Snotboogie – McCann certainly in the catbird seat. Especially with the youngster on the Giants future in question now with a serious leg injury. The Yanks would love to sign McCann and his lefthanded power bat. They’d trade that catcher in the minors for another chip and go with the sure thing. They gave Burnett $82 mil, I’m sure 6 years at $90 mil for BMac wouldn’t scare them.
It’s a given that the Braves will make every effort to sign Bourn to a long term contract. However, I’m not sure if Atlanta has the financial resources to keep him around beyond 2012. But I certainly hope Bourn takes into consideration the great young team he is already playing for before looking elsewhere.
phil, where is the evidence or any reason to believe whatsoever that McCann has never been in shape? His body type automatically means he’s not in shape? Are you a doctor or something?
If McCann has never been in shape, I’ll take out-of-shape guys at every position.
I saw the ESPN article on Chipper. But no, I would not have ranked him above Brooks Robinson. Simply because Brooks was a third baseman his whole career, and I put more stock in a players defensive ability than most Hall of Fame voters.
I don’t think Mac has any thought of playing anywhere but Atlanta, following Chipper’s lead on that. That takes the true economics out of the equation in that transaction. What remains to be seen in the extent of the hometown discount he gives the Braves, whether or not he doesi is out of the eqauation.
I know I’m gonna get killed for this, but I kinda wish we would trade Prado for prospects and spend that $$$ to go after a legit power hitting LF’er. Someone like Carlos Quentin. Prado’s real value is that he’s versatile. But that’s more of a value you want from your super utility guy not from a starting corner OF’er.
Here’s my offseason plan:
lose KK, Mclouth,Moylan,Linebrink, Lugo, save $17 mill
Trade Lowe and $7 mill for a bag of cheesy poofs to whomever we can save $7 mill
Trade Prado to an AL team that needs a 3b guy for some good positional prospects. save $5 mill
re-sign Gonzo for one year with an option for like $2mill
Sign Carlos Quentin for LF. 4 yr $39 mill
Sign Omar Infante as Super Utility man 2 yr $5.5 mill
Sign Ty Wigginton or similar as RH PH bat 1 yr $1.5 mill
sign some veteran RH pen arm for 1 yr $3 mill
Pay arbitration raises to eligible players $8-$10 mill
Payroll would be aprrox the same as this season give or take a couple mill.
Pen
Kimbrel
Venters
O’Flaherty
Vizcaino
Sherrill
Martinez
veteran RH guy
That team would score a good bit of runs as well as pitch it well. I have another alternative idea that involves trading JJ for a ton of prospects and using the $$ saved by moving he, Lowe and Prado to go after Kemp for LF…. but that’s another story! lol
A-Rod presents an interesting question when considering what position he should be rated at; SS or 3B.
As for the top 5, I ask myself a question: Who would you want on your team in his top 5 seasons? I gotta say it would be Schmidt hands down as the #1. From there, it’d be darn hard to choose between Mathews and Chipper. Brett comes 4th. I think I’d put Brooks above Boggs at that point. But how do you not put A-Rod at or near the top of that list if you are considering him a third sacker?
My bad, Shaun. McCann is in excellent physical condition. The extra 50 pounds he carries around on his body is a mirage. I apologize for pointing out something that no one else could have possibly noticed.
And I apologize for wanting him to have a long a healthy career, as opposed to a shortened and ultimately ruined one as being presently experienced by another legendary fatty, one Andruw Jones.
Chipper ranks 27th all-time in Runs Created while Brooks Robinson ranks 124th.
Chipper ranks 26th in Offensive WAR while Brooks Robinson ranks 238th.
Chipper ranks 41st in Times on Base. Brooks Robinson ranks 65th. Chipper has 1,730 fewer plate appearances, too.
Chipper ranks 42nd in Total Bases. Brooks Robinson ranks 57th. Again, Chipper has 1,730 fewer plate appearance.
This is Baseball Reference rankings, so I think it’s coming into this season and doesn’t include this season but I could be wrong. Still doesn’t change the argument much.
Robinson’s overall WAR ranks 89th to Chipper’s 51st rank.
If you think Brooks Robinson was better than Chipper you are overrating Brooks because he was a “old timer” or you are overrating defense or both.
IMO, Mac needs to stay a Brave. He needs to take over the Chipper role as the teams leader and veteran presence . He’s still so young, that I wouldn’t mind see him locked up through his age 35 years honestly! Is he going to stay at catcher? I think he will be there through age 33 at the least. (heck Piazza, who was a terrible catcher, stayed there full time til around 35 I think)
I’d offer him a long term deal that is in the fair market range but a few million a year less and then throw in a team option year that vests if he meets certain criteria that would kee phim a Brave through age 36 (if the option vests). Besides, if Freeman is still here we can cross that bridge when we come to it.
I watched the Brewers – Cubs game yesterday. Kinda scouting the probable first round foes. One thing that was stated, and the game confirmed, is that you’ve got to get to Greinke early in the count. He’s deadly when up by two strikes.
The Brewers almost gave the game up in the ninth.
If we get them in the first round, I like our chances.
(and yeah, I’m really thinking that the Braves need to move Prado and use his arby $$$ to get a real power hitting LF bat) I know everyone loves Prado, but come 2012 , his arby is gonna outpay his value.
