12:48 pm February 28, 2011, by Carroll Rogers
February 28th, 20113:13 pm
Happy for Nate.
February 28th, 20113:14 pm
old fashioned nwa style beat down by los bravos today
But don’t let the facts get in your guys’ way.
You can’t claim that trading Escobar magically made the Braves a better team when, in fact, they were worse without him. You can argue all day long that they won before the trade in spite of him, but the facts prove your original claim wrong.
P-Town Brave ©
February 28th, 20113:15 pm
I would have to think that Lucas is the leader in the clubhouse right now for the backup IF job…
Granted its early but he already has 2 RBI and a couple hits…
February 28th, 20113:16 pm
Varvarro strikes out the nameless Astro to end the inning with no damage.
that a boy
looks like nate was more productive today than he was all of last year’s spring training. hopefully that’s a sign of things to come.
I was going to pick Utley for Home Run Durby this year….. Now I wiil Pick Hamilton from the Rangers…… Utley is a good player, and last year the injuries hit him…..
February 28th, 20113:17 pm
Little early don’t you think?
February 28th, 20113:18 pm
The Braves had a better record before Escobar was traded in spite of his effort. Not BECAUSE of his effort.
Thus my statement N8. I wasn’t attributing our first half success to Escobar or our second half struggles to Gonzo. I said to quote myself, “Not that it has anything to do with just Yunel but we were actually a better team in terms of results before the all-star break when we had a 52-36 record, we went 39-35 after the break for various reasons. This is a team game and its hard to attribute overall success or failure to the addition or subtraction of one player. So for accuracy sake the TEAM was playing better in the first half than the TEAM played in the second half.”
My point was to suggest that last year our success overall first half and second half was more contingent on the team as a whole than our swap of shortstops. It was you that seemed to want to pin our success or failure on Escobar and that trade. Was simply pointing out the facts as they really were. Also not sure where you’re getting your before and after numbers from, we traded Escobar during the break and we went into the break with a 52-36 record and the second half our record was 39-35.
RG’s favorite shortstop, the Sea Bass, leads off the bottom of the sixth.
February 28th, 20113:19 pm
“Escobar never disappointed the past 3-4 years” = opinion.
Nothing more, nothing less
McFann Ô Ô
February 28th, 20113:20 pm
Wow! This has been an exciting game! Was following on my iTouch at work, but was “out of touch” during the last couple innings…12-3 now, eh?
abwright McCann pops up on the in-field. I can hear McFann cursing from here.
Hahahaha! Nah, it’s fine…he’s had a good day today! Can’t complain. ……OK, if it was the regular season I might just a little, but in Spring Training it’s fine.
He and Jordan Schafer worked out together this winter in Orlando with Tom Shaw, Schafer said, a trainer who works out football players
Bad memories re-surface from the last time a Braves outfielder worked out with a Football trainer…
A-gon gets a base hit to lead off the inning. He is replaced by a pinch runner.
A-gon is the last of the starters to take a seat. Bring on the scrubs.
February 28th, 20113:22 pm
robbie, I noticed you don’t answer me when I ask you a serious question about why you post here.
Obviously you are no Braves fan. I guess since you choose not to answer that my assumption was correct, that you are a troll here merely to stir up hatred. That is the only conclusion with the facts as presented.
Therefore, you will join fishy bishy in the land of the ignored. You are not worth a response if you are only coming here to spout junk and do nothing but bash the Braves.
buh bye, have a nice day
McFann Ô Ô, February 28th, 2011, 3:20 pm … “Hahahaha! Nah, it’s fine…he’s had a good day today!
You must be mellowing out! Last year, any scoring opportunity that McCann makes an infield fly or strike out instead of a double brought a comment. (Maybe not a curse … )
February 28th, 20113:23 pm
A scrub flied out for out number one.
I was going to pick Utley for Home Run Durby this year….. Now I wiil Pick Hamilton from the Rangers……
I might be a little late in asking, but whom do you like for the Oscars in 2012?
Double play ends the inning.
Top of the seventh up-coming. Braves 12, Astros 3
February 28th, 20113:24 pm
I’m not mellowing yet! Just saving all that for when the games and stats matter!
Escobar was lazy, and had a cocky attitude, and he wasn’t a team player……We have a good ss right now. Who hits for better power. Gonzalez….. Well you all be cool, and have a great one today……I’m impressed with the offense the Braves have……..Peace all, and talk later tonight……”Go!!! Braves!!!.”
Shut the F up, Donny!
He never smiles, so he shouldn’t play for the Braves. It’s a rule that’s been written down…somewhere.
