3:20 pm September 23, 2009, by David O'Brien
September 23rd, 20096:16 pm
Its not all on Bobby. Even if he makes a different move than we would do, its still on the players too perform. It doesnt matter if KJ or Norton or Ross go out there, there on a major league roster for a reason. To perform. Yall would be saying he made bad moves if we lost those gms. For Example
We complain he didnt rest Soriano and Gonzo enough but if he brought in Medlen to close out the game instead of puting Gonzo or Soriano out there for the 5th game in a row, and Medlen blows it we say what was Bobby thinking ???? Its on the players too. Not Just Bobby.
September 23rd, 20096:17 pm
“So Cox is back for one more year of over using relief pitching, another season of leaving starters in the game too long, and of course using players like Greg Norton when he’s hitting under .200. It’s time for Cox to go. The manager has cost us over 10 games this season.”
This might be my favorite anti-Bobby post of the day above. I love how Bobby both over used his relief pitching AND left his starters in too long! This is classic stuff, I tell ya!
September 23rd, 20096:18 pm
You have a lil sis…? I bet see will be taught Proud on being loyal to Dem Braves!
What will her blog name be in a few years…?
McFann’s Cans or something…?
As a matter of fact I’m Suprised there isn’t a blogger who goes by the name “McDaddy On Here” I think that might be my next blog name in a few years…Or Justice4all
September 23rd, 20096:20 pm
My guess is that an AJC writer was Edes’ source. It makes sense, in that the season is concluding, and speculation is/was flying about Bobby Cox’s future. But the AJC writer couldn’t poison the well, so to speak, so he outsources the story to Edes and Yahoo Sports. The AJC then has plausible deniability and can repeat what SOMEONE ELSE FIRST REPORTED in the hope they will be insulated from the wrath of Cox, Wren, the Braves, Chief Nok-A-Homa. Just a theory.
How the hell did Cox blindside everyone for personal reasons???
McFann – how are the Blue Jays down there. I fear my fat f…er has gone for good. I miss his little beer belly !
“Granted Bobby didn’t have a bunch of Ichiros to pick from, but KJ, Schafer, and Francoeur were absolutely destroying our offense. And Kelly was batting leadoff forever!”
Co-Sign, Cox’s Stubbornness to change the lineup early this year cost us…especially dropping games to the AAA pirates and AAA Nats
Kelly Johnson Fan Club
September 23rd, 20096:21 pm
It’s time for Cox to go. The manager has cost us over 10 games this season.
You are absolutely delusional. If there was a manager who could improve a team’s record by 5 wins, teams would pay $20 million for him. Such is not the case. You’re completely overstating a manager’s impact.
I’m gonna put this up one more time:
We love the Atlanta Braves. There, we said it. We have loved them since Dale Murphy was patrolling the outfield for the never-say-die, perpetually-out-of-the-pennant-race-by-May teams of the mid-80s. And, thanks to the SuperStation, there are a lot of us Braves fans out there. We fell in love with Murphy and Bob Horner and Ken Oberkfell and stayed in love when those heroes gave way to David Justice, Ron Gant, Steve Avery, Tom Glavine and John Smoltz. And starting in 1978 and again in 1991 when he came back from the front office as a general manager to become the manager of our Atlanta Braves, we fell in love with Bobby Cox.
please read my Bobby Cox tribute at:
The whole Norton fiasco literally knocked the wind out of me.
September 23rd, 20096:23 pm
Geeze, is there any middle ground here? Bobby is either a mastermind being considered for Secretary of Defense, or he belongs on the short bus.
Tomahawkin….I’m sorry, but dropping games to the Pirates and the Nats is on the players, not the manager. I don’t agree with everything Cox does, but he isn’t the one pitching or hitting. Just sayin’.
White Blood Cells
September 23rd, 20096:24 pm
Just sayin, when was the last time such key figures in the organization had to address these types of stories. Edes stands behind the story 100%. Maybe Bobby recounted these actions to Edes and it backfired. Who knows, but if you read between the lines, this is not the Braves way.
Steve from OH
I don’t agree with everything Cox does, but he isn’t the one pitching or hitting. Just sayin’.
