1:13 pm October 3, 2011, by Carroll Rogers
October 4th, 20112:36 pm
So many things went so terribly wrong in September it’s hard to sort through the ashes and see what if anything is salvagable. When your team leaders are a 39-year old third baseman, a catcher with failing eyesight and a bad back, and a Rule 5 reclamation project turned millionaire, well, you should expect to have some issues. One thing is clear: the Braves need to stay committed to the youth-movement, and in doing so they should expect to take some lumps.
Players who don’t fit in the future and ideally would not be here next year: All the Boras clients (would like to keep Bourn but see no way that will happen). AGon(e). Chipper. And, I’m really afraid Uggla is the next KK/Lowe contract albatross (listen to the baseball chatter this winter – you won’t hear anyone except a Braves employee talk about Uggla as one of the top MLB or NL second basemen).
Keep in mind, until they prove otherwise the Braves are now the WORST team in the Division. Wren has wasted three years of playoff-caliber pitching largely because he could not find a legitimate Major League left fielder, and I suspect the window of opportunity is now closed until the next wave of starters grows up and the current crop of free-swinging position players moves on.
October 4th, 20112:38 pm
For all those criticizing Wren for the Chipper and Lowe contracts, consider the dilemma for Cashman. CC is getting 23 million/year and about to opt out for more. With a physique that makes Mac look like he just did a Weight Watchers ad, the Yankees have the choice of letting go the only guy in their rotation that can be called an ace (Novoa has to do it for a longer time before he gets that designation) or pay two guys on the other side of the career hill 25-31 million dollars a year until after the Rio Olympics. He also has “the core” Jeter, Posada, and Rivera in the same boat as Chipper but more money owed to Jeter.
October 4th, 20112:54 pm
I am one of those “idiots” that an earlier blogger mentioned who is calling for the Braves to trade McCann.
It is not that McCann is not a good player — he is, But he has more value now than he will have later, he has weight issues, is a mediocre defender, might have eyesight issues, and can bring in some good young talent. I would rather see the best hitter on the team be an OF or 3B/1B that can play 155 games a year rather than a catcher who plays 120 and tires at the end of the season.
Pradois another “nice” player who now does not have a role on this team and is in the last years of arbitration where his contract is going to become too expensive. . He should also be moved this off season. I agree with the first post at the top of this page, that Uggla is not the straw that should be stirring this drink, and would love to see him moved if possible to rid the team of a big contract in the future. Heyward had a bad year at 22, but the chorous on here that wants to dump him or bench him for Constanza are showing either their frustration or their short-sightedness. He will be an important contributor for this team in the future. Maybe now with the expectations lowered and not having to be the next McGriff/McCovey, and with time to recover from his shoulder injury and regain his stroke, he will approach the player he was projected to be.
October 4th, 20112:55 pm
sick and tired of all the Chipper haters, he may not be the best clubhouse leader in baseball but I guarantee you everything he says is calculated, not redneck snap responses as some other idiots on here would have you believe. he is a hall of famer and as such deserves a little more respect than he’s getting, especially when considering that he MAY have been our most consistent hitter once again this year. He has certainly lost a step or two, but still plays solid defense and most days is a very tough out and rbi guy. he didn’t come through for us on a regular enough basis in late september just now, but that was symptomatic of what was going on with the TEAM, not him.
why are we even worrying about Chipper’s role on the team next year anyway? There are FAR more glaring areas for concern than how much time Chipper plays!
October 4th, 20112:57 pm
completely forgot to mention how sad it was that Chipper had to handle as much as he did this past year because about 75 per cent of that SHOULD have been handled by our sorry A S S manager!
Laughing Jack (OUT LOUD)
October 4th, 20112:58 pm
AJC writers and bloggers holding Frank Wren accountable??? Bloggers holding players accountable??? Is that what you guys are doing???? YOU MAKE ME LAUGH OUT LOUD!
At best, we offer only our opinions. For the most part they are stupid, ignorant opinions….LOL!
As fans, we don’t even speak for nor represent all the fans, just ourselves. LOL “holding them accountable.” WOW!
