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© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
1,264 comments Add your comment
Ward
August 30th, 2011
2:39 am
We keep Prado,and let go of Lowe, Nate,and K.K. Gonzalez. Sign Infante,and bring up Pastornicky. I think he will be ready for next year,and then save some money for a big time third baseman for the following year………
Ward
August 30th, 2011
2:44 am
Next year the Braves wont have to do too much! We just need a couple of good bench players,and that wont be hard to find……..
Ward
August 30th, 2011
3:19 am
A while back we were talking about third basemans. Where would you rank Buck Weaver?
Ward
August 30th, 2011
3:22 am
Well, I talk tomorrow after the game,and peace every one!”Go!!!!! Braves!!!!!”
RAG
August 30th, 2011
7:08 am
Great job DOB. I keep hearing rumors that Liberty Mutual plan to sell
the Braves in 2012-13. How do you anticipate the Braves will handle new
contracts and aquisitions in a “For Sale” environment?
Ron H.
August 30th, 2011
7:10 am
Hopefully the Braves don’t get owned by the Nats again…
Teheran dominance!
August 30th, 2011
7:19 am
If the potential NLCS game 7’s match-up would be Halladay, Lee , Hamels VS Lowe,
That would be as automatic as it gets.
D-Lowe should not be a starter in october, period!!!
Random
August 30th, 2011
7:27 am
T for Texas (August 29th, 2011 9:08 pm): “Shane Victorino. Nemesis.”
The Grim Reaper.
Mixxo
August 30th, 2011
7:30 am
My boy Shane lifts his team late with a big blast!
Guy is AWESOME!
The Nats own us.
Random
August 30th, 2011
7:34 am
RAG (August 30th, 2011 7:08 am): “Great job DOB. I keep hearing rumors that Liberty Mutual plan to sell the Braves in 2012-13.”
I believe that depends on when and if Liberty Mutual actually buys the Braves from Liberty Media.
Ron H. (August 30th, 2011 7:10 am): “Hopefully the Braves don’t get owned by the Nats again…”
Rest easy, brother — I’m pretty sure that neither Liberty Media NOR Liberty Mutual will sell the Braves to the Nats.
O.J.
August 30th, 2011
7:39 am
gotta suck for the Giants though, knowing they had a rare opportunity to gain a little ground with the Braves having 3 days off all the sudden, and yet, they lose ground by going 1-2 in those two days. Just pitiful.
LWB
August 30th, 2011
7:46 am
So, let’s see……….3 days off and the Braves come back facing the Nats and Livan Hernandez? That’s a recipe for a 6-1 loss right there. I think the bats will be pretty cold tonight. Hope not though.
Moe Berg
August 30th, 2011
7:47 am
jimcaple Jim Caple
Here’s one you could win a lot of bar bets with: Who is active career leader in strikeouts? Bet you didn’t guess Javier Vazquez.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
7:59 am
Well the Phillies won one of the four games in hand. The four (now three) that the Braves can’t respond to, and are at the mercy of the Phillies opponents. Hamels looked a lot better coming of the DL than JJ did. Victorino wins another game for them with his glove and bat. Since this Blog is on Bourn, my ranking of Center Fielders this season would be…
1. Granderson
2. Kemp
3. Ellsbury
4. Victorino
5. Bourn
6. McCutchen
7. Jones
8. The Rest
Mixxo
August 30th, 2011
8:00 am
LWB –
It doesn’t get any easier tomorrow night either……..facing Lannan. We all know what he does to us.
I think we can beat Wang though. We’ll go 1-2 against these guys.
Jimmy
August 30th, 2011
8:00 am
McFann :Ô: :Ô: Jimmy – In fact, this year I’ve noticed he doesn’t even slide his body over to block a pitch in the dirt – just his glove.
“Not to be a smart[butt], but you must not watch many games, then.”
Actually, I watch every game I can. And that is what I’m basing my statement on. I know he’s your favorite player, but the truth is the truth.
Let’s watch him tonight. He should be fresh with the days off. Let’s see.
Random
August 30th, 2011
8:18 am
Teheran dominance! (August 30th, 2011 7:19 am): “If the potential NLCS game 7’s match-up would be Halladay, Lee , Hamels VS Lowe, That would be as automatic as it gets.
“D-Lowe should not be a starter in october, period!!!”
Yeah, right.
