3:45 pm April 27, 2011, by David O'Brien
April 28th, 20119:46 am
CrαZy…”Do we know what the fans said to Roger to provoke him?”
Unfortunately, in this world, the answer to that question is of no consequence. Fans can say anything short of a physical threat without consequence. If a player singled out a fan and sued them for whatever derogatory thing they said, it would be a PR nightmare for the organization. If a fan sued a player or coach for whatever derogatory thing they said, it would be a PR nightmare for the organization.
When you’re at the top, people can only bring you down. You can’t be dragged down when you’re already at the bottom. McDowell has more to lose than those fans, so he should show better self control in that situation, not because he has to, but because it would be in his best interest.
Do we know what the fans said to Roger to provoke him?
That’s what I want to know. He obviously caught McDowell’s attention somehow. He’s worried about his children being exposed to raucous behavior, yet he’s heckling the visiting team? If you’ve been threatened, fine. Make your case. It’s not a crime to yell at the players coaches, and umps, I know…but don’t give me that moral values, family-exposure crap when you’re the one standing there in front of 45,000 people acting like a horses a55 to begin with.
Okay, so I wake up to find out the big news on Rockin’ Roger.
What I don’t find discussed is what the “threesome” had to say. Apparently, they are nowhere to be found.
The whole thing is too bad. Sounds like Roger was being heckled and responded to three dudes, and when one parent of a nearby family overheard/saw what was happening, Roger lacked the good sense to apologize and move on.
The first part was unprofessional, the second part seems really stupid.
What’s wild is this family from Fresno taking it to these lengths. Who is paying for the trip for the 4 of them to LA to hold press conferences? And why do they, as a family, find this to be the best course of action?
Why would they want to amplify it to this level? The Giants beat the Braves. The Giants won the World Series. Buster Posey won the ROY over Jason Heyward. Why be bitter? (Okay, j/k about this part).
Okay, seriously, it’s pretty evident that we won’t hear much of anything about specifics of this from Roger. I’m sure he’s been advised to not talk publically other than statements (one already released, probably the last unless/until some type of formal action is taken) that are crafted by his attorney.
So, we’ll probably never really know what was said to him initially. Even so, he’s gotta know better than to get into it at that level with fans, and even moreso, not taking it out on others in attendance.
That said, I have little doubt that stuff like this has gone on for years (>100), just with little fan fare. Maybe not the fights with families, but certainly arguments with other fans.
Even with Kobe, calling the ref a name, that stuf happens all the time, and everyone knows it. Ever wonder why the audio often goes dead after missed shots under the basket? It’s because there are microphones there recording every f-bomb and (fill in blank) uttered by the players.
Regardless of what you believe is or is not appropriate, we live in an increasingly PC society. (Research where the concept of PC comes from, you might not be as pro-PC as you currently think you are). But, if reports are accurate, then what McDowell did was not just anti-PC, it was generally inappropriate.
Gestures with bats are rude. Making lewd comments are rude. Threatening to knock a guys teeth out is threatening. Saying that kids don’t belong at the ball park is just plain stupid.
We DON”T KNOW the FACTS. But again, if reports are accurate, then he made a lot of mistakes.
Even if McDowell deserves a second chance, I agree with the sentiment that says the Braves don’t need this distraction.
McDowell’s been around the game a long time. He has to know better than to engage in this kind of banter with fans and hecklers alike.
April 28th, 20119:48 am
What I’d like to know is where are the three guys he supposedly made the homophobic remarks to? They just don’t look as cute as little girls dressed all in pink? Just why aren’t they front and center?
I can see him getting ticked and yelling something to hecklers (yeah, I know, you can’t say anything anymore when someone pisses you off), but to wait four days and walk into the press conference with Lady Lawsuit demanding money? Smells a bit iffy to me.
April 28th, 20119:49 am
Crazy- great call.
Could this society be a little more sensitive. He was obviously wrong if he these accusations are true and punished in some form. IMO he shouldn’t be fired. Get over it and move on.
Sutton IMO is extremely knowledgeable about pitching and he is HOF. Thinking man’s pitcher and a really good one. I like him on the radio and don’t see him ever moving anywhere but who knows. He and Steve Stone are a fountain of knowledge about the art of pitching and without Stone’s massive ego a little easier to listen to.
April 28th, 20119:51 am
Hillbilly, I don’t think the Dad was heckling Roger. Some other people were and Roger reportedly responded to them with the gay slurs and some hip thrusting. The Dad was in the area with his two girls and yelled out to Roger that kids were there, at which point Roger reportedly told him kids don’t belong at the ballpark and made a threatening gesture with the bat.