October 4th, 20113:10 pm
October 4th, 20113:15 pm
Agree about the Chipper bashers….
You boneheads that rail on him are possibly dumber than FG was in continuing to pitch Lowe every 5 days…
If we didn’t have Chipper, we would have been finished two weeks earlier than we were.
you bonehead Chipper bashers are right up there in the Schaefer intelligence department too…in other words, not much.
October 4th, 20113:16 pm
October 4th, 20113:37 pm
LOL, the Constanza junky’s are amusing… He can’t hit… He got figured out and was hitting like a career AAA player. Heyward began to hit and was hitting with an OPS of .837 over the last 2 weeks of the season, so why play Constanza?
After the initial 14 games where Constanza was hitting .,400+ with good OPS the following 28 games he played (including 14 more starts) he hit .211 with a .211 OBP and a .285 SLG for a mammoth .496 OPS. He was pretty much terrible after that first couple of weeks.
October 4th, 20113:38 pm
I don’t really understand why so many keep bringing up those comments he made about Heyward not playing hurt. All Chipper said was somebody needed to point out to him that Jason Heyward is a better athlete at 80 per cent than most guys are at 100 per cent. How is that a bad comment given the circumstances? If you’ll look at Chippers career numbers, you’ll find that the guy played NINE years in Atlanta hardly missing a day before his injury woes started. I think he can get away with telling somebody MUCH YOUNGER than him to play hurt even if he misses time these days with injuries. If you read between the lines there, Chipper is saying that at 22 a guy plays ball with a “sore” shoulder. The same might not be said about somebody who’s about to turn 40, but anybody critical enough to make that distinction isn’t a realistic sports fan, period.
October 4th, 20113:46 pm
Oh and to the person who suggested we trade McCann…. let us discuss something called player value.
McCann has loads of value because he’s a catcher that can hit. regardless of whether or not he’s the teams best hitter is unimportant. If we trade him, whomever we get in there is going to likely hit for #$%^ resulting in more losses. It’s easier to find a LF’er who can hit .260 with 25 HR’s and a.800 OPS than it is to find a catcher that can do (or exceed) that. So regardless of potential trade value. To trade a catcher with power for either an outfielder with power (or the parts to acquire one) would be a horrible waste of resources.
IMO, they should move Prado back to the super utility role and trade one of our arms for an under control mashing LF’er with good OBP skills. Prado would still probably play in 100 games as he can spell every position. It would also mean that our bench would go back to being a strength again .
Unless Pastornicky is ready, i think we should all get comfortable with the idea that Jack Wilson or Gonzo is gonna start at SS. The other options are too pricey (and overvalued IMO due to persistent injury probs). I actually like Wilson a bit more due to his better contact skills and equally fine defense….
October 4th, 20113:49 pm
Fredi Gonazlez is not a leader, otherwise we would not have seen Chipper take it upon himself to host a come to Jesus meeting in the dugout before the final game of the epic slide.
October 4th, 20113:50 pm
agreed about Wilson over Gonzalez. Prado should start every day at 2B and Uggla should play LF as long as we’re stuck with him, Prado has a better year playing 2B every day, I’d wager a large sum of money on it…
October 4th, 20113:54 pm
The braves need help. we can’t keep sending Lowe to the mound. his record
indicates his ineptitude. The big mystery is heyward(?). based on his major
league performance to date,, he is a bust. I don’t know what to do about him except
hope for the best. we could use a .300 hitter, and the pitching staff has to come
back healthy in the spring. all things considered, this is not a very exciting team-
in fact it is one of the least interesting brave’s teams in years. I’ve been following
baseball sinde 1946, this braves team is right up there with respect to uninteresting.
October 4th, 20114:01 pm
Jordan Schaffer busted for pot in Florida. He is done in baseball.
unfortunately I have to agree with Mr. Marlowe, unless quite a bit is changed by next season, I just don’t see a lot to pull for and get behind with this team of Braves, had trouble with that all year and really question how much time I’ll give them next year…
October 4th, 20114:10 pm
Some of you remind me of the morons on the Audi ads.
