In frigid Indy, Braves look to deal pitcher or two

(more...)

5,422 comments Add your comment

Wayne in Utah

December 9th, 2009
6:52 pm

glord1

Prado vs KJ was not my point at all. Agree that Prado is the choice. BUT, if prado is needed to get Pena, would you pull the trigger?

Burdell

December 9th, 2009
6:52 pm

Do the Braves need to really move Soriano? As I posted on MLBTR:

“The Braves really aren’t that pressed to move Soriano. Sure it’s a lot of money in the ‘pen, but if the Braves can move Lowe at full salary and non-tender Kelly Johnson, they’ll be $17 million below budget, which should be enough to get a 1B (LaRoche: 2/14), an OFer (Cameron: 1/9), and a bench bat (1/1).”

SilverKey

December 9th, 2009
6:54 pm

I wouldn’t Wayne

Mixxo

December 9th, 2009
6:56 pm

:update:

Friedman just flatuated at the table, but Wren took all the “credit” for it. Something must be in the works!

Stay tuned

Steven

December 9th, 2009
6:57 pm

Hey Braves Fans

Why is it that Kawakami is never mentioned as one of the tradabale pitchers? Do you really think he is better than Lowe at there peak levels?

BERNIE

December 9th, 2009
6:58 pm

Why don’t the Braves throw in Bobby Cox Frank Wren, Lowe and Soriano and see what kind of bat we can get. It’s obvious they are fixing to mess up especially if they get rid of Vasquez. We might get a dollar or 2 for Cox and maybe 50 cents for Wren. Go BRAVES!

Wayne in Utah

December 9th, 2009
6:58 pm

gotta run…..later

Xalz

December 9th, 2009
6:59 pm

Burdell – One wouldn’t think it would be a dire need if Lowe moved. I sure would like to start the year with the feeling we are stacked at all positions, but I am concerned about getting a true strength in the middle of the order. From the chatter it sounds like we are going to have to wait on Freeman and Heyward to develop and fill the need in the middle of the order and by that time Chipper will be gone… If Chipper is slowing down I would not blame him for getting out quick and maintaining the top All-Time switch hitting batting average.

Gthebrave

December 9th, 2009
6:59 pm

not really question of the quality between lowe kk. kk is cheaper Lowe frees up more funds

VP

December 9th, 2009
7:02 pm

Plus KK actually pitched pretty good last year. He was just a victim of pathetic run support.

Rob - in pain (from SC)

December 9th, 2009
7:03 pm

The real question about the offseason is who are we going to get to make sure Pendleton gets nowhere near Jason Heyward and Freddie Freeman

Home of the Braves

December 9th, 2009
7:03 pm

“The Braves really aren’t that pressed to move Soriano. Sure it’s a lot of money in the ‘pen, but if the Braves can move Lowe at full salary and non-tender Kelly Johnson, they’ll be $17 million below budget”

Actually, that’s not very sound logic. Nearly all baseball contracts are slightly back-loaded (Lowe’s is the exception, not the norm), so even if we were to make no changes to our team, we would still have a higher total payroll next year. Also, take every player who is arbitration eligible. If they were healthy last year, they can expect a raise through the arbitration process. So saying that we’re $17 million below budget if we dump 2 people who are scheduled to make $17 million isn’t really accurate, since we’re trying to keep nearly the same budget as last year and will have to pay raises to a decent proportion of our players.

VaBraveFan

December 9th, 2009
7:03 pm

Steven

Kawakami is under contract for 2 more seasons at 14 mil. Lowe is 3 yrs 45 mil. Were trying to free up salary. KK is a good pitcher, he had horrible run support. Look at it this way if he would get Lowe’s run support KK would have won around 17 games. Also its his second season in the bigs and is fully ajusted to the 5 man rotation. So i expect around the results lets just hope we can score some more runs. KK could be the best 5th starter in the bigs. he was a ACE in japan.

BravesFanChris25

December 9th, 2009
7:03 pm

Wren is up next!

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:04 pm

Frank Wren on MLB network after the commercial break. Should be some Q&A on Braves off-season plans. Bet it’s all a rehash of stuff that DOB has already reported.

Knox Harrington

December 9th, 2009
7:04 pm

Frank Wren coming up “next” on MLB Network’s Hot Stove.