Don’t see this line of reasoning here every day…
Dan in NJ
September 23rd, 20096:25 pm
I guess the Braves will be looking for a SS this winter. Esco will be gone for sure now that BC is back next year. I HOPE i’m wrong though.
The conspiracy theories are hilarious…keep ‘em coming.
September 23rd, 20096:27 pm
Not only Norton but Johnson, Francouer, taking pitchers out too soon or leaving them in too long.
Any word on whether Prado is still starting tonight?
Nova Scotia Steve - Goodbye Booby Cox
September 23rd, 20096:28 pm
Tomahawkin: Thanks for that comment earlier.
And for the record “njbraves”…I was the biggest Cox supporter around…Actually I just never talked about him on this blog…while some have smashed him all year.
It was actually only until recently that I turned on Cox and have been calling for his retiring.
1. The use of Medlan (in three straight games) against the Marlins…He got rocked in all three appearences.
2. His constant use of Greg Norton in big game situations.
3. The way he has handled the bullpen
The guy is a lock to make the HOF…and has over 2,000 victories….Good for him.
But its time to retire.
Didn’t know there were established guidelines for what “too soon/too long” really are. In fact, it stems simply from one’s own level of experience, competence and observation–and who ya betting on here, I wonder? You or Cox?
I don’t agree with everything Cox does, but he isn’t the one pitching or hitting
He is the one who hit KJ at leadoff or Chipper 3rd forever while they were struggling to stay above water. He’s the one who (still) puts Norton in in key spots, and he drowned a looong time ago.
No he’s not pitching or hitting, but he’s making it a lot harder to win by making some decisions that obviously won’t work out (obvious for everyone but him). When’s the last time you’ve said “Wow! That was a great decision Bobby made! That worked out brilliantly!” Obvious decisions don’t count.
September 23rd, 20096:29 pm
You sorry ass people got what you wanted Now be prepared to live with it. There’s going to be one sorry manager after another.Just can’t hold this great mans jock. And when that day come please stand up and face it like a man,because you won’t you gutlass wonders. You sicken me.
TnBrian(Vazquez ace 2010)
September 23rd, 20096:30 pm
Didn’t Kelly hit Prado in the leg once before in batting practice?
If you’ve been following since 1976, you’d realize the biggest scandals this organiztion has had to deal with are Turner making himself manager or Justice dogging the fans. This particular story is peculiar to this organization.
RE: jeffrey d “Geeze, is there any middle ground here? Bobby is either a mastermind being considered for Secretary of Defense, or he belongs on the short bus”
Made me laugh out loud dude
Yup–she’s 5 years younger than me. We do this whole “Braves Thing” together…course we have different favorites. That’s how it has to be–can’t really ever have the same favorite “characters” from anything, be it Hogan’s Heroes or the Braves…
What will her blog name be in a few years…? McFann’s Cans or something…?
LOL! Well, truth be told, the Blog is my territory. But if she did have a name on here, it wouldn’t have anything to do with McCann–she gets enough of that from me…think I bore her quite a bit with him. That’s why I let off so much “steam” or whatever on here…
She likes McLouth, Hanson, and Johnson the best (no particular order to the list I gave)…and she has told me that, being a Johnson fan, she doesn’t think she could be on here…
September 23rd, 20096:31 pm
I think it’s obvious that Gordo’s source was Paul Lentz. Not even Paul Lentz could influence Frank Wren enough to get rid of Bobby Cox. The best Lentz could do was get Bobby out after 2010. That’s why I hate Paul Lentz. The man just doesn’t have the kind of pull that he claims to have.
Didn’t know there were established guidelines for what “too soon/too long” really are.
Remember when Lowe kept throwing hanger after hanger? And Bobby thought “maybe one of those hangers will turn into a ground ball!” But instead, Lowe got lit up for like, 10 hits in the inning? That’s too long.
My guess is that an AJC writer was Edes’ source.
I smell Sox.
It was Norton who his Prado last time in BP.
First knock of the year for Norton.
I know….I know….un-freakin-believable
September 23rd, 20096:32 pm
Ok, you’re right. The past two days have been business as usual for this organization.
White Blood cells…..Do me a favor, don’t lecture me on this organization. I know how they do business, and I also know that thsi wouldn’t be the first time that an internet report wasn’t true.
September 23rd, 20096:33 pm
N. Sc Steve
No Prob Bob…
But Sending Conrad Down when he was hot in June was the last straw for me in somewhat supporting Cox…Keeping Norton on the squad was another reason why I had BF’s over and over agin…
There was a blue jay doing his hawk impersonation in our yard this afternoon. Love it when they do that–they’re trying to scare the other birds away so they cann eat all the food!
That’s too bad that yours is gone. Hope nothing happened to him…
My 6:32 was for Steve from Ohio – Sorry
Awesome! We’ve found the definition!
We’ve also found that Cox has violated it exactly once this season. Worthy of firing/running-out-of-town-on-a-rail/complete dismemberment? You tell me.
September 23rd, 20096:34 pm
14 years the Braves went to the post season. Fans complained that we only won one World series. They complain that we didn’t make it out of the NLCS. Then complain that we stopped making it out of the first round of the playoffs. Now the complaints are that we miss the post season.
It cracks me up. I personally was always happy we made the postseason. I was always heart broken when we got knocked out. I would much prefer going then not going.
Bobby Cox was instrumental in those 14 winning years. It is was his style and Leo’s talents that made guys like Denny Neagle champs.
It is Cox’s style that made Javier Vasquez this good this season. He is a cheerleader and in a sport that can turn on you as quickly as baseball can, guys need someone to help keep their confidence up. No one does that better then Cox. Javy struggled in Chicago because Ozzie called him out. He is not the type of guy who responds well to that management style.
His previous managers were Ozzie and Frank Robinson both tend to be hard nosed. That doesn’t work with all players.
Cox’s main issue (there are a couple) was refusing to pull KJ or Francouer and play his hot hands. Give them 100 abs, fine but he left them to die. Not his finest hours. Using Prado and Infante while they were hot would most likely given us at least 5 wins more likely 7-10.
I glad he is coming back for 1 more round and if you all want Chipper to retire. My best guess is that if Cox goes and TP or Don Baylor is not managing. Chip is retired too. They could go into the HOF together.
September 23rd, 20096:35 pm
wbc–re: your 6:32–What about it, now? Don’t recall making any statements in that vein.
So you question O’Brien, who reported knowing Edes and respecting him.
Prado’s out of lineup, KJ in batting eighth, Diaz moves up to second.
September 23rd, 20096:36 pm
Brooks Conrad being sent down was the last straw???? really?? Brooks Conrad???
That’s too bad that yours is gone. Hope nothing happened to him…
Too bad that my what is gone?
September 23rd, 20096:37 pm
It is a scientifically proven fact…that every team will win 54 games…lose 54 games…and it is what you do with the other 54 that determines success or failure. (I mean…look at the Yankees. They have done unbelievably well with that “other 54″ thus far…how about only 2 losses…as they only have 56 losses this entire year…I have them at 42 – 2…with 10 games left…and winning again today!!!)
And in determining this years Braves record…I have found it to be true that Bobby was personally responsible for 9 games…or 6%…(so far…11 games left still to go) …that we were going to win…that he turned into losses.
With that said…
I STILL BELIEVE
AND, that’s already one spot on the Bingo card
blood cells…..I’m not questioning anyone, i personally don’t care if they argued or not. I’m saying this story may be true, it may be false. You’re acting like it has been verified by Wren and Cox.
September 23rd, 20096:38 pm
I’m a Bobby fan, but I couldn’t resist. Pic of Bobby and Wren after the Press conference.
Steve from Ohio,
Get over yourself and stop jumping to conclusions dude. I support whoever the manager is and am glad it’s Cox. However, I’m not going to agree with anyone who says he managed well this year because he did not.
September 23rd, 20096:39 pm
Cue the Official Kelly Johnson Fan Club theme song!
That one’s for you, Dave.
Bobby Cox Farewell Tour Starts Tonight
September 23rd, 20096:40 pm
jeff d and McFann – my Blue Jay disappeared not Jeffrey’s !
Do you really think they would verify it? Do you verify to people when you argue with your wife?
Another thing that Bobby did to piss braves fans off was his reluctance to move Francoeur and A. Jones for the power spots in the order (4-5-6) when they were clearly automatic outs that hurt the braves offense last year and the year before
And Having Roachey hit no higher than 7th when he has been our best power hitter since his arrival was another reason as to why I jumped on the “Bash Bobby Bandwagon”
Add That Loss in Hanson’s Start in Houston as well where he pull him after throwing shutout ball when he could’ve gone another inning…
Please Don’t get me started or I will do another post P-Lentz Style…
Where is Soph/ She’s my psychiratrist…! I’m bout to have a BF right Now thinking about the games we lost because of Bobby
September 23rd, 20096:41 pm
Sorry! That post was meant for dogsbrekky! Not sure how I happened to type your name…
You’re prob’ly wondering, “What the [heck]? Why is McFann randomly telling me about a blue jay?”
What does that have to do with the Braves’ business as usual or lack thereof, though? That’s what I’m confused about…
Oh, and enlighten me: how am I jumping to conclusions? When did I say that he has managed well this year?
Or perhaps you’re jumping to conclusions?
Just about what I expected. Same ‘ole attacks and defenses.
LET IT GO!
It’s a done deal.
Yeah…that’s what I meant.
September 23rd, 20096:44 pm
I’m glad that I’ll get another year to look in the dugout and wonder, “Gee, what will it be like having a new manager for the first time since I was ten?”
Woo hoo some Dave Coverdale on the ol’ bloggage, thanks so much for the memory STEVE OH
One of my favorite (cool) power ballads… not cheesy .. just brilliant
McFann: “Why is McFann randomly telling me about a blue jay?””
Actually…I think it’s really not that unusual at all for you to throw a random comment about a blue jay, Egg Sac or Turtle on the blog.
“I’ll believe it when I see it. Bobby’s as much of Atlanta Braves baseball as Skip Caray or Pete Van Wieren, all those guys were. More so, because he’s been the one constant through the entire run that we’ve had over the last 20 years. It’ll be a sad day when he leaves.”
“It’ll be a little bit of added incentive [next season], to send him out on a good note. But the personnel that we have in here, that’s up to Frank [Wren]. Whether Bobby goes or stays, Frank’s going to try to put the best product he can out there on the field, regardless of who the manager is. That’s his job.
On how he’s said he hoped to play his whole career for Bobby:
“Well, Bobby might be my only manager. We’ll see. If I have a good year, I will consider continuing to play, depending on who the manager is. [That’s] very important.”
“Obviously the way things are done around here may change. That could be good, could be bad. Guys around here are used to the way Bobby runs a camp, the way he runs a clubhouse, and the way he runs a game. And something different could be culture shock. But, I mean, there could be some positives. Could be some negatives. Just got to wait and see who the lucky soul is.”
Easy shoes to fill?
“Yea [he laughs]. I wouldn’t want to be stepping into ‘em.”
September 23rd, 20096:45 pm
Conrad got sent down right after he hit that 3 run homer in Washington to beat the Nats…
Everyone on here wanted him to stay on the bench and this was right before KJ got sent down…
I remember a majority of the people on this blog saying “Conrad gets sent down while Norton stays as well as Diory Hernandez, WTF”
Conrad was hot when he got called up and Bobby sent him down for no reason…and this was when the AWFense hit RockBottom
September 23rd, 20096:46 pm
McFann – I just figured because we talked about Lovey Cann yesterday you were sharing bird stories with me.
And I would’ve said heck…you didn’t have to put it in brackets
“First of all, a guy like that, it’s like Joe Paterno – you let him leave when he wants to leave. But I also think, to go out and have a final year is good, to get whatever [appreciation that's going to come for him], and I also think it gives the organization a year to think about who they want to have take his spot. It’s not like, all of a sudden, ‘I’m retiring,’ and spring training’s in two months and it’s this mad scramble to hire his replacement.
“I imagine it’s going to be hard for him. I mean, this is all he’s done. But from my standpoint, unfortunately I’ve been used to having managers change all the time. It seems like everywhere I’ve gone, it’s been one guy after another. I was actually looking forward to, you know, when you come here you pretty much know who your manager’s going to be. But I think everyone’s got to stop doing what they’re doing [someday]. Only he’s going to have the answers why he only wants to do it one more year. But it’d be great, not just next year but this year, to somehow get him back to the playoffs. Get him back to where he wants to be.
“His competitive nature is incredible, as far as managers go. It’d be great to give him another chance to manage at that level.”
On next manager: “It’ll be interesting to see what happens. This organization just pretty much runs on its own. Or do you bring in someone who’s just going to make wholesale changes. That’ll be interesting to see. But either way, they’ll get it right.”
September 23rd, 20096:47 pm
I’ve selected the Atlanta Braves Theme Song for next year!
Prado just went down during batting practice. Kelly Johnson hit a liner off his left leg, it looked like.
Thats the 2nd time this season he’s tried to take Marteeeeeen out. DOB, can you confirm or deny reports of clubhouse tension between the two?
“He’s the only manager I’ve ever had, and from what I’ve heard everybody around the league wants to play for him. I don’t know what it’s going to be like without him, to be honest with you. I can’t imagine the Atlanta Braves without Skip [Cox].”
“I don’t think you really need any extra incentive to win, and he’d say exactly the same thing. But knowing it’s his last year, and knowing it’s been such a good career and him wanting to go out on a high note – I said you don’t need any extra motivation, but I’m sure it’ll be in the backs of our minds.”
“I wouldn’t have a career if it wasn’t for him, to be honest. He gave me the opportunity in ’06 to come up and prove that I could pitch at this level, after a mediocre year in Triple-A. And the faith that he showed in me in ’07 and then again this year, coming back from surgery – that’s something that you want to be able to pay back to him, but I don’t know how to do it except to go out there and try and pitch as best as I possibly can.”
September 23rd, 20096:48 pm
Alright! KJ get some playing time. He’s 4-for-18 with a HR and 3 BB’s against Met’s staff ace Mike Pelfrey in his career. .222/.318/.389/.707. Not flattering stats. But Kelly’s hot. He’ll improve that line tonight.
September 23rd, 20096:49 pm
“I think that maybe some guys are going to take a little more pride to give him at least one more run to the playoffs and maybe give him a chance to win a ring again.”
When Cox leaves, “It’s going to be like Smoltz and Glavine, when Glavine left the first time and Smoltz left. It’s not the same clubhouse without them in there, because you’ve seen them for a lot of years. It’s strange. It’s strange.”
I’d like to see Bobby and Chipper go out together after another World Series loss to the Yanks. It would be like old times. I hate you.
September 23rd, 20096:50 pm
“I will consider continuing to play, depending on who the manager is” Chipper Jones
Uhh, shouldn’t he want to play anyways? I mean, is he so scared that he won’t get pampered by another manager that even if he has a good ‘09 that he would retire anyways? That comment just rubbed me the wrong way.
“I was expecting [Cox to return in 2010]. I think he had some fun this year, and he’s seen that we’ve got a pretty good team, and just a couple of little things that we’ve got to work on, and if we keep the same team, same pitching staff, I think we’re going to be fine.”
“I’m glad that he’s coming back. He’s one of those guys who always supported me, supported my work, and he knows what we can do. He knows the team, knows everybody here, and I’m so glad, so happy that he’s coming back next year.”
“There’s still a slight chance we can make the playoffs this year. But next year, I hope it’s going to be a lot smoother season, and I hope to contribute and help him have a great way to end his great career.”
That was absolutely hilarious….lol
September 23rd, 20096:51 pm
Just want to go on record that Bobby Cox is…and will be…the greatest manager of alltime to me. Glad he’s coming back next year and wish he’d never retire.
Now if some of the Bobby haters want to retire and not return to the blog or as Brave fans, I could accept that.
It’s going to be like Smoltz and Glavine, when Glavine left the first time and Smoltz left. It’s not the same clubhouse without them in there, because you’ve seen them for a lot of years. It’s strange. It’s strange Jurrjens
….how would he know?
“I haven’t been here as long as a lot of these guys, but he’s great to play for and it’s good to know I’ll be playing for him next year…. Knowing it’s going to be his last year, and as much as he’s meant not only to the organization but to major league baseball, it certainly won’t hurt [in terms of motivating team to succeed in 2010].”
“He’s been the face of Braves baseball for a long time. When that chances, it’s going to certainly be weird.”
September 23rd, 20096:52 pm
I just hope you support the next manager as much as you support Bobby. I wouldn’t want you to be inconsistent.
September 23rd, 20096:53 pm
“Having him back is great for us. The team we’ve got going into next season is a team that has a chance to really do some good things, and all of us in the clubhouse want him to be the guy who calls the shots. I think if next year is going to be his last year, we definitely want to send him out on a good note and get this organization, get everything back to where it was when he got here, and that’s on top of the division and making a postseason appearance every single year.”
“I thought he’d come back [in 2010]. The team we’ve got coming back, on paper it’s going to be a really good team.”
Please consider this for your 2010 Theme Song.
September 23rd, 20096:54 pm
jeffrey d I just figured because we talked about Lovey Cann yesterday you were sharing bird stories with me.
Ok…yeah, I mean, it’s not that I wouldn’t want to be telling you this…it was just kinda funny…
Of course you would’ve! Sorry…reflex…
Thanks for the quotes, Chief!
Rob from SC
Most important thing about Cox coming back is that Wren can’t make bad trades just to give Cox a serious shot for one season. Wren did a great job fixing the rotation. Fix the offense while allowing Heyward to become a fixture in RF.
September 23rd, 20096:55 pm
Steve from OH
If you don’t mind I would like to ask you some surgery questions.
September 23rd, 20096:56 pm
All of the number crunching and speculation surrounding the possibility of the Braves still somehow making the playoffs is a true sign of the delusion that has come to identify this organization.
It could and should have happened; it will not.
September 23rd, 20096:58 pm
Good work David O’Brien…Very interesting stuff!
Sorry Ryan and Tom, but Bobby let me pick the song for next year.
September 23rd, 20096:59 pm
Mitchell – mate, when the Grim Reaper knocks on your door, you do not cave in, you kick him in the balls, head butt the mother and think about positive things… nothing in this wonderful country is impossible, including the Braves winning all 11 remaining games… woo hoo
Rob–absolutely, I’m always happy to help in whatever way I can, LOL! I’m leaving for the library like, now, so I’ll answer as much as I can in one post and get the rest when I return…
September 23rd, 20097:00 pm
Chop Chop–I will support our next manager with the same sense of urgency as I support this one. Because I’m a winner.
September 23rd, 2009
Prado’s out of lineup, KJ in batting eighth, Diaz moves up to second.
If KJ’s batting 8th then Chipper should at least bat 7th. I think Kelly is the only guy on this team who’s worse than Chipper at this point. Give Chipper the respect to bat him 7th and put LaRoche at the 3 spot.
Come on, how hard is this?
September 23rd, 20097:02 pm
Stev OH and Gwegg Nawton – god I never thought I would hear 2 1970’s icons on the same blog… especially a duo as different as Neil (I like girls, really) Sedaka and the great David Coverdale
As pissed as I am that Bobby is coming back, I have to admit, I’d tear up if this was his last year…
September 23rd, 20097:03 pm
It’s beside the point. We’re better than the Rockies as far as I’m concerned and we might very well win every game (ha!) but they already did their job. They know how to win when matters.
It’s too late. It’s not happening.
Props to you for being a winner. I’m sure you would agree with the advice I like to give the kids:
Never be a loser.
Words to live by.
Rob from SC,
I can’t wait until Heyward retires. Why? Because I won’t have to read any more crap from you about how wonderful he is.
Who cares what a damned Yankee from ohio thinks?
September 23rd, 20097:04 pm
Tim Hudson is 105 – 2 with a three run or more lead in his career according to the Mets broadcasters.
Good quotes, DOB. Thanks.
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