February 28th, 20113:25 pm
Finding free stations over the radio is so much easier during the regular season. I have about 15 stations from the Braves family of stations programmed into my favorites list on OOToones on my IPHONE. There is always one who screws up and streams the game.
February 28th, 20113:26 pm
Oh, and a K could possibly bring a cuss…whether or not I’ll say it out loud is entirely based on how crucial the situation will be…
Snotboogie: I’ll get back to that on the Oscars tonight. Have to think about that one peace ……Talk tonight friends…..
McFann … “saving it up for the regular season” == “mellowing out” <g>
For me, as well. As long as they were working on speed and agility – stuff of that ilk – maybe it isn’t so bad…right?
So is BMac out of the game now? Spring Training Gameday stinks…
February 28th, 20113:27 pm
Heyward the only Braves’ hitter without a hit today…wasn’t expecting that.
February 28th, 20113:28 pm
Abreu comes in to pitch for the Braves. Gets the first out.
Ward I like you buddy but sometimes you throw comments out of nowhere. Thoughts about a home run derby in the spring…gotta love it.
You’re not digging deep enough. It’s not that cut and dried.
Before the trade the Braves scored 374 runs in 79 games (4.73 RPG).
After the trade the Braves scored 364 runs in 83 games (4.38 RPG).
So again, on the surface the Braves scored more runs per game before the trade than they did after. But NONE of that had anything to do with Yunel.
Before the trade, Yunel had 45 hits, 35 BB, and 1 HBP (on base 71 times in 66 games played), with 0 HR, 18 RBI and 26 runs scored.
Forget what Alex did in Toronto compared to what Alex did as a Brave. Compare what Alex did as a Brave to what Yunel did for the Braves before the trade.
After the trade, Alex had 72 hits, 16 BB, 1 HBP (on base 89 times in 81 games), with 9 HR, 48 RBI and 32 runs scored.
The “dip” in the Braves offense had more to do with Glaus cooling off than it did with losing Yunel.
Before the trade in 69 games played, Glaus had 71 hits, 45 BB, 2 HBP, 14 HR and 46 RBI.
After the trade in 49 games played, Glaus had 32 hits, 18 BB, 2 HBP, 2 HR and 15 RBI.
Again, blame the loss of runs per game on Yunel’s departure all you want. But the facts point out that despite Gonzalez’s production not being what it was in Toronto before the trade, hes was double the run producer that Yunel was before the trade.
Without the black hole in the offense that Yunel was before the trade, the offense was deeper and more balanced in it’s production.
February 28th, 20113:29 pm
Base hit past Conrad at 2B. Sounds like Conrad made a good effort.
Was I bad in Spring Training last year?
Last year he hit .500 in ST and had a “down year”…in 2006 he hit .220 in ST and his Regular Season was superb…I cann do math!
February 28th, 20113:30 pm
What inning is it?
baxter my little gentleman
our offense and pitching should be fun to watch this yr but our defense is going to be junk again…oh well, cant be perfect
7th i think
February 28th, 20113:31 pm
The most “interesting” man in the world.
He can answer a Y/N question in a 1000 words.
Corky Miller's Beer Gut
someone should step up and be a play by play guy here….
February 28th, 20113:32 pm
Nate already has more hits and walks than last spring?
Double play ends the inning. Braves 12, Astros 3. Bottom of the seventh is up.
McFann, I’ve been complaining about GameDay since about the 3rd inning.
February 28th, 20113:33 pm
Escobar trade talks
Hey here’s something just as relevant as the Yunel trade lets talk about crappy return we got in the 1990 Dale Murphy trade!!
Jeff Parret, Victor Rosario and Tommy Greene damn-it Bobby you were an idiot of a GM!!!
Gameday still at top of 6th. Thanks for the update, abwright!
abwright,thanks for play by play.
February 28th, 20113:35 pm
Wilkin Ramirez leads off the inning with a triple off the glove of the CF.
February 28th, 20113:36 pm
Thank you, N8. I threw up a little bit in my mouth at the suggestions that Yunel made the Braves a better team in the first half of last season. I can understand liking a player, but making stuff up to justify it…
February 28th, 20113:37 pm
“Also not sure where you’re getting your before and after numbers from, we traded Escobar during the break and we went into the break with a 52-36 record and the second half our record was 39-35.” Jake W.
Sorry. Looked at the date of the trade wrong on Yunel’s game log on baseball reference’s site. I thought it was June 30’s. It was July 11th. So all of my numbers given are up to June 30th only.
But to clarify and “update” the numbers, in 9 games played in July, Escobar had 1 RBI and scored 2 runs. If anything, that continues to back up the theory that his production did nothing to help the Braves go 6-3 in those 9 July games he played in.
