3:47 pm July 7, 2009, by David O'Brien
July 8th, 20092:00 pm
“By the way, those who hope the Braves trade Francoeur: They probably won’t get much in return, but they’ll get zero in return if they never play him. Gotta at least show he’s healthy and can do something to help a team in some way. So they’ll probably keep running him out there long as he’s on the roster.”
I’d rather us get zero in return than keep throwing him out there everyday when Diaz is clearly a better hitter and we have a weak offense. People act as if Jeff may suddenly find it and start hitting. He’s a lost cause, get rid of him. Either for something or nothing it doesnt matter, he makes this team worse
July 8th, 20092:01 pm
Everyone made a big deal about Yunel when they got rid on Pena. Why is no one worried about what effect trading Frenchy will have on McCann? Just curious.
its been raining in chicago all day …according to my sources
Yes, but rammer. Frenchy is producing. Not stat-wise. But wins-wise. look at our unbeaten record when he wears his turkey underwear and tell me i’m wrong.
July 8th, 20092:02 pm
Has everyone here written off Schafer as our future CF? I dont think we should go out and trade for a CF when Schafer will be a huge asset in (at the latest) 2010.
July 8th, 20092:03 pm
work in chicago. very light rain. i’d call it a heavy dew/mist.
July 8th, 20092:04 pm
???, because McCann doesnt need a translator to talk to other players. Im sure Mac has other friends on this team also and he would like to have a RF that can actually produce and help this team.
Why do some of y’all say the Braves need to acquire a CF when we have both McLouth AND Schafer?
I think CF is covered….
July 8th, 20092:05 pm
“Why is no one worried about what effect trading Frenchy will have on McCann?”
This question may be sarcasm it may not be. But you’re fooling yourself, if you think a guy like McCann is going to be bummed out about a “friend” leaving, if that means his team is better for it.
He may never publicly say so, but for guys like Chipper and McCann it has to be as frustrating as it is for the fans, to watch Jeff’s AB’s.
Have you ever watched a little league or HS game where the really good kids let their emotions show, when one of their teamates mess up? Especially when it’s the SAME mistakes?
Those emotions never really go away. They just hide them publicly better, because nobody “likes” the guys that call people out. My guess is that Chipper and McCann are pretty tired of having Jeff “the hitter” as a teammate. Doesn’t mean they still don’t like the guy.
we are on a roll with jeff starting. I say go with it till we lose then DFA him. Am I a guiness or what? LOL N8 will this work for you?
F U WGN!
weather report continued…
went out for lunch about an hour ago and didn’t need to open my umbrella. been like that all mornin.
DOB….weather report please.
James is Red
July 8th, 20092:06 pm
The Escobar/Pena thing was much ado about nothing. DOB has posted the Esco stats about that time after time. And the Frenchy trade winds have been blowing for quite a while. If McCann was really going to get upset about it, I think we’d have already seen the effects. Also, McCann’s not 18 years old anymore.
Looks like the tarp is being pulled over the field on the WGN feed.
July 8th, 20092:08 pm
Piedmont Blues, Keeping Francoeur in the line up signals to me & a lot of fans that the best line up is not on the field. Using the excuse to up his trade value is a poor one IMO.
I’m willing to bet putting him back in the line up is Cox’s decision, not Wrens thus blowing the “increasing his value” agrument all to hell. If anyone wanted him & his contract they would have already made a move. Anyone can have him next year for nothing more than the league minimum so we’re not going to get anything for him. If a team wants to make a reclamation project out of him they don’t want him now because he will have to be offered arbitration this off season if they plan on keeping him.
Bottom line is this team is within striking distance no matter how remote it seems & Diaz is the hot hand. If this team was strong with the bat I’d have ZERO problem playing him right now. The fact is they are a very weak offensive team & need all the help they can get.
In years past Cox could get away with running a guy out every day that was struggling. There was always other guys to pick up the slack, but in recent years he couldn’t & it’s shown with Francouer the past two seasons & Andruw the season before. The TEAM shouldn’t suffer because the manager wants to play people whose production is proof enough he doesn’t belong on the field especially when there is better options.
jeff…thanks…any links to feeds?
July 8th, 20092:09 pm
WGN blows. How about broadcasting the game in all markets, no one wants to watch Bewitched!
July 8th, 20092:10 pm
I’m watching on MLB Premium which was only something like $109. If you wait after the all star break it should be half off. (Assuming ya don’t live in the blackout areas.)
David O’Brien……..Matt Diaz is 13 for his last 26. Jeff Francoeur is 3 for his last 17 (including a “gift” hit last night in the 9th inning on an obvious throwing error by the shortstop), with 5 strikeouts and no walks…………yet for the second day in a row, Francoeur is playing while Diaz is on the bench?