October 4th, 20114:13 pm
Wren and FG (sorry to say, he will be back) ought to rethink what to do with Prado. He is serviceable as a backup in many positions and for Chipper, as an everyday player, not so much. W and FG should seek one or two OFers with pop and good situational hitters, like Pence has proven for Phils. Dump Lowe and seek another veteran pitcher, rely on bullpen. Or, dump Lowe and rely on starter from youth squad. As long as Lowe is gone. Figure out a better way to use Ross or trade him. And release, trade, or just say byebye to bench-Conrad, Hinske, Wilson, all were terrible all year. Oh, and upgrade at SS, please. I cannot bear to watch Alex “hit” another season.
October 4th, 20114:33 pm
bobby cerasuolo— How can you trade someone that’s not with the Braves. The Braves released Matt Young.
October 4th, 20114:34 pm
..don’t waste your energy rooting against the phillies today. cards going down in game 3. phillies in 4
October 4th, 20116:12 pm
nashevillewill: all that would be great if it were possible to just throw Yankees money out on the market, but right now with our current ownership, our salary cap sits at the mid-range for clubs these days, so the ability to just go out and get somebody isn’t like it was with Ted Turner. IF we manage to dump Lowe this off-season, we’ll still be responsible for a TON of his salary. Basically everybody that will be gone this off-season (and that’s an assumption about some) won’t take enough money off the payroll to pay for an established power-hitting outfielder, which means a trade, which means pitching talent diminished, which means Frank Wren probably won’t do it. Several people have suggested trading JJ, but who would want him for anything of value to us at the moment? He’s an injury liability right now to us and everybody else. Try to keep it real man.
October 4th, 20116:19 pm
You Silly fans count for most of the morons.
October 4th, 20116:27 pm
sticks and stones dude, sticks and stones
October 4th, 20116:41 pm
I have been a Braves fan since 1953. I lived in the Filthadelphia area most of my life. Most of the town is dirty and smells bad. The same can be said for many of the sports fans. Yor Beagles are looking good though.
October 4th, 20116:43 pm
oh you’re referring to the Philly fan, I gotcha, my bad
j l roberts
October 4th, 20117:17 pm
get rid of the likes of lowe,and a good hitting coach, worst september in the life of the braves, a lot of people on the team needs to go including jones hes washed up, bench warmer at best and sign up a real 3d baseman soon, and a good outfielder as well and a new bench, get rid of any on over 34 years of age and start hitting and pitching the way you need to.. maybe wren should go also as he didnt help get a long term solution for 3d base out field area jl roberts
October 4th, 20117:32 pm
October 4th, 20117:40 pm
…good game so far
HE visto muchos d ustedes pero consideren una alternativa los rangers estan en busca d un veterano posibilidad traspaso d lowe y linebranic los rengers tambien estuvieron con la presion d mickeal young quier traspaso puede jugar SS por este a|~o y si chiper c ba pasaria a 3b.en ese cambio m qedaria con prado en la banca y alex.le daria esto una temporada d preparasion a pastornicki
October 4th, 20117:49 pm
otra posibilidad d cambio los witesox anunsiaron posibilidad d cambio jj x carlos queitin atlanta le hase falta otro lansador lf por la problematica d los filis en los juegos interligas jason vargas seria un arma mortal los domina
October 4th, 20117:54 pm
October 4th, 20117:55 pm
otro punto buscar en el mundo del beisball seria mente un entrenador d bateo donbailor lo han mensionado pero parese estar arizona y el estubo en atlanta y lo dejaron ir en la era de andres galarraga VEREMOS a VER si wren aprendio a buscar locorecto
October 4th, 20118:02 pm
.. los double play!
October 4th, 20118:03 pm
jl roberts: this is becoming redundant, but we don’t live in magicland where we can just go buy any player we want man, we have to ride out some big, terrible contracts ,and then, and only then, will we have payroll space for your “wish list”!
October 4th, 20118:06 pm
si wren es listo pudiera tener 2012 esta alineasion bourn,maickelyoung ,chiper ,uggla freman queitin macanan jh.