NS

December 9th, 2009
7:09 pm

Please recap what he says for us who can’t watch.

Rob - in pain (from SC)

December 9th, 2009
7:09 pm

I kind of want to keep Soriano

Rob - in pain (from SC)

December 9th, 2009
7:09 pm

Wren is kissing Garret Anderson’s ass

glord1

December 9th, 2009
7:11 pm

Wayne- as far as Prado involved in a Pena deal I don’t know. Pena is attractive for next year. Although his average is low he walks a lot and has a decent OBP. You could pencil him in for 35 HR next year which is huge.

I think you are asking the wrong guy about Prado. I look at his swing and see a .300 hitter that develops 15-18 HR and 70 RBI. He is only 25 and think the sky is the limit for him. If I am right on his future stats he is worth an awful lot at his current salary. I probably would not do it but would have to think hard.

Bobby's Cox

December 9th, 2009
7:13 pm

There was talk about my favorite player, so I have to chime in…

Would you include Prado to for Pena and keep KJ

Why would the Braves do that? Prado is under team control for a few years, KJ is not. Pena is LH. Freeman in 2011 is LH. Heyward is LH. BMac is LH. McLouth is LH. Schafer LH. Teams could turn Chipper around and bat LH. Ummm…you get the picture right? Our only RH hitter would be Escobar and a guy to play LF? That would idiotic.

BravesFanChris25

December 9th, 2009
7:13 pm

And a pile of nothing ~_~

VaBraveFan

December 9th, 2009
7:15 pm

i only caught the end of the Wren’s showtime, he did say that clubs are interested in our startes and he had trade parteners. And then he praised Tommy Hanson and JJ. He also said Chipper called him earlier today to find out what going on , he said all the currnt players are really excited about getting a adding a new bat.

VaBraveFan

December 9th, 2009
7:16 pm

Has**** trade partners

Jimmy Joe

December 9th, 2009
7:16 pm

I have serious doubts the Braves are going to be able to move Lowe. Too much money.

Then there is Vazquez. If we take all teams in the West out of the equation, and all teams in the NL East, then that leaves 16 teams. Lets take out Chicago White Sox and the Yankees. Both teams have been there and done that. So that leaves:

Boston
Tampa Bay
Baltimore
Toronto
Minnesota
Detroit
Kansas City
Cleveland
St. Louis
Chicago(NL)
Milwaukee
Pittsburgh
Cincy
Houston

Lets take out Baltimore, Kansas City, Toronto, Cleveland, Tampa Bay, Cincy, Pittsburgh and Houston because there is just no way that those teams would want to give up what it would take for one year of Vazquez at 11.5 million. Those teams are looking to sell off high priced talent and build with prospects. That leaves:

Boston
Detroit
Minnesota
St. Louis
Chicago(NL)
Milwaukee

Detroit, Milwaukee and St.Louis have made trades/signings that have filled their need at starting pitcher. So that leaves:

Boston
Minnesota
Chicago(NL)

Three teams that could/would make a play of Vazquez. Did I mention the Braves might actually have needs of their own if they wanted to deal Vazquez??? So those teams may not match up.

I’m not seeing a Vazquez deal happening.

Bobby's Cox

December 9th, 2009
7:18 pm

…almost as idiotic as me leaving out 2 verbs in my last post ;)

MVH

December 9th, 2009
7:19 pm

Rob: what was there to say about Garret Anderson and was it you or Wren who was considering keeping Soriano?

Robert(Chipper Is The Best)

December 9th, 2009
7:20 pm

I don’t see the Rays trading Pena. They need the offense. I actually thought maybe Crawford could be part of the deal but I don’t think the Rays will trade him either in the end. Besides I don’t think Prado with Soriano would be enough for Pena or Crawford for that matter. I can almost bet the Rays would demand Schaefer or a better than solid pitching prospect too.

C's

December 9th, 2009
7:21 pm

One of my biggest pet peeves…………….people who knock certain moves but offer no alternatives or their opinion on what they would like to see happen or what they would do if they were in FW’s shoes.

Robert(Chipper Is The Best)

December 9th, 2009
7:21 pm

I said it awhile back and now it seems to be being confirmed. The Braves are not going to move Lowe without having to eat salary. It just isn’t realistic. I’m guessing they will try to get away with eating $6 to $9 mil but may have to eat as much as $15 mil.