April 28th, 20119:52 am
In this day and age of technology and the usually immediate appearance of video’s taken when something like this happens, I find it very odd that NO ONE in that SF stadium didn’t catch this on a smartphone or other device…not to mention all the TV cameras within the stadium itself. IF it truly happened the way this family/Allred is alleging, where is the proof? I’m not saying the family HAS to prove it happened. I’m simply saying that usually when something major (like I would consider this to be), someone somewhere usually gets it on camera to get their own 15 minutes of fame.
I do believe if this happened the way its being said, McDowell deserves whatever fallout comes of it. Accusations are sometimes enough on their own to ruin a career. The reason Roger gave a blanket apology was because Allred is looking for him to ‘apologize’ so she has “proof” from Roger that he did something wrong. Maybe all of this is blown out of proportion. Maybe it did happen like they claim, maybe it didn’t. I wasn’t there, neither were the rest of you. I say we not be so quick to judge before we’ve heard more of the story.
April 28th, 20119:53 am
Folks before hanging McDowell, remember who is behind the accusations. We have to consider the source. Gloria Allred is a liar. She lies far more than she ever speaks any truth. Sorry to say but I have no doubt MLB will force the Braves to let him go. If Selig feels McDowell will harm MLB’s “revenue stream” he will kick him out regardless.
Coach (2011 Fredi G. a Go!)
I just wanted to repost this from another blog, it’s good stuff about Roger McDowell.
Jerry Pritikin aka The Bleacher Preacher:
I just read about Roger McDowell, and his bad choice of antics for any fans, especially Giant Fans. And that McDonnell apologized for his poor choice of actions.
However, I known Roger as one of, if not the best fan friendly players I had the pleasure to watch and know for his many years as a Met,Philly and Dodger pitcher. I first met him in 1984, during a pennant chase… he with the Mets and I was a Super cubs fan. He played Frisbee prior to important games in September. From that time on when ever he came to town, he would always come out to the bleachers and ask” Got your Frisbee?” In September of 1987 on a drizzling rainy day… he came out and asked the question…
there were few fans in the bleachers and no chance of batting practice. As I took my Frisbee out a rookie usher said if i threw it… i would get kicked out of the park. I threw it and sure enough my 75 game streak for that season came to an end. As it turned out…
it made the Chicago Sun-Times and even Sports Illustrated. However, for the next 10 years… when ever he was in town… he came out to say hello, or play catch with a ball or Frisbee. The fans in the cheap seats loved him. Often, people would throw him their cheap cameras… and he would take pictures of them from the field, of his teammates and of himself making funny faces.
On hot days, before a game he would pull out the hose from under the bleachers and cool down the fans. That earned him a “Gunga Din” Award from me. When he was with the Dodgers, he and Orel Hershiser would take a clean garbage can, put a new Dodger jacket, a Bat a signed ball and a hundred dollar bill into it and then had fans from throughout the bleachers trying to make a basket with a baseball. It gave fans a chance, and when someone one won… they got a standing ovation from their fellow bleacherites, and Roger and Orel.
Once, when his team had a traveling day, he stayed behind and sat with us in the bleachers, and he walked over to the fans in wheel chairs, and signed their scorecard or gave them a ball. This went on for years… and never once did I see him mistreat a fan or make unkind gestures.
So when I heard of this story tonight, I wanted to let Brave fans and all baseball fans know that Roger McDowell is a good guy, who made a few bad choices on this one day in a career as a player and coach for over 25 years. I urge the Braves and Giant Fans fans to accept his apology, and maybe Roger can make a donation to a good gay cause.(San Francisco and Atlanta’s Gay Community Centers). I happen to be gay, and spoke OUT against Cubs Pitcher Julian Taverez in 2001 when he made anti-gay remarks, as well as John Rocker. But both those guys had a history of being hot headed and anti-gay. My best wishes to him for all those great years he entertained fans in Chicago and elsewhere.
Cheers and Good Sportsmanship Always,
Jerry Pritikin aka The Bleacher Preacher.
April 28th, 20119:54 am
It doesn’t really matter what the hecklers said to him, he should have ignored them and gone on about his duties.
Turning the other cheek is admirable, Brava. But the idea that there is nothing that hecklers can say that would cause a man to lose his self-discipline, is naive. Everybody has a breaking point. And just as some folks here take liberties behind anonymity, some fans do the same from behind the rail.
I hate to put it in this context, but, folks who have never endured the kind of “heckling” that crosses the line can’t really speak to defining the recipient’s appropriate reaction.
