6:26 pm November 16, 2010, by David O'Brien
November 17th, 20108:54 am
dpelfrey: It’s funny though. I’m still blown away that the Marlins agreed to this deal. Even if Uggla walks after the season. Wren Bought low and sold high with Infante and Dunn. This was a great deal for the Braves.
November 17th, 20108:55 am
Hey DOB. Ask Frank Wren about Andruw Jones back in CF.. I would love to see him back!! He is affordable! Also everyone understand the Braves definately have more money to spend but need some veteran relievers, and why max out at the beginning of season when in June and July the unspent money under the max allowed payroll would give the Braves the flexibility to go get a need..
November 17th, 20108:58 am
As with most here I like this trade. I will like it a lot more if we don’t give Uggla a ridiculous 5 year contract. A potential first round pick and a sandwich pick will have far more long term value than the disaster that years 4 and 5 are likely to be in a long term contract. Especially as he will eventually have to move from 2B because of his defense.
Infante had a career year, but either tired at the end with regular play, or the pitchers figured him out. His numbers in the last 6 weeks were underwhelming. Dunn would have been the 3rd lefty in the bullpen.
November 17th, 20109:00 am
Will the Braves please get some speed to go with all this power.
November 17th, 20109:01 am
DOB, not too many established veteran relievers are free agents (exceptions are Trevor Hoffman and Arthur Rhodes) and it seems less likely they’ll trade for a starting OF now (best FA options may be to bring back Andruw Jones or Willie Harris if the price is right). Honestly, I wouldn’t mind if they got Ankiel back (great defensively). Who do you think would be the best addition to the Braves bench (FA or trade)? Bullpen? Any possibility they could still work a trade for Ellsbury with a package of Vizcaino, Beachy, Diaz (or Schafer)?
November 17th, 20109:02 am
vmr: Yeah! Like BJ Upton?
November 17th, 20109:03 am
I love the trade. Now what about signing Andruw to be backup CF or to platoon there with McLouth? One of them could play some LF when Chipper gets hurt. Andruw hit 19 HR’s last year with .827 OPS in limited role, and only made a half million. Between Nate and Andruw surely one of them would step up.
November 17th, 20109:04 am
doggylike: I also noticed that huge jump in OPS vs. lefties in 2010, compared to previous two seasons for Uggla. Surprising thing to me was the previous two seasons, not 2010 (you’d expect him to have a significant advantage in OPS vs. lefties). Before 2010, last time he had better OPS vs. lefties than righties was 2007.
November 17th, 20109:07 am
And we aren’t trading for Upton or Ellsbury, or signing Crawford or Werth now people. This isn’t fantasy baseball. We have severe budget limitations, and a loaded farm system which we want to preserve, get over it and get used to it. Wren will only make small moves from here on out.
November 17th, 20109:08 am
Right on Chief
November 17th, 20109:09 am
Can anybody remember “Teixeira”? — GwinnettDad
I think everyone does. And it’s probably why most Braves fans are glad the Braves didn’t give up a bounty of top prospects this time around to get the big bat they needed. Instead, they gave up a veteran infielder coming off a career year and headed for free agency after 2011, and the third lefty in their bullpen.
Also all people in the ATL.. Listen to 680thefan @ 9:35am. Fredi G. is going to be on the show!!
November 17th, 20109:11 am
Who’s the backup SS?…I assume Prado helps at 1B, but what if Chipper is injured, Freeman doesn’t get a day off?… — JoJo
Braves hope that Mather nails down backup 1B job in spring training. Diory Hernandez could be backup SS, having strong winter-ball season after getting stroke back following shoulder surgery. But Braves are still trying to add to bench, nothing set in stone.
November 17th, 20109:15 am
We weakened our bench and strengthened our power and starters. Martin is an upgrade most anywhere but especially in our left field. The outfield still isn’t great, but our infield will hit well. Don’t understand all the hand-wringing–if you’re unhappy, at the end of 2011 let him walk and re-sign Omar. I predict we’ll be VERY happy. We had a great bench team last year, showing that you can’t get to the Series with the bench being your main strength. If Chipper, Mac, Heyward and Uggla play most of the year and our pitchers stay well, watch out Giants.
November 17th, 20109:19 am
It would be nice to upgrade in CF, or at the very least add some quality depth there. Chipper will miss some time, the only question is how much? So when you bring Prado in from LF to play 3B, or to play 1B for Freddie, or to play 2B for Uggla, the OF will be right back to where it was last year.
I had been against bringing Andruw back, and am still not crazy about the idea, but we need someone like him to platoon with Nate in CF or play CF when Nate shifts over to LF to fill in for Praco. It would be great if Schafer could bounce back and earn that role, but we can’t count on it. No more than we can count on Nate bouncing back. Maybe Wren could pry BJ or Ellsbury or someone else like that away for a similar package. I’d first see who gets non-tendered. The answer may present itself.
Is it time to DROP Terry Pendalton and REsign Glenn Hubbard? Hubbard’s work ethics and his teaching mechanics on Marcus Giles, Kelly Johnson and Martin Prado…defensively there was never a problem. Now Mr. Uggla is on board, is it time to bring back Glenn Hubbard?
November 17th, 20109:25 am
How bout a round of applause for DOB folks? Dude puts out a post @ 2am and then is back on the beat posting for us knuckleheads @ 730am. I know it’s his job, but this is why I follow this blog each and every day. Appreciate the work, Chief!
And my 2 cents…love this trade as well. Curiously, I haven’t seen anything from “Fire Frank Wren”
November 17th, 20109:28 am
Nooooooo. You don’t trade your best player (co-best with Prado). At least I don’t. And Uggla is a defensive liability at 2B; the Braves should work to improve defense first, hitting second. So I don’t like this move but thought they might try to move Infante for some reason. He didn’t get the love from the Braves that I thought he deserved. Also, Dunn is a potential star reliever. So I disagree with pundits who think the Braves got the better deal.
One other thing–the Braves track record for signing expensive players to long-term deals is terrible. So this may turn into a one-year rental player (Again!) in exchange for your best player (who could have been signed to a longer deal for much less than what Uggla will command) and a potential pitching star.
Not a good deal. In fact a terrrible one.
I’m not concerned about Prado playing LF. Hell, he can’t be any worse than Diaz and Hinske. I really wish the Braves could bite the bullet and get rid of McNothing and get a new center fielder.
Anyone hiring 1B coaches????
November 17th, 20109:30 am
DOB…I hope you, and those with like thoughts, are still this elated next October. I suppose I am one of the “ignorant 25%”, but I still don’t like the deal. My mind keeps going back to the 2008 All-Star game where Mr Uggla distinguished himself by going 0-4 at the plate (twice in crucial situations) and setting an All-Star game record for errors…three (3) in ONLY SEVEN CHANCES. It could have been worse had it not been for the official scorer’s generosity. And, he wants more than 14 million for 5 years to sign. Sounds like a good deal to me…why don’t we just go out and sign Manny.
November 17th, 20109:31 am
Now all the braves need is another arm in the bullpen, trade for B.j. Upton, and resign Hinske and nothing will stop them from being the world series champs!!! Go Bravos!!!
November 17th, 20109:32 am
You know what…this reminds me of the trade the Braves made last year with the Yankees which ironically included Mike Dunn.
The Braves needed payroll flexibility so they tried to trade Derek Lowe, but found no takers. So they were forced to move Javy Vasquez after a great season, and got Melky Cabrera and Mike Dunn.
The Braves got Uggla and the Marlins got Infante and Dunn.
The difference is that the Braves also got Arodys Vizcaino, who is really the valuable part of that trade. I’m shocked that Florida wasn’t able to get at least a prospect out of the deal.
November 17th, 20109:41 am
Hey dave thanks for the nuggets at 2am. Completely thrilled we landed this guy, uggggggla. Hes going to really help this team out driving in some runs, our middle of the line up is philliesqe. He seems to be an all or nothing sort of guy. Youd have to think a every so often stikeout with RISP is better than the ever giving 6 4 3’s weve been getting the last 2 1/2 seasons out of our RH bopper. Dont think well be meeting his contract demands but atleast we can enjoy it while it lasts
November 17th, 20109:45 am
Wendy…If you’re still hanging around, go back and read my earlier post. Nowhere in that post does it say, or imply, that I’m smarter because of my age. I was making the point that I’ve seen many of these deals before that did not work out like everyone thought. Anyone ever hear of “the next Henry Aaron” (AKA Brad Komminsk)? He spend most of two seasons (limited in two others) and hit a total of 12 home runs, with a batting average of .227 and below. In his 8 seasons in the bigs he hit 23 home runs and batted a whopping .218.
November 17th, 20109:48 am
Yeah Nashville let’s just keep the same team as last year and scramble again to make the wild card in the last day of the season.. If y’all love Infante that much go to Florida they have plenty of seats for u!!! Infante had 1 great year.. The previous 2 years he spent alot of time of the DL.. Plus did anyone of you see Infante in game 1 of NLDS when he cost us the game of his lack of ability to get a ground ball that he knows he should have made!! You can’t make errors if u can’t get to the ball!!!! That should have been an error but how the rule states it wasn’t!!!! Hey DOB did u ask Wren about Andruw Jones yet??
November 17th, 20109:51 am
I like this quote i found…
Uggla plays second base. He’s not great defensively, but as one scout said Tuesday, “He’s a Gold Glove second baseman — when he’s in the batter’s box.”
November 17th, 20109:57 am
This team lacks defense (terrible last year) and speed and this trade did not help either. What good is scoring 4 runs a game if the other team scores 5? Prado will probably end up at 3rd but he can’t replace Chipper’s defense. Uggla at 2nd will be a defensive downgrade and there is only one decent defensive player in the outfield (Hayward).
Great move! but now let’s concentrate on some speed at lead off and defense overall, we need to be able to create runs when the team is in a slump…..
November 17th, 20109:59 am
Uggla is great…., but losing Omar is going to hurt. He was a spark plug for the team in his consistent playing. Gonna miss him.
November 17th, 201010:00 am
Every time I want to get depressed about the state of humanity and our collective intelligence, I just open up this blog. It’s better than mixing Joy Division and Nyquil.
On another note per backup CF – he’s not a good hitter but maybe Tony Gwynn Jr. if the Padres release him? Gives us speed too…
Love the trade! Uggla will be a great addition. We did give up alot but got alot in return. I wish the Braves would play Uggla in LF and keep Prado at 2B. Prado is an excellent fielder and Uggla is just serviceable at best. Still a great trade for the Braves.
November 17th, 201010:07 am
We still need an outfielder. IF Chipper doesnt come back we still need two outfielders.
November 17th, 201010:08 am
Yep its a good trade but the question is,will he be in a braves uniform after the 2011 season? if he don’t then this trade would be terrible getting rid of omar and dunn.
November 17th, 201010:14 am
I would imagine that the salary chipper has been making will be off the books after next year and that money will go to locking Uggla down with us for many years to come.
November 17th, 201010:17 am
My first thought was that this is a good deal. Uggla is a talent, and we needed the power.
My second thought was what do we do with Prado? I investigated and found that Prado is being moved to left field, where he played in the Venezuelan league I believe.
Prado was moved to third last season and struggled defensively. I am not sure how a move to the outfield is going to work out, although he was a utility player before the permanent move to second base.
My feeling is that Prado was leading the world in hits, for much of the 2010 season. He was a constant for much of the season while most every other position either struggled or fought through injury. He played a solid second base, and performed well anywhere you put him in the lineup. Prado is the main reason we made the post-season. I think he deserves to own second base.
What if Prado struggles defensively in LF, like he did at 3B? This team needed fine tuning, not blowing up.
If Prado excels at LF, then I my worries are for nought. However if he struggles defensively, and then his hitting is affected, then… Well, I guess the wisdom of this move remains to be seen.
November 17th, 201010:18 am
@David O’Brien – understood about the young talent. If Uggla wouldn’t sign for 48 million for four years with Florida, what are the chances of him being with the Braves for more than one year? Again, the Braves will end up with nothing. That’s the point.
November 17th, 201010:19 am
Word is that Prado is playing left field in winter ball. If Garrett Anderson can play it then Prado surely can.
November 17th, 201010:27 am
/sticks head in blender
November 17th, 201010:28 am
Not sure if this was mentioned among the 737 comments, but Uggla played under Fredi in Florida. I believe Uggla’s signability was thoroughly discussed with Fredi, (and perhaps Uggla, shhhh), before the deal was consummated. I think we’ll have a good chance at signing Uggla.
NORRIS, I agree. When Prado was moved to third last season, he didn’t have a whole lot of time to prepare for it. That was my thought at the time, also. A winter of adjusting to left field might be enough for the flexible Prado. In that case, this was a great deal. Like DOB said in a comment, Dunn was third on the bullpen depth chart.
Never have seen a comment on Prado’s arm one way or the other. That is also a consideration.
Fire Frank Wren
Trading away Infante and the best bullpen lefty, both of whom could be here at reasonable prices for 4 to 5 years for a 1-year mercenary? Does anyone remember the Mark Teixiera trade? This is the same thing.
Can you imagine the Braves if we still had Neftali Perez (who just won AL Rookie of the Year), Elvis Andrus, and Salty?
The Braves will regret this when Uggla leaves for the $$$ a year from now. He already turned down 4 years $48 million. The Braves won’t offer him more than that.
November 17th, 201010:30 am
Awesome! Uggla will be gold in the middle of the lineup.
Who leads off now?
November 17th, 201010:31 am
@Fire Frank Wren Youre right, Gwinnett could use another catcher. Salty would have been perfect for that!
In Fredi I Trust
Wow, how could any TRUE Braves fan be bashing this trade? Where do I start on this?
1. We traded away a very good UTILITY player who himself will be a free agent after the 2011 season and committed only 2 errors less then Uggla did and he started pretty much every game. So what does that tell me? It tells me that Infante messed up in the field just as many times as Uggla did with FAR LESS chances to mess up.
2. We gave away a LH reliever that was not even originally in our system, and who didn’t immediately start in the big leagues with us anyways. What did Dunn have last year, 18-20 innings the entire year? We have Venters and O’Flaherty anyways. Dunn was hardly untouchable.
3. Sure Infante his .320 last year, but many of those hits came with nobody on, or nobody in scoring position. Uggla hit what .288? He also had 30+ HR’s and over 100 RBI’s. Imagine what an extra 60+ runs would have done for this Braves team last year? That could have been the difference between Division Champs and the 2nd place that we finished.
Point being, this was a great trade in every sense of the word. Uggla will have an opportunity to drive in 120 RBI’s next season, and if he is placed in between a healthy Chipper and Mac, it will increase the numbers of those guys as well. If Uggla walks after the 2011 season, then we get 2 draft picks whereas if we kept Infante and he walked, we get nothing. How can anyone bash this trade? Unreal.
November 17th, 201010:32 am
The Vasquez trade seems a lot more sexy already when they got a few quality innings out of Mike Dunn and now they have Uggla.
I’ll miss Infante, I liked him a lot.
November 17th, 201010:34 am
THis is exactly what we needed. Infante was a great player for us but we needed a 30/100 guy, period, and got one.
DOB- any chance we still go after Kemp, Upton, or Ellsbury or are we done?????
This is also huge in that Mac can move down in the line up some and maybe get more rest as we have David Ross who is pretty excellent too.
Open; Prado; Heyward; Uggla; Mac
or Prado; Heyward; Chipper; Uggla; Mac…
Is pretty sexy yes?
November 17th, 201010:35 am
Wren just needs to add some good bench people and wait to see what happens with chipper. He might need to do some wheeling and dealing at the end. Would love to see Braves get some help for the outfield on the cheap. I wonder if there is a veteran hitter with a little pop that could fill this role….Love the move…Go Braves!!
I believe that the change was perfect, if you change to infante and dunn for uggla but to turn the braves acquire ..that is super . now as close to the braves serious search for a CF to help someone quick .I do not believe that have the money to crawford although serious the player perfect for atlanta , quick , good contact em order , but also the braves have to look for someone to help to steal bases and legitimate first bat can no longer be experiencing.
Infante for Uggla…another stupid move by Wren.
November 17th, 201010:36 am
Everyone liked Infante but the Braves are better today than they were yesterday….
November 17th, 201010:40 am
coach13: they’re not done, but not going to be any moves as big as Upton, Kemp, Ellsbury. Not unless things change and they unexpectedly shed a big salary or another player currently projected to be in lineup.
November 17th, 201010:41 am
Fire Frank Wren , you are very pessimistic , this GM is not the john schuerholtz , this kept the minor leagues of the braves intact and if you want grab something good you have to give something good , uggla is a tremendous player who tells you to you that will not sign for some years more , there are $$$$ myfriend in atlanta ,Atlanta has money , bet that uggla sera signed by some years more and more than the florida marlins he wanted offer . also recalls that chipper jones this at the edge of the withdrawal.
It’s impossible not to like this deal. Maybe it’s too good because I don’t recall such a one sided deal this early in the off season.
Even if Infante has a career yetar for the Marlins it would not match an average or below average year from Uggla. If he’s only here for the season the Braves will get two high draft picks. If they extend him they have that power bat for years to come.
Dunn is not even on the radar as far as a prospect. He’s not closer material or even set up material.
Wren did not have to part with ANY prospect to fill a HUGE need. That’s amazing if you think about it. The team doesn’t have the money to sign a Crawford or Werth. Trading was the only option to fill that need & one that most Braves fans thought would result in giving up some of the top prospects. I didn’t see any way around it to be honest.
I can’t believe anyone would compare this deal to the Tex/Drew deals.
Marc in FL
November 17th, 201010:44 am
Infante was a personal fav, but we needed power badly, this will help a lot with that. Uggla also seems to own Turner Field, maybe he will shine with us.
“Uggla, 30, is a two-time All-Star who just turned down the Marlins’ four-year, $48 million extension offer.”
It’s not that I don’t like this trade, it’s just that I wonder what it means from a philosophy standpoint. The BA and the strikeouts are a concern, but not unusual in a power hitter. Does he work the count? I don’t really know about that aspect of his game. I can’t help but wonder, for the amount of money Uggla is going to want as a FA, if throwing somewhat more money at a Carl Crawford is not a better move since our infield defense would be better with Prado and Infante and Crawford would add some speed, BA and some power. I’d take a lighter hitting better fielding infield and look to get my power from my outfield, especially with a team built on pitching. The Uggla trade is basically asking our starting pitchers to work out of one more jam per start. I do like the trade, but it means living with Uggla at 2nd base for maybe 5 years. I’ve seen balls bounce off of him on their way to right field. I’m sure he has heart, but as much as heart wants to field the ball, heart can’t fix hands of stone. I do like the trade, it’s just that I really value defense in my national league game. That said, it is a pretty weak FA class this year and Crawford is a nice piece, not a god.
November 17th, 201010:46 am
This is by far the best move the Wren could possibly have made, under the circumstances. He is in a real tough position because of the chipper situation. Chipper is a complete question mark other than the fact that he will take up a huge chunk of the payroll. No team on a limited budget like the Braves would want to be in this situation. Wren was really backed into a corner and too be able to pull off a move like this is like a game winning grandslam in the bottom of the ninth. Thanks Marlins! Yes we gave up some great talent, but its hard to believe that another team would not have offered more. Then you factor in that they are a rival, it makes the deal even more unbelieveable. Great job Wren! This gives the Braves a real good offense, with or without chipper as long as heyward keeps progressing and freeman has a decent rookie year.( I believe both will be do fine.) Need to add some affordable depth at centerfield, just in case Mclouth struggles again, (possible, but doubtful, I excpect him to get it turned around, he’s in his prime and he’s hit before) but a cheap backup never hurts. If Mclouth just pulls his weight our outfield will be greatly improved with Prado and Heyward out there with him. Can’t wait for spring training!
Fan in RIC
November 17th, 201010:47 am
A consideration in re: Uggla’s defense: he played home games in Sun Life Stadium (or whatever its nom du jour is), where players were constantly plagued by poor weather and fielding conditions. Not to mention the field is shared with the Miami Dolphins, and anyone who remembers Fulton County Stadium can attest to the poor fielding conditions there. While Uggla’s defense will likely not rise to the form of Roberto Alomar, I bet it improves a good bit next season when he plays on the well-manicured Turner Field.
November 17th, 201010:50 am
My favorite thing I heard was when Wren called up Freddie and said “What do you thing about getting Uggla for Infante and Dunn?” and Freddie said “Yea! How many prospects do we have to give them?” NONE!!!
DOB, Have a question about the bench……as it currently sits, here are the projections:
B.Conrad (S) – 2B/3B/PH $425,000
Joe Mather (R) – 1B/3B/OF/PH $400,000
Ross (R) – C $1.625
Backup Middle Infield/SS
The question is where does Hinske or Diaz fit???? In my estimation neither one of them seems to fit what the bench needs. We need to spend the remaining budget on our 4th outfielder with Mclouth being such a question mark. Besides that we need a SS option that we lost in trading away Infante. I can’t see any way that Diaz or Hinske make sense, unless it is Hinske vs Mather in spring training. Thoughts???????
November 17th, 201010:53 am
Everyone needs to stop complaining about losing Omar. He was great this season, but he clearly had a career year and he is a free agent after next season anyway. 30 HRs in each of the last 4 years for a 2nd baseman….are you kidding me? This is a guy they will definitely look to lock up. Great trade!
In a lot of ways, the trade is a no brainer, but I’m just wondering if this is us making our one allowed move under the Liberty regime (the CEO made more than the whole team) if there was really no way to use straight cash to sign a Crawford, keep the whole team intact, and wait for Chipper and KK and McOut to come off the books. Winning = cash. It’s also about having out corner outfielders locked up for the first time in a long time. Then we could run lighter hitting decent fielding (Blanco? oh, wait, we gave him away) players in CF. Uggla can hit, no question, but the question is, what does this do to our pitching and defense, especially if we keep him for 5 years. The Giants got it done with Renteria, Sanchez and Uribe. They really got it done with defense and pitching.
Bob the Blogger
November 17th, 201010:57 am
Statistically, Uggla has been pretty bad at 2B, and the Braves were near the bottom of fielding percentage in the NL already. On the other hand, Prado was becoming a pretty good second baseman. I would like to see Uggla be the one to move to LF, then concentrate on a super CF, if something can be done with McClouth. Good teams are usually strong defensively up the middle, and McCann, Uggla, and McLouth don’t exactly fit that description.
I still like the trade, however, and am becoming a bigger fan of Frank Wren’s by the week.
November 17th, 201010:58 am
The reason this makes Crawford more of a possibility (in hindsight) is because people are talking about locking up hands of Uggla long term. If you are going to go 5/60 on Uggla, you might as well go 8/100 on Crawford.
November 17th, 201010:59 am
I don’t think Uggla can play LF. He’s build like a truck, and moves like Pete Incaviglia.
November 17th, 201011:00 am
rainman376toothpicks— Why don’t you take your teeth out and pick them. Did you even read what I said. I said if if if they sign Uggla explore trading Prado for OF with speed and power. I know his salary is not great but it would be nice to have some speed in Of.
November 17th, 201011:08 am
I’d hate to see them trade Prado – but the fact Wren filled his spot at 2B has me a little worried. Would Wren be crazy enough to trade Prado? I’m sure we could get a good, speedy OF in return – but Prado is such an important part of this team – Wren wouldn’t consider trading him, would he?
November 17th, 201011:10 am
The Braves got the RH power bat they needed, although the defense is compromised a bit. The Marlins did not fair as poorly as some on the blog are suggesting either. Their combined move was to sign John Buck for 3 year at 6 million/year plus add Infante and Dunn. The payroll for the marlins will be about the same, but they add 20 HRs at catcher, better defense at 2B and another 8-12 HRs there, and get an 8th/9th inning arm for their pen. They get 3 useful regulars for the price of 1. They will more than make up for Uggla’s power with a full year of Mike Stanton plus Buck. They are still a formidable contender in the division.
November 17th, 201011:11 am
Do you think the Braves would ever consider making Jeff Francoeur an offer to come in as the 4th outfielder? He’s got more power than Diaz and Hinske, and is a great defensive outfielder and could easily play any of the outfield positions. With his and Jason’s arms out there, no one would be running on the Braves.
November 17th, 201011:19 am
Its tough because Omar has played his way into maybe being our best utility guy eva. But, another 25+ HRs?…..you gotta be feeling happy about that. Also, Dan Uggla IS an Atlanta Braves type of guy. Its a perfect fit.
Now its up too Roger McDowell and our pitching coaches down the organization to turn these potential phenom pitchers into lights out World Series champions. Lets go!
p.s. Shout out to KRIS MEDLEN: keep gettin stronger kid.
November 17th, 201011:28 am
The gorrila in the room here is Chipper. Will Prado play LF, 3B, some 2B or back up 1B? If Prado is to be our LF, he needs to go there and stay there — same if he is to be the 3B. Prado will not improve defensively at any of the new positions if he is to become the new Infante. He is an all-star and he deserves a position. The other thing that is being overlooked here is what is a semi-healthy Chipper able to contribute. A 270, 18 HR, 80 RBI season with adequate defense would be an improvement over the numbers he was putting up over the last 2 years before the injury. One year older and recovering from reconstructive surgery does he even have these numbers in him? Even if the answer is yes, these are not the numbers needed from a 3-hitter If the answer is no, then we are missing an opportunity to fill another roster spot and possibly playing people out of position to accommodate an old fan favorite. If we knew right now that Chipper either could not be ready to play or to be able to play to a minimal standard, then we could go after the likes of an Alex Gordon to play 3B, or an Ordonez or Upton to play LF and resolve the roles for our bench players. As of now the lineup is not set and the need for another regular or for an additional bench player instead is in flux.
November 17th, 201011:29 am
It’s funny to see some of the comments on here from bloggers. They make it sound like this is the JD Drew or the Tex deal all over again.
They make it sound like Infante was an all star everyday starter (and not a utility guy) who we had under control for multiple years, or that the 25 year old Mike Dunn was going to develop into an all-star closer.
Relax people. Uggla can be penciled in for 25 HRs, 30 doubles, and 90 RBIs, which he has done for 5 years in a row (unlike Nate who had one really good year).
Think of what his presence does for the rest of the lineup. If Chipper hits in front of him, they have to pitch to Chipper.
We left a lot of men on base last year because we couldn’t get 3 hits in an inning to drive them in. Now, one bad pitch to Uggla can lead to one run.