Not with 95.1 IP of postseason baseball, posting a 3.21 ERA and 1.15 WHIP and a .228 AVG against. Definitely don’t want HIM!
And especially not after his last year’s performance with the Braves in the NLDS — 11.2 IP, 2.31 ERA, 1.03 WHIP and .150 AVG aginst.
Your and idiot.
Eleven in '11
August 30th, 2011
8:27 am
For the NLDS, you go with your best three
That would be Hudson, Beachy, and JJ or Hanson (if healthy)
Lowe becomes a starter only if the Braves reach the NLCS, and he’s the number four starter then (kind of like a struggling Avery was in 1995)
Eleven in '11
August 30th, 2011
8:28 am
Check that – if Hanson and JJ are both healthy, I would start either of them over Lowe in the NLCS
LWB
August 30th, 2011
8:31 am
Yeah, that’s right Mixxo. I think the Braves will win 2 out of 3, but I dont expect it to be pretty hehe. They looked totally dead in that one Mets game.
Mixxo
August 30th, 2011
8:45 am
…They looked totally dead in that one Mets game. – LWB
Yes they did. They looked whipped. Hopefully, this little break will spark some urgency and inspired play.
richbrave
August 30th, 2011
8:52 am
DOWN ON THE FARM
G-Men best BULLS 2-1
The man with the plan.1B ‘45′ GOMEZ [.292 BA] comes through going 3-3, 1 2B [32], 2 RBI [76], 1 BB.
DH STEF GARTRELL [.265] 2-2, 2 BB.
2B RUBEN GOTAY [.259 BA] 1-3, 2 R, 2 BB, 1 SO.
TODD REDMOND [10-8, 2.91 ERA] 6.0 IP. 6 H, 1 R/ER, 3 BB, 9 SO. TODD was dealin’ last night. This start he’s up. Next one………..who knows.
CORY GEARRIN [H 5, 1.79 ERA] 1.2 IP, no hits, 1 BB, 4 SO. Also dealin.’
JAIRO ASENCIO [SV 24, 1.39 ERA] 1.1 IP, pristine. Everybody was on the same page tonight pitching-wise.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
8:55 am
Wow. Giants lost….again. 10 games back in the loss column. If the Braves go 15-14 down the stretch, they will have a 94-68 record. To force a one game playoff, the Giants would have to 23-4. 23 wins….and 4 losses. And that’s with the Braves going a mediocre 15-14 in their last 29 games.
richbrave
August 30th, 2011
9:00 am
Yard clean-up soon. Been filling trashcans and the truck with storm damage. Lots of damage to neighbors homes, one completely crushed by a massive oak, but this time, no one killed thank God. During ISABEL we lost a neighbor to a falling tree. Wind topped out here at 71. Worse than on the coast. Only minor flooding however. We had hot tropical air trapped under the rain-bands which brought the high winds aloft down to ground level. All our neighbors have power out. Estimate friday for it’s return. We have a new below ground power line, and only lost power for about 30 seconds thank goodness.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
9:05 am
Hope everything went okay at Dr. Andrews yesterday…..
JRW
August 30th, 2011
9:16 am
Good to hear your well richbrave. That storm left a lot of damage in many areas. Particularly with flooding up north.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
9:21 am
This is pretty cool from the Dodgers game.
http://www.foxsportswest.com/08/29/11/Blind-woman-throws-out-first-pitch/landing_dodgers.html?blockID=555478&feedID=7972>1=39002
John A
August 30th, 2011
9:23 am
If the management team can get Scott Boras out of the picture, then it would be worth the effort. The front office has shot themselves in the foot many times, and I don’t see anything changing this time. Of course Frank can always rely of McLouse (his brain child). He is in love with his press clippings.
What management has to keep in mind is pretty simple….in order for the pitchers to win they have to score runs. Having said that keep in mind we still need a power hitting bat from the right side of the plate.
As much as I hate to say this, because i’m a strong fan of his, JHEY needs a refreher course (AAA level) in hitting. He has many holes in his swing, and until they are addressed
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
9:30 am
Very little damage in Raleigh. A lot more as you go east. We lost power for 11 hours, but most did not. We live in an old neighborhood with lots of trees and above ground power.