NickB, was Piazza really a terrible catcher or was he just bad at throwing out baserunners trying to steal? I don’t know that Piazza was a great catcher but I think his defensive deficiencies are often overstated.
DS1, I think Uggla might eventually move to third and Prado might move to second, stay in left or move on. I can’t see Uggla staying at second through the length of his contract nor can I see him going to left, but stranger things have happened.
It would be hard to trade Prado. Not sure the Braves front office will agree to trade him. Why not consider making the trade for a LF, let Prado be a super utility guy until Chipper retires then let Prado play 3B?
I don’t think any of our minor league guys will be ready to fill in at 3B so soon.
Instead of spending the money on Infante, let Prado backup at 1B, 2B, 3B and LF, sign a defensive whiz to back up SS (or just use Brandon Hicks), then spend some coin on a RH foil to Hinske.
but come 2012 , his arby is gonna outpay his value.
Well, his value will be depressed by playing a corner, IF or OF, that’s true. But if he gets back to his career norms of .300/.350, he’s still going to have a lot of value, even with non-corner power numbers.
NickB, was Piazza really a terrible catcher or was he just bad at throwing out baserunners trying to steal? I don’t know that Piazza was a great catcher but I think his defensive deficiencies are often overstated. (Shaun)
Having watched Piazza for all those years I agree 100% with you on this. As a matter of fact he was better than Posada in my opinion but Posada skated here in NY because they were so loaded nobody ever really cared.
That said, two things happen when you have a catcher like Piazza. one, they wear out from catching every day and you can’t rely on their bat late in the season which the Mets needed to. Two, in the playoffs catching skills are magnified in the NL and even an average catcher can become an albatross. Just my opinion of course.
Anders – The Braves weren’t playing and I had to watch some baseball. See, that’s the kind of insightful information I bring to the blog.
Seriously, last week, there were some on here saying that “we don’t want the Brewers” with their home record and the streak they are now on. I’m not that worried about them. Of course they could beat us, but we won the season series and we are playing pretty good ball.
What does worry me is that it is a five game series.
V-Mart signed that deal when he was 32. Mac will be 3 years younger. Not sure you can give him the same money.
True, but part of that signing was with the acknowledgement that Victor would DH quite often. We don’t have that luxury with Mac, so I’d be hesitant to lock him up further out than his age 32 year old season.
JimBowdenESPNxm JIM BOWDEN
Jim Leyland just told us “I’m not an OBP guy, I’m a SLUG% guy, enough players will get on…I want the hitters that can drive them in” XM 89
@ flange 1 – well it’s because once you take Prado out of the starting lineup he loses trade value. It would be much better to use him as a chip to acquire some young players for the future and then use the $5+ mill he’s likely to recieie via arbitrartion to help fill the dang LF GAP WE’VE HAD FOREVER!!! lol I’m not really yelling, but honestly, name the last full time honest to goodness LF’er the Braves have had? Plus, Prado’s offensive production is good for an infielder, but not very good for a corner OF’er. He would be better off in a small AL ballpark playing 3b and hitting 2nd or 6th. The Braves would be better off by maximizing his value and using his potential salary for the specific thing they have lacked for a loooong time. I think it’s a win/ win
August 29th, 2011
4:02 pm
phil, what “extra 50 pounds”? What do you mean “extra”?
Again, where is the evidence or reason to believe McCann has never been in shape? Would love to see it, if you’ve got it.
***********************
Your condition, whatever it actually is, shows itself at moments such as this….
I don’t have access to McCann’s medical records.
I do, however, have eyes that function. They can identify a fatty fairly quickly.
Some fattys are in excellent shape for their sizes. Brian appears to be one of them, aside from the incredible sweating he does, as do most fattys and Derrick Lowe….Some fattys can run blazing fast 5ks and blow my thinner self out of the water. I’m always happy for them.
But it doesn’t mean it’s good for them to be so large.
Brava, …and they miss him getting to batted balls the he should catch (and some that he shouldn’t) more often than Prado. That explains it. They just keep track of every bad play while brushing aside any normal or plus plays. Geez, how do those people not think Alex Gonzalez is a bad defensive player? He’s second on the team in errors, so he’s doing something wrong, correct? Never mind range and the positive things.
I would like to be the first person to vote for Shaun on his new position of Agent for Jason Heyward. No one could be as dedicated to Jason as Shaun. Jason should be signed to a 6 year 150 million dollar contract before the playoffs.
i know the brewers have been playing well, but have you noticed the teams they have been beating up on? alot of wins against teams like pittsburgh, houston, and the cubs. thats a really weak division, and they are taking advantage.
Sell tickets and this is not a worry. You can pay players what you need to to be successful. Nobody on this board can whine about losing players if they actually go to the games. If all anyone does is watch TV and then expect the owners to bankroll more than they have, it won’t happen. There is no reason that more fans are not going to the games. Oh the traffic, it’s a school night, they’re just playing the Astros, the game starts at 7 and i work till 5, etc. If Bourn’s your man, McCann’s your man, then get out there and buy tickets. I do like Anders post about the wonderful scouting report by Jimmy…wow – what knowledge we gained…don’t fall behind a good pitcher.
Now you also have to consider the value of speed in todays game, Carl Crawford and Jose Reyes certainly have power, but what gets them the big bucks is their speed and defensive skills. — Tomas
If you think defensive skills get Crawford and Reyes their big bucks, sorry to tell you, but you’re wrong.