Just because some MORON feels that the not playing Jeff Francoeur was the reason we lost 3 games in a row……..does not mean that you should ask Bobby why he doesnt play Francouer more. Francoeur’s numbers do not lie. 16 homers in his past 895 at-bats for a batting average of .241 SHOWS that Francouer does not deserve to start. Meanwhile, in his past 941 at-bats, Matt Diaz has hit .317 with 25 homers. How hard is it for ANYONE do see the difference.
July 8th, 20092:11 pm
Wren has pretty much firmly stated he will not trade pitching or take on much in the way of salary. Why doesn’t this seem to register with so many of you? (LEW)
because they each believe that what they want to happen is so overwhelmingly important that it transcends what any ol’ GM happens to say.. Obviously Frank is just hiding in the bushes until he can implement their team saving approach.
July 8th, 20092:14 pm
Gotta give it to Paul Lentz,
Dude is relentless!
I’m sure Brian and Jeff can seperate the “work stuff” from being friends outside of being baseball players. I believe Mac won’t care one bit if Jeff leaves and someone infinitely BETTER takes his place:)
Hope the Braves can get that game in….need the win! Gotta hammer that kid early and not let him get rolling.
Oh, and Chipper NEEDS to man up and PLAY in the Rockies series, b/c they are a hot team and have been scoring runs, so the Braves will need all their big guns to be in the lineup…including Chipper Jones.
Come on Hoss, earn that paycheck!
July 8th, 20092:15 pm
wrigley field makes chippers crotch hurt.
also lew, if they were to trade a guy like vasquez (11.5mil) then you wouldn’t need to add much salary to get a bat.
July 8th, 20092:16 pm
Frenchy vs Diaz… any chance that Cox makes the decision based upon who is pitching for the Braves. Lowe starts, Diaz starts since Lowe is a gound ball pitcher, maybe the same for JJ. But if Vazquez or KK start (fly ball pitchers) he wants Frenchy out there.
July 8th, 20092:17 pm
This year against right handers, Jeff Francoeur is hitting .222 with 4 homers in 203 at-bats. Matt Diaz is batting ..256 with 3 homers in 78 at-bats.
In 125 more at-bats, Francoeur only had 1 more homer than Diaz. Yet Bobby wants to continue starting Francoeur. Francoeur is a CANCER to our offense. He has ABSOLUTELY no pop in his bat. The ball JUMPS off the bat of Matt Diaz, yet he mostly languishes on the bench. UNREAL.
The Bird and Indian
Paul: We all know. You don’t have to say the stuff EVERY SINGLE TIME YOU POST!
This is me wondering...
July 8th, 20092:18 pm
Who is Jeff Francoeur? Is he running against Obama in 2012?
My favorite are the people who say “We should trade Francouer, Johnson, and (insert whoever is in slump at the time) for a big bat”.
Ok if francoer flies out today to short right field again i’m throwing my laptop in the pool. And how about hitting a ball hard in the air JF and not an infield hit?
July 8th, 20092:19 pm
Judging by the radar this game is going to be really hard to get it.
Dang rain delay!
Greg Olson Homers
July 8th, 20092:20 pm
Winning while Jeff is in the lineup is a clear case of the Correlation v. Causation failure in reasoning. You have to look at the reasons we won those games, and it certainly wasn’t directly attributable to Jeff in the batters box or in the field. Jeff being in the lineup did nothing to “cause” wins. He just happen to be in there when we won (correlation). Diaz on the other hand, has almost single handedly “caused” wins. Too bad the rest of the team hasn’t stepped up in his games.
July 8th, 20092:21 pm
Any human not locked up for serious crimes is far from CANCER. Those of us affected by cancer (I bet there are a lot on here) don’t find that very funny. I sure as hell don’t.
Uh Oh…..no game today.
Good luck getting this game in.
and Morton has thrown 17 or so innings of sub-3 ERA. (SCOOTS)
been waiting for you to bring that up. Just a damn shame that they traded such a dominating can’t-miss prospect like Charles. Why, I said all alone that he was the next Chuck Norris of the pitching staff.
Rain, bollocks, oh well I can watch Charlie pitch for the Bucs for a while
And tarp’s on field, light rain
Spotlight on Francouer-AGAIN!! YOU GOT TO BE F’N KIDDING ME
the hopes of the braves nation rest in your hands mr. hanson
July 8th, 20092:22 pm
do they honestly play frenchys spotlight as a joke?
Rain Delay. For all Frenchy Haters: Spotlight- Jeff Francouer
I really wouldn’t mind a rain out. The team could use the rest, especially Chipper & McCann. If Chipper can get some time off plus the All Star break I’ll bet he starts the second half on fire.
July 8th, 20092:24 pm
How many times does SS have to broadcast spotlight on Jeffery Brandon Francouer ? Does he have serious stock in SS ?