I hear Lew is OK. Hope he’s back on line soon. I miss my friend.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
9:32 am
richbrave – Good to hear you’re OK, my friend.
abeeeewright
August 30th, 2011
9:37 am
If the Braves put on a run right now and the Giants and Cardinals swoon, Braves could lock up a playoff spot in 10 games.
The E# = 20. Ten wins by the Braves + 10 losses by the Cards and Giants means playoffs.
Certainly by four days from now, Braves should have eliminated the Cubs as a possible threat. <g>
GoldMember
August 30th, 2011
9:41 am
Michael Bourn is “The Bourn Supremacy”! A fantastic, dynamic talent. The Braves must sign him if they are serious about remaining enduring contenders.
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
9:43 am
richbrave, good to hear all is well. I’m glad no one was injured.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
9:46 am
raleighbraves -It’s a total mess up here. We lost power for Sunday and mot of Monday and the flooding (though it didn’t hit us personally) is widespread and will take months to clean up – over 270 roads washed out – with many small towns totally isolated. We’ve got a grocery store running on a generator and the pharmacy was a total loss. Most shopping centers here and in New Hampshire on the Connecticut River (state line between Vermont and NH) are a total losses – even the Wal Mart is shut down. Five dead so far and they’re still looking for missing persons.
abeeeewright
August 30th, 2011
9:50 am
Lew … I’m glad to hear you made it through OK.
Sounds like a major disaster in Vermont. The whole Northeast is a bit hinky when it comes to food supply. So much food has to be brought in to sustain the population. Losing the roads could be “Katrina-esque” for a state like Vermont.
I hope that Vermont gets an “all hands on deck” approach to get things back to normal in a few days as opposed to a few weeks.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
9:51 am
Lew – Good to hear from you. Sorry for the problems. I’ve been through it, but you don’t expect that in VT.
During Fran (1996) we lost power for 8 days. I’m opn a well, so we had to haul water to flush. Very hot also. Lots of damage all over. That was the only direct hit in raleigh during my lifetime, with the exception of Hazel, a terrible storm that hit in 1954. Easteern NC is hit from time to time, sometimes worse than others.
Good luck for a quick recovery, my friend.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
9:53 am
Surely FEMA will do a better job than during the Katrina disaster.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
9:56 am
abeeeewright – MY wife works at the Food Bank – not even sure if she can get to it – the bridge right down the street from it got inundated the other day. There’s even lines out the door and down the street at the convenience store in town – and we didn’t get hit nearly as bad as neighboring areas..
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:01 am
raleighbravefan, they were stating in the news this morning that FEMA is out of money.. they are having to pull resources from elsewhere to help the immediate needs on the east coast.
McFann :Ô: :Ô:
August 30th, 2011
10:02 am
Jimmy but the truth is the truth.
How true. And the truth is that he DOES block pitches—MANY pitches. But because there’s no recognized “stat” to back me up, it’s a little hard for me to prove this very easily…
So this year, I made my own stat, and am keeping track myself. I calculate them as Bases Saved and Runs Saved, and base them on how many men are on base—like, is he stops a tough pitch with two guys on, that’s 2 Bases Saved—and if there are any on third—if he stops a tough pitch with a guy on third, that’s a Run Saved. A more advanced way, I suppose, to calculate Runs Saved would be to, say, if he keeps a guy from advancing to second or third, and then the next guy gets a hit that would have scored him from that base, but not from the base he was held to, that’d be a Run Saved. Perhaps I’ll try to work that in for next year…
But for now, I have this: And this stat is slightly incomplete, because I’ve missed innings here and there, and also have missed entire games, I think, so obviously I can’t mark those down, because I didn’t see them and no one else has this stat at my disposal. But here’s what I do have so far this year:
Bases Saved: Approx. 99
Runs Saved: Approx. 34
PB(4)+WP: 37 (and not all those resulted in runs…yes, I should have been keeping a closer eye on that)
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:03 am
Lew, did you get any damage at your place? Didn’t you mention before that you get some flooding under your house but you have a pump? With the power outages, I’m sure that made it more difficult to address.
McFann :Ô: :Ô:
August 30th, 2011
10:03 am
Glad to hear from a bunch of our friends up the East Coast! Been thinkin’ about y’all all weekend!
DC Brave
August 30th, 2011
10:04 am
What I like about Michael Bourn: he’s already got that professional Atlanta Braves swagger. If he makes a great play or steals a base, he gets up and acts like that is what was “supposed” to happen. Just like Chipper after he hits a home run.