If Roger said the word “homo”, I have no problem with that.
If he used a different word, than I might be able to understand the outrage.
April 28th, 20119:55 am
one has to wonder if we would not be better off with Leo
How many years has he been out of baseball now? You’d think such a valuable pitching coach wouldn’t have to do morning drive radio for a living.
April 28th, 201110:00 am
Turn the other cheek? No freaking way – too often you get tagged there, too.
April 28th, 201110:03 am
The Dad was in the area with his two girls and yelled out to Roger that kids were there
I think they said the girls were both 9 years old. If they’re in public school what Roger said was nothing compaired to what they hear daily in school. Again Roger was wrong but he should only be fine and suspended then brought back to continue his fine work as piching coach!
April 28th, 201110:04 am
Unfortunately, when you’re dealing with matters like this, it doesn’t really matter what’s right and wrong. I work in engineering and my company gets pulled into lawsuits all the time. Something goes wrong on a project, and even though we had nothing to do with what went wrong, whoever is filing the lawsuit includes everyone that touched the project. Doesn’t matter who was wrong or who caused it, the least expensive thing to do is let our insurance pay out a settlement to make it go away. It would cost far more to fight it in court and prove we did nothing wrong.
This is the reality of this world. So my point is to say that Roger shouldn’t be fired for making the comments (assuming they’re true) may be valid from a logic standpoint since he really didn’t break any actual laws, but the reality is that this incident will cost the Braves in many ways (lost revenue from sponsors, costs associated with the lawyers and public relations needed to work through this, etc.). Sometimes those are the factors that drive decisions like this. Just the way things are.
That’s why lawyers that chase cameras and ambulances are, in my mind, some of the most costly and damaging people in our society. Some lawyers do good work protecting people, but largely it’s more about the settlement than upholding justice.
April 28th, 201110:05 am
“Unfortunately, in this world, the answer to that question is of no consequence. Fans can say anything short of a physical threat without consequence. If a player singled out a fan and sued them for whatever derogatory thing they said, it would be a PR nightmare for the organization. If a fan sued a player or coach for whatever derogatory thing they said, it would be a PR nightmare for the organization.”
– Lemke’s Knuckler
This is very true.
“What I’d like to know is where are the three guys he supposedly made the homophobic remarks to? They just don’t look as cute as little girls dressed all in pink? Just why aren’t they front and center?
I can see him getting ticked and yelling something to hecklers (yeah, I know, you can’t say anything anymore when someone pisses you off), but to wait four days and walk into the press conference with Lady Lawsuit demanding money? Smells a bit iffy to me.”
Lew, I’d just say: Follow the money. Trust me, Allred’s on the scene because there’s a payday somewhere. And she likes the earned media; beats running commercials.
Lemke’s Knuckler, thanks for that clarification. I completely misunderstood all of that when I read it the first time. I thought the father was the heckler.
April 28th, 201110:06 am
To heck with the McDowell discussion, since I read the blog in it’s entirety this morning, I have been “SHAKIN’”, snapping my fingers….
April 28th, 201110:07 am
Sorry, scoots, I disagree. In my opinion, there is nothing those fans could have said that warranted a response of homophobic remarks and obscene gestures with a bat in front of other fans. This isn’t a 20-something baseball player we are talking about here, this is a 50-something coach. As such, he should have had the maturity and good judgment to not bring dishonor on the organization he represented while visiting a rival team. If he has so little self-discipline, he should probably not be working in such a high profile occupation where he is expected to maintain a high level of professionalism.
April 28th, 201110:09 am
If I were looking to collect a quick buck for nothing, I’d call Allred too.
A good father takes his children out of that sort of situation and does not remain. How’s a pitching coach on the field of play going to physically threaten you when you are 10 rows away and walking in the other direction?
I want to hear from folks who were there before passing judgement.
April 28th, 201110:10 am
Everybody’s getting so caught up with the homophobic element of this incident.
That is VERY minor compared to the allegation that a MLB pitching coach THREATENED to knock a paying customer’s teeth out! In front of his nine-year-old daughters.
Good grief. How can any rational human being defend this? Or say people are being too sensitve?
If McDowell really did that, when all the guy was trying to do was remind the “professional” that kids were around and his actions were inappropriate, well, then he deserves ANY punishment he gets. Completely classless. And embarrassing.
I think Roger has done a fabulous job of bring an end to bullpen and batting order discussions.
April 28th, 201110:12 am
To be honest, right now it is only “he said…” Something happened, since an apology was offered, but at this point, who has corroborrated (sp) the claim?
