown. From team president John Schuerholz, a letter sent to Hall of Fame voters: [...]

Brian from Villa Rica

November 16th, 2011
4:14 pm

All of these guys with gaudy numbers and padded lifetime stats were never considered to be the best in the game. Johnny Damon is closing in on 3000 hits and Jim Thome hit 600 homers but neither of them have ever been considered to be even in the top 5 at their positions at any given time and look where they placed in MVP voting. Look at where he ranks in offensive stats for the 1980’s. It’s as if the decade never happened. Jim Rice and Andre Dawson were never discussed as being the best player in the game. Two time NL MVP who refused to stick around long enough to get the 400 dingers that used to get you in the hall. I believe at the time Murphy retired that Dave Kingman was the only non-HOFer with 400+. Don’t tell me about the numbers. He was elite.

Need to step up.

November 16th, 2011
4:20 pm

Ya know I realize Dale was a great player BUT here we go again. Hes been on the ballot what 13 or so years and has not made it. Why, because someone better did. Its turned into a no loser society and you know what, its killing the normal way of life.

Look at little league, all players must play regardless of their talent, all teams must win, all players must, all things must. Now look at the Occupy people, same spoiled kids who want, demand, need, not win it but be given it. Im kinda sick of the whole thing.

Sure I hope Murphy gets in but if he does not its because there was someone better deserving. There are great players and then there are really good players that people really like and make them great. Maybe Murph is one of those really good players sitting beside the great players. Ya think.

DawgDad

November 16th, 2011
4:24 pm

Murphy deserves election, but it’s almost certain to be the Veteran’s Committee route.

bravedawg

November 16th, 2011
4:28 pm

How about this question for baseball fans. Would you want your son to grow up to be like Dale Murphy?

Ken Stallings

November 16th, 2011
4:33 pm

Those who want to compare Murphy’s offensive numbers to say they do not merit HOF election, precisely whom are you comparing them to?

Perhaps the only power hitter with better numbers in that era was Mike Schmidt and he was elected. Andre Dawson’s numbers are barely better in some areas. Unless you are prepared to maintain that only the best hitter of a decade can get into the Hall of Fame (and that flies in the face of the facts based on who’s in today), then to say Murphy’s numbers don’t merit election are wrong.

His numbers don’t compare favorably to the steroid era of offensive baseball, which also benefitted from expansion with AAA or AA caliber pitchers on whom the best hitters of the 90’s and 2000’s feasted on. OK, if that’s the yardstick, then take out George Brett’s and Tony Gwinn’s plaques. Because compared to players from the turn of the century who routinely hit .400, these two didn’t put up averages and on base numbers that would warrant consideration!

That would, of course, be stupid! But, the point is that during the 80’s, Murphy played in multi-purpose stadiums that were enormous, with walls pushed out to 385 in the power alleys and 410 or more to center field. Even down the lines was routinely 335. Further, many had wall over ten foot in height, such as in the Astrodome or Jack Murphy in San Diego. Even Candlestick had its walls pushed out further than they were when it was closed for baseball. In the 90’s, the offensive emphasis caused all these stadiums to bring in their walls, or even build new shorter and closer ones, but Murphy was already retired by then and did not benefit.

Put Murphy in today’s stadiums, even without steroids and HGH, and he would have blasted through the 400 HR mark and likely flirted with 500, at which point even by today’s skewed standards, he would already have his plaque at Cooperstown. His home stadium was named the “Launching Pad,” but the walls were even moved out during his era and made higher than they were when Henry Aaron played, and they were considered short by the standards of most 80’s era stadiums.

The simple and unalterable truth to any HOF career is one yardstick: how did this player compare to his peers? Using that only acceptable yardstick, Murphy does not merely compare, he excels! His numbers during those six monster seasons were not merely “very good” as a few feeble praises here have maintained. They were the very best of those seasons! The very best! And the very best, people, is a heck of sight better than merely “very good!”

Additionally, he earned multiple Gold Gloves in centerfield. He stole bases. He led the team. He exemplified the highest of integrity and goodwill for the sport. Pete Rose is outside the HOF because his character violated the integrity of the game. Mark McGuire, Sammy Sosa, and Rafael Palmero are all out, and likely will stay out, because their character violated the integrity of the game. How then can it withstand objective and logical analysis to say impeccable and stalwart character that represented the best of the game does not merit any consideration!