Way to go. One of you guys had to go and remind me that Glavine was once a Met. It is hard to even write that. I somehow had repressed the awful memory of Tommy going over to the other side. Now I am depressed.
At least during the All-star break, we get things like the home run derby….this…this is frustrating! I can’t even root against the Phillys because they haven’t been doing anything either.
I would like to be the first person to vote for Shaun on his new position of Agent for Jason Heyward. No one could be as dedicated to Jason as Shaun. Jason should be signed to a 6 year 150 million dollar contract before the playoffs.
Shaun comes off poorly here, but I’ll say it again, hope for Heyward to get out of this and reach his potential. Very bad if he doesn’t. Bad for this franchise like Hanson shoulder surgery would be bad. Heyward is extremely important and I personally enjoy rooting for this team more when young players that were drafted and develope3d contribute to the team winning. The Willie Harris, Jose Constanza, Jaret Wrights of the world don’t excite me as much. Sorry.
Shaun, I never said, I don’t see the good plays he makes, I was just pointing out why I think Prado is better at fielding his position. I don’t think Heyward is a bad defensive player, just average. He’s certainly not the gold glover some claim he is.
Murphwhat will you do if the unquestionable happens and the Braves let BMac walk at the end of his deal? And he goes to the Mets?…Will you be a Mets fan or will you be a Braves fan who roots for BMac on Mets? What about the first time he comes to Atlanta wearing that Mets road uni?
Well, after I regained conscientiousness, I think I would be a Braves fan who roots for BMac and BMac only on the Mets…that is if I “come around” while he’s still with them…
AndersThey still sting from dealing with Piazza as their big bat as a catcher.
Hey hey hey! Don’t be comparing BMac to that……guy!
But they have stupid money and treat it as such.
Excuse me? Nothing stupid about wanting BMac…
That said- I’d be proud to have McFann as a fellow fan. She’s one of my favorites on this blog.
OK, all is forgiven…You’re alright, man! (Seriously, thanks…but I don’t think I could ever come over to your side! )
Jason has better range and a better arm than Prado. He still needs to work on his routes. He looked absolutely great in the minors.
I do not want someone his size diving after balls most of the time.
I think Leyland still wears cleats at the ballpark, so my guess is that he give a person suggesting “optimal” use of a bullpen his most sympathetic look of pity. Or incredulity. Or scorn. Or maybe the one that says, “You see what kind of bull-bleep I have to put up with in this bleepin’ office?”.
I don’t think Prado is the future of 3b for us though. Plus, if his production drops again next year he won’t have much value at all…. (yet he would still probably get a raise to around $7 mill in arbitration)
He’s had 3 straight years of declining OPS … that’s troubling. HOWEVER, don’t get me wrong. If they decide to keep him and he plays 3b until he’s a FA or wtvr, it’s not the end of the world. I’m just saying, If I were GM, I’d think about maximizing his value. As well as maximizing the potential production from LF.
Efrim, didn’t mean to mislead you about Heyward. I am a big fan also, just can’t compete with Shaun. I am a big fan of the Braves team and understand that each person plays an important role. You will never hear me bash a major league player. It takes so much to just get there whether it be raw talent or someone busting his butt everyday to work harder than the next.
No doubt the Braves should resign Bourn as he is the best leadoff hitter we have had in a long time plus he is a good defensive player and a great base stealer, he fits in with our clubhouse, 5 years at 50 million is about right , with all the good young pitchers we have it is time for the Braves to put a team on the field that can score some runs and win some championships, we need Liberty to sell to an owner that can at least spend 100 million a year in order to keep and also add good players, hard to do this with an 80 million dollar payroll.
southern hope – You can root aginst the Phils tonight – ESPN 7:10.
NickB – I was being very sarcastic. Even I am not that stupid. I thought the “38 teams” would give it away. Someone on here used to talk about how Ross could be a starter for a wad of teams. I like Ross very much. He is the premier backup in the league.
I think it’s about the best and most reasonable thing I’ve read about the whole Heyward situation.
I’ll sum it up for you: Heyward is having a brutal season. But he’s not as bad as many think because those people are over-reliant on batting average and are rating him not on what he’s done but on comparing what he’s done to hype and expectations. If you wade through all of the hype and expectation and you go beyond batting average, to more telling metrics, he’s valuable even to a playoff team.
I would be just as belligerent if the Braves had decided to bench Uggla several games in a row quite frequently after a few months of poor play or if they were benching Prado for several games in a row. I honestly would. Has very little to do with the fact that it’s Heyward. It has everything to do with the Braves often not putting their best players on the field.
Yeah but I’m not talking he went from .850 to .830 he’s gone from .822 to .809 to .722. now, his bABIP is down from his norm of around .330 (down to .275) so he may just be having an unlucky season. But for a guy who relies on hits to get on base (he’s never had much plate discipline) his big drop could be a sign that he’s too agressive..
Anders, you have no idea the pain that Heyward’s struggles have caused. Not so much his actual struggles. Just a lot of unnecessary back and forth about the topic on this blog.
you have no idea the pain that Heyward’s struggles have caused. Not so much his actual struggles. Just a lot of unnecessary back and forth about the topic on this blog.
So much so that political blogs have banned the discussion of Jason Heyward on them.