October 4th, 20118:12 pm
la rotasion 2012 hudson minor beschi jason vargas randal delgado y el bullpen tejeran medlen venters flanery kimbrel viscaino y varvarro
October 4th, 20118:19 pm
jgadores 2012 en la banca alex ,prado constansa hinscki dias conrad
October 4th, 20118:23 pm
a tdos los fans pedirle a wrenCLUS para diciembre y les digo el 2012 sera WOLRD CHAMPION
October 4th, 20118:27 pm
..phillies win! great game
October 4th, 20119:27 pm
sign Bourn! as a side note, Chipper was way better than I expected this year. #10 is still a large part of our team.
October 4th, 20119:29 pm
Phillies fans have no life, why would you post here after our season has ended? it’s desperate for no good reason. GO AWAY!
October 4th, 20119:35 pm
Ugh, a 3rd baseman hauling in 10+ million who can’t play everyday, and the Braves have to watch him like a baby so he doesn’t get hurt. Thanks Chipper for eating up the payroll. The Braves basically have to plan platoons for LF and 3rd until he retires. And yes, before the flaming starts, I know CJ is a HOF, but honestly, his salary is limiting the Braves ability to make some decent moves. We all know it but the CJ homers want to dwell on the past and not the future.
Frank Shab PA
October 5th, 20118:04 am
CLUTCH HITTERS! That’s what the Braves need. You have to look long and hard after Septmeber to find any clutch hits delivered by Bravs hitters. When the pressure starts in September they choked big time.
Wren has to agree with that. But corporate wants the team to have a certain image and dog eat dog, hustle, get dirty, win at all costs style are not the Brave way.
Unless they change their mentality the Braves will always be Pretenders!
October 5th, 20119:32 am
oh philly has life. did you see that game?? of course it does. philly does smell bad. but not as bad as the 2011 braves…. sniff it b***ches!
October 5th, 20119:35 am
the eagles stink real bad. but how ’bout those fail-cons??
October 5th, 20119:37 am
you’re right phredd. although i did pick the braves to win it all before the season. i’ll go away…..
October 5th, 201111:19 am
Who would be a good fit for atlanta in the OF?
Seems not to many free agent options from the RH side.
Bobby Abreu LAA *
Carlos Beltran SF
Milton Bradley SEA
Mike Cameron BOS
Ronny Cedeno PIT
Ryan Church PIT
Jack Cust OAK
Matt Diaz ATL
J.D. Drew BOS
Jonny Gomes CIN
Gabe Gross OAK
Carlos Guillen DET
Corey Hart MIL
Jeremy Hermida BOS
Raul Ibanez PHI
Conor Jackson BOS
Ryan Ludwick STL
Gary Matthews Jr. NYM
Nate McLouth ATL *
Juan Pierre CWS
Juan Rivera LAD
Cody Ross FLA
Grady Sizemore CLE *
Nick Swisher NYY *
Josh Willingham OAK
Willingham has already been in the NL EAST and didnt do all that well
Swisher seems interesting but he is hiiting them out @ Yankee stadium so not much to talk about with Power until he does that in Atlanta
Ryan Ludwick, Corey Hart, Jonny Gomes seems to be some decent bats, Gomes tons of power but no average, hart very good/decent all around, Ludwick – average, nothing exciting.
List from: http://www.chickenfriedbaseball.com/p/mlb-free-agents-2011-2012.html
October 5th, 201111:35 am
Fredi gotta go, that is the only thing on my wish list.