April 28th, 201110:13 am
Poor SF fan got his wittly feelins hurt by Roger. Dude needs to grow a pair he should have ran onto the field and beat the hell out of Roger if he was offended. No need for all these apologies, sensitivity training and loss of jobs they should just solve the issue with violence it solves everything!!
April 28th, 201110:14 am
Chilidog, I want to be clear that I think both the homophobic remarks/obscene gestures and the threatening of the father with the bat are, separately, offenses that should result in his being fired, if proven true.
DS1- When I was doing art work for a radio station, I had a free ticket to see Eddie Money back inhis heyday. Dude rocked.
April 28th, 201110:15 am
I think you can probably kiss Roger goodbye.
The blog is turning into a “Law & Order, SUV” scene!
Don’t ya just love off days!
Later Braves fans…..
And the notion that lawyers have told McDowell not to speak is utter nonsense. There is no lawsuit (at this time) and no criminal investigation … so what would be the harm? If he, in fact, was innocent of most or all of this?
If the dad was just blndly making that accusation up or embellishing in anyway, McDowell would scream from the mountains that it was a lie. Just like we all would. The silence, so far, is pretty deafening. And damning.
April 28th, 201110:16 am
Wayne, I agree completely and have tried to qualify all my comments with something to the effect that all this is alleged, at this point. If this a all a farce, then Roger should sure everyone involved for defamation of character.
Before this is all over, I would like to know if Roger is indeed scared of gay people, humans or same. The term “homophobic” has been toss around quite a bit. Homo, from Latin, meaning Human. And phobic from the greek meaning fear. Human fear. Is this a natural state? Or are they both intended to be from the Greek, Homo meaning same, and phobic meaning fear.
sue, not sure
April 28th, 201110:17 am
And lastly, Gloria must be running out of things to do.
April 28th, 201110:18 am
“Something goes wrong on a project, and even though we had nothing to do with what went wrong, whoever is filing the lawsuit includes everyone that touched the project. Doesn’t matter who was wrong or who caused it, the least expensive thing to do is let our insurance pay out a settlement to make it go away. It would cost far more to fight it in court and prove we did nothing wrong.”
Litigation has long been about going after anyone or entity involved and especially going for deep pockets. There are also plenty of nuisance suits filed by cut-rate versions of Gloria Allred designed to win quick out-of-court settlements. Some trial attorneys make a fortunate this way.
Believe me, somewhere, somehow, Allred and whoever else involved in the McDowell controversy will want money. On the Q.T., the Braves will be writing checks.
As to terminating McDowell, I don’t know the terms of McDowell’s contract with the Braves. He could be dumped for reasonable cause. Even if facts bear out that he reacted only mildly to provocations, Braves’ management could let him go, citing anyone of a number of factors in terms of his harming the club, etc.
Yeah, maybe homophobic remarks isn’t appropriate. Gay slurs, maybe? Doesn’t really matter, if it happened, it’s wrong.
April 28th, 201110:19 am
Brava – Assuming, of course, that the allegations are real and actually happened as Gloria said they did? I’m still waiting for the people who supposedly instigated the situation and originally were slurred to make an appearance.
This all seems awfully opportunistic to me – especially since it took four days and engaging that particular lawyer before anything was even brought to the Braves’ attention.
Yes, you’re right – there’s no excuse for saying those things to a family and making any gestures with a potential weapon. There really hasn’t been any proof of what was said, nor has there been an admission that it was anything other than a response to a heckler. And then there’s the “fine” Allred wants imposed. The question is – who gets the “fine”.
Could be yet another case of “Show me the money”.
Brava, certainly your prerogative to think as you do. Though I would think that you would want to hear both sides of the story, before bringing in the verdict.
I wasn’t really addressing the McDowell situation, anyway (Braveheart summed up my sentiments on the matter with an overnight post that said it at least as well as I could have done). I was making the point that there’s just so much a man can stand before he has to stand up. Baseball, or life, either one.
April 28th, 201110:20 am
Since it won’t let me comment on Mark Bradley’s article, I’m over here. My mouth dropped open reading the AP article about Roger McDowell’s “antics” in SF. If these are true, he should be fired. I liked Roger always remembered him fondly from his pants on his head playing days but that behavior is absolutely unacceptable. And in front of kids! My kids go to more games that I do and they just love the whole experience, for him to say kids don’t belong at the ballpark lets me know there’s something wrong with this guy. Was he on drugs or something or is that just the real Roger? Either way, bye bye. Don’t care how good a coach you are, bring Leo back, I’d be thrilled with that and so would Leo.