The issue with Brian is his arm. It never was great and is getting worse. So where does FG put him? He is a great stick, so he’s a keeper, but long term FG needs to find a new position for him……… and let Ross, who has a great arm (and is overall better defensively), be the #1 catcher. It is a real dilemma for the Braves. I wonder if Freeman can play third?
1,264 comments Add your comment
Anders
August 29th, 2011
3:45 pm
Snotboogie – McCann certainly in the catbird seat. Especially with the youngster on the Giants future in question now with a serious leg injury. The Yanks would love to sign McCann and his lefthanded power bat. They’d trade that catcher in the minors for another chip and go with the sure thing. They gave Burnett $82 mil, I’m sure 6 years at $90 mil for BMac wouldn’t scare them.
noliee
August 29th, 2011
3:45 pm
in OPS Chipper is second to Arod. Brooksie is 64th.
Coach (2011 Fredi G. a go!)
August 29th, 2011
3:46 pm
It’s a given that the Braves will make every effort to sign Bourn to a long term contract. However, I’m not sure if Atlanta has the financial resources to keep him around beyond 2012. But I certainly hope Bourn takes into consideration the great young team he is already playing for before looking elsewhere.
MFin04
August 29th, 2011
3:48 pm
Sorry for asking again…can someone post the Heyman article on here? I can’t access the link…
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
3:48 pm
phil, where is the evidence or any reason to believe whatsoever that McCann has never been in shape? His body type automatically means he’s not in shape? Are you a doctor or something?
If McCann has never been in shape, I’ll take out-of-shape guys at every position.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
3:50 pm
Eh, I’ll believe it when I see it re: McCann leaving. They’ll work something out that’s reasonable. Hopefully it isn’t 4 years and 60 million…..
Coach (2011 Fredi G. a go!)
August 29th, 2011
3:50 pm
I saw the ESPN article on Chipper. But no, I would not have ranked him above Brooks Robinson. Simply because Brooks was a third baseman his whole career, and I put more stock in a players defensive ability than most Hall of Fame voters.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
3:50 pm
in OPS Chipper is second to Arod. Brooksie is 64th. (noliee)
Is this slang for operations? {:
T for Texas
August 29th, 2011
3:51 pm
I don’t think Mac has any thought of playing anywhere but Atlanta, following Chipper’s lead on that. That takes the true economics out of the equation in that transaction. What remains to be seen in the extent of the hometown discount he gives the Braves, whether or not he doesi is out of the eqauation.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
3:52 pm
Efrim- Maybe, maybe not. Who’s his agent?
NickB
August 29th, 2011
3:53 pm
I know I’m gonna get killed for this, but I kinda wish we would trade Prado for prospects and spend that $$$ to go after a legit power hitting LF’er. Someone like Carlos Quentin. Prado’s real value is that he’s versatile. But that’s more of a value you want from your super utility guy not from a starting corner OF’er.
Here’s my offseason plan:
lose KK, Mclouth,Moylan,Linebrink, Lugo, save $17 mill
Trade Lowe and $7 mill for a bag of cheesy poofs to whomever we can save $7 mill
Trade Prado to an AL team that needs a 3b guy for some good positional prospects. save $5 mill
re-sign Gonzo for one year with an option for like $2mill
Sign Carlos Quentin for LF. 4 yr $39 mill
Sign Omar Infante as Super Utility man 2 yr $5.5 mill
Sign Ty Wigginton or similar as RH PH bat 1 yr $1.5 mill
sign some veteran RH pen arm for 1 yr $3 mill
Pay arbitration raises to eligible players $8-$10 mill
Payroll would be aprrox the same as this season give or take a couple mill.
Lineup
Bourn
Freeman
McCann
Uggla
Chipper
Quentin
Heyward
Gonzo
rotation
JJ
Hudson
Hanson
Beachy
Minor
Bench
Hinske
Infante
Constanza
Wigginton
Ross
Pen
Kimbrel
Venters
O’Flaherty
Vizcaino
Sherrill
Martinez
veteran RH guy
That team would score a good bit of runs as well as pitch it well. I have another alternative idea that involves trading JJ for a ton of prospects and using the $$ saved by moving he, Lowe and Prado to go after Kemp for LF…. but that’s another story! lol
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
3:56 pm
Anders – “Lickier than many.”
Some typos make you smile more than others.
Snotboogie
August 29th, 2011
3:56 pm
Efrim
V-Mart signed that deal when he was 32. Mac will be 3 years younger. Not sure you can give him the same money.
CB
August 29th, 2011
3:57 pm
I see SB and Soph are discussing Avila. I caught that smile,Soph.
DS1
August 29th, 2011
3:58 pm
A-Rod presents an interesting question when considering what position he should be rated at; SS or 3B.
As for the top 5, I ask myself a question: Who would you want on your team in his top 5 seasons? I gotta say it would be Schmidt hands down as the #1. From there, it’d be darn hard to choose between Mathews and Chipper. Brett comes 4th. I think I’d put Brooks above Boggs at that point. But how do you not put A-Rod at or near the top of that list if you are considering him a third sacker?
phil
August 29th, 2011
3:59 pm
My bad, Shaun. McCann is in excellent physical condition. The extra 50 pounds he carries around on his body is a mirage. I apologize for pointing out something that no one else could have possibly noticed.
And I apologize for wanting him to have a long a healthy career, as opposed to a shortened and ultimately ruined one as being presently experienced by another legendary fatty, one Andruw Jones.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
NickB was winning hearts and minds, and then goes all roster-post on me. I’m shattered, I tell you, shattered.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
Coach,
Chipper ranks 27th all-time in Runs Created while Brooks Robinson ranks 124th.