Stop looking at numbers without context of the era they were compiled. There was an era in baseball where if your ERA was not 2.50 or lower, you were an average pitcher! There was an era where a .400 batting average with a .600 OBA was required in order to be an “above average” hitter. Want to know why Ted Williams’ .402 season did not earn him MVP? It was because as late as that era, a .400 season average was not considered anything but a remarkably good year, but not elite! Writers and fans needed only look back but a few years to find higher season averages. But, a 52-game hitting streak was record setting, and hence Joe DiMaggio was widely elected for the MVP that year. Ask writers from that era who voted, and they didn’t even think it a close contest! They’d look at you like you were stupid if you even questioned their votes, or asked them if it was a hard choice to make!

Today, hitting .400 for a season would re-write the baseball records in terms of press coverage. In truth, Roger Maris may deserve more consideration for HOF than he got. Frankly, the Baseball HOF has always been widely too stingy, far more selective than the HOF’s for basketball, football, and hockey. If you don’t believe me, check out the truth of it for yourself.

But, for a career, Maris’ numbers don’t come close to matching Murphy’s. But, more importantly, despite the two MVP seasons, Maris’ numbers were not even the best of his decade. No one can make an argument to say Dale Murphy was not one of the elite baseball players of his generation — his numbers say that without question he was one of the very best players of his generation, among the two or three best, in fact.

His sole misfortunes were to play for a team outside of media-saturated NYC plus also to end his career and compete for HOF votes when the steroids era re-wrote the concept of what it took to have a remarkable offensive season. Finally, one has to admit that he put up those elite numbers of his generation despite having to practically carry his teams on his solitary back, surrounded by at best middling talent except for 1982 and 1983, which is by no means coincidental that these were two of his best years that exceeded every other player in the National League! If he had that kind of surrounding talent each of his years in Atlanta, we wouldn’t still be debating his eligibility. He’d already be in!

Enough of the nonsense! Elect the man, or further see the integrity of the voting process plus the appeal of the HOF diminished.

ScottBravesFan

November 16th, 2011
4:34 pm

You know who is another former Brave great that gets screwed in the hall of fame voting? Fred McGriff. The guy had a great year and has some gawdy numbers. I hate that the fact if he played one more year he could have hit 7 more homeruns to finish with 500 and he would probably have gotten in.

roge

November 16th, 2011
4:35 pm

Curve ball strickout king. He was good but not that good.

TennBravesFan

November 16th, 2011
4:38 pm

I was listening to one of the shows on XM’s MLB station about a year ago and the announcer (who I believe was Jim Duquette) described a Hall of Famer as someone who “dominates his era”. Murphy’s “era” would be considered the 80’s. During the 1980’s, Murphy was 1st in all of baseball in total bases, 2nd in MLB in homeruns (to Schmidt), 2nd in RBI’s (E. Murray), and had the 5th most hits. Not to mention 7 All-Star selections, 5 Gold Gloves, and 2 MVP’s. Thats a pretty impressive decade, a dominate era, and a Hall of Fame Career!!

Brian from Villa Rica

November 16th, 2011
4:44 pm

Awesome post Ken Stallings. Maybe the veterans commitee will have a clue.

P. Bull Terrier

November 16th, 2011
4:49 pm

@ MARK 1:00 pm – “Folks sorry ,he is not a hallof famer, .265? with 398hrs. hall of fame should be .300+ avg and 450hrs,only halll player i’ve seen that ain’t a pitcher for the Braves in the last 30 yrs. is Chipper”

Do you have any idea how many players would be in your Hall of Fame if the criteria for eligibility was a .300+ average and more than 450 home runs? There are only 12 players who have a batting average of .300 or better and 450 or more Home Runs: Aaron, Ruth, Mays, A. Rodriquez, M. Ramirez, J. Foxx, F. Thomas, T. Williams, M. Ott, L. Gehrig, Musial, and Chipper. Of those 12 players, 4 of them are still playing or only recently retired so they wouldn’t even be eligible for the HOF yet. That leaves only 8 players eligible for your .300+ BA / 450+ HR Hall of Fame. That sounds more like a Closet of Fame to me.

Considering the players who have hit for a .300 or better average and 450 or more home runs brings up an interesting point regarding Dale Murphy’s chances at the HOF. In more than 100 years of baseball before the 1990’s, only 8 players were able to top the .300/450 mark. In the 21 years since 1990, 4 players hit .300/450 and 3 of those players were still playing and adding on to those stats last season. Obviously something changed since 1990 that made it easier to achieve amazing stats like .300/450. Steroids, expansion, smaller parks, etc., the explanation doesn’t really matter. The fact is that baseball became a different game after the early 1990’s than it was over the previous 100+years. Dale Murphy’s career was nearly over by 1991, so judging him based on what players have done since the early ‘90s doesn’t do justice to his career.