Sidenote, great play from the Bravos lately! And I love Eddie Money….Sh Sh Sh Sh Sh shakin!!!! Hope Rossy gets a regular start now, let him be JJ’s catcher. Glad the team is coming home.
April 28th, 201110:21 am
I don’t see the homophobic (if that’s really what you would call it) remark or the gesture would have cost him his job and nor should it. But if he did threaten the father and responded in the matter in which he’s being accused after the father brought it to his attention that there were children in the area, then yes he probably should be let go.
April 28th, 201110:22 am
Transplant – I’d rather not kiss him goodbye – I might have homophobic remarks yelled at me if I did.
April 28th, 201110:23 am
“If the dad was just blndly making that accusation up or embellishing in anyway, McDowell would scream from the mountains that it was a lie. Just like we all would. The silence, so far, is pretty deafening. And damning.”
Nope, not so. Braves’ management and lawyers are in the driver’s seat, not McDowell. McDowell has very likely been instructed to keep quiet, the inference being that if he doesn’t, he’s toast.
And just because a suit hasn’t been filed doesn’t mean one won’t. Any lawyer for McDowell worth his salt is telling McDowell not to say or do anything that can fuel a suit or be cited later if a suit is filed.
April 28th, 201110:26 am
Lew, I’d also like to hear from the three hecklers. I’m curious about what was said to set off this unfortunate chain of events.
I can’t speak to Allred’s motives yet, as she doesn’t yet seem to be seeking compensation for her clients. Of course, knowing her past, that could very quickly change.
Lew, it’s funny how they can turn what he said into a phobia. I doubt those guys even batted an eye over it, it was probably just a lot of back and forth going on. I’d imagine the guys were excited that they had actually gotten his attention and had him engage with them in the heckling.
Anyone here get San Francisco TV stations? I’d like to know if there were reports of this on Saturday or Sunday or it was just released yesterday.
April 28th, 201110:27 am
Seems to me that if it really happened – especially as described in that contrived press conference -, it would have been immediately picked up by local – if not national – news services.
What does it matter what Gloria’s intentions are?
For us, as Braves fans?
The only thing that matters is if our pitching coach acted like a 12-year-old bully and threatened to knock out the teeth of a dad … the circus-like aftermath of said incident is almost completely irrelevant.
Whether they sue? Whether they don’t. Who cares? It’s not YOUR money.
The only thing that should matter is whether it is true or not.
April 28th, 201110:30 am
“I can’t speak to Allred’s motives yet, as she doesn’t yet seem to be seeking compensation for her clients. Of course, knowing her past, that could very quickly change.”
Allred’s history indicates that she has motives – likely on many levels. She’s a pretty clever shyster.
April 28th, 201110:33 am
There was an incident at Spring TRaining in 08 that The Grinch and I were witeness to – in fact we were sitting right next to the obnoxious a holes that were doing the heckling. It was a group of Mets fans who were also autograph brokers. They got pissed because Bobby wouldn’t come sign at that particuar moment (he always signed plenty on a daily basis and would later that day, as well). and they were abusively vocal about it to the point where I had to hold Grinch back.
It was so bad that I saw Chipper and several others looking like they were about to come over and take issues with them.
Now nothing happened this time and Bobby just told them he had a job to do – but it does show that there are times when it’s the fans being abusive in an extremely profane and vitriolic manner.
Honestly, I’m shocked that this type of situation doesn’t happen more often. As for Roger’ comments? At least he didn’t wing a baseball at the fan like Albert Belle did.
April 28th, 201110:34 am
“Nope, not so. Braves’ management and lawyers are in the driver’s seat, not McDowell. McDowell has very likely been instructed to keep quiet, the inference being that if he doesn’t, he’s toast.
“And just because a suit hasn’t been filed doesn’t mean one won’t. Any lawyer for McDowell worth his salt is telling McDowell not to say or do anything that can fuel a suit or be cited later if a suit is filed.”
Utter nonsense. If McDowell didn’t do it, then he has ABSOLUTELY nothing to worry about in a future lawsuit. He denies, denies, denies. Any any lawyer worth his salt would say the exact same thing.
If McDowell did do it, then yeah he’s probably been instructed to keep quiet. That makes sense. If he didn’t do it, not only would the Braves tell him he should deny the allegations they would hold a f’n press conference to make sure he told the world he was innocent.
To think otherwise is just ridiculous.
McDowell and the Braves would have absolutely NOTHING to gain from staying quiet.
Yeah, maybe homophobic remarks isn’t appropriate. Gay slurs, maybe? Doesn’t really matter, if it happened, it’s wrong.
