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2,702 comments Add your comment
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:11 pm
Plus what scoots just said.
CB
November 9th, 2009
12:12 pm
Wren should be like the batter who comes up with the bases loaded- be patient and wait for his pitch before swinging. Wren is not a dummy,imo, he will find the best trade possible before making a deal.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
12:12 pm
If it all balances out and the Phils win 93, I’d bet they’d sign for that. We’ll see.
No bleep, LOL. Me, too.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
12:16 pm
to Texas
Vazquez
Sammons
to KC
Salty
Schafer
Logan
to Braves
Cruz
Soria
Jake W.
November 9th, 2009
12:18 pm
“nova scotia steve, gonzalez had a really good year, actually. he gets wild at times, but usually finds way to settle down and get it done. check out his stats with runners on. they are really good. anyways, every pitcher has their issues, but with gonzo weve got a stikeout guy who is a leader, who loves to take the ball, and gets it done more often than not. the braves could do alot worse than resigning mike gonzalez.”-DAP
Not to mention he’s our best lefty in the pen. Even if he’s not the closer and say they do give Moylan a chance to close like so many want. I’m sorry but I don’t want EOF pitching against Howard, Utley, and Ibanez on a consistent basis. He had a good year but it would be nice to have both those lefties. Gonzo may be a little wild, hit a few people, throw some wild pitches. At the end of the day though he gets the job done more times than not.
Not to mention I don’t think we will be getting Soriano back. Cubs need a closer. Maybe they go after Wagner but they also can afford to outbid us for Soriano. I think Gonzo is more affordable and he’s good. He like EOF and Moylan were overused. Hopefully we will have a pen next year where Bobby actually uses all of them so we can avoid the overuse of these key guys.
Efrim
November 9th, 2009
12:20 pm
Now I’m not claiming they’ll turn into the 09 Mets, or that the Braves will run away from them the next couple of years, but they have their issues and they will come home to roost sooner rather than later, IMO.
They have their issues, like most every team in baseball. Braves included. I disagree that Hamels is “not panning out”. I think that’s a bit strong. I think their rotation is pretty much what it is right now: Lee, Hamels, Blanton, Happ, Pedro/Moyer and at some point Kyle Drabek. I still like Madsen a lot. Based on his salary, I think they have to go with Lidge at closer, but I’m sure they will go out and get a relief pitcher of some sort. I’d just rather not knock the defending World Series champs and make it seem like they won’t be that difficult to pass. Not that you’re doing that, but I think the team has a lot more going for it.
Efrim
November 9th, 2009
12:22 pm
I meant two time defending NL champs*.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:26 pm
So we’d trade Vazquez, Schafer, Logan and Sammons for two players I wouldn’t trade Vazquez straight up for? I don’t think so.
scott
November 9th, 2009
12:29 pm
If we could get rid of Lowe and KK and add Bay, we would be set. Keep LaRoche at first and maybe Gonzalez.
CF McClouth
2B Prado
SS Escobar
RF Bay
C McCann
3B Chipper
1B LaRoche
LF Diaz
P (Insert)
When Heyward is ready he can take over in RF and Bay moves to LF with Diaz becoming super sub.
Hudson
Vazquez
Jurrjens
Hanson
Medlen etc.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:29 pm
Efrim- Dude, I was born and raised in Philly. I know and understand the fans and their support or lack thereof. I know the GM. Their salary level is not sustainable Count on it.
CB
November 9th, 2009
12:31 pm
scott,you lost your credibility when you put Bay in rf.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
12:33 pm
why not lew?
Efrim
November 9th, 2009
12:35 pm
Efrim- Dude, I was born and raised in Philly. I know and understand the fans and their support or lack thereof. I know the GM. Their salary level is not sustainable Count on it.
Lew, I’m not talking about 2011 and beyond(and actually wasn’t referring to their salary). I’m talking about next season. I haven’t seen anything written about them having to cut payroll. I’m well aware that they won’t be able to have a similar payroll to the Yankees, but I’d bet that they can handle next years roster and won’t have to slim it down. All the key players on that team is under contract for next season(unless you count Pedro as a key player). There certainly is a chance that they could upgrade by trading for a player that makes the league minimum, so that won’t effect payroll too much.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
12:37 pm
So Vazquez,Schaferr(who clearly is not ready),and Logan, arent worth Joakim Soria,and Nelson Cruz
Rock On......