When Murphy retired in 1993, most people figured he was a pretty good bet to make it into the Hall. It’s hard to believe that the offensive explosion of the steroids era immediately following Murphy’s retirement has clouded the view of his accomplishments so much that not even 13% if voters consider him worthy of the HOF now. What short memories we have.

59bulldawg

November 16th, 2011
4:52 pm

Totally agree. Webster should put his name and pic under the phrase “class act.” I hope JS is successful in changing minds

phil

November 16th, 2011
4:56 pm

TennBravesFan

November 16th, 2011
4:38 pm
I was listening to one of the shows on XM’s MLB station about a year ago and the announcer (who I believe was Jim Duquette) described a Hall of Famer as someone who “dominates his era”. Murphy’s “era” would be considered the 80’s. During the 1980’s, Murphy was 1st in all of baseball in total bases, 2nd in MLB in homeruns (to Schmidt), 2nd in RBI’s (E. Murray), and had the 5th most hits. Not to mention 7 All-Star selections, 5 Gold Gloves, and 2 MVP’s. Thats a pretty impressive decade, a dominate era, and a Hall of Fame Career!!
********************
Why didn’t we get YOU to write the letter? The way you put it, he definitely belongs in there!

Unfortunately, the way I read DOB’s piece, he looks way too average to go in, which is why he hasn’t come close.

I’m not knocking DOB at all. I’m just saying that dominating the 1980’s is the right way to approach this issue.

Not that it will matter, as he’ll never be elected. I’m already on record here repeatedly saying that the damn writers aren’t going to vote Chipper in either, no matter what he does. Maybe in year 3 or 4, but not before then. The national media ALWAYS references Chipper with a “Do you think he belongs in the HOF?” Bugs me to no end. Why ask? Of course he does, but the question just proves my point, I think.

phil

November 16th, 2011
4:57 pm

NickGranite

November 16th, 2011
4:58 pm

The HOF pretty much divides the entrants by position and unfortunately for Murph, his outfield numbers just don’t hold up.

onthego

November 16th, 2011
4:59 pm

I always felt Dale Murphy’s strongest comparative competition during what was a very strong pitching era was Andre Dawson. I’ve never understood how little support Murph has received…and Dawson gets in?!

Hal Smith (Calhoun)

November 16th, 2011
4:59 pm

In 1984 I attended a Braves game. During BP Dale was running laps around the field before the game. I had his ‘82 & ‘83 Topps Baseball Cards (MVP years) in my hand asking him to autograph them. As he came my way he held up 3 fingers and said “3 more laps” and I’ll sign them. Sure enough, he completed his running and came over there and signed them. I still have those ball cards to this day. Dale Murphy may not have HOF numbers, but one thing for certain is probably NO ONE can say nothing bad about him. He was certainly a model ball player that every kid in the south aspired to be on the fields and pastures where we played. I hope he makes it!

joekill

November 16th, 2011
5:15 pm

How is murph not in the hall he needs to get in he is on the mount rushmore of the atlanta braves

savannahdawg

November 16th, 2011
5:20 pm

He still won’t make it because most sports writers just don’t have a clue! Most have never played ball which is why they are writers. Murphy is not the only one being left out the establishment. And he won’t be the last.

Writers should not be allowed to vote for HOF’s, or polls, or anything else sport because they don’t get it!

Kevin W

November 16th, 2011
5:26 pm

Ahhh, Nick B… I’ve got to use your Sandberg argument against you. If you allow that logic to argue for Sandberg, then you should know that when Murphy retired he was ranked #27 ALL-TIME in Home Runs (not just among the best at one position). To put that in perspective for how much the steroid era inflated and devalued Dale Murphy’s 398 Home Run numbers… the players ranked from 26-28 on the all-time list today are Lou Gehrig, Fred McGriff, Stan Musial, and Willie Stargell.

Make sure you get this… I’m not saying Gehrig, McGriff, Musial, and Stargell’s numbers are not taken seriously. What I’m saying is that the current position of these 4 guys (#27) on the all-time Home Run list is where Murphy was at when he retired. If you are impressed by the position of these guys on the list, well, that’s where Murphy was at when he hung it up.

And then everyone quickly forgot how great Murphy was when the 90s came along and the inflated home run numbers put Murphy in the shadows quickly.

drbasic

November 16th, 2011
5:27 pm

yes i too remember the time Glavine had to retaliate and yep the batter up was Murphy. He almost underhanded a soft lolipop pitch behind Murph. Even Murph Grinned when it happened and you could see Glavine laughing…..a classic moment that was. Murphy is definately hall of fame, he loved the game and his Character is not seen anymore by any pro sports player.

MountainDawg

November 16th, 2011
5:32 pm

Ol’ Dale definitely belongs in Coopertown.

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