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:22 pm

Jim Martin, December 9th, 2009, 6:49 pm … “a bum wrap…”

I know PETA is cutting into the fur trade. But, geez! Skinning bums for fashion? Say it ain’t so!

VaBraveFan

December 9th, 2009
7:23 pm

Jimmy Joe

Lackey is better than Lowe, But i would have to say Lowe is more of a sure thing when it comes to staying healthy and giving you innings. Say the braves eat 3 mil a year of Lowes contract. 12 mil a year for Lowe is what he would prolly command maybe more if he was a free agent. Lackey might get up to 18 million a year and he’s shown that he cant stay healthy. There are plenty Trade partners for Vasquez and Lowe. Wren has already comfirmed that there has been lots of interest in the starters.

glord1

December 9th, 2009
7:23 pm

If I was Wren these are the guys I would not move because of Upside and salary.

Hanson
Jurrjens
Prado
Escobar
McCann
Hayward

I would only move McLouth in a perfect deal. Still affordable and should bounce back bigtime this year.

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:24 pm

NS, December 9th, 2009, 7:09 pm … “Please recap what he says for us who can’t watch.”

Bobby Cox and John Scheurholz are future hall of famers.

Soriano surprised us.

We’ve talked about a six man rotation. But, we think we need to move a starting pitcher.

Tommy Hanson and Jair Jurrjens are great.

Chop Chop

December 9th, 2009
7:25 pm

I’d kinda like to see Wagner and Burrell on the same team. Wagner could call Pat “a rat” again, but this time, he could do it to Burrell’s face. Imagine Wags shouting “Pat the Rat, Pat the Rat!” over and over again.

It would be fun for us, right?

Chop Chop

December 9th, 2009
7:26 pm

VaBraveFan,

It’s also possible that Wren is just trying to talk Lowe up. That’s what happens at the Liars’ Table.

Jimmy Joe

December 9th, 2009
7:26 pm

There are plenty Trade partners for Vasquez and Lowe. Wren has already comfirmed that there has been lots of interest in the starters.- VaBravesfan

How can you disagree with what I just posted. Do you think Milwaukee and St. Louis are going to find 11.5 million under their sofa?

Steven

December 9th, 2009
7:27 pm

My only thought pattern is if we save about 15 million next year to keep the same payroll he would need to add a 10 million dollar bat to keep us about the same right? If they have to eat some Lowe money. Why then dont we ever go after the big bat clearly getting rid of lowe ,raffy,gonzo,kelly, clears lots of money? We should be in on Bay or Holiday.

NotAgain

December 9th, 2009
7:27 pm

people who knock certain moves but offer no alternatives or their opinion on what they would like to see happen or what they would do if they were in FW’s shoes

perhaps they are smart enough to know how useless those projections are since we have no idea what Wren is willing to do, no reason not to comment on a proposed trade etc. did you get your feelings hurt once or twice?

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:28 pm

More from Wren …
Chipper and McCann have called to see what’s up.

Garrett Anderson is a professional hitter who had a calf injury early in Spring Training. We gave him an honorary bum wrap as a parting gift.

Yunel Escobar and Martin (Marteeeeeeeeeen for Soph. Yes, Frank Wren said it just like that.) Prado were important parts of the team last year.

Steven

December 9th, 2009
7:28 pm

Lets Send Bobby out with a World Series Ring even if it means spending a few extra million. Cox deserves to go out on top.

brian

December 9th, 2009
7:29 pm

with Chris Ray going to Texas in the Millwood trade , does this perhaps open up Baltimore as a potential suitor for Soriano

MaineBrave

December 9th, 2009
7:30 pm

Man what a horrible time for my DIRECT TV to go out, wtf

Robert(Chipper Is The Best)

December 9th, 2009
7:31 pm

Someone just mentioned McClouth. Here is a somewhat wild idea but one I think has some merit. What if the Braves offered McClouth and Soriano to the Rays for Crawford. The Rays get a quality guy in McClouth they would control as long as they do Crawford but at a cheaper price. Moving Crawford frees up some space. The Braves then offer Lowe to the Angels for Reggie Wilits and some prospects or they approach the Yanks and ask for Melkey Cabrera and some quaility prospects.