I think if people are offended by Gay slurs or Homophobic remarks then they should go to de-sensitive training and get over it. It’s going to happen no matter how many lawsuits or how many people get fired for making remarks it’s always going to happen some people just aren’t comfortable around it and some of those people just don’t know how to bit their tongue. So maybe society should just learn to deal with it.
But what do I know I was de-sensitized long ago there isn’t much that offends me!!
Wonder whats going to happen to McDowell, if anything. You dont think the Braves would fire him do you? I mean, its one thing when a player runs their mouth, you can trade or suspend them, but its another when a coach on the staff does it, and in such a rude manner. That has to be grounds for termination, dont you think?
Who would they replace him with? Dave Wallace??
April 28th, 201110:35 am
chilidog – Her intentions matter, because she has a way of blowing situations way out of proportion to up the payday for her clients and to give credence to her cause du jour. That’s why.
April 28th, 201110:37 am
As a matter of fact, why would someone even engage her services if all they wanted were an apology? Answer is that you bring in GLoria to pump the money and for no other reason.
The four day lag could well be a rehearsal session to get all of their stories straight – bet that Mom and the girls had a trip to the salon, as well.
I just don’t trust anything she has a hand in.
April 28th, 201110:38 am
Roger Mcdowell vs. Golddust. BOOK IT!
April 28th, 201110:39 am
gloria Allred is the lionel hutz of female lawyers!
Lew, I’d say that 99% of these controversies start because of “fan” incitements. Today, players and coaches have to 1) take a lot of abuse and 2) learn to ignore it and walk away. As McDowell can attest, there’s little upside to any response to provocations from the stands.
April 28th, 201110:40 am
chilidog – Yeah nothing at all for Roger to worry about. No one has ever been falsely accused of something or had what he DID do trumped up to make it look worse. Yeah – no chance of THAT happening. We never react precipitously in this country, do we?
But whether the family ends up getting paid or not is irrelevant. What is relevant, for us and for the Braves organization and for Selig … is if it’s true or not. That’s it.
Everything else, from the Gloria sideshow to any potential lawsuit, is secondary.
It is kind of funny that McDowell is being called a “homophobe” (by Mark Bradley and others).
If there is “nothing wrong” with being a homosexual, then why is it wrong to ask someone if they are? What if McDowell had asked this guy if he was married to his wife? Would that have been wrong? What if there had been an openly polygamist family there? Would it have been wrong for McDowell to ask the man if he had two wives?
Yes, the comments cross the line, mainly because they are of a sexual nature, and the gesture with the bat is sick, especially in public, out on a baseball field (or in the bullpen). But, if these guys were gay, and proud of it, then why the outrage about McDowell asking them if they were gay?
Here is his alleged quote: “Are you guys a homo couple or a threesome?”
That is not homophobic. Especially not in light of all the efforts that are made by so many in our society to make us believe that just about every choice in this area is OK. (Not my beliefs, just what is being purveyed by our society).
The real issue is that McDowell then gets into it with a family, who is now pushing the issue. So GLAAD is more than HAPPY to get involved (they are attention grabbers, just like Allred) and stir up controversy.
But, as tacky as McDowell’s comments to the first duo/trio may have been, to jump on them and call them homophobic is very short-sighted and ill thought out.
April 28th, 201110:41 am
LEW- you sir are correct. The family is looking to hit da pay window. If they were really upset and wanted just an apology they’d write a letter to MLB or the Braves or try to contact them directly someway.
What’s amazing about Allred is she’s claiming a phobia in this instances and when you look at her past and background she’s a staunch male hater. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
April 28th, 201110:42 am
“chilidog – Yeah nothing at all for Roger to worry about. No one has ever been falsely accused of something or had what he DID do trumped up to make it look worse. Yeah – no chance of THAT happening. We never react precipitously in this country, do we?”
Have no idea what point you’re trying to make and it how it pertains to anything I’ve typed.
April 28th, 201110:45 am
Roger Mcdowell vs. Golddust. BOOK IT!
When Wrestle Mania 28 or Backlash? Holy crap Dustin Rhodes will kill Roger!!
April 28th, 201110:46 am
April 28th, 2011
Chip Carey has grown on me a little, but I can’t believe anyone would prefer him over Sutton.
I’ll take Powell by himself over any broadcaster we have!!
And Powell over all three.
chili – I love that comment “its not your money” exactly whose money is it?
If there is a settlement it will likely be paid by an insurance company. the premiums paid to that insurance company will be paid by the Braves & or MLB. So if you spend money on baseball part of that money will come from your pocket.