Sure I like to see some guys show a little fire (like Kimbrel does occassionally, or Freddie), but this team generally has that quiet confidence that shows an uncommon degree professionalism and class.
Bottom-line…if he’ll “settle” for 8 million a year, for 5 years, with some attractive incentives built in for 50 SB seasons…SIGN HIM.
John A
August 30th, 2011
10:06 am
At 3rd Base….did you ever hear the name BROOKS ROBINSON? He was the idol of George Brett, and that is why he choe to wear the number “5″.
abeeeewright
August 30th, 2011
10:08 am
Lew … maybe you can get tiger to fly over and drop food packages.
For those who go way back, the end of “Mr. Mike’s Mondo Video” had a scene of American aid packages dropped on a remote location. The natives killed the camera crew with the lava lamps.
DAP
August 30th, 2011
10:12 am
DC Brave if he’ll “settle” for 8 million a year, for 5 years, with some attractive incentives built in for 50 SB seasons
you cant do incentives like that in baseball contracts, but the $8mil per for 5 years is reasonable to me.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
10:13 am
Brooks Robinson was a GREAT 3rd baseman…maybe the best defensive ever, and no slouch with the bat. However, I did see him commit 3 errors in the same inning once (tv game of the week). People remember that, because it was so unlike him. Anyone can have a bad day, I guess.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:14 am
Since going 1-5 against the Braves and Phillies the D-Backs are 7-1 and opened a 5 game lead over the Giants in the West. THere’s the incentive for the Braves to somehow win the Division, it seems much better to open with Arizona at home vs. Milwaukee on the road.
JerseyGil
August 30th, 2011
10:16 am
Lew…glad you & Family are ok….We have damage here in South Jersey…For first time my Basement flood…4 inches of water…lost my Tower computer, modem of the internet,telephone was damage…today the cable guy came to replaces…But…why are ok…
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
10:18 am
DAP – I din’t know you couldn’t put those kind of incentives. Doesn’t surprise me. MLB is the only sport with a REAL players union.
If you think about it, that would not necessarily be a good move anyway…it gives the individual player an incentive top do things that may not be ideal for the team and the situation. There are times when a stolen bese may take the bat out of the hitter, or change the situation in other negative ways.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:19 am
I’ve revised slightly, but this is what I am going with:
Sign Bourn to a 5 year 43 million dollar deal(12: 7m, 2013-2016: 9m per year)
Sign Prado to a 3 year 21 million dollar deal with a 4th year option(12: 5.5m, 13: 6.5m, 14: 8m, 15: 8m or 1m buyout)
Sign McCann to a 5 year 60.5 million dollar deal(12: 8.5m, 2013-2016: 13m per year)
b
August 30th, 2011
10:22 am
Quit comparing Constanza to Willie Harris.
Georgie utilizes his MUCH greater speed to help the team.
It’s a shame it’s taken him this long to get a call up.
His stats bare that out compared to others who were summoned up.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:23 am
I say Brandon Beachy is the Braves’ best starting pitcher right now. He’s basically Johnny Venters with a lower walk rate and a higher homerun rate.
Anyone see the CAC post about Beachy possibly becoming only the 23rd pitcher in baseball history to strike out at least 10 batters per 9 IP, have a K/BB ratio of at least 4 and start at least 20 games in a single season?
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:25 am
b, Harris hits the ball with more authority while Constanza is faster. Constanza is more of a Gregor Blanco/Matt Young type.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:26 am
Anyone see the CAC post about Beachy possibly becoming only the 23rd pitcher in baseball history to strike out at least 10 batters per 9 IP, have a K/BB ratio of at least 4 and start at least 20 games in a single season?
Yeah, I saw it. I’d rather have Tim Hudson on the mound in a post season game. Beachy is kind of homer prone.
Jimmy
August 30th, 2011
10:28 am
McFann – good stats. Maybe I’m focusing in on one particular game.
Anyway, you and I are on the same team. We want to win. And let’s start tonight.
BRAVES BASEBALL BABY – 7:10 !!!