Ugg, the Frenchy thing on TV again?
July 8th, 20092:26 pm
timthebrave………..I agree, blaming Bobby for a player’s inability to bunt is not fair. However what is FAIR is to question why Bobby didnt bring in Gregor Blanco to bunt instead of Matt Diaz.? Blanco is a left handed hitter who was facing a right handed Aaron Heilman. Plus he is a better bunter with more speed. Matt Diaz should have been used only if he was going to swing away.
It’s about getting the maximum use out of your players. Having Diaz bunt in that situation (as a pinch hitter) wasnt the most effective use of the bench. If Diaz was already in the game, then I could see Bobby asking him to bunt. However, Bobby attempted to use him as a pinch hitter to bunt. That is what I (and a number of posters on here) have a problem with.
Every time there is a rain delay, FoxSportsSouth shows the “Jeff Francoeur” propaganda love fest live story.
Hey Everyone, for what its worth. Here’s a bit of information that might make you think twice about not having Francouer in the game. During the 5 game winning streak, Frenchy was playing RF everyday, during the 3 game losing streak we just had, Diaz played left field those days. We won yesterday and Frenchy was the starting RF’er. Now, I am not saying he is playing worth a crap, but maybe he is a good luck charm when is starting the game. Sure seems that way
July 8th, 20092:27 pm
MLB xFIP Leaders (Qualified only):
1. Javier Vazquez – 2.65
2. Tim Lincecum – 2.72
3. Dan Haren – 2.94
4. Roy Halladay – 2.97
t-5. Zach Greinke – 3.14
t-5. Justin Verlander – 3.14 PWHjort
Oh who gives a FIP?
July 8th, 20092:29 pm
There is an NCIS marathon on USA.
July 8th, 20092:33 pm
hey dumb o’brien when are you going to tell us how great this conrad guy is going to be after 13 at bats
July 8th, 20092:38 pm
I hope Phillies don’t end up getting Halladay in a trade.
David O’Brien……….playing Francouer is not going to make him more “tradeable”. No team out there is going to trade for a player who cant hit……knowing that they will have no choice but to non-tender him in the offseason because they will not risking having to pay him $5-6 mil in salary arbitration. The only way that any team would consider acquiring Francouer would be as a non-roster invitee during Spring Training where if he makes the roster, he gets the minimum. I’m sure that there will be teams out there who will take a flyer on Francoeur, hoping to catch “lightening in a bottle”. However there is a BIG DIFFERENCE between paying Francoeur the minimum…..and…….giving up a player and risking having to pay him $5-6 mil in salary arbitration. BIG DIFFERENCE.
The ONLY thing that will end up happening by playing Francoeur is that his bat will continue to drag down the Braves offense. Let’s be logical and real here. His lack of offense is KILLING our offense. I know that Matt Diaz in right field isnt he long term answer. But come on……..you cant tell me that Diaz in the line-up isnt an upgrade over Francoeur.
I know that Bobby Cox really likes Jeff Francouer and “feels” that he is the “real deal”. However reality, and Jeff Francoeur’s stats, suggest otherwise. At what point does Bobby finally give up on Francouer? 2 or 3 more years of futility? I feel that Bobby does not want to bench Francouer because if he did, it would signal how wrong his faith in Francoeur was. Admitting a mistake is something that I’m sure that Bobby does not want to do in this case.
July 8th, 20092:41 pm
Paul Lentz… Keep sayin’ it about Francouer vs. Diaz… Completely agree.
In fact, if you ask me, I think Frenchy should be riding the bench. Don’t care what he thinks or does, he does not deserve to start over Diaz and he should rarely if ever get an AB. It’s not punishment but rather doing what is necessary to win. If a player says he is all for doing what is right for the team, then bench yourself when you suck. But that’s not how players really think huh? “As long as it’s not me on the bench.”
I’ve always been a Diaz fan ever since the Braves got him. His minor league stats were phenomenal which made me think that his ceiling was very high–despite the peculiar swing. I really don’t know what in the world happened last year (and please no one bring up the knee–that happened after he stunk it up).
I’d rather take a hit on defense if it means getting that bat in the line up every day.
RHR……….Even if the Phillies trade for Roy Halladay………they will still need another starting pitcher and bullpen help. Not enough is being said about Brad Lidge not being the same pitcher as he was last year. He is VERY hittable this year. Not only that, but so is Ryan Madsen, their 8th inning guy.
In order to pry Halladay from Toronto, the Phillies will have not choice but to give up a couple of their BEST prospects. Toronto is not going to give him away.
paul lentz…. there is nobody on our team named Jeff Francouer. We have a RF named Jeff Francoeur though.
July 8th, 20092:48 pm
It’s funny but I swear there is always at least one player in Bobby Cox’s line up every day who can’t hit. Been like that for 20 years.