Is everyone accounted for after those storms yesterday? Crazy, scary stuff. I just read that the death toll is up over 200 now.
As for this Roger McDowell business, regardless of what happened he’s now in the media crosshairs and there’s the potential for this to turn into a very distracting issue for the team.
Whether he did it or not, if this starts affecting the team’s performance they’re going to have to make a change. Either putting him on suspension until things calm down or getting rid of him or sending him elsewhere within the organization.
I don’t know much about the guy, and from what I’ve read he seems to have the respect of the players and other coaches…. but they can’t let something stupid like this affect the season. I’d hate to see him go, but I’d hate to see the Braves distracted and losing even more.
April 28th, 201110:47 am
What would Frank, Deano and Sammy say about this?????
i wonder if d-ross has two tickets to paradise for himself and O.
April 28th, 201110:48 am
chilidog – The money is irrelevant? Not so – it may well be the reason for the entire situation and it would certainly point to the motivationm for this entire situation. I’m still bothered that we haven’t heard from thos who were supposedly slurred to begin with.
As for IF he did it – yeah, IF he did what they claimed in the wway they claim, threatening anyone with a bat is inexcusable and should be dealt with. However, short of having a cell phone video, I just don’t see how it can be proven. As for the comments? Fine him and give it to a charity and let the situation drop.
Maybe you can’t yell fire in a crowded theater, but last I heard, we have freedom of speech guaranteed by our constitution and last I heard, names don’t hurt like sticks and baseball bats. Same he’s insensitive – send him to a sensitivity training course. It ain;’t a firing offense.
April 28th, 201110:49 am
AT – Checked Sportsline? The rich are getting richer, aka, my lead is getting bigger and bigger. 65.6 to 50.5!
I’m still worried about RG & soph – jeffrey d have you heard from them?
April 28th, 201110:50 am
tiger297 … Ha. I hope you didn’t injure yourself with that big of a stretch.
Ok then. I bought the MLB package. So out of the 180 dollars i paid for it, I’m thinking about 1/10 of 1 cent will go to some yet-to-be determined settlement. Damn you Roger! I’ve got kids to feed!
billy jack – I’m coming to see your for lunch today.
Murph, I’m with you.. I’d hate to see him go but if this could potentially cost us this season then I hope they make a move.
April 28th, 201110:52 am
Unfortunately, if there is any truth to the allegations at all, I think McDowell’s days with the Braves are numbered. If for no other reason, it would be because this is going to be a distraction, and the Braves organization has generally, for better or worse, doesn’t put up with these sorts of distractions. I’m not saying I agree or disagree; just saying that’s probably the case. Sad situation for all involved.
April 28th, 201110:55 am
Talk about a fall from graces.. I’m bearly in the top 5 now.
April 28th, 201110:56 am
Lew, even if you disagree that slurs and yelling aren’t a fire-able offense (Believe me. I sympathize with this for the exact same reasons you do: Free speech.) I think you have to acknowledge threatening to knock the teeth out of a fan, no matter what the fan said, if that is indeed what he did, is a fire-able offense.
April 28th, 201110:57 am
Lew. That’s sort of my point.
If the family’s motives are purely money-driven and most or all of this was conjured out of thin air, then that will be proven soon enough. But IF McDowell did what he is alleged to do, and it is proven to be true, then everything else is secondary. Don’t you agree? How could you not agree? Whether the dad gets paid or gets an apology or the two girls get teddy bears — who cares? It’s not relevant to us. The ONLY thing that’s relevant to us is that we’ll most likely be looking for a new pitching coach.
And I’m not sure why you’re bothered about the other three guys. They aren’t suing McDowell. They aren’t asking for an apology. For all we know, they were laughing at the stupid bat-humping McDowell was allegedly doing. And for the record, I don’t think the gay slurs are fireable. I think the threat, if he made one, is what will do him in.
April 28th, 201110:58 am
Hey, I found a post of Shaun’s I agree with!! Totally agree Shaun.
April 28th, 201110:59 am
I’d hate to see him go but if this could potentially cost us this season then I hope they make a move–Ark
How could this cost us the season? I don’t see Chipper standing at the plate with a 3-2 count in the bottom of the 9th worrying about what’s going to happen to Roger. I think a true pro can over look these sorts of things. Hell, what ever it was Roger did say I bet most of the guys in the clubhouse have wanted to say the same thing to a fan at some point in their careers. I don’t think it’ll be a distraction.
April 28th, 201111:02 am
chilidog-sorry,you’re missing my point. Not surprised, but sorry.
The point is nothing has been proved and you ( as well as others) seem to be jumping to conclusions before facts are in. All you have is one side of a supposed story, coming from one of the most monumentally unreliable and self serving legal representatives there is.
April 28th, 201111:04 am
I think firing someone and using the distraction excuse is just that an excuse. I call BS to most firings that are to prevent distractions. If they fire Roger its not to prevent distractions it’s to prevent corporations from pulling their sponsor. That’s the truth!!
Dude – I said if he was guilty of brandishing a baseball bat then he has to pay the price, but if it was just insensitive remarks, then he should pay a fine and take a class.
April 28th, 201111:05 am
Shaun… Could well be true that the Braves will cut McDowell loose because the organization has never liked controversy. Reasonable cause is a fairly broad area to find grounds for dismissal.
April 28th, 201111:06 am
CraZy, it’s not about worrying about Roger it’s about the constant media exposure, potential protests and things of that sort. So pretty much the constant annoyances of the “circus” that would follow.
Believe me. I sympathize with this for the exact same reasons you do: Free speech.
I dont think you have quite got the right meaning of that. It doesnt mean “No consequences”.
April 28th, 201111:08 am
then he should pay a fine and take a class. – Lew
Personally, I think this would actually be too much of a price. I think the apology and a seat down reprimand by the organization should be enough.
Dammit, why couldn’t it have been TP out there getting heckled instead of Roger??? Oh, yeah, he was probably asleep in clubhouse.
I’m sure you’re quite used to not being understood. So I’m glad you’re not surprised.
I’m not jumping to any conclusions. It’s why I consistently use the word “if.” Look it up, it’s in the dictionary. Right in between idiot and ignoramus.
April 28th, 201111:09 am
If they fire Roger its not to prevent distractions it’s to prevent corporations from pulling their sponsor. That’s the truth!!
It could also be so that they can continue to sell their business as a family entertainment event. And to maintain a certain uniform code for handling of such situations.
Right or wrong, in today’s media frenzy climate, McDowell will most likely be fired. It doesn’t matter if he’s guilty at this point. An overblown acccusation is all it takes these days. That said, Dave Wallace would be a good replacement, even if it’s just for the rest of the season. Also, I don’t worry too much about this being a distraction on the field. The Dodgers are in a much worse situation, and they seem to be doing ok.
chili – Do you really want to go that route?
April 28th, 201111:10 am
Lew, even if you disagree that slurs and yelling aren’t a fire-able offense (Believe me. I sympathize with this for the exact same reasons you do: Free speech.)
I don’t much care to wade into this, but the free speech argument will get you nowhere. The Braves are not a government threatening to, or jailing someone for stating an opinion, simply mouthing off stupid. They are a business that can, and will, fire your ass for damaging their product with your mouth.
At least you know how to spell. I’m impressed.
April 28th, 201111:11 am
Lew … Ha. No. Not really.
You insult me. I insult back.
Now we can move on.
April 28th, 201111:12 am
Arkansas Transplant… I think your 11:08 is correct. What is it with this sensitivity training nonsense? Sorry, Lew, but I think we’ve gone overboard on this feelings stuff.
BravesQueen, April 28th, 2011, 9:52 am … “In this day and age of technology and the usually immediate appearance of video’s taken when something like this happens, I find it very odd that NO ONE in that SF stadium didn’t catch this on a smartphone or other device…”
This is almost certainly why Allred called the presser. To encourage folks with video of the incident to come forward so that she will have the actual smoking gun that will get her a fee.
BravesQueen, April 28th, 2011, 9:52 am … “where is the proof? I’m not saying the family HAS to prove it happened.”
Yes. They do. Family is making serious accusation, perhaps with criminal consequences. The burden of proof falls on the accuser, not the accused.
April 28th, 201111:15 am
The fact that Roger already issued an apology tells you that there is some truth to the accusations. So there’s strike 1.
The fact that he was in gay-friendly San Francisco, probably the hub of the world’s pro-gay movement, and chose to reply to hecklers with a gay slur… strike 2.
If he indeed threatened someone with a bat, regardless of whether it was a heckler or someone trying to calm the situation down… strike 3. He’s out.
I don’t see this ending well for Roger.
April 28th, 201111:16 am
On a totally different topic – Has anyone heard from RHR or any of the other Bama or Tennessee residents?
JeffR – Yeah, it has gone overboard, but has become an almost mandatory way of proving the situation has been dealt with.
Just got back from church, working to get relief supplies to tornado stricken areas. I see the blog hasn’t changed topics since I read the overnights earlier.
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