But I apologize for being wrong. But the bottom line is that we’re both right.
You are correct in that the team effort and the other 24 players on the 25 man roster contributed to the better record before the trade. But at the same time, I’m correct. While the overall numbers (offensively – runs per game) were better with Escobar…… it had very little to do with his contributions.
I stand by my theory that for the first half of 2011, Escobar’s bat killed many more rallies than it helped extend. Just the same that Kawakami had very little to do with our pitching staffs being one of the better staffs in the NL last year.
February 28th, 20113:38 pm
I understand completely what you’re arguing. I was merely pointing out that the loss of Escobar/gain of Gonzalez probably had little effect on the results, yet you claimed the Braves were better after the trade. Any supposed upgrade offensively that Gonzalez provided last year was too minute to make up for the lost defense. Also, Escobar’s OBP was significantly higher than Gonzalez’s last year. It’s not as cut and dried as you’re trying to make it out to be.
“Can’t stand ya” makes an out, but Clevlen’s ground out brings in the 13th run.
February 28th, 20113:39 pm
Castillo strikes out to end the seventh. Braves 13, Astros 3.
Yeah, thanks for the play-by-play!
It seemed to be working fine for me on my iTouch at work, but now? Eesh…no movement.
February 28th, 20113:40 pm
I’m leaving work in 5. I might actually get to listen to the last innign on XM MLB channel. My system is already tuned to it.
Gonzalez’s Braves line of .240/.291/.386 is what provides balance?
February 28th, 20113:41 pm
Oberholtzer in to pitch for the Braves.
McFann, I’ve closed it, refreshed it, you name it, and it sticks at top of 6th. I gave up on it.
I threw up a little bit in my mouth at the suggestions that Yunel made the Braves a better team in the first half of last season. I can understand liking a player, but making stuff up to justify it…
Can’t say that I saw what stemmed N8’s original response, but that’s a two-way street you’re talking about…
The most “interesting” man in the world.
He can answer a Y/N question in a 1000 words.” snot
I’ve also won the lifetime achievment award….. twice.
February 28th, 20113:42 pm
Fly ball out to start the inning.
Great job abwright
Bye, ya’ll. See you on the flip side
February 28th, 20113:43 pm
Grounder to Brooksie yields the second out.
So, McFann, if he gets a hit are you going to boo him?
I’ve also won the lifetime achievment award….. twice
Retired the trophy, bro, LOL.
February 28th, 20113:44 pm
Anybody know who’s catching?
Fly ball out for the third out closes out the inning.
Nice lineup, Fredi G., nice lineup.
Cruisin right along today aren’t we…
I only wish my work day was going this well…
February 28th, 20113:45 pm
Gonzalez’s Braves line of .240/.291/.386 is what provides balance? – Roman Gal
Compared to .238/.284/.334? Yes.
Who is Wilkin Castillo
Well, I’m not gonna go that far…
February 28th, 20113:46 pm
People, just stop it with the Gonzo comments…its THREE days into ST!
Ya’ll, since I’ve got my iPhone on our wireless network and the MLB app, I’m happy (as much as I can while editing this book chapter) to give a PBP. I remember when I was “Game-day’d” how much I appreciated other folks doing likewise. Consider it my pay-back for all the great stuff that this blog brings to me.
Thanks for the committed P-B-P abwright.
February 28th, 20113:47 pm
Uh…IDK…somebody in the Braves’ minor league system?
Conrad, M. Jones, Pastornicky for the Braves in the eighth.
Compared to .238/.284/.334? Yes.
FYI, those are out of order.
“Gonzalez’s Braves line of .240/.291/.386 is what provides balance?” RG
Nope. I’m going with the 6 HR and 38 RBI in 72 games vs. Yunel’s, 0 HR and 19 RBI in 75 games.
Or if you want to nitpick, Gonzo’s “Braves” production in 72 games was better than Yunel’s production in all 135 games he played last year combined between Atlanta and Toronto…. 4 HR and 35 RBI.
Keep denying if it makes you feel better. I’m sure you can find a 1 or 2 month stretch in the past few years where Escobar was better than Alex.
Also, since you brought up the line, Yunel’s line before the trade was:
238/.334/.284/.618 (meaning that Alex’s .677 OPS, while still pretty weak, was STILL better than Yunel’s was).
Gil In Mechanicsville
Uh, guys… the argument over the merits of Escobar pre and post trade is really pretty irrelevant. That dog “just don’t hunt” anymore. Better to spend time speculating if the Braves will make a trade for a new shortstop next season or try to promote from within. PS… Don’t count on Liberty to go crazy with payroll to make a splash either.