Feels almost like a season opener.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:29 am
Why does everyone care what money it may take to keep Bourn? He’s great for this team with no Center Fielders in the wings. As long as the Braves keep him who cares how they use their money? The Phillies started spending money 3 years ago to keep their core and it seems to have gone alright for them so far with two WS appearances.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:30 am
Efrim, yeah, I think they have to make sure Beachy starts at home or in other non-homer-friendly parks. But guys like Schilling and Smoltz were sort of homer-prone, so I don’t think that’s a huge problem, as long as he’s only giving up solo shots when he gives them up.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:32 am
Why does everyone care what money it may take to keep Bourn? He’s great for this team with no Center Fielders in the wings. As long as the Braves keep him who cares how they use their money
Because I can’t stand seeing the Braves overpay a player, especially in their decline phase. I want Wren to draw a hard line on that sort of stuff, kind of like he does with our top prospects. It’s a mid market payroll, 90-92 million. Can’t overpay guys in their mid thirties and then watch guys in their prime(Heyward,Freeman, Hanson, Kimbrel, etc.) walk away because we didn’t have the cash to lock em up.
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:32 am
JerseyGil, glad to hear that your okay.. those things can be replaced, although I’m sure you lost a lot of important data on your computer.. hate that for you.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:34 am
But guys like Schilling and Smoltz were sort of homer-prone, so I don’t think that’s a huge problem, as long as he’s only giving up solo shots when he gives them up.
I trust Schilling and Smoltz a bit more than Brandon. But he’d start Game 2 for me, right behind Tim Hudson. I’d probably consider starting Mike Minor in Game 3 if we were facing a lefty heavy lineup like the Phils. A shame Hanson is shelved. Hopefully Jair can get better and better with each start.
DAP
August 30th, 2011
10:35 am
shaun I say Brandon Beachy is the Braves’ best starting pitcher right now. He’s basically Johnny Venters with a lower walk rate and a higher homerun rate.
interesting about the venters comparison, but it would be hard to srgue that he is their best SP right now. the only challenger would be huddy, right?
i think beachy has the makeup to be an excellent post season pitcher. keeps his cool, strikes guys out, and has good control. like a righthanded andy petit.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:35 am
JRW, well, I can’t speak for everyone but it’s not just the money. I’m also concerned that Bourn could slip to merely an average offensive player or a little worse within a couple of seasons, and he’ll be getting paid like a legit all-star-caliber center fielder at that point. I’m thinking it could be a little bit like McLouth, although I don’t think Bourn will be as bad as McLouth was last season. Bourn is a much better defender than McLouth ever was, so at worst, even if Bourn doesn’t add much of anything offensively, he’s probably going to provide a lot of value defensively for a while.
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:35 am
Efrim, it would work better to load Bourn’s contract up front and progressive decrease thru the years. Maybe something like this… 10 next year, 9 the next 2 years, 8mil in 2015 and finish up with 7mil in ‘16.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:36 am
And I don’t think it’s, ahem, ‘optimal’, to lock up players to monster 10 year deals that take em from age 28 to age 38 like we’ve seen recently. That’s such a long period of time, no telling what could happen to effect a players production level.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:37 am
The only problem is that Wren is kind of in a hard place with Bourn. He has to get a free agent Center Fielder because of nothing of substance in the Minors and everyone has seen first hand that you have to be strong up the middle and have a true lead off hitter. I think the Braves are going to have to pay market to keep him especially with Boras as his agent.
Jimmy
August 30th, 2011
10:37 am
…They looked totally dead in that one Mets game. – LWB
Mixxo – “Yes they did. They looked whipped. Hopefully, this little break will spark some urgency and inspired play.”
Yeah, but I can understand what happened. They fly you from Chicago to New York – in the direct path of a hurricane, mind you – to play a three game weekend series that you know won’t be completed. You hear news reports that the airports will be closing around noon Saturday. If you don’t fly out by then, you are stuck in NYC until Monday or Tuesday. You are supposed to play in Atlanta Tuesday, etc…. The Mets live there and the Braves just wanted to get out. Their heads weren’t in the game.
MLB did a poor job in managing this storm… in my opinion. They knew the storm was running up the east coast and yet tried to force the games through. Look at that horrendous DH in Boston.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:38 am
Maybe something like this… 10 next year, 9 the next 2 years, 8mil in 2015 and finish up with 7mil in ‘16.
Rarely do you see deals like that, although I know the Red Sox structured Lackey’s deal sorta like that. Players association want that last year to be the highest for arbitration purposes.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:39 am
Shaun, – I’m also concerned that Bourn could slip to merely an average offensive player or a little worse within a couple of seasons
*****************************************************************
Be honest, you can say that about any player. That risk is inherent to every contract in every sport
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:40 am
There are so many other ways Wren could go. He could always make a trade, sign a different free agent, sign a stop gap if we see a prospect up their game. A lot of things could change it.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:40 am
Efrim, good points. I think that sums it up pretty well. I would be a little surprised if Bourn is any kind of offensive force by the second year of his next contract. Once he starts to lose a little with the bat, I just don’t think he’ll be able to get on base at a good rate because he’s not really a guy that draws a ton of walks. But he will likely still be a plus defender in centerfield, which will have tremendous value. I tend to agree with you, if the contract demands are what we expect them to be. If there are any other decent, cheaper options for the Braves, perhaps they should explore those before offering Bourn a contract.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
10:42 am
Transplant – NO flooding at our place – the water in the basement before was from ten feet of snow right next to the house melting, but no more since they put the pump in. We’re halfway up a big hill, so the river would have to rise more than 100 feet or so before it flooded us.
We came through it all with just power loss for 27 hours. Since there were no Braves games to miss, all is well. Many others were nowhere near that lucky. It is a huge mess up here.
DAP
August 30th, 2011
10:42 am
AT it would work better to load Bourn’s contract up front and progressive decrease thru the years
its hard to do that, to. contracts go up, not down. especially for guys signing their first free agent deal. theres no way wren gets bourn to sign a declining salary contract.
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:42 am
Efrim, not to mention it helps to protect against possible trades.. but it would work in the Braves favor to structure the contract like that, allowing for more flexibility in the future when you might actually need it. Don’t really need much next year with so much coming off the books.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
10:44 am
For all the detractors out there, the criticism of NcCaann is hard to understand. Everyone has some limitations. That said, he is almost universally considered the best catcher in the NL…perhaps all of baseball. Some may prefer Buster Posey, but he is hurt, and has the infamous “small sample size”. Let him do it over more than a season (or less).
Arkansas Transplant
August 30th, 2011
10:44 am
DAP, It’d be nice to do something like that.. kind of like the NLF where the guys get the signing bonus cause the rest of the contract isn’t guaranteed.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:45 am
Arkansas Transplant – Boras would not let a highly regarded free agent sign a decreasing value contract. Just ain’t going to happen.
Edward
August 30th, 2011
10:45 am
It’s simple Scott Boras will be the reason the Braves don’t sign Bourn to a long contract.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:47 am
JRW, true. That’s why a lot of free agent contracts turn out badly. By the time a player hits free agency, he’s usually a little bit past his prime. But some risks are better than others. It obviously depends on the player and his skills, position and things of that sort.
Bourn is somewhat unique because I see him as a risk offensively but he’s not that much of a risk as far as defensive position and defensive skills. Say he’s a league-average-or-slightly worse offensive player next year or the year after. Well, he’ll still likely provide a lot of value on defense and you can just plug him in at the bottom of the order.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
10:47 am
No legitimate lead off hitter since Furcal left and damned few even in MLB anymore and none others available. Bourn fits. Do the deal and be done with it – otherwise, it’s a continued search for the same damned thing year after year – not to mention a continuous bitch fest on the blog (though they’ll likely still gripe about Bourn).
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:48 am
I like that Peter Bourjos dude from LAA. Great defender.
I’m all for keeping Bourn if it’s at the right price – just don’t want it to effect the potential extension for a player like Mac. Gotta make sure we can fit all of these pieces. Just by eyeballing it, looks like we should be able to as far as I could see it – through 2015.
JerseyGil
August 30th, 2011
10:50 am
Arkansas Transplant
Thanks…but we have two laptop in my household…much of my client
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
10:52 am
JRW – Phillies payroll is nearly double that of Braves. They can afford to overpay. If we overpay one player, it cripples us at other positions. (Re all the angst over KK, Lowe, McLouth, even Chipper money expressed here almost daily).
THAT’S WHY WE CARE HOW MUCH BOURN WILL COST US.
JerseyGil
August 30th, 2011
10:53 am
Client Data is in my laptop and in my backup….the tower is in my office for other think that my wife keep….but you are right think can replace,,,human life don’t.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
10:53 am
Lew – I agree and basically said that earlier in that Wren by aquiring Bourn has put himself in a position where he has to pay market value because of very few or no alternatives.