william in pasadena
October 5th, 20113:35 pm
DOB, interesting comment about Wren sitting down with a few “selected” media writers. Why do you think they were selected? Could it be “soft” media writers? Why did Wren make excuses about other players not being the same after injuries, but he bags on Heyward not having a guaranteed position next year. Take Wren and Fredi’s performances this year and the past years, I wish we had an owner to tell them they son’t have guaranteed jobs next year. I keep hearing about the great Chipper. Great players perform and carry their teams on their backs, not spend all their time giving advice. Don’t tell the younger players, show them. Nobody cares what he did ten years ago. The Braves are not going to win anything until they get players who have passion. And it starts with management. Stop looking for All-American goodie goodie white boys and pick some winners. Question…how do you rednecks know Heyward was at bars til 5am unless you were there yourself? If we got rid of Wren, Fredi, Lowe, Chipper, Prado, and Gonzo, that would be bold moves we needed to make. The Braves lack fire. How many fights or knock-down pithes have you seen from this team? Every season is now ending with a loss. The last game, only Bourne and Hudson played with a sense of urgency. Even the “great” Chipper was just laid back waiting for something to happen instead of making something happen. Oh, I know. He “almost” had a game-winning hit. His $13 mil could help bring in a good right-handed hitter who has fire.
October 5th, 20116:59 pm
How cute. Soft little safe questions and soft answers. The reporting from AJC is like a middle school newspaper. Let the fans ask Wren what we really all want to know.
October 5th, 20117:00 pm
Forgot…. Hire Francona and fire fat Fredi.
October 5th, 20118:09 pm
DOB, interesting comment about Wren sitting down with a few “selected” media writers. Why do you think they were selected? Could it be “soft” media writers? — william in pasadena
Actually, it was the beat writers who cover the team on a daily basis. Or “soft” media members, if you prefer.
Sorry, didn’t get to the rest of your long rant. Figured it was along the same lines as the first three sentences.
October 5th, 201110:32 pm
I like Julio Franco as hitting coach.
Why play a player who is hurt and won’t preformed his best, and is made to play in an important game, this doesn’t make a bit of sense, more like stupid.
Whether it’s the GM or the Managers decision, shows they don’t care about winning.
During the season, Chipper, McCann, Heyward, Prado, the cast from general hospital, all played hurt doesn’t this club have a back up plan, that’s better than what they put on the field..
Do Baseball Announcers have to talk so much, and make so may excuses for the players or tell me what they’re thinking, when they have no idea.
Ross, is a better catcher than McCann will ever be, and should have play more.
Braves need to get rid the dead weight, and get players that aren’t made out of s—.
I think the Atlanta fans, and all of Braves fans all over, back the Braves this season– 100%.
What did the Braves do?
*surrounded before it was over,
*blow the games that they need,
*played, afraid of the other teams,
*played like defeatist, lazy and ineffectual
That my feel for the 2011 Atlanta, Braves maybe they can improve in 2012 and then, we’ll can also seen the first visitors from Mars in 2012.
October 6th, 201112:47 pm
October 6th, 20115:25 pm
I hope sophomore slumps don’t apply to managers. This guy can’t afford to get any worse.
October 7th, 20118:32 am
that what wrong with the braves and there fans now always want to blame the BLACK man for there down fall. i said it
October 10th, 20116:02 pm
Dub366 will you tell us more. I really think you are onto something.
October 10th, 20116:08 pm
William in pasadena I think you are closer to the real problem ma brother. You articulate it so well. You go right to the problem and nailed it.
February 19th, 201212:17 pm
Our Government is operating so far outside of its design parameters that this type of discussion becomes futile. In my opinion the place to start is eliminating income tax which would force massive reductions in power and programs, bringing the govt. more in line with the founders structure. Only then can a discussion vis-a-vis federal and state govts. become worthwhile.
February 19th, 20123:03 pm
Our Government is operating so far outside of its design parameters that this type of discussion becomes futile. In my opinion the place to start is reducing tax which would force massive reductions in power and programs, bringing the govt. more in line with the founders structure. Only then can a discussion vis-a-vis federal and state govts. become worthwhile.
Billigflug Berlin Frankfurt-hahn
March 27th, 201211:34 am
Division Male,soldier recognition team award either game largely century account look shut village count college notion blue comparison tonight value pocket sound ensure unfortunately treaty deputy copy them problem maybe benefit strike very again article speed conclusion representative victim thought oil end civil up document prefer next my matter fresh modern evening step contribution pupil plate current average best contact labour reality forward murder strike language blue bring single representation head servant exist whether system scheme across go represent domestic style where link total health shoulder address help impose request me past weather
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