TnBrian

December 9th, 2009
7:32 pm

I hope to read where the Bravos have acquired a big bat here soon. That isnt happening in a Soriano or Lowe deal, obviously, but don’t count Wren out on packaging one or both of these guys with some prospects to get that slugger they need.

MaineBrave

December 9th, 2009
7:34 pm

Robert:
The only way i see that happening is if we plan re-sign Carl, McLouth has 3 years left on his deal(if i remember correctly) and i can’t see us trading for Crawford for just one year.

Robert(Chipper Is The Best)

December 9th, 2009
7:35 pm

Again, just throwing out trade ideas but what about the Braves offering Lowe to the White Sox for Kornerko. Basically one bad contract for another. And, if I’m not mistaken the Braves would only have to worry about Kornerko for 2010 and he then becomes a free agent.

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:36 pm

According to Melvin from the Brewers, they want quality innings eater for a starter and some help in the bullpen. But, they don’t want to trade anything away.

Soriano and Lowe to Milwaukee for prospects?

MaineBrave

December 9th, 2009
7:37 pm

I’d dump Lowe for an Expiring contract everyday of the week.

[...] David O’Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution spoke with Braves GM Frank Wren who said “several teams” are talking to the Braves about [...]

TnBrian

December 9th, 2009
7:37 pm

I’m shocked at how dead these meetings are as far as making trades/signings. Rangers got Harden and that’s about the only news that’s worth mentioning. This things over tomorrow, right?

VP

December 9th, 2009
7:40 pm

There is not much going on tomorrow. If it ain’t happening tonight then it won’t go down in Indy. Tomorrow is a footrace to the airport.

Rob - in pain (from SC)

December 9th, 2009
7:40 pm

Wren did not sound like he wanted Soriano around

getsomepower

December 9th, 2009
7:40 pm

If Tampa Bay is the front runner for Soriano, hopefully we can pry Zobrist from them. Would any of you do Soriano for Zobrist straight up?

VP

December 9th, 2009
7:41 pm

A quality major leaguer for Soriano? Sign me up right now.

abwright

December 9th, 2009
7:45 pm

Kevin Millwood to the O’s. KM never seemed to reach the potential I thought he might have.

His next stop is probably the Pirates or the Royals.

MVH

December 9th, 2009
7:46 pm

getsomepower, getreal

Eric B

December 9th, 2009
7:47 pm

I wish we could get Zobrist for Soriano, heck I’d take Zobrist for Raffy and pay a mil or two of his expected salary…however I highly doubt it will happen. We’d(the Braves) be making out like a bandit imo.

Ronald Millsaps

December 9th, 2009
7:48 pm

Derek Lowe and Jordan Schafer for Jeff Francoeur and Angel Pagan.

Mixxo

December 9th, 2009
7:50 pm

getsomepower -

Zobrist for Sori?

In a skinny minute!

getsomepower

December 9th, 2009
7:52 pm

MVH – Tampa needs a closer to compete with Red Sox and Yankees. They will take Soriano. Zobrist could play RF and is a switch hitter. It would be a good deal for both clubs.

ncscoots

December 9th, 2009
7:52 pm

Would any of you do Soriano for Zobrist straight up?

Why would a team that could have signed the guy three days ago for the cost of a draft pick, not do so, and then turn around and offer a current major leaguer? Are you saying they think Zobrist is worth less than a pick?!? If so, what does that say about the player, LOL? If not, then the proposal doesn’t really compute for the Rays.

glord1

December 9th, 2009
7:54 pm

The field players that Tampa is not going to move are -

Zobrist
Longoria
Crawford

I would also be surprised to see them move Bartlett.

Ronald Millsaps

December 9th, 2009
7:55 pm

I’d like to see Rafael Soriano stick around, too, given his age and slight concerns about Billy Wagner.

I stand by my Francoeur statements.

Acquiring B.J. Upton would be intriguing.

Randomly, Tampa has a reliever whose last name is “Balfour.” Those letters hardly look intimidating when on the back of a pitcher’s jersey, haha.

Randy J.

December 9th, 2009
7:56 pm

I really like Zobrist For Soriano.

MVH

December 9th, 2009
7:56 pm

Getsomepower, TB will not do that. They could have had Soriano for no compensation just three days ago, so why would they part with their reigning team MVP to get him now? But, if they will, then yes, I hope the Braves pull the trigger on that and I have no doubt the Braves would pull the trigger on that one.

TennesseePaul

December 9th, 2009
7:57 pm

Would any of you do Soriano for Zobrist straight up?

Sheeeesh this blog is really turning into a smut board.

Jeff R

December 9th, 2009
7:59 pm

If Wren moves Soriano (likely) and Lowe (slightly less likely), I think he’ll pick up a grand total of three solid prospects. All in all, that wouldn’t be a bad catch for moving two surplus pitchers an d dumping salary.

Last night, it was interesting to read that Wren wanted a shortstop prospect included for Lowe, I believe.

With Escobar at short, why would Wren seek a shortstop prospect versus a third base prospect, for instance? Escobar is going to be around longer than Chipper, I’d presume.

I can only think of two explanations: 1) Management may have Escobar in mind for a switch to third when Chipper shuffles off; 2) management doesn’t expect to retain Escobar’s services when he reaches free agency.

Curious to read what others think.

NCBravesFan

December 9th, 2009
8:00 pm

If TB was offering Zobrist for Soriano, Frank Wren would have immediately left the Winter Meetings, gotten in his car, kidnapped Soriano and hand delivered him to Tampa before the Rays changed their minds.

CB

December 9th, 2009
8:00 pm

Tennessee Paul,don’t be besmirching this fine blogger!

glord1

December 9th, 2009
8:01 pm

Zobrist slugged .948 last year while playimg every position on the field except pitcher and catcher (he is their emergency catcher btw). He did that for $415,000.

Zobrist was the most valuable Major league baseball player when looking at performance vs cost.

Would you trade him for one year of a solid relever being paid his market value?

Crazy Trades McKnee

December 9th, 2009
8:02 pm

Rafael Soriano for Matt Joyce and Carlos Pena. Braves pick up Soriano and Pena’s salaries.

Try that one on for crazy.

ncscoots

December 9th, 2009
8:02 pm

people who knock certain moves but offer no alternatives or their opinion on what they would like to see happen or what they would do if they were in FW’s shoes

Hey, I may not be able to solve Fermat’s Last Theorem, either, but I sure as bleep know the answer ain’t two plus two. Some numbletard opines the the latter, and I might just pipe up whether I can do the former or not.

DHD

December 9th, 2009
8:03 pm

If you’re going to get Zobrist, Crawford, Pena, etc. you will have to include Freeman, Schafer, etc. along with Soriano. They are NOT going to give us their studs for a guy we’re trying to dump.

rainman

December 9th, 2009
8:04 pm

i like scott for soriano. the o’s need to move him and neet a closer. Scott could platton with diaz and play some first as well.

Efrim

December 9th, 2009
8:05 pm

The Angels have offered SP Joe Saunders, SS Erick Aybar and CF Peter Bourjos to the Blue Jays for SP Roy Halladay, according to a report in the Toronto Sun.

Crazy Trades McKnee

December 9th, 2009
8:05 pm

Or Sean Rodriguez instead of Joyce.

glord1

December 9th, 2009
8:06 pm

rainman

December 9th, 2009
8:04 pm
i like scott for soriano. the o’s need to move him and neet a closer. Scott could platton with diaz and play some first as well.

Now that is a reasonable trade proposal. I would be very happy if that happened and it is possible.

FEAR

December 9th, 2009
8:07 pm

yeah Halos get halladay. so the phils don’t!

RM

December 9th, 2009
8:08 pm

BJ Upton has regressed over the last two seasons. Find a way to trade for the 2007 BJ Upton and I might be enthusiastic about picking him up.

Couch Tater

December 9th, 2009
8:09 pm

Scoots,

I think you may want to add TennPaul to that BAS cocktail party.

ncscoots

December 9th, 2009
8:09 pm

I can only think of two explanations:

How about the one where, “Hey, we have zero middle infield depth in the minors. Geez louise, there’s Brandon bleepin’ Hicks leading the parade, fercrissake. Think we could use another guy who could at least look up ‘Major League’ in the dictionary?”

tr

December 9th, 2009
8:10 pm

Speculation is boring. Ready for another back-to-back announcement.

Bill in VA

December 9th, 2009
8:10 pm

Jim Martin: Verrry good points in your 6:43 & 6:49 pm!!

Efrim

December 9th, 2009
8:13 pm

Matt Joyce and a prospect would be a pretty good haul for Soriano at this point.

Heath

December 9th, 2009
8:15 pm

Quick poll:

UK or UConn tonight?

Mitchie-san

December 9th, 2009
8:16 pm

From a Rays blog:

http://blogs.tampabay.com/rays/

UPDATE, 5:44: Another sign there may be a ways to go on a Soriano deal; his camp says it’s too early to say whether he would approve a trade to the Rays.

Crazy Trades McKnee

December 9th, 2009
8:16 pm

All the OF’s TB has under control in 2010:

Carl Crawford – LF $10 M in 2010
B.J. Upton – CF Arb 1 in 2010, Arb 2 in 2011, Arb 3 in 2012
Gabe Gross – RF Arb 2 in 2010, Arb 3 in 2011 (non-tender candidate)
Gabe Kapler – OF $1.05 M in 2010
Matt Joyce – OF 6 years of control left
Fernando Perez – CF 6 years of control left
Justin Ruggiano – OF 6 years of control left
Desmond Jennings – CF 6 years of control left

And I suppose you could count Pat Burrell – LF $9 M in 2010

chipperchop

December 9th, 2009
8:18 pm

Phillies are definetly in the fray for Halladay, they have Drabek, Happ, Brown to offer. I must say that is a pretty good haul.

hmmmm

December 9th, 2009
8:19 pm

why again are we trading Lowe and Soriano for a bag of balls? The players mentioned as hitters to be used with the money “savings” are a joke…. Just plug in Heyward, Schaefer, and Freeman instead of wasting the money and giving away good players..

TnBrian

December 9th, 2009
8:20 pm

That fu*** Soriano! I just feel he & his greedy agents are stauling Wren & his people from going after other needs, like improving the team.

Efrim

December 9th, 2009
8:21 pm

Phillies are definetly in the fray for Halladay, they have Drabek, Happ, Brown to offer. I must say that is a pretty good haul.

I think they would have to move Blanton’s salary to make a trade for Halladay.

ncscoots

December 9th, 2009
8:22 pm

Phillies are definetly in the fray for Halladay, they have Drabek, Happ, Brown to offer. I must say that is a pretty good haul

Except they wouldn’t offer even one of those guys for Cliff Lee. Not one. Hard to believe they’d offer all three, even for Halladay.

18 Wheels of Love

December 9th, 2009
8:22 pm

Here’s a simple formula to help determine what we will get for Soriano and Lowe.

Think of your 3 favorite prospects from any organization that you would like to see in our farm system.

Now completely forget about those 3 top prospects. Remove them from your memory banks entirely. We won’t be getting them. Think more along the lines of guys you have never heard of.

This way at least you won’t be disappointed when we don’t hit the motherload.

unbelievable

December 9th, 2009
8:22 pm

“From a Rays blog:

http://blogs.tampabay.com/rays/

UPDATE, 5:44: Another sign there may be a ways to go on a Soriano deal; his camp says it’s too early to say whether he would approve a trade to the Rays.”

doesnt matter, he doesnt get to decide where he goes. This isnt like a no trade clause, He’s given Wren the go ahead to trade him. He can now be moved anywhere whether he likes that team or not

Tiger Woods

December 9th, 2009
8:23 pm

The Angels have made an offer, according to Bob Elliott of the Toronto Sun. They’d give up Joe Saunders, Erick Aybar and Peter Bourjos for Halladay.

Sorry if this has been said.

TnBrian

December 9th, 2009
8:24 pm

The Angels are nuts if they think Toronto is taking that offer for Halladay & the Jays are even crazier if they accept it.

Mitchie-san

December 9th, 2009
8:25 pm

I wonder if they have that in writing yet.

FEAR

December 9th, 2009
8:25 pm

hey tiger how dem porn stars? haha

Burdell

December 9th, 2009
8:25 pm

Also from that Blog:

Also, in clarifying the rules, Soriano and agent Peter Greenberg would have to give permisson for the trade to a specific team, rather than a blanket approval.

Add your comment