Chipper ranks 26th in Offensive WAR while Brooks Robinson ranks 238th.
Chipper ranks 41st in Times on Base. Brooks Robinson ranks 65th. Chipper has 1,730 fewer plate appearances, too.
Chipper ranks 42nd in Total Bases. Brooks Robinson ranks 57th. Again, Chipper has 1,730 fewer plate appearance.
This is Baseball Reference rankings, so I think it’s coming into this season and doesn’t include this season but I could be wrong. Still doesn’t change the argument much.
Robinson’s overall WAR ranks 89th to Chipper’s 51st rank.
If you think Brooks Robinson was better than Chipper you are overrating Brooks because he was a “old timer” or you are overrating defense or both.
T for Texas
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
how do you not put A-Rod at or near the top of that list if you are considering him a third sacker?
PEDs.
timthebrave
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
I think they will just roll chipper’s money over to Mac. Something alons the lines of 5 years 70 million
DS1
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
NickB
I think you have to consider Prado your third baseman of the future, until someone better comes along.
NickB
August 29th, 2011
4:00 pm
IMO, Mac needs to stay a Brave. He needs to take over the Chipper role as the teams leader and veteran presence . He’s still so young, that I wouldn’t mind see him locked up through his age 35 years honestly! Is he going to stay at catcher? I think he will be there through age 33 at the least. (heck Piazza, who was a terrible catcher, stayed there full time til around 35 I think)
I’d offer him a long term deal that is in the fair market range but a few million a year less and then throw in a team option year that vests if he meets certain criteria that would kee phim a Brave through age 36 (if the option vests). Besides, if Freeman is still here we can cross that bridge when we come to it.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:01 pm
extra 50 pounds he carries around on his body is a mirage.
He’s just big-boned, phil.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:02 pm
Jimmy- You’re assuming it WAS a typo. {:
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:02 pm
phil, what “extra 50 pounds”? What do you mean “extra”?
Again, where is the evidence or reason to believe McCann has never been in shape? Would love to see it, if you’ve got it.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:02 pm
I watched the Brewers – Cubs game yesterday. Kinda scouting the probable first round foes. One thing that was stated, and the game confirmed, is that you’ve got to get to Greinke early in the count. He’s deadly when up by two strikes.
The Brewers almost gave the game up in the ninth.
If we get them in the first round, I like our chances.
Sopheee
August 29th, 2011
4:03 pm
Trade Prado to an AL team that needs a 3b guy for some good positional prospects. save $5 mill
…
Just break my heart, why don’t you?
Sopheee
August 29th, 2011
4:04 pm
CB, doesn’t it make you feel better that you’re in good company though? Besides you’re kicking my behind.
I am ahead of the petrel right now though.
NickB
August 29th, 2011
4:04 pm
@ nscoots….. sorry man, I love to rosterbate
(and yeah, I’m really thinking that the Braves need to move Prado and use his arby $$$ to get a real power hitting LF bat) I know everyone loves Prado, but come 2012 , his arby is gonna outpay his value.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:06 pm
NickB, was Piazza really a terrible catcher or was he just bad at throwing out baserunners trying to steal? I don’t know that Piazza was a great catcher but I think his defensive deficiencies are often overstated.
DS1, I think Uggla might eventually move to third and Prado might move to second, stay in left or move on. I can’t see Uggla staying at second through the length of his contract nor can I see him going to left, but stranger things have happened.
flange1
August 29th, 2011
4:06 pm
NickB,
It would be hard to trade Prado. Not sure the Braves front office will agree to trade him. Why not consider making the trade for a LF, let Prado be a super utility guy until Chipper retires then let Prado play 3B?
I don’t think any of our minor league guys will be ready to fill in at 3B so soon.
Instead of spending the money on Infante, let Prado backup at 1B, 2B, 3B and LF, sign a defensive whiz to back up SS (or just use Brandon Hicks), then spend some coin on a RH foil to Hinske.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:06 pm
Anders – “Jimmy- You’re assuming it WAS a typo.”
LOL. Smiling even more now!
Brava
August 29th, 2011
4:07 pm
…actually there is no evidence that suggest Prado is a better leftfielder than Heyward is a rightfielder.
Have to disagree. I know we’re not supposed to believe in what we see, Shaun, but my eyes tell me this is so.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:07 pm
Hey Jimmy- That’s a heck of a scouting report there at 4:02. Clear sailing to the WS now. What size ring do you wear?
CB
August 29th, 2011
4:08 pm
SB is definitely good company,I feel slightly less stupid. Petrel is somewhere plotting revenge,Soph.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:10 pm
but come 2012 , his arby is gonna outpay his value.
Well, his value will be depressed by playing a corner, IF or OF, that’s true. But if he gets back to his career norms of .300/.350, he’s still going to have a lot of value, even with non-corner power numbers.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:10 pm
Brava, apparently your eyes don’t see Heyward getting to batted balls that he should catch more often than Prado does.
noliee
August 29th, 2011
4:10 pm
Prado has a better arm MF04
like hell he does
flange1
August 29th, 2011
4:10 pm
BAS,
Just heard from Grinch, he spoke with Lew’s son and all is fine in Vermont! Lew is without power and phone but all are OK.