February 28th, 20113:48 pm
Um, guess you should get a smartphone…
While the overall numbers (offensively – runs per game) were better with Escobar…… it had very little to do with his contributions.
I stand by my theory that for the first half of 2011, Escobar’s bat killed many more rallies than it helped extend.
And i’ll stand by this theory. None of our shortstops contributed much offensively, at least not in what the braves expected going into the season from that position but they both brought their gloves.
To sum it up, Escobar, huge disappointment in 2010, Gonzo slight upgrade offensively over the struggling Escobar(biggest improvement apparently in the locker room), but both played solid D with Escobar probably being slightly better in that department.Thats about it to me. Nothing more, nothing less.
Brooksie strikes out to start the eighth.
I was answering your question to who is catching…
February 28th, 20113:49 pm
People, just stop it with the Gonzo comments…
I told myself I was going to not hate him this year, but when people start bashing Escobar to put Gonzalez on a pedestal, it makes that resolution harder than it needs to be.
Anyone wants to complain, maybe they should discuss how bad Conrad has looked 3 days into ST…
Like I said, right now I think Lucas is the front runner there…
February 28th, 20113:50 pm
Mycal Jones walks.
February 28th, 20113:51 pm
February 28th, 20113:52 pm
Pastornicky flies out.
I go away for a couple of months, and you people are STILL talking about the Yunel trade?!?!? It happened. Move on.
You’re missing the point. I never said Escobar was anywhere close to good last year. Neither of them were, that’s the point. The last thing I’ll say about this – Gonzalez didn’t make the Braves better last year. He didn’t really seem to matter either way.
February 28th, 20113:53 pm
I’m not certain that anyone was really putting Gonzo on a pedestal so to speak, but to say Escobar was so amazing (or at least thats how a couple put it) is absolutely asinine!
Besides, the reason he is gone had much more to do w/ his great *ahem* attitude and not as much his play…his play just so happened make the trade much easier for the FO…
But like I said before…whats it matter now, he’s gone?!
Thats like talking about that guy that dropped that popup against Philly that cost us…
Are we STILL arguing Yunel vs. AG??? REALLY??? Yunel supporter’s arguments fail to hold water. Furthermore, that trade was about a lot more then pure talent (perceived or otherwise). Finally, it’s way over, and that horse hase been beaten into oblivion. What’s the point??
BTW, do you think that the worse record after the trade may have more to do with the injuries (Chipper, Medlen, Wagner, Saito, Prado, etc. etc.) than whatever the irrelivent Yunel did/didn’t/would/wouldn’t do in the first half, last half or all year?
February 28th, 20113:54 pm
Bowman strikes out looking to end the eighth.
“I told myself I was going to not hate him this year, but when people start bashing Escobar to put Gonzalez on a pedestal, it makes that resolution harder than it needs to be.” RG
I’m not bashing Yunel to put Alex on a pedestal. I’m bashing him because for 3 months last year, Yunel put up Rafael Belliard type numbers at the plate and obviously his GM and the HOF manager (who everybody puts on a pedestal), didn’t want the guy around anymore.
Not sure about you’re neck of the woods. But where I’m from 2+2=4.
NOBODY was a bigger supporter of Yunel’s than me going into last year. I expected big things from him and BEGGED for him to be the leadoff hitter based on his success there in the past.
But he flat out sucked last year before the trade. NOBODY can deny that.
I hope he has a monster year for Toronto. Kid has a ton of skills. Take this for what it’s worth from a guy who wasn’t a big Bobby supporter. I’ve always considered Bobby’s biggest fault to be his loyalty.
Bottom line is that if you are a big enough jackass to manage to get yourself in the doghouse of one of the alleged “easiest” players managers to play for? Your problems go way beyond your onfield production. So for that alone, I’m not sad to see him playing in Toronto instead of Atlanta.
February 28th, 20113:55 pm
Nate McLouth: “My first hit was a bloop hit but at least it didn’t take me nine games to get it.”
February 28th, 20113:56 pm
People telling me to let something obviously don’t know me very well. That junk plays right into my stubbornness. Nice try, though.
If The Dipper is batting 3rd come June 1st…the Braves will be in for a long, long year.
Roman Gal – AG in the locker room was a huge improvement (reference the teammate standing ovation when he showed up). That CLEARLY tips the scales in his favor in my mind.
We talk baseball, other sports, music, movies, BBQ and whatever (except politics or religion)
Atlanta Braves RSS feed
Previous entries »
Send a feedback technical issue
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution