1:55 pm February 28, 2010, by David O'Brien
March 1st, 201010:46 am
Obviously there are some fans who think Bobby Cox is great and some who think he is terrible. The mystery is that there are some things that Bobby Cox does or fails to do that are a matter of record or at least obvious and cannot be denied. So then, you Cox supporter must think these things are good??
(1) There can be no doubt at sometimes Cox leaves a nonproductive who he likes in the lineup for months when everyone knows that he has a better option on the bench. — So you Cox supporters must think that this is a good practice.
(2) It is a matter of record that Cox, for the most part, does not adjust his batting order based on who is hot and who is not. So you Cox lovers must think that this is good.
(3) It is obvious that Bobby does not adjust his batting order based on certain hitters doing great or doing terrile against certain opposing pitchers. So I assume that again you must think that a manager should not be bothered with details like this.
(4) It is a matter of record that Bobby has coninued to use a completely innefective pinch hitter in game afer game after game in key game determing situations. So you Cox supporters must think that this is good.
(5) It is obvious that Bobby Cox does not teach, emphasize, demand that hitters be selective, work the count, and make the opposing pitcher throw some pitches. So do you Cox supporters think that this is a good practice to violate the most essential thing to consistant run production.
(6) It is a matter of record that Cox does not move a star player down from his favorite spot in the batting order when he is in a terrible prolonged slump. So you must think that this does not effect run production.
(7) In past seasons, it is a matter of record that Cox has continued to use ineffective relief pitchers game after game after game. So you must think that this what a good manager does.
(8) It is also a matter of record that in past seasons Cox has overused some bullpen pitchers to the extent that they are completely worn out by the last 1/3 of the season.
THERE CAN BE LITTLE OR NO QUESTION that Bobby Cox does these things. So then the question becomes – HOW CAN YOU THINK THAT THESE ARE GOOD PRACTICES.
March 1st, 201010:48 am
Look guys I’m gonna keep it real here. The Braves have simply too many if’s to be projected for everyone’s post season projections. Besides the pitching questions/scenarios previously mentioned, the offense has it’s own quandries. Will Glaus provide the 4-hole 30 homer power we need while being shoe-horned into a 1st base role. Will Chipper finish up like a HOF player he is. Will Heyward be that ROY candidate that holds up well to the spotlight and play a great RF from opening day. Will McLouth rebound to his Gold Glove Pittsburgh days or will he indeed be a .260 hitter. Will Wagner be the closer we all hope he will be. Finally how many “Houstons” will Bobby pull this year. Lot of if’s for me. I say the Braves will finish 3rd in the division this year and hope I am wrong. A lot has to go right. Anytime you trade away your top pitcher and get potential with a question mark in return you aren’t exactly playing with house money. I’m pulling for them but not betting on them(to reach post season) unless I get real good odds.
March 1st, 201010:50 am
And my last post had teh dubious distinction to come right after Don…probably a good time to sign off.
March 1st, 201010:51 am
Don, you’re right. I would root for another team if I were you.
March 1st, 201010:53 am
Good Call on the Todd Snider lyrics
March 1st, 201010:54 am
Scout X also says…”When I look for breakout players, I look for good, young players who have some experience who are on good clubs, with good players around them.”
He doesn’t actually say who…just generically says what he looks for. Gee, thanks.
And Roodge Owns
March 1st, 201010:55 am
“Anytime you trade away your top pitcher and get potential with a question mark in return you aren’t exactly playing with house money.”
That’s right. There are no potential question marks with Vazquez. He’s simply “top pitcher.” That’s established. That’s a done deal. The Yanks got all the house money on that one.
March 1st, 201010:57 am
The Braves have a lot of ifs no doubt but so does every team. The whole key to success is health. If you stay healthy chances are you’ll produce just like the braves did in the latter part of the season. This years lineup has a good chance of performing well but of course its success is directly linked to the health of the players. The Phillies for instance could suffer a few injuries that could ruin their season. I’m not saying that were going to win the division but we didn’t miss 90 wins by much last year and with the bulk of the lineup returning and a strong pitching staff I don’t see it as crazy to view this team with others as a potential to win 90. The key of course is health.
March 1st, 201010:59 am
So me and the wife went and did the 2 for 1 movie deal at the AMC this weekend. Many of our family and friends have done it but we never had the chance yet when we take the kids, way too long to be at the theater for 5-6 hours with the kids. I felt bad at first but after the prices they charge for tickets and food that feeling quickly disappeared. First movie we watched was Shutter Island and after some of the hype it received my wife didn’t like it too much and I kind of agree, nothing special. Long movie too-2 hours and 20 minutes. I would’ve been pissed spending the money if that was the only movie we watched. The second movie made the money worth while…Edge of Darkness. This was a great movie, everything I expected and more. Mel Gibson is probably my favorite actor because he seems like he doesn’t take anyone crap and isn’t a typical hollywood type. Definately would recomend Edge of Darkness.
don 1) true, bobby likes to let his guys play out of thier slumps.
2) this is false
3) this is false
4) if you are talking about norton, the guy didnt makes out any more often than cox’s other options.
5) not bobby’s job
6) braves won alot of games and scored alot of runs during chipper’s slump. must not have affected run production that much
7)i dont like the way he manages a bullpen, but i always give him the benefit of the doubt, since he has all the info, and i dont.
8)use ‘em up, well get some more.
why cant you just accept that not everyone sees it the way you do?
March 1st, 201011:00 am
And Don, The One Trick Pony drones on and on and on and………….
Dude, have you just resorted to posting the same post every time you wake from your coma?
(2) It is a matter of record that Cox, for the most part, does not adjust his batting order based on who is hot and who is not. So you Cox lovers must think that this is good. (Don)
Name another manager in the game that tinkers with his lineup based on whos hot or not. No manager constantly shuffles the lineup. Its just not good practice. I’m taking it you were someone who enjoys watching the game but has limited experience playing or managing it. Some of what you have said is right but most of it seems to come from an individual who is self taught about the game and knows very little.
March 1st, 201011:01 am
rock on… Will McLouth rebound to his Gold Glove Pittsburgh days or will he indeed be a .260 hitter.
if anything is for sure, its that mclouth is a .260 hitter. not that there is anything wrong with that. i think its reasonable for braves braves to expect the post season in 2010, in all seriousness.
Don, I applaud you for your growth. Your rants make so much more sense in a numbered list format rather than the block format you’ve used previously. By the way, are you a personal injury lawyer?
March 1st, 201011:04 am
dpelfrey-Dude couldn’t get into a Law School, much less pass a Bar Exam.
So no non UGA fans are allowed to be Braves fans and live in Atlanta? Check the facts the Alumni Association of the University of Florida in Atlanta is larger than the UGA one, sorry if your grads don’t have the cash to join their associations. You may also want to see that many schools alumni associations in metro Atlanta are among their institutions largest,especially from the SEC,ACC, and Big10. Atlanta is a melting pot and the ATLANTA Braves represent that city NOT the state. Since people move here from everywhere other fans out number UGA 5 to1, Atlanta is a big city it is NOT a UGA town, hell you can’t claim the city of your biggest rival thats like saying Tallhassee is Gator Country. If UGA represents the state because it is state funded, then what about Tech, Southern,Georgia State, Kennessaw, West Georgia etc…why do you have to be a UGA fan?
March 1st, 201011:06 am
On your numbers 7 & 8, that’s a complete contradiction. If you want Bobby to ONLY use “effective” relievers, then those guys are going to get overworked. Otherwise you have to use some guys who aren’t as effective as others.
Agreed in your last post about Nate-Dawg…
I really don’t care about batting average at the top of the order because I stress OBP over batting average (which I think is over-rated)…
We just have to get Nate Dawg to cut down on his K’s and maintain an OBP around .360 or higher…
March 1st, 201011:07 am
Also, I didn’t want to get into a football conversation when we should be talking about Baseball but you UGA people make no sense. Say what you want about fan base, your “beautiful” (and over rated) campus, truth is Tech has a more recent championship AND was Nationally relevant and in a national championship discussion this year somewhere you havent been for going on 30 years now.
March 1st, 201011:12 am
“N8…if Lowe duplicates what he did last year and doesn’t get the run support he got last year…” Rock On….
I couln’t care less about Lowe’s actual win total. He made 34 starts, and in 21 of them, he went 6+ innings giving up 3 ER or less.
As of August 12th, through 25 starts, he was 12-7 (team was 15-10 in his starts to that point), with a 4.08 ERA, with 150 IP (ending up with 194.2).
Save 9 rough starts to end the season, where he went 3-3 (team went 6-3), despite allowing 33 ER in 44.2 IP (6.65 ERA), I’d say he was exactly what the doctor ordered for a team that had no reliable starters in 2008.
You can say that a handful of his wins (and certainly some of the team wins in his starts), were due to good run support. But in 2/3 of his starts, he MORE than did his job.
March 1st, 201011:13 am
I thought Homer was the only guy who posted the same thing on every blog (of course he only posts two words), but Don seems to be on to the cut and paste idea too, if he could be original nobody would mind (they would disagree but it would not be so annoying) but simply regurgitating the same stuff every time is just a waste of space.
Something to ponder….someone want to explain to me how Maryland (who for my money is a better team than Duke in a short tourney and may well be ACC champion) is not even in the AP top 25 but Univ. of Richmond is ranked 23′rd. Given that may change now coming off college basketball’s best game of the year against VT.
Assuming Vt beats BC this week and GT loses to Clemson at Clemson the VT/GT game on Sat. could determine which team gets the last NCAA bid out of the ACC. Can’t see the ACC getting 7 teams in the dance. If GT beats either VT or Clemson that would give the ACC 7 teams with 20 + wins and 8-8 in the ACC or better. Only once has a team finished .500 in the conference during the regular season and posted 20 total wins and not received an invitation. That team—-VT. The ACC tourney is going to be very interesting.
Inspired by Marteeeeen and Matty D, I started P90X this morning. Weighed in at 202.2 last night. Day 1 was really tough. The instructor guy is cheesy to the point of hilarity. He is a PT machine though. It was a really good workout.
Florida plays in a place called The Swamp. Nuff said. Who cares about how large the Booster Club is in Atlanta? Check how large the Dawgs Booster Club is in Tampa – it’s huge. Makes no difference, though.
If you can’t be a fan of your own favorite team than what’s the point of it all? Dawg Fans like Chipper despite the fact he’s a Gator Fan. Whatever. It’s a zero sum argument. Move on.
March 1st, 201011:15 am
Uhhhhh, UGA was just as much “in the national championship discussion” in 2007 as Tech was in 2009.
March 1st, 201011:16 am
Just found out I’ve lost 64 pounds so far -half way to my goal. Didn’t use P90X, either. I quit eating and started walking. Try it. It works. Even without a trainer.
March 1st, 201011:20 am
“Will Glaus provide the 4-hole 30 homer power we need while being shoe-horned into a 1st base role. Will Chipper finish up like a HOF player he is. Will Heyward be that ROY candidate that holds up well to the spotlight and play a great RF from opening day.”
I think That too many people are putting too much expectations on a 21 year old Phenom…
He will not carry the offense, so some fans need ( not you) need to get that straight…
I’d be content with Heyward at .270-20-75-15SB especially at 21 years old he is going to struggle after 4 weeks into the season
Chipper was 23 in 1995 but he had a Squad of veteran sluggers to help him break into the league, Heyward doesn’t have that Luxury, so there will be more pressure on Heyward as opposed to when Chipper was a Rookie
Actually UGA was in the National Championship discussion the last few years besides last year. Just sayin. They did begin the year #1 a couple years ago DMSO they had to be in the discussion.
March 1st, 201011:21 am
Lew thats exactly my point, Gators catch gruff here, nobody in Tamps cares if you are a UGA fan. You never here down there “how can you be a UGA fan in Tampa, especially oh man how do you like the Bucs and UGA?” Tampa, its sports teams and the Univeristy of Florida are in no way linked together, UGA wants to try and claim Atlanta and it’s teams. There are plenty of native Atlantans that went to UF PLENTY. I am a Gator but my favorite pro teams are the Braves, Falcons, Hawks, Thrashers, and I am as big an Atlanta fan as anyone so why should it matter if i’m a Gator as well they are totally different things. The question to Chipper just seemed a bit ignorant to me.
UGA was in the picture, until the actual season started and they fell on their face, Tech was in the picture in November.
March 1st, 201011:23 am
“Will Glaus provide the 4-hole 30 homer power we need while being shoe-horned into a 1st base role..”
We will be lucky to get 20-25 homers out of Troy Glass (Glaus) in that he’s hitting in a pitcher’s park and he’s off the HGH/Roids…
Honestly, The only hitter I think that is capable of hitting more than 25 homers in our lineup is B-Macc and that’s if and only if he plays 138-144 games…
March 1st, 201011:24 am
Buckhead Brave-Dude, whatever your point is (still not all that sure), it’s moot. Like I said-It’s a zero sum argument, designed to do nothing but piss people off and inflame useless passions. Time to move on.
March 1st, 201011:25 am
UGA was also the picture in November the year they won the Sugar Bowl
March 1st, 201011:26 am
buckheadbrave Tech has a more recent championship AND was Nationally relevant and in a national championship discussion this year somewhere you havent been for going on 30 years now.
are you kidding me with that? whoop whoop GT won a national championship 20 years ago. how can anyone brag about something like that?
and UGA WAS in the national championship discussion most recently in 07 and 08. you have no clue what youre talking about.
March 1st, 201011:27 am
My point was not only did someone make the statement to Chipper is it “biting the hand that feeds him” to be a Gator fan over UGA which I am just trying to have someone explain to me how that question can even be justified, but it was by actually being presented to Chipper.
DOB- will you be doing play-by-play for tomorrow’s game?
Anybody know what time it will start? Sorry if I’m repeating a questions already asked a ton.
DAP, UGA brags about a championship in 1980, how is that better?
March 1st, 201011:28 am
N8…agreed, he wasn’t by any stretch terrible or anything like that. In fact I have him tabbed as teh #1 starter this year. I think he has it figured out and is durable. However, by his own admission he wasn’t the pitcher he wanted to be and certainly not at season’s end. If memory serves he did receive the most run support of any regular starter we had last year. If the Braves don’t hit well no pitcher is going to look great anyway. I am not blaming Lowe for getting run support or downplaying his 15 wins. My question is does he really feel like he has made the adjustments he needs to and will he get the 15+ wins we need him to get. I am betting he does actually.
March 1st, 201011:29 am
Don: 1. Cox shows faith in his players, sometimes he and the team is rewarded, sometimes not. You would have benched Willie Mays(A horrible start to his career)
2. Cox shows faith in his players, He always believes they will soon snap out of thier slump, His confidence in them usually helps them get out of their slumps sooner, sometimes not.
3. Cox knows that players like knowing where they will be batting in the order on a daily basis, it creates a comfort level that allows the players to perform at their best.
4. Sometimes, Cox did wait too long to take Greg Norton out of that roll, but they signed him because he did a great job in 2008 and Cox believed he would snap out of it, he had faith that the player would return to his norm.
5. Some players do best when they have a great eye for the strikezone and are able to “work the count” Chipper, Prado are examples. But, Escobar, McCann have great results even when they don’t. It’s a nice goal to have, but all players are not gifted with the same strikezone judgement, thus different approaches with similar results.
6. Players earn their positions in the lineup over a long period of time during which they produce, Cox gives them an extended period( though not as long) to prove they can’t produce. He has faith in their ability to work out of the slump.
7. NO MANAGER can win this debate, the pitchers make the team for a reason! If, the manager doesn’t use all his relievers, the few hot relievers will be burned out. If, he uses the relievers that are struggling he is an idiot. HE has to have faith in all the relievers that have earned their way onto the team, unless they have other better pitchers in the minors, which has not been the case for most of the past 20 seasons. It was a main reason they lost some World Series!
8. See No.7
You may be finally getting the picture(though I doubt it), that the key phase here is Bobby Cox’s faith in his players. He picks the guys who he and the staff are the best they have at the start of the season and has the faith in them to give them time to prove that they belong or not. IT IS THE REASON THEY ALL LOVE TO PLAY FOR HIM. Even the ones that are traded, cut loose or retire almost never have anything bad to say about their treatment or opportunity that they got while playing for him. HE IS A MANAGER OF PEOPLE AS WELL AS GAME SITUATIONS. What don’t you understand about that!!!!!
HOW CAN YOU THINK THESE ARE NOT GOOD PRATICES
March 1st, 201011:33 am
buckhead UGA brags about a championship in 1980, how is that better
no, i dont think they do. certainly not in the way that you are. ive never heard a UGA fan trash talk someone by bringing up the championship in 1980. are UGA fans proud of it? sure. do we think it makes us better than ANYBODY because we won it all 30 years ago? no.
March 1st, 201011:34 am
Bailey – SPOT ON POINT with numbers 7&8. This season may be the ONLY season Bobby has ever had solid dependable middle relief. JS didn’t believe in spending the money in this area. Wren has been working on it, and it’s looking good now. Also, during the “glory years” closer sucked most years. Thank goodness for the great starters that took us late into games with leads most games.
In past, Bobby’s choice was to use undependable middle relief (did Don want more Acosta last year?) or wear out the guys he could (sometimes) depend on. He could only use players that he had available on the roster. (responsability of GM, not manager). Let’s hear your answer to that, DON!
in response to your point number 2, I am a huge Bobby Cox fan but I think the concern is his judgement of players may be more skewed than it used to be. I agree he is respected for showing faith and giving players time to correct their problems but his recent track record with that has been horrific. Kelly Johnson, Jeff Francoeur, Jordan Schafer, and thats just last season, all of them should have been benched long before they were.
March 1st, 201011:36 am
I was making a point, I was not bragging on one measly title in 1990. I don’t have to, my school won in 1996, 2006, and 2008…pick one and i’ll brag about that one.
Tomahawkin…..Actually I think Heyward has the veteran sluggers to help him which is indeed why he won’t feel the pressure to begin the season as much. I mean Chipper (HOF), BMAC (all star) and Glaus (homer potential former GG) all will bat ahead of him and can help him along. Heyward will most likely bat in the 7 hole. The numbers you have for Heyward are pretty realistic but the .270 average might be low for me.
March 1st, 201011:37 am
Tomahawkin-Dude, the whole Glaus/steroids issue is just a bunch of nothing. IF the reports are to be believed, he received shipments during the 03-04 seasons (six years ago), likely for recuperation from injury (he played 91 games in 03 and 58 in 04 then had surgery). Since then, his HR totals have been 37, 38, 20 (in 115 games) and 27 year before last in St. Louis (hardly a sterling hitter’s park). His RBI totals have been 97, 104, 62 (again in 115 games) and 99, before missing most of last season ith surgery due to a freak injury (he slammed his shoulder into the ground and severely dislocated it – hardly due to steroid use).
Should he put up an average season for the Braves (like post 04), he will hit 25-3o HR with around 95 RBI. Considering he’s playing for one more big contract, I’d say he’s highly motivated and will excel in Atlanta, hitting between Chipper and McCann.
March 1st, 201011:39 am
ccrider – well said
March 1st, 201011:41 am
braves bullpen is really deep this year. i feel really good about what we have out there, and i think we will be in really good shape in combo with our starters. it shouldnt be hard to get 6 strong out of our starters every time out.
March 1st, 201011:44 am
buckhead brave , truth is Tech has a more recent championship
sounds like bragging to me.
It will be great for Heyward to have a guy like Chipper to mentor him!
March 1st, 201011:47 am
So I have a bet with a friend that Glaus will hit more than 30 HR’s this year. If I win I get lunch for a week. If I lose He gets 1 dinner. (the odds are in his favor) Was this a good bet on my part?
from what Dob said yesterday this chavez kid is gonna be awesome
March 1st, 201011:48 am
DAP – Agreed. Bobby should have a strong bullpen which he can depend on, with extras waiting in the wings. This will be a first. Past bullpen problems have added significantly to post season problems, especially since starters (other than Smoltz) have often struggled during post season. (Glavin and Maddox have been especially disappointing, partly because of different strike zone in playoffs, especially by former American League umps and umps trying to make a name/statement).
Your chances of winning would of been better if you set it at 25. Not saying he won’t get 30, just kinda iffy.
March 1st, 201011:51 am
Congratulations on your weight loss Lew.Last April I was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes and weighed over 260 pounds.I now weigh about 185 and have the diabetes well under control with a hba1c reading of 5.5.Keep up the good work.
March 1st, 201011:53 am
I tried to get 25 as the mark but he thinks it will be 20-25 if he stays healthy…I think high 20’s with a chance at 30+. So I made the bet at over 30 with him giving me odds…the fun part is that if I am right and he is close in Sept each game my friend that is a Padre Fan will be checking my braves box score. That almost makes it worth it.
March 1st, 201011:54 am
Glaus’s 40 Homer days (During the HGH era) are long gone, but I will be happy with .265 25-85…That beats the hell out of the numbers we started last year with The Kotchmeister…
with that said our infield is set. Our main priority is to get out of the ML cellar in terms of production from our outfielders…Having Nate Dawg for a full year is a plus…and I think if Heyward starts 130-145 game then Milky Cabrera gets traded during midseason. I’m not sold on Milky Cabrera at all seeing that he hit 9 of his 13 homeruns at that Corporate Bandbox in NY… (I’m still can’t get over that deal BTW)
Also I like the Idea of Batting Matty D or Esco Leadoff against Southpaws….but leave it to Bobby to stick the same lineup out there for the first 2 months….
March 1st, 201011:56 am
Looking at our Infield as it stands right now….
75 Homers combined from our 4 infielders would be legit…
and 60 from our OF would work for me as well…
March 1st, 201012:13 pm
Tomahawkin-Considering he was supposed to have ordered the steroids (seen absolutely NO proof of that, though) in 03 and 04 and his 40+HR seasons were prior to that, I would say that (if he even did them) the steroids had damned little effect on anything he hit. Had he been juicing prior to those two injured seasons, why aren’t they included in the “Evidence”? Hmmmmmm…..Much ado about not a damned thing? I’d say so.
Besides, no one is expecting him to hit 40+ HR. Should he hit even 25 from the cleanup spot with Mac batting behind him, the Braves will have a huge season – especially with their consideraboly deep rotation and pen – by far the best in the league.
March 1st, 201012:16 pm
Nruce’s Pearl-Dude, that is absolutely excellent. Keep it up. I only hit a 5.8 and 5.9 on my last two A1C’s. Of course, I’ve been insulin dependent for almost 20 years, but none the less -way to go Dude.
March 2nd, 20106:47 am
Nasty morning here on the shores of Lake Bryan, in the shadow of Dark Star (actually, there are no shadows now, since it’s still pitch black out).
Thunder and steady rain out now….
In Port St. Lucie it’s not raining yet, according to weather.com, and only 30 percent chance till about noon. But then … arrgh. 70 percent chance of rain and thunderstorms at 1 p.m., 60 percent at 2 p.m., doesn’t improve much till after 3 p.m.
So we’ll see. I can only remember a couple of road games being called before the bus ride in my years doing this. But with a two-hour ride today and a nasty forecast, this might be one that gets banged early. We’ll see.
National League East Division Baseball News for 3/2/10, Philadelphia Phillies, Florida Marlins, Atlanta Braves, New York Mets and Washington Nationals » Baseball Up
March 2nd, 20108:10 am
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May 5th, 20123:34 am
So will they not be starting prcticae this weekend 3/10/2012 as the confirmation email stated. I am just a little confused and need clarification which was not provided in your previous message. I think the above calendar is a great help for us to keep track of upcoming events. Thanks-Demetria
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