November 9th, 2009
12:41 pm
As I see it, and assuming Heyward starts in RF from day 1 and a new bat is added for LF, the Braves will have a new and improved starting lineup in April compared to what they began with in 2009. Only McCann, Chipper, and Escobar are holdovers.
That alone should be worth more early victories. If the Mets are born again and can compete like we thought they would last year then the entire division (save the Nats) can beat up on each other throwing more losses into the mix. Given that, I will set the over/under at 90 wins for the division and I am taking the under. 93 wins will win the division going away IMHO.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:43 pm
Eavesdropper-First of all, three way trades are few and far between. Second of all, Vazquez is not going to command the players so many think he will because his success (and count on other GM’s knowing this) is due to pitching in Atlanta, where he’s comfortable and pitching in a pitcher friendly stadium (something Texas’s is not) fopr the first time.
Third of all, I’m far from convinced that Cruz is a. the player we need, or b. is really as good as he seemed in a season where he misses a sh!tpile of games.
And fourth and maybe most important to the other teams involved-Why do you think the Royals would trade a closer who is making league minimum (first year arb at worst) and they have under contractual control for three more years for any of the players you mentioned?
KC
November 9th, 2009
12:47 pm
N8: “Like I said, I too think they’ll have a better year next year with guys like Hudson and Hanson around all year. But will it be enough?
It goes deeper than just having Hudson and Hanson for a full season.
We saw extraordinary upgrades at 3 positions (CF, 2B, RF) – not even including LaRoche – mid-way through the season, and those changes will be in place on day-1 next year.
I think the Braves will improve the roster. But even if they don’t; even if they remain only AS good as they were in the second half of last season (when they had the best record in the league from June 28 until the last week of the season)… they WILL top 90 wins.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
12:49 pm
while Iagree Lew,it still makes more sense than DanUggla!
Rock On......
November 9th, 2009
12:52 pm
KC….they will top 90 wins only IF they find a way to top the Nats consistently. Tongue-in-cheek but half serious too.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:54 pm
Efrim-Couple of points re: the Phils and 2010. First of all, I wouldn’t be surprised if Hamels comes up lame. He sure hasn’t been pitching like the guy they thought they had and while I’m not claiming he isn’t a decent 2-3 pitcher, they expected him to be an Ace and he just isn’t-sometimes not even a decent 2-3, like late in the year and during the post season.
Lidge is a drag on that team (salary wise and performance wise) unless he can repeat the success (or close to it) that he had in 08-he won’t.
Ibanez will not hit like he did the first half of last year-Dude had a career year and it won’t be repeated.
Rollins’ first half last year is quite indicative of the way the Phillies’ team plays at times (and they go through stretches of various duration every year) like they forgot how to play. Don’t expect that to change and if the Braves can take advantage of it ( like they did NOT the first half of 09), then not only will the Phillies not run away with the Division, they won’t be able to beat our pitching in the Playoffs.
The Phillies are an offensive juggernaut (at times)-like I said, no doubt. The rest of the team and their consistency can make one wonder at times and during major stretches, whether or not they remember what they’re doing and how to do it. This year we couldn’t take advantage. Next year and thereafter? I wouldn’t count us out. The Phillies have a good team with a great offense, but they are hardly invincible.
O'Brien
November 9th, 2009
12:54 pm
Even if Lidge goes back to his old self, and Hamels continues to struggle, the bottom line is both these pitchers were a major reason why the Phills won the world series last year.
Hamels was World Series and NLDS MVP, and Lidge was 48 for 48 in save chances (regular season and playoffs combined). What I question (in terms of Lidge), is why they gave him the big contract when they did.
Billy Walsh
November 9th, 2009
12:55 pm
I would have a hard time trading one starter…but two? Leaving the roster as is..I don’t see the braves as a 90 win team. Not with the Mets getting healthy and upgrading their outfield and starting staff, and the Phils tweaking their roster by adding a more proven starter. Not to mention the Nationals, who will have Lannan, Jordan Zimmerman, and Strasburg in their starting rotation next year.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
12:56 pm
Eavesdropper-Lots of deals make more sense than Dan Uggla.
P. W. Hjort
November 9th, 2009
12:58 pm
KC (November 9, 2009 12:47 PM EST) I think the Braves will improve the roster. But even if they don’t; even if they remain only AS good as they were in the second half of last season (when they had the best record in the league from June 28 until the last week of the season)… they WILL top 90 wins.
That makes a lot of assumptions. Diaz’s production is sustainable. Prado’s production is sustainable. Vazquez’s production is sustainable. The team will continue to hit better with RISP than without. Etc…
Not saying they won’t, but you’ve gotta pick and choose and acknowledge your assumptions.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:01 pm
personally I dont want him traded, but what about J.V for M. Cuddyer?
Lew
November 9th, 2009
1:01 pm
O’Brien-That was then and this is now. They won the WS with Lidge being lights out and Hamels pitching like an ACE. They didn’t do it this year (not really close actually) when those two settled back to human levels. What makes you think Lidge’s perfect season or Hamels ace like performance are the norm for them instead of what we just saw this fall?
RC
November 9th, 2009
1:03 pm
That makes a lot of assumptions. Diaz’s production is sustainable. Prado’s production is sustainable. Vazquez’s production is sustainable. The team will continue to hit better with RISP than without. Etc…
Not saying they won’t, but you’ve gotta pick and choose and acknowledge your assumptions. – P.W. Hjort
Another thing to keep in mind is that both the Phillies and the Mets should be better than they were at the start of last season as well. Philly added Cliff Lee, giving them a true #1 to go in front of Hamels, while the Mets should be getting about $10 gajillion back from the disabled list (approximate value). Seriously, Beltran/Reyes/Santana will all be back for NY, and I’m betting they’ll get SOMEONE other than David Murphy to play 1b (or is it Daniel Murphy?? I get them mixed up).
Lew
November 9th, 2009
1:03 pm
Eavesdropper-From what I’ve been reading, the Twins signed Cuddyer to prove to Maurer that they were serious about contending so he’d sign long term. I don’t see them turning around and trading Cuddyer for an $11.5 salary.
Andrew
November 9th, 2009
1:04 pm
why didnt boston pick up victor martinez’s contract yet
Rock On......
November 9th, 2009
1:05 pm
Lew…yeah, Uggla always just kills Atlanta. His defense will lose more games than his bat will win and that is never a good wash. Ditto Dunn or any other crazy rumor floating around. Of all the players that just kill Atlanta pitching it seems Ethier in LA is right at the top. There is a player I would want for LF.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
1:07 pm
RC-What exactly, makes ytou think Reyes and Santana will be back right off the bat? Reyes just missed damned near an entire season with leg issues and didn’t have it surgically repaired til after the season. Johan didn’t even HAVE the surgery to resolve his problem. There is no guarantee either will return to full strength early in the season.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
1:07 pm
But even if they don’t; even if they remain only AS good as they were in the second half of last season
You mean, when you had a .950 OPS from LaRoche (who, by the way, is not on the squad for 2010), an .850 OPS from Escobar, “as good” like that? Even if you think McLouth and McCann and Chipper are all going to return to some semblance of previous norms, you’re being awfully optimistic calling for 90 wins from the club as currently constituted.
Even if LaRoche is re-signed (or a similar bat replaces him), the Braves still need another big bat. Otherwise, you’re still going to have Escobar batting near the middle of the order, probably. If he’s the best option to hit, say, 6th, then the team hasn’t really upgraded the offense. Nor will they gain any traction towards overtaking the Phillies.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
1:08 pm
by the way, the twins look like they could really score some runs in 2010. hardy, mauer, morneau, kubel, cuddyer…thems some hitters.
Lew
November 9th, 2009
1:08 pm
Not to mention that this IS the Mets and they can always find a way to make the absolute wrong personnel decision. They have a positive penchant for it.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:09 pm
Brutal honesty says Cruz,Cuddyer,Ludwick are the type of hitters to expect in return for JV
CB
November 9th, 2009
1:12 pm
I think if the Braves are to win 90 games some improvement needs to be made to the offense to balance out this lineup- it needs either the one big bopper or two good hitters for LF and 1B. You have to expect the Phillies to stay about the same and the Mets to improve dramatically.
O'Brien
November 9th, 2009
1:13 pm
Lew – We are actually on the same page. I would not be surprised if Lidge goes back to the Lidge of old (not 48 for 48 Lidge). And Cole Hamels may not return to ACE form.
But the point I was trying to make, is that the Phillies got their world series championship, so in my opinion, even if those guys continue to struggle, they still helped bring Philly a championship.
So Philly will just make changes accordingly. If they resign Cliff Lee, Hamels could be a good #2, they still have Happ, plus their highly touted pitching prospect Drabek. And there is talk on MLBTR that they could end up with Jose Valverde.
P. W. Hjort
November 9th, 2009
1:14 pm
Another thing to keep in mind is that both the Phillies and the Mets should be better than they were at the start of last season as well.
Why does that have any bearing on getting to 90 wins?
RC
November 9th, 2009
1:14 pm
Lew – The Mets could very well have issues with Reyes and Santana not returning to full strength. However, Beltran has already proved at the end of last season that he was healthy enough to play, and should be able to heal more over the winter. And even if Reyes and Santana are not at full strength when they get back, even at 75% they are better than the players that were replacing them last year. I also think that knowing they have question marks going into the season should cause the Mets to have better backup plans in place than they did this year (although your point about them always messing up personel decisions rings very, very true).
Efrim
November 9th, 2009
1:15 pm
Brutal honesty says Cruz,Cuddyer,Ludwick are the type of hitters to expect in return for JV
Imagine the explosion on this blog if the Braves send Javier Vazquez to the Cards for Ryan Ludwick? I just can’t see Wren going through with something like that.
P-Town Brave
November 9th, 2009
1:17 pm
I actually think Ludwick would play well in Atlanta, but at this point, JV should command a bit more than that.
Also, I don’t see the Cards parting with him if they can’t resign Holliday as they already parted ways with Ankiel.
As most have said, its really hard to gauge JV’s value, BUT also like some have said, you better get a haul for him otherwise you will be crucified by everyone as he is not only a managers favorite, but a team, AND a fan favorite as well.
I still would rather trade KK, but I don’t see having a 15M player in the 4 or 5 slot in the rotation, and not only that, it seems like Frank doesn’t want to burn the perverbial bridge from Asia to Atlanta.
The trade will need to be soon though as then the team would be able to assess how much money they can spend on 1b and the OF.
I am one who doesn’t expect the team to rely on “what ifs” and projections as isn’t that what they did w/ the offense at the beginning of 09?
Look where that got them!
DAP
November 9th, 2009
1:20 pm
scoots, in what kind of lineup would yunel escobar batting 6th be a bad thing? i can only think of one team in the majors where yunel batting 6th wouldnt be the best option.
reagan
November 9th, 2009
1:21 pm
Efrim (11:47) (about Wren) …”this guy knows a lot more than we do”…………………You bet! Plus…he has Cox, JS and great scouts to draw from. Yea…they MIGHT know more than us.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:22 pm
unless you step up to the next tier like M. Kemp,A.Ethier types which would require GULP Jurjjens
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
1:24 pm
scoots, in what kind of lineup would yunel escobar batting 6th be a bad thing?
A lineup that wants to score 800 runs in a season. That one.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
1:26 pm
scoots, so where do you bat the guy with a OPS over .800 including a OBP of around .375?
KC
November 9th, 2009
1:30 pm
P. W. Hjort, it makes assumptions in the other direction as well.
That assumes that Nate McLouth won’t hit any better than .208 at Turner Field. It assumes that Chipper won’t hit better than .264 for the season. It assumes that Brain McCann WILL again be hampered for 1/4 the season with a vision problem…
You catch my drift? There is always room for things to go better OR worse. I don’t think the Braves had a team full of guys playing way over their heads. They had some guys that might have been playing above their heads, and others who weren’t performing to the best of their ability. It usually balances out.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:32 pm
face it,either the team a has to pony up for Bay,Holliday,step up with jurrjens, or settle for Cuddyer,Ludwick types for Vazquez, Lowe is damn near un-tradeable
chuckw/deadjournalist
November 9th, 2009
1:34 pm
i know everyone is obsessed with getting a power-hitting outfielder, but personally, i’d rather have a table-setter at the top of the order the likes of which the braves haven’t had in years.
hello chone figgins.
since he can play anywhere, the idea of slotting him in left field on days he didn’t play in place of chipper at third, is a plus. throw in almost 50 steals a year, great base running, and an OBP of .393 or higher two of the last three years …
he’s a type-b free agent, so no loss of a 1st round pick would be a big plus for the braves. he’s also a local-ish guy, who has been linked with the braves for years. plus his signing would allow mcclouth to hit lower in the order, where is power would be better utilized (maybe 6th).
Daslied
November 9th, 2009
1:35 pm
Andrew – Boston just picked up Martinez’ option. Like, minutes ago.
O.J.
November 9th, 2009
1:35 pm
Lowe is not damn near un-tradeable. Have you not been listening to all the talks these past few weeks? There are very few, if any, front line starters other than Lackey out there right now, and what GM is going to pay top dollar for a Randy Wolfe type when they could have Lowe at the same price?
O.J.
November 9th, 2009
1:39 pm
15 million a year for Lowe for the next 3 years is about what he would get this winter if he were a free agent right now, so its not impossible to think they cannot trade him.
Rob (from SC) no more arm brace
November 9th, 2009
1:39 pm
For me, I don’t really care what we get back for Derek Lowe. It is more about shedding payroll. I would offer they Yankees Lowe for David Robertson plus a prospect
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:39 pm
I can give you 45 million reasons Lowe will not bring the desired bat that Vazquez will.
CB
November 9th, 2009
1:41 pm
I would rather have Chone Figgins than a mediocre answer like Jermaine Dye,although hard to agree with a dead journalist.
Frank Robinson (Rockmart)
November 9th, 2009
1:42 pm
Those two teams constitute 1/5 of our schedule for one.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
1:43 pm
scoots, so where do you bat the guy with a OPS over .800 including a OBP of around .375?
That’s easy, if you have a lineup of run-producing bats at 3-6: you hit him at 2, where his offensive skills can both create run-producing opportunities and produce runs when the lower part of the order creates opportunities. That’s the easiest part of the whole equation. Getting offensive depth in the lineup that would allow you to do that is the hard part.
Ask yourself this question: would you be satisfied hitting Escobar at 5 against LH pitchers, and doing so because he’s your best option? If not, then you need a bigger bat to hit at 6. And that, currently, is the state of the Braves’ offense.
It’s not just that the Braves need offense in the middle of the order; it’s that adding enough offense to the middle of the order allows Bobby the flexibility to use players where they can be most effective, in the context of that revamped lineup, rather than being forced to use players at slots simply because the player is the best option available.
O.J.
November 9th, 2009
1:43 pm
I can give you 1 reason on why Vazquez wouldnt get you as big a bat as some of you think he might bring back.
Warhead
November 9th, 2009
1:44 pm
O.J: Lowe is close to untradeable at his salary. Wolfe won’t get $15 million per year. He’s get $8-10, most likely. If they Braves can trade Lowe, they won’t get much in return. I’m OK with that if they can sign Jason Bay to play LF.
Frank Robinson (Rockmart)
November 9th, 2009
1:44 pm
P. W. Hjort
November 9th, 2009
1:14 pm
Another thing to keep in mind is that both the Phillies and the Mets should be better than they were at the start of last season as well.
Why does that have any bearing on getting to 90 wins?
Those two teams constitute 1/5 of our schedule for one.
P-Town Brave
November 9th, 2009
1:46 pm
Chuck-
It wouldn’t matter if we had Chone Figgins, Juan Pierre, Usain Bolt, or Carl Lewis on first base.
Bobby doesn’t run! Its as simple as that, thus 90% of why everyone wants the power hitter.
Anyone who wants to disagree w/ me, feel free to provide some sort of proof on how I am wrong. Even Furcal came up after stealing ~80 bases granted in a minor league season, but drastically shrunk his total while in Atlanta and he was by far the best base stealing threat we’d had for quite awhile. Not a fan favorite by any, but Kenny Lofton was ruined in Atlanta.
Just trying to state simple facts really…
Bobby loves the station to station and the 3-run homer.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
1:51 pm
Bobby loves the station to station and the 3-run homer.
Winning ballgames will do that to you.
O.J.
November 9th, 2009
1:53 pm
Ok Guys and Gals, think of it this way. If Lowe were a free agent, he and Lackey would be the only pitchers that other teams would want, and when they were signed, then the lesser players would get bid on, so to speak. maybe, maybe not, but that is my hope.
P-Town Brave
November 9th, 2009
1:55 pm
Scoots-
Its not too difficult to get used to either when you have a HR hitting lineup that includes Grissom, Jones, McGriff, Justice, Lopez, and Klesko.
Unfortunately we don’t have those players anymore or play in that ballpark.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
1:56 pm
if you have a lineup of run-producing bats at 3-6:
im not sure what you mean by “run producing bat” but escobar was pretty good at doing that last year. looking at the braves lineup, weve got one full of guys OPSing between .800-.850 which is pretty good. finding a guy who will constantly give you .900+ OPS is pretty tuff to do. i think escobar is a very good #2 hitter, (so is prado) but i also think that he is good at #5.
the reason we have this conflict of where guys fit in the lineup is that you and i have very different expectations on who the braves can get to help out. your opinion is built on the premise that wren will be able to get us a much better offensive player than i am assuming he can get.
you should probably consider that our guy might end up being jermaine dye instead of jason bay.
chuckw/deadjournalist
November 9th, 2009
1:58 pm
p-town –
i agree that bobby isn’t a steal-a-minute manager but figgins base running prowess would be a plus – especially since prado (who seems to stay in the second slot in the order) lead the team in doubles. in left, he’d be an upgrade over anderson and would add protection if chipper were to miss significant time.
Eavesdropper
November 9th, 2009
1:59 pm
From afar depending on JV trading partners are limited.Lowe has more optuins with less return, so that deduces out to Jurrjens being traded!
rammerjammer
November 9th, 2009
2:01 pm
“Bobby doesn’t run! Its as simple as that, thus 90% of why everyone wants the power hitter. Anyone who wants to disagree w/ me, feel free to provide some sort of proof on how I am wrong.”(P-Town Brave)
In 2000, the Braves were 2nd in the NL in stolen bases. They were 3rd in ‘91. If Bobby has the horses, he runs. You are wrong and there’s the proof.
P-Town Brave
November 9th, 2009
2:06 pm
Ok rammer, maybe you got me there but then again, one example was 18 years ago and the other was 9.
So once in the decade the Braves actually stole bases is what you’re telling me correct?
ccrider
November 9th, 2009
2:12 pm
Perhaps the Braves need to look at this from another direction. Everything is wrapped around offense with the Yankees, Phillies, Dodgers, Red Sox Angels, Etc. What if Frank Wren hit a wall on getting a big bat and instead was able to include Derek Lowe, KK, Medlen and some prospects to acquire Roy Halladay. He could then use the money left to sign Laroche, Mike Cameron and upgrade the bullpen. A rotation of Halladay, JJ, Hanson, Vazquez and Hudson, with a shutdown bullpen and a upgraded defensive outfield CF Cameron, LF McLouth and” Eventually Heyward” (This is his new name since the Braves will keep him at AAA till June). Laroche, Escobar, Prado and McCann are all solid to exceptional in the infield and hopefully Chipper will rebound from 2009. If you can’t outscore them, then stop them from scoring!
Black Betty
November 9th, 2009
2:13 pm
What they’re telling you is that when the Braves have the personnel to run, they run. Take a step back from negative town and let someone else share an opinion.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
2:14 pm
i think getting a player like figgins and letting that be it is a terrible idea.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
2:14 pm
you should probably consider that our guy might end up being jermaine dye instead of jason bay.
ACtually, I’m pretty sure that the difference in our expectations is that I don’t have any. I neither expect that a certain player should be the centerpiece acquisition, nor do I assume that any player is unavailable to become that acquisition. I do make the assumption that the GM will do everything in his power to secure the best players available that meets the perceived team needs and fits whatever other criteria may be applied.
Daslied
November 9th, 2009
2:14 pm
P-Town – Atlanta team SB rankings since 1990 (average or better):
2005 – 11 (92 SB)
2004 – 16 (86 SB)
2000 – 2 (148 SB)
1999 – 6 (148 SB)
1993 – 11 (125 SB)
1992 – 14 (126 SB)
1991 – 3 (165 SB)
Bobby will send them. Looking back, in the 90s the average leading team had around 200+ SB. In the last ten years most leading teams were around 140-150.
Greg Olson Homers
November 9th, 2009
2:16 pm
“What if Frank Wren hit a wall on getting a big bat and instead was able to include Derek Lowe, KK, Medlen and some prospects to acquire Roy Halladay.”
You lost me there. No way the Jays would take on Lowe’s contract.
rammerjammer
November 9th, 2009
2:19 pm
Ah, P-Town, so now you want to qualify your terms? Let me repeat, when Bobby has the horses, it is a fact that he will run. That it doesn’t happen often is more a reflection of an organizational philosophy that values power over speed in player drafting and acquisitions. It doesn’t mean that every decade Bobby decides to turn ‘em loose!
DAP
November 9th, 2009
2:20 pm
p-townthus 90% of why everyone wants the power hitter.
i think having a team slg% hovering at .400 is why most people want a power hitter.
i wouldnt mind having a guy like chone figgins who can steal 50 bases, either, but i honestly dont think it would do as much good as a guy who slugs over .500. and i dont think having a leadoff guy like that will help this offense score more runs overall until we find a way to raise that slg%.
Donald Trump
November 9th, 2009
2:23 pm
DOB you’re fired!
Fire DOB!
DAP
November 9th, 2009
2:24 pm
scoots I do make the assumption that the GM will do everything in his power to secure the best players available that meets the perceived team needs and fits whatever other criteria may be applied.
im with you here. i guess im having a hard time allowing anything to seem within wren’s reach.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
2:25 pm
If you can’t outscore them, then stop them from scoring!
Tried that last year, my friend (fewest RA since 2002, and before that, you have go back to 1998 to find better). Turned out not so swift.
You end up with diminishing returns on both sides of the differential ledger, after a certain point. Just not much more blood left in that run-prevention turnip, LOL.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
2:29 pm
im with you here. i guess im having a hard time allowing anything to seem within wren’s reach.
That’s why I keep trying to get you to pick up the other glass, LOL…you know, the one that’s not half-empty?
Brother, you can be all realistic and open-eyed and right-brained in March, but this is November…imagination should get free rein until Wren’s actions provide impetus to do otherwise. That’s my story, and I’m stickin’ to it, LOL.
ccrider
November 9th, 2009
2:32 pm
Greg Olson Homers: The Blue Jays might if they either thought that with Lowe, KK, Medlen and their young hitters they could have a shot at the wild card or if they thought Lowe and KK might be valuable trade chips at the trade deadline. They already cleared at lot of salary with the Alex Rios trade and Halladay would be about the same as Lowe. A rebound year from Lowe would make the Jays a possible WC contender, along with KK and Medlen or bring back some good prospects in trade at the deadline, PLUs it would show the fans that they were not just dumping the 2010 season.
richbrave
November 9th, 2009
2:40 pm
RANDOM:
Ha,ha,ha. Which are you? Opinions are like a—holes son, everybody got one. You just show yours more often than most I see.
ccrider
November 9th, 2009
2:50 pm
ncscoots: It did fall short in the first half of the season, but after we got Laroche we were almost just as good as the Phillies or anyone else in the NL. If, you replace Loaf with Cameron it is a upgrade, build a deeper bullpen, Heyward arrives, Prado a whole season,Halladay and Hudson instead of Lowe and KK are all upgrades from the team that made a great run in the 2nd half of the season. I don’t think any teams,even the Phillies, would want to face that rotation and defense,PLUS, Laroche and Prado all season, along with Heyward will increase the offensive and defensive performance>
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
3:00 pm
Bro, Prado had 450 ABs and over 500 appearances; somehow, I think that’s pretty close to a “full year”, no? LaRoche hasn’t been signed yet, and asking him to produce .950 over a full year might be a stretch. As far as Cameron goes, I think I’m record on THAT topic, LOL. And Heyward may indeed be ROY next year, but I think it’s more likely that he’ll play more like, well, a rookie. Not a big fan of hanging my hopes on any first-year player, thanks.
So, I guess I’m saying that the concept of incrementally changing a team that had a good second half doesn’t quite do it for me, LOL.
NamVetInPhnx
November 9th, 2009
3:01 pm
A lot of talk on XM radio this morning about the MLB meetings in Chicago this morning and when mentioning the Braves they said talk of a Lowe,Schafer and minor league IF named Brandon Hicks to Texas for Nelson Cruz is starting to heat up. Texas is willing to take on Lowe’s full salary if Atlanta included Schafer and Hicks. Goes on to say Texas will look to resign M.Byrd and possibly acquire another OF to replace Cruz. If I’m the Braves then this is a deal I want to make. Really, Texas would be foolish to pass on it as well.
ncscoots
November 9th, 2009
3:06 pm
Really, Texas would be foolish to pass on it as well.
No bleep. A ML starter and two minor leaguers for a 30-year-old with one good year? Yes, I’d think the Rangers might be ready to make that deal, geez louise.
Bobby's Belly
November 9th, 2009
3:06 pm
Why would Texas want Lowe AND his salary. They actually have a good rotation developing in TX.
Andy K.
November 9th, 2009
3:06 pm
NamVet, I’d take that deal with a little restructuring… Lowe, Brandon Jones, Julio Teheran and Diory Hernandez for Cruz, with us still eating a few million of Lowe’s salary. The futures for Schafer especially, and Hicks are bot too bright.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
3:06 pm
mentioning the Braves they said talk of a Lowe,Schafer and minor league IF named Brandon Hicks to Texas for Nelson Cruz is starting to heat up.
does that seem like alot to anyone else? i guess the idea is that we are adding in prospects sp that texas will take all of lowes salary? i honestly dont love the sound of that deal.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
3:08 pm
I’d take that deal with a little restructuring… Lowe, Brandon Jones, Julio Teheran and Diory Hernandez for Cruz, with us still eating a few million of Lowe’s salary.
what? no!
ccrider
November 9th, 2009
3:08 pm
NamVetInPhnx: A pitching Prospect instead of Schafer and I do it. I believe Cruz is far from a sure thing and I would rather include some money than Schafer, who I think will be our CF this time next year.
DAP
November 9th, 2009
3:09 pm
i was gonna say sub brandon jones for schafer in that deal. lowe, jones, hicks for cruz, with texas taking on all of lowe’s salary.
braves fan lmh
November 9th, 2009
3:09 pm
OFFSEASON WISH LIST:
Trade Kelly Johnson for Jake Fox
Sign Chone Figgins
Sign Billy Wagner
Re-sign Adam Laroche
Sign Brandon Lyon
BravesfaninWis
November 9th, 2009
3:10 pm
Amazing that nothing has been mentioned about who the Braves are interested in. I have read so many articles of what every other team is interested in, except the Braves. While I am hopeful that Wren can improve this team, I won’t hold my breath on it happening. Afterall, this is the same guy that passed on some OF’s that could have actually of helped us and instead signed Loaf Anderson because he was cheaper. That is all its about in Atlanta, who IS the cheapest, and who MIGHT help us. That is why they won 14 straight division titles, and only 1 WS Title.
chip off the ol block
November 9th, 2009
3:10 pm
DOB, or anyone
is there any news on when Huddy’s announcement will be that he signed with us?
I know it was supposed to be sometime this week, but haven’t herd any more
RC
November 9th, 2009
3:10 pm
DAP,
I agree with you entirely. It almost sounds like the deal is Schafer and Hicks for Nelson Cruz, and then we throw in Derek Lowe as long as Texas takes $45 million off our books.
Bobby's Belly
November 9th, 2009
3:11 pm
Wren is GM of the decade if he does this deal. Lowe is not needed by the Braves and he clears $45 mil. Shocked I’m in the minority on this one.
Sgt. Pepper
November 9th, 2009
3:11 pm
DOB –
Any of those people asking why in the world the Braves would trade Vazquez happen to be Frank Wren? Because that would make me feel a lot better.
P-Town Brave
November 9th, 2009
3:14 pm
Yeah, I think that is way too much for Cruz unless the whole point is because they’re taking Lowe’s entire salary and no one else will.
I like Cruz, but not that much. Maybe if it included CJ Wilson as well I might be more interested.