I understand those who have concerns about his defense and his strikeouts. Those are legit concerns.
But to make it sound like Infante (a career backup and free agent in 2011, just like Uggla) and Dunn were too much to give up for a right handed power hitter? I could not disagree more.
November 17th, 201011:30 am
Not to mention that we just weakened a division rival in the process. We just took away a HR threat from their lineup and added him to ours. How can that not be a great move?
November 17th, 201011:32 am
DOB, the Braves have several options for starting pitching past the top 3. Any indication the Braves might deal JJ?
November 17th, 201011:34 am
This isn’t a good trade, this is a great trade. I am still in shock that Beinfest pulled the trigger on this prior to the winter meetings. Unreal. If the Braves don’t sign Uggla to a long term deal, they simply offer arbitration and take the two picks. Incredible deal for Atlanta. Wren should be nothing but commended.
Wren’s hands are tied as far as spending a ton of money on free agents right now so I’m very happy with Uggla. Bargain price if you ask me.
In the next few years a lot of cash will free up when Chipper hangs them up & Lowe’s contract is done. Some of that will probably go to extensions/raises for a number of players, but will still leave plenty to spend.
Also I’d look for JJ to be traded at some point, not this year, but next off season. If Minor, Teheran & Delgado continue to progress I’d say it’s a given. He will bring a bit in return if he can have a solid season. Had he been injury free this season he may have been moved this off season.
The Braves a loaded with pitching & with Wren protecting the young guys I’d say we have a solid rotation for years to come. JJ will command some serious cash & with Boras as his agent I’d say Wren moves him at some point. Hanson will be the one they go after to lock up long term IMO.
Fear not. The Marlins wanted Martin, but Wren sadin no way. They settled for Infante instead.
November 17th, 201011:37 am
Also, something else to keep in mind. The Braves more than likely would have received NOTHING when Omar left after next season.
November 17th, 201011:38 am
Good trade but I hope the McLouth is up to the task because He will have to cover a lot of ground to make up for the lack of range of Prado or Uggla. I feel that we still another player away to take over the Phils. The Marlins are the only team that can give away a 31 HR hitter and not miss him too much. They still have a couple of mashers in their line up.
Daren in Utah
November 17th, 201011:48 am
I really like this trade, though I will miss Infante’s consistent quality at-bats next year.
All players strike out. All players make errors. Some K or E more than others. Over the course of a season, I think Uggla’s bat and fielding will far outweigh his strikeout or error numbers.
I’d invite Andruw Jones to spring training and let him compete with McOut for the CF job. Them Jones boys used to best bad boys together !
November 17th, 201011:50 am
From Keith Law on ESPN today:
“Bad day to be a Florida Marlins fan. First the team gives away one of its best trading assets, then it gives a multiyear deal to a catcher who should have been happy with just one…
“The Marlins almost come off as determined to spite Uggla by cutting off their own noses. In the deal, they acquire Omar Infante, who has one year left before free agency like Uggla, and Mike Dunn, a hard-throwing but hilariously wild left-handed reliever who might figure something out over the next five years but is probably just as likely to blow out his arm, especially since he’s a converted position player. He throws a fastball offset with a slider, but since both pitches move in toward right-handed hitters, they get a good look at the ball and will hit Dunn hard unless he starts commanding his fastball. His arm action is long but not violent or difficult to repeat, so there’s no obvious mechanical reason he couldn’t throw more strikes. Infante had a fluke year driven entirely by batting average; he can play a few positions but has no business as a starter on a contending club. He’ll earn $2.5 million — or about $7 million less than Uggla — but he’ll be worth 3-4 wins less on the field.
“In this instance, at least, the Marlins won’t get what they don’t pay for.”
Easy But Sleezy
Yeah Minnie’s, McOut is the weakest link by far now ! He hits .186 and misjudges fly balls…
November 17th, 201011:55 am
Frenchy wants to play everyday. That’s one of the problems he had in NY, because he was platooning, so he demanded a trade.
I dont think Braves want to deal with him and his complaints.
November 17th, 201011:56 am
Why not invite Barry Bonds to spring training ? Put Barry in LF,Heyward in CF and Prado in RF. I bet Barry could still hit .285 30 100.
November 17th, 201011:58 am
What about trading Lowe for Kemp or Upton, DOB ?
November 17th, 201012:00 pm
Let’s hope for good years from D Lowe and Huddy again this year. If Huddy matches even 80% of his performance last year and D Lowe can regain what he was doing in September, we may have one of the most well-rounded teams in baseball.