Brava
August 29th, 2011
4:12 pm
No, they see him stop and let a lot of balls drop that he could get to and shy away from balls bouncing off the wall in fear that they will hit him.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:12 pm
NickB, was Piazza really a terrible catcher or was he just bad at throwing out baserunners trying to steal? I don’t know that Piazza was a great catcher but I think his defensive deficiencies are often overstated. (Shaun)
Having watched Piazza for all those years I agree 100% with you on this. As a matter of fact he was better than Posada in my opinion but Posada skated here in NY because they were so loaded nobody ever really cared.
That said, two things happen when you have a catcher like Piazza. one, they wear out from catching every day and you can’t rely on their bat late in the season which the Mets needed to. Two, in the playoffs catching skills are magnified in the NL and even an average catcher can become an albatross. Just my opinion of course.
DS1
August 29th, 2011
4:13 pm
flange1
Thanks for the Lew update…..
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:13 pm
Thanks Flange1. Glad to hear it.
CB
August 29th, 2011
4:13 pm
Great news on Lew,was very concerned for him.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:14 pm
Anders – The Braves weren’t playing and I had to watch some baseball. See, that’s the kind of insightful information I bring to the blog.
Seriously, last week, there were some on here saying that “we don’t want the Brewers” with their home record and the streak they are now on. I’m not that worried about them. Of course they could beat us, but we won the season series and we are playing pretty good ball.
What does worry me is that it is a five game series.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:15 pm
V-Mart signed that deal when he was 32. Mac will be 3 years younger. Not sure you can give him the same money.
True, but part of that signing was with the acknowledgement that Victor would DH quite often. We don’t have that luxury with Mac, so I’d be hesitant to lock him up further out than his age 32 year old season.
Bay Area Steve
August 29th, 2011
4:16 pm
Thanks, flange.
Paint on, Lew.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:16 pm
Very good news about Lew.
Moe Berg
August 29th, 2011
4:16 pm
JimBowdenESPNxm JIM BOWDEN
Jim Leyland just told us “I’m not an OBP guy, I’m a SLUG% guy, enough players will get on…I want the hitters that can drive them in” XM 89
NickB
August 29th, 2011
4:17 pm
@ flange 1 – well it’s because once you take Prado out of the starting lineup he loses trade value. It would be much better to use him as a chip to acquire some young players for the future and then use the $5+ mill he’s likely to recieie via arbitrartion to help fill the dang LF GAP WE’VE HAD FOREVER!!! lol I’m not really yelling, but honestly, name the last full time honest to goodness LF’er the Braves have had? Plus, Prado’s offensive production is good for an infielder, but not very good for a corner OF’er. He would be better off in a small AL ballpark playing 3b and hitting 2nd or 6th. The Braves would be better off by maximizing his value and using his potential salary for the specific thing they have lacked for a loooong time. I think it’s a win/ win
phil
August 29th, 2011
4:17 pm
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:02 pm
phil, what “extra 50 pounds”? What do you mean “extra”?
Again, where is the evidence or reason to believe McCann has never been in shape? Would love to see it, if you’ve got it.
***********************
Your condition, whatever it actually is, shows itself at moments such as this….
I don’t have access to McCann’s medical records.
I do, however, have eyes that function. They can identify a fatty fairly quickly.
Some fattys are in excellent shape for their sizes. Brian appears to be one of them, aside from the incredible sweating he does, as do most fattys and Derrick Lowe….Some fattys can run blazing fast 5ks and blow my thinner self out of the water. I’m always happy for them.
But it doesn’t mean it’s good for them to be so large.
At what height and weight are Brian listed?
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:17 pm
Just think of Prado as our third baseman from 2013-2015 and it makes you feel a whole lot better about the guy.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:17 pm
Brava, …and they miss him getting to batted balls the he should catch (and some that he shouldn’t) more often than Prado. That explains it. They just keep track of every bad play while brushing aside any normal or plus plays. Geez, how do those people not think Alex Gonzalez is a bad defensive player? He’s second on the team in errors, so he’s doing something wrong, correct? Never mind range and the positive things.
JFP
August 29th, 2011
4:18 pm
I would like to be the first person to vote for Shaun on his new position of Agent for Jason Heyward. No one could be as dedicated to Jason as Shaun. Jason should be signed to a 6 year 150 million dollar contract before the playoffs.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:18 pm
Jim Leyland just told us “I’m not an OBP guy, I’m a SLUG% guy, enough players will get on…I want the hitters that can drive them in” XM 89
I always thought it was the other way around. Enough guys will drive em in, but I want guys that can get on base.
DAP
August 29th, 2011
4:19 pm
i know the brewers have been playing well, but have you noticed the teams they have been beating up on? alot of wins against teams like pittsburgh, houston, and the cubs. thats a really weak division, and they are taking advantage.
Moe Berg
August 29th, 2011
4:19 pm
Efrim–I wondered about it as well.
Bay Area Steve
August 29th, 2011
4:19 pm
Moe,
But, is Leyland’s closer use ‘optimal’…
noliee
August 29th, 2011
4:20 pm
ignoring PEDS, I gotta go with Arod as the greatest 3rd baseman of all time
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:20 pm
I say sign David Ross long-term. He is our catcher of the future.
Heck, he’d be starting for any other of the 38 teams!
dcp
August 29th, 2011
4:20 pm
Sell tickets and this is not a worry. You can pay players what you need to to be successful. Nobody on this board can whine about losing players if they actually go to the games. If all anyone does is watch TV and then expect the owners to bankroll more than they have, it won’t happen. There is no reason that more fans are not going to the games. Oh the traffic, it’s a school night, they’re just playing the Astros, the game starts at 7 and i work till 5, etc. If Bourn’s your man, McCann’s your man, then get out there and buy tickets. I do like Anders post about the wonderful scouting report by Jimmy…wow – what knowledge we gained…don’t fall behind a good pitcher.
David O'Brien
August 29th, 2011
4:20 pm
Now you also have to consider the value of speed in todays game, Carl Crawford and Jose Reyes certainly have power, but what gets them the big bucks is their speed and defensive skills. — Tomas
If you think defensive skills get Crawford and Reyes their big bucks, sorry to tell you, but you’re wrong.
Skeezix
August 29th, 2011
4:20 pm
Way to go. One of you guys had to go and remind me that Glavine was once a Met. It is hard to even write that. I somehow had repressed the awful memory of Tommy going over to the other side. Now I am depressed.
Moe Berg
August 29th, 2011
4:21 pm
BAS–Very true. I bet he is too preoccupied with the saves stat.
southern hope
August 29th, 2011
4:21 pm
This no-baseball stretch stinks.
At least during the All-star break, we get things like the home run derby….this…this is frustrating! I can’t even root against the Phillys because they haven’t been doing anything either.
grrrr…
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:21 pm
I would like to be the first person to vote for Shaun on his new position of Agent for Jason Heyward. No one could be as dedicated to Jason as Shaun. Jason should be signed to a 6 year 150 million dollar contract before the playoffs.
Shaun comes off poorly here, but I’ll say it again, hope for Heyward to get out of this and reach his potential. Very bad if he doesn’t. Bad for this franchise like Hanson shoulder surgery would be bad. Heyward is extremely important and I personally enjoy rooting for this team more when young players that were drafted and develope3d contribute to the team winning. The Willie Harris, Jose Constanza, Jaret Wrights of the world don’t excite me as much. Sorry.
Bay Area Steve
August 29th, 2011
4:21 pm
dcp,
I appreciated Jimmy’s report infinitely more than yours. Hope this helps.
Brava
August 29th, 2011
4:22 pm
Shaun, I never said, I don’t see the good plays he makes, I was just pointing out why I think Prado is better at fielding his position. I don’t think Heyward is a bad defensive player, just average. He’s certainly not the gold glover some claim he is.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:22 pm
But, is Leyland’s closer use ‘optimal’…
I love that word now.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:24 pm
Isn’t Prado considered a good defender at third?
McFann :Ô: :Ô:
August 29th, 2011
4:24 pm
Murph what will you do if the unquestionable happens and the Braves let BMac walk at the end of his deal? And he goes to the Mets?…Will you be a Mets fan or will you be a Braves fan who roots for BMac on Mets? What about the first time he comes to Atlanta wearing that Mets road uni?
Well, after I regained conscientiousness, I think I would be a Braves fan who roots for BMac and BMac only on the Mets…that is if I “come around” while he’s still with them…
Anders They still sting from dealing with Piazza as their big bat as a catcher.
Hey hey hey! Don’t be comparing BMac to that……guy!
But they have stupid money and treat it as such.
Excuse me? Nothing stupid about wanting BMac…
That said- I’d be proud to have McFann as a fellow fan. She’s one of my favorites on this blog.
OK, all is forgiven…You’re alright, man!
(Seriously, thanks…but I don’t think I could ever come over to your side!
)
noliee
August 29th, 2011
4:25 pm
Jason has better range and a better arm than Prado. He still needs to work on his routes. He looked absolutely great in the minors.
I do not want someone his size diving after balls most of the time.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:25 pm
But, is Leyland’s closer use ‘optimal’…
I think Leyland still wears cleats at the ballpark, so my guess is that he give a person suggesting “optimal” use of a bullpen his most sympathetic look of pity. Or incredulity. Or scorn. Or maybe the one that says, “You see what kind of bull-bleep I have to put up with in this bleepin’ office?”.
One of those.
NickB
August 29th, 2011
4:25 pm
@ jimmy – I’m assuming yer being sarcastic
I don’t think Prado is the future of 3b for us though. Plus, if his production drops again next year he won’t have much value at all…. (yet he would still probably get a raise to around $7 mill in arbitration)
He’s had 3 straight years of declining OPS … that’s troubling. HOWEVER, don’t get me wrong. If they decide to keep him and he plays 3b until he’s a FA or wtvr, it’s not the end of the world. I’m just saying, If I were GM, I’d think about maximizing his value. As well as maximizing the potential production from LF.
JFP
August 29th, 2011
4:25 pm
Efrim, didn’t mean to mislead you about Heyward. I am a big fan also, just can’t compete with Shaun. I am a big fan of the Braves team and understand that each person plays an important role. You will never hear me bash a major league player. It takes so much to just get there whether it be raw talent or someone busting his butt everyday to work harder than the next.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:26 pm
dcp – dog me if you want, but check out his averages according to the count.
And don’t take me so serious. Just a fan of the game. And I don’t claim to be anything more.
McFann :Ô: :Ô:
August 29th, 2011
4:26 pm
phil At what height and weight are Brian listed?
6′3″, 230…though in Spring Training this year, he was closer to 220.
noliee
August 29th, 2011
4:27 pm
He’s had 3 straight years of declining OPS … that’s troubling. …NickB
as has the majority of players in MLB. Numbers are down a lot across the board
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:27 pm
You will never hear me bash a major league player.
Good for you. Better person than I am.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:28 pm
I somehow had repressed the awful memory of Tommy going over to the other side. Now I am depressed.(Skeezix)
Trust me, you wouldn’t be alone to want to go back in time and make this never happen. You’d have an awful lot of northern company.
Brava
August 29th, 2011
4:28 pm
That may be, nolie, but he doesn’t use it to its potential. Prado may not throw as hard, but he’s far more accurate.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:30 pm
Wow, comparing Heyward to Prado? I know I’ve been away a while but when I left weren’t you guys comparing Heyward to Mickey Mantle or something??
steve
August 29th, 2011
4:30 pm
No doubt the Braves should resign Bourn as he is the best leadoff hitter we have had in a long time plus he is a good defensive player and a great base stealer, he fits in with our clubhouse, 5 years at 50 million is about right , with all the good young pitchers we have it is time for the Braves to put a team on the field that can score some runs and win some championships, we need Liberty to sell to an owner that can at least spend 100 million a year in order to keep and also add good players, hard to do this with an 80 million dollar payroll.
Anders
August 29th, 2011
4:31 pm
For the record I’ll put my money on Leylands baseball thought process – always.
Jimmy
August 29th, 2011
4:31 pm
southern hope – You can root aginst the Phils tonight – ESPN 7:10.
NickB – I was being very sarcastic. Even I am not that stupid. I thought the “38 teams” would give it away. Someone on here used to talk about how Ross could be a starter for a wad of teams. I like Ross very much. He is the premier backup in the league.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:32 pm
JFP, I’m just for reason and logic and being sensible. Read this: http://capitolavenueclub.com/?p=4843
I think it’s about the best and most reasonable thing I’ve read about the whole Heyward situation.
I’ll sum it up for you: Heyward is having a brutal season. But he’s not as bad as many think because those people are over-reliant on batting average and are rating him not on what he’s done but on comparing what he’s done to hype and expectations. If you wade through all of the hype and expectation and you go beyond batting average, to more telling metrics, he’s valuable even to a playoff team.
I would be just as belligerent if the Braves had decided to bench Uggla several games in a row quite frequently after a few months of poor play or if they were benching Prado for several games in a row. I honestly would. Has very little to do with the fact that it’s Heyward. It has everything to do with the Braves often not putting their best players on the field.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:32 pm
Wow, comparing Heyward to Prado?
That’s the undercard. Stick around for the main event: comparing Heyward to Jose Constanza, LOL.
NickB
August 29th, 2011
4:32 pm
Yeah but I’m not talking he went from .850 to .830 he’s gone from .822 to .809 to .722. now, his bABIP is down from his norm of around .330 (down to .275) so he may just be having an unlucky season. But for a guy who relies on hits to get on base (he’s never had much plate discipline) his big drop could be a sign that he’s too agressive..
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:32 pm
Anders, you have no idea the pain that Heyward’s struggles have caused. Not so much his actual struggles. Just a lot of unnecessary back and forth about the topic on this blog.
Shaun
August 29th, 2011
4:34 pm
Brava, don’t know who claimed he was a Gold Glover.
But all the evidence points to him being a better defender than Prado. I know. Forget the evidence. We only go on perception around here.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:34 pm
No way on Leyland. That comment he made is just plain wrong in my opinion. Or at least, not ‘optimal’….
DAP
August 29th, 2011
4:35 pm
efrim I always thought it was the other way around. Enough guys will drive em in, but I want guys that can get on base.
didnt work well enough for the 2010 braves. i mean, it did because we won 91 games, but a little slugging would have gone a long way. (like this year)
flange1
August 29th, 2011
4:35 pm
It was a good line Jimmy.
Efrim
August 29th, 2011
4:35 pm
Mike Stanton has a .543 slugging percentage. Star with a capital “S”.
noliee
August 29th, 2011
4:35 pm
Leyland is highly overrated. losing career record
T for Texas
August 29th, 2011
4:36 pm
you have no idea the pain that Heyward’s struggles have caused. Not so much his actual struggles. Just a lot of unnecessary back and forth about the topic on this blog.
So much so that political blogs have banned the discussion of Jason Heyward on them.
Brava
August 29th, 2011
4:37 pm
Well, Shaun, all I can say is I watch every game and what I, and those around me, see often doesn’t jive with your “evidence”.
ncscoots
August 29th, 2011
4:37 pm
That comment he made is just plain wrong in my opinion. Or at least, not ‘optimal’….
“sub-optimal”, Efrim. You got your “optimal” and your “sub-optimal”.
Skeezix
August 29th, 2011
4:37 pm
The issue with Brian is his arm. It never was great and is getting worse. So where does FG put him? He is a great stick, so he’s a keeper, but long term FG needs to find a new position for him……… and let Ross, who has a great arm (and is overall better defensively), be the #1 catcher. It is a real dilemma for the Braves. I wonder if Freeman can play third?
TennesseePaul
August 29th, 2011
4:38 pm
where is the evidence or reason to believe McCann has never been in shape?
I’ve got some baby photo’s of him, will that be admissible as “proof”?