Shaun – Boras will most likely not let Bourn sign an extension with free agency opportunity at the end of next year. If his offensive numbers are with in 10% of this year he is going to get PAID and as I said earlier there really isn’t much to replace him without taking a big step backward.
Efrim
August 30th, 2011
10:53 am
Bourn is somewhat unique because I see him as a risk offensively but he’s not that much of a risk as far as defensive position and defensive skills. Say he’s a league-average-or-slightly worse offensive player next year or the year after. Well, he’ll still likely provide a lot of value on defense and you can just plug him in at the bottom of the order.
Which is why a five year deal from 2012-2016 probably works if the financials are in the range of 45 million. That’s takes him through age 33. It’s when it gets up beyond 50 million that it starts to get risky. And while were just talking a million more year, you really have to draw the line somewhere, imo.
JerseyGil
August 30th, 2011
10:54 am
Also was damage my Baseball card Collection….some are old card…
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:56 am
Lew, I’d be somewhat surprised if Bourn is a really good leadoff hitter beyond the first year or two of his next contract. Most of his value is going to come from him being a plus defender in center field.
What is a “legitimate lead-off hitter”? As long as a guy can get on base well, he’s a legitimate leadoff hitter, contrary to what tradition tells you about speed being the primary thing to look for in a leadoff hitter.
Plus, it’s much more important to get good hitters than to obsess over whether they fit into particular spots in the order, since batting order is secondary to having quality batters in the order.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
10:58 am
JRW, I’m fine with signing him for more than 1-2 years. As Efrim says, the price needs to be right because after that they are probably going to be paying for a glove-first, mediocre-at-best offensive player.
TennesseePaul
August 30th, 2011
11:00 am
It’s simple Scott Boras will be the reason the Braves don’t sign Bourn to a long contract.
He didn’t seem to get between the Braves and Lowe or the Angels and Weaver.
I’m not a huge fan of the impact Boras has had on the game, but it isn’t entirely all his fault. The players too share the “blame.” If one of his players wants to play for a particular team, he’ll work to get that done. If the player merely wants highest value, he’ll work to get that done. And he usually advises to do the latter. But it doesn’t mean it’s impossible to sign one of his players.
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
11:01 am
JRW – Boras will probably advise Bourn to test FA market…however, “not let him”? Boras works for Bourn, not the other way around.
Jared Weaver told Boras he wanted to stay with Angels. They did an extension, without going to free agency, and gave a significant “home-town discount” to get it done.
Boras plays hardball to get the best deal for his clients (as he should)…but the Boras phobia around here is just plain irrational.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
11:01 am
Shaun speed at the top of the order is important because you turn singles/walks into run scoring opportunities for the 3-4 hitters. Look how well Rollins and Victorino’s speed has been in creating RBI opportunities for Utley and Howard.and Gardner and Granderson in front of Texiera and Cano.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
11:01 am
Gil- Sorry to hear about those cards. The Chipper and Estrada drawing are OK, I hope?
raleighbravefan
August 30th, 2011
11:04 am
Braves have been able to work with Boras about as well as ANY team has.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
11:05 am
Shaun – Honestly, sometimes I think you’re afraid of anyone over 29 ever performing again.
The Dude’s 28 years old and would be no older than 33 after a five year deal. He won’t be crippled, on crutches or collecting medicare by then. If the Braves have the money available, there will be no better alternative.
Sign him and be done with it, strengthen the bench and the pen, find Chipper’s heir apparent and a corner outfielder.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
11:05 am
raleighbravefan – I agree probably poor choice of words there. But Bourn hires an Agent like Boras for the soul source of getting him the most money. His “Hometown is Houston” not Atlanta.
Shaun
August 30th, 2011
11:06 am
JRW, speed is nice. An ability to get on base is much more important.
Lew
August 30th, 2011
11:07 am
JRW- Re: Granderson – did anyone here ever figure him to lead the AL in HRs?
DC Brave
August 30th, 2011
11:09 am
Wow…had no idea you could not do performance incentives in a baseball contract. I guess I had that confused with the “games played” incentives you sometimes hear about.
JRW
August 30th, 2011
11:10 am
Bourn is 6th in OBP for Center Fielders behind Kemp, Victorino, Granderson, McCutchen, Ellsbury respectively. That’s not bad company to be compared to.IMO