You made the argument that Uggla’s lackluster defense isn’t really a concern because we’ll be upgrading defensively with Prado in LF and Freeman at 1B.
Just to clarify, are you really saying that Freeman in his rookie season is going to be a better defender than Derrek Lee? Really?
November 17th, 201012:02 pm
Hey me you thank I will get him sum more balls four hims hittin cages ?
Very gooder plus nicer tradings him Wren did its.
November 17th, 201012:04 pm
Why you invited Don Sutton two bees thems mops up pitching ?
Who knows what moves the Philliews will make this off-season, but if they were to lose Werth and stand pat, replacing him with Dominic Brown, they would all be 1 year older (Ibanez, Polanco, Howard, Rollins, Oswalt especially) and would miss a key RH bat in their lineup. They would appear to be starting on the down turn. The Marlins lineup of Coghlan, Infante, Ramirez, Morrison, Stanton, Sanchez, Buck, Dominguez? + P is scary — as scary or more so than the Phillies, and they have Johnson, Nolasco, and A. Sanchez heading their rotation, but still have issues in the pen. The Nats seem a year away, waiting for Strasburg to return, but have talent coming into place and seem ready to be players in the FA market. The Mets are still the Mets, but should begin to improve under new leadership. The Braves have added the RH bat they have lacked, but the bullpen depth is not as solid as last year with the departure of Wagner, Saito, and Dunn, and the injury to Medlen. There is a lot of additional pressure on two young relievers. The Chipper question and the McLouth contract inhibit the ability of the team to add the missing parts it needs to compete on stronger terms within a strong division. Those 2 issues should be resolved in 2012 and Heyward and Freeman will have had a year or two of experience. It is imperative that we sign Uggla for multiple years, because 2012 and 2013 should be the years we will field our most competetive team with the most realistic chance of winning it all.
November 17th, 201012:05 pm
The gorilla in the room is not Chipper, it’s McOut and KK. Chipper is not worth his current contract, but that’s not what this current Chipper contract is about. The people who just want to throw Chipper out with the trash is just astounding to me.
Just to clarify, are you really saying that Freeman in his rookie season is going to be a better defender than Derrek Lee? Really? — LD
No, not better than D-Lee, whom the Braves had for about six weeks. But many times better than Glaus, whom they had at first base for more than four months.
November 17th, 201012:06 pm
I think the Marlins willingness to trade Uggla without a prospect being part of the deal may come from the owner. No doubt Hanley Ramirez is the owners golden child. This is probably part of the reason Gonzalez was fired so early in the season not long after the Hanley loafing incident and their record wasn’t even that bad. The owner is pampering Hanley. If you will recall at the time, some of the Marlins players were not happy either with Hanley’s loafing, supportive of the way Fredi handled things. I am willing to bet Uggla was very much in the anti-Hanley attitude camp. So the owner already knows Uggla is not resignable, and also wants to build around Hanley. So Uggla is expendable from his perspective probably, regardless of what prospects he gets. Does anybody think the Marlins management gives a flip about what the rest of baseball thinks about them? They don’t care, and they weren’t keeping Uggla. So they made the trade. It’s probably about that simple.
November 17th, 201012:08 pm
I think DOB is saying that Freeman is a better defender than Sanchez or Cantu.
November 17th, 201012:09 pm
I think the Marlins willingness to trade Uggla without a prospect being part of the deal may come from the owner. No doubt Hanley Ramirez is the owners golden child. This is probably part of the reason Gonzalez was fired so early in the season not long after the Hanley loafing incident and their record wasn’t even that bad. The owner is pampering Hanley. — sportsmandh
Agreed on the owner part. But I tend to think it was more about the owner being perturbed that Uggla quickly turned down their four-year, $48 mill offer and asked for five years, $71 mill ($1 mill more than Hanley got).
Owner, who’s made plenty of knee-jerk sort of decisions before, probably told Beinfest to get whatever he could for Uggla and dump him now. I mean, otherwise there’s no reason they couldn’t have waited at least till Winter Meetings and gotten more for Uggla.
November 17th, 201012:11 pm
The other dark part of this trade is the need to use medium to big money to tie up Uggla (30years old) to a longer term deal. Look at how fast Utley deteriorated defensively this year.
November 17th, 201012:13 pm
Count: Utley was hurt this year.
November 17th, 201012:16 pm
Any chance the Braves may look at offering Saito a new incentive laden contract? Or another veteran reliever to add some bullpen depth?
November 17th, 201012:17 pm
Yes, but in the playoff, he was awful looking.
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