I live outside NY and I can tell you that if either of the new york managers did what cox did last night(sending diaz up to bunt) the media would have been all over the manager.
July 8th, 20092:50 pm
Keeping It Real……….the Braves will have a lot of money to available to use towards free agency. If a trade isnt made this season, one WILL have to be made in the offseason if the Braves exercise the $13 mil 2010 option on Tim Hudson’s contract. The Braves are not going to trade Tommy Hanson or Jair Jurrgens. Both are young starting pitchers who arent eligible for salary arbitration yet. So that would leave 4 starters making significant money vying for 3 spots:
Derek Lowe………$15 mil
Tim Hudson………$13 mil
Javier Vazquez….$11.5 mil
So realistically, who would the Braves be able to trade and get the most value in return?
Also, if the Braves are smart, they will non-tender both Kelly Johnson and Jeff Francoeur. That will open up a combined $6 mil.
The Braves will have options. Frank Wren wisely focused last offseason on fixing the starting pitching. This offseason (that is if he doesnt make a trade before the trade deadline), he will focus on fixing the offense.
July 8th, 20092:52 pm
Peric @ 2:48- the media, in general, down here is a lot less openly critical. Not saying it is right or wrong. It just is.
July 8th, 20092:54 pm
Chris…….I would not release Francoeur. For one, the Braves still owe him half of his $3.375 mil 2009 salary. Plus I do feel that he has value as a late inning defensive replacement, particularly in games where Garrett starts in left field. I like Garrett’s bat. I just feel that moving Diaz over to left while inserting Francouer in right field late in games would be the best use of Francoeur on our roster this year. After the season the Braves can non-tender him and let him go his merry way.
July 8th, 20092:55 pm
Paul. Braves do not have a player named Garrett. They do, however, have a LF named Garret Anderson
July 8th, 20092:56 pm
hey lentz I don’t know if you have ever played ball but if things are going well you don’t mess with it. Baseball is about pitching, defence and hitting in that order, and Jeff can at least catch a ball while Diaz and Anderson will cost you more games then they will win with there defence.
July 8th, 20092:57 pm
what are we, in britain? peric, in america we spell it “defense.”
July 8th, 20092:58 pm
Greg Olson Homers………great posting at 2:20pm. Your “Correlation v. Causation” posting is taught in most PSY 1 classes in college.
Then again, when some posters really feel that “turkey underwear” and “prayer” are reasons why a team wins, then expecting someone to understand “Correlation v. Causation” is asking for a little too much.
July 8th, 20093:01 pm
Got to run. Wish me luck today. Got to play some poker.
July 8th, 20093:04 pm
Tim Joyce is very definitive with his strike calls
July 8th, 20093:07 pm
Adam: Our new grammar expert!!! Loaf is struggling again. He needs a 5 hour energy drink. WAKE UP!!!
July 8th, 20093:13 pm
So Loaf still can’t get it done in the 3 spot gasp/shock
the only one who didn’t see that coming is the one who makes the lineup
July 8th, 20093:15 pm
That was a terrible call.
July 8th, 20093:16 pm
Not even close at 2nd. Maybe that doofus should take off his shades. Guess you take what they give you.
July 8th, 20093:21 pm
Is it just me or are MLB umpires turning into NBA refs in terms of thinking that they are part of the show?
July 8th, 20093:27 pm
After watching the SPOTLIGHT I just knew he would get a hit. PSYCHE…………THE NATURAL MY #%@
predictable jeff at-bat:
swing, swing, swing, swing and miss
he’s just not even a good player anymore, he swings at everything and hopes he gets lucky. He’s not going to succeed anywhere with that kind of approach ….
July 8th, 20093:28 pm
Scouting report is diffinitely out on GA. He has been figured out, No fast balls.
July 8th, 20093:41 pm
Nine-game hitting streak for McLouth, who’s scorching balls since he got back from the hammy injury.
July 8th, 20094:43 pm
Weird — during batting practice, Bobby Cox was watching batting practice and said aloud, I’ve got a feeling Kotchman is going to homer today.
July 8th, 20094:58 pm
Major news for the Japanese reporters here, and in the pressbox
July 8th, 20095:10 pm
now in the bullpen’s hands. Keep em off the board!
July 8th, 20095:16 pm
moylan does his job. Wouldn’t mind having 1-2 more runs though.
July 8th, 20095:43 pm
keep that up Loaf, play yourself right out of that spot
first pitch, wow …. so dumb
July 9th, 20091:20 am
bigmacattack He needs to spend some time in Texas and relearn his swing.
July 20th, 20097:47 pm
Sure could have used Frenchy tonight. He would have gotten to those balls hit out of Diaz’ reach. And the rbi double he